S03.E06: The Demon of Algorithms

[formerlyfreedom]

Quote

A single mother enlists the team to look into the potentially demonic ways the viral app TipTop is terrorizing her family.

Dropping Sunday, July 17, 2022.

[Snazzy Daisy]

The pop-up book for this episode!

[Annber03]

OMGOMGOMGOMG WHAT THE HELL ARE THEY PLANNING TO DO WITH ANDY HOOOOOOOOOOOLY SHIT!

Wow. WOW. Okay. Well. That answers our little mystery about what's up with him, then. That's...deeply unsettling on so many levels, and the fact that Sheryl's in on it...I mean, I knew she couldn't stand Andy and wanted him gone and all, but damn... I could even see her doing this if she felt Andy was a legitimate threat - if she's starting to see demons everywhere, like she did with her boss last episode, maybe she's getting those vibes off Andy, too, and now she has a concrete answer to why she's never liked him, and this could explain her desire to go after him as she is. But of course, if that's the case, that wouldn't explain Leland's involvement, I wouldn't think...

All I know for sure is that she is going to rue the day when Kristen and her daughters find out what she's done to their husband/father. I wonder if and how they'll find out about this, and what Andy might do to try and get himself out of there. 

Um. As for other topics...ooooooh, again, another really good case this episode. I literally had the exact same reaction Kristen did upon seeing the video of the mom cutting her own child's back. And Ben looked about ready to punch something, he was so pissed. I was wondering if that was the route the story would go when the team came over to the house late that one night...and sadly, I'm not at all surprised that a mother could do such a thing. I've seen too many damn true crime shows :/. I was terrified that the mom was going to try and stab herself with the scissors when the team came to confront her at the end. Thank goodness that didn't happen. But man. Those poor children. 

I also sympathized with Ben's desire to try and argue with whackjob conspiracy theorists online. I've been there. It's very tempting. As for David, he was getting videos from other priests, but now I'm thinking he may have inadvertently tapped into a new way for people to do their confessions :p! Are online confessions a thing yet? I wouldn't be surprised if they are. And if not, I won't be surprised if they become a thing.  

On a lighter note, I liked Ben's interaction with that woman from the app company. Kristen just coming straight out and asking the question we were all wondering about whether or not she's his girlfriend was great :D. Hee. 

Leave it to the Bouchard daughters to ultimately be the ones to take Leland down XD. Watching his reaction to being told to leave the Church was very, very satisfying, indeed (and yet, true to form, the Church will still give him a "positive recommendation", because of course they will). But man, Leland's reaction to being removed from the Church was genuinely scary - it's rare you see him THAT openly furious. I love that the girls called him out for the creep that he is, but man, I really hope that Kristen learns about what they've done and they continue to keep their guard up about him, 'cause between his threat about making the girls orphans and the reveal of what's going on with Andy, I'm really worried for the Bouchard family. 

As for David's Kristen demon, weird as that whole situation is, I do like the idea that it is forcing him, on some level at least, to question the motives of the Entity. Mind, I get why he's wary of trusting the Kristen demon, because, well, demon. But he definitely should keep his guard up about the Entity, too. And I hope he does. Perhaps Sister Andrea can help him figure out what they're all about - I feel like she might have more answers and explanations about them than anyone else. 

Yeah. Whew. Quite a freaky episode, this one. I can't believe we're halfway through the season already - only four episodes left to go this season, I can't even begin to imagine what all could happen in that amount of time. 

[phalange]

Leland really fucked around and found out, didn't he? I love that the girls got him fired, though of course the church is actually more concerned about their image than Leland stalking little girls (shocker!).

I knew those videos of Andy were completely faked. He never actually responded to Kristen or the girls and gave generic answers to everything. I did not, however, expect to see that Leland and Sheryl have him kidnapped and sedated as part of their creepy experiments. 

Demon!Kristen really has a point about the Entity. They're just using David and he knows what their real goal is, so he should actually take the demon's advice here (a sentence I could only ever write about this show lol). I assume that insect looking thing that Sister Andrea saw was Demon!Kristen's actual form?

Poor Ben, he tries to get people to think critically about what they view online and gets videos telling him to fuck off for his trouble. The whole team needs to just delete the app off their phones or at least turn off notifications. I know the point is that social media is addictive, but there are simple solutions, people! 

I had a feeling the mom was really behind those videos, and it was terrible seeing her attacking her own kids for likes and then doubling down when called out on it. I hope she gets the help she clearly needs.

[Snazzy Daisy]

OMG Andy! 😱😱😱

You are a lousy husband but you don’t deserve that. We were right about Andy not being Andy but it’s way worse than we thought. 😢

Geez, between Sheryl and Leland, I wonder who’s changing Andy’s diaper?

Will the show tell us more about Leland’s rejuvenation serums? So many in stocks, is Andy being injected with that too?

The takedown of Leland by the Bouchard girls was epic but I pity Andy. Leland will make him his punching bag now.

COTW was so real. People will do anything for clout. It’s sad thinking about how many of us are easily manipulated by the apps especially those that actively stealing users data. It’s NOT as easy as turning off notifications and uninstalling the apps.

ETA:

The mosquito demon is the true evil behind VidTap - an app that’s sucking the life out of its users!!!

Why Andy’s business partner never got in touch with Kristen when Andy didn’t show up for the actual climb? He and some of the base camp local workers must be aware of the arrangement they made for wealthy Edward right?

So many WTFs in this episode. 😬 

Edited July 17, 2022 by SnazzyDaisy
Added new thoughts about Andy & VidTap!

[TakomaSnark]

@Annber03, @phalange and @SnazzyDaisy

You three said everything I wanted to say much more eloquently, so I'll just go with OMG WHAT AN EPISODE. I think this might be my favorite ep of the series so far.

Andy seems like an expendable character but I do hope the team is able to save him. 

I can't get enough of the girls besting Leland. The Kings understand how to take annoying child characters and make it work for the show.

[Madding crowd]

This episode was really dark. I knew something was up with Andy but just can’t believe Sheryl would do this to her daughter and granddaughters. It was a really good message that algorithms try to predict what we want to see, but it’s important to know that they are not really knowledgeable about our true selves or intentions. The fact that after buying something that is a singular purchase like a oven, you will get a million more ads for ovens proves the bot’s aren’t that smart. Once I made my oven purchase, I have zero interest in stopping at ads for other ovens.

Lots of great things about the internet here but a little diluted because the issue has been explored before on the show. Still, I felt a chill and loved the scary elements here and hope Kristen and her girls destroy Leland and Sheryl.

[WAnglais1]

Andy's videos all had the same content, in the same place, at the same camera angle. The last call to him kind of disturbed me, but this one was so obviously Fake!Andy from the start. 

A great episode full of true WTH moments. I may be the only one, but I have a soft spot for Andy. He seems to be trying to do the right things...he confronted the MiL and wanted her out of the house, and this is his payback. Leland shouldn't mess with Kristen. I'm sure there are several climbing axes in the house.

I know the kids are realistic since they annoy like regular kids do. Good for the Kings.

[Dani-Ellie]

This episode was fairly disturbing (OMG ANDY! and OMG MOM TERRIFYING AND HURTING HER OWN KIDS FOR LIKES and I mean, don't get me wrong, I love disturbing but holey sheet) so I will just say that the Bouchard girls doxxing Leland out of his position at the church is something I never knew I needed.

[Scout Finch]

BWAH! I clicked on the Skip intro button and although it did, a little message appeared at the bottom: "Skip this intro and you will be haunted!"

[AimingforYoko]

I love that the show has weaponized the girls' powers of annoyance for good. Leland really had no idea what he was dealing with.

As many have noted we knew Andy was in big trouble, but the reality turned out to be so much worse. When Kristen finds out, that axe is coming back into play.

[Annber03]

2 hours ago, Scout Finch said:

BWAH! I clicked on the Skip intro button and although it did, a little message appeared at the bottom: "Skip this intro and you will be haunted!"

I wondered how many other people caught that! That was a fun touch :D. 

[RedInk]

I gotta say…it’s a testament to Christine Lahti’s likeability that people try to understand Sheryl’s motivations or excuse her! I mean this legitimately- I’m not hating on Sheryl fans -but imo the woman is as bad as (if not worse than) Leland. Leland is just no good at manipulating anyone, not even children. 
I wish there were a better explanation for Kristen’s employment with the church. She is gaslit and abused by the priests, with the defense of Leland being particularly egregious, and she said in a recent episode she makes 60k a year?! I’m a public schoolteacher and outearn this cash-strapped doctor.  Is there a reason she’s not working for a hospital or in private practice, and I’ve forgotten? 

[Chaos Theory]

Poor Andy.   At least Sheryl is going to give him a heroes death scene.  And yeah she has gone full dark side of the force.   Watching her do Andy's nails while he was catatonic and telling him he was worth more dead then alive to his family was......something.

Loved watching Leland getting doxxed by the Bouchard daughters.   Leland may be good with computers but he is a 60 year old man and these are girls who are growing up in this world and they are smart (AND I LOVE THAT THEY ARE BEING WRITTEN AS SMART) tagged the pig character as Leland immediately and then went on to torture him both online and in real world.   

Watching all the videos that pop up on Ben, David and Kristens phones were all pretty sad but also true.   How easy it is to go down the deep dark rabbit hole of mom vids,  conspiracy theory vids,  and angry at the world vids is kind of sad.   And the mom who hurt her own kids just to clout chase......wow.

17 minutes ago, RedInk said:

I gotta say…it’s a testament to Christine Lahti’s likeability that people try to understand Sheryl’s motivations or excuse her! I mean this legitimately- I’m not hating on Sheryl fans -but imo the woman is as bad as (if not worse than) Leland. Leland is just no good at manipulating anyone, not even children. 
 

I have a soft spot for "evil villian female characters"  especially ones that have a motive I can understand that goes beyond "that boy is mine" motives.   And Christine Lahti plays Sheryl in a way that is incredibly understandable.  She is an angry vengeful manhater/maneater but still loves her daughter and will do anything to be back in with her daughter.  

Edited July 17, 2022 by Chaos Theory

[Annber03]

1 minute ago, Chaos Theory said:

Loved watching Leland getting doxxed by the Bouchard daughters.   Leland may be good with computers but he is a 60 year old man and these are girls who are growing up in this world and they are smart (AND I LOVE THAT THEY ARE BEING WRITTEN AS SMART) and tagged the pig character as Leland immediately and then went on to torture him both online and in real world.   

I also got a kick out of how dark they went with their plotting. Didn't take long for them to go to, "We could just kill him..." as a possible solution to their problem. They really do take after their mom :p. 

(Also, every time I see them I still can't get over how much they've grown. I feel almost like a mother myself watching them sometimes, LOL.)

Quote

I have a soft spot but "evil villian female characters"  especially ones that have a motive I can understand that go beyond "that boy is mine" motives.   And Christine Lahti plays Sheryl in a way that is incredibly understandable.  She is an angry vengeful manhater/maneater but still loves her daughter and will do anything to be back in with her daughter.  

I think there's also the fact that Sheryl was so hellbent on taking Leland down, and yeah, she's working with him, but she's still wary of him and using him for her own means, too, whatever that may be. So we feel like we kinda have to be on her side on some level, because whatever she's doing might thwart Leland's evil plotting, which, yay! Just that, unfortunately, Sheryl seems to have either been dragged into or is willingly throwing herself into some pretty diabolical stuff herself. As baffled as I am by her motives and her endgame much of the time, I also like that - I like that this show keeps me guessing as to what exactly is going on with her and why. 

As for your last sentence about her love for Kristen, I did notice that we didn't see Sheryl's reaction to Leland threatening to make Kristen's daughters orphans at the end. He basically just stated he was going to take out Kristen right in front of Sheryl. Surely she would have some kind of reaction to that, no? 

[RedInk]

45 minutes ago, Chaos Theory said:

Poor Andy.   At least Sheryl is going to give him a heroes death scene.  And yeah she has gone full dark side of the force.   Watching her do Andy's nails while he was catatonic and telling him he was worth more dead then alive to his family was......something.

Loved watching Leland getting doxxed by the Bouchard daughters.   Leland may be good with computers but he is a 60 year old man and these are girls who are growing up in this world and they are smart (AND I LOVE THAT THEY ARE BEING WRITTEN AS SMART) tagged the pig character as Leland immediately and then went on to torture him both online and in real world.   

Watching all the videos that pop up on Ben, David and Kristens phones were all pretty sad but also true.   How easy it is to go down the deep dark rabbit hole of mom vids,  conspiracy theory vids,  and angry at the world vids is kind of sad.   And the mom who hurt her own kids just to clout chase......wow.

I have a soft spot for "evil villian female characters"  especially ones that have a motive I can understand that goes beyond "that boy is mine" motives.   And Christine Lahti plays Sheryl in a way that is incredibly understandable.  She is an angry vengeful manhater/maneater but still loves her daughter and will do anything to be back in with her daughter.  

I also *love* how the girls are being written, but I don’t see any evidence that Sheryl loves her daughter. I mean beyond the way a sociopath loves someone, whatever that means to them. Like as an extension of themselves? She’s given Leland access to her daughter and grandchildren and has done something horrible to the person they love most. And she’s lying to them. I see that as abuse. I do like watching her character, though, because I think she’s the most interesting. 

Edited July 17, 2022 by RedInk

[Broderbits]

1 hour ago, RedInk said:

but I don’t see any evidence that Sheryl loves her daughter.

Totally agree! Sheryl loves Sheryl, period. She uses everyone, including her granddaughters, to further her own schemes; and enjoys screwing over anyone (like poor Andy) who gets in her way or says no. Kristen is the one who needs an exorcism to get rid of her evil mother.

[ferjy]

Well that was freaky! On many levels. I wondered if Leland might be behind the fake Andy videos, it seemed to be leading up to it. But I figured Andy was already dead, not this! And I didn’t clock that Sheryl would be in on it. Sweet revenge for her. Then we had the insect demon draining David. Yikes! And finally the evil mom. She seemed so genuine. What a turnabout. Definitely not a feel good episode!

The girls brought a bit of light. Go 4L’s!” I loved Lexis’ blunt announcement “Pollie the Pig is a pedophile.” The look on Leland’s face, ha! Figures it takes four little girls to accomplish something the Church couldn’t care less about (until it threatens their image). Still, it was satisfying to see Leland fired. I will miss the girls’ encounters with him on Bumblebee Valley though. Loved seeing flustered Leland. 

[Zaffy]

That was a very evil episode.

How long it will take Kristen to realize Andy's video feed is fake? I think this is a glitch in the script, she should had realized already.

Poor Andy... 

I am glad the showrunners finally got how to properly use the Bouchard daughters! I love those 4 kids! 

[snoopypez]

10 hours ago, Madding crowd said:

This episode was really dark. I knew something was up with Andy but just can’t believe Sheryl would do this to her daughter and granddaughters.

You'd think she'd have a line, wouldn't you? She barely even reacted (that we saw) to Leland saying it was time to make her granddaughters orphans! Like. Does she not KNOW those are the specific kids (brilliantly, hilariously) driving him mad? She claims she doesn't want to hurt Kristen, and she had all those pretty words to poor Andy about how well they'll all do without him, but... I dunno, I don't really NOT have confidence that she could handle Leland if it came to it, but at this point I just wonder if she'd even bother, if he tried to kill her daughter and granddaughters. She's just getting worse. 

Anyway. I know it's not popular, but I really like Andy. I was...not happy to see this reveal, though I did assume, as others had, that he was probably actually already dead. This doesn't seem much better though! (Also, I don't really agree with the apparently widely-held opinion that he's a shitty husband. Their circumstances have obviously been hard, but they've always been trying to make it so they can be in the same place. Sadly, money is a thing that is needed, which is why this evil plan worked in the first place. And back in first season, he told Kristen it was her turn to go climb and he'd stay at home and she told him otherwise. Plus, you know, the whole her-cheating-on-him thing. I dunno, I shouldn't like them as a couple at all, honestly, but I sadly think they're cute when together and Kristen isn't possibly possessed.)

In other news, the girls kicking Leland's ass again: BRILLIANT, SHOW-STOPPING, EMMY WORTHY, etc etc. I love them, and I loved his reaction to them actually saying his name, and I cackled at the girls excitedly deciding to burn the pig's house down. HA!

Ben reacting to that cotton candy dryer thing was also hilarious. But seriously guys, just DELETE and UNINSTALL the app!! Come on!! The employee at VidTAP or whatever was a cutie, and Kristen asking if she was Ben's girlfriend was giggly-hilarious too. Not that we ever found out what happened with Vanessa...and Maggie. Ahem.

The case of the episode was creepy and creepier still with the reveal. Curious about David's strong reaction to Sister Andrea in his room; felt a bit over the top to how he might've reacted if he hadn't just been, you know. Getting his brain or whatever sucked out by a demon. Intriguing! 

Edited July 18, 2022 by snoopypez

[Chaos Theory]

2 hours ago, Zaffy said:

How long it will take Kristen to realize Andy's video feed is fake? I think this is a glitch in the script, she should had realized already.

Why would she suspect?  I have been on zoom calls that have been that bad.   No matter how you try you just can’t get the person and the reason could be as simple as crappy wifi.     And there is no reason Kristen should suspect anything is wrong.  It’s kinda like one of those mysteries where the audience knows who the killer is and we all think the detective or whoever is an idiot because he doesn’t see the signs the minute the killer says “hello my name is Killer McKiller.”  It’s the downside of being on this side of the narrative.  Every second that Kristen doesn’t figure out Andy is being held hostage “someone” is going to think she is an idiot even though we as an audience found out like a minute ago.  

Edited July 18, 2022 by Chaos Theory

[jenn31]

5 hours ago, RedInk said:

I don’t see any evidence that Sheryl loves her daughter.

What more proof of love than taking your four high energy chatterboxes whenever you need it... driving them around everywhere, to school, from school, feeding them, at no charge! If anything, she is the one being used. A mother’s work is all too often not appreciated. 

[Anela]

I knew it! I knew it was strange that he would just cut his wife off, when she was worried about their girls. 

The girls are amazing, and I loved their apology to their mum, on the board. 

I hardly spend time on tiktok. For me, I get foodie people, or dogs. Lots of dogs. Especially since I searched for disabled dogs, after seeing a video of a dog that was a bit like mine. Instagram used to be my favourite, but it gets to me, when I can't afford to go anywhere, and people are travelling all over the world. Also with covid, but there is a lot of FOMO. I get tired of people trying to sell me things that I can't afford, as they get a kitchen upgrade for free, or an entire house decorated. Plus "here's a link to order the same vacation that I got for free."

Sheryl... wow. She's on board with killing Andy. I don't know why I'm surprised. I mean, those people whose blood they were taking - I can't imagine Leland and co, just letting them go.

Yes! at least the church finally had to do something.

On 7/17/2022 at 3:40 AM, Annber03 said:

OMGOMGOMGOMG WHAT THE HELL ARE THEY PLANNING TO DO WITH ANDY HOOOOOOOOOOOLY SHIT!

Wow. WOW. Okay. Well. That answers our little mystery about what's up with him, then. That's...deeply unsettling on so many levels, and the fact that Sheryl's in on it...I mean, I knew she couldn't stand Andy and wanted him gone and all, but damn... I could even see her doing this if she felt Andy was a legitimate threat - if she's starting to see demons everywhere, like she did with her boss last episode, maybe she's getting those vibes off Andy, too, and now she has a concrete answer to why she's never liked him, and this could explain her desire to go after him as she is. But of course, if that's the case, that wouldn't explain Leland's involvement, I wouldn't think...

All I know for sure is that she is going to rue the day when Kristen and her daughters find out what she's done to their husband/father. I wonder if and how they'll find out about this, and what Andy might do to try and get himself out of there. 

Um. As for other topics...ooooooh, again, another really good case this episode. I literally had the exact same reaction Kristen did upon seeing the video of the mom cutting her own child's back. And Ben looked about ready to punch something, he was so pissed. I was wondering if that was the route the story would go when the team came over to the house late that one night...and sadly, I'm not at all surprised that a mother could do such a thing. I've seen too many damn true crime shows :/. I was terrified that the mom was going to try and stab herself with the scissors when the team came to confront her at the end. Thank goodness that didn't happen. But man. Those poor children. 

I also sympathized with Ben's desire to try and argue with whackjob conspiracy theorists online. I've been there. It's very tempting. As for David, he was getting videos from other priests, but now I'm thinking he may have inadvertently tapped into a new way for people to do their confessions :p! Are online confessions a thing yet? I wouldn't be surprised if they are. And if not, I won't be surprised if they become a thing.  

On a lighter note, I liked Ben's interaction with that woman from the app company. Kristen just coming straight out and asking the question we were all wondering about whether or not she's his girlfriend was great :D. Hee. 

Leave it to the Bouchard daughters to ultimately be the ones to take Leland down XD. Watching his reaction to being told to leave the Church was very, very satisfying, indeed (and yet, true to form, the Church will still give him a "positive recommendation", because of course they will). But man, Leland's reaction to being removed from the Church was genuinely scary - it's rare you see him THAT openly furious. I love that the girls called him out for the creep that he is, but man, I really hope that Kristen learns about what they've done and they continue to keep their guard up about him, 'cause between his threat about making the girls orphans and the reveal of what's going on with Andy, I'm really worried for the Bouchard family. 

As for David's Kristen demon, weird as that whole situation is, I do like the idea that it is forcing him, on some level at least, to question the motives of the Entity. Mind, I get why he's wary of trusting the Kristen demon, because, well, demon. But he definitely should keep his guard up about the Entity, too. And I hope he does. Perhaps Sister Andrea can help him figure out what they're all about - I feel like she might have more answers and explanations about them than anyone else. 

Yeah. Whew. Quite a freaky episode, this one. I can't believe we're halfway through the season already - only four episodes left to go this season, I can't even begin to imagine what all could happen in that amount of time. 

The mum, I expected that as soon as the little one wet himself. I immediately thought she was abusing them. 

I've mostly stopped arguing with anyone like that online. I need some peace of mind, wherever I can get it. My social media is locked down.

Ah, my cat George keeps grabbing at my hands, with his claws. then rubbing his head against the keyboard. 

I love that Sister Andrea whacked that demon, but I'm sad that David told her off.

On 7/17/2022 at 10:39 AM, Madding crowd said:

This episode was really dark. I knew something was up with Andy but just can’t believe Sheryl would do this to her daughter and granddaughters. It was a really good message that algorithms try to predict what we want to see, but it’s important to know that they are not really knowledgeable about our true selves or intentions. The fact that after buying something that is a singular purchase like a oven, you will get a million more ads for ovens proves the bot’s aren’t that smart. Once I made my oven purchase, I have zero interest in stopping at ads for other ovens.

Lots of great things about the internet here but a little diluted because the issue has been explored before on the show. Still, I felt a chill and loved the scary elements here and hope Kristen and her girls destroy Leland and Sheryl.

I thought it was the company that Leland and Sheryl work for, manipulating the videos towards them. They were incredibly specific, for Kristen and David. It wouldn't surprise me if they had people working there, but I know the ups and downs of social media, too.

On 7/17/2022 at 3:31 PM, RedInk said:

I gotta say…it’s a testament to Christine Lahti’s likeability that people try to understand Sheryl’s motivations or excuse her! I mean this legitimately- I’m not hating on Sheryl fans -but imo the woman is as bad as (if not worse than) Leland. Leland is just no good at manipulating anyone, not even children. 
I wish there were a better explanation for Kristen’s employment with the church. She is gaslit and abused by the priests, with the defense of Leland being particularly egregious, and she said in a recent episode she makes 60k a year?! I’m a public schoolteacher and outearn this cash-strapped doctor.  Is there a reason she’s not working for a hospital or in private practice, and I’ve forgotten? 

I thought Leland messed with her in the first episode of the series, when she had a job. Was it with the city? they were experts called in for opposing sides in at least one case. 

On 7/17/2022 at 9:47 PM, jenn31 said:

What more proof of love than taking your four high energy chatterboxes whenever you need it... driving them around everywhere, to school, from school, feeding them, at no charge! If anything, she is the one being used. A mother’s work is all too often not appreciated. 

She was living there rent-free. I think she loves her daughter, but if she really cared, she would have told her about Leland. Her own selfish interests supersede any concerns about her family. I hope that I'm wrong, and that she does take Leland down, otherwise this is leading to a showdown between her and her daughter (and David and Ben).

Edited July 18, 2022 by Anela

[Zaffy]

7 hours ago, Chaos Theory said:

Why would she suspect?  I have been on zoom calls that have been that bad.   No matter how you try you just can’t get the person and the reason could be as simple as crappy wifi.     And there is no reason Kristen should suspect anything is wrong.  It’s kinda like one of those mysteries where the audience knows who the killer is and we all think the detective or whoever is an idiot because he doesn’t see the signs the minute the killer says “hello my name is Killer McKiller.”  It’s the downside of being on this side of the narrative.  Every second that Kristen doesn’t figure out Andy is being held hostage “someone” is going to think she is an idiot even though we as an audience found out like a minute ago.  

Because he is the same spot looking exactly the same in every single call despite the fact he is changing locations? And she is supposed to be quite observant? and she used to climb so she knows the landscape and the conditions change. Not to mention she should had called him using a simple phone or even asked his climbing partners if everything is ok. 

[ferjy]

2 hours ago, Anela said:

Her own selfish interests supersede any concerns about her family.

I think she loves her daughter and granddaughters. But there’s no love lost between her and Andy. He hates Sheryl as much as she hates him. And Kristin knows this and has lived with it for years, so she might not be as surprised as we were!

[Ceindreadh]

3 hours ago, Zaffy said:

Because he is the same spot looking exactly the same in every single call despite the fact he is changing locations? And she is supposed to be quite observant? and she used to climb so she knows the landscape and the conditions change. Not to mention she should had called him using a simple phone or even asked his climbing partners if everything is ok. 

He did claim to be at the base camp every time she called. 

[ABay]

I imagine Ben Linus looking at Leland Townsend and sneering "amateur". Not that Ben was anywhere as evil as Leland but he holds the Gold for manipulation.

[tennisgurl]

I knew that something was wrong with Andy, but I didn't expect that! Poor Andy, that's horrifying, and presumably all because he tried to keep Sheryl's creepy ass away from his family. I hope that Kristen can save him but its not looking good right now. I find Sheryl to be a really entertaining character, but I think that she's an awful person and Kristen and the girls would be a thousand times safer without her around. She might act like she loves her daughter and grand daughter, but she also manipulates them, gas lights them, and is apparently about to murder their husband/father, any love she has for them is driven by selfishness. 

I thought something was off with that mom right away, but the ending was still really hard to watch. Those poor kids, I hope they get a lot of help. You hear about people doing crazy things for likes, but that horror show certainly takes the cake. I sympathize with Ben's extremely pissed off reaction, I was about to reach through my screen and slug that awful woman as well. 

Watching Leland finally getting kicked out of the church was an absolute joy, Bouchard sisters for the win! I love that they've weaponized their annoyance, Leland never stood a chance against the power of plucky kids who love making noise. I have always really liked Kristen's daughters, but this season they are using them amazingly well. It does worry me though, Leland can be seriously scary when he's truly pissed off, and he is already seconds from taking the girls father from them. Who knows what he could do next. 

[Scout Finch]

23 minutes ago, ABay said:

I imagine Ben Linus looking at Leland Townsend and sneering "amateur". Not that Ben was anywhere as evil as Leland but he holds the Gold for manipulation.

Because Michael Emerson did such an amazing job, to the point that when later in Linus' storyline where he becomes more and more broken that I actually felt a lot of empathy, is the reason I've been following him from show to show ever since. Particularly loved his character in Person of Interest! I don't think I would have even begun watching that show--or Evil--if it wasn't initially because of him.

[Chaos Theory]

The show has always been about how we let "evil" into our lives.   Sheryl has literally let an evil man into her life.  A man she KNOWS is evil because it is convenient and gets her what she wants.   I think it would be too easy to say that Leland is "Forcing" Sheryl to do these very bad things in some way.  It takes away Sheryl's free will and kinda ruins the premise that we do bad things for complicated and sometimes downright stupid reasons.  

[gesundheit]

On 7/17/2022 at 4:26 PM, Annber03 said:

I wondered how many other people caught that! That was a fun touch :D. 

I saw the "skip the intro and you will be haunted" and opted out of skipping the intro for the first time ever, hee! Listen, I don't believe in that stuff, but no need to test it!

On 7/17/2022 at 4:31 PM, RedInk said:

I gotta say…it’s a testament to Christine Lahti’s likeability that people try to understand Sheryl’s motivations or excuse her! I mean this legitimately- I’m not hating on Sheryl fans -but imo the woman is as bad as (if not worse than) Leland. Leland is just no good at manipulating anyone, not even children. 
I wish there were a better explanation for Kristen’s employment with the church. She is gaslit and abused by the priests, with the defense of Leland being particularly egregious, and she said in a recent episode she makes 60k a year?! I’m a public schoolteacher and outearn this cash-strapped doctor.  Is there a reason she’s not working for a hospital or in private practice, and I’ve forgotten? 

I just tend to feel like there has to be an explanation much bigger than "she's a really shitty person." That's too simple for this show. We did see her break up with Leland after she heard the horrific thing he said about the kid getting raped in prison, and then what followed certainly seemed to imply that something demonic got imposed on her in the "goodbye kiss" and subsequent blood-sex. 

That 60k/year detail was hilarious. On what planet were she and Andy going to live off of that + his proposed retail wages while raising 4 kids in a beautiful house in NYC??? Does she mean 60k net? Did the Catholic church take over her loan payments or something? I couldn't even support myself on that amount in NYC with student loan repayments and I'm not raising four children.

Edited July 18, 2022 by gesundheit

[RedInk]

4 hours ago, gesundheit said:

I just tend to feel like there has to be an explanation much bigger than "she's a really shitty person." That's too simple for this show. We did see her break up with Leland after she heard the horrific thing he said about the kid getting raped in prison, and then what followed certainly seemed to imply that something demonic got imposed on her in the "goodbye kiss" and subsequent blood-sex. 

True! I can get behind the idea that she’s possessed or compromised (for lack of a better word) because she is quite different in recent seasons. If Lexis is some diabolical experiment, it would make sense to target her grandmother. I’m hoping for details with a Sheryl-centric episode! Just saying I can’t exactly root for her in her current state like she’s some warrior mother who’s not taking any shit from men. Sure she does some mundane favors to support her family; she’s also literally torturing/murdering people, working for demons, and performing ritual sacrifices for personal gain. And I notice no one is interested in making the same allowances for Leland, who could be in the same situation. But unlike Lahti, Emerson always plays people easy to hate ;) 

[ShawnaLanne]

On top of everything else with Sheryl, did you notice - from what we have seen so far - she had nothing to say about Leland saying he was going to make the girls orphans in his temper tantrum? So Sheryl is good with him murdering her daughter now? 

I was not expecting to see Andy in that box like some sort of Sleeping Beauty. That was creepy AF. I really hope they don't kill off his character. I don't think he is a bad husband, that is something Sheryl espouses because Andy sees through her bullshit and she can't have that, now can she? He sets and keeps to boundaries. She can't have that. Also, if Andy comes back full time she is no longer needed as much. And that kind of sociopath needs to be needed, to hold things over heads and to be seen as being special in some way. Sheryl swooping in to save her daughter gives her that weird status. 

[Anela]

Last season, the actress who plays Sheryl, made it sound like Sheryl was playing Leland.  We saw her go to dinner with him, like something was going to happen, and then he drugged her, took some of her blood, and she just joined him and the rich guy, in what their were doing.  She could be playing a long game, I hope she isn’t really down with killing Andy.  

I do like Andy, too.  

[gesundheit]

13 hours ago, RedInk said:

True! I can get behind the idea that she’s possessed or compromised (for lack of a better word) because she is quite different in recent seasons. If Lexis is some diabolical experiment, it would make sense to target her grandmother. I’m hoping for details with a Sheryl-centric episode! Just saying I can’t exactly root for her in her current state like she’s some warrior mother who’s not taking any shit from men. Sure she does some mundane favors to support her family; she’s also literally torturing/murdering people, working for demons, and performing ritual sacrifices for personal gain. And I notice no one is interested in making the same allowances for Leland, who could be in the same situation. But unlike Lahti, Emerson always plays people easy to hate ;) 

I assume nobody's interested in making allowances for Leland because we know he sold his soul willingly, right? (Sometimes I get lost on that backstory and how much of it is what he's selling or others have gleaned and how much we actually know as fact, but that's always how I've read it -- he was earthly-evil before and demon-evil now)

But yes, there is definitely a delight in watching Lahti that makes me long for some reveal or mitigating detail, whereas I'm perfectly comfortable loving to hate Emerson's character!

[kwnyc]

I think Kristen knows there's something up with Andy. She wished him "Happy Anniversary," and Sheryl pointed out that it wasn't their anniversary.

Sheryl's onboard with having Andy kidnapped and drugged. But then she stood behind Leland and shook her head and nodded to give him the right responses when Leland was questioning him. So she wants Andy alive for SOME reason.

The girls are their mother's daughters. And yes, they have grown so much. 

As for the weird room with the bottles of serum, we haven't had much info about it, but it SEEMS like they are draining some kind of fluid from the people they have imprisoned, and using it to make themselves feel stronger and younger. (Can you do that in an apartment lair?) And presumably, there's only so much you can drain from a body.

I had the weird feeling that Andy's going to find some way to either throw off the paralyzing drug, or communicate with someone (or maybe David or Sister Andrea will have a visitation that gives them the message that Andy's alive.) All 4 daughters woke up and screamed that their Dad had died at the same time...maybe that was when he was kidnapped?

And yeah, where IS Andy's partner? 

[Jacks-Son]

On 7/17/2022 at 1:31 PM, RedInk said:

I’m not hating on Sheryl fans

There are fans of this Troll?  There's no coming back to the family after what she has done.  She's now Demon Chum and I cannot see her ever escaping the grasp of Leland's Master. The joy she is getting out of others' misfortunes is sick.

[millennium]

This season is a vast improvement over last season's mess.   The Demon of Algorithms was IMO the best episode of the series thus far.   It made a visceral social commentary without being preachy in the least.   It's said that the best jokes are funny because they're true.  I would apply the same sentiment to good horror.   When I saw the mother gouge her son's back, I thought, "Yes, that's entirely possible these days."  And Ben's dismay at the gullibility and attention-whoredom of the social media world echoed my own.

I'm kind of sad that Bumblebee Valley is finished.  I thought the girls' interactions with Pollie the Pig were hilarious.

Edited July 20, 2022 by millennium

[Snazzy Daisy]

David: “Umm, is the app evil?”

Err David, Kristen should have told you that she found some sigils in VidTap when she clicked #possesed.

[millennium]

On 7/20/2022 at 3:35 PM, SnazzyDaisy said:

Err David, Kristen should have told you that she found some sigils in VidTap when she clicked #possesed.

She needs to be more sigilant.

[leocadia]

On 7/10/2022 at 9:22 PM, saoirse said:

A single mother enlists the team to look into the potentially demonic ways the viral app TipTop is terrorizing her family.

I have to wonder if this was changed to "VidTap" because it was a little too close to TikTok?  Not that it wasn't completely obvious that was the app they were targeting.

On 7/18/2022 at 4:10 PM, gesundheit said:

I saw the "skip the intro and you will be haunted" and opted out of skipping the intro for the first time ever, hee! Listen, I don't believe in that stuff, but no need to test it!

I'm right there with you, lol!  Of course I really wish I could skip the into because it is one of the few things I despise about this show.  It seems like it changed for this season into almost a carbon copy of the Good Fight into.  The escalating volume on the music irritates me on both shows.

I wonder if the girls would have had more difficulty identifying Leland in Bumblebee Valley if had hadn't felt the need to add glasses to his avatar? ;)

[KittyQ]

I, too, like Andy. He's flawed all right, but he wants the best for his family, and now he's in Leland's clutches. That scene was freaky, but it reminded me of something and I finally tracked it down. Back in Season 2, the suspicious fertility doctor also ended up incapacitated in Leland's "closet" (O is for Ovaphobia). Did they ever say what happened to her or why she was being held?

I find it very funny that the "Ls" are running rings around Leland online. He's supposed to be a master manipulator (and he succeeds often enough with adults) but for some reason he just can't get over on the kids anymore and he keeps trying these dumb ploys to deceive them. Thank goodness someone in the Church finally gave him his walking papers.

What kind of double game is Sheryl playing? Or is she? I thought that she had it in for Leland, and yet, she's participating in (maybe she even initiated?) Andy being kidnapped and imprisoned. I know Sheryl hates Andy, which is reciprocal, but if her daughter were to find out, that relationship would be toast, at the very least.

Was the mosquito demon the real form of the Kristen-demon? Creepy! Is that why David was so adamant that Sister Andrea butt out?