All Episodes Discussion

[Morbs]

The filler drives me crazy too, every 2 hour episode is awful, but on Twitter The Cancellation Bear has started calling NBC the Dateline network since it's the only show people actually watch, so it's probably not going to stop any time soon.

[LittleIggy]

Did anyone else watch the 2004 tsunami episode?

[photo fox]

I am assuming a mod changed the title of this thread but for clarification this entire series of Thursday night Datelines hosted by Richard Engel are called "The Real Blacklist" (and will focus on more international stories) in order to tie-in with The Blacklist which follows it and at least this episode and next week's episode didn't have an individual episode title which is why I modeled the thread after the Dateline Escape thread.

Ah, that makes sense. I was just housekeeping and changed it to match thetvdb.com, which is where I get the episode descriptions.

Is it going to be a short series, or an ongoing thing?

[editorgrrl]

According to Google, future episodes of "Dateline: The Real Blacklist" will feature the Pink Panther Gang (an international jewel heist ring) and John McAfee (a former antivirus pioneer who is a person of interest in the murder of Gregory Faull in Belize). So that's at least two more.

 

The NBC News website is a horror show—couldn't find anything other than video of the first installment.

[LittleIggy]

Of course, I've never gone through a tsunami, but the son that the family looked all over for struck me as odd. Everything he said was about him --I thought, "I'm an orphan now", the stuff about his songs, no expression of grief or survivor's guilt about his sister. He just seemed very unempathetic to me. Maybe that was why his interview was very brief.

[Lovecat]

Oh, with the last name Peterson and a dead wife? Guilty.

[Ohmo]

Is it going to be a short series, or an ongoing thing?

 

I think it is going to be a short series...8 or 12 episodes or something like that.  I can't recall where I heard or read that, though.

 

The Pink Panthers are going to be featured?  Makes me think of Neal Caffrey and White Collar.

 

I agree about NBC's website.  It's difficult to find things.

[Tunia]

Oh, with the last name Peterson and a dead wife? Guilty.

Yes, Lovecat ~ I've come to the thinking that one should never marry a man named "Peterson", as in Michael, Drew and Scott!

 

What is it about that name?

[panthergirl13]

Yes, Lovecat ~ I've come to the thinking that one should never marry a man named "Peterson", as in Michael, Drew and Scott!

 

What is it about that name?

And if your first name is Kathleen you're pretty doomed as well.

 

When I was a kid (a weird one, OK??) I used to collect news clippings about serial killers or murderers with the name Wayne or Lee or any combination. (which is also why I LOL'd at the name of the Reverend on Kimmie Schmidt!). There are a TON. And what's really funny is that one NY Times clipping was about a study on serial killers, conducted by WAYNE STATE UNIVERSITY. Score.

[Primetimer]

The newsmagazine grabs a ratings coattail with a special report. Is it worth watching?

Read the story

[panthergirl13]

What I found really off-putting were the talking heads staring straight into the camera. That was really bizarre.

 

Durst looked PARTICULARLY nutso in those police car shots from NOLA...wow.

 

One disappointing thing that was said (aside from the fact that he'll probably skate again) is that the trial won't happen for quite some time (seeing Titus at the library on Kimmie Schmidt made me laugh out loud, because that would be me if I didn't have wi-fi at home)

[frogprof]

Can we have Sam Elliott in ANYthing, please? (Anything on network or cable TV, that is, and I've only just discovered he's in Justified so I'm going to have to start that on Hulu or somewhere ...) And if he's in something with Tom Selleck and Mark Harmon I will die a happy woman.

[jenkait]

This wasn't part of The Real Blacklist series...  I'm confused.  

[editorgrrl]

This wasn't part of The Real Blacklist series... I'm confused.

It was "breaking news." The Real Blacklist should be back this Thursday.

You can learn more about Robert Durst over in The Jinx forum: http://forums.previously.tv/forum/1428-the-jinx-the-life-and-deaths-of-robert-durst/

I recognized Durst's prosecutor John Lewin at the end talking about clearing cold cases. (He's a Los Angeles deputy district attorney.) Dennis Murphy said the footage was from an episode three years ago. It was "Missing in Paradise" from December 3, 2011.

Edited March 21, 2015 by editorgrrl

[jenkait]

Dear Tim: You date Rachel for FOURTEEN YEARS and never ask her to marry you?  You're then heartbroken when she dumps you for a guy who wants a family?  You're so sad now you can't paint?  Really?  GO POUND SAND!!  Sincerely, A Thirtysomething Woman.

[editorgrrl]

I think this is Rachel's dad: http://donhatfield.com

Edited March 21, 2015 by editorgrrl

[RedheadZombie]

Good Lord she had bad taste in men. And her dad was an asshole. When asked if his daughter was a good mother, he answers "I guess"?

[Lizzing]

Uggghhhh....48 Hours and Dateline need to coordinate better.  I know they're on competing networks and all, but I saw this story months ago, so I knew the outcome.  Though, IIRC, 48 Hours focused more on Todd's psychiatric state over the years than Dateline did.  Now I'm gonna have to go back and rewatch it because of my true crime OCD.

 

But yeah, Rachel did have terrible taste in men.  Not that it should have gotten her killed, of course.

[annzeepark914]

Interesting that both of Todd's wives married him very shortly after beginning to date him.

[jenkait]

This episode is kind of awful, but it did have it's unintentional hilarious moments:

 

KEITH: "Were the murals they painted any good?"

RACHEL'S DAD: "Not really."

 

KEITH: "How was Rachel as a mother?"

RACHEL'S DAD: "Oh, she was OK, I guess."

 

So awful...  That Dad was quite the jerk, though. I was actually thinking, "Well, kind of serves you right..." when he found out Rachel was having an affair and he was upset about it (considering he'd had apparently affairs too.)  I think worst of all was how he was actually...mimicking/almost making fun of the "hysterical" neighbor who called him to tell him Rachel was dead.  He's retelling the moment he heard of his daughter's death...and his focus on mocking of the hysterical phone caller?  Sounds like the phone caller cares more than you!

 

Rachel and James...wow.  They sounded like ridiculous lovesick teenagers.  I felt sorry for the real teeanger (James' daughter) who clearly admired both of them.  I was floored that her reaction to her father's mistress's husband coming to the door was to get a gun?  WHAT?  That in itself is incredibly disturbing, and I'd like to know what's in her head, what she thinks of marriage, etc.  Aren't' most kids devastated when Dad has an affair?  She was totally supportive!

 

Also, James and his teen daughter complain that Todd and Rachel's dad were using the kids as "shields"...hey, put down the guns, you won't be thinking of children as "shields", ok?!

 

I can't watch the rest tonight!  Turned it off at the Dad mocking the hysterical crying neighbor, so bizarre.

Edited March 21, 2015 by jenkait

[ridethemaverick]

You know, if you look beyond the tragedy of the story...it was rather sordid and trashy, no?

A woman cheats on her husband with a guy, then her dad and husband team up to confront said guy. Dad and husband take her babies with them to use as human shields and the other guy and his young daughter strap up with guns to prepare for the showdown. By the way, the other guy is also married so young daughter has a step mom at home but apparently she also hangs out with the woman dad is cheating with. The woman's dad doesn't seem to like her much and thinks she needs Jesus, but he does admit it's his fault she's a lyin' jezebel because he couldn't keep it in his pants when he was married to her mom.

Geez. And for the record, the only reason killer husband even got two women to marry him was because he looked good on paper and didn't mind being the rebound.

I feel awful for everyone but dad and husband. Dad seems like an asshole and husband was obviously a complete monster.

[Lizzing]

Okay, so I just rewatched the 48 Hours ep and the dad came off as a total NON asshole, and pretty glowing of Rachel.  A different friend of Rachel's was interviewed, the sister of Cathy was interviewed instead of the brother, and they totally downplayed the airfield boyfriend and left out altogether the sadsack painter boyfriend.  Any way you cut it though, Todd is totally guilty of both murders.  The camping witness guys were consistent throughout and I don't see any motive for either of them to lie about what they saw in Georgia.

 

ETA: I have no idea why that link appears so large.  Don't know how to fix it.

Edited March 25, 2015 by photo fox
removed broken link

[biakbiak]

To me the reason the dad came off as a dick wasn't just because he said she was "an ok mom" he also said the reason was that she had a full-time job and had them in daycare because a mother should be at home with her kids, fuck you dad.

Edited March 22, 2015 by biakbiak

[Morbs]

Seriously, the father was so awful, it's a shame he has custody of those kids now.  Hopefully they have better role models in their life than that nutjob.  I wonder if he owns the bar his interview was shot in or if he just wanted to be drunk, his eye contact and a body language towards Keith was so off.   The fact that the victim was dying and ran to hold and protect her baby tells me she was a pretty good fucking mom.

 

I loved the shot of Keith in the woods with one leg up on a tree trunk and his hands folded covering his crotch.  So natural.

Edited March 21, 2015 by Morbs

[RedheadZombie]

 I felt sorry for the real teeanger (James' daughter) who clearly admired both of them.  I was floored that her reaction to her father's mistress's husband coming to the door was to get a gun?  WHAT?  That in itself is incredibly disturbing, and I'd like to know what's in her head, what she thinks of marriage, etc.  Aren't' most kids devastated when Dad has an affair?  She was totally supportive!

 

There was something not right in that household.  Father and daughter were both nutty.   The daughter went on and on, at length, talking about her incredible suffering.  Because obviously, the three little kids whose mother was murdered can't compare to losing your married father's married mistress.  They were twin drama queens.  What did dad do when he heard the news - he collapsed to the ground.  What did daughter do when she heard the news - she collapsed to the ground.

 

Later she reflects, "After going through that trial, seeing what I had to see, I can tell you with absolute certainty, that that is 110% false [that monsters don't exist]".  This girl is injecting herself right into the middle of the story.  Nobody made you go to the trial little girl, you would have been sitting at your desk in high school if your father wasn't such a schmuck.  They seem to have the type of parent/child relationship where there are skewed boundaries.  He probably cries on her shoulder every time his heart is broken, and she has to give him romantic advice, as she dries his tears and pats him on the head.

 

I would have liked for the man to at least acknowledge that he incited the husband's rage, when he refused to stop seeing her, and she was the one stuck paying the consequences.

[zxy556575]

This was presented so differently than the 48 Hours version that I didn't even remember having seen it before until the courtroom scene of Todd slapping himself and ranting in what sounded like a thick Russian accent.

 

I guess the first sadsack boyfriend was supposed to be one of those background friends who explain how wonderful the victim was, how she lit up the goddamn room, etc., but all he did was make it about himself. Keith let that interview get away from him. Stop trying to make a high school romance relevant to a murder that happened years and years after the breakup in question.

 

What really bothered me was James and Rachel carrying on an affair basically in plain sight of their spouses and children for a couple of years. Jeez. GET A DIVORCE ALREADY! Why either of the scorned spouses put up with it after finding out is mystifying.

 

From the rundown look of his house, Rachel's asshole dad isn't exactly making a good living as an artist, so pot/kettle, dude. Count me as another person who feels sorry for the kids growing up in that poison.

[Cherrio]

Seriously, the father was so awful, it's a shame he has custody of those kids now.  Hopefully they have better role models in their life than that nutjob.  I wonder if he owns the bar his interview was shot in or if he just wanted to be drunk, his eye contact and a body language towards Keith was so off.   The fact that the victim was dying and ran to hold and protect her baby tells me she was a pretty good fucking mom.

 

I loved the shot of Keith in the woods with one leg up on a tree trunk and his hands folded covering his crotch.  So natural.

Almost all of them did the I am a Christian blah blah blah so it was clear to me they would all be disgusting assholes, especially the father.        The leg and tree trunk was hilarious.

[editorgrrl]

I guess the first sadsack boyfriend was supposed to be one of those background friends who explain how wonderful the victim was, how she lit up the goddamn room, etc., but all he did was make it about himself. Keith let that interview get away from him. Stop trying to make a high school romance relevant to a murder that happened years and years after the breakup in question.

He was there for two more reasons. 1. To help pad the story into two hours; and 2. To fit the gross framing of the dead hussy and her "four men." That was just a cheap ploy to get people to watch. One of the four was her judgmental, admittedly hypocritical dad.

This was the story of Rachel, who had terrible taste in men. One of them killed her—with their infant son in her arms. Now that boy and his two sisters are being raised by the same hypocrite who raised Rachel. I worry about those kids.

[Lizzing]

The thing that jogged my memory that I'd seen this story before was the little airplanes in the driveways/garages.  There just can't be that many places that allow that kind of car/plane traffic.  Well, I hope not at any rate.

 

James and his daughter, well, I get the daughter having his back if confronted by bad forces, say in the abstract...if two unknown assailants rolled up on the property, sure.  But it was James' gf's husband and father asking him to back down.  James needed to back down. But so did Rachel.  Or, as lordonia says, GET A DIVORCE ALREADY!  Yeah, Rachel was about to, on the eve of her murder, but she should have put that in works a year prior.  Again, this does not excuse murder in any way. Hell, she may have been murdered a year earlier had she done so.

 

It certainly doesn't explain Cathy's murder in any event.  And, as much as I'm a true crime addict, I swear 60 to 75% of these shows wouldn't happen if people just got an f'in divorce and decided money wasn't worth spending their life behind bars.   It's easier to get a divorce, fake your disappearance, check out of the US with some cash, and move to a different country without killing anyone.  If you've not killed anyone, no creditor that you may owe $300 or $3000 to is going to give a GD to find you on the beaches of some unextraditable country. 

 

I really wish some true crime show would pick up the story around here of a Belgian national who went missing after her husband, a Venezuelan native, absconded with their kids (US citizens), to Venezuela. It's been over 2 years and it seems like the case has run cold.  Bring on Keith!

[Mrs. P.]

I also didn't realize I'd seen this story before. I got my first hint when I saw the prosecutor. I even told my husband that we'd seen her before on some show. Then with the verbal outbreak in the courtroom, I knew I'd seen it before.

This was a completely different telling of the story. I was completely disgusted with the wife during the first hour and I don't remember feeling that way when watching the story on 48 Hours. The whole thing was sordid and depressing.

[tobeannounced]

Great comments here.  I don't have much to add, but I did notice how the dad didn't sugar coat the daughter.  I've read a lot of comments on these boards about how the victim is always made out to be a saint and how silly that is.  The dad kind of told it like he saw it, so I'm not going to complain he didn't do the same old song and dance of martyring the victim.  I don't know any mother who works full-time and has three kids that could possibly have the time or energy for an affair.  So, yeah, I don't think Rachel was putting her kids' needs first.  Not saying her dad isn't a wing nut, but as has been pointed out, there's was plenty of dysfunction to go around.

[callmebetty]

The only thing that made this episode palatable was Keith and his tree trunk modeling poses. How I love that man.

anyway nobody came off good. I'm sorry that Rachel was murdered. Feel for those kids who have to grow up with low rent "not Bob Ross" grandfather.

James and his daughter need therapy for their codependent relationship.

[Callasin]

I didn't see them taking the babies with them as shields but more as an attempt to look non-threatening.  Like when religious people going door to door bring kids.  The daughter immediately grabbing a gun was disturbing.

[applecrisp]

Love the comments.Could not finish this story.

[woodscommaelle]

Did they tell us if Will Robin's wife survived?  I feel like I missed that if so.

[annzeepark914]

I believe this woman would have been murdered by her husband even if she hadn't been having an affair.  In his mind "how dare she divorce me" is how he came across to me.  Geez...there sure are a lot of sickos out there in the world.  Maybe if she (and his first wife) had not married Todd so quickly, had experienced a longer dating/engagement period (at least a year), they might have noticed something odd about him.

[zxy556575]

He was there for two more reasons. 1. To help pad the story into two hours; and 2. To fit the gross framing of the dead hussy and her "four men." That was just a cheap ploy to get people to watch.

 

Ha! True. "This is the story of a woman and her five men: high school boyfriend, father, husband, lover, and a Walgreen's clerk who once showed her the Kotex aisle."

[ElleBee]

One thing I didn't understand though, was that one family that decided to evacuate taking separate cars.  The parents went first, then their son followed with one of his sisters, leaving his other sister behind.  When he got to the end of their long driveway, he looked back to see her crawling up behind him.  Was she supposed to be driving another car?  Anyway, she gets in her brothers car and they take off, but then he wrecked the car and took off on foot for the fire station where the whole family was supposed to meet up at. 

I didn't understand why he didn't have his sisters come with him.  He made it out just fine.  Then one of his sister's came walking out and she was badly burned.  The third sister's body was found in the car after the fire burned through.  It wasn't clear if she died in the accident, or if she was too injured to walk, or if she was too afraid to get out and walk through the fire. 

 

Then the family says that there wasn't just one body in the car, there were two.  Who was that other person?  The family says it was her guardian angel and they're glad she didn't die alone.  It was very confusing.  Was the second body actually a metaphor?  Or did someone who was trying to escape take refuge in the car when the flames overtook them?

 

 

I just watched it and my understanding (for what it's worth because I was really confused too) was that the sister had a panic attack when it started burning all around the car and tried to run for safety. I was curious whether gas tanks might explode, especially for those driving through "walls of fire", but that must not be a big issue in that situation (good to know) since it didn't come up. So point being that maybe the one daughter was more worried about being stuck in the car than outside it, or just flat-out panicked. It seemed like her family was never really able to determine her motivation.

 

Another part I was confused about was the sister who died. So the brother and the sister who'd run out were put in the ambulance and they left the other sister (who I think had been fine until then) in the car and she eventually burned to death? It just seems so odd that the EMTs wouldn't squeeze her into the ambulance as well if there was any kind of imminent danger. And then there's the "two bodies" question mark. Not to downplay that they were consoled by the idea of a guardian angel, but human remains are human remains and it must have been someone. It was really strange that there didn't seem to be any follow up as to that second body.

[JudyObscure]

I thought the reason Todd and Rachael's father carried the babies with them was just because it was either take them along or leave them home alone.  From what the neighbors said, Todd had the kids much more often than Rachael did.  In that particular scene, I thought it was the boyfriend allowing his teenage daughter to carry a semi- automatic weapon into a confrontation, who seemed like the worst parent.  I could not stand that love sick, collapse on the floor drama queen or the mural painting, wimpy boyfriend who was living with a woman twice as good looking as he was, but "wasn't ready to commit," because he thought something better might come along. 

 

Then we have the murderer who, I believe, had learned long ago, to fake mental illness when the going gets rough.  Caught shop lifting? Fake a little amnesia. Unprepared to give a presentation?  Go catatonic.  Notice the prosecuting attorney is telling the jury exactly what you did?  Pull out your tacky Japanese accent and quote a line from the Last Samurai.  I was so glad the judge was having none of it.

 

That poor first wife of Todd's, no one even cared to look at that very hard.

[woodscommaelle]

Of course, I've never gone through a tsunami, but the son that the family looked all over for struck me as odd. Everything he said was about him --I thought, "I'm an orphan now", the stuff about his songs, no expression of grief or survivor's guilt about his sister. He just seemed very unempathetic to me. Maybe that was why his interview was very brief.

Maybe he was pissed off at his dad for taking the family on the vacation that he had a dream/premonition about. 

[pigs-in-space]

Thank you for posting the 48 hours episode - it's interesting how completely different the father comes across in the two!  In 48 hours he says he wanted his daughter out of there, whereas on Dateline he supported the husband in his confrontation with the guy she was having an affair with.  The only way I can logically make sense of that was if there was a gap between the two instances, but I couldn't really tell the timeline of the two very well.

 

I feel so bad for the family of the first wife.  I know they probably won't see official justice in her case, but I do hope they take some comfort in the fact that the scumbag husband is behind bars.

[biakbiak]

Okay, my partner doesn't have a dead wife but I imagine that if he did than I would be completely fine with an urn with her ashes in the living room. I would never be okay with her ashes being in a plastic bag in a crappy box in a bookcase in my bedroom!

[JudyObscure]

Wow, that 48Hours piece is adding so much information. Rachael knew about the ashes, how the first wife had died, and had told friends she was afraid of Todd.  One of those men who supposedly loved her so much should have taken her and the children out of that house and far away before she started divorce proceedings.  Also, she only weighed 110lbs to his 240.

Edited March 22, 2015 by JudyObscure

[Ohmo]

We've got Durst overload this week.  I'm behind on my true crime watching, but 48 Hours also did its Durst episode last night.  Haven't watched Dateline's version yet, but I now don't have to bother with the HBO documentary.  The 48 Hours episode showed footage of Jeannie Piro (sp?)  Isn't she now a TV judge?

[walnutqueen]

We've got Durst overload this week.  I'm behind on my true crime watching, but 48 Hours also did its Durst episode last night.  Haven't watched Dateline's version yet, but I now don't have to bother with the HBO documentary.  The 48 Hours episode showed footage of Jeannie Piro (sp?)  Isn't she now a TV judge?

 

The HBO documentary is nothing like the pieces Dateline, 48 Hours and 20/20 did on Durst.  I found it fascinating to watch Durst being interviewed, and there were interviews with many more people than we saw on those other 3 shows combined.  Of course, I'm now burnt out on the topic, but it was worth watching, for sure.

[editorgrrl]

Yes, former Westchester DA Jeanine Pirro is now a TV judge.

And 4.5 hours of The Jinx is nothing like a 45-minute newsmagazine. The latter tell you how creepy Bob Durst is. The former shows you.

[Tunia]

Okay, my partner doesn't have a dead wife but I imagine that if he did than I would be completely fine with an urn with her ashes in the living room. I would never be okay with her ashes being in a plastic bag in a crappy box in a bookcase in my bedroom!

Yeah...that kinda' tells her what her fate might be also and how much she'd be missed.  Ouch!

[Ohmo]

Now to my actual thoughts on the Dateline episode.

 

I absolutely believe that Durst killed all three people, but I also agree with the male writer/reporter that Durst's lawyers will likely get him off again.  There is no other person that links Susan, Kathy, and Morris together, and I don't believe that we're talking about three individual crimes.

 

I also think the way that Durst was caught shoplifting was interesting.  It seemed intentional to me, as though Durst was bored and wanted to play some perverse game with the cops.  When the shoplifting video sits beside the HBO audio "confession," the "confession" seems as intentional to me as the shoplifting.  For whatever reason, in his warped mind, I think Durst wants to play another game with the cops.  From the media frenzy, all indications are that he will likely get his wish.

[annzeepark914]

Yeah...that kinda' tells her what her fate might be also and how much she'd be missed.  Ouch!

I wonder when she learned about the bag of ashes (how soon into her relationship/marriage with Todd)?  That would scare the heck out of me and I'd like to think I'd be savvy enough to do some research and get away from that creep asap.  Why in the world would Todd keep the ashes anyway?  He murdered his first wife so why would he want the reminder of her?  Maybe because he's a sick creep.  

[RedheadZombie]

Okay, my partner doesn't have a dead wife but I imagine that if he did than I would be completely fine with an urn with her ashes in the living room. I would never be okay with her ashes being in a plastic bag in a crappy box in a bookcase in my bedroom!

 

Sometimes ashes get forgotten.  When helping a friend clean out her recently deceased grandmother's home, I came across her grandpa's ashes in a box, just like in this case.  I imagine Todd just forgot about the ashes.  If he wanted to defile her remains, he could have flushed them down the toilet.  He probably planned on buying an elaborate urn so he could play the grieving widower, but met his next mark too quickly.