S03.E08: Sitzprobe

[shapeshifter]

…

6 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

At the end, when Loretta is being taken into custody in lieu of Dickie, to what is she referring when she declares: “I'm not gonna let another innocent man go to jail for what I did”?

6 hours ago, Cotypubby said:

The stalker who the police originally arrested for the murder but who was released earlier in the episode. They all got the news of his release during the sitzprobe.

Oh. Right! 
Did Loretta’s declaration of “I'm not gonna let another innocent man go to jail for what I did” sound like maybe she was lying to protect Dickie?
— and it will turn out neither Loretta nor Dickie are killers
— which I think is a plot point in an episode of Murder She Wrote, or maybe OG Perry Mason, or Matlock, or all of the above and others?
— maybe even Agatha Christie, or…?

[ofmd]

Yes, I think most of us think she's lying. I'm not ruling out that she's doing a double bluff, but it seems unlikely. And probably Dickie is innocent, too.

I agree that's been a plot on... probably every murder mysteryx show ever, but I don't necessarily mind.

Edited September 20, 2023 by ofmd

[peeayebee]

9 hours ago, secnarf said:

If there is a clue in there, I wonder if it's in the last verse, saying that they should be looking outside of the cast/crew.

I saw that as a clue of sorts. I like the idea of the critic being the murderer. However, I'm going back and forth betw suspects, which is not a bad thing.

 

7 hours ago, Quilt Fairy said:

Have we seen the scene that Dickie refers to when he's talking to Loretta by the stairs?  "When Ben and I had that big argument and Ben said I was dead to him..."  I don't remember that.  But the more I think about it, maybe that's why Ben and Loretta were fighting, she was defending Dickie.  Jeeze, maybe Loretta DID do it. 

I too was trying to remember if we'd see that Dickie/Ben scene.

 

5 hours ago, the fresh maker said:

I watched the episode again and noticed a couple of interesting things about Loretta's confession. She says she poisoned Ben's protein drink. Williams only mentioned that he was poisoned; she didn't say how.

"Protein drink" jumped out to me, too. That seemed very specific. And again, I was trying to remember if we knew Ben drank protein drinks. 

[Milburn Stone]

There was an exchange in this episode where someone said "It couldn't have been [name of person] because of [this] and [that]!," and I went "wait, what's the logic there?," and I'm not entirely sure the problem was me.

I hope millennials are watching this show so they will finally hear the names Gilbert and Sullivan.

[Athena]

I like Streep and she has been good here. I agree that that this smaller, unassuming role is great for the woman who was named the  Star of the 80s. This role also reminds me a bit of her role in Sophie's Choice but much less depressing. I really like her and Martin Short's chemistry. Oliver can be such a twat but Short is great at being vulnerable as Oliver that I do feel for him. Even if Loretta is innocent, Streep won't be around to play the love interest. Her Happy Ending will probably be off to LA career with Dickie managing.

I'm not someone who wants characters to be in relationships for them to be happy, but it would be nice for Oliver or Charles to have a stable, loving partner when the show ends. Mabel/Selena doesn't really seem to have romantic chemistry with most of the people they have paired her with.

 

[Milburn Stone]

58 minutes ago, Athena said:

Mabel/Selena doesn't really seem to have romantic chemistry with most of the people they have paired her with.

Possibly unpopular opinion, but I don't "get" Selena in this show, never have. She seems dead. Not in the manner that her character is dead, but like she, the actress, is dead. 

Being old, I came to this show with no prior knowledge of her, which maybe is the problem. Maybe if I already thought she was great, I'd think she was great in this. 

[iMonrey]

I'm also leaning toward two murderers, possibly Donna and Cliff. Or possibly Donna poisoned Ben and then Dickie pushed him into the elevator shaft, either on purpose or accidentally.

Still, I've been suspicious of Tobert all season long. It doesn't seem like they would hire Jess Williams to play such an inconsequential part. On the other hand, if Detective Williams was right, the murderer(s) were in the theater in that episode, and Tobert wasn't there.

I dunno. 

And yes, that Pickwick patter song is damn catchy.

22 minutes ago, Milburn Stone said:

Possibly unpopular opinion, but I don't "get" Selena in this show, never have. She seems dead. Not in the manner that her character is dead, but like she, the actress, is dead. 

She has a definite flat affect in her performance. I've never seen her in anything else so I don't know if it's a character choice or if she's just like this. 

[Suzn]

 

40 minutes ago, Milburn Stone said:

Possibly unpopular opinion, but I don't "get" Selena in this show, never have. She seems dead. Not in the manner that her character is dead, but like she, the actress, is dead. 

Being old, I came to this show with no prior knowledge of her, which maybe is the problem. Maybe if I already thought she was great, I'd think she was great in this. 

17 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

She has a definite flat affect in her performance. I've never seen her in anything else so I don't know if it's a character choice or if she's just like this. 

 

I don't know Selena from anything else so I don't know what is just her and what is her as this character.  I've thought that her very subdued performance works as a good contrast to the manic Oliver and Charles.  I think it works best when all three are together (and there hasn't been enough of that this season).

[Snazzy Daisy]

13 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Donna being sick makes me wonder if Cliff is the killer, but Donna fits too.

They deliberately show us how flexible Cliff can be and his parkour skill. There must be something to these, right?

[sistermagpie]

10 hours ago, HelloooKitty said:

Even if it was pretty obvious, I’m so happy I called it correctly that Loretta was Dickie’s mom.  my very first guess, after episode one, was that it was the producers. I still think so, though I’m leaning towards the mom specifically.

Thinking about Donna as a suspect made me think of The Producers--that is, the show that this season even directly referenced. In that show, the producers need the show to fail so nobody finds out how much they cooked the books.

 

10 hours ago, Phebemarie said:

On second watch and noticed something I'd overlooked.  During the conversation between Mabel and Loretta, Mabel says, "Killers sometimes insert themselves into investigations".   I thought it was a pointed comment pushing back on Loretta's nosiness...but maybe it's also foreshadowing someone that Mabel is overlooking, who also inserted himself into the investigation:  Tobert.  

Yeah, Tobert definitely seems like he's the odd man out here with everything he's doing.

7 hours ago, ofmd said:

On a different note... When Oliver told Loretta he loved her, she didn't say it back. Of course she had her mind on more urgent things, but I didn't really get the vibe of "oh no, if only I wasn't going to do this thing..."

I did. I thought the whole set up was that Loretta was finally getting the life she'd always wanted--professional success and personal happiness--and she was going to throw it all away for Dickie, exactly the opposite of what she did as a young girl.

3 hours ago, peeayebee said:

I too was trying to remember if we'd see that Dickie/Ben scene.

I don't think we ever saw it.

3 hours ago, peeayebee said:

 

"Protein drink" jumped out to me, too. That seemed very specific. And again, I was trying to remember if we knew Ben drank protein drinks. 

Or this could be a clue that she's lying. We viewers have focused on cookies, but maybe Loretta went for protein drinks because that's what Ben says he's into--healthy things. 

[DoctorAtomic]

22 minutes ago, Suzn said:

I've thought that her very subdued performance works as a good contrast to the manic Oliver and Charles.

I think it's a deliberate acting choice because we know the other two can be wacky and manic. I think it works because you're not expecting the pretty, young woman/teen pop star to be the "straight girl" on this show at face value. She's got great, droll readings to me, "That's a weird flex." Or the way she says "olds". 

She hosted Saturday Night Live not too long ago, and she was funny/wacky. 

[chaifan]

The mystery for me is how Ben was poisoned but not poisoned.  They've said the tox screen came back negative, right?  So wouldn't that rule out the rat poison? 

I think the twin/triplet theory is shot, as Loretta's scrap book and flashbacks only show one brother for Ben.  I suppose they could come up with some sort of convoluted story about how the mom was pregnant with twins, but since they already had one child and couldn't afford 2 more mouths to feed gave one up for adoption.  But I think that's a stretch, even for this show. 

I loved Mabel's prep talk to Howard.  We know Howard is going to find something, but what?  (I love the automatic assumption that the shred bin hasn't been emptied in what now, months?)

I also love Oliver and Charles' elaborate ruse to plant the GoPro for the interviews.  I suppose it would have been much simpler to just leave a cell phone in there recording... 

Where's KT?  Isn't she stage manager?  Wouldn't she be there for this rehearsal?  She's still on my list of suspects, just because.  As are Tobert, the mom/son...  I really haven't a clue...

Did anyone notice what was on the screen during the credits?  On the left.  It was too small and I was too lazy to get off the couch to see what it was. 

Poor Oliver... 

 

 

[peeayebee]

1 hour ago, Milburn Stone said:

Possibly unpopular opinion, but I don't "get" Selena in this show, never have. She seems dead. Not in the manner that her character is dead, but like she, the actress, is dead. 

Being old, I came to this show with no prior knowledge of her, which maybe is the problem. Maybe if I already thought she was great, I'd think she was great in this. 

The only thing I know her from (other than her SNL appearance) is The Wizards of Waverley Place. I remember thinking she was really good in that, but then I was surprised to read that many people hated her on the show. To each their own.

I'm not a big fan of hers as Mabel. I don't like her flat vocal affect or that her face often doesn't really move. I wish she were more expressive.

[Athena]

2 hours ago, Milburn Stone said:

Possibly unpopular opinion, but I don't "get" Selena in this show, never have. She seems dead. Not in the manner that her character is dead, but like she, the actress, is dead.

Being old, I came to this show with no prior knowledge of her, which maybe is the problem. Maybe if I already thought she was great, I'd think she was great in this. 

1 hour ago, Suzn said:

I don't know Selena from anything else so I don't know what is just her and what is her as this character.  I've thought that her very subdued performance works as a good contrast to the manic Oliver and Charles.  I think it works best when all three are together (and there hasn't been enough of that this season).

1 hour ago, DoctorAtomic said:

I think it's a deliberate acting choice because we know the other two can be wacky and manic. I think it works because you're not expecting the pretty, young woman/teen pop star to be the "straight girl" on this show at face value. She's got great, droll readings to me, "That's a weird flex." Or the way she says "olds". 

She hosted Saturday Night Live not too long ago, and she was funny/wacky. 

I have also never really seen Selena acting in anything before this but know she was and had heard a couple of her songs back in the day.

There are a few things at work here I think. Mabel is not really an expressive character. She has struggled with a number of tragedies in her life. The character especially this season is depressed and going through a quarter life crisis. Theo even told Tobert, "I don't get her either," which isn't saying much since it's Theo but we're suppose to see Mabel adrift.

Selena is the "straight man" because of the other two. When they are together, they do have chemistry and they bring out some good work and expressions from her. I like her acting choices when she's allowed to be dramatic and goofy including the musical number from earlier. I also think Selena's health may have affected her performance at least in the first ep of the season.

On the whole, Selena is not great acting wise here but she's been decent to good when in certain moments with her fantastic co-stars. I don't think that's an unpopular opinion since Selena is not necessarily known for great acting. She also gets a lot of hate in general for being a popular female celebrity who was a child star. Her personal life has been open to the public for most of her life.

[Snazzy Daisy]

8 hours ago, ofmd said:

By the way, was anyone able to read what was on the few scraps of paper Howard had pieced together?

An insurance contract from the State Farm?

Or an employment contract? 🤔

[Abra]

51 minutes ago, chaifan said:

Where's KT?  Isn't she stage manager?  Wouldn't she be there for this rehearsal?

I'm pretty sure that was KT calling people to the stage over the intercom, including I think Charles with an added "God help us" or some such added to the request for his Pickwick Triplet's number 😂

[Affogato]

I like all the acting in this show. I am always impressed by how much Streep communicates with every look. each expression, the way she looks when she thinks of Dickey, how she hugs him, leaves nothing to the imagination. 

I would like Mabel to find a goal or direction more than I want her to find a romantic entanglement. 

Loretta could know about the protein drinks because she has been spending time with Dickie, who probably told her about Ben and his drinks/snacks. Taking care of Ben has been a big part of his life. I don't think that is necessarily a clue. 

I think the rat poison is a clue, though. I hope that the phantom of the theater doesn't die eating poisoned rats. 

The critic was there for both heart attacks, which could be suspicious. She seemed actually fond of Oscar, though.

[shapeshifter]

-

9 hours ago, Athena said:

Even if Loretta is innocent, Streep won't be around to play the love interest. Her Happy Ending will probably be off to LA career with Dickie managing.

Loretta and Dickie could be shown as the future anti-Bizarro versions of Donna and Cliff.

 

7 hours ago, iMonrey said:

On the other hand, if Detective Williams was right, the murderer(s) were in the theater in that episode, and Tobert wasn't there.

Or was he?👀
—although I prefer the theory of Tobert being a DEA operative.

 

3 hours ago, Affogato said:

I like all the acting in this show. I am always impressed by how much Streep communicates with every look. each expression, the way she looks when she thinks of Dickey, how she hugs him, leaves nothing to the imagination. 

In this episode Selena seemed to also be conveying emotions through facial expressions — possibly influenced by watching Meryl Streep work.
But the directing and camera work deserve credit for eliciting and capturing both of the actors’ performances too.

Edited September 20, 2023 by shapeshifter

[Lugal]

7 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Still, I've been suspicious of Tobert all season long. It doesn't seem like they would hire Jess Williams to play such an inconsequential part.

Mabel did tell Loretta that the killer often tries to insinuate themself into the investigation.

[Quilt Fairy]

8 hours ago, sistermagpie said:

Thinking about Donna as a suspect made me think of The Producers--that is, the show that this season even directly referenced. In that show, the producers need the show to fail so nobody finds out how much they cooked the books.

Oooh, I like this idea.  Thinking more about The Producers, they create a perfect storm of failure, with bizarre choices for director and star.  And here in OMITB's Death Rattle, we have Ben Glenroy, who may be a movie star but has no stage experience, and of course, Oliver, the director who talks grandly but hasn't directly a play, much less had a hit, in forever. 

Edited September 21, 2023 by Quilt Fairy

[Zaffy]

Best episode of the season so far.
I loved everything in it. 

The whole "triplets" sequence was fantastic!

I think there is  something weird with the poisoning.
What if Ben ate the donuts, that were poisoned for someone else?

Edited September 21, 2023 by Zaffy

[cardigirl]

On 9/20/2023 at 12:14 PM, sistermagpie said:

Thinking about Donna as a suspect made me think of The Producers--that is, the show that this season even directly referenced. In that show, the producers need the show to fail so nobody finds out how much they cooked the books.

 

15 hours ago, Quilt Fairy said:

Oooh, I like this idea.  Thinking more about The Producers, they create a perfect storm of failure, with bizarre choices for director and star.  And here in OMITB's Death Rattle, we have Ben Glenroy, who may be a movie star but has no stage experience, and of course, Oliver, the director who talks grandly but hasn't directly a play, much less had a hit, in forever. 

The more I think about this idea, the more I love it. Donna said they were literally lighting money on fire for every moment they were in production. 

It is quite possible that she decided to "help" Cliff by over-selling shares of the show in the hopes it would fail. And it would be just like this show to bring in Mel Brooks and Matthew Broderick to kind of point the way, but in our star-struck eyes (or at least, mine) we overlooked The Producers angle and just watched them interact with Oliver. LOL. 

Clever. 

[peeayebee]

I'm glad the show is keeping us guessing as to who the murderer is. I can see motives for just about everyone, and that's as it should be.

[DoctorAtomic]

The Producers angle is kind of brilliantly sublime. I could buy it. 

I still like the idea of everyone having a motive and trying to kill Ben. 

[shapeshifter]

5 hours ago, Zaffy said:

The whole "triplets" sequence was fantastic!

It just now occurred to me that there are the triplets in the play, and then there are the three podcasters.

 

[JenE4]

21 hours ago, Lugal said:

Mabel did tell Loretta that the killer often tries to insinuate themself into the investigation.

Isn’t that exactly what the “assistant” is doing? I forget his name—the one helping piece together the shredder paper. He insinuated himself not only into the investigation—but the play itself, and has always seemed infatuated with the trio’s podcast/investigation.

I do really like the theories about Mother Producer protecting Boy Producer. The whole lipstick scene with doing anything to protect your child was so heavy handed that it seems like they/she will be the very next suspect. How many episodes are left? If there’s more than one, then I almost feel like it’s too soon to be throwing suspicion on them. 

So that brings me back to the assistant simply because he just wants to be very involved and seen as important—and everyone seems to be humoring him and trying to give him busy work—calling the stage direction for Oliver and working the shredder puzzle for Mabel. Motive could be just giving them another murder to solve that he can help with. He pointed out the shredder. I’m trying to think back to previous episodes… I feel like he’s always piping up with “helpful tips” but I can’t think of any specifics to be like the smoking gun of how would he know about this? Eh, all I can think of is the “ghost” who turned out to be the old homeless director, so I got nothing on that one!

[Suzn]

On 9/21/2023 at 11:37 AM, peeayebee said:

I'm glad the show is keeping us guessing as to who the murderer is. I can see motives for just about everyone, and that's as it should be.

I agree.  I want to know the answer to who killed Ben, but I'm not watching to solve a puzzle.  I just want to spend time with these people.  Every episode seems too short.

ETA: This episode was the best of this season.  I loved the songs.

Edited September 24, 2023 by Suzn

[shapeshifter]

Just now, Suzn said:

Every episode seems too short.

I like the episodes not running too long like a lot of streaming shows, filled with stuff that should have been cut — especially since I like to dissect every detail.

[peeayebee]

2 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

It just now occurred to me that there are the triplets in the play, and then there are the three podcasters.

I didn't make that connection either. Duh! Plus there's two males and one female in each trio. I suppose that could just be the rule of three.

I suddenly remember a number from one of my favorite movies, "The Band Wagon." Triplets.

Edited September 21, 2023 by peeayebee

[Enigma X]

On 9/20/2023 at 12:20 PM, DoctorAtomic said:

I think it's a deliberate acting choice because we know the other two can be wacky and manic. I think it works because you're not expecting the pretty, young woman/teen pop star to be the "straight girl" on this show at face value. She's got great, droll readings to me, "That's a weird flex." Or the way she says "olds". 

She hosted Saturday Night Live not too long ago, and she was funny/wacky. 

I think it is a bit of both. I think as an actress, Selena Gomez has limited range, and it fits for a character playing the straight man. This is not to bash Gomez. I think all the main actors have great chemistry with each other.

[Quilt Fairy]

2 hours ago, JenE4 said:

So that brings me back to the assistant simply because he just wants to be very involved and seen as important

The assistant is Howard, and he actually does have a motive of a sort.   His boyfriend was Ben's understudy, so he's now going to have his Broadway debut.  Of course, that depends on them continuing with a show after Ben's death.  

While I'm speaking about Howard, has anyone noticed in the opening sequences that Howard is walking a dog?  Whose dog?  Howard famously has a cat. 

There are 2 more episodes left. 

[shapeshifter]

-

1 hour ago, peeayebee said:

I didn't make that connection either. Duh! Plus there's two males and one female in each trio. I suppose that could just be the rule of three.

I suddenly remember a number from one of my favorite movies, "The Band Wagon." Triplets.

“I wish I had a gun.
A wittle gun.
It would be fun
to shoot the other two 
and be only one!”

[sistermagpie]

15 minutes ago, Quilt Fairy said:

While I'm speaking about Howard, has anyone noticed in the opening sequences that Howard is walking a dog?  Whose dog?  Howard famously has a cat. 

 

He is walking a cat. 

[SourK]

On 9/19/2023 at 10:30 PM, secnarf said:

If there is a clue in there, I wonder if it's in the last verse, saying that they should be looking outside of the cast/crew.

I think this could be right. We've all been suspicious of everyone with screen time, but the characters are locked into the idea that it's someone from the play. Maybe it's not. (My bet's on Tobert right now, but my bet changes a lot.)

On 9/20/2023 at 10:03 AM, Athena said:

I like Streep and she has been good here. I agree that that this smaller, unassuming role is great for the woman who was named the  Star of the 80s.

I like Meryl Streep in this -- I've liked her in a few things in the past few years, much more than I used to. I also think the tone and style of this show is a good fit for her.

However.

I always find it kind of weird when I watch a movie or TV show about characters who failed to have a career in the entertainment industry. Because the story is obviously always being told by people who succeeded. And there's part of me that can't get that out of my head, and I'm just like, "Nice of you to have empathy for your unlucky peers, I guess?" but it still feels weird.

8 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

The Producers angle is kind of brilliantly sublime. I could buy it. 

I still like the idea of everyone having a motive and trying to kill Ben. 

I like both of those ideas.

[Crs97]

9 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

The Producers angle is kind of brilliantly sublime. I could buy it. 

 

In which case Matthew Broderick and Oliver’s phone call were great Easter eggs!

This was my favorite episode.

[Quilt Fairy]

4 hours ago, sistermagpie said:

He is walking a cat. 

Really?  If so, it's a cat that walks like a dog. 

[sistermagpie]

32 minutes ago, Quilt Fairy said:

Really?  If so, it's a cat that walks like a dog. 

I think that's the idea--he may not really ever walk Sevelyn like that, but they wanted somebody walking something in the opening.

[cardigirl]

I walk my cat on a leash and she goes forward ahead of me. She loves it! 

Edited September 22, 2023 by cardigirl

[Jediknight]

Meryl's got the Supporting Actress Emmy locked up.  This episode continued to prove that.

[Athena]

11 hours ago, SourK said:

I always find it kind of weird when I watch a movie or TV show about characters who failed to have a career in the entertainment industry. Because the story is obviously always being told by people who succeeded. And there's part of me that can't get that out of my head, and I'm just like, "Nice of you to have empathy for your unlucky peers, I guess?" but it still feels weird.

I know what you mean. It's actually come at a pertinent time with the strike because most actors in SAG-AFTRA are closer to Loretta than any of the stars on this show. Most actors have second jobs and can't afford health care or can get qualified for it via SAG. Most want to make it big but very few even get any consistent gigs. It's a creative work so I think most are realistic in that they will be satisfied if they can keep doing what they love in some capacity.

[Yeah No]

On 9/20/2023 at 11:28 AM, iMonrey said:

I'm also leaning toward two murderers, possibly Donna and Cliff. Or possibly Donna poisoned Ben and then Dickie pushed him into the elevator shaft, either on purpose or accidentally.

Still, I've been suspicious of Tobert all season long. It doesn't seem like they would hire Jess Williams to play such an inconsequential part. On the other hand, if Detective Williams was right, the murderer(s) were in the theater in that episode, and Tobert wasn't there.

I have thought the same all season long.  I was saying in early August that I wasn't even sure either of these events was a murder.  I know it's called "Only Murders in the Building" but there is a possibility that either one or neither of these was a murder or murder attempt.  And I have also been down with the multiple murderers theory.   One who made an unsuccessful attempt and one that finished off the job.   One could have been by accident and one intentional.  I thought the rat poison was a clue but maybe it wasn't rat poison per se but another kind of poison that may not show up on toxicology reports.

I was down on Sept. 1 saying I thought Tobert was a possible murder suspect and that's before all the hints about the murderer inserting themselves into the investigation.  I am still wondering who is buying Mabel's aunt's apartment.  Why has that been the trade secret of the entire season?  They made it look like she only had a short time to find another place to live, even made her look at an apartment and here it is weeks later and she's still living in her aunt's apartment with Tobert.  Go figure.

On 9/20/2023 at 12:24 PM, chaifan said:

I think the twin/triplet theory is shot, as Loretta's scrap book and flashbacks only show one brother for Ben.  I suppose they could come up with some sort of convoluted story about how the mom was pregnant with twins, but since they already had one child and couldn't afford 2 more mouths to feed gave one up for adoption.  But I think that's a stretch, even for this show. 

Yes, I thought the same thing.  Also, I have a question.  I'm confused about how at the end of the episode Mabel said that the photos in Loretta's scrapbook were not of Ben but of Dickie.  I was not really following that being that I'm getting over Covid my brain is not at full capacity just yet.  Is that what she said?  Because from what I saw, the photos certainly looked like Ben.  Unless they're going toward the claim that Dickie looked like Ben when he was younger.  Perhaps the "triplets" plays in with this?  Although your theory about giving one up for adoption is not that far fetched because I've actually heard about that being done before if you can believe that.

Also, what was the significance of the letter Charles and Mabel pilfered out of Loretta's purse?  The one she was telling Dickie about earlier that she wanted to give him and then "run away"?  I didn't see anyone mention that yet in this thread.  What was that all about?  Is it part of the cliffhanger of the episode and we just have to wait until next week to find out?

[Quilt Fairy]

13 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

Because from what I saw, the photos certainly looked like Ben.

The photos all focused on Ben because he was the celebrity, but had Dickie in the background. 

 

13 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

Also, what was the significance of the letter Charles and Mabel pilfered out of Loretta's purse?  The one she was telling Dickie about earlier that she wanted to give him and then "run away"? 

That's the same letter, the one she never gave him.  It's the one where she tells Dickie she's his biological mother. 

 

We did see who bought Mabel's aunt's apartment, the woman who answered the door when Charles and Oliver knocked looking for Mabel.  It doesn't seem to have any relevance. 

Edited September 23, 2023 by Quilt Fairy

[Yeah No]

Just now, Quilt Fairy said:

The photos all focused on Ben because he was the celebrity, but had Dickie in the background. 

That's the same letter, the one she never gave him.  It's the one where she tells Dickie she's his biological mother. 

Ah OK that all makes sense now, I remember that letter now.  I've been through a lot in the past few weeks....

I guess Mabel noticed Dickie in the background on those photos after reading the letter.

[KittenPokerCheater]

What a terrific episode.  I am sure he will ultimately be okay but wow- it felt like a gut punch.

And serious props to Steve Martin for performing the Patter Song so beautifully.  It truly is like a Gilbert and Sullivan piece.

And YAY for the cop coming back to handle the interrogations.  So fun.

[shapeshifter]

-

8 hours ago, Yeah No said:

am still wondering who is buying Mabel's aunt's apartment.  Why has that been the trade secret of the entire season? 

8 hours ago, Quilt Fairy said:

 We did see who bought Mabel's aunt's apartment, the woman who answered the door when Charles and Oliver knocked looking for Mabel.  It doesn't seem to have any relevance. 

Maybe not relevant, but I think the apartment drama was not just to have Mabel crash with Theo for a bit.🤔
In Law & Order, NYC apartments have definitely been motives for murder. 
IDK. 🤷🏻‍♀️

[iMonrey]

On 9/21/2023 at 5:30 PM, Quilt Fairy said:

While I'm speaking about Howard, has anyone noticed in the opening sequences that Howard is walking a dog?  Whose dog?  Howard famously has a cat. 

I have never been certain whether or not that's supposed to be Howard in the animated opening sequence. It seems odd that the four people depicted in the titles would be Charles, Oliver, Mabel and . . . Howard?

Quote

am still wondering who is buying Mabel's aunt's apartment.  Why has that been the trade secret of the entire season? 

I can't remember, is Mabel's aunt still alive? If so, where is she? Is it possible someone is just renting that apartment while Mabel's aunt or some other relative remains the owner? Because ultimately I have to believe Mabel will move back in at some point.

[peeayebee]

10 hours ago, Yeah No said:

I'm confused about how at the end of the episode Mabel said that the photos in Loretta's scrapbook were not of Ben but of Dickie. 

Yes, the presumption was that Loretta had a scrapbook devoted to Ben, but it was Dickie. So the photos were all about Dickie, not Ben.

39 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I have never been certain whether or not that's supposed to be Howard in the animated opening sequence. It seems odd that the four people depicted in the titles would be Charles, Oliver, Mabel and . . . Howard?

The sweater vest is a dead-giveaway that it's Howard. His animation was also last season, too, right?

[sistermagpie]

59 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I have never been certain whether or not that's supposed to be Howard in the animated opening sequence. It seems odd that the four people depicted in the titles would be Charles, Oliver, Mabel and . . . Howard?

Quote

I think it's just there to have someone walking by who lives in the buildilng to show the building. Didn't it start off being Bunny or someone else?

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

I can't remember, is Mabel's aunt still alive? If so, where is she? Is it possible someone is just renting that apartment while Mabel's aunt or some other relative remains the owner? Because ultimately I have to believe Mabel will move back in at some point.

I thought the whole point of Mabel renovating was so her aunt could sell it, and now it's sold so she had to leave. But yes, she needs to come back!

[shapeshifter]

2 hours ago, sistermagpie said:

3 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I can't remember, is Mabel's aunt still alive?…

I thought the whole point of Mabel renovating was so her aunt could sell it, and now it's sold so she had to leave. But yes, she needs to come back!

Maybe Mabel’s aunt will pass away off-screen, leaving Mabel enough money to at least buy some apartment in the building and live without needing too much additional income.

[KerleyQ]

Early in the season, I thought it had to be Donna and/or Cliff. Then I got distracted by the idea of Ben being a twin (or triplet) and Loretta's son. But, that's all been shot to hell over the past couple episodes, so I think I'm back to Donna/Cliff. If it's Donna doing it for Cliff (for some reason we'll find out), then it parallels Loretta/Dickie, in that Loretta confessed to protect Dickie, which fits into Donna talking about how you'll do anything for your child. And, even though they're connected to the play, nobody (on screen) has seemed to mention them as part of the cast and crew under suspicion. And that would fit with the lines in the song about being too focused on the nursery and needing to look outside of it for suspects. 

I think Tobert will turn out to have some other secret he's hiding, but I don't think he's the killer.