S04.E02: Chapter Two: Vecna's Curse

[blueray]

On 5/27/2022 at 11:25 AM, Spartan Girl said:

As much as I would have loved Eleven to go full blown Carrie White at the roller rink, hitting Angela in the face with the skate was equally satisfying. Yeah, yeah, assault is wrong, but still…

Did she really kill all the everyone in the lab flashback? I’m a little dubious. Nothing is ever as it seems on this show.

I was also was expecting her to go full on Carrie. I think Will was worried about that too. As he knows how much she hates those girls and what she is capable of.

And my theory on the lab is that it was Eight's escape. She would make it seem like everyone is dead then she used Eleven as a distraction (for some reason) to actually leave. The second she left they were fine. I can't imagine they'd have Eleven kill a bunch of kids that seems to extreme at like 6, for even this show. Eleven was remember that moment as someone said the same line that Benner did. But maybe I'm just hoping she didn't kill the kids. 

[blueray]

On 5/27/2022 at 3:56 PM, bettername2come said:

Dang, El, I just wanted you to punch Angela. And the whole "snitch" thing really doesn't work when she didn't snitch on you! And how is the DJ in on this prank?

I feel like I missed something what did El do? Did they ever say. Because it couldn't have been the teacher thing as the girl already hated her and El said she tripped (which wasn't telling on them). So it must have happened off scene. And why would the DJ and anyone else at the rink be involved with it. I did cheer when she hit her though. She completely deserved it. 

[paulvdb]

8 hours ago, foxfreakinmulder said:

So the Russian guy sent a package to America not knowing when it would arrive or when or if the hidden message would be discovered with a phone number to a pay phone and what just sat there day and night for weeks waiting for it to ring? Didn't he have to report to work?

I thought the note also had a time on it. So the guy would be waiting by the phone at that time every day until he got the call from Joyce and Murray.

[Sarah 103]

17 hours ago, paulvdb said:

Today Steve and Robin would be working for Netflix and looking at people's streaming profiles to find the drug dealer.

Steve and Robin would find someone (Suzie) who could hack into people's streaming accounts to find the drug dealer. 

[Chicago Redshirt]

I am hoping that when El inevitably gets her powers back, she gives Angela some more TK beatdown. Sort of like how in Superman II, Clark went back to the diner to kick the ass of that trucker who had bullied him when he was powerless.

[rhiamon]

On 5/28/2022 at 3:44 AM, BlackberryJam said:

I always feel like this show is portraying the 80s from the POV of someone who learned about the 80s from watching TV and not from someone who actually grew up in the 80s. It’s frustrating. 

Perhaps that's why I feel so warm and fuzzy with the visuals of this show - I was just a little bit too young to really register and remember the fashion at the time but Stranger Things just looks so much like what I'd see on TV back in the day (and probably much the same styles continued on screen even into the 90s) that I can't help but love it.

[Armchair Critic]

On 5/27/2022 at 9:42 PM, Demian said:

no one was wearing all that neon crap at the roller rink in 1986. 

I had a neon sweater in 1985, like what Madonna wore. I remember everybody had those Forenza sweaters from The Limited. I also lived in the midwest so to me it's plausible, they may have been behind the times a bit. Here's the sweater I am talking about:

Edited May 29, 2022 by Armchair Critic

[Clanstarling]

10 hours ago, blueray said:

I feel like I missed something what did El do? Did they ever say. Because it couldn't have been the teacher thing as the girl already hated her and El said she tripped (which wasn't telling on them). So it must have happened off scene. And why would the DJ and anyone else at the rink be involved with it. I did cheer when she hit her though. She completely deserved it. 

As I recall, they called her a snitch after El told the teacher she'd tripped, and the teacher left. It made no sense, other than the bullies were horrible people and used whatever fodder they could, even if they made it up. Or figured just by being visibly hurt, El was snitching on them? I don't understand the way bullies think.

Edited May 29, 2022 by Clanstarling

[Redrum]

16 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

As I recall, they called her a snitch after El told the teacher she'd tripped, and the teacher left. It made no sense, other than the bullies were horrible people and used whatever fodder they could, even if they made it up.

I thought the teacher rather obviously didn't believe El and grabbed Angela for a talking to - which in high school can be interpreted as snitching. Angela got in trouble because El didn't lie effectively. 

[silverstream]

16 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

As I recall, they called her a snitch after El told the teacher she'd tripped, and the teacher left. It made no sense, other than the bullies were horrible people and used whatever fodder they could, even if they made it up. Or figured just by being visibly hurt, El was snitching on them? I don't understand the way bullies think.

I thought the called her a snitch because a) they're horrible and b) because El didn't enthusiastically repeat she'd tripped and that Angela was totally innocent while she was being lead away, despite Angela demanding she confirm that.

[Clanstarling]

15 minutes ago, Redrum said:

I thought the teacher rather obviously didn't believe El and grabbed Angela for a talking to - which in high school can be interpreted as snitching. Angela got in trouble because El didn't lie effectively. 

14 minutes ago, silverstream said:

I thought the called her a snitch because a) they're horrible and b) because El didn't enthusiastically repeat she'd tripped and that Angela was totally innocent while she was being lead away, despite Angela demanding she confirm that.

I think both of these are true. I'd forgotten all the dynamics in that scene.

a) the teacher didn't believe El because

b) she didn't repeat that she tripped (and teacher knew how horrible Angela was) and

c) Horrible Angela and other bullies of her ilk would interpret that as snitching.

[charmed1]

The 80s fashion discussion is interesting because as a little black girl who was slightly younger than Erica at that time, I feel like they absolutely nail her aesthetic every season. Those tightly rolled bangs achieved only with the nightly pink sponge roller and the slightly less tight back bang was my every day hairstyle from ages 11-13. Even the side barrette and her double socks of different colors. The only thing missing from her look last season was the aluminum foil on the end of her braids. Most 80s retrospective shows are terrible at representing Black American style for that time period, but Stranger Things, at least for Erica does a good job. I always feel like I’m looking at myself from 35 years ago. YMMV of course. I think I even had a kids size version of Joyce’s coat. Mine was burgundy and corduroy. Same buttons.

Edited May 29, 2022 by charmed1

[eleanorofaquitaine]

My experience as someone who was 13 in 1986 was that bullying of that nature wasn't so blatant. The reason why other kids get away for so long is because they often know how to hide it from adults. In any case, I think El hitting Angela in the face with a roller skate is a bit of fan service to everyone who has been bullied.

I was also wondering why Mike and Will didn't actually go out on the rink to support El. I will say one thing, Noah Schnap and Milly Bobbie Brown are believable as some form of siblings.

Re the 80s fashion - some of it is over the top but I remember neon's hey day as being more 1985-ish. Still, I am sure people were wearing it in '86.

[Taryn74]

53 minutes ago, charmed1 said:

The 80s fashion discussion is interesting because as a little black girl who was slightly younger than Erica at that time, I feel like they absolutely nail her aesthetic every season.

I'm just your basic white girl but I had several black classmates, and I think the show has totally nailed Erica's style too. One of them recently posted a throwback picture of herself on FB and she totally had the tightly rolled bangs going on. Too funny! I don't remember any of them having foil on the ends of their braids though, was that something you wore out or to protect them while you sleep or something? (I was always jealous of the black girls' hair texture because it would hold whatever style they put it in all day long, LOL.)

[charmed1]

The foil was just a way to secure the bead and keep the braid from unraveling. You can see little silver bits at the end of Taraji  P. Henson’s braids in her throwback school photo.

[Taryn74]

23 minutes ago, charmed1 said:

The foil was just a way to secure the bead and keep the braid from unraveling. You can see little silver bits at the end of Taraji  P. Henson’s braids in her throwback school photo.

Ahh, okay, cool! Maybe they were wearing it, then, and I just never noticed.

[foxfreakinmulder]

13 hours ago, paulvdb said:

I thought the note also had a time on it. So the guy would be waiting by the phone at that time every day until he got the call from Joyce and Murray.

Thanks, I totally missed that. I'll catch it on the re-watch ;-)

[Kel Varnsen]

On 5/28/2022 at 2:24 PM, BlackberryJam said:

I hate to harp on it, but that roller rink scene was just 80s movie and not 80s. 

Isn't that what the show has always been? To me at least it is always way more about references and homages to classic 80's movies and tv shows than a reflection of what actually went down in the 80's.

On 5/28/2022 at 8:17 PM, mledawn said:

 but the two of them just standing there while all the shit went down with El at the roller rink was a massive disappointment. I guess they're used to being outcasts, though, and were just frozen.

I bought that, those two are used to bullies picking on them and its way more normal for El to save them than the other way around.

I am really liking Max this season, they have made her into such an interesting character. Although it would have been nice to see that her and El have kept in touch.

As for Hopper did the Russians capture him in Hawkins (under the mall) and take him back. Or did he jump through the door to the upside down then to another door from the upside down into Russia? If it is the first how did all those Russians get there so fast and how did they get him out of the country?

[BlackberryJam]

4 minutes ago, Kel Varnsen said:

I am really liking Max this season, they have made her into such an interesting character. Although it would have been nice to see that her and El have kept in touch.

Max is the foreshadowing of grunge. On my lazy days, I wore Max’s braid. Max seems to embody that feeling of isolation, from El, from Lucas, from her family. 

[CeeBeeGee]

On 5/27/2022 at 3:51 PM, tennisgurl said:

I thought that El might get her powers back just in time to fling that awful girl across the rink, but a skate to the face works too. Yeah violence is bad and all, but I mostly just feel bad that El could get in trouble for this after everything. I also felt really bad for Will, he clearly missed Mike so much but Mike is all about El, he hardly even got a hug.

Yeah, couldn't GAF that Angela got pounded. Don't start none, won't get none.

On 5/27/2022 at 6:26 PM, DearEvette said:

I know it is for drama etc. etc.  but come on show!  Everybody in the skating rink just stands around and laughs at a girl being completely bullied and humiliated?  Not one person in the crowd looks uncomfortable or condemning?  I know it was the 80s and anti-bullying wasn't quite the crusade it has since become, but people were still sympathetic to people being bullied.  I also found it equally unbelievable that those same people who just saw this poor girl humiliated and bullied would stand there in condemning silence when she cold cocked Angela with that skate.  I mean, law of averages, at least one random onlooker would have laughed or had a 'served that bitch right' smirk on their face.  But no they all just looked so flabbergasted.  I specifically looked and in each scene the background crowd were all giving off hive energy.  Just doesn't ring true with casual crowd dynamics, imo.

I kind of agree but I think both things--the crowd not intervening and then the crowd seeming aghast--can be chalked up to either: the crowd took a while to catch on to what was happening, or the whole scene is mostly from El's POV.

What I think is odd is how--elaborate Angela's revenge scenarios are. That's more unusual at that age--in the 9th grade, I would think her bullying would amount to snide and mocking remarks and the like. But whatever, it's a TV show and perhaps the fact that they're freshmen (Angela and her friends seem older but if El is in the same classes, they couldn't be older than freshmen) explains it.

10 hours ago, Armchair Critic said:

I had a neon sweater in 1985, like what Madonna wore. I remember everybody had those Forenza sweaters from The Limited. 

The Firenza sweaters! I remember them fondly. Also, I don't know if this was widespread or just our HS but we went through a phase of wearing our dad's sweaters. 

I totally rocked Nancy's loosely structured sweater vest look in 1986. In fact I think I still have that pink sweater vest!

[Chicago Redshirt]

5 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

As for Hopper did the Russians capture him in Hawkins (under the mall) and take him back. Or did he jump through the door to the upside down then to another door from the upside down into Russia? If it is the first how did all those Russians get there so fast and how did they get him out of the country?

He jumped into a gate leading to the Upside Down in Hawkins and somehow emerged in the Rightside Up in Russia. They blew up the secret Russian facility under the Starcade real good. 

[overtherainbow]

Someone on reddit who pays way more attention to this show than I do mentioned that the day of their date at the rink was Will's birthday. That would explain why he was so sullen that day, he was waiting for Mike to mention it and he never did.

[methodwriter85]

14 hours ago, CeeBeeGee said:

What I think is odd is how--elaborate Angela's revenge scenarios are. That's more unusual at that age--in the 9th grade, I would think her bullying would amount to snide and mocking remarks and the like. But whatever, it's a TV show and perhaps the fact that they're freshmen (Angela and her friends seem older but if El is in the same classes, they couldn't be older than freshmen) explains

I mean, obviously this whole thing was an homage to Carrie. The whole show in general is an homage to both Stephen King and Stephen Spielberg, and that includes the over the top bullies right down the first season when Troy tried to force Mike to jump over a cliff. I kind of was just hoping El would fight Angela like Jonathan fought Steve in season 1, though I think this is more about triggering El's PSTD.

[Sarah 103]

16 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Isn't that what the show has always been? To me at least it is always way more about references and homages to classic 80's movies and tv shows than a reflection of what actually went down in the 80's.

YES! I was trying to find a way to say this exact thing and you just did it better. This isn't a show about the 1980s as it was lived by real people. This is a show about the 1980s as seen through popular culture, especially kids action adventure movies, teen movies, and horror movies (plus a dash of 1970s conspiracy thrillers for the adults/older teens). 

[HelloooKitty]

So, is Will gay and scared to tell Mike bc he’s unsure of his reaction?

or is Will gay and also has a crush on/feelings for Mike and scared to tell him bc he knows Mike isn’t gay and it could very easily ruin their friendship?

[Sarah 103]

56 minutes ago, HelloooKitty said:

So, is Will gay and scared to tell Mike bc he’s unsure of his reaction?

or is Will gay and also has a crush on/feelings for Mike and scared to tell him bc he knows Mike isn’t gay and it could very easily ruin their friendship?

I would say yes to both if that's an option. 

[HelloooKitty]

1 minute ago, Sarah 103 said:

I would say yes to both if that's an option. 

Where’s my Road to El Dorado gif…?

[CeeBeeGee]

1 hour ago, methodwriter85 said:

I mean, obviously this whole thing was an homage to Carrie. The whole show in general is an homage to both Stephen King and Stephen Spielberg, and that includes the over the top bullies right down the first season when Troy tried to force Mike to jump over a cliff. I kind of was just hoping El would fight Angela like Jonathan fought Steve in season 1, though I think this is more about triggering El's PSTD.

That makes perfect sense, the Carrie reference. Although, as much as I love Carrie and as much as it still stands up (there's a reason it gets remade and rebooted and referenced so often), upon closer examination it still reads in parts as though this is how a man thinks older teenage girls act.

[Scout Finch]

14 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

He jumped into a gate leading to the Upside Down in Hawkins and somehow emerged in the Rightside Up in Russia. They blew up the secret Russian facility under the Starcade real good. 

[methodwriter85]

1 hour ago, CeeBeeGee said:

That makes perfect sense, the Carrie reference. Although, as much as I love Carrie and as much as it still stands up (there's a reason it gets remade and rebooted and referenced so often), upon closer examination it still reads in parts as though this is how a man thinks older teenage girls act.

I've said it before and I've said it again- no other movie has worked as well at this trope as Mean Girls has, because Mean Girls was written by women. It even gets the fact that by senior year, seniors are largely over the major drama because they're already looking forward to college. (I attended a high school that was like 66 percent female and it always struck me how much Mean Girls reflected what high school was really like.)

In this case they're supposed to be in 9th grade so I can buy Angela being that much of an unrepentant bitch, just amped up and with more elaborate bullying schemes because we are watching a tv show. I always thought the bullies in Stephen King novels/movies were so amplified and psychotic beyond just a normal mean girl/mean boy because he wants to convey to adults how horrifying bullying is for the kids going through it. I don't think the roller skating scene was as sadistic as it was depicted as being, but we were seeing it from El's view.

[Kel Varnsen]

2 hours ago, CeeBeeGee said:

That makes perfect sense, the Carrie reference. Although, as much as I love Carrie and as much as it still stands up (there's a reason it gets remade and rebooted and referenced so often), upon closer examination it still reads in parts as though this is how a man thinks older teenage girls act.

Maybe, or maybe it is just a reference. Just like how I have known many people who were like experts at computer stuff but I have never known anyone who hacked into their school's computer system and changed their grade. So Dustin's girlfriend doing it, is pretty clearly a Ferris Bueller reference (and yes I know he changed his attendance record).

[Chicago Redshirt]

3 hours ago, Scout Finch said:

i feel seen. :)

[CeeBeeGee]

1 hour ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Maybe, or maybe it is just a reference. Just like how I have known many people who were like experts at computer stuff but I have never known anyone who hacked into their school's computer system and changed their grade. So Dustin's girlfriend doing it, is pretty clearly a Ferris Bueller reference (and yes I know he changed his attendance record).

Or possibly a reference to War Games (such a great movie!) where David does change his grade and Jen's.

[Sarah 103]

2 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Maybe, or maybe it is just a reference. Just like how I have known many people who were like experts at computer stuff but I have never known anyone who hacked into their school's computer system and changed their grade. So Dustin's girlfriend doing it, is pretty clearly a Ferris Bueller reference (and yes I know he changed his attendance record).

And possibly refrencing Brodrick's earlier acting role in WarGames. He changes his grade and his girlfriend's grade. 

[For Cereals]

On 5/27/2022 at 6:44 PM, BlackberryJam said:

I always feel like this show is portraying the 80s from the POV of someone who learned about the 80s from watching TV and not from someone who actually grew up in the 80s. It’s frustrating. 

This!  I like the nostalgia but when TPTB make these shows, the entire decade gets thrown in.

[azshadowwalker]

I am finding everyone and everything about this show tiresome and ridiculous. The nostalgia element isn't even holding me anymore because everyone is so damned annoying. I mean, it's been heading this direction each season for me. The first one was fun, but it's progressively weaker each season. They're officially at bad now. 

Edited May 31, 2022 by azshadowwalker

[cloeymoon]

On 5/27/2022 at 9:35 PM, BlackberryJam said:

Agyle’s wig is terrible. He’s like an extra from a Cheech and Chong film.

It’s like a parade of bad wigs this season! Joyce, Jonathan, El and Eddie. Though it seems that may be Argyles own hair. 

Edited May 31, 2022 by cloeymoon

[methodwriter85]

3 hours ago, For Cereals said:

This!  I like the nostalgia but when TPTB make these shows, the entire decade gets thrown in.

As someone who has extensively studied 1980's yearbooks, I think the show has done an okay job of showing how fashion progressed through the decade. The first season, set in 1983, was pretty heavy on the earth tones which was true of actual 1983. By 1986, you really start seeing the pastels popping in and I think the show is reflecting that pretty well. Some of the really big hair and neon though is more reflective of 1987-1989, though. Here's a good primer:

I remember going through a 1986 yearbook once and being surprised at how well Pretty in Pink depicted actual high school fashion, especially when it came to prom. (Save for Andie's dress which was intentionally made to stand out as different.) Miami Vice hit HARD in 1985-1986.

[Aryanna]

I've seen a fair amount of 80s movies and I get the feeling that ST is made by people who have seen those movies too. Rather than lived through the 80s. When making a period piece, it's the small things that matter. Like when I watch A Christmas Story it feels like the 1940s even though that was before my time and I would have no way of knowing. But little touches like them wearing sweaters in the house because central heat wasn't a thing in the 1940s makes it feel authentic. 

We have Robin who is gay but I feel like if Will is gsy too then that would be overkill for the time period. It's like when a movie takes place in the past and there's a white character who displays modern sensibilities toward black characters that you know weren't common for the time. It comes across as the white screenwriter trying to make themselves feel better or absolve themselves of any guilt from the past.

It's the same as when I watched a show a few years back called The Alienist. It's supposed to take place in the 1890s but some of the characters had 21st century sensibilities. That kind of thing takes me out of the show.

[eleanorofaquitaine]

It's not overkill to have two gay characters. Most communities - even small ones - have more than one LGBTQ+ resident (even if they are not out to the rest of the world). As I said in another thread, there was a lot of homophobia in the era and what would be overkill is to have everyone be as accepting of LGBTQ+ characters as Steve was. But the fact that at least two gay people live in a community is not unrealistic. 

[Taryn74]

9 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

Some of the really big hair and neon though is more reflective of 1987-1989, though. Here's a good primer:

That video was everything. Thanks for sharing.

[yesandno]

1 hour ago, Aryanna said:

We have Robin who is gay but I feel like if Will is gsy too then that would be overkill for the time period. It's like when a movie takes place in the past and there's a white character who displays modern sensibilities toward black characters that you know weren't common for the time. It comes across as the white screenwriter trying to make themselves feel better or absolve themselves of any guilt from the past.

It's the same as when I watched a show a few years back called The Alienist. It's supposed to take place in the 1890s but some of the characters had 21st century sensibilities. That kind of thing takes me out of the show.

There have been gay people since the beginning of time, I went to high school in the 80's and knew more than a couple gay people, had a gay teacher. It's not unrealistic at all.

[Aryanna]

4 hours ago, eleanorofaquitaine said:

It's not overkill to have two gay characters. Most communities - even small ones - have more than one LGBTQ+ resident (even if they are not out to the rest of the world). As I said in another thread, there was a lot of homophobia in the era and what would be overkill is to have everyone be as accepting of LGBTQ+ characters as Steve was. But the fact that at least two gay people live in a community is not unrealistic. 

Maybe not for 2022. But for 1986 it feels inauthentic and inaccurate that one group of friends has two gay people. 

[DearEvette]

19 minutes ago, Aryanna said:

Maybe not for 2022. But for 1986 it feels inauthentic and inaccurate that one group of friends has two gay people. 

I am sure this isn't what you mean, but the way this is worded makes it sound like there are more gay people in 2022 than there were in 1986.

There are probably more out gay people now than then so that people are more aware of who is gay or bi.  But I can say in my own experience that it was truly accurate and authentic for there to be two gay people in one friend group in the mid-80s.  One of my male BFFs that was part of our group we knew was low key gay.  He never said, no one ever said but we knew.  And of course it was true.  He is out and married now.

One of our other friends -- same friend group -- was a major ladies man and playa, playa.  Come to find out years later after we were all grown and gone that he was gay as well.  I had reconnected with him over facebook after we'd lost touch and learned that he knew he was gay at the time when we were teenagers, he was deathly afraid to admit it or to even have people silently speculate like we did with our other friend.  He never came back home (we lived in New York as kids) but moved to Chicago after college and we all found out from his sister that he gay and had a boyfriend in Chicago. 

So from my own anecdotal personal experience, what they are doing with Robin and Will feels familiar.  Right now on the show we know Robin is gay but only, irrc,  Steve knows for sure.  No one else knows.  And Will is possibly gay and at this point only he knows (or maybe he is struggling to admit it).  But it isnt unrealistic that nobody in their friend group may know that about them at this time in their lives.

[CarpeFelis]

On 5/29/2022 at 10:27 AM, eleanorofaquitaine said:

Re the 80s fashion - some of it is over the top but I remember neon's hey day as being more 1985-ish. Still, I am sure people were wearing it in '86.

I went on a spring ski trip in 1990. I remember it well because I met my husband there. And people were wearing a lot of neon.

As to El being a “snitch”: she wasn’t. It was just another nasty thing Angela made up as an excuse to torment her. The teacher was pretty observant and it wasn’t hard at all to tell that Angela was the ringleader, especially after her smug expressions in class when she was putting El down during her presentation.

[tennisgurl]

Having grown up in a small town in Indiana (albeit in the 00s not the 80s) that was even smaller than Hawkins, I can guarantee that there are more than two gay people in Hawkins in the 80s, even within the same monster hunting circle. I know tons of people I grew up with who came out years later, who dated members of the opposite sex to try and seem more "normal" or because they hadn't figured themselves out yet, but there were quite a lot of people even in my graduating class of about 100. Some people were already out in high school, some people it took years, but they were certainly there. It makes complete sense to me that Hawkins would have LGBTQ people around, just people who aren't out in a time and place that was not friendly. I don't know why people act like LGBTQ people were invented in 1994 and didn't exist before then or act like they only live in costal states. 

Edited June 6, 2022 by tennisgurl

[CarpeFelis]

14 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

As someone who has extensively studied 1980's yearbooks, I think the show has done an okay job of showing how fashion progressed through the decade. The first season, set in 1983, was pretty heavy on the earth tones which was true of actual 1983. By 1986, you really start seeing the pastels popping in and I think the show is reflecting that pretty well. Some of the really big hair and neon though is more reflective of 1987-1989, though.

This. I was in my 20s in the ‘80s and remember it well. People who didn’t live through the ‘80s tend to think the entire decade was shoulder pads, acid wash reverse silhouette jeans, neon, Michael Jackson-style military jackets, etc. But really during the first few years of the decade, fashion was still basically ‘70s. I recall commenters on The Americans complaining that they didn’t see any ‘80s fashion at the beginning of that series, but it started out set in 1981, so they were actually period correct.

Edited May 31, 2022 by CarpeFelis
typo

[CarpeFelis]

On 5/28/2022 at 4:06 PM, SnapHappy said:

Karen's headband may have a bit too Olivia try hard, but her crunchy, blonde permed-to-within-an-inch-of-it's-life hairdo was dead accurate for that year! 

All the ladies then were doing Jazzercise, so workout wear and the appropriate hair & makeup were required! 

Can confirm that, right down to the Jazzercise, and I had the ‘80s perm though not blonde. But I was a 20-something, not Karen’s age.

[eleanorofaquitaine]

1 hour ago, Aryanna said:

Maybe not for 2022. But for 1986 it feels inauthentic and inaccurate that one group of friends has two gay people. 

I have to agree that this seems to imply that you think there are more LGBTQ+ people now than there were in the 80s and that's just... not how it works.

I mean, putting aside the fact that Robin isn't really a part of the Will/Mike/Lucas/Dustin "friend group," it was also not uncommon for people in the 80s - or now - who generally felt a little alienated from the culture at large to become friends with each other.  So yes, gay people were actually friends with each other in the 80s, just like they are now.

It's one thing to say that it would be unlikely to have two out people in the 80s, well, that's worth debating. But the mere existence of more than one LGBTQ+ character? No. LGBTQ+ people have existed in American communities since there have been American communities, and that means in the 1980s.

[Cranberry]

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

Having grown up in a small town in Indiana (albeit in the 00s not the 80s) that was even smaller than Hawkins, I can guarantee that there are more than two gay people in Hawkins in the 80s, even within the same monster hunting circle.

Yep. I attended a small city high school in the late '90s, and there was only one out queer girl in my entire school (she was bisexual, and she got a lot of shit for it). However, four people in my friend group alone came out as gay during college, and I know of many more former classmates who later came out as queer. It's completely believable to me that one large friend group could have two gay people in it.

14 minutes ago, eleanorofaquitaine said:

I mean, putting aside the fact that Robin isn't really a part of the Will/Mike/Lucas/Dustin "friend group," it was also not uncommon for people in the 80s - or now - who generally felt a little alienated from the culture at large to become friends with each other.  So yes, gay people were actually friends with each other in the 80s, just like they are now.

I was just starting to type something similar when you posted! LGBT+ people are drawn to each other even when everyone's closeted.

I'd be surprised if Robin and Will were both out and proud and surrounded by a big group of supportive allies in the mid '80s, but they're not. They're both closeted. Of all the kids, literally only Steve knows about Robin. He's pretty open-minded for the time, but he's also someone who went through a near-death experience with his friend, which tends to bond people! For that reason, I wouldn't even find it unbelievable if others in the group end up accepting her almost as easily. They have bigger things to worry about.