Bethenny Frankel: Skinny Girl

[Celia Rubenstein]

1 hour ago, motorcitymom65 said:

So now she gets some things when she is with one parent, but she doesn't get those things when she is with the other parent. It seems small, but it really isn't. And that is why it is a dick move for Jason to do it. Because he knew how Beth felt about it, but he did it anyway. 

This makes me wonder what other mutually-agreed upon things Jason will decide to do his *own* way even though it would be better off for Bryn if things stayed consistent between the two houses she will be living in.  What is he going to throw out the window the next time he is mad at Bethenny and wants to upset her, or because he wants to be the more popular parent? 

I am not talking about minor personal decisions like wearing shoes in the house.  I mean like what age Bryn is allowed to start dating...  Will Bethenny and Jason decide she needs to be 16, then Jason will decide when Bryn is with him she can go out on a date at 14 just because he wants to irritate Beth?  Or will she be allowed to take her car and go on an overnight roadtrip with friends when she has had her license for a month when there was a prior understanding she needed be home with the car by midnight, no later, just he can be the "cool parent?"  

It's really not fair to Bryn for Jason to set her up for such a situation.  Not that he cares, of course (it may even be his goal), but it could drive a wedge between Bryn and her mother.  She will resent Beth for putting restraints on her that Jason does not.  And it could teach Bryn some bad habits about how to manipulate people - something Jason may not intend, but which could easily happen as Bryn is forced to learn how to navigate between two people who can't stand each other. 

[motorcitymom65]

34 minutes ago, film noire said:

It feels obsessive to bring this up in court, instead of accepting that your ex, as much as you may hate him, is allowed to build his own food traditions with his daughter).

Honestly, I think that we are making a bigger deal out of the bacon than Bethenny probably did. It is about changing decisions that they had agreed upon when they were married. 

Edited July 8, 2017 by motorcitymom65

[film noire]

2 minutes ago, motorcitymom65 said:

Honestly, I think that we are making a bigger deal out of it than Bethenny probably did. 

In her testimony, it was one of the reasons she cited as to why she should have sole custody -- that's making it a big deal, imo.

[Celia Rubenstein]

I don't think Bethenny brought hot dogs up in court because she thought she would win custody by showing that Jason makes poor dietary choices for Bryn.  Rather I think it was intended to show that he had no respect for or intention of honoring agreements made about how to raise Bryn, and might even go so far as to do things that (at one time he agreed) were not in Bryn's best interests just to upset Bethenny.  Essentially, it was meant to make him look uncooperative and spiteful and a poor choice to receive custody.

[QuinnM]

50 minutes ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

I don't think Bethenny brought hot dogs up in court because she thought she would win custody by showing that Jason makes poor dietary choices for Bryn.  Rather I think it was intended to show that he had no respect for or intention of honoring agreements made about how to raise Bryn, and might even go so far as to do things that (at one time he agreed) were not in Bryn's best interests just to upset Bethenny.  Essentially, it was meant to make him look uncooperative and spiteful and a poor choice to receive custody.

That also fits with her statement that they had agreed on baptizing Bryn for his parents but that she would not be raised Catholic.  Her attendance would be limited to Holy Days.  And he disregarded that as well. D

[zoeysmom]

From what has been presented I feel as if the agreement, if in fact it did exist to be vague and ambiguous.  When does the child get to try the gateway meat?  Who decides?  Is it a unilateral decision or does it require the approval of both parents?  What is a party?  Could it be Grandpa's birthday and they are having inane bacon and eggs is that a party?  In a perfect world filled with imperfect people there just can't be all these exceptions and interpretations of what the intent was agreed. 

In Family Law and the world of pre-nups the courts have generally not upheld any part of the pre-nup regarding personal behavior and child rearing.  Parties can enter into a separate agreement but the court has no power  to intervene.  http://family.findlaw.com/marriage/what-can-and-cannot-be-included-in-prenuptial-agreements.html 

When people divorce it sounds rather strange for the moving party to start reciting agreements.  The moving party promised to love and stay married to the respondent.  Talk about a being spiteful and uncooperative. 

Important things are threatening one party with never seeing their child again.  That is the ultimate in spite and being uncooperative and has a deleterious effect on the child.

[motorcitymom65]

33 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

Important things are threatening one party with never seeing their child again.  That is the ultimate in spite and being uncooperative and has a deleterious effect on the child.

My guess is that there are lots of folks here - and everywhere - who will tell you that there are more things that make it tricky and hard to co-parent besides threatening one party with never seeing their child again. There is a whole bunch of other stuff that makes it hard as well. 

[diadochokinesis]

Ok, on the Bryn being a vegetarian issue...

Here is my main issue with this: there is basically a protocol in place for when a vegetarian starts to reintroduce meat into their diet. Basically, they stop producing enzymes to digest meat so if they just eat a hamburger or hot dog one day after not eating meat for years, it will make them sick. I'm talking throwing up, diarrhea, etc. So, if Hoppy gave Bryn meat and wasn't following the stages then he was probably making her sick.  Depending on when he was giving it to her, he got the fun of giving it to her and knowing that Bethenny was going to deal with the aftermath. 

[zoeysmom]

2 minutes ago, diadochokinesis said:

Ok, on the Bryn being a vegetarian issue...

Here is my main issue with this: there is basically a protocol in place for when a vegetarian starts to reintroduce meat into their diet. Basically, they stop producing enzymes to digest meat so if they just eat a hamburger or hot dog one day after not eating meat for years, it will make them sick. I'm talking throwing up, diarrhea, etc. So, if Hoppy gave Bryn meat and wasn't following the stages then he was probably making her sick.  Depending on when he was giving it to her, he got the fun of giving it to her and knowing that Bethenny was going to deal with the aftermath. 

I would agree about introducing meat and the effect it can have on someone's digestive system which is why the "agreement" was an epic fail.  There has never been a discussion of stages in the agreement just exceptions.   If a child can eat meat at a party or if she feels like it there doesn't seem to be a commitment..  I don't think the human body distinguishes between the party exception, a parent feeding a child meat, and a child just indulging.  In no way do I think either parent would set out to cause the child intestinal distress either intentionally or accidentally.  And I certainly don't believe Jason would intentionally feed the child meat to indulge her and delight in knowing Bethenny would deal with the aftermath.

These parties may hate each other but their head butting involves how they feel violated by the other.  I am in the dark if there has been allegations of intentional physical harm to the child to take a dig at the other parent. 

[diadochokinesis]

2 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

I would agree about introducing meat and the effect it can have on someone's digestive system which is why the "agreement" was an epic fail.  There has never been a discussion of stages in the agreement just exceptions.   If a child can eat meat at a party or if she feels like it there doesn't seem to be a commitment..  I don't think the human body distinguishes between the party exception, a parent feeding a child meat, and a child just indulging.  In no way do I think either parent would set out to cause the child intestinal distress either intentionally or accidentally.  And I certainly don't believe Jason would intentionally feed the child meat to indulge her and delight in knowing Bethenny would deal with the aftermath.

These parties may hate each other but their head butting involves how they feel violated by the other.  I am in the dark if there has been allegations of intentional physical harm to the child to take a dig at the other parent. 

I don't know of any allegations of intentional physical harm. I was just more pointing it out for posters that might not be aware that you can't give a kid raised on a vegetarian diet a hot dog without some serious repercussions. Hot dogs are like the absolute last thing you would introduce. 

Also, most daycares/nurseries have very strict guidelines for food brought in for parties. When I lived in the US, my daughter's daycare would allow cupcakes but it had to be from a bakery with a complete ingredient list on the box and the teachers would check it against each child's allergies and dietary restrictions. The nurseries in my part of the world pretty much only allow fresh fruit to be brought in because of all the different cultures and religious rules on diets. So, I doubt she would have gotten a meat item if the daycare knew Bryn was vegetarian. 

[Giselle]

4 hours ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

I believe Brynn now prefers espresso (she just had to drink out of Daddy's cute little cup and now she's hooked on the stuff). 

 She sips it while she munches her bacon as she reads the Times to Jason. 

Please. It's Kopi Luwak exclusively except when she's slumming then it's Blue Mountain.

[Giselle]

36 minutes ago, diadochokinesis said:

Ok, on the Bryn being a vegetarian issue...

Here is my main issue with this: there is basically a protocol in place for when a vegetarian starts to reintroduce meat into their diet. Basically, they stop producing enzymes to digest meat so if they just eat a hamburger or hot dog one day after not eating meat for years, it will make them sick. I'm talking throwing up, diarrhea, etc. So, if Hoppy gave Bryn meat and wasn't following the stages then he was probably making her sick.  Depending on when he was giving it to her, he got the fun of giving it to her and knowing that Bethenny was going to deal with the aftermath. 

Oh kinda like when one parent feeds the kid corn and it's the other parents turn to get up that night.

My mom and dad liked to tell that story.

[breezy424]

Stepping out from the other side of the pool.  Oh my gosh.  Just my opinion but this conversation about hot dogs and bacon have gone off the rails.

We're not talking about a child wishing to taste a parent's alcoholic drink. We're not talking about a child eating something that they have an allergy to.

Ya know.  Many parents start out with a plan to have their child having a diet that is so called healthy.  Yeah, cool.  Then there's reality.  Beth may want her child to have a healthy diet but this also the woman who has made millions selling alcoholic beverages and now has a deal to sell cold cuts.  Was Jason on board with Bryn's diet?  Maybe.  Or was it about a one or two year old where the child basically doesn't really have a choice.  By three things change.  They're exposed to more 'opportunities'.  And they 'notice' what mommy and daddy are eating as well as others they're around.  Beth may be a legume gal.  I think Jason is probably more main stream.  Quite frankly, and I know others will disagree, Beth suffers from first child syndrome.  Let's discuss....because I know others will have a lot to say on that.

Bottom line for me is that Beth said at the custody trial is that she didn't want Bryn to be deprived or felt to be 'different' if the child wanted to eat what others were eating.  She also said that  Jason didn't consult her.  The problem is that Beth feels that she is supposed to in charge.  She's not.  And she is being, IMO, a bit hypocritical. 

In any case, I don't think bacon or hot dogs are being shoved down this child's throat.  IMO, moderation is the key. 

I'll go back to the other side of the pool where I'm having a few strips of bacon (isn't it the perfect food and guilty pleasure) and a beverage.  I'm not crazy about hot dogs but I did make them for dinner tonight because 'it' was easy.  The kids are fine.  Moderation is everything.

[Giselle]

17 minutes ago, breezy424 said:

Stepping out from the other side of the pool.  Oh my gosh.  Just my opinion but this conversation about hot dogs and bacon have gone off the rails.

We're not talking about a child wishing to taste a parent's alcoholic drink. We're not talking about a child eating something that they have an allergy to.

Ya know.  Many parents start out with a plan to have their child having a diet that is so called healthy.  Yeah, cool.  Then there's reality.  Beth may want her child to have a healthy diet but this also the woman who has made millions selling alcoholic beverages and now has a deal to sell cold cuts.  Was Jason on board with Bryn's diet?  Maybe.  Or was it about a one or two year old where the child basically doesn't really have a choice.  By three things change.  They're exposed to more 'opportunities'.  And they 'notice' what mommy and daddy are eating as well as others they're around.  Beth may be a legume gal.  I think Jason is probably more main stream.  Quite frankly, and I know others will disagree, Beth suffers from first child syndrome.  Let's discuss....because I know others will have a lot to say on that.

Bottom line for me is that Beth said at the custody trial is that she didn't want Bryn to be deprived or felt to be 'different' if the child wanted to eat what others were eating.  She also said that  Jason didn't consult her.  The problem is that Beth feels that she is supposed to in charge.  She's not.  And she is being, IMO, a bit hypocritical. 

In any case, I don't think bacon or hot dogs are being shoved down this child's throat.  IMO, moderation is the key. 

I'll go back to the other side of the pool where I'm having a few strips of bacon (isn't it the perfect food and guilty pleasure) and a beverage.  I'm not crazy about hot dogs but I did make them for dinner tonight because 'it' was easy.  The kids are fine.  Moderation is everything.

This makes me love you so much more. Clink!

Wanna play Marco Polo or do we just wanna water buffalo on  floaties?

[BBHN]

Quote

God, I hope Jason doesn't like it with a shot of Bailey's, because you know, you cannot refuse to let kids try things they want. 

He takes it in the morning with a shot of Bitter Loss, served with a side of Angry Resentment. Both taste stalkeriffic to him.

Quote

There has been a plethora of incidents where Bethenny has changed her stance on an issue about a co-star and it is always she has the right to change her mind.

Well, that is her right...just like it is for any other HW. Or person in general.

Quote

If anything, eating what her father and grandparents were eating at family dinners may have given Bryn a sense of belonging, as opposed to having to eat a plate of food different than theirs

I guess having her eat in her underwear would have made more of a sense of belonging for Bryn as well lol

Quote

Depending on when he was giving it to her, he got the fun of giving it to her and knowing that Bethenny was going to deal with the aftermath. 

Ouch. Poor Bryn!

[film noire]

1 hour ago, diadochokinesis said:

So, if Hoppy gave Bryn meat and wasn't following the stages then he was probably making her sick.  Depending on when he was giving it to her, he got the fun of giving it to her and knowing that Bethenny was going to deal with the aftermath. 

 Bethenny/her lawyer would have brought up any kind of illness - violent or otherwise - if Bryn had experienced that from eating a hot dog or bacon. That would have significantly added weight to the argument that she was the better parent.

[Giselle]

6 hours ago, shoegal said:

...and if little Bryn wanted to taste daddy's beer or one of his jalapeño poppers, well, she was curious! No one can say no!

Are we so sure that Beff hasn't given her a finger taste of her newest Skinnygirl cocktail? I wouldn't get my knickers in a twist even if she did.

I have to wonder if Beffy is just pissed that it was a piece of plain old bacon and not Skinnygirl Cane Sugar Sweet Uncured Ham?

[formerlyfreedom]

Hey, all - just so you know...

The hot dog debate? It's over. Please move on.

[BBHN]

Tough life...

[zoeysmom]

Bethenny opens up in new Parade Magazine interview:  https://parade.com/584198/jerylbrunner/bethenny-frankel-on-finding-success-shark-tank-and-the-newest-addition-to-the-skinnygirl-family/  She sounds pretty upbeat about her Shark Tank appearances.

Once again Bethenny commenting on the dynamics of the show and who should be cast. " I would like to see some younger cast members.  I'd like to see an African American woman on the show.  I suggested someone who didn't work out.  There are really no Jewish women on the cast.  There are also no Asian, Latino, or gay women on the show.  I'd like to represent New York more."

Last season there was Jewish, Asian younger Jules.  Over the years there have been Jewish women Jill, Aviva, Heather, Cindy Barshop, Jennifer Gilbert, Jules to name a few.  It seems Bethenny may have scared some off by doing her bad Jew business last year on Jules.  Kristen was younger and Bethenny treated her poorly.  And well Bethennyis Jewish.  So over 14 RHONYC six of the women are Jewish.  Maybe Bethenny should take a look back at how she treated Jill. Heather and Jules.  To me, the biggest missing component is it has become a RH show with no (until this year) married women.  These women don't even want to acknowledge Luann being married.  Luann had an African American friend who was in the running that didn't work out as well.  She was featured at Luann's photo shoot and treated to a Bethenny melt down.   As a viewer I don't care what the race, religious affiliation or sexual preference.  I would not be crazy about bringing in token representatives, especially the way the newbies get treated.  As to age Ramona spikes at the high end and has had Jules, Tinsley that are young enough to be her daughter.  I don't really see early thirty somethings wanting to be a part of these women's lives.  Way too much baggage. 

Bethenny also revealed the name of her new show-Keeping It Real Estate .  Representative of her brand, good for her, kind of nonsensical.  I guess it is what branding is all about.

I would disagree with her assertion she is not a negative person. 

She of course addresses her "situation" with Jason. "I personally had a verynegative situation which affected me emotionally. It affected my health."  I hope Jason isn't to blame for her fibroids. 

[KungFuBunny]

[Jel]

He might be!  (Some claim stress may exacerbate the condition.)

I think Keep It Real Estate is a great name.

I think she was talking about the present cast of the show, which is definitely lacking in diversity. 

[KungFuBunny]

She looks good in Yellow

[BBHN]

Quote

It seems Bethenny may have scared some off by doing her bad Jew business last year on Jules

Exactly who was scared off?

By that logic, you could argue potential HWs were scared off by the inherent snobbishness of Luann, Sonja, and Ramona.

Jill left when Bethenny was no longer on the show. Cindy and Aviva came and went when Bethenny was off the show. Jennifer was never more than a Friend of one season and a guest another, and her not becoming a HW had nothing to do with Bethenny. And Jules' leaving also had nothing to do with Bethenny, it was due to her own marriage imploding.

Quote

Maybe Bethenny should take a look back at how she treated Jill

How Bethenny treated Jill? Wasn't that the other way around?

Also, Bethenny and Heather seemed to be becoming friends towards the end of the season. It would have been interesting to see how things would have developed between them had Heather stayed.

Quote

These women don't even want to acknowledge Luann being married

That isn't proof that they are against the institution of marriage as a whole, they just have their reservations about Luann's marriage specifically.

Quote

She was featured at Luann's photo shoot and treated to a Bethenny melt down

Which has what to do with the issue of lack of diversity on the show?

Quote

I would disagree with her assertion she is not a negative person. 

Being married to Jason would make anyone a negative person...

Quote

I think Keep It Real Estate is a great name.

I like it too.

[zoeysmom]

36 minutes ago, Jel said:

He might be!  (Some claim stress may exacerbate the condition.)

I think Keep It Real Estate is a great name.

I think she was talking about the present cast of the show, which is definitely lacking in diversity. 

Most of Bethenny's stress is self-inflicted.  And I would go so far as to say she is stress inducer when it comes to most of the cast past and present.  She might want to review some of her nastier comments and opinions she has voiced on the show. 

Well if I had never watched the show and since Parade Magazine has a circulation of 22 million versus 2 million RHONYC, I would think she was talking about the show in its entirety and it would be a false representation as to Jewish RHs on the show during its run.  It is not as if the show hasn't had some of the groups represented.   

[motorcitymom65]

2 hours ago, zoeysmom said:

Once again Bethenny commenting on the dynamics of the show and who should be cast. " I would like to see some younger cast members.  I'd like to see an African American woman on the show.  I suggested someone who didn't work out.  There are really no Jewish women on the cast.  There are also no Asian, Latino, or gay women on the show.  I'd like to represent New York more."

I read it as her saying who she would like to see cast, not who should be.  Clearly she is taking about the present and not the past. She is saying something that many others have said. For a show based in a city that many equate with diversity, there is a shocking lack of it on this show.  

I bet Jennifer Gilbert is thrilled to make the list. Was she even a "friend of"? 

[zoeysmom]

8 minutes ago, BBHN said:

Exactly who was scared off?

By that logic, you could argue potential HWs were scared off by the inherent snobbishness of Luann, Sonja, and Ramona.

Jill left when Bethenny was no longer on the show. Cindy and Aviva came and went when Bethenny was off the show. Jennifer was never more than a Friend of one season and a guest another, and her not becoming a HW had nothing to do with Bethenny. And Jules' leaving also had nothing to do with Bethenny, it was due to her own marriage imploding.

How Bethenny treated Jill? Wasn't that the other way around?

Also, Bethenny and Heather seemed to be becoming friends towards the end of the season. It would have been interesting to see how things would have developed between them had Heather stayed.

That isn't proof that they are against the institution of marriage as a whole, they just have their reservations about Luann's marriage specifically.

Which has what to do with the issue of lack of diversity on the show?

Being married to Jason would make anyone a negative person...

I like it too.

We will never know as it is not as if casting and potential casting of RHs is public.  True enough collectively they are not a friendly bunch.  Although I find Ramona far more aggressive towards the other women and unfiltered and hurtful.  I would not put Ramona in the same boat as Sonja or Luann.  I would not want to be around Ramona under any circumstances given her track record of gossip and attacks. 

Reading the article as stand alone it would seem that none of the mentioned groups have ever been a part of the show.  Jill, Jennifer, Heather and Jules all appeared with Bethenny.  Jules certainly had issues with Bethenny and her attacks on Jules being a bad Jew.  Jill tried to atone with Bethenny and she would have no part of it.  I also recall Bethenny picking up chopsticks and threatening to poke Jill's fucking eyes out. So there is that.  Well I don't think Heather gives a rip about Bethenny and she pretty much just rolled over as she knew she would be exiting under her own steam and had her business to protect. 

Since Bethenny specifically has said she will never marry again , of course there are variations on this theme with Bethenny, depending on her feelings in the moment.  I found Dorinda to be way out of line with her comment about staying silent about marriage so as not to offend others. Ramona trying to break up marriages isn't a good look and she continues with Luann to this day.  I think it is far worse for anyone to decide if someone else's marriage is real or good or in this case deserved.  It really isn't any of their business just as Carole getting involved with a much younger guy was none of Luann's business.

Bethenny has said pre-Jason she was always jaded, Jason and his love brought her around. Oh that was to sell a couple of books and get a magazine cover and a spin-off.  Her negativity and coarseness has always been a part of her personality.  Wrapping it in a pretty package and calling it by cute names doesn't disguise what is inside.

The producers tried to introduce an African American cast member she was featured at Luann's photoshoot which turned into another Bethenny meltdown.  Be it Jennifer Gilbert who didn't get extended an invitation or an African American women who didn't make the cut Bethenny was part of the cast and deeply involved in divisive situations with cast members.  I prefer to think people who place their dignity over opportunity, fame and a paycheck are pretty much across the board be them Jewish, African American, Caucasian, Latino or Asian.   We have seen eating disorders condemned and chastised. People labeled crazy to the point they can't come back from it.  Accusations regarding alcoholism, illegal drug use and  the hands of an angry Bethenny.  I think she has to take responsibility for the tenor  of the show before throwing out the lack of diversity on the show.  Bethenny and Carole might also want to take a look at some of their comments regarding the LGBT community, who I have no doubt they support but aren't above a slur or two in the name of humor.  The comments about  fish, strap ons, cross dresser, deep homosexual panic.  Even the almighty Andy identified their discussion as a gay slur. 

The producers walk a tight rope-do they fill a slot or create a slot because diversity would be appropriate?  Do people who would qualify to diversify the cast necessarily want to become friends with these women or expose their families?  Are they entertaining?  DO they have an interesting job?  Will a checkered pass be featured?  Does someone want to come  become an object of Bethenny's derision?  Or Ramona's?  Sonja's next forced house guest so they can be part of Grey Gardens and Sonja's ire and put downs? 

[Celia Rubenstein]

39 minutes ago, BBHN said:

By that logic, you could argue potential HWs were scared off by the inherent snobbishness of Luann, Sonja, and Ramona.

Yes, I can see why many potential cast members would shy away from being on this show ... who wants to be subjected to Luann's superiority or try to keep a straight face while she swans around like she is royalty? Looking up her nostrils while she walks around with her nose in the air would get old quick.  

Sonja is gross and vulgar and I can understand people not wanting any part of a show she is on. And Ramona is just nasty and so cruel. Who wants to be subjected to that? 

The biggest reason to avoid this show is, of course, Bravo itself. Them and their contrived storylines and the chainsaws they use to edit everything ... a person has to be nuts to turn their public image over to the likes of misogynist assholes like Andy Cohen and his ilk so they can make money off of exploiting you.

Bethenny was the one in a million who managed to turn things to her advantage. I guess a lot of women out there realize their chances of being as fortunate as she was are pretty slim, so why bother.

2 hours ago, zoeysmom said:

Last season there was Jewish, Asian younger Jules.  Over the years there have been Jewish women Jill, Aviva, Heather, Cindy Barshop, Jennifer Gilbert, Jules to name a few.  It seems Bethenny may have scared some off by doing her bad Jew business last year on Jules. 

I seriously doubt that. 

I don't want to start making generalizations about anybody, but suffice it to say I know a lot of Jewish women ... and the idea that Bethenny Frankel might call one of them a "bad Jew" would definitely cause a lot of reactions. But scaring them off being on this show would NOT be among them, let's just put it that way.

[BBHN]

Quote

Jill tried to atone with Bethenny and she would have no part of it. 

Rightfully so, given the shit Jill pulled during season 3 with her manufactured drama bullshit.

Quote

  I also recall Bethenny picking up chopsticks and threatening to poke Jill's fucking eyes out

When did this happen?

Quote

I don't think Heather gives a rip about Bethenny and she pretty much just rolled over as she knew she would be exiting under her own steam and had her business to protect

I don't think she knew it at the time. Heather seemed to be trying hard to keep her spot during the season 7 reunion, so I doubt she had plans to leave at that point.

Quote

Since Bethenny specifically has said she will never marry again , of course there are variations on this theme with Bethenny, depending on her feelings in the moment.  I found Dorinda to be way out of line with her comment about staying silent about marriage so as not to offend others. Ramona trying to break up marriages isn't a good look and she continues with Luann to this day.  I think it is far worse for anyone to decide if someone else's marriage is real or good or in this case deserved.  It really isn't any of their business just as Carole getting involved with a much younger guy was none of Luann's business.

I'm not sure I get the relevance of all these tangents to Bethenny and her thread?

Quote

Bethenny has said pre-Jason she was always jaded, Jason and his love brought her around. Oh that was to sell a couple of books and get a magazine cover and a spin-off.  

Or it could have just been from the euphoria of her feeling she was in love at the time. People sometimes become schmaltzy when they feel they are in love.

Quote

The producers tried to introduce an African American cast member she was featured at Luann's photoshoot which turned into another Bethenny meltdown.  Be it Jennifer Gilbert who didn't get extended an invitation or an African American women who didn't make the cut Bethenny was part of the cast and deeply involved in divisive situations with cast members

Again, I am not sure I see any links or causality between the two. Having someone appear in the background or a guest spot doesn't mean it was the producers trying to introduce someone. There have been dozens and dozens of friends of the HWs who have appeared on the show, I doubt each time it was the producers trying to introduce someone on the show. Has Andy or anyone at Bravo come out and said they tried to introduce an African-American HW and Bethenny scared her off?

Jennifer rarely interacted with Bethenny. It is even more possible Kelly's kukoo antics scared her off more than anything, or the manufactured drama Jill created.

Quote

People labeled crazy to the point they can't come back from it

Kelly stayed on a full season after Bethenny. If she kept acting the idiot, that is on Kelly, not Bethenny.

Quote

Accusations regarding alcoholism, illegal drug

They all accuse each other of this shit, to single out Bethenny isn't exactly fair.

Quote

Bethenny and Carole might also want to take a look at some of their comments regarding the LGBT community, who I have no doubt they support but aren't above a slur or two in the name of humor.  The comments about  fish, strap ons, cross dresser, deep homosexual panic.  Even the almighty Andy identified their discussion as a gay slur. 

Andy does not speak for all of us when it comes to identifying gay slurs. I didn't think much of Bethenny and Carole's comments about the strap on. I found it funny.

Andy has condoned much worse comments throughout the franchise, so he really isn't in a position to lecture anyone about anything gay related.

Edited July 8, 2017 by BBHN

[Celia Rubenstein]

IIRC, the chopsticks comment was something Bethenny said early on in the show when they were out at dinner and Jill was grilling her about engagement rings or getting married or something and Bethenny was tired of listening to it. 

 She was just being a smart ass saying something over-the-top like she always does. In no way was it a serious threat. I can't believe anyone would even try to characterize it as that. 

[film noire]

32 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

Bethenny and Carole might also want to take a look at some of their comments regarding the LGBT community, who I have no doubt they support but aren't above a slur or two in the name of humor.  The comments about  fish, strap ons, cross dresser, deep homosexual panic.  

And Carole calling Tom gay, while also calling his bride LuMan -- she's no friend to any community, not with how easily those comments rolled off her tongue. She's like a white shoe lawyer telling "harmless"  Jewish jokes in a restricted country club in the fifties, not even aware enough to hear her own bigotry.  

Edited July 8, 2017 by film noire

[LIMOM]

They should hire Aviva's stepmother.

she is youngish, AA and has a business to promote.

[BBHN]

Quote

I bet Jennifer Gilbert is thrilled to make the list. Was she even a "friend of"? 

She was in season 3.

Quote

And Carole calling Tom gay,

She never called Tom gay. She was addressing rumors he was gay.

[bagger]

Bethenny refused to make up with Jill only after she debased herself and begged Jill to sit down and discuss the issues. Jill wanted no part of making up with B until she realized her misstep that trying to "create" a storyline does not work.

 

B, threatened the chopsticks after multiple attempts to get her to stop meddling and in fairly certain that no one including Jill expected for B to poke her eye out.

[film noire]

12 hours ago, BBHN said:

She never called Tom gay. She was addressing rumors he was gay.

She was passing on rumours that he was gay, not addressing them.  (But even if that were true -- why did the rumours need addressing? Was there a headline in The Post I missed?) And if she wanted to make it clear she thought it was bullshit, it's easy to make it impossible for the editing monkeys to screw with you -- denounce it as you lay it out ("There's a ridiculous rumour about Tom being gay. It's absurd but mouth-breathers believe an unmarried man -- around my age -- must be a big old 'mo because..." etc etc. )

She did it straight (no pun intended) because she wanted it out there, wanted to take the shine off "LuMan's" marriage.

Edited July 9, 2017 by film noire
wrong thread!

[BBHN]

Quote

She was passing on rumours that he was gay, not addressing them.

Nah, she was addressing questions from production in her TH segment.

Quote

why did the rumours need addressing?

See above.

Quote

And if she wanted to make it clear she thought it was bullshit, it's easy to make it impossible for the editing monkeys to screw with you -- denounce it as you lay it out ("There's a ridiculous rumour about Tom being gay. It's absurd but mouth-breathers believe an unmarried man -- around my age -- must be a big old 'mo because..." etc etc. )

From what we have seen, production has no problems editing around just about anything to get what they want.

Quote

She did it straight (no pun intended) because she wanted it out there, wanted to take the shine off "LuMan's" marriage.

Considering all the talk in other threads on here about George Clooney being gay (maybe to take the shone off his dating Carole?), I wouldn't be surprised if there was similar talk about Tom circulating among certain circles in Manhattan. 

[film noire]

25 minutes ago, BBHN said:

Nah, she was addressing questions from production in her TH segment.

Nah,  she was passing on rumours under cover of being asked questions (unless she's too dumb to know how to work her way around a potential landmine, this many seasons in).

Edited July 8, 2017 by film noire

[BBHN]

Yeah, she asked the producers to please bring up the issue so she could discuss it. That Carole, she is a sneaky one!

Edited July 8, 2017 by BBHN

[RedheadZombie]

9 hours ago, BBHN said:

Tough life...

Can anyone identify the breed?

[film noire]

3 hours ago, BBHN said:

Yeah, she asked the producers to please bring up the issue so she could discuss it. 

She sure had descriptive labels ready, for somebody who had no idea the question  was coming at her -- but even if she was completely surprised, she could have left it at a simple "I've never heard that rumor" - or if she was looking to feed them a quote to get air time, she could have said, "What a stupid rumour, sounds like something Trump would say" -- but she was looking to piss on LuAnn (and paint Tom as a sad-as-fuck closeted queen trapped in a Tennessee Williams play) so she said what she said.

3 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

Can anyone identify the breed?

A (friggin' adorable) mutt mix? With some terrier, I'm guessing (the coat?)

Edited July 8, 2017 by film noire

[Inspectabecky]

3 hours ago, film noire said:

Nah,  she was passing on rumours under cover of being asked questions (unless she's too dumb to know how to work her way around a potential landmine, this many seasons in).

I was just watching a behid the scenes special about love and hip hop where they showed a confessional face-off bw star and producer.  He was relentlessly trying to back her into calling someone a porn star (they had a "leaked" sex tape) and she wouldn't bite, they finally reached delirium and the producer was jokingly trying to trick madlib her into it. So ya if that cast can dodge producer traps, I hope Carole can.

[WireWrap]

10 minutes ago, stewedsquash said:

Yeah dot dot dot Absolutely not what she was doing. What she was doing (did) was completely uncalled for.  She is one of those ridiculous and stupid people who titter around that they are so cool and hip and open minded and then the mask slips and they reveal that they are the kind of person who will take something that can be completely gut wrenching, can fuck up someone's whole life, the decision of whether to come out as being a gay person or keeping it to themselves, and use that extremely private matter and make it into a smirky innuendo because, well as I said at the beginning of this long sentence, the fake mask of who she pretends to be versus who she really is slipped.

And Bethenny Frankel was there eating it all up, with glee in her eyes. 

Not to mention that if this were a rumor already out there, it would have been reported on in the negative press he got after his Regency scandal, yet it wasn't, anywhere. This is something that Carole made up on her own or with help from her good friend Bethenny because she/they thought it would be funny. She was not repeating gossip she heard elsewhere, it was a lie/rumor she, Carole started IMO.

[Celia Rubenstein]

But weren't posters here questioning why Tom had never been married at his age? I seem to recall it being suggested he was gay, that he was some kind of serial cad, lots of things.

So it doesn't seem like Carol was the first person on earth to "go there." I do wish she hadn't, especially not on national TV, but it's not like it wasn't something other people had already commented on.

[zoeysmom]

49 minutes ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

But weren't posters here questioning why Tom had never been married at his age? I seem to recall it being suggested he was gay, that he was some kind of serial cad, lots of things.

So it doesn't seem like Carol was the first person on earth to "go there." I do wish she hadn't, especially not on national TV, but it's not like it wasn't something other people had already commented on.

It was incredibly irresponsible and Carole doesn't get a pass.  Gay slams are gay slams.  She should know better.  As to Bethenny par for the course.  She is always inappropriate when there isn't a need to be. 

[diadochokinesis]

3 hours ago, film noire said:

She sure had descriptive labels ready, for somebody who had no idea the question  was coming at her -- but even if she was completely surprised, she could have left it at a simple "I've never heard that rumor" - or if she was looking to feed them a quote to get air time, she could have said, "What a stupid rumour, sounds like something Trump would say" -- but she was looking to piss on LuAnn (and paint Tom as a sad-as-fuck closeted queen trapped in a Tennessee Williams play) so she said what she said.

A (friggin' adorable) mutt mix? With some terrier, I'm guessing (the coat?)

1

Yeah, my guess is a mix of a terrier in there because of the wirehair coat and shape of the muzzle. 

[Celia Rubenstein]

20 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

It was incredibly irresponsible and Carole doesn't get a pass.  

 

I don't think I offered Carole a pass.  I was just responding to Wirewrap's suggestion that the whole thing was all a lie Carole made up on her own.  I made it clear in my post I think she shouldn't have mentioned it at all.

 

1 hour ago, WireWrap said:

Not to mention that if this were a rumor already out there, it would have been reported on in the negative press he got after his Regency scandal, yet it wasn't, anywhere. This is something that Carole made up on her own or with help from her good friend Bethenny because she/they thought it would be funny. She was not repeating gossip she heard elsewhere, it was a lie/rumor she, Carole started IMO.

 

Has the countdown to Jason's conviction trial started yet?  It's set for *when* in August?  I hope it's not during the first two weeks since I will be away.  I would hate to miss all the fun! 

[BBHN]

Quote

Yeah dot dot dot Absolutely not what she was doing. What she was doing (did) was completely uncalled for.  She is one of those ridiculous and stupid people who titter around that they are so cool and hip and open minded and then the mask slips and they reveal that they are the kind of person who will take something that can be completely gut wrenching, can fuck up someone's whole life, the decision of whether to come out as being a gay person or keeping it to themselves, and use that extremely private matter and make it into a smirky innuendo because, well as I said at the beginning of this long sentence, the fake mask of who she pretends to be versus who she really is slipped.

Yeah...that isn't what she did at all. Unless you are saying Tom is  gay, and Carole outed him somehow?

Quote

She sure had descriptive labels ready, for somebody who had no idea the question  was coming at her -- but even if she was completely surprised, she could have left it at a simple "I've never heard that rumor" - or if she was looking to feed them a quote to get air time, she could have said, "What a stupid rumour, sounds like something Trump would say" -- but she was looking to piss on LuAnn (and paint Tom as a sad-as-fuck closeted queen trapped in a Tennessee Williams play) so she said what she said.

So unless a HW responds with words that are only syllable, that means she had descriptive labels? Maybe she just relayed what she heard.

And why would she lie about hearing rumors she has heard? I mean, people on other threads here are saying George Cloony is gay based on the fact that their cousin's uncle's college roommate's nephew saw that at a gay orgy or something.

Quote

She was not repeating gossip she heard elsewhere, it was a lie/rumor she, Carole started IMO.

I guess we missed the scene where Carole and Bethenny plotted to forcibly bring this up at a TH so that they could trick the producers into allowing them to discuss a rumor they themselves started...?

Quote

But weren't posters here questioning why Tom had never been married at his age? I seem to recall it being suggested he was gay, that he was some kind of serial cad, lots of things.

It was a plot by Carole and Bethenny all along?

Quote

Gay slams are gay slams.

Addressing rumors about someone being gay isn't a slam.

[WireWrap]

4 hours ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

But weren't posters here questioning why Tom had never been married at his age? I seem to recall it being suggested he was gay, that he was some kind of serial cad, lots of things.

So it doesn't seem like Carol was the first person on earth to "go there." I do wish she hadn't, especially not on national TV, but it's not like it wasn't something other people had already commented on.

Posters here at PTV talking about why he hadn't married before is entirely different than someone, Carole, saying it on TV as if it were true. There have been zero reports in any tabloid/blog that I have seen/read that suggest Tom is "gay". So, unless Carole is reading our comments and then talking our posts as gospel truth, she made it up. Also, I have no doubt that had there been any rumor of Tom being gay, Ramona would have outed that last season or early this season, especially considering the depths she went to in trying to uncover any dirt on Tom that she could. And Carole stated it as fact, not as speculation IMO.

[film noire]

1 hour ago, BBHN said:

So unless a HW responds with words that are only syllable, that means she had descriptive labels? Maybe she just relayed what she heard.

Maybe she did (or maybe she read a personal ad, circa 1921 -- "My dream man is: 50, eligible,  got a buffalo nickel in his pocket and a fancyman penthouse apartment and no damn harridan of a wife and a couple of failed engagements to a society missus. Diamond dickers welcome.")  

Edited July 9, 2017 by film noire

[Celia Rubenstein]

10 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

There have been zero reports in any tabloid/blog that I have seen/read that suggest Tom is "gay". So, unless Carole is reading our comments and then talking our posts as gospel truth, she made it up. 

Correct me if I am wrong, but Carole lives in NYC and has ears.  She could have heard things about Tom from any number of people. Actual live living walking around talking people.

There is more to the universe than just this web site and blogs, believe it or not. 

 

Quote

Also, I have no doubt that had there been any rumor of Tom being gay, Ramona would have outed that last season or early this season, especially considering the depths she went to in trying to uncover any dirt on Tom that she could. 

I have to LOL at the idea that a rumor can't exist if Ramona was unable to uncover it.