S01.E04: False Imposition

[Tara Ariano]

Lucious makes an attempt to steal a hot artist who's topping the charts from his rival at Safe House Records. Meanwhile, Jamal struggles with writer's block; and Cookie tries to mend her broken relationship with Hakeem.

[Syndicate]

Very slow and uneventful episode!  I'm beginning to see why this was renewed so quickly.  The drama feels too manufactured.

Edited January 29, 2015 by Syndicate

[peridot]

I like getting the little bits and pieces from the past about the Lyon family.  I was surprised to see that Andre had a little talent with singing and it was interesting to see that he covered for his father way back then.

 

Also want to hear more about Lucius' background with the Nation of Islam. 

 

Hakeem was getting on my nerves this episode, he has no work ethic and is a fool to boot.  I hope his career crashes and burns.

[Artsda]

I liked the ending with the "Baby" line. Also that Lucious actually told Anika the truth. 

 

Like Jamal trying it out on his own in the bad neighborhood, I think it will earn Lucious's respect compared to Hakeem who he has to keep harping on as a diva when he has no career or even songs yet. Cookie already compared the place to where they used to live in Philly. 

Edited January 29, 2015 by Artsda

[Syndicate]

For me, the most interesting element to this show at this point is Andre, his bipolar condition, and his skeevy wife.  Andre appeared in this episode, but his mental illness and skeevy wife were nowhere to be found.  That's too bad because I found this episode largely boring.

[sarkygal]

Ok, I'm trying to understand why the hell Cookie is doing so much for Lucius still. She got him his dreams, paid for it with 17 years in jail and away from her kids. And now, she gets him an artist he wants. Yet he still doesn't give her the credit publicly for any of it. There's something so painful about how much Cookie will still give this man and I don't see the same from him. I know the jury's out, but this episode made me think Cookie still loves his pompadour wearing ass, ugh. 

[SimoneS]

I don't think that Cookie is doing these things for Lucious. She is doing it for Empire and her sons. As far as Cookie is concerned, she owns half of Empire and one day, her sons will definitely own it. Cookie becoming a lead producer and manager along with signing a top hip hop artist, getting Jamal writing, and Hakeem on track all helps the company prosper which is all good for her family.

 

I wonder how she will cope finding out about Lucious being sick.

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Appears that Anika genuinely loves Lucifer.

Not as good this week, but still a decent episode.

[Malbec]

Taraji carried this episode -- I thought Cookie's scenes bonding with the rival guy's mother, her comment to Tianna about wanting a daughter and her monologue about Luscious forgetting her in jail were all great scenes.

 

 

For me, the most interesting element to this show at this point is Andre, his bipolar condition, and his skeevy wife.  Andre appeared in this episode, but his mental illness and skeevy wife were nowhere to be found.

 

 

I'm with you in that he's currently the most interesting of the three brothers to me.  Last week was Jamal's week, this week was Hakeem's and I'm hoping next week will be Andre's.  I did think his compulsive covering for his father, flashback included, was a good character detail to drop.  It's also probably going to bite everyone in the ass.

[Mya Stone]

The only time I ever like Lucious is when he's one on one with Cookie. Those two have chemistry. I can feel their history on screen, with every little touch TH gives TJH.

It's very cat and mouse...I just don't know if it's all a game to Lucious or if he truly does still love Cookie somewhere in that twisted heart.

And young Andre broke my damn heart tonight.

[thuganomics85]

I still enjoyed it, but it was slower then the other three episodes.  Parts of it did feel like filler, and other parts felt like it was setting up upcoming storylines.

 

Actually surprised Lucious ended up telling Anika about his ALS diagnosis, before either Cookie or his sons.  I guess he just couldn't hide it anymore.  Not sure what this means.  It seems like she is going to support him for now, but with this show, I have a feeling that could all change on a dime.

 

I do think this being Hakeem-centric probably hurt it a bit.  I only find him interesting when he's with Jamal, because it shows a different side of him.  All the other times, I feel like he's just the basic over-privileged, egotistical, jackass, whose big mouth is going to finally catch up for him.  Of course, in this episode, it was almost his dick, since Tiana caught him with Naomi Campbell, but it seems like Tiana is fine with it, as long as being with him helps her career.

 

Still love Cookie though!  Loved that she signed up Tiana, and approached that Titan's guys mom, and was able to help find Lucious find a way in with him.  Woman is one smart, well, cookie.  Now, I just hope she can use her magic with Jamel, and he will finally step up.

 

I have a feeling Andre covering for Lucious is going to come back into play.

 

Judd Nelson as Baretti is certainly an interesting casting choice.

 

Judging from next week's previews, it looks like the show is going to have more camp and soap coming up, so I'm fine with a slower episode for now.

[wanderingstar]

The Cookie/Lucious teases are becoming more obvious. I think I am ok with that.

 

Glad Lucious told Anika the truth. I still don't like her though.

 

Hakeem continues to be a brat.

Edited January 29, 2015 by Gillian Rosh

[aprilbabe]

This episode was a lot slower than the others but still good.

Anika girl, some things just aren't for you. You don't fit in that world good try though.

It's good to see Cookie succeed. Getting a Tianna, signing Titan. She very smart and she was right about Hakeem the reason why he's not succeeding is he's rapping about a world he didn't live. Lucious ran the company based on what Cookie taught him, and now that she's back he lowkey does whatever she says. Might as well leave to company to her.

Loved the flashback of Andre and Lucious.

Also like that Tianna really likes Cookie. Good to have another person in her corner.

On a side note Cookie loves her animal print.

[SimoneS]

It was difficult seeing how much Andre loved Lucious even as a boy and yet his father continues to play games with him and Hakeem.

 

It was interesting that Lucious smiled when Jamal declared his independence and walked away. Living in the hood will help Jamal write some authentic music.

[Irlandesa]

This episode may have been "slower" but I preferred it to last week.  The difference between trashy soap and great soap comes down to character development for me. 

 

Tonight gave us a lot of backstory.  The Andre/Lucious flashback was my favorite flashback they've done.  We see that adult Andre may not be an artist, he certainly understands the art as his father indoctrinated him in it from a young age. It also shows us why he's so upset about not even being considered to take over the empire since it looks like he has always had his father's back. 

 

I also like that some layers were added to Lucious and Anika's relationship.  She has always felt like a simple appendage but tonight did a good job of making me feel that there was a connection between the two even if I do think he is more inspired by Cookie.

 

Loved seeing Cookie being smart in her wheeling and dealing.  In fact, I loved all of the business stuff in this episode.  So often the professional realm of these shows is related to law, or medicine or law enforcement. This is a nice change.

[Syndicate]

Sorry, but this episode dragged.  This show has such an exciting premise but doesn't seem to be really capitalizing on that premise.  What I'd like to see?

 

1.)  Truly mysterious and dangerous characters from Lucious' and Cookie's past, coming back to threaten them and their family.  They team up to do whatever it takes to neutralize the threat.

 

2.)  More exposition for Anika.  Perhaps a destructive ex-husband (or current husband whom she didn't divorce) who arrives on the scene to stir the pot.

 

3.)  Andre, Jamal, and Hakeem in scenes TOGETHER!  I want to know how they all REALLY feel about each other.

 

4.)  Andre's bipolar disorder morphing into full-blown split personality disorder.  Andre murders a business associate for his father but it wasn't Andre doing it.  It was Andre's thug of an alter "Antoine."  Lucious thinks that Andre is the killer because he knows nothing about his son's mental illness.

 

5.)  Rhonda is sleeping with Andre's doctor who's a hottie.  "Antoine" knows this but Andre doesn't.

 

6.)  Lucious paying off Michael to betray Jamal in the worst way.

 

WHATEVER!

 

I just want to be shocked and surprised more.  I have no idea why we got such a bland episode this week.

Edited January 29, 2015 by Syndicate

[tmelange]

I enjoyed this episode a lot and thought it was much better than last week's. We learned a lot about everything. What got me was that scene with Cookie and Lucious where she says that he just stopped all communication with her in prison without any explanation. That could break a person, and to see that she survived and is trying to get back what she lost says a lot about her character. I also loved the flashback with little Andre; I liked that song they were doing too.

 

I also thought it was very revealing to know that Judd Nelson has Lucious' publishing, and isn't he the one that Cookie is trying to bring down with the feds? I was surprised that Lucious revealed his condition to Boo Boo Kitty; guess we'll see now whether she's in it come what may. We also found out in this episode that Cookie produced Lucious' albums, which was an interesting tidbit to me, and that the Nation killed his father. I thought one of the best lines was Jamal's when he told his father that his talent was worth more than the money and that it's his. Very poignant from an artist's perspective. I also liked the music in this episode in particular.

 

Anyway, I wasn't bored at all.

[Jazzy24]

Cookie is right Hakeem ain't bout that life, baby boy needs to stop acting like he is.

Living in the hood will do Jamal some good

Lucious is an asshole Andre deserves some appreciation I actually want him to get the company, Hakeem is an idiot and Jamal just wants it for revenge.

Cookie is smart! And I felt for her when she was talking to Lucious and that rapper's mother she was just left alone in prison, she should never forget that.

I still don't know why Hakeem is mad at her he seemed like he didn't believe that she loved him I again felt for Cookie she really does love her boys. And I want to see more Andre and Cookie.

[Lila82]

I still don't know why Hakeem is mad at her he seemed like he didn't believe that she loved him I again felt for Cookie she really does love her boys. And I want to see more Andre and Cookie.

 

 

Hakeem was likely no more than two when Cookie went to prison and has no real memories of her as his mother.   So there's a lot of anger there, because unlike his brothers, he doesn't have those experience to ease the pain and abandonment.   Also, and his (and her) comments have indicated that Lucius actively worked to turn Hakeem against his mother.  We don't know yet if Andre saw her in prison, but it seems like Jamal maintained relationship with her until her release.  I don't mind slower episodes like these when we get so much screen time with Cookie and her sons.  The music and drama might were the original draw, but prefer the smaller family moments, particularly the flashbacks to the Lyons' past.  Sometimes it's anvilicious, but still provides so much insight towards the characters and their current motivations.  

 

Hakeem and Jamal bonding moment!  They're my favorite part of the show.  And Andre, his wacky wife, and their bizarre marital dance.  I mean, how did Rhonda react to his latest meeting with the deputy mayor?  Did she wear the blow job bib?  Inquiring minds want to know! 

 

Of course Porsha doesn't pay taxes.  The writers include her at just the right moments.

 

Were Hakeem and Naomi Campbell taking a bath in his foyer?  The set up of his apartment was confusing.  As was everything happening in that bathtub.  When she mentioned an inspirational book, I really thought she'd talk about "The Secret" (and then I hoped she'd share all she's accomplished since she started "secreting").  She's such a bad actress and this show could use more comedic relief.  Cookie making a fool of herself doesn't count. 

[NorthstarATL]

For me, the most interesting element to this show at this point is Andre, his bipolar condition, and his skeevy wife.  Andre appeared in this episode, but his mental illness and skeevy wife were nowhere to be found.  That's too bad because I found this episode largely boring.

If you're going to refer to the woman as "skeevy", it should probably apply equally to Andre. Just to be fair. The flashbacks with Andre, though, were well done. He out of all three brothers was there for the lean years. His cover story for his father will no doubt blow up in his face. I was disappointed a bit that we saw the musical connection between Andre and his father, though. It had seemed to me that his business sense, which he shares with both parents, but might be more like Cookie's, set him apart from his younger brothers, as they connect with their father easier through musicality.

  Cookie was, as always, the best. We still need to know more about Michael.

[EyesGlazed]

I am in the tank for this show; I'm enjoying all the characters and all the actors and most of the music.  Especially because I've always been a fan of Taraji, and now she's getting a big juicy role to play and a lot of scenery to chew and she's owning it!  I think all around the acting is pretty good, so I must disagree respectfully with our esteemed recapper.   She's not giving the show the soapy props that it deserves.

 

The only time I ever like Lucious is when he's one on one with Cookie. Those two have chemistry. I can feel their history on screen, with every little touch TH gives TJH.

So much word.  And you can see how Lucious is beginning to respect her and want her again.

 

This episode may have been "slower" but I preferred it to last week.  The difference between trashy soap and great soap comes down to character development for me. 

 

Tonight gave us a lot of backstory.  The Andre/Lucious flashback was my favorite flashback they've done.  We see that adult Andre may not be an artist, he certainly understands the art as his father indoctrinated him in it from a young age. It also shows us why he's so upset about not even being considered to take over the empire since it looks like he has always had his father's back. 

I agree with this too.  It's unfortunate that these days, showrunners feel they have to cram 15 plot developments and 10 shockers into every episode to hold the attention of us kiddies.  Maybe they do thanks to the Shonda Effect, I don't know.  But I like that this show has slowed down a bit from the frantic throw-everything-you-got-at-the-screen tactic of the first two episodes.

 

The Kinksters are much more interesting than expected.  Rhonda gives me a kick.  I liked her sassy "white girls can be brilliant too" to Cookie at the photo shoot.  And her love of perverse role-playing of the other woman (women?)  And what about that BJ Towel that she keeps handy for when her man needs to be soothed into taking his meds??  Awesome!

Edited January 29, 2015 by EyesGlazed

[tmelange]

I think Hakeem is likely mad at Cookie for doing something illegal that got her thrown in jail for his entire childhood. As much as I love Cookie, she was a drug dealer. I think Hakeem has a right to his feelings about the issue, though he is a brat and benefiting from her original illegal actions, so he should try to practice some forgiveness.

[Rick Kitchen]

Very slow and uneventful episode!  I'm beginning to see why this was renewed so quickly.  The drama feels too manufactured.

 

I don't understand what you're saying.  Why would the NETWORK renewing the show have to do with the WRITERS and PRODUCERS making a show you are bored with?

 

Judd Nelson!

 

I was worried that Jamal was going to shot out there on the streets.

 

I would like to know more about Michael.  Does he work?  Does he have family?

 

Hakeem's G-rated song includes lyrics like "I give it to her"?

Edited January 29, 2015 by Rick Kitchen

[Syndicate]

I am in the tank for this show; I'm enjoying all the characters and all the actors and most of the music.  Especially because I've always been a fan of Taraji, and now she's getting a big juicy role to play and a lot of scenery to chew and she's owning it!  I think all around the acting is pretty good, so I must disagree respectfully with our esteemed recapper.   She's not giving the show the soapy props that it deserves.

 

So much word.  And you can see how Lucious is beginning to respect her and want her again.

 

I agree with this too.  It's unfortunate that these days, showrunners feel they have to cram 15 plot developments and 10 shockers into every episode to hold the attention of us kiddies.  Maybe they do thanks to the Shonda Effect, I don't know.  But I like that this show has slowed down a bit from the frantic throw-everything-you-got-at-the-screen tactic of the first two episodes.

 

The Kinksters are much more interesting than expected.  Rhonda gives me a kick.  I liked her sassy "white girls can be brilliant too" to Cookie at the photo shoot.  And her love of perverse role-playing of the other woman (women?)  And what about that BJ Towel that she keeps handy for when her man needs to be soothed into taking his meds??  Awesome!

I guess I'm just a kiddie at the age of 43 because I just didn't like this episode. This show is likely building itself on style and silliness, not substance, which is unfortunate.  Very lucky renewal!

I don't understand what you're saying.  Why would the NETWORK renewing the show have to do with the WRITERS and PRODUCERS making a show you are bored with?

 

Judd Nelson!

 

I was worried that Jamal was going to shot out there on the streets.

 

I would like to know more about Michael.  Does he work?  Does he have family?

Nevermind!

Edited January 29, 2015 by Syndicate

[Dusty]

I liked the slow burn of this episode.  I think it'll get to be to much if it's crazy all the time. That can get grating and while this is a soap and I love the crazy, some of my favorite moments from soaps through the years have been the quiet ones. I think it's already going to be crazy most of the time.

 

I don't think that Lucious turned Hakeem against his mother but I don't think he talked her up either.  I think he just didn't talk about her at all and Hakeem formed his own opinions on the matter.  If Lucious was bad talking Cookie to Hakeem then I think Hakeem would fight back more with Lucious when he complains about her to him and Lucious just laughs or says he needs to respect her.  Like why would he say he has to respect her if all Lucious has told him was that Cookie was a terrible person and mother.  I don't think he helped at all but I also don't think he threw her under the bus so to speak with Hakeem.

 

So Anika knows now.  Makes sense that out of everyone she would know.  She does live with him and probably is the one that had him go see a doctor when the symptoms first started.  That was sweet scene. I wonder how they're going to progress Lucious' illness though.  He said the doctors didn't give him much time and no offense to the reality of the disease but I don't really want to see a bedridden Lucious and to be honest I don't think he's going to let himself go out like that anyway.  If this show continues to be a success I wonder how they're going to stretch out his three years.  I think Lucious is an ass like 99% of the time but I also don't think the show would be the same without him.  Maybe they should've gone with MS which can be easier to play around with timeline wise.

 

I really liked the Andre flashback.  I like that they were hanging out and singing together.  It's totally going to bite him in the ass, giving Lucious an alibi.  I think it was kind of a dumb one too considering Lucious could've just said "Oh yeah I was hanging out with my son." instead being like "Oh I don't know. Maids and stuff."  I hope it doesn't turn into Andre getting arrested for it because as evidenced so far Lucious isn't above letting someone take the fall for something he did or at the very least was part of.

 

My favorite part has to be when Anika is like "I'm going to get Titan." and everyone just pretty much laughed at her like "Oh bless your heart, but sit down.  This ain't your crowd." Cookie had her moment last episode with the Swedish guys and this was Anika's.  I will give her props for still trying to say that she got this after the drive by because I would be like NOPE.  All yours Cookie.

[jsbt]

Speaking of the Shonda Rhimes Effect, I feel this show isn't sweating nearly as hard as HTGAWM, which is probably why I can still stand to watch it. Every single character on the latter show except Viola Davis' is a shrill caricature and the plotting is incredibly ADD. This is the only primetime network drama I watch, for a reason. Empire doesn't have to push a hashtag every week, the show is the hashtag, and it knows how to work the slow burn with character and the drama that comes out of them. I'm really enjoying watching people talk and scheme and develop, and I loved how they unspooled so much this week.

[memememe76]

What I like about Empire is that all the characters have at least some knowledge or competence in the industry (varying degrees, of course). There is no "complete novice" on the show that needs to be explained how the industry works. Cookie may not know everything there is to know about the industry because she's been out of it for awhile, but it's not because she's stupid. 

 

Andre covering for his dad was a very interesting flashback. Makes sense--he already lost his mom, didn't want to lose his dad too. 

[missbonnie]

This episode may have been "slower" but I preferred it to last week. The difference between trashy soap and great soap comes down to character development for me.

Tonight gave us a lot of backstory. The Andre/Lucious flashback was my favorite flashback they've done. We see that adult Andre may not be an artist, he certainly understands the art as his father indoctrinated him in it from a young age. It also shows us why he's so upset about not even being considered to take over the empire since it looks like he has always had his father's back.

I also like that some layers were added to Lucious and Anika's relationship. She has always felt like a simple appendage but tonight did a good job of making me feel that there was a connection between the two even if I do think he is more inspired by Cookie.

Loved seeing Cookie being smart in her wheeling and dealing. In fact, I loved all of the business stuff in this episode. So often the professional realm of these shows is related to law, or medicine or law enforcement. This is a nice change.

See, this is exactly how I viewed it and my sister thought that it was too slow as well. I just can't get on board with Andre's wife though. I mean damn that Lucious is one cold hearted bastard to be all giving Cookie words she I think needs to hear from him and yet next week he proposes to Anika? As low as that is, I think it's a couple of hundred feet up from the pond scum that is Rhonda. As of right now, in my opinion, she serves no useful purpose on this show. Of course, as always, YMMV. One more thing, I loved Judd Hirsch tonight. Edited January 29, 2015 by missbonnie

[Irlandesa]

I agree with this too.  It's unfortunate that these days, showrunners feel they have to cram 15 plot developments and 10 shockers into every episode to hold the attention of us kiddies. 

People watch for different things but I do find I burn out quickly on shows that continuously strive to top itself in shocking twists.  I think that's why I rarely past 2 or 3 seasons with Shonda's shows.  It eventually feels like she abandons character in the pursuit of those big plot twists.  (I loved Breaking Bad when it was on and that show would have many "slow" episodes where it let its plot breathe and its characters develop.  When those shocking twists happened, they resonated and are still powerful in repeats because of that character/plot pacing.)

 

Honestly, for me, the flashback with Andre is the kind of "surprise" I love as much as the bombastic surprises.  Heck, I liked it more than Lucious shooting a man. 

 

One of the biggest themes of the first four episodes has been authenticity and how certain people (Big Pho & Hakeem) don't have it while others (Titan & Lucious) do. Hakeem isn't authentic because he has lived a life of privilege for probably as long as he can remember.  He has knowledge of the "street" life but he doesn't actually know it.  Jamal probably has some passing memories but was  too young to have experienced it the way his parents experienced it.  To his credit, he doesn't sing about those struggles but rather his own personal struggles.

 

What the flashback did is remind us that Andre was old enough to have memories of that life. He's old enough to remember his parents selling drugs.  He remembers the us vs. them mentality in regards to the wars with the cops and other drug dealers.

 

Andre made numerous choices over the years and he now more closely resembles someone that Anika grew up with rather than someone his parents raised, but the flashback served to remind us that he was a soldier of the war even at a young age.  Unlike his brothers, the "street" still flows in him.  And that makes him 1000X more dangerous than he may seem judging on the wrapping paper.

 

So when he was covering for his father again, I was like "Dayummmm." 

 

Very lucky renewal!

We can debate forever about the quality of the show but what can't be debated is that the show started out very strong ratings-wise and then only got stronger.  The only people "lucky" here are the FOX execs who greenlit this show. 

Edited January 29, 2015 by Irlandesa

[RedRebelSummer]

I was waiting on somebody in this series to say something about a thot... Who better to do it than Hakeem's Manish ass smh lol

Edited January 29, 2015 by RedRebelSummer

[Actionmage]

As low as that is, I think it's a couple of hundred feet up from the pond scum that is Rhonda.

 

How is Rhonda pond scum when she hasn't actually committed a felony, at least that the show has told us about? She has not-strictly missionary sex with her husband and has a business as a photographer. (Either ad/magazine layouts, hence the hunks, or whatever freelance gig she can land.)  She seems to be monogamous to-date, and seems to be invested in helping Andre reach his goals. I am not seeing 'pond scum' activities. Like shooting your ex-wife's cousin because you got tired of paying him to keep secrets and beating industry folk because you can and get away with the beatings.

 

Also, why is Andre not 'pond scum' as well?

 

 

I think Tiana was savvy enough not to blow off a high-profile appearance, like the Teen Choice Awards. (Yeah, I know. I can't believe I wrote that either! Anyhoo...) I just hope that Cookie gave her some counsel and we get a Taraji/Naomi showdown!

 

Judd Nelson was a) looking good, tho' sleaztastic and b)fun! I loved how Lucious was reminded by Tiana, of all folks, that Cookie was all about protecting the music and making stars. Which ties back, imo, to Lucious having his 'fire in the belly' moment after Baretti promised that Empire was going down.   I thought it was whimsical of JN's character to say he'd rename Leviticus, Cookie's. Be careful of what you wish, sir.

 

Becky was delightful! Love Gabby and her happy freak-out over the all access passes. It was better than what I was thinking Lucious would do, which was to tear them up in front of Hakeem. Seeing they were the works possibly stopped that. I was worried for poor Becky and her girls once guns came out! That place was super-packed.

 

I wonder how alike Jamal and Lu really are after all, since Lucious' father's death is not a question in trying to poach Titan. Just stickin' it to Baretti. While last week we had Jamal not caring about how hard living is going to be after leaving the loft , but determined to end up with the company.  I like that the common ground with Lucious and Jamal is that they are fighting to keep their intellectual property. Cookie, of course, was always on that.

 

I am feeling mixed on Anika at the diner. While it was no greasy spoon/dive, it wasn't exactly upscale, so why the obvious fancy earrings and really nice clothes. Why not some good jeans, killer heels, more tasteful studs/ earcuff/earrings, and a dressed up oxford or similar shirt. It wasn't like you were meeting Jay and Bey. And even they know when to dress down for the venue. But then Anika, shaking from all the feels, is all " I can do this, Lucious!"  I can't help but respect that. Facing that reality and wanting to continue is admirable. I don't know if she should, but I think she's cool for trying to  make it a business thing she has to just deal with. 

 

Just so much to enjoy!  Fun soapy stuff!

[dirtypop90]

Ok episode. best parts were Andre, Anika being fleshed out more, and Cookie getting a win.

 

I really want more Andre! I just feel there's so much ground to cover there. Cookie puts forth so much effort with hakeem and jamal but none with Andre. Can we get more andre and cookie instead of multiple scenes of hakeem shutting cookie out?

 

Andre feeling the need to protect his father from a young age was not surprising, but I found it very interesting that Andre can sing. It makes lucious's treatment of him even more odd. We know his problem with Jamal, but what's his issue with Andre? In the preview where andre tells him hakeem's music video is way over budget, and lucious says "if you can't get money for this what good are you?" (something like that) I was like whaaat? I don't get it. Is it just a case of taking him for granted because he knows he'll always be there?

Edited January 29, 2015 by dirtypop90

[Actionmage]

Is it just a case of taking him for granted because he knows he'll always be there?

 

dirtypop90, I think you have the reason. After he lost Cookie, his wife, to prison, the only other person he felt honestly had his back was Andre. Look at how he treated Bunkie and how Lucious treats Vernon. (By the by, I'd like a bit more on ol' Uncle Vern! What up with him?)

 

I also forgot earlier: Like others, I think Bushwick is going to be good for Jamal, musically, because he can add real rhythms to already existing tracks and/or lyrics and come out with crazy hooks and melodies. Now, that can be the sound of tires on the overpass or neighbors dragging a stick across a chain link fence, but I'm betting it's a side Jamal may have forgotten/grown away from.

 

I, too, think that Andre is very interesting, especially after tonight's flashback. He might be the most surprising of the sons.

[GreekGeek]

I also loved the flashback of Kid Andre and Lucious. Until Lucious said his name, I wasn't sure which son he was because the two singing together threw me off. So Andre had some interest and ability in music as a kid. I wonder why he never pursued it?

 

After Lucious and Andre finished telling their story to the detective, there was a shot of Vernon with a very troubled look on his face. Does he suspect they're lying? If so, how?

[Syndicate]

People watch for different things but I do find I burn out quickly on shows that continuously strive to top itself in shocking twists.  I think that's why I rarely past 2 or 3 seasons with Shonda's shows.  It eventually feels like she abandons character in the pursuit of those big plot twists.  (I loved Breaking Bad when it was on and that show would have many "slow" episodes where it let its plot breathe and its characters develop.  When those shocking twists happened, they resonated and are still powerful in repeats because of that character/plot pacing.)

 

Honestly, for me, the flashback with Andre is the kind of "surprise" I love as much as the bombastic surprises.  Heck, I liked it more than Lucious shooting a man. 

 

One of the biggest themes of the first four episodes has been authenticity and how certain people (Big Pho & Hakeem) don't have it while others (Titan & Lucious) do. Hakeem isn't authentic because he has lived a life of privilege for probably as long as he can remember.  He has knowledge of the "street" life but he doesn't actually know it.  Jamal probably has some passing memories but was  too young to have experienced it the way his parents experienced it.  To his credit, he doesn't sing about those struggles but rather his own personal struggles.

 

What the flashback did is remind us that Andre was old enough to have memories of that life. He's old enough to remember his parents selling drugs.  He remembers the us vs. them mentality in regards to the wars with the cops and other drug dealers.

 

Andre made numerous choices over the years and he now more closely resembles someone that Anika grew up with rather than someone his parents raised, but the flashback served to remind us that he was a soldier of the war even at a young age.  Unlike his brothers, the "street" still flows in him.  And that makes him 1000X more dangerous than he may seem judging on the wrapping paper.

 

So when he was covering for his father again, I was like "Dayummmm." 

 

We can debate forever about the quality of the show but what can't be debated is that the show started out very strong ratings-wise and then only got stronger.  The only people "lucky" here are the FOX execs who greenlit this show.   

Yes, those FOX execs are shockingly lucky, which is why I said very lucky renewal.

Edited January 29, 2015 by Syndicate

[Malbec]

Ok episode. best parts were Andre, Anika being fleshed out more, and Cookie getting a win.

 

I really want more Andre! I just feel there's so much ground to cover there. Cookie puts forth so much effort with hakeem and jamal but none with Andre. Can we get more andre and cookie instead of multiple scenes of hakeem shutting cookie out?

 

Andre feeling the need to protect his father from a young age was not surprising, but I found it very interesting that Andre can sing. It makes lucious's treatment of him even more odd. We know his problem with Jamal, but what's his issue with Andre? In the preview where andre tells him hakeem's music video is way over budget, and lucious says "if you can't get money for this what good are you?" (something like that) I was like whaaat? I don't get it. Is it just a case of taking him for granted because he knows he'll always be there?

 

I agree with all of this.  It also feels a little bit like, Luscious is uncomfortable with people who remind him of the past (Cookie, Bunky) and he's more attached to people who represent the future and who don't interfere with his fantasy of himself as a completely self-made man (Anika, Hakeem and even Jamal despite their other issues). Andre, poor guy, seems like he was just old enough and just aware enough to fall on the wrong side of that.  After that flashback, the "what purpose do you serve?" line in the preview was just brutal.

[Syndicate]

Ok episode. best parts were Andre, Anika being fleshed out more, and Cookie getting a win.

 

I really want more Andre! I just feel there's so much ground to cover there. Cookie puts forth so much effort with hakeem and jamal but none with Andre. Can we get more andre and cookie instead of multiple scenes of hakeem shutting cookie out?

 

Andre feeling the need to protect his father from a young age was not surprising, but I found it very interesting that Andre can sing. It makes lucious's treatment of him even more odd. We know his problem with Jamal, but what's his issue with Andre? In the preview where andre tells him hakeem's music video is way over budget, and lucious says "if you can't get money for this what good are you?" (something like that) I was like whaaat? I don't get it. Is it just a case of taking him for granted because he knows he'll always be there?

Yes, I now believe it's Andre who's poised to be the best part of the show, but only if he's given more focus.  Cookie really needs to detach herself from Jamal's hip for awhile because it's kind of tiresome already.

Edited January 29, 2015 by Syndicate

[Neurochick]

This episode was slower, but I liked it.  I liked it a lot better than shows that feel they need a huge twist in the last seven minutes.  That gets tiresome after a while.  I like slow burns of stories because I don't burn out so quickly.  It's like a good relationship, the good stuff doesn't have to happen in the first five minutes.

 

My favorite scene was of young Andre and his dad.  It's like he knew his father was lying and immediately knew just what to say to the police.  

 

Judd Nelson as Baretti is certainly an interesting casting choice.

 

 

I wasn't 100% sure that was him, but it was nice seeing him.  

[aprilbabe]

Ok, I'm trying to understand why the hell Cookie is doing so much for Lucius still. She got him his dreams, paid for it with 17 years in jail and away from her kids. And now, she gets him an artist he wants. Yet he still doesn't give her the credit publicly for any of it. There's something so painful about how much Cookie will still give this man and I don't see the same from him. I know the jury's out, but this episode made me think Cookie still loves his pompadour wearing ass, ugh. 

She not really doing it for him as she is doing for herself. This is Cookies company and she's trying to prove that shes valuable and should have a bigger role in the company. The more artist she gets to sign and more artist she is able to manage, the more good things she does for the company the more people take her seriously. She's fighting for her place.

 

On another note. Anyone notice that Lucious treats Cookie completely different when they are in front of Anika, than he does when they are alone. He acts like shes an annoyance when Anika's around, but when she's not he seems genuinely enjoys her company. Also he was eyeing the hell of Cookie especially in that last scene, he even leaned back to get a better look at her ass.

[Tiger]

There was some really good stuff this episode like the flashback of Andre & Lew-shush, Jamal getting that song together while walking around, and that Cookie/BBK scene where Cook grabbed BBK's pearls.

There was also some great character moment like Cookie bringing Jamal & Michael that pizza, Becky getting excited about Titan, Portia saying "I don't do taxes", and Vernon looking with suspicion at Andre & Lew-shush.

But I swear every third world of dialogue was "Titan" and all things Hakeem/Tiana/Camilla were simultaneously boring and irritating. The real problem here is that IMHO the actor playing Hakeem doesn't have the chops to bring the nuance that is needed to play a character this unlikable. He also can't generate any chemistry with the actresses playing Tirana and Camilla, and he is so flat opposite TPH and TH its laughable.

I'm sure many would find it too soapy, but i think they should have a fire or a car bomb or something to have Hakeem disfigured so he has to have plastic surgery to explain a new actor.

ETA: they finally found a good hair style for BBK. I see lots of black women that look fantastic with short hair, so I'm not sure why they are struggling with her look. Especially since Annika has money, she shouldn't have a struggle look which IMHO she did in the first three episodes.

Edited January 29, 2015 by Tiger

[LydiaMoon1]

Add me to the chorus of people who appreciated last night's slower pace.  All that "shocking twist" nonsense all of the time is exhausting and gets on my nerves. Last night's episode provided a lot of insight and character development.  If they keep giving me a good show week after week, I'll be satisfied. I agree with so much that's already been said that I don't have much to add this week. 

 

Best scene of the week:

The flashback of Lew and Andre (for all the reasons stated above).  Seems to me that Andre is a treasure box just waiting to be opened.

 

Honorable Mention:

Anything with Cookie (her talk with Titan's mom, her musical advice to Hakeem and her face when he rejected her again, Cookie and Lew at the end).  TPH is pure gold.

 

Worst scene of the week:

Okay, this wasn't bad, but it made me laugh with unintentional humor.  Jamal walking the streets rattling chains and kicking trashcans gave me such Michael Jackson vibes that I half expected him to throw up his arms and yell OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

 

Just me?  Oh, okay.

[Primetimer]

For one week, at least, Empire is TV's most pragmatic drama.

Read the story

[SimoneS]

Other than the flashback of Andre and Lucious, my favorite scene last night was Cookie with Titan's mother. Even as Cookie was trying to bond with her about both of them being worried mothers, her despair over her estrangement with her sons was heartbreaking. Cookie needs a friend. I wish her sister was closer so she could be a confidant. 

 

Whatever her feelings for Lucious, I don't think Cookie has many illusions about who he really is. He is the one is self-delusional which is why he can show up and mourn Bunkie after killing him and then tell Cookie that he never forgot her after he stopped visiting her in prison and moved on with his life.

 

I felt for Anika. Between Cookie's arrival and Lucious' ALS, her life has been turned upside down. That is a lot for anyone to handle.

[Milz]

Ok, I'm trying to understand why the hell Cookie is doing so much for Lucius still. She got him his dreams, paid for it with 17 years in jail and away from her kids. And now, she gets him an artist he wants. Yet he still doesn't give her the credit publicly for any of it. There's something so painful about how much Cookie will still give this man and I don't see the same from him. I know the jury's out, but this episode made me think Cookie still loves his pompadour wearing ass, ugh. 

 

I think Cookie is doing this for Empire and her sons, not Lucious.  I think she knows who Lucious is and I think she knows how he's playing with the three sons will destroy Empire and the family.

 

BUT, the episode really, really, really makes me want to know exactly why Lucious divorced Cookie. Per Cookie, Lucious just stopped all contact with her without any explanation.

I loved Porsha's expression when Lucious called her Donkey-Kong. More Porsha please!

[aprilbabe]

I

BUT, the episode really, really, really makes me want to know exactly why Lucious divorced Cookie. Per Cookie, Lucious just stopped all contact with her without any explanation.

I loved Porsha's expression when Lucious called her Donkey-Kong. More Porsha please!

Im not curious about why he divorced. I mean as opposed to what?   Staying married and waiting for her for 30 years. Don't really know anyone who would do that. Once she was sentenced for that long the relationship was over. I AM however curious as to why he went about it the way that he did. If had come to the jail, talked to her, and ended the relationship face to face, told her he wanted a divorce and why, I think Cookie would've understood and had her closure. I don't understand why he didn't do that. Was he just a coward??

Edited January 29, 2015 by aprilbabe

[teebax]

I liked the slower pace of this episode. As a viewer, I want to know the layers of a character; it connects me better to the overall story. In order to give us those layers, shows need episodes like this. It's not filler to me at all. I am already fascinated by a few of the characters, and we're only three episodes in. As a few posters said above, I don't need shocking twists and turns every episode. For me, less is more.

 

I also don't feel a need to compare this show to any of Shonda's shows. I'm still very much into Scandal and HTGAWM and am just happy that there are so many strong dramas on television, especially since we're seeing great parts for actors of color as well. It's a great time to be a fan of TV!

[Mozelle]

Worst scene of the week:

Okay, this wasn't bad, but it made me laugh with unintentional humor.  Jamal walking the streets rattling chains and kicking trashcans gave me such Michael Jackson vibes that I half expected him to throw up his arms and yell OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

 

Just me?  Oh, okay.

 

Nope, not just you! Initially I was like, that fool tryna get shot?! But now I can't get the image out of my head of him channeling Michael Jackson. Thanks! :/

 

Like many others have said, I also enjoyed the slow burn of this episode. Character development is always a plus as far as I'm concerned. They're needed to sustain plot. I liked how Cookie was able to speak to and relate to Titan's mother. I'm also curious how the NOI played a role in Lucious' father's death. 

 

That flashback between Andre and Lucious was a nice detail. Andre is a tough one, and I think I've been sleeping on him. That at a young age he knew to hide the gun for his father because he understood what it would mean for Lucious to be caught with the weapon is an important note. He doesn't know now what his covering for his father could mean, but that he knows he needs to do it just in case makes me wonder why Lucious is so much more focused on Hakeem running Empire than Andre. 

 

 

[marceline]

This episode may have been "slower" but I preferred it to last week.  The difference between trashy soap and great soap comes down to character development for me. 

 

 

ITA. They did a ton of character work in this episode. I especially loved that we got to see a bit of how lonely and abandoned Cookie felt in prison. The first scenes were all about her bravado and bluster but then we got a scene of her in a head scarf telling another mother how scared she is for her children and her deep sense of loss at not having been there for them. 

[DearEvette]

Count me in as one who liked that this episode seemed to slow down and take it's time.

You simply can't sustain a break-neck pace week in/week out and have every other scene being high, high camp drama before the show and the characters all become cartoons.

I like that the show stepped back and took the time to look at more of business aspect of Empire and let some of the interpersonal drama take a bit of a back seat.

I also like that this episode seemed to focus on the women a bit more and let the men take a bit of a back seat.

While I enjoy Cookie pwning Boo Boo, I do appreciate the deeper look we get at Annika. I can only imagine that being a debutante with a privileged background may have been somewhat of a sore point at times, what with the pre-occupation in the Hip Hop world for 'keeping it real.' And what is less real to an art form that takes it's pride from it's artists mostly being 'from the streets' that some bougie person like Annika who simply can't relate to them. While Lucious is now a rich man, he still has street cred and his kids gets a pass as well. An now here is Cookie, the ultimate representation of Hip-hop keeping-it-realdom in Annika's face.  I like that Annika feels threatened by Cookie on a business level, not on a romance level.

I also liked what we saw of Tianna. I had dismissed her as a little fuax-Rihanna stand in just for titillation purposes. But I liked them showing that she is focused on her career. I like that she recognized that Cookie is hungrier than Annika and would work harder for her. And I liked that she is not letting her involvement with Hakeem mess that up. In fact she is being smarter about her career than he is about his.

And finally, I like the conversation between Cookie and Fatima. On one level you know Cookie was there kinda under false pretenses and playing a bit of a role. But on the other hand there was a great honesty in her conversation with Fatima about mothers raising sons. It was a really nice beat.

Edited January 29, 2015 by DearEvette

[BestestAuntEver]

I liked the slower pace of this episode. As a viewer, I want to know the layers of a character; it connects me better to the overall story. In order to give us those layers, shows need episodes like this. It's not filler to me at all. I am already fascinated by a few of the characters, and we're only three episodes in. As a few posters said above, I don't need shocking twists and turns every episode. For me, less is more.

THIS. The episode didn't feel slow to me at all either. I don't want or need plot point, plot point plot point, twist,plot point, shock plot point. I like to know what drives/motivates a character. Help me to connect so I actually feel for a character when the big twist/shock happens.

I felt like I was being shown more layers for Cookie and Andre. I saw Jamal still sticking to his guns and working things out mentally for his music. Lucious and Hakeem simply continued to be asses, lol.

I understand Lucious being an ass yet Hakeem's assery bugs the crap out of me. He is a spoiled lazy entitled litte shit. His also a dumb ass because he can't see that Camilla and Tiana are playing his slow ass.

SMH, Boo boo kitty, take it from ne, everybody can't go everywhere or handle every situation. Little girl, you need to know this. Debutant means easy mark or absolutely shit in some places.

I want to see TPH and Jude Nelson in a scene. I hooted when he said he'd rename Leveticus, Cookie's.

Lucious is forever touching and checking out Cookie yet he proposes to BBK.

ITA, that Cookie has his number. It will take more than flowery words to woo her.

ETA : I want to know how NOI plays into this. All I know about NOI is superficial. I didn't understand how working with Titan put them in bed with NOI. Wouldn't the same have held true for Bill?

Edited January 29, 2015 by BestestAuntEver