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S07.E04: Poor Little Lamb


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Abel didn't have enough problems, now Courtney Love is the administrator of his school. Kid can't catch a break.

Why is Gemma talking to herself this season? Is it the guilt over killing Tara? I doubt it-I don't think Gemma is capable of feeling guilt. Is she losing her mind?

Heh-Gemma tells Jax he has a mommy fetish.

Nero is finally taking his Gemma-colored glasses off. Too late.

Great plan, Jax.

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Guest Accused Dingo

Its way past my bedtime so I will stick with Four things and give my main opinion tomorrow

1, Tig and Venus are a thing. This makes me happy.

2. "Remember when our biggest problem was which Mayan to kill?" "Simpler Times."

3. " Charming. This is a bad place, isn't it Wayne?" Paraphrased a bit

4. "Damn, Grandma's kinda crazy." Talk about an understatement.

Edited by Accused Dingo
  • Love 6
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Why is Gemma talking to herself this season? Is it the guilt over killing Tara? I doubt it-I don't think Gemma is capable of feeling guilt. Is she losing her mind?

I don't know and I don't care I'm just really really sorry they didn't sneak Maggie Siff back into the episode by have her play Tara's ghost haunting Gemma.  A great, honking, Hamlet shout out and they missed it.

 

Oh, and fuck this show for killing the hooker with a heart of gold.  And all the other hookers.  And the nice cop.  Even Venus couldn't save this episode.

  • Love 6
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I don't know and I don't care I'm just really really sorry they didn't sneak Maggie Siff back into the episode by have her play Tara's ghost haunting Gemma.  A great, honking, Hamlet shout out and they missed it.

I was waiting for Tara to be sitting in the back seat!

  • Love 1
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You keep saying two cops are dead when it's pretty explicitly stated that the woman is not and it's implied her survival will impact the Sons heavily. <br /><br />And Manson was in the season premiere so his 'cameo' wasn't unexpected or big news.

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Wow, that was a lot to process.

 

One SOA member dead for the season.

One SOA member shot.

 

Gemma didn't even need to sneak out, the guy guarding her ended up leaving and going to the ice cream shop anyways. Gemma and the silencer, does she intend to put Juice out of his misery? She's probably going to ask Juice too what Nero has to do with anything. Surprised she doesn't already know that whole story, that Juice didn't tell her.

 

Juice and the silencer, he wants to put himself out of his misery. However he's tried before and has always failed, so don't expect him to do it.

 

I laughed at Chibbs driving the sheriff home in a cop car. The irony.

 

Her argument about the ice cream shop could have been full of kids. Ummm no Sheriff, the ice cream shop is a front. She never noticed it's always closed and there's never kids in there? How does she not get it's a front? 

 

Nero getting mad about Jax beating up the guy was stupid. Jax would have beat up that guy whether Tara was dead or not. It's what they do, someone beats up a family member they attack back. Nero's acting like that makes Jax out of control when that move was normal. I think Nero is protesting too much, his "doing it because it feels good" is about himself and not Jax. He's projecting his feelings.

 

Loved all the Venus. The Venus & Tig. Jax's commentary about Tig and Venus, "should I be worried?" and "Now I'm worried."

 

Still loving Wendy and Unser being there for Juice. 

 

Jax will be even more mad now that his mommy fetish (that conversation with Gemma was so hilarious and true) has been killed by the Chinese.

The female cop (and witness) is alive. They can't have that...

 

Grenades, slaughter. The guns are gone! The Chinese stole them, this is going to be crazy!

Edited by Artsda
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IF YOU HAVEN'T WATCHED, DON'T READ THIS. SPOILERS!!

Holy SHIT.... What a roller coaster ride of emotions!! We normally don't get that till a finale. I don't know what the hell they're gonna do- how they're gonna get out of this. A few questions::

Does anyone know if that Sheriff bitch told the club that the woman cop is still alive before the explosion in the ice cream shop? Because they denied knowing anything and you wouldn't think they would have if they knew one survived. Unless of course they intend on somehow getting to the hospital and killing her somehow.

I don't know what to think about the sheriff bitch and Chibbs (or should I say Scotty). Does she like him, or is she just trying to get money and info? Does he like her or is he just trying to get info?

Does anyone know if Lilah was at Diosa? I hope not....

I know most ppl don't like Juice now but I feel bad for him. All he's been trying to do is find a way to stay alive- with the club. I get that what he did was a betrayal but I don't think he would've done it if he wasnt half unconcious after his suicide attempt. I think there may be another suicide attempt unless Gemma kills him first.

Speaking of Nero, he'd better not get killed cause of this shit. I like him a lot and he's all his kid has.

I know this is long already but I said something about this before and I need to say t again.... I don't like that this is pointing toward Jax possibly getting killed. Mainly because of those boys. Throughout the entire show- Jax has been about family. Now since Tara's gone- I don't know why he's not at least trying to spend more time with those boys. Everything important to him all of a sudden went away with Tara. And like ppl have been saying- how and why is the rest of the club letting their President be so reckless.

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I forgot- about Gemma talking to Tara. Last episode she told Tara (actually she was talking to her birds) that she thinks everything happened the way it was supposed to. Based on that and the way she talks to her- I don't really think it's all guilt. I think she's horrified that she killed Tara and she may even feel a little bad that she took the boys' Mom from them. All Tara ever did was give her shit. She has free reign over Jackson and the kids now that she's gone. I think she talks to her because she feels better telling her that they're doing just fine without her. I don't think she's losing her mind at all but I think Juice may be. At least Gemma is talking to someone- Juice was talking to running shower water. I know I'm in the minority here as I never liked Tara but always have liked Gemma.

I forgot to mention Venus too- so glad to see her back. She & Tig are great. Hopefully with Tig getting shot, he'll be laid up for a while (with Venus taking care of him) and he won't be one of the ones that die.

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Gemma makes plans to kill Juice. If her justification were that the Juice plotline is stale and that she is rescuing the audience from more boring and inconsequential scenes between her and Juice, then I would say bravo. But instead, her justification is that it's for Juice's own good. I checked, it does not count as euthanasia if malady you are rescuing someone from is that he might rat you out for killing your daughter-in-law.

 

 

Honestly, I scared myself by saying aloud "Gemma, put one in his head and end this" while Juice was having his little Acting Moment in the hotel. He could not make it any more honkingly, screamingly obvious that he's a ticking time bomb of disaster and secrets waiting to go off in front of every wrong person. And frankly, even if she does get him to her dad's place, he's going to have a meltdown in three minutes, call Jax, and tell Jax where he is. Even if he doesn't say the words "Gemma drove me here" it's going to be glaringly clear that she is the only one who would or could stash him in her father's house. The biggest mystery with Juice is that he hasn't gone crackers before now, considering the high stress life he leads.

 

Okay, gorgeous lakefront property with multiple gunshots and car GOING INTO SAID LAKE and not one neighbor calls the cops??? Rich people don't hesitate to ring up the local constabulary when that crap goes down. Also, is there any shady deal  on the west coast that Jax isn't involuntarily involved with at this point?

 

The Mommy Fetish conversation was equal parts hilarious and I Will Never Be Clean Again. 

 

Loved Gemma's little tete-a-tete with Dead Invisible Tara; the Justification Machine was working overtime there. "I never sent Jax and Thomas to daycare and blah blah blah..." yes, and look how splendidly everything worked out there!  Plus, love how Gemma's willing to write off Thomas to straight life, because he's "Tara's" kid, but she's got her claws in Abel just as deep as she ever had them in Jax; "I can see it in his eyes, he's loyal to the tribe." Funny, all I see is dead-orbed sociopathy and future serial killer but if there's one investment Gemma pays into every year, it's rose colored glasses. 

 

I really need to know where Nero is drawing the line. His involvement with this group of psycho losers has gotten multiple women he professed to care for brutally slaughtered. The whole gripping his cross thing made me want to slap him. God doesn't want to hear from this, you spineless piece of shit. Oh, and I'm guessing Peter Weller's crooked cop isn't going to be to happy about hearing that both his gun and escort investments have been most hostiley taken over. 

Edited by Snookums
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I was so waiting for the camera to pan over to Tara in the front seat with the fork in her head.

 

Wasn't Unser in the hospital at the bedside of the female cop?  They will find out she is alive soon enough.

  • Love 6
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I so loved that a SAMCRO dude got hit with one blind shot.  After alllllll the OK Corral firefights, a total blind shot does the trick.  Of course, it isn't fatal.  Oh well.

 

One thing out of all this mess tonight that is bugging me - and it is so small - is that they chose to bust the front door window at the lake house and not wait out Bobby, who got in with little trouble in the back.  That's just sloppy staging.

 

I am fine that Althea is savvy, but I can't buy just how ridiculously well she connected the Chinese dots.  

 

So, now we have another sheriff assassinated.  I give it a week before that is ignored.  No CHP.  No ATF.  No FBI.  No nuthin'.

 

So there was no LE staying with the remains of the club.  They all take off like a Meatloaf song to Diosa.   No LE whatsoever see it nor respond.  Ya know, at this rate , they are gonna reveal Venus to actually be a Martian.

 

I am pleasantly shocked that Sutter chose to not show us the actual massacre.   I am not at all shocked at the humorous misdirection of the first part of the ep.  I gotsta admit, though, that was some funny stuff.

 

Good for Lin!

Edited by Lonesome Rhodes
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This was much better.... some humor, some Venus, some Juice booty.  All it needed was a shirtless Jax at the lake.  They missed the opportunity!

 

I could nitpick, but I watch this for over-the-top not-my-life-ness.

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I love Venus & Tig almost as much as Sutter enjoys killing characters off.

 

Is it wrong I hope Juice ends up killing Jemma, and THAT is how he ends up getting his 'in' back into the club and fessing up to Jax about who exactly killed Tara? 

 

This show is going scorched earth...but if it ends up with Venus and Tig riding off into the sunset and living happily ever after to go help Nero on his farm, I'm OK with this.

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After the episdoe ended, I sat on my sofa and tried to figure out what I saw.  A whole lot of WTF tonight, some good and some bad.

 

- Tig and Venus, I'm 'shipping them so hard and have been since Venus first appeared.  Venus is perfect for Tig, whose preferences and interests have always been flexible and rather broad.    As someone said up thread, hopefully they'll end up on a beach in Mexico somewhere at the end of this.  Walton Goggins, I worship you, I swear, between Venus and his work on Justified.   Two uber masculine actors and I'm buying the relationship.  

 

- Chibs and the deputy chief:  Good together but it's going to be complex.  It feels like in some scenes they're the only grownups in the place.  I could feel the bonding happening between them, but the hand holding came as a bit of a surprise.   One of the two of them is going to have to give a lot more than the other, unless they both say screw it and leave Charming.   Strange as it is, I thinking I'm 'shipping them, too.   Damn, Sutter has given me people to root for again.

 

- Lin and the boys:  I'm glad they saw through Jax's master plan.  It was a stupid master plan.   I'm afraid, though, that Sutter will pull something out of thin air that has Jax having a plan within a plan within a plan...the master strategist that he is...and he's able to defeat Lin.  I think this season should end with Jax's world and influence totally destroyed, a lesson in stupidity and hubris.

 

- The black gang and sub-gangs:  Damn, guys, you all need to talk a bit and notice that Jax has his fingers in all of this. 

 

- The slaughter at the brothel:   Again, every single thing Nero has or is is being destroyed as a direct result of his involvement with Gemma and Jax.   I'm angry at Sutter for manipulating me, bring back the blonde woman (blanking on character's name) with whom Jax had been screwing around.  She's smart and interesting, would have been a good stabilizing influence on Jax...so obviously she and a dozen or so other people must die.  It's part of Jax's total annihilation, but I'm sad to see her go. 

 

- Gemma:  Horrible, horrible person who is apparently coming off the handle, given that she's talking to dead people.   I hope the last episode has Jax finding out she killed Tara, then lied to him about the Chinese guy, which caused him to destroy his world.  His last act in this series should be to kill his mother.  Then Chibs, Althea, Wendy, the boys, Nero, Tig, and Venus all go off to their various sunsets.

Edited by terrymct
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His last act in this series should be to kill his mother.

 

 

Execution is too good for Gemma, she should lose her son and grandsons.  She deserves a long, lonely, bitter, miserable life.  I can picture her walking the streets of Charming, talking to herself, like Cate Blanchett in Blue Jasmine.

Edited by sugarbaker design
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Guest Accused Dingo

This entire show could be summarized with Jax and his mommy issues. He would have been better off with the psycho dominatrix.

Edited by Accused Dingo
  • Love 6
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Loved all the Venus. The Venus & Tig. Jax's commentary about Tig and Venus, "should I be worried?" and "Now I'm worried."

I thought those lines sucked some of the humor out of the moment because let's face it, the SOA are not a progressive bunch.  Juice thought they'd drive him out of the club if they found out his father was black.  Do we really think this bunch is going to be able to wrap their brains around Tig hooking up with a transsexual?  If Tig does hook up with Venus and one of the crew makes the inevitable joke about it to Tig, there may be blood.

  • Love 2
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Execution is too good for Gemma, she should lose her son and grandsons.  She deserves a long, lonely, bitter, miserable life.  I can picture her walking the streets of Charming, talking to herself, like Cate Blanchett in Blue Jasmine.

I agree with you 100%.  Now, I know this a long shot, but, do you think the homeless lady walking around in the previous seasons could be a foreshadowing of Gemma's future?

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I don't know and I don't care I'm just really really sorry they didn't sneak Maggie Siff back into the episode by have her play Tara's ghost haunting Gemma.  A great, honking, Hamlet shout out and they missed it.

 

Oh, and fuck this show for killing the hooker with a heart of gold.  And all the other hookers.  And the nice cop.  Even Venus couldn't save this episode.

The whole ghost thing has been done before on Dexter and Six Feet Under.

You can't have ghosts running around all over the place.

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Well, there was that.

 

LOVED, absolutely LOVED Venus and Alexander! Venus is such a lady! When she was looking over Tig and she said she "took an oath to take care of a friend" what was she referring to?

 

Was I the only one that was confused with the cop that was shot and survived? I thought it was the new sheriff but ended up being another cop.  What made that cop see the SONs roll by and want to follow them? I remember her recognizing them and saying their names and that's why they follow them. That had me thinking it was the new Sheriff.

 

I do not know what the point of Love as Abel's teacher is/was, I assume there will be more of her...

 

Same with Manson, I still do not get his character.

 

So it is same to assume that Jury went to Lin with what he knew and this is why shit hit the fan?

 

The body count tho, it is too damn much for nothing to come of it. They must be running out of citizens in Charming!

 

Over the Gemma talking to herself and now that is being passed on to Juice too? At least we had a nice butt shot.

  • Love 2
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My bullet pointed thoughts about this episode, which I really liked.

  • I always like when the outside world calls out the denizens of the club for their stupidity, and serve as the voice of the viewer, like Courtney Love did with her "Damn, Grandma's Crazy" statement.  Umm yeah, Grandma's also a racist ( her comment toward the sherrif, ugh), and a murderer
  • Jury totally sold out the club to Lin, and Robocop is complicit to some degree
  • I really like Sheriff Jarry, whether she's on the level or not, she's just plain cool- and I do hope that she and Chibbs  have some sort of relationship
  • I am glad we were spared the actual Diosa shoot out-- definitely a case of less is more.
  • Venus, Venus, Venus.  Look, I was already a fan of her, and of anything Walton Goggins does, but tonight was just on another level entirely.  You really felt that she and Tig  were friends in that scene where the club came looking for information
  • Venus and Tig, Venus and Tig, Venus and Tig - ( or should I say Venus and Alexander)  Wow.  Kim Coates and Walton Goggins sold that scene, and I had the widest grin on my face.  They have a really comfortable familiarity with each other, I loved that she called him "Alexander" ,  and say what you will, but that kiss scene was just beautiful.  The obligitory montage scene of them, showed that, too.
Edited by Febgirl
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Was I the only one that was confused with the cop that was shot and survived? I thought it was the new sheriff but ended up being another cop.  What made that cop see the SONs roll by and want to follow them? I remember her recognizing them and saying their names and that's why they follow them. That had me thinking it was the new Sheriff.

 

Now the problem is that the cop who survived will wake up and tell everyone that she was watching the SOA and some rednecks do what looked like a drug deal when her partner was murdered and she was chased down and shot in the back.

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Chibbs/Cop Lady and Tig/Venus make cute couples, but Venus and Cop Lady need to get the hell away from these guys otherwise they will end up like Tara and Donna, and all the other collateral damage that happens to people who get anywhere near the SoA.

 

Teacher:  “Grandma is a little crazy.”
Me:  “No, Grandma is completely crazy and murderous.”

 

Line of the night goes to Bobby, “Remember when our biggest problem was deciding which Mayan to kill?”

Edited by TigerLynx
  • Love 4
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LOVED, absolutely LOVED Venus and Alexander! Venus is such a lady! When she was looking over Tig and she said she "took an oath to take care of a friend" what was she referring to?

She was referring to him. My guess is after the care he showed her last season with all that went on with her mom/son-- they established a friendship.  I read where she'll be back in episode 10...

  • Love 1
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So the path Gemma sent Jax on (after Lin and crew, for allegedly killing Tara) led directly to the result one would expect (throwing a grenade through the shop window is a pretty clear message). No one should be surprised, not even Jax (if he has a brain, that is).

 

I have to think that Nero's words about committing mayhem because it "feels good" were the key to this episode. We have seen Jax go from contemplative to wanting out to being pulled back in to save the club to going full-on gangster. It's a rise-and-fall story of someone who couldn't escape his environment. And now we are seeing the last few acts, which *should* lead to death. I don't see how Jax could have a plan to escape this, nor does he seem to have the mental capacity to execute it even if he had one.

 

I, also, don't understand how the club is so accepting of Venus, given their racist issues. Do they just have issues with color, and not gender if the gender changer is white?

 

Not getting the Chibs/sherriff thing at all. This is a guy whose dating  life revolves around whores. Have we ever seen him show an interest in women as people, or heard of a past where he did so? Maybe I forgot something. But I don't see how those two connect, more on his side than hers (assuming she is setting up the club).

 

This is the third season the SOA have been a collective group of drooling idiots. It is definitely time to wrap this series up.

Edited by Ottis
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I, also, don't understand how the club is so accepting of Venus, given their racist issues. Do they just have issues with color, and not gender if the gender changer is white?

 

Remember that Venus has been helpful to them in the past, very helpful and cheerfully going along with the Sons plans. That likely puts her in a different category than a transgender person they just met cold.

Edited by maraleia
edited word transgendered to transgender per correct terminology
  • Love 3
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Is it wrong I hope Juice ends up killing Jemma, and THAT is how he ends up getting his 'in' back into the club and fessing up to Jax about who exactly killed Tara?

A girl can dream! That's what I'm hoping for.

I think it'll come down to that or Gemma killing Juice since he's the only other one that knows who killed Tara. Notice they had shots of both Gemma and Juice putting silencers on their guns. It'll be one or the other. I feel for poor Juice though. Isolation can bring out the worst in people and I think that's what we're going to see unravel.

I cannot stomach the incestuous vibe between Jax and Gemma and the way she speaks to him all breathy (shudders). I wonder how many cigs she smokes a day.

Just let the truth come out to Jax is all I ask of this show!

  • Love 1
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Guest Accused Dingo

Not getting the Chibs/sherriff thing at all. This is a guy whose dating life revolves around whores. Have we ever seen him show an interest in women as people, or heard of a past where he did so? Maybe I forgot something. But I don't see how those two connect, more on his side than hers (assuming she is setting up the club).

.

Chibbs has a wife and daughter he loves but never sees. It was all part of the irish plot of seasons past.!!

As for Venus the club has always turned a blund eye to their own prejudices when someone is usefull and Venus has always been useful. Not sure what they will think when they find out that Tig is seeing her but then Tig has always been a strange one and the club know this.

Edited by Accused Dingo
  • Love 5
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Just let the truth come out to Jax is all I ask of this show!

 

I have to believe that is the ending Sutter has planned.  That is the big dramatic payoff for the series.  I can't predict what Jax will do when he learns the truth, but there's no way he doesn't find out who killed Tara. I'm not always a fan of Sutter's writing, but I believe he has an overall vision and concept for the series and how it will end.  (Yes, I'm still bitter about Lost!)

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Not getting the Chibs/sherriff thing at all. This is a guy whose dating  life revolves around whores. Have we ever seen him show an interest in women as people, or heard of a past where he did so? Maybe I forgot something. But I don't see how those two connect, more on his side than hers (assuming she is setting up the club).

 

 

I am so glad I am not alone on this.  I am not shipping Chibs and the sheriff at all.  Maybe because I love Chibs myself but I just don't feel it.  I don't think he would instantly connect with a cop - - it just feels forced to me.

 

I was drowsy last night while watching and will need to watch again so maybe I'm missing something but since the Sons are backstabbing and screwing over, oh EVERYONE, wouldn't they have every one of their businesses watched and protected?  Would they really leave Diosa wide open like that?  You would  think retaliation would be a relatively normal occurence for them.  Anyhow . . .

 

I never cared much for Collette but none of those girls deserved to be murdered as a message for Jax and the Sons.  It seems like this is only the start though.

 

I actually liked Jax last night.  But maybe that was because he didn't kill anyone.

  • Love 3
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I am so glad I am not alone on this.  I am not shipping Chibs and the sheriff at all.  Maybe because I love Chibs myself but I just don't feel it.  I don't think he would instantly connect with a cop - - it just feels forced to me.

 

It looks to me like Chibbs is very surprised himself to be feeling something for a sheriff; and we know he's capable of deep love from the storyline with his wife & daughter. At least I think that's how Tommy Flanagan is playing it.

  • Love 6
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Umm yeah, Grandma's also a racist ( her comment toward the sherrif, ugh)

 

 

WTF was that about? Not only was it completely racist it made no sense on any level, none at all. If Gemma wants to show hostility towards the new sheriff (which I guess derives from her knowing Wayne is working for them as a consultant), well that's a stupid showing of a hand that's beneath her in the first place, but why would you say such a thing to anybody? Is she trying to set herself up as racist to throw off suspicion in Tara and Roosevelt's murders? Because that makes no sense at all, none. No wonder Althea was staring at her like she was a total nutjob. 

 

Or wait, was it to show that Gemma's coming apart and can't do her old manipulation/domination games anymore, that's she's misreading what will make her come across as intimidating and strong? That is truly the only thing I can come up with that makes that bit less then "total fucking racist shit out of nowhere for no reason, hi, viewers of color, enjoying the show yet?"

  • Love 1
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Paraphrasing the Sheriff: "What if that ice cream shoppe had been full of kids??"

WTF? When was the last time that "ice cream shoppe" sold ice cream? Isn't it always just the clubhouse now? Maybe she really DID just get to town.

 

And re Girl Power: Sutter Style, let's not forget that "girls can't do maths". SO HIGH-LARIOUS and SO original!! Next week, one surviving hooker tries to change a tire.

 

As more and more formerly-good shows fuck up their final seasons (or can't sustain more than one or two before going down the tubes), we can see how truly incredible Breaking Bad was. It stayed high-quality from the first episode to the last. Clearly not an easy feat.

  • Love 11
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I don't like Tig and Venus. Because no one can be happy on this show, and they like killing off characters, and that's why we can't have nice things.

 

Nope. Venus should be set up with Marilyn Manson's character. Long live Veman (I really don't know his character's name).

 

Nope. Tig and Venus are horrible together. Ugh. Uh... Bring Tara back, or something.

 

(I hope they get at least a full week of being happy, before it all goes to shit. She deserves at least that.)

  • Love 1
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I'm embarrassed at how thrilled I was when Jax jumped in the water and saved the mom lady's life.  It felt like we had rolled back several seasons and the old Jax came out and showed some compassion toward the mother, and the son, too.

 

Then the whole weight of the current season came slamming back down.

 

Sutter's Hammer.

  • Love 4
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I think the only reason Jax jumped in the water to save the mother's life was because they needed her signature.  I do not for one second think that he actually cared about her wellbeing.

  • Love 6
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If that boy was supposed to be Jury's son, and assuming that Jury turned on the SOA due to them killing him, it really doesn't make sense that Jury wouldn't have just said who the boy was.  Except for plot, which is a bullshit reason.  There seems to be no reason Jury would keep it quiet.  Unless the boy was his lover.  Even still, Jury could have made up some story to relay enough info to let them know this kid was important to him rather than just saying that they were random muscle he met somewhere.  

 

I hope they don't find out Gemma killed Tara by Gemma getting caught talking to herself.  Would be lame.  

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