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S03.E03: Grab Your Hankies

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redpencil
redpencil

I think Ben is absolutely talking to a plate of cookies. Also, the nanny's lullaby was genuinely beautiful.

Irlandesa
Irlandesa

I thought Ben was reciting lines from a previous job or rehearsing for another project but a plate of cookies sounds about right.  The lullaby was gorgeous.  Meryl and Ashley Park sounded great t

ajsnaves
ajsnaves

My theory, there are multiple killers. As there are multiple “Bens.” 3 in fact.  And their names are Ben, Glen, and Roy. Loretta killed “Ben” on opening night at the theater.  Probably with the cookie

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Irlandesa

Irlandesa

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I thought Ben was reciting lines from a previous job or rehearsing for another project but a plate of cookies sounds about right. 

The lullaby was gorgeous.  Meryl and Ashley Park sounded great together.  And I'm genuinely surprised by how much chemistry Loretta and Oliver have.  (And once again, Martin Short is terrific.  I think it's the best role of his career and he deserves to win an Emmy even if he'll likely get beat out by the Ted Lasso peeps.)

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Snazzy Daisy

Snazzy Daisy

(edited)

Flobert??! 😂😂😂

Ben is definitely talking to cookies. They’re his kryptonite!

The lullaby scene is mesmerizing. Loretta totally steals the scene. Kimber is invisible to me.

Mabel has ZERO scene with Oliver in this episode. This is something to be concerned about. Are they gonna keep separating the trio throughout S3?

 

Some hints that could be useful:

Male killer(s) this season?

OMITB S03 E03 - Male Killer.JPG

 

The possibility of Double Ben Theory - twin CoBros?

OMITB S03 E03 - Twin CoBro.JPG

 

Edited by Snazzy Daisy
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thuganomics85

thuganomics85

I'm with Mabel: that was the best the penthouse has ever looked!  So much epic memorabilia and items with Ben's face doing that classic Paul Rudd grin!  They should so auction those things off at some point.  Assuming Rudd himself didn't snag a few for his place!

They were definitely having fun with the 4th wall breaking moments with Tobert (yeah, his mom really must have wanted him to suffer) saying the first podcast (season) was better than the second one, and Charles wondering would the killer really be another woman.  Kind of wondering that myself, honestly.  I could see them avoiding that this go around, but it really wouldn't surprise me if they triple down on that because that would be the greatest twist of them all!

Glad that Oliver did apologize for his outburst to Loretta about not letting her out of her contract.  It's easy to forget that underneath all of the enthusiasm, outlandish behavior, and general Martin Short-ness of everything that Oliver really is someone who once he its attached to something or someone, he can be really lash out and be insecure if things go in unexpected directions.  It wasn't a good look for him, but I think it was in character: as was him realizing he was wrong.  Of course, it all seems to work out for now since she's staying after-all.

Love that Death Rattle got a second chance due to Clifford being a fan and willing to stand up to his mom because of it.  It was all thanks to the therapy he got and what he learned when still breastfeeding at eight years old!  Oliver's face said it all during that moment!

I'm sure everyone is a major professional here, but I imagine that there was at least a little voice in Ashley Park's head going "Holy crap, I'm doing a duet with Fucking Meryl Streep!!!"

Tobert being set up as another love interest for Mabel?

I'm sure there is going to be a lot more to that tape of Ben.  Definitely think it's possible that he isn't actually yelling at someone, but something instead.  A plate of cookies is a good suggestion!

Good episode, but I do hope the trio isn't separated for too long.  I get the play is his new child now, but Oliver needs to get back into the podcast game!

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cardigirl

cardigirl

I didn't love this episode as much as the first two. And I wasn't impressed with the nanny lullaby, considering who co-wrote it (Sara Bareilles), but I did enjoy the duet that Meryl and Ashley sang. (Kimba is up to something!) 

I'll admit, I was very tired when watching this, so will watch again for more perspective. I didn't really believe that Tobert and Mabel could have a whispered conversation and not be overheard by Ben's brother.  I did enjoy their "banter" though. Tobert seems a little old for Mabel, but what do I know. 

Interesting also that Ben's brother has signed on to manage Loretta so quickly after his brother's death. 

Will report back after watching again. 

 

 

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peeayebee

peeayebee

1 hour ago, SeanBug said:

Well now the title of this episode makes perfect sense. 

It has a great double meaning.

1 hour ago, cardigirl said:

I didn't love this episode as much as the first two.

I didn't love it either. I thought the best part was the monologue Donna did. It was awesome. Right now I think Donna and Cliff are the best part of the show. And can their relationship get any ickier? Stay tuned.

Quote

I didn't really believe that Tobert and Mabel could have a whispered conversation and not be overheard by Ben's brother.

I was distracted by that, too. I guess that sort of thing happens frequently in shows and movies. Suspending disbelief once more. 

My initial thought for who Ben was talking to was himself. After all, there are images of him everywhere. But since he was looking downward, I really like the idea that he's talking to cookies on a table.

That Fairey poster of Ben with "Talent" underneath was hilarious.

I also laughed when Oliver said, "But we do have champagne!" followed by Howard dropping it. Also loved when he did his mother's voice. "Momma
was a smoker.”

I don't think I liked any of the scenes with Mabel and Tobert. I thought the whole thing with her stealing his drive and demanding the password so SHE could solve the murder was stupid. It was his drive. He was the one who got the bit of evidence. I just didn't much like Mabel in this ep. Well, I did like her impression of Oliver.

I liked the lullaby. I thought it was beautiful.

"Creatures of the Night." Why does that sound familiar? I just did a quick google search and see that it's an album by KISS, but the title reminds me of something else.

  • Like 9
Affogato

Affogato

I think at this point a draft of the script gets written and it is handed around so everyone can suggest misdirects. Ben's monologue is definitely written so you think he is talking to cookies, 'you're so sweet', but why would they be so obvious, or is that itself a misdirect? Anyway, this show is more misdirects than actual clues.

I can't imagine that turning it into a musical is a good idea. Oliver has the worst instincts. Also, I thought he was going to have another heart attack, several times.

 

12 minutes ago, peeayebee said:

I don't think I liked any of the scenes with Mabel and Tobert. I thought the whole thing with her stealing his drive and demanding the password so SHE could solve the murder was stupid. It was his drive. He was the one who got the bit of evidence. I just didn't much like Mabel in this ep. Well, I did like her impression of Oliver.

 

That wasn't a good look for her, but Charles and Oliver weren't great either. Oliver telling Loretta she was under contract and insisting on it, and Charles was looking down on everyone, at times. They may be better together because they can point out this stuff to each other.

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sjankis630

sjankis630

(edited)

I thought dude shushing Mabel in the surprisingly spacious armoire was Hella creepy. 
I did chuckle at Howard's push for his sponsor. 
"Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there..."
Lol.

Wow am I the only one watching the credits that just now noticed that the hankerchiefs Ben had given out had little rattles on them?

Edited by sjankis630
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peeayebee

peeayebee

2 hours ago, Affogato said:

Ben's monologue is definitely written so you think he is talking to cookies, 'you're so sweet', but why would they be so obvious, or is that itself a misdirect? Anyway, this show is more misdirects than actual clues.

Yes, the show is a lot about misdirects, but I guess all whodunnits are, right? In this case, I didn't think it was obvious that he was talking to cookies. I think many viewers, esp those outside of discussion forums, would assume he was talking to a woman.

As for Mabel's behavior with Tobert (whose name keeps autocorrecting to Robert), so far this season she is really missing doing the podcast and working with Charles and Oliver, so I should excuse her entitled behavior with Tobert.

I believe I figured out what song 'Creatures of the Night' reminded me of: 'The Music of the Night.'

  • Like 11
Affogato

Affogato

5 minutes ago, peeayebee said:

Yes, the show is a lot about misdirects, but I guess all whodunnits are, right? In this case, I didn't think it was obvious that he was talking to cookies. I think many viewers, esp those outside of discussion forums, would assume he was talking to a woman.

As for Mabel's behavior with Tobert (whose name keeps autocorrecting to Robert), so far this season she is really missing doing the podcast and working with Charles and Oliver, so I should excuse her entitled behavior with Tobert.

I believe I figured out what song 'Creatures of the Night' reminded me of: 'The Music of the Night.'

At the tableread he says 'even the name sounds sexy' (where the cookies were bought)

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ofmd

ofmd

(edited)
2 hours ago, peeayebee said:

"Creatures of the Night." Why does that sound familiar? I just did a quick google search and see that it's an album by KISS, but the title reminds me of something else.

It reminded me of that song from The Rocky Horror Picture Show. "Touch-a touch-a touch-a touch me, I wanna be dirty.... Thrill me, fullfill me... Creature of the night!!"

Edited by ofmd
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SeanBug

SeanBug

(edited)
3 hours ago, peeayebee said:

It has a great double meaning.

I didn't love it either. I thought the best part was the monologue Donna did. It was awesome. Right now I think Donna and Cliff are the best part of the show. And can their relationship get any ickier? Stay tuned.

I was distracted by that, too. I guess that sort of thing happens frequently in shows and movies. Suspending disbelief once more. 

My initial thought for who Ben was talking to was himself. After all, there are images of him everywhere. But since he was looking downward, I really like the idea that he's talking to cookies on a table.

That Fairey poster of Ben with "Talent" underneath was hilarious.

I also laughed when Oliver said, "But we do have champagne!" followed by Howard dropping it. Also loved when he did his mother's voice. "Momma
was a smoker.”

I don't think I liked any of the scenes with Mabel and Tobert. I thought the whole thing with her stealing his drive and demanding the password so SHE could solve the murder was stupid. It was his drive. He was the one who got the bit of evidence. I just didn't much like Mabel in this ep. Well, I did like her impression of Oliver.

I liked the lullaby. I thought it was beautiful.

"Creatures of the Night." Why does that sound familiar? I just did a quick google search and see that it's an album by KISS, but the title reminds me of something else.

It's from Phantom of the Opera-ish. That song is Music of the Night but that was my first thought. 

Edited by SeanBug
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Lovecat

Lovecat

45 minutes ago, ofmd said:

It reminded me of that song from The Rocky Horror Picture Show. "Touch-a touch-a touch-a touch me, I wanna be dirty.... Thrill me, fullfill me... Creature of the night!!"

Same.

Did anyone else get a State Farm ad at the beginning?  Coincidence, or synergy?

Also, Loretta being offered a part on a Grey's Anatomy spinoff?  Paging Jesse Williams (Tobert and Mabel are totes going to smash).

  • Like 7
tennisgurl

tennisgurl

I'm glad that I wasn't the only one who thought that Ben was talking to cookies (his one weakness) or even a picture of himself. Or it could have been a script for a new part, I don't think he was talking to anyone, but I do think that somehow it will be a part of the solution. 

Oliver is getting sucked back into the theater world and its making him even more Oliver than usual. Even more high strong, more dramatic, more snippy, Oliver is a LOT on even a chill day and now he's back in his element. This musical idea is so not going to end but as long as he can avoid pools, he'll probably be alright. The nanny song was really beautiful, Meryl Streep and Ashley Park did a great job. I can only imagine that Ashley was seriously freaking out like "I cant believe I've gone from Emily in Fucking Paris to singing a duet with Meryl Streep in a few months!" I have to say, I am really not normally a huge Meryl Streep fan, which I know is blasphemy as she's a living legend, and I do think she's very talented, but to me she often comes off like she's acting too much, I can only see her and not a character, with a few exceptions, but I think she's been great in this. I always like her the most when she's allowed to go big and wacky and she's really selling this. 

I know that Mabel always looks great, but I especially loved her outfit when she was sneaking around with Tobert. I figured they wouldn't have cast a pretty well known actor for such a tiny part, is he going to be Mabel's next love interest? Will she get one every season? The meta commentary about liking the first season of the podcast more and then later about how they wont do three female killers in a row were quite funny, it does certainly make me wonder. 

"Nothing unites people like a common enemy. Or a good cheese plate."

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Guest

Guest

1 hour ago, peeayebee said:

Yes, the show is a lot about misdirects, but I guess all whodunnits are, right? In this case, I didn't think it was obvious that he was talking to cookies. I think many viewers, esp those outside of discussion forums, would assume he was talking to a woman.

Same. I think Mabel believing it was a woman combined with Kimber not having her hankie is the misdirect before it is revealed he was talking to the cookies. Which I’m guessing is another misdirect and whoever is responsible for his “death” on stage wasn’t involved with his falling to his death. Maybe the understudy hoping Ben would be sick enough he couldn’t take the stage. 

19 minutes ago, SeanBug said:

It's from Phantom of the Opera

I kept waiting for one of the characters to call it out as an obvious Music of the Night ripoff. 

cardigirl

cardigirl

(edited)
1 hour ago, Dani said:

Same. I think Mabel believing it was a woman combined with Kimber not having her hankie is the misdirect before it is revealed he was talking to the cookies. Which I’m guessing is another misdirect and whoever is responsible for his “death” on stage wasn’t involved with his falling to his death. Maybe the understudy hoping Ben would be sick enough he couldn’t take the stage. 

 

The understudy is Howard's love interest from season 2, I believe. So that puts Howard in line as a suspect, getting rid of the "star" so his true love could get a break. 

(Not sure if this is a theory I'm going to stick with, or if it's just a fleeting thought. 🤔)

Edited by cardigirl
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Maren

Maren

That was a freaking beautiful song. Actually made me tear up. So beautifully written and sung!

I'm sorry, I know its suppose to be humourous but Cliff and his mom stuff is just too much and grosses me out. 

I really hope Tobert and Loretta aren't guilty. Don't know enough about the others to care lol.

I like the theory of the cookies being who Ben is yelling at. And they could have easily held the poison!

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shapeshifter

shapeshifter

(edited)
On 8/15/2023 at 3:45 AM, thuganomics85 said:

I'm sure everyone is a major professional here, but I imagine that there was at least a little voice in Ashley Park's head going "Holy crap, I'm doing a duet with Fucking Meryl Streep!!!"

Hah! Definitely at some point. 
But regardless, that song 🎶 performance wins all the awards.

23 hours ago, cardigirl said:

Interesting also that Ben's brother has signed on to manage Loretta so quickly after his brother's death

putting Ben’s brother back on the suspect list…

22 hours ago, ofmd said:

I was thinking Loretta...

Loretta is still on the suspect list…

But they sure telegraphed Kimber as the prime suspect.

But Charles’ “But another female killer? That's so done” is kind of a breaking of the fourth wall to us.

18 hours ago, peeayebee said:

As for Mabel's behavior with Tobert … so far this season she is really missing doing the podcast and working with Charles and Oliver, so I should excuse her entitled behavior with Tobert.

Yes, Mabel isolated from her “Olds” is a good setup for her collaboration with Tobert, but:   
Tobert would have filmed the baby elephant dying without rendering assistance = possibility of Tobert being a cold blooded killer…. 
and Ben could drive almost anyone to murder.

Cliff might have killed Ben because he was having Loretta fired… 
Loretta may be Cliff’s first love outside his mother.

Edited by shapeshifter
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AnimeMania

AnimeMania

9 hours ago, cardigirl said:

Interesting also that Ben's brother has signed on to manage Loretta so quickly after his brother's death. 

They would have known each other several months by this time and they were probably discussing it before Ben died, maybe Ben's brother wanted to leave Ben or he just thought that Loretta was really talented and he had lots of connections in the industry and he wanted to work with someone he enjoyed being around.

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ajsnaves

ajsnaves

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(edited)

My theory, there are multiple killers. As there are multiple “Bens.” 3 in fact.  And their names are Ben, Glen, and Roy. Loretta killed “Ben” on opening night at the theater.  Probably with the cookies he’s talking to in the video.  After he was killed, “Glen” took his place. “Glen” was killed by Dickie in the Arconia.  That is why he was apologizing in the penthouse while Mable and Tobert were listening from the confessional, I mean armoire. In around Episode 6, “Roy” will turn up. The big reveal will involve the three bassinets in Oliver’s apartment. 

Possible twist. “Glen” and “Roy” were the ones who were murdered.  And Dickie is really “Ben.”. They were triplets hired by Brazzos because they could work more hours by swapping them out.  Credited as “Ben Glen Roy.”  But “Ben” was not identical and not as good looking as the other two. So he became the manager.  This one might be a bit out there though.  But we will see.  

Edited by ajsnaves
Because there’s a difference between there, their, and they’re, and bot oughta know it.
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ofmd

ofmd

(edited)
5 hours ago, Lovecat said:

Also, Loretta being offered a part on a Grey's Anatomy spinoff?  Paging Jesse Williams (Tobert and Mabel are totes going to smash).

An offshoot of an offshoot of a Grey's Anatomy spinoff! I liked those little meta shoutouts.

Like documentary dude saying he preferred the first season of the podcast, just like some of us prefer the first OMITB season...

Or Charles saying: A female murderer is so overdone!

Those two remarks could also be seen as lampshading... I totally think the murderer will be a woman, again.

I agree this episode was weaker. Highlights were the sinister producer's monologue and the lullaby, although I wish they had recorded the latter on set, not played a studio version.

I'm not sold on documentary dude yet. Also, I assume we won't see Loretta for a while, maybe even until the finale, and I don't like it.

And the closet scene... not only did they manage a conversation with Ben's brother close by, Tobert also used a flashlight for a hot minute... *eyeroll* I assume he's Mabel's new love interest.

As far as Mabel's behavior... Tobert wanted to do the same thing: withhold information from the police to use it for his documentary. Sure, the device was his property, but still. Not impressed.

Edited by ofmd
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secnarf

secnarf

I laughed at Charles' comment about the murderer can't be a woman because that's been done - before the season started, Meryl Streep was my pick for the murderer, and a friend said no it can't be, they've already done two female killers.

Now that the season has started, I feel like Loretta is too obvious, too soon. At this point in season 1, Jan hadn't even been introduced yet, had she? And Poppy was introduced, but there was very little to point to her.

I did enjoy this episode more than the last two. I loved the lullaby, Meryl Streep is amazing.

I didn't think Ben was talking to anybody in that recording - if he was, wouldn't we have heard them respond? It seemed weird that he was saying things that should elicit a response, but not getting anything back.

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LADreamr

LADreamr

It's possible that Ben didn't snatch the camera away from Tobert, but that Tobert actually planted it in his dressing room.  For whatever reason, having his own plan to make a documentary about Ben's death, rather than his premier on Broadway.

Or... Ben's brother hired Tobert for the purpose of documenting the murder.  He would have known about the cookie weakness, and had full access to put the lethal cookies in the dressing room, knowing Ben well enough to know that he would yell at the cookies, but devour them, anyway.  Even at the table read, he barely had a minute of will power.  But that moment revealed that Ben was kind of powerless with them, as well as getting the information about what they were, and where to get them.

He could hide in plain sight among a cast who all disliked Ben enough to be suspects.

Or... I could be totally off.

Loved the lullaby.  Loving Meryl in general, here.  I've been hoping we could hear Ashley sing, and that was so gorgeous.

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MisterGlass

MisterGlass

I actually liked this one because it was a little calmer, and we're past the initial urgent set-up.  Several gags made me giggle:

  • On top of Oliver's piano next to the open bottle of gut milk was a pour over coffee pitcher with a tall straw sticking out of it
  • Charles accidentally stepping in between the wall and the decorative column and trying to play it off casually
  • The cardboard cutout of Girl Cop Ben in the back of the armoire

I like the plate of cookies theory.

I have no conclusions about Tobert.  I am not a Grey's Anatomy watcher, so Jesse Williams is not known to me.  Good for him for getting, according to imdb.com, 275 credited episodes out of it thus far.

  • Like 5
shapeshifter

shapeshifter

(edited)
1 hour ago, MisterGlass said:

Several gags made me giggle:

  • On top of Oliver's piano next to the open bottle of gut milk was a pour over coffee pitcher with a tall straw sticking out of it
  • Charles accidentally stepping in between the wall and the decorative column and trying to play it off casually
  • The cardboard cutout of Girl Cop Ben in the back of the armoire
13 hours ago, peeayebee said:

. Also loved when he did his mother's voice. "Momma
was a smoker.”

I f'loved the physical comedy at the 16 minute mark when Mabel and Tobert hide in the armoire and then peek out of the conveniently placed curtains
— even though I'm not sure such decorative embellishments exist on any armoires anywhere.

Special kudos to the show writers for not diminishing the comedy aspect like so many recent dramedies have done, such as Barry and White Lotus.

 

 

15 hours ago, cardigirl said:

Tobert seems a little old for Mabel, but what do I know. 

Jesse Williams (Tobert) is 42; Selena Gomez (Mabel) is 31.
So, yeah, he is "a little" old for her, unless he's supposed to be, maybe, 35-37-ish?

OTOH, if Tobert turns out to be the (perhaps accidental) killer, his being somewhat older might prevent shippers from being angrily disappointed that he and Mabel can't live happily ever after together.

Edited by shapeshifter
Typos
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moonorchid

moonorchid

(edited)

I love this show so damn much!

This episode got better on rewatch. I don’t really have any theories different than what everyone else is already theorizing. 
 

I was initially disappointed we didn’t have any scenes of the Big 3, this show is at its best when they are together but I didn’t mind it as much as I thought. 
 

Jesse Williams has nice chemistry with Selena Gomez and if he knows nothing else, he knows how to play up the charisma! I’m Uber side eyeing Tobert though. 
 

One of my favorite aspects of this show is it is actually a comedy and Steve Martin and Martin Short will not let you forget it. The bit that had me reeling was the crab scene…Oliver screams out “crab men” and Charles with the perfect perplexed confusion says “what?” And then Oliver proceeds to bark out “breeding” and hip thrusts all over the stage! I was crying laughing, that scene has no business being that funny lol. 
 

Speaking of Martin Short, we are only 3 eps in and he is KILLING! From all angles! In so many ways, this show is tailor made for Martin Short! He actually has been a very well rounded actor his entire career and it truly feels like finally he has a project that lets him tap into that. I am buying him being funny, being dramatic, and being a romantic lead…who saw that chemistry with Meryl Streep coming? Lol. 
 

Speaking of, she is damn near stealing the show and her song at the end…I was shocked at how much I loved it and was questioning if I’m supposed to be THAT into it. She really is just exquisite!

 

 

Edited by moonorchid
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HelloooKitty

HelloooKitty

(edited)
13 hours ago, peeayebee said:

It has a great double meaning.

I didn't love it either. I thought the best part was the monologue Donna did. It was awesome. Right now I think Donna and Cliff are the best part of the show. And can their relationship get any ickier? Stay tuned.

I was distracted by that, too. I guess that sort of thing happens frequently in shows and movies. Suspending disbelief once more. 

My initial thought for who Ben was talking to was himself. After all, there are images of him everywhere. But since he was looking downward, I really like the idea that he's talking to cookies on a table.

That Fairey poster of Ben with "Talent" underneath was hilarious.

I also laughed when Oliver said, "But we do have champagne!" followed by Howard dropping it. Also loved when he did his mother's voice. "Momma
was a smoker.”

I don't think I liked any of the scenes with Mabel and Tobert. I thought the whole thing with her stealing his drive and demanding the password so SHE could solve the murder was stupid. It was his drive. He was the one who got the bit of evidence. I just didn't much like Mabel in this ep. Well, I did like her impression of Oliver.

I liked the lullaby. I thought it was beautiful.

"Creatures of the Night." Why does that sound familiar? I just did a quick google search and see that it's an album by KISS, but the title reminds me of something else.

Are you thinking of the line “creature of the night” from Rocky Horror? Bc I was. 

Edited by HelloooKitty
  • Like 4
phalange

phalange

Ben was definitely talking to a plate of cookies and not a person who would've responded. It's looking like someone poisoned the cookies then had to kill him a second time at the Arconia, but that almost seems too obvious so I'm expecting another twist.

Charles wondering if it would really be a female killer for the third season in a row made me laugh. I still don't think it's Loretta. Kimber seems like she's jealous of Loretta so I don't know what her motive for killing Ben would be, though her not having her hankie is suspicious. 

When Charles talked about everyone bringing their hankies, everyone agreed except for Bobo, I think. 

Loretta booking a show that's a spinoff of an offshoot of an offshoot of Grey's Anatomy is hilarious. Speaking of, it's curious how quickly Ben's brother became Loretta's agent. Seems fishy.

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luna1122again

luna1122again

When Oliver was talking about needing a showstopper but his ballady lullaby didn't qualify, I kept thinking of Sara Bareilles' She Used to be Mine, from Waitress, a showstopping ballad if ever there was one. So learning she co wrote this gorgeous lullaby wasn't surprising, but lovely. 

I really do hope we don't have a third female killer this year. I also hope it's not Jesse Williams. I normally hate a buzzcut on a man but his eyes make up for everything. I think he and Mabel had a low key sizzly chemistry, and the age diff is no biggie. 

 

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