Chit-Chat: The Feels

[peacheslatour]

6 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

This. There never has been, isn't, and never will be any valid or logical explanation or justficiation to support him and his policies. None whatsoever. There wasn't any in 2016, and there sure as fuck isn't any now. 

Only the best people.

[annzeepark914]

Ohhh...how appropriate that genius Donald's only-the-best Secretary of Education got a math lesson from a Senator.

Saw on Deadline:WH today that former tea party congressman Joe Walsh has become a Democrat!  He wants Dems to fight the way Republicans fight (*never* giving up/*never* backing down). And I read in The Atlantic that Sarah Huck Sanders is getting FEMA funds after she made a personal call to DJT. Blue states better not get hit by any hurricanes.

 

Edited Wednesday at 01:37 AM by annzeepark914

[Annber03]

2 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

And I read in The Atlantic that Sarah Huck Sanders is getting FEMA funds after she made a personal call to DJT. .

The GOP: "We hate the federla government! Keep them out of our lives! The private sector can handle everything!"

Also the GOP: "..oh, shit, well, I guess we do need some of that fedleral government money/aid after all, please, please let us have it, but only us, 'cause those other people will just abuse it, unlike us." 

[ProudMary]

I have so much admiration for Senator Warren. This is a press release from her office. The link to the full report is right near the top of the press release. The report itself is only 12 pages long, which in Senate terms is short.

NEW Warren Report: Special Interests over the Public Interest: Elon Musk's 130 Days in the Trump Administration

Warren Highlights 130 Potential Acts of Corruption in Musk’s 130 Days in Government

https://www.warren.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/new-warren-report-special-interests-over-the-public-interest-elon-musks-130-days-in-the-trump-administration

[Eri]

1 hour ago, Annber03 said:

The GOP: "We hate the federla government! Keep them out of our lives! The private sector can handle everything!"

Also the GOP: "..oh, shit, well, I guess we do need some of that fedleral government money/aid after all, please, please let us have it, but only us, 'cause those other people will just abuse it, unlike us." 

Cue the Pikachu face responses for the Big Bastardly bill when all the extra clauses are coming out ~_^ This includes but not limited to:

• Tax cuts for individuals and businesses that will likely only last till the end of 2028
• A reduction of spending on food aid (parents and older Americans face work requirements for food assistance basically)
• New work requirements for Medicaid (Democrats warned people several times that they'd lose their coverage despite Trump saying they wouldn't touch it)
• No taxes on gun silencers
• No money for Planned Parenthood
• ‘Trump’ (formerly MAGA) kids $1,000 savings accounts - basically a child tax credit for any born between Jan. 1, 2024 and Dec. 31, 2028 (this one must've been a callback to Vance wanting America to have more children - yeah no thanks)
• Funding for Trump’s mass deportation operation (to revive construction of Trump's border wall scam..err I mean scheme)
• More money for the Pentagon (defense spending) and Trump’s ‘Golden Dome’
• Tax increase on university endowments and overhaul of student loans
• More drilling and mining on public lands
• Limitation of state powers with a 10 year ban on any state legislature regulating the use of generative AI
• Limitation of the judicial branch for courts to enforce contempt rulings when this administration breaks the law

It's like 20+ bills rolled into one because they (stupidly) assumed it would pass.

So when the constituents back home are asking their state representatives at town halls what's going on? Here come the "Well I didn't know..." excuses.

Exhibit A:

Suuuuuure, you didn't.  Been hearing that one a lot lately lol

But they knew that this was the hill they wanted to die on when they pushed it through - watch them blame Mike Johnson for it next.

Edited Wednesday at 03:38 AM by Eri

[Lantern7]

5 hours ago, tres bien said:

God I hate him

I think anyone or anything that can cause him lasting damage should be forever hailed. I mean, I don’t think any one of us has ever wanted to see a statue of an improperly-eaten Big Mac, but I’m open to that.

An actual parade. Fuck him in all holes for making people go through with that.

Joined MBTV in early 2001. “Lantern” comes from one of my fave comic book characters, “7” was the number of roommates on The Real World. Seemed better than “75.”

[Annber03]

25 minutes ago, Eri said:

Cue the Pikachu face responses for the Big Bastardly bill when all the extra clauses are coming out ~_^ This includes but not limited to:

• Tax cuts for individuals and businesses that will likely only last till the end of 2028
• A reduction of spending on food aid (parents and older Americans face work requirements for food assistance basically)
• New work requirements for Medicaid (Democrats warned people several times that they'd lose their coverage despite Trump saying they wouldn't touch it)
• No taxes on gun silencers
• No money for Planned Parenthood
• ‘Trump’ (formerly MAGA) kids $1,000 savings accounts - basically a child tax credit for any born between Jan. 1, 2024 and Dec. 31, 2028 (this one must've been a callback to Vance wanting America to have more children - yeah no thanks)
• Funding for Trump’s mass deportation operation (to revive construction of Trump's border wall scam..err I mean scheme)
• More money for the Pentagon (defense spending) and Trump’s ‘Golden Dome’
• Tax increase on university endowments and overhaul of student loans
• More drilling and mining on public lands
• Limitation of state powers with a a 10 year ban on any state legislature regulating the use of generative AI
• Limitation of the judicial branch for courts enforce contempt rulings when this administration breaks the law

It's like 20+ bills rolled into one because they (stupidly) assumed it would pass.

So when the constituents back home are asking their state representatives at town halls what's going on? Here come the "Well I didn't know..." excuses.

Exhibit A:

Suuuuuure, you didn't.  Been hearing that one a lot lately lol

But they knew that this was the hill they wanted to die on when they pushed it through - watch them blame Mike Johnson for it next.

I sincerely hope this attempt to shove this bill through backfires in every last one of their faces, and backfires HARD. 

(I could honestly buy Greene not being aware of what's in the bill, simply because I don't think she's aware of a LOT of what's going on around her much of the time.) 

[Eri]

18 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

I sincerely hope this attempt to shove this bill through backfires in every last one of their faces, and backfires HARD. 

(I could honestly buy Greene not being aware of what's in the bill, simply because I don't think she's aware of a LOT of what's going on around her much of the time.) 

I hope so too! And it wasn't even just MTG - Joni Ernst defended it, leading to notable consequences. Mike Flood (R-Nebraska) was railroaded at a town hall when asked about Section 70302 on federal courts and contempt orders. His only response was that he didn't agree with the added sections or that he was unaware of the provision when voting for the bill. Uh, what!? Now they're all doing damage control to cover their butts. Too little too late!

Honestly this bill is designed, like much of congressional legislation, to speak to insiders with insider knowledge. A 1000+ page document is simply incomprehensible to the untutored eye. And that this congressman would acknowledge that the provision, which would neuter the contempt power, he didn't even know about, is an acknowledgment of what I think needs to be labeled as congressional dysfunction.

Edited Wednesday at 03:35 AM by Eri

[Bastet]

52 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

(I could honestly buy Greene not being aware of what's in the bill, simply because I don't think she's aware of a LOT of what's going on around her much of the time.) 

A staggering number of congresscritters don't know what's in the bills they vote on (quite notably the PATRIOT Act being rushed into law, the consequences of which we are still suffering from).  A lot of those bills are long as all get out, by design, and despite every member having a large staff whose sole job is to parse proposed legislation and brief the Rep/Senator on it, too many of them just vote as party leadership recommends.  This is true of both parties, of course, but has never been more rampant - or more harmful - than Republicans falling in line behind anything Trump touts.

[Soapy Goddess]

1 hour ago, Eri said:

New work requirements for Medicaid (Democrats warned people several times that they'd lose their coverage despite Trump saying they wouldn't touch it)

And it's not going to be touched or taken away. The new "work requirement" pertains to able-bodied citizens (as JJ would say "what's the nature of your disability?")...even if they just do a few hours of community service. 

[LexieLily]

1 hour ago, Eri said:

• Limitation of the judicial branch for courts to enforce contempt rulings when this administration breaks the law

It's so curious how there never needed to be this specific addendum to a bill, specific to the point where it's blatantly written out like this, until this particular president came along. Almost as if no president before (or after) him had or would have even considered breaking the law as he does.

[Salacious Kitty]

1 hour ago, Annber03 said:

I sincerely hope this attempt to shove this bill through backfires in every last one of their faces, and backfires HARD. 

(I could honestly buy Greene not being aware of what's in the bill, simply because I don't think she's aware of a LOT of what's going on around her much of the time.) 

Speaking of our little MTG...

[heatherchandler]

6 hours ago, anony.miss said:

Exactly. If this site welcomed content currently not allowed - sexist memes, dehumanizing language, opinion stated as fact - or hosted a forum where people were not required to provide links to back up emphatic or extreme statements (or where links to sites full of errors would be taken at face value) I'd just move on, and find a place more in line with my standards.

 

Trying to reconcile this post, noting standards and saying that people are decent and don’t agree with name-calling and dehumanizing language (and a few posts above it where people are glad to have anything harmful that they post called out and removed) with this post-

 

5 hours ago, Annber03 said:

 

@Bastet, thank you for sharing that domain link for Ernst, that's HILARIOUS. And spot on. Whoever did that is a damn hero. 

Thankful for a sickening post with full on name calling (calling someone fucking stupid and a coward).

 What a disgusting display of (I’m assuming) adults.  It’s degrading and shameful.  And applauded?  The party of kindness?

 

 

Edited Wednesday at 05:25 AM by heatherchandler

[Anela]

10 minutes ago, heatherchandler said:

Trying to reconcile this post, noting standards and saying that people are decent and don’t agree with name-calling and dehumanizing language (and a few posts above it where people are glad to have anything harmful that they post called out and removed) with this post-

 

Applauding a sickening post with full on name calling (calling someone fucking stupid and a coward).

 What a disgusting display of (I’m assuming) adults.  It’s degrading and shameful.  And applauded?  The party of kindness?

 

 

A snark site about a Senator who rudely shrugged off the worries of her constituents, when it comes to medicare and medicaid, saying, "We're all going to die anyway" who doubled down with sarcasm, after she was called out for it. Walking through a graveyard, apparently, as she recorded herself.

You have a problem with someone getting enjoyment from that? She's also religious, and seems to think she has the moral high ground because of that - like a lot of republican politicians. 

 

Edited Wednesday at 05:35 AM by Anela

[Annber03]

Yeah, no, sorry, when a member of Congress is out here callously talking about how we're all going to die someday in response to people's genuine concerns about losing their access to health insurance, and then has the nerve to make a video mocking people's genuine anger over her comments, and shoving in a pathetic attempt to show how "religious" she is besides, I am more than fine with people calling that person stupid and cowardly. Because they are. 

See, I live in Iowa, where Ernst is from. I am familiar with her attitude on various policies. She is stupid, and she is cowardly, and she deserves every bit of scorn and contempt she's receiving for her shitty, deeply tone-deaf and offensive comments. 

And she continues to support Trump and all the shit he's pulling, so that just further adds to the reasons to call her out. 

16 minutes ago, heatherchandler said:

The party of kindness?

We do not have to be kind to people who think it's perfectly okay to take away someone's access to healthcare.  I wouldn't think I'd have to explain something so blatantly obvious, but apparently I do. 

ETA: Ernst's comments hit especially close to home for me, because it brought back memories of me sitting there watching a GOP debate before the 2012 election where people in the crowd CHEERED the idea that people should just die if they can't afford health insurance, and the GOP remained absolutely sillent on that reaction, or gave mealy mouthed, "Hey..stop that..." responses to it, all while continuing to do everything in thier power to keep the ACA from becoming a thing. 

And this was going on just a mere year after my own dad died, and my family was struggling with the fallout from the insane medical debt we'd received, because my dad had lost his job and his good medical insurance due to his illness and my family had to jump through a shitton of red tape as a result just to get even the barest amount of Medicare to even try and help cover the medical expenses. And even that still didn't cover everything.

And then my mom lost her sister on top of that, and her sister also didn't have health insurance and couldn't cover her medical care for her cancer treatments.

So hell, yes, I am going to cheer someone who calls out people like Ernst for their attitudes. If someone is more offended by my cheering on that kind of response to Ernst's comments than Ernst's comments themselves, comments made, again, by someone who is in a high ranking political position and is supposed to be responsible for and address the concerns of their constituents, then that says far more about them than it does me. 

Edited Wednesday at 05:47 AM by Annber03

[anony.miss]

3 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

Trying to reconcile this post, noting standards and saying that people are decent and don’t agree with name-calling and dehumanizing language

.... here in this forum,  with each other, per the rules, not at every political satire site online. If Jon Stewart starts posting here, he'll have to follow the rules; if the person who founded the Ernst site starts posting here, same deal. Equating satire against a public figure with how people treat each other in this forum  = apples & oranges.

Quote

 It’s degrading and shameful. 

I think Trump sexually assaulting women, and still retaining Republican leadership, is what's degrading and shameful, not a website mocking Ernst's record of political cowardice.

 

Edited Wednesday at 08:40 AM by anony.miss

[CM-BlueButterfly]

Hi everyone,

how are you doing?

I’d like to address the discussion (and post removal) over the last several pages. We (the team) recognize how you feel, what your opinions are of the individuals discussed. We see the range of views and emotions, the frustration, irritation, concern and worry, and we understand where each of you is coming from.

Nevertheless, please remember that the language we use has an impact on anyone who reads our comments and a comment considered harmless by a poster can be harmful to a reader no matter who the comment is directed at.
Language that shames, generalizes, labels, dismisses someone’s feelings or opinion or invalidates someone’s identity or humanity can erode a sense of safety and inclusivity within a community. 

As Primetimer recognizes human dignity as every person’s fundamental right, all community members should engage in ways that respect the full spectrum of identities present in (and outside of) the community as well as in ways that recognize the humanity of the individual we’re talking about or to, regardless of the kind of person (we think) they are.

Kindly remember that the goal of civil discourse shouldn’t be to be right or best one another but to create understanding; Why might the other person feel the way they feel? How would I feel if I were in their shoes? What might we agree on?

"I“ statements (“I think…”, “In my experience…”, “My impression has been…”, “To my knowledge…” etc) can be helpful in debates as they allow us to share our perspective without being accusatory or assigning blame and keeping the focus on actions and facts instead of the individual allows us to be critical without shaming or making fellow community members feel judged.

On that note, please keep in mind that individual community members have different comfort levels. Discussing moderator action and/or fellow posters can, therefore, erode a sense of safety and inclusivity within a community as well and feel harmful not just to the member who is discussed but to anyone who reads our comments. (Including moderators).

It’s for that reason that discussing moderator action and/or fellow community members should be avoided in topic and fellow community members should be talked to and not about.

If you have a question regarding moderator action, please review the mod notes or reach out by creating a topic here.

While we realize that it may not always seem that way, we strongly believe that every voice has value; a community can only be healthy and thrive when opinions are diverse, so, we want you all to succeed in the community and have a place to be heard.

Thank you!

[shapeshifter]

5 hours ago, Eri said:

Cue the Pikachu face responses for the Big Bastardly bill when all the extra clauses are coming out ~_^ This includes but not limited to:

• Tax cuts for individuals and businesses that will likely only last till the end of 2028
• A reduction of spending on food aid (parents and older Americans face work requirements for food assistance basically)
• New work requirements for Medicaid (Democrats warned people several times that they'd lose their coverage despite Trump saying they wouldn't touch it)
• No taxes on gun silencers
• No money for Planned Parenthood
• ‘Trump’ (formerly MAGA) kids $1,000 savings accounts - basically a child tax credit for any born between Jan. 1, 2024 and Dec. 31, 2028 (this one must've been a callback to Vance wanting America to have more children - yeah no thanks)
• Funding for Trump’s mass deportation operation (to revive construction of Trump's border wall scam..err I mean scheme)
• More money for the Pentagon (defense spending) and Trump’s ‘Golden Dome’
• Tax increase on university endowments and overhaul of student loans
• More drilling and mining on public lands
• Limitation of state powers with a 10 year ban on any state legislature regulating the use of generative AI
• Limitation of the judicial branch for courts to enforce contempt rulings when this administration breaks the law

It's like 20+ bills rolled into one because they (stupidly) assumed it would pass.

So when the constituents back home are asking their state representatives at town halls what's going on? Here come the "Well I didn't know..." excuses.

Exhibit A:

Suuuuuure, you didn't.  Been hearing that one a lot lately lol

But they knew that this was the hill they wanted to die on when they pushed it through - watch them blame Mike Johnson for it next.

Perhaps a new Congressional soap opera titled:
”As The Worm Turns”

I’ll try to find the interview I saw in the past few days in which it was pointed out that anything in the BBB that does not effect the budget directly (is just ideological policy) is not legitimate — unless someone else can find it first? 
It was was not between any MAGAs.

Edited Wednesday at 08:25 AM by shapeshifter

[tres bien]

This is for real 

Trump upped his ante to $25 million in his lawsuit against CBS and his lawyers are arguing in court that Trump suffered mental anguish from CBS’s news editing of a 60 Minutes interview with Kamala Harris 

 

 

 

[bluegirl147]

13 minutes ago, tres bien said:

This is for real 

Trump upped his ante to $25 million in his lawsuit against CBS and his lawyers are arguing in court that Trump suffered mental anguish from CBS’s news editing of a 60 Minutes interview with Kamala Harris 

 

 

 

What about all of us who suffer mental anguish from having to listen to him?

 

[tearknee]

55 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

What about all of us who suffer mental anguish from having to listen to him?

 

Trump can always claim he is advised by Stanley Milgram.

[BetyBee]

I remember after Katrina, when many posters were horrified that the government didn't seem to care to help much, TWoP allowed discussion on a thread. It was either a reality show thread or a soap opera thread, I forget which. It really helped to finally be able to speak with others about the devastation and the appalling response. I think of that with this thread, how helpful it's been to discuss with others whether we agree or disagree with other POVs. I'm glad we have this forum, although I admit to putting a few people on ignore. I just need peace of mind some days!

[DrSpaceman73]

10 hours ago, StatisticalOutlier said:

Correct me if I'm wrong (this is a loooong thread), but didn't you say you didn't vote for either Harris or Trump?  

To me, refusing to vote for the one person who could keep Trump from becoming president again is at least acquiescence in a Trump presidency. 

No I never said that. 

I didnt vote for Hillary in 16. 3rd party. I thought Hillary would win anyway.  Then saw how awful he truly was as president and had to admit the fact that 3rd party votes can't be wasted against maga. Voted for Biden and Harris. 

 

[Spartan Girl]

2 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

What about all of us who suffer mental anguish from having to listen to him?

 

Oh, could you imagine how wonderful it would be to sue him for that—and win? That’s the dream.

1 hour ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

I didnt vote for Hillary in 16. 3rd party. I thought Hillary would win anyway.  Then saw how awful he truly was as president and had to admit the fact that 3rd party votes can't be wasted against maga. Voted for Biden and Harris. 

Well, it’s a pity that that lesson didn’t stick for some people in this election.

[lookeyloo]

8 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

And it's not going to be touched or taken away. The new "work requirement" pertains to able-bodied citizens (as JJ would say "what's the nature of your disability?")...even if they just do a few hours of community service. 

Can I relate something from my persona work experience?  I am a social worker, not the kind that does therapy. One of my jobs was through a University and we were involved in a program to reduce truancy from K-5 since it is usually not the children who choose it but a family situation getting in the way.  I monitored several of the program sites in such extremely poor areas it was hard to comprehend how the folks even survived.  There are no jobs.  There are no "community service" projects.  There is no public transportation.  Grocery stores are few and far between.  Where people live are in dire need of repair.  Children didn't get to school for some fixable reasons - no shoes, no electricity in their houses, school bus didn't come that far, sick parents.  Some children didn't eat if the school didn't provide food.  We tried to help the local program find resources for these families, but, there were no resources.  Even if a child was Medicaid eligible, there were no providers.  No cars, no busses, etc.  Also, in some states that I personally know of, there is no broadband service in a big swath of rural areas.  Some people can get a cell phone which is seen as a luxury, but nowadays jobs require on line applications.  Yes, there are computers in libraries, but folks have to have a library available that isn't on the other side of the interstate.  Some things when seen with one's own eyes are literally "eye opening".  

I am a "city girl" and observing and experiencing the conditions of some poor rural communities is heartbreaking.  Many studies have been done on how hard it is to break out of that cycle. And when people told us "those people should get a  job" and we would say "will you hire him/her"?  Oh no, not me, someone else.  

Some things seem simple on paper but the actual execution of them is very complicated.

[PRgal]

The taco truck is a reality:

 

[Mollywolly555]

7 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

Trying to reconcile this post, noting standards and saying that people are decent and don’t agree with name-calling and dehumanizing language (and a few posts above it where people are glad to have anything harmful that they post called out and removed) with this post-.

The party of kindness?

Different strokes for different folks? I remember that phrase used here recently in a differing POV discussion. ;)

I agree with anony.miss, Annber3, and Anela.

Ernst's comments were stone cold elitist and ignorant of any human feelings, especially for the depth of grief-- that ripping,  rendering of our hearts when torn from people we love-- particularly when said deaths were unnecessarily too soon, i.e., preventable by governmental means $ for health care. 

And then she exacerbated her tone-deaf brittle remarks by using her religious beliefs as a lead paint undercoat thus revealing a further "Let them eat cake", snobbery, and yes, stupidity. Insert mind-blown icon here.

The party of kindness? Taking the high road?

Humor/satire seems to have both bark and bite when it comes to issues we don't agree with. 

Humor/satire is how we survive the  unimaginable comments and events that we don't agree with,  but moreover those that are actually hurting and killing human beings.

I think most Dems understand that "strongly worded messages" are not the answer, if we are to fight the ridiculosity of the current administration. We need to spread the word--facts with references--about the enormous greed, vast ineffectiveness, crucial military mistakes, woefully under qualified cabinet appointments, and the dementia-driven nonsensical presidential remarks that make up the clear and present danger to the existence of the US government and people. 

Can pain-full truth and kindness go together? 

I'm willing to let kindness go by the way side, but only IF we keep civility and facts, and rule of law in the picture. The time of connecting across the aisle seems to sadly have passed, as evidenced by Reps lockstep adherence to maga/Project 2025.  It's past time that we put on the gloves, as well.

Dems need to shore up their vocal chords and muscles and fight LOUDLY on media and in townhalls, where Reps run away from their constituents.

They need to start strength training future candidates and get them out there front and center. Brainstorm those wild (but true) sound bites that grab headlines. Push the narrative. And yes, poke fun and make jokes about the opposition to point out its ineffectual, harmful platforms.

Show up. Show up. Show up. 

 

[bluegirl147]

8 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

And it's not going to be touched or taken away. The new "work requirement" pertains to able-bodied citizens (as JJ would say "what's the nature of your disability?")...even if they just do a few hours of community service. 

Since the Medicaid expansion that came with the ACA most people who receive Medicaid do work.  The first year of the expansion I had a full time job (40 hrs a week) and qualified for Medicaid.  Then I got a raise and no longer qualified so I moved to buying my insurance on the exchange.  They can keep repeating waste fraud and abuse but they only way they are going to find the savings they need to offset the tax cuts is if they cut benefits or drop people.  People might not notice at first.  But when they go to fill a prescription and it now costs them full price they will notice.  Or when they try to schedule a mammogram they will notice. Making it more difficult for people to receive affordable health care is simply unconscionable. Especially when it's being done to give more money to the richest of the rich. And before anyone starts whining about the national debt or the deficit health insurance for poor people is not responsible for that.  You know what is responsible?  Fighting two wars that we didn't have the money for.  And tax cuts done in 2017.  Both happened under Republican presidents.  And here we are again with Republicans wanting to do it again.

Just now, Mollywolly555 said:

The party of kindness? Taking the high road?

Once again Democrats are supposed to be held to a higher standard. It's OK for Republicans to roll around in the mud and say vicious nasty things but Dems are criticized for simply responding to the nastiness. With all due respect to Michelle Obama going high really hasn't worked out too well for us.

[Ohiopirate02]

14 minutes ago, lookeyloo said:

 Many studies have been done on how hard it is to break out of that cycle. And when people told us "those people should get a  job" and we would say "will you hire him/her"?  Oh no, not me, someone else.  

Some things seem simple on paper but the actual execution of them is very complicated.

In my work as a librarian, I have helped people that may appear to be able-bodied but are anything but. Where I live, we have some non-local unhoused individuals who float around the state. They show up anywhere from 3-18 months, live in the homeless shelter or in a tent city, and make use of the low cost or even free medical care the local med school provides before taking the bus to another city after they have maxed out on resources. These people are incapable of holding down a job long enough to afford rent, food, clothing, etc. even with government assistance. They have been failed by the system since birth, and while they may resort to alcohol or drug abuse that is not the reason why they cannot build a typical life. I do not begrudge my tax dollars going to help these people.

[tres bien]

Here’s the truth about Joni Ernst

She will vote for the BBB full stop 

She will not loose one vote in her reelection next year 

She makes her fellow Iowa senator 91 year old Chuck Grassley seem positively palatable 

[Yeah No]

9 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

And it's not going to be touched or taken away. The new "work requirement" pertains to able-bodied citizens (as JJ would say "what's the nature of your disability?")...even if they just do a few hours of community service. 

That's the thing. A lot of people on Medicaid are not "able bodied citizens" and some get worse while on Medicaid because they can't get approved for certain surgeries.

Here's a case from my personal life. A friend who used to work before the pandemic lost his job doing handywork and had to exist on pandemic unemployment and Medicaid. During that time he could not find a job and had to find gigs "under the table" to make ends meet to support a wife with her own medical issues rendering her unable to work and a teenage daughter. He ended up injuring himself and despite needing a hip replacement he could not get Medicaid to cover it. They kept insisting all he needed was physical therapy. The doctors disagreed with each other. It was a mess. So he continued to get worse and was not physically fit enough to get another job doing handyman work on the books. He and his family sunk deeper into poverty and had to go on public assistance. Then his old Prius finally gave out and he didn't have the money to get a new car. It got to the point where he was barely able to walk. And then his MIL became ill and then died and he was the only person able to handle the complications of her situation. She ended up losing her house while she was in a nursing home because she never signed it over to his wife. So her daughter never got any money from the sale of the house. It was a very sad situation.

During all this his hip was getting worse. He begged the doctors to help him get the surgery. It turns out that in the 2 years that had passed since he was turned down he also needed a second hip replacement. And the doctors, who were on his side, said that if he could have had the surgery on the first hip he probably wouldn't have gotten so bad as to need the second one. This is how people spiral down. 

So anyway he finally got approved by Medicaid for both surgeries. But having to wait so long for that until he was eventually almost a complete invalid completely ruined his life. When your livelihood depends on being "able bodied" It takes very little not to be up to your usual level of physical labor. And you are SOL if you're not. It's not like he had the skills or experience to go out and get another type of job, not at his age and unable to walk. We don't exactly have tons of work for unskilled people that don't know computers or the internet. He is also "on the spectrum" with diagnosed and medicated ADD and he has other severe medical conditions like COPD and Asthma. I can't imagine him holding any type of job in his present condition.

The good news is he JUST had the first hip replacement and is doing much better after weeks of recovery. But they say he needs to wait a while before he can have the other one done. AND he is turning 65 in two days! So now he will likely be on both Medicare and Medicaid at the same time.

But the point is, I am sure his story is far from unique. Scratch the surface with people on Medicaid and you'd have to have a heart of stone to say they should "just find a job". Even I was on Medicaid during the pandemic when my husband lost his job and I was unemployed. And in those days forget about finding a job, and even after because by then I was over 60. I tried for several years with no success. And people think you can just go get a job doing anything. Hell NO. No fast food restaurant or Walmart would hire someone with my advanced experience, education and qualifications. So it's not even as easy as all that.

[bluegirl147]

7 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

He is also "on the spectrum" with diagnosed and medicated ADD and he has other severe medical conditions like COPD and Asthma.

If we go back to the old system your friend would never have been covered by private insurance because of prior existing conditions.

Our country not having everyone covered by some type of health insurance is simply unacceptable.  I would say we are the only civilized country to not do that but can we really say we are civilized anymore? If everyone was covered there would be less preventable deaths.  People would miss less work because they would be treated for simple health issues before they became big health issues. Chronic diseases would be managed better.  We as a country would be better off.  But private insurers have bribed too many politicians for that to happen.  I think our elected officials should have to forego health insurance until everyone can be covered. And if they don't want to do that then they are free to find another job that will provide them with insurance.  Or they can simply pay out of pocket.  That is what we are told to do.  They should have to follow their own advice. 

[Affogato]

19 minutes ago, tres bien said:

Curious here

How are we to believe anyone posting here the facts of the BBB when house reps that voted for it admit they didn’t know what was in it 

Also so discouraging that there are no legitimate news outlets anymore because low IQ man has no idea what he’s doing coins stupid phrases and it becomes the norm

That is why it is a ‘big beautiful bill’. Individual bills wouldn’t get passed. Same thing with project 2025. So big no one knows what is in it.
Heh. heh. Heh. 

[peacheslatour]

26 minutes ago, tres bien said:

Curious here

How are we to believe anyone posting here the facts of the BBB when house reps that voted for it admit they didn’t know what was in it 

Also so discouraging that there are no legitimate news outlets anymore because low IQ man has no idea what he’s doing coins stupid phrases and it becomes the norm

 One Big Beautiful Bill Act," also known as H.R. 1, has been published and passed by the House of Representatives. The full text was revealed on April 28, 2025, and the tax portion was revealed on May 12, 2025. The House passed the bill on May 22, 2025, and it is now in the Senate for consideration. The White House (.gov) says it includes work requirements and aims to lift Americans up through the dignity of work. The bill is also expected to be enacted in the coming months, with a target date of July 4, 2025. 

[fastiller]

21 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

Our country not having everyone covered by some type of health insurance is simply unacceptable.  I would say we are the only civilized country to not do that but can we really say we are civilized anymore? If everyone was covered there would be less preventable deaths.  People would miss less work because they would be treated for simple health issues before they became big health issues. Chronic diseases would be managed better.  We as a country would be better off.  But private insurers have bribed too many politicians for that to happen.  I think our elected officials should have to forego health insurance until everyone can be covered. And if they don't want to do that then they are free to find another job that will provide them with insurance.  Or they can simply pay out of pocket.  That is what we are told to do.  They should have to follow their own advice. 

PREACH!!!!

A friend of mine who is originally from NJ and currently lives in Stockholm is head-over-heals in love with how their health system works.  Her son had to go to the ER.  The first person they spoke with was a doctor.  The last person they spoke with was a doctor.  They got billed precisely 0 krona for the visit.

This is why private $ needs to get out of politics: Want better healthcare? Get insurance/medical companies out of politicians' pockets.   Want affordable medication? Get pharma companies out of politicians' pockets.  Want cleaner air?  Get auto/fossil fuel companies out of politicians' pockets. Want gun control?  Get the NRA/gun manufacturers out of politicians' pockets.   

[bluegirl147]

5 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

says it includes work requirements and aims to lift Americans up through the dignity of work

Are they going to provide that work? And will that work provide health insurance?  Republicans always want to blame the person receiving the assistance.  Why don't they blame the employers who refuse to provide benefits to their employees?  Or pay their employees a living wage?  And while I'm asking questions why aren't we seeing any employers arrested for using all these immigrants being picked up by ICE (or whoever is under those masks)? I know when I was hired for my job I had to provide proof of citizenship.  Doesn't every employer have to do that?  Or are Republican donors given an exemption?

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, Yeah No said:

…When your livelihood depends on being "able bodied" It takes very little not to be up to your usual level of physical labor.…

And being "abled bodied" on paper does not mean you are still able bodied when you need medical help, as your story in its entirety explains. 

 

42 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

The White House (.gov) says it includes work requirements and aims to lift Americans up through the dignity of work.

…more likely these work requirements will just humiliate the poor for not being qualified for jobs, while the obscenely wealthy hit balls around greens feeling so proud of themselves for having proven via their wealth that they must be worthy.

35 minutes ago, fastiller said:

Want better healthcare? Get insurance/medical companies out of politicians' pockets. 

.This too.

 

 

[tres bien]

1 hour ago, peacheslatour said:

 One Big Beautiful Bill Act," also known as H.R. 1, has been published and passed by the House of Representatives. The full text was revealed on April 28, 2025, and the tax portion was revealed on May 12, 2025. The House passed the bill on May 22, 2025, and it is now in the Senate for consideration. The White House (.gov) says it includes work requirements and aims to lift Americans up through the dignity of work. The bill is also expected to be enacted in the coming months, with a target date of July 4, 2025. 

So in conclusion more of same MAGA word salad 

[annzeepark914]

1 hour ago, fastiller said:

PREACH!!!!

A friend of mine who is originally from NJ and currently lives in Stockholm is head-over-heals in love with how their health system works.  Her son had to go to the ER.  The first person they spoke with was a doctor.  The last person they spoke with was a doctor.  They got billed precisely 0 krona for the visit.

I was just a tourist & only paid $35 for a clinic visit & $12 for an antibiotic. Nice of the Swedes to let me benefit from their health plan 🇸🇪 💙💛💙

[Affogato]

13 minutes ago, tres bien said:

So in conclusion more of same MAGA word salad 

July 4 ….. 

[Lisa418722]

2 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

If we go back to the old system your friend would never have been covered by private insurance because of prior existing conditions.

Our country not having everyone covered by some type of health insurance is simply unacceptable.  I would say we are the only civilized country to not do that but can we really say we are civilized anymore? If everyone was covered there would be less preventable deaths.  People would miss less work because they would be treated for simple health issues before they became big health issues. Chronic diseases would be managed better.  We as a country would be better off.  But private insurers have bribed too many politicians for that to happen.  I think our elected officials should have to forego health insurance until everyone can be covered. And if they don't want to do that then they are free to find another job that will provide them with insurance.  Or they can simply pay out of pocket.  That is what we are told to do.  They should have to follow their own advice. 

I had some times in my life when I was out of high school, where I was uninsured because I wasn't a full-time student (this was pre-ACA days) or working in a job that offered insurance.  I was born with a heart defect, so when I would finally get back on insurance, I always had to wait a year to be covered. Thankfully, it never became an issue beyond seeing my cardiologist once a year, but when I look back now, I realize how lucky I was.  

In 2022, I went to the dermatologist for my yearly skin cancer check, and he found melanoma. It was caught early, but now I have another pre-existing condition that if they remove these protections, I'm screwed.  Then add to that I'm 7 years away from being old enough for Medicare, and I don't know if it will be there for me.  

People talk about how high our taxes would be to have this.  At one point, I had a job that cost me $600 a month for a $9,000 deductible and an additional $38,000 out of pocket.  Yeah, I think I could afford a little more in my taxes in order not to have to file for bankruptcy if I had to seek major medical treatment. I was in and out of that job quickly. Not because of the insurance, but I was very happy to leave that behind.  Also, I don't have the "I got mine, but I don't want to pay for you to have the same" philosophy, so if it meant every American could have insurance, I'm good with paying more in taxes, as long as the rich pay their fair share. 

 

Edited Wednesday at 05:53 PM by Lisa418722

[PRgal]

My maternal grandmother was super-classist and very pro-education (likely because she was denied a post-secondary education due to WWII).  She used to say that if one didn't study, they'd end up "dahm nai jo gwoo lai" which translates to "hauling cement (and) working as a coolie."  In other words, you'd never get a good job.  

[Kemper]

To me, a winning campaign strategy for the Dems (if they can manage to break away from the same-old-same-old) would be to go after insurance companies. Hard. Most everyone in this country (unless very wealthy) has had at least one terrible, sometimes tragic story of being denied insurance for a surgery or other needed procedure. Why can't they (Dems, of which I am one) seem to think of this? Could it be because like seemingly everyone in Congress, they are taking lobbying money from the companies involved. And....there should be a law against lobbying. It is nothing but bribery, plain and simple. We all know that this will  never happen.

My son has MS; and is a veteran. He is fortunate that his company has decent health insurance - or at least they try. This past year he was denied coverage of his MS medicine for the first time. His employer tried very hard to get the insurance company to change their mind. Crickets. Finally, his neurologist got involved and contacted the pharmaceutical company. Who for whatever reason decided to get involved. Whatever negotiating tactic they used....it worked. 

While waiting for his prescription to hopefully be approved by the insurance company, my son had a serious MS flare. It has been months; some of the damage done while off his meds is serious and may be no coming back from. This is most everyone's life right now, more or less, in the Land of the Free and Home of the Brave. Capitalism and greed run amok; while we, as citizens, seem helpless to do anything. While politicians, billionaires and Tech Bros profit. Their greed is a bottomless pit. By the way, appointments and care via the VA is a steep, uphill climb. No fault of the VA; fault politicians for decades who have done nothing to help this agency. Whose "clients" have fought and died for their country. Maybe starting with Vietnam.

Edited Wednesday at 06:08 PM by Kemper

[bluegirl147]

11 minutes ago, Lisa418722 said:

Also, I don't have the "I got mine, but I don't want to pay for you to have the same" philosophy, so if it meant every American could have insurance, I'm good with paying more in taxes, as long as the rich pay their fair share.

And this is what is missing from so many people nowadays.  The lack of empathy still astounds me even though I know it shouldn't.  I hear a lot of people say I worked for mine so everyone else should too.  It is usually being said by an older person who's job opportunities were much better when they were in their 20s and 30s than they are now for people in their 20s and 30s. 

[bluegirl147]

4 minutes ago, Kemper said:

Why can't they (Dems, of which I am one) seem to think of this? Could it be because like seemingly everyone in Congress, they are taking lobbying money from the companies involved.

To put it bluntly, yes.

5 minutes ago, Kemper said:

It is nothing but bribery,

Thank Citizens United for that.

6 minutes ago, Kemper said:

While waiting for his prescription to hopefully be approved by the insurance company, my son had a serious MS flare. It has been months; some of the damage done while off his meds is serious and may be no coming back from.

And insurance companies do not care.  They gladly collect the premiums but loathe having to pay claims.  I read somewhere that some insurance companies deny a percentage of all claims no matter what they are hoping patients will not appeal.  

9 minutes ago, Kemper said:

While politicians, billionaires and Tech Bros profit.

And this is not sustainable.  There has to be a breaking point.  The income gap continuing to widen is only going to lead worse things happening.  

[fastiller]

45 minutes ago, PRgal said:

My maternal grandmother was super-classist and very pro-education (likely because she was denied a post-secondary education due to WWII).  She used to say that if one didn't study, they'd end up "dahm nai jo gwoo lai" which translates to "hauling cement (and) working as a coolie."  In other words, you'd never get a good job.  

Did anyone ever say to her 'someone needs to haul the cement so the world can be built'?
Also, I work in construction (we're a structural engineering firm who designs for GCs; most of my Clients are ones who build and repair NYC's many, many public schools & public housing), and I can tell you, those 'unskilled' labourers are anything but unskilled.  They train & re-train extensively and get several qualifications.  They're all very well compensated (union jobs).   Union mason in NYC averages $30/hour;  an electrician averages $35/hour. I do know that my Client constituency MUST be union & do the regular training/certifications b/c they're involved in public work and that private jobs don't necessarily have to meet such stringent requirements.

[ECM1231]

1 hour ago, PRgal said:

My maternal grandmother was super-classist and very pro-education (likely because she was denied a post-secondary education due to WWII).  She used to say that if one didn't study, they'd end up "dahm nai jo gwoo lai" which translates to "hauling cement (and) working as a coolie."  In other words, you'd never get a good job.  

"No work is insignificant. All labor that uplifts humanity has dignity and importance and should be undertaken with painstaking excellence."

Martin Luther King, Jr.

 

 

[PRgal]

15 minutes ago, fastiller said:

Did anyone ever say to her 'someone needs to haul the cement so the world can be built'?
Also, I work in construction (we're a structural engineering firm who designs for GCs; most of my Clients are ones who build and repair NYC's many, many public schools & public housing), and I can tell you, those 'unskilled' labourers are anything but unskilled.  They train & re-train extensively and get several qualifications.  They're all very well compensated (union jobs).   Union mason in NYC averages $30/hour;  an electrician averages $35/hour. I do know that my Client constituency MUST be union & do the regular training/certifications b/c they're involved in public work and that private jobs don't necessarily have to meet such stringent requirements.

As an adult, my interpretation is that the cement hauler in this situation is that they're forever an apprentice and wouldn't get their full licence.  But that's not what she meant and she probably doesn't understand unions.  She was born in Macau, in 1923.  

[fastiller]

1 minute ago, PRgal said:

As an adult, my interpretation is that the cement hauler in this situation is that they're forever an apprentice and wouldn't get their full licence.  But that's not what she meant and she probably doesn't understand unions.  She was born in Macau, in 1923.  

Understood. 

Even so, someone has to haul the cement for the world to be built.  Similarly, someone has to pick the produce for the world to be fed.  And as @ECM1231 reminds us (through the words of MLK, Jr.) no work is insignificant.

[bluegirl147]

17 minutes ago, ECM1231 said:

"No work is insignificant. All labor that uplifts humanity has dignity and importance and should be undertaken with painstaking excellence."

Martin Luther King, Jr.

 

 

When my son was little he thought the people bagging the groceries at our grocery store must have made a lot of money because in his words "they are doing all the work".   I remember hearing Henry Ford paid his employees enough to ensure they could buy the cars they were building.  If only that were true today.  For as long as I live I will never understand why someone sitting behind a desk makes tens of millions of dollars a year while the workers who ensure that particular company makes a profit doesn't even come close to making that in their lifetime. Why shareholders are valued more than the employees.  Why whenever the stock price doesn't reach it's expected price the first thing they do is cut labor costs.  Tell me again how much winning is going on.