S02.E06: Do Not Resuscitate

[Trini]

As Ryan Wilder's Kryptonite wound grows more severe, it hinders Batwoman's ability to protect Gotham. Growing interest in reproducing the serum from the Desert Rose puts Mary's and Commander Kane's lives in danger. Meanwhile, Alice's reunion with a fellow Coryana inhabitant presents unexpected complications.

Holly Dale directed the episode written by Caroline Dries and Daphne Miles.

Airdate: 2/28/2021

 

[scarynikki12]

I do NOT enjoy seeing my Mary in harm’s way so this better not become a habit show. She does need some training to resist telling all the secrets ever. 

Ooooh Amygdala! I haven’t seen him in live action before so good pull show.

That kryptonite wound looks even worse and poor Ryan suffering in silence to prove herself.

Ok that blood and guts came off the map super fast when the flame hit them.

Luke finally came around to Ryan’s Batwoman.

Jacob you should fund the clinic, hire licensed doctors, nurses, and staff and have Mary be the administrator while she finishes med school instead of shutting it down.

Alice’s face swapping talents come in handy yet again. And I’m still enjoying her and Ocean.

The Desert Rose being the only thing that can heal Ryan’s kryptonite wound is a good way to connect to Alice’s story. Looking forward to the inevitable confrontation. 

[Jediknight]

Insurance not covering something that it should, healthcare being too expensive, bad treatment of mental health, and a cancer patient getting no treatment?  It's the most realistic episode of Batwoman ever.

This episode shows the huge problem with no crossovers thanks to COVID.  The second that Luke finds out about Ryan having kryptonite poisoning, he would call Supergirl.  No way would he not have a contact number for her.  Even a quick mention like "I called Supergirl, and she can't find anything on how to fix it."

Ryan's ex was in the wrong.  Ryan went to jail for her.  She holds no high ground over Ryan, so she can stop with apologizing being enough and getting mad at Ryan for the device.

[cambridgeguy]

10 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

Jacob you should fund the clinic, hire licensed doctors, nurses, and staff and have Mary be the administrator while she finishes med school instead of shutting it down.

Isn't Mary an heiress?  She can fund everything herself, including those final years in med school.

And I know she was in a rush but hopefully Sophie had the foresight to take a photo of that map.

[scarynikki12]

Just now, cambridgeguy said:

Isn't Mary an heiress?  She can fund everything herself, including those final years in med school.

She could (and maybe she will as a way to keep it open) but I want Jacob to do it.

[Chicago Redshirt]

I am scared that we are heading toward a Ryan-Sophie romance, y'all, and I am not here for it.

The one highlight of her being around was Ryan calling her Crow-phie.

But once again, Sophie is full of fail.

There was literally no reason for Sophie to involve Ryan in this whole mess. As long as you're going to violate someone's rights, there are probably easier ways that don't involve relying on a woman you can't necessarily trust. Indeed, Sophie should not really have a clue that Ryan and Angelique are back together as far as I can recall. 

There was literally no reason why Sophie brought the map to the rescue attempt, or why she didn't copy it before taking it someplace where it could possibly be stolen from her. 

And of course, it ultimately is Sophie's fault that they don't have the map anymore.

In other news, Team Bat needs to get some damn panic buttons and codewords and such. Mary needs some basic self-defense training, although I guess one can't expect it to do much good if literal Bat-villains are going to hold her hostage on a biweekly basis. On the other hand, there re probably not too many people who can say they've survived encounters with two Batvillains, so she has that going for her.

I was rooting for the show to kill off Jake or Sophie, but no joy.

I suppose we need to just handwave how the hell the people traced the map to Mary's clinic.

[Lantern7]

Looks like most of the cast took an L this week. Well, except for Alice and Ocean, perhaps. Also, for any viewers getting Superman III flashbacks when Ryan was going over the composition of Kryptonite.

1 hour ago, scarynikki12 said:

Ok that blood and guts came off the map super fast when the flame hit them.

It's not too messed up the theme from Bonanza played in my mind as the flames took out the "paint," is it?

1 hour ago, Jediknight said:

This episode shows the huge problem with no crossovers thanks to COVID.  The second that Luke finds out about Ryan having kryptonite poisoning, he would call Supergirl.  No way would he not have a contact number for her.  Even a quick mention like "I called Supergirl, and she can't find anything on how to fix it."

I'm giving up trying to interconnect the shows right now. Come to think of it, there hasn't been much interaction since CoIE. Or maybe I should stop questioning why no one pops up in Freeland to give Black Lightning a hand.

[possibilities]

1 hour ago, scarynikki12 said:

She could (and maybe she will as a way to keep it open) but I want Jacob to do it.

She has been funding it, I thought. Making it above ground and not a secret would make it harder for her to protect and serve closet superheroes, though.

Why did they bring the REAL map and not a fake?????? Isn't that the first law of defeating demented hostage-takers? Use a fake to pacify them til you can regain control? Why did Sophie go alone, for that matter? Doesn't she have the entire Crow paramilitary infrastructureat her command?

 

But I actually liked this episode more than most this season, so I guess they figured they don't have to sweat the common sense.

[Primal Slayer]

I found this episode to be fairly boring. 

1 hour ago, Jediknight said:

This episode shows the huge problem with no crossovers thanks to COVID.  The second that Luke finds out about Ryan having kryptonite poisoning, he would call Supergirl.  No way would he not have a contact number for her.  Even a quick mention like "I called Supergirl, and she can't find anything on how to fix it."

Yeah...they still could bring up talking to the Supergirl crew or having them facetime...SOMETHING. I have a feeling that even if they could do crossovers they likely wouldnt. It's weird that Kryptonite plays such a huge part of a bat-show then it does in a Super show.

[Twilight Man]

1 hour ago, scarynikki12 said:

Ooooh Amygdala! I haven’t seen him in live action before so good pull show.

They had him in one episode of "Gotham" back in the second season.

Remember that scene in "Dark Knight" where "Tiny" Lister takes the remote from the officer and tosses it out the window???

 "Tiny" Lister was actually portraying Amygdala.         You can see "the scar" on the side of his forehead.

He has a very sparse history in the comics.   Not much to say, he's a big huge guy who beats heroes up.

Doctors were able to treat him "for a time" and he moved to Bludhaven and coincidently became a boarder

at the same building that Dick Grayson lived at.   That was several years ago, before the reboot.

He hasn't been used much post reboot.

They even have an action figure of him.   It's very hard to find and purchase.

[Diapason Untuned]

Last week it was the Crows, this week it's Hamilton Dynamics. It is so awesome that this season of Batwoman is taking the opportunity to examine the shady elements in Gotham that the last season didn't really get into.

Like the Crows, the corruption in Hamilton Dynamics flows downwards from the top. Good intentions aside, the way leaders operate and the culture they create effects the people below and the people they have to interact with.

Luke and Ryan continue to impress me, I like how their relationship is developing at its own pace.

Sophie failing real badly today, she messes up Ryan's relationship by blackmailing her into snitching and then she can't even do her illegal wiretapping properly. I really, really hope that she managed to take a pic of the map though.

54 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

I'm giving up trying to interconnect the shows right now. Come to think of it, there hasn't been much interaction since CoIE. Or maybe I should stop questioning why no one pops up in Freeland to give Black Lightning a hand.

I understand why shows would want to remain separate to do their own thing, but they can at least come up with plots that don't make me ask "Why don't you call Supergirl or the Flash?" Come to think of it, have they even briefed Ryan on any of this stuff as of yet?

[Chicago Redshirt]

I mean, if I got shot with a Kryptonite bullet and I had at least one friend who was a billionaire you best believe that there would be ads placed in Catco and the Daily Planet: saying "Dear Superman and Supergirl, I got hit with a piece of your stupid radioactive planet and now I've got a crazy festering wound. Please send help. Love, Chicago Redshirt."

 

[Trini]

Figured Angelique would be gone one way or another, but didn't think it'd be so soon. But she's probably coming back at some point, because she's dealing that drug everyone's trying to stop.

I get Ryan's reasoning for not telling Luke right away, but you can't be Batwoman if you're dead!

Supposedly, the only cure for Ryan's infection is the Desert Rose? I hope not. It just feels a little too out there that it can cure everything AND extraterrestrial radiation.

It's one way to get the storylines to converge on Coryana, but I just feel like once we get everyone there all this build up is not going to pay off. Kate's probably not going to be found there.

3 hours ago, Jediknight said:

... This episode shows the huge problem with no crossovers thanks to COVID.  The second that Luke finds out about Ryan having kryptonite poisoning, he would call Supergirl.  No way would he not have a contact number for her.  Even a quick mention like "I called Supergirl, and she can't find anything on how to fix it."  ...

The thing is - are we sure Luke even knows about the other heroes, and how to contact them, and that's there's enough of a relationship to ask for help? Because that hasn't been clearly established; Kate was the only one to interact with the rest of the proto-Justice League in the last crossover. Although, they did establish last season that he knows about Superman (not sure about Clark Kent).

Hamilton Dyanmics being shady; wish they had done more with this and Mama Hamilton last season. Aw man, Mary's clinic is turning into STAR Labs 2.0 AKA the least secure facility EVER. Maybe it's a good thing Jacob is shutting it down? Nah - I hope she gets that back at some point. I did like that we got some Mary/Jacob scenes. That particular relationship was ignored before.

The entire thing with the map was stupid. Mary telling the crazy kidnapper about Coryana/the Desert Rose/the map; Ocean and Alice letting Sophie get away with it; Sophie actually bringing it to Crazy Kidnapper; Batwoman letting shady doctors get away with it. I really, really hope that they reveal that Sophie didn't bring the real map next week.

So Alice is clearly psycho, but Ocean is into it anyway? Maybe they really are meant to be together! I will enjoy this eye candy while it lasts.

[BeautifulFlower]

10 hours ago, Diapason Untuned said:

 

Sophie failing real badly today, she messes up Ryan's relationship by blackmailing her into snitching and then she can't even do her illegal wiretapping properly. I really, really hope that she managed to take a pic of the map though.

 

Sophie didn't design the advice that tapped the phone. She looked disappointed when Angelique revealed she found out about it. Anway, Ryan and Angelique's relationship was doomed anyway. I get she cares for her, but Ryan shouldn't have stayed in a relationship a drug dealer. The same drug dealer who caused Ryan to serve jail time. No, Ryan needs to stay away from Angelique.

11 hours ago, possibilities said:

She has been funding it, I thought. Making it above ground and not a secret would make it harder for her to protect and serve closet superheroes, though.

 

 

 

Actually, if the clinic was legal in the first place, Mary wouldn't be operating on patients at all. She is not licensed yet. So if a superhero got hurt, she could still help them in secret.

[tennisgurl]

Not my favorite episode this season, but I am glad that they are diving more into the sketchier aspects of Gotham with the corruption of the Crows and Hamilton Dynamics, as well as the relationship between Jacob and Mary which I have always thought had a lot of underused potential. I am glad that we are building their relationship more, but it sucks that it has taken a bad turn. I can kind of get where Jacob is coming from, as he is probably worried about Mary getting into trouble and so soon after losing Kate and everything with Alice, but there has to be a better way to handle this than just telling Mary to shut everything down. Aren't they super rich, cant they fund the clinic and hire some doctors and let Mary supervise until she finishes school? In fact, is Mary still even IN medical school anymore? How does she find the time? 

The bad guy was interested, its hard to even call him the bad guy, he was really just a pawn for the corrupt doctors who made him so unstable. The actor did a pretty good job, and I am curious where Hamilton Dynamics goes from here. Will they explore these corrupt doctors more, or is this kind of it for them? 

This episode was kind of a downer in general. They managed to save Mary and Jacob, but they lost the painting, Mary and Jacob are in a bad place, as are Ryan and Angelique, Ryan is still hurt, and Jacob wants Mary to shut down her clinic. The only people that really "won" were Alice and Ocean who managed to stay one step ahead of the island people. That and Ryan and Luke finally reaching an understanding and Luke really accepting her as Batwoman and Ryan trying to get help for her festering space injury, which was nice to see. 

A real string of misses for Sophie, I have never been that impressed by Sophie's competence but she has been really flailing since Kate disappeared. Why not bring another fake painting, don't bring the only clue you have to where the killer is. She also apparently really messed things up with Ryan and Angelique, but I cant be too mad about that. Ryan went to jail because of her, and even if she is clean now, she is still dealing drugs and is in bed with some really sketchy people, this is not a healthy relationship to rekindle, even if Ryan still cares about her. She can do a lot better, even if I am guessing that Angelique isn't gone for good. 

So did Kate not leave Supergirls number for Luke in case of emergency? I get that they don't want to tie this show into the other shows too much and are hampered by COVID restrictions to do more of a crossover, but I would at least like them to mention that Kate happened to be buddies with one of the two Kryptonians that live on this planet and might know what is going on with her injury. Just a comment about how they tried to get in touch with her or they don't know how to find her would be enough. 

I like Alice and Ocean, he seems to admire her special brand of crazy. I also like that Ryan was understandably pissed at everyone being alright with working with Alice, I know that they need Alice right now (and the writers don't want to get rid of her) but I don't blame Ryan for getting annoyed that everyone is working with the women who killed her mom. 

[Proteus]

There's no way I believe Ryan & Angelique are done for good. Angelique is easily redeemable.

Every week I dislike Sophie more & more.

Ocean & Alice were fun.

[Loandbehold]

Is Jacob an alien? The man's been tased, knifed, jack-knifed by a truck, kidnapped twice, pistol-whipped (I think that happened) all in the last few episodes. I don't even like the guy and I'm feeling sorry for him. Yet, he just gets up and has no internal bleeding (I'm not sure if he there are any outward signs of bruising). Look, if they want to get rid of the guy, go for it. If the only way to do it is to decapitate him, I say fire up the damn chainsaw. But, if not, then the next time he is run over by a 20-ton bulldozer, I don't want to see him pop up like he's from a Warner Brothers cartoon. 

Someone with a lot more knowledge of DC comics will have to explain to me the role of the Crows. Are they a private security company? If so, who is paying for them to protect Gotham? If it's being financed all by Jacob, how come the GCPD and the DA's office never complained about them interfering in criminal cases? Is Oswald Cobblepot the Mayor? Has Jacob bribed him? Admittedly, that would explain a lot. 

[mrspidey]

I swear, Jacob Kane shrugs off stab wounds like other people shrug off scratches....

*get's stabbed twice in a row.

"Yeah, whatever. So what's with this secret clinic thing, huh?"

 

Edited March 1, 2021 by mrspidey

[Trini]

43 minutes ago, Loandbehold said:

Someone with a lot more knowledge of DC comics will have to explain to me the role of the Crows. Are they a private security company? If so, who is paying for them to protect Gotham? If it's being financed all by Jacob, how come the GCPD and the DA's office never complained about them interfering in criminal cases? Is Oswald Cobblepot the Mayor? Has Jacob bribed him? Admittedly, that would explain a lot. 

Pretty sure the Crows were invented for this particular show. It's not from the comics, as far as I know. Yes, they're a private security company... but they act just like the police also, so it's confusing.

[thuganomics85]

This episode was alright, but I felt like it suffered due to it needing to move a lot of stuff forward with a quickness, and the only ways the writers were able to make it work was either by convoluted coincidences, mysteries explaining other mysteries, and; worst of all; characters having to be dumb to make it work.  Not the worst I've seen (man, there are/were times on Arrow or The Flash where I wanted to bang my head against the wall with how dumb they made supposed smart characters act), but noticeable enough to ruin some of the enjoyment here.

I was actually looking forward to seeing more of Mary/Jacob since I felt like there was always more to their relationship; especially after Catherine's death; so I did find their scenes interesting, even if it seems like they are talking in circles or ignoring obvious solutions.  Looking at things from a distance, I can see why Jacob doesn't want Mary to run an underground clinic due to possible legal issues and danger, but with all of his resources, why doesn't he try to propose opening an actual clinic that Mary can possibly run or supervise, until she gets her medical degree?  Or, really, why can't Mary simply do it herself?  Does she have any control of their funds?  I wish they just delved into that some more.  Then again, since it now looks like Hamilton Dynamics is shady as shit as well, we might get a chance!

Apparently the Crowes have some lame ass tech, if Angelique was able to figure out she was being spied on that easily.  Luke could have probably whipped up something more effective in his sleep and with stuff he found at a yard sale!  Wish I could care about this hurting Ryan's relationship, but it might be for the better, since Angelique clearly doesn't seem to want to change, and I don't see a happy ending on the path she is currently on.

Alice and Ocean totally ended up having a relationship on that island, of course!  Still enjoying this duo.

At this point, I just have to believe Kate took all of her superhero contact list with her, because I really don't understand why Luke or Mary wouldn't be ringing up Kara and being like "Hey, Supergirl?  We've got a friend who was shot with a Kryptonite bullet and it isn't going so well.  Do you know anything about it?  Or anyone that might?  Maybe your cousin knows something?  Or what about that weird gang of assassins, flame-throwing drunks, and sorcerers that are zipping around in that time-traveling space ship?  You think they've might have come across this?" over Ryan's issues. 

[MissLucas]

19 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

I am scared that we are heading toward a Ryan-Sophie romance, y'all, and I am not here for it.

Yeah, I got some of these vibes too. So I decided that 'do not resuscitate' should apply to any Crow-Batwoman romances. But Angelique sucks too. 

I hate to say it but Jacob was right, every patient who walks into Mary's clinic ends up a medical experiment. And if she ever screws up and word gets out she could lose her future in the field and a good chunk of her money. 

Alice and Ocean remain the show's power couple - which is entertaining but also worrisome.

[Proteus]

11 minutes ago, MissLucas said:

Yeah, I got some of these vibes too. So I decided that 'do not resuscitate' should apply to any Crow-Batwoman romances. But Angelique sucks too. 

I hate to say it but Jacob was right, every patient who walks into Mary's clinic ends up a medical experiment. And if she ever screws up and word gets out she could lose her future in the field and a good chunk of her money. 

Alice and Ocean remain the show's power couple - which is entertaining but also worrisome.

I can't see Ryan being with Sophie. Sophie is too much of a mess to be with anyone. Especially now that she's obsessed with a character who is gone from the show for good. I think Ryan will be with Angelique.

[TiffanyNichelle]

It hit me this episode that Ryan is the only one who doesn't seem to know she's in a comic book show. She's the only one having real world reactions to things, lol. I swear she wants to quote Zoolander and ask if she's taking crazy pills. Everyone else is like sure, let's work with Alice even though she's a dangerous killer because she's a major character that we have to keep around all season. Or how despite every single thing the Crows have done to Ryan and Lucius Fox, she needs to just suck it up and work with them.

I did not like Ryan's ex so I'm glad they are broken up. She let her go to jail and I guess after a "my bad" and a few nights together it's all good??

I'm not a fan of Alice and her long lost lover story.

Jacob's reaction to Mary's clinic is why none of his kids confide in him.

The search for Kate and the island with the healing flowers and Ryan's infection is coming together in a way that makes sense for him. I wondered why they were doing this kryptonite infection storyline.

Sophie taking the map with her instead of stashing it somewhere safe along the way (hell even lock it on the car) was stupid.

5 hours ago, Trini said:

Pretty sure the Crows were invented for this particular show. It's not from the comics, as far as I know. Yes, they're a private security company... but they act just like the police also, so it's confusing.

That's something that has always bothered me. There's supposed to be a GCPD still, right? In the original crossover they stressed that the Crows were just private security for rich people because Gotham was so dangerous that the police was useless. Instead on this show they act like the cops and Crows are just a nickname for GCPD officers.

[immortalfrieza]

On 2/28/2021 at 8:02 PM, scarynikki12 said:

Ok that blood and guts came off the map super fast when the flame hit them.

And apparently the blood and guts managed to burn away without the map it was on catching fire along with it... somehow.

On 2/28/2021 at 9:14 PM, Chicago Redshirt said:

There was literally no reason for Sophie to involve Ryan in this whole mess. As long as you're going to violate someone's rights, there are probably easier ways that don't involve relying on a woman you can't necessarily trust. Indeed, Sophie should not really have a clue that Ryan and Angelique are back together as far as I can recall.

Yep. if she was remotely competent Sophie could easily have put the spyware on herself, even if for some reason it actually needed to be the worst spyware in the world and thus needed to be literally laying on the phone itself for 30 seconds to infect the phone. On that note, I can't think of any good reason Angelique would suspect Ryan of bugging her phone instead of... well, anyone else, rival drug dealers, cops, some wacko supervillain...

23 hours ago, Diapason Untuned said:

I understand why shows would want to remain separate to do their own thing, but they can at least come up with plots that don't make me ask "Why don't you call Supergirl or the Flash?" Come to think of it, have they even briefed Ryan on any of this stuff as of yet?

The real problem is that the issue just screams at you when it comes to things like this. Had they simply had whatever it is that pierces the Batsuit be something other than Kryptonite we would have no problem here. It could have been even some alien metal or something and still would have been a lot less likely to shove "hey, just call Superman/Supergirl about this!" into everybody's heads. Kryptonite just hangs a big flashing neon sign on the whole thing because it's a distinctly Superman thing.

22 hours ago, Trini said:

Aw man, Mary's clinic is turning into STAR Labs 2.0 AKA the least secure facility EVER.

At least Mary's clinic is... you know, a CLINIC instead of this multi-billion dollar facility with no apparent security whatsoever, or this underground bunker with way too much green that everybody and his mother breaks into on a regular basis.

3 hours ago, TiffanyNichelle said:

That's something that has always bothered me. There's supposed to be a GCPD still, right? In the original crossover they stressed that the Crows were just private security for rich people because Gotham was so dangerous that the police was useless. Instead on this show they act like the cops and Crows are just a nickname for GCPD officers.

They have treated the Crows like the GCPD on this show for the most part. Occasionally there's actual GCPD around but they seem more like just extra bodies than anything and they never actually do anything. Of course, the Crows STILL aren't remotely competent. I suppose it's a step up from Gotham the show where entire precincts were slaughtered on a regular basis.

Edited March 2, 2021 by immortalfrieza

[Lantern7]

On 3/1/2021 at 12:38 PM, Proteus said:

There's no way I believe Ryan & Angelique are done for good. Angelique is easily redeemable.

Well, the Arrowverse has seen plenty of unhealthy relationships . . .

23 hours ago, mrspidey said:

I swear, Jacob Kane shrugs off stab wounds like other people shrug off scratches....

*get's stabbed twice in a row.

"Yeah, whatever. So what's with this secret clinic thing, huh?"

Wasn't Dougray Scott one of the lead contenders to play Wolverine in X-Men before Hugh Jackman got the role?

Edited March 2, 2021 by Lantern7

[quarks]

1. Serious question: why hasn't Mary put Ryan on a top quality health insurance program through the bar? Ryan can't be the only employee, right, even if we can't see this on the show because of Covid filming restrictions? Does the bar just not offer health insurance? If so, why not, given that both Kate and Mary - the supposed owners/managers - are extremely rich, as we were reminded again in this episode? Why am I asking this many questions about health insurance on a comic book show? 

2. Did like the pointed reminder that hospitals/doctors tend to undertreat Black women - especially when it was pretty much immediately followed up by a doctor saying, yeah, that looks kinda bad. Here, have some antibiotics! And now I'm off! I'm not a huge fan of Angelique so far, but she was spot on there.

3. I'm still trying to figure out why that wound only glows green when the plot-appropriate people are looking at it....oh, just answered my own question.

4. That said, now that Team Bat knows that this is a Kryptonite wound leaching radioactivity and pain into Ryan, why aren't they - or indeed, anyone - suggesting, I dunno, REMOVING AT LEAST SOME OF THE KRYPTONITE. Like, I realize that probably wouldn't work in real life, but this is the same show that, again, in this episode alone, had Alice the non-doctor replace someone's face and an unknown doctor remove part of a brain and treat the rest with UV light. I really don't think the idea of trying to dig some of the Kryptonite out of Ryan is all that far off.

5. Also, you get a lab report of someone walking around with high levels of radioactivity IN GOTHAM, a city that has been dealing with weird villains/assassination attempts for years, and your only response is, "Yeah, come back in for another lab report." Seriously, doctor?

6. This wound is really bugging me.

7. And while I'm on this subject, yes, yes, Covid, and yeah, it's not at all clear if either Bruce or Kate left contact information for any of the other superheroes. But. Given that the last episode of Crisis established that at least a couple of the superheroes are fairly well known, and it is kinda mindboggling that no one on Team Bat is even thinking about trying reach out to them. Again, I know, I know, Covid - but they could do a voice recording.

8. I still think Ocean can do much, much better than Alice. 

9. And speaking of Alice, loved Ryan's, "AND YOU CALLED 911, RIGHT?" response to Luke's story.

10. The other great story? Mary explaining the whole Ultimate Antidote plot and then explaining to her father that she didn't say anything because he wouldn't have believed it. Which, fair! Even by the standards of this show, not a very credible story.

11. Gotta love that Jacob's response to hearing that several people in Gotham have no other access to health care is to say, just shut it down anyway, and by love, I of course mean hate. And, honestly, Jacob, while you have a point about Mary not being licensed yet, and I'm more than a little concerned that she didn't notice active, pulsing, green radiation moving around Ryan's wound, she's in at least her second year of med school, right? With only a couple more years to go, and then an internship/residency. Which is to say, it shouldn't take her that long to be licensed. Since this is a comic book show, she can probably do it in two months.

12. So if I followed the painting thing correctly, and I'll be the first to admit I might not have, it was covered in dried human blood which....probably shouldn't have gone up in flames, leaving the painting untouched, with just a lighter?

And now, Sophie!

So, yeah. We are definitely moving into major failure territory here with Sophie, who was just a disaster on so many levels in this episode. Including, but not limited to:

1. Not realizing that her boss had been kidnapped, even though he is a high priority target and even though his car had been involved in a fairly visible accident on streets that the Crows are - allegedly - monitoring as part of this kidnapping.

2. Using a high tech cell phone thingy that was discovered by its target within a few hours, like, Sophie, there's a reason you call in the high tech guys to help with things like this. Bonus negative points for being an unethical and illegal high tech cell phone thingy. 

3. Making a deal that allowed a drug dealer/potential witness to go free, while in pursuit of her own personal goals. This is like the very definition of corruption, Sophie.

4. Spying on said drug dealer and her semi-girlfriend without a warrant.

5. Lying to Ryan - a person who already distrusts her - about her reasons for wanting to track Angelique, further eroding Ryan's trust and willingness to work with her.

6. Not bothering to take a couple of cell phone pictures of this map/painting thing before rushing over to the lab with it.

7. Bringing the actual map/painting instead of a decoy even though she was the one person in the episode with access to a decoy that had been convincing enough to trick her.

8. Going to the lab without backup. (This was almost certainly because of Covid restrictions - editing work can only do so much - and I would usually be able to handwave this by saying that she was in a rush to save people, but.)

9. Failing to save anyone at the lab, forcing Jacob to do some of his own self-saving and a "terminally ill" Ryan to do the rest.

10. Immediately getting defeated by the bad guys, forcing Ryan to give up the painting.

11. Thus helping to doom both Batwomen to CERTAIN DEATH! (Well, ok, neither one of them is going to die, but it's the PRINCIPLE of the thing.)

Ryan, I know Angelique has broken your heart and she's a drug dealer and there's a number of other reasons why she's not exactly the ideal girlfriend, but, take my advice: ignore all the hints that this episode was throwing at you, and focus more on a relationship with Angelique and less on any potential fling with Sophie. I mean, at least Angelique gave you a plant. 

[BeautifulFlower]

11 hours ago, quarks said:

 

And now, Sophie!

So, yeah. We are definitely moving into major failure territory here with Sophie, who was just a disaster on so many levels in this episode. Including, but not limited to:

1. Not realizing that her boss had been kidnapped, even though he is a high priority target and even though his car had been involved in a fairly visible accident on streets that the Crows are - allegedly - monitoring as part of this kidnapping.

2. Using a high tech cell phone thingy that was discovered by its target within a few hours, like, Sophie, there's a reason you call in the high tech guys to help with things like this. Bonus negative points for being an unethical and illegal high tech cell phone thingy. 

3. Making a deal that allowed a drug dealer/potential witness to go free, while in pursuit of her own personal goals. This is like the very definition of corruption, Sophie.

4. Spying on said drug dealer and her semi-girlfriend without a warrant.

5. Lying to Ryan - a person who already distrusts her - about her reasons for wanting to track Angelique, further eroding Ryan's trust and willingness to work with her.

6. Not bothering to take a couple of cell phone pictures of this map/painting thing before rushing over to the lab with it.

7. Bringing the actual map/painting instead of a decoy even though she was the one person in the episode with access to a decoy that had been convincing enough to trick her.

8. Going to the lab without backup. (This was almost certainly because of Covid restrictions - editing work can only do so much - and I would usually be able to handwave this by saying that she was in a rush to save people, but.)

9. Failing to save anyone at the lab, forcing Jacob to do some of his own self-saving and a "terminally ill" Ryan to do the rest.

10. Immediately getting defeated by the bad guys, forcing Ryan to give up the painting.

11. Thus helping to doom both Batwomen to CERTAIN DEATH! (Well, ok, neither one of them is going to die, but it's the PRINCIPLE of the thing.)

Ryan, I know Angelique has broken your heart and she's a drug dealer and there's a number of other reasons why she's not exactly the ideal girlfriend, but, take my advice: ignore all the hints that this episode was throwing at you, and focus more on a relationship with Angelique and less on any potential fling with Sophie. I mean, at least Angelique gave you a plant. 

I have to defend Sophie. She JUST received the actual painting and then got a called about her boss being kidnapped. It was an urgent matter. What did you want her to do? Go to the crows headquarters to get the decoy and then rescue Jacob and Mary? Where's the logic in that? Again, it was an URGENT matter. You literally mentioned how she rushed over to the lab. How can you say that and get mad over her not bringing a decoy?

The only thing Sophie should've done was leave it in the car. But who's to say those people weren't watching her when she got there. If she left it in the car, it would get broken into and taken.

[Stardancer Supreme]

On 2/28/2021 at 10:14 PM, Chicago Redshirt said:

I am scared that we are heading toward a Ryan-Sophie romance, y'all, and I am not here for it.

The one highlight of her being around was Ryan calling her Crow-phie.

But once again, Sophie is full of fail.

There was literally no reason for Sophie to involve Ryan in this whole mess. As long as you're going to violate someone's rights, there are probably easier ways that don't involve relying on a woman you can't necessarily trust. Indeed, Sophie should not really have a clue that Ryan and Angelique are back together as far as I can recall. 

There was literally no reason why Sophie brought the map to the rescue attempt, or why she didn't copy it before taking it someplace where it could possibly be stolen from her. 

And of course, it ultimately is Sophie's fault that they don't have the map anymore.

In other news, Team Bat needs to get some damn panic buttons and codewords and such. Mary needs some basic self-defense training, although I guess one can't expect it to do much good if literal Bat-villains are going to hold her hostage on a biweekly basis. On the other hand, there re probably not too many people who can say they've survived encounters with two Batvillains, so she has that going for her.

I was rooting for the show to kill off Jake or Sophie, but no joy.

I suppose we need to just handwave how the hell the people traced the map to Mary's clinic.

I'm not here for it, either.  Sophie, to be a high level Crow, isn't too bright. Although it was a nice touch for Ryan to have a vocoder in her mask to hide her voice, I feel that Sophie should be able to put 1+1 together to at least suspect that Ryan and Batwoman 2.0 are the same person.  You're hanging around this Black felon who you know went to jail for her girlfriend.  You know this woman has extensive martial arts knowledge (hopefully Ryan didn't get it on Coryana...).  You know the current Batwoman is black.  Sophie just can't connect the dots?  I like her, but damn. I really hate the "good guys are dumb as a bag of burning hair" tropes.

I also don't want her to become romantic with Ryan. Kate is supposed to be the love of Sophie's life, right?  If she gets with Ryan, it will smack of Sophie being in love with the Batwoman Vigilante persona as opposed to the woman in the suit.  Also, Ryan hates Crows, which Sophie is.  No way would she be googly eyed at the woman who represents the worst parts of her life.

 

[quarks]

2 hours ago, BeautifulFlower said:

I have to defend Sophie. She JUST received the actual painting and then got a called about her boss being kidnapped. It was an urgent matter. What did you want her to do? Go to the crows headquarters to get the decoy and then rescue Jacob and Mary? Where's the logic in that? Again, it was an URGENT matter. You literally mentioned how she rushed over to the lab. How can you say that and get mad over her not bringing a decoy?

The only thing Sophie should've done was leave it in the car. But who's to say those people weren't watching her when she got there. If she left it in the car, it would get broken into and taken.

Because she didn't have to go to the Crows headquarters to get that decoy. She easily could have called the Crows during the time that she took to get from wherever Alice and Ocean were to Mary's clinic, and asked someone there to bring the decoy painting to her. She also could have taken that moment to let the Crows know that, hey, their boss had been kidnapped, and arranged to have at least some backup. 

She didn't do any of this, with the result that not only did she fail to save Jacob and Mary (that was all Jacob and Ryan) and managed to get herself captured, she lost the painting. 

This would be bad enough on its own, but Sophie is supposed to be a highly trained security officer - that is, trained to manage/control situations like this, while protecting/rescuing private clients. She failed here.

[Loandbehold]

16 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

Wasn't Dougray Scott one of the lead contenders to play Wolverine in X-Men before Hugh Jackman got the role?

So you're suggesting that he's a method actor and actually had adamantium injected into his body?

I did like the scene at the hospital where we see how black people are treated in these situations. But, I was very impressed by Angelique's drug-dealing employer who has the best health insurance plan possible. I mean, Ryan doesn't have health insurance (bad Mary!) but Angelique just tells the doctor that she has and so he can treat Ryan. That's not how health insurance works. Unless she not only put Ryan on her plan in the 48 hours they have been back together, but got the insurance company to waive the 30-day period before they begin covering the new person. 

I should care why Alice is still on the show without Kate, but I don't. She's such a fun character. Keep her on. Let her work with every other character. Please keep her around. 

[Stardancer Supreme]

I just took Angelique's comment to the doctor to just give her the bill. I'm sure she would pay it in cash.

So Mary is just paying the bare minimum of health insurance for Ryan's job at the bar?  The doctor told Ryan that her insurance wouldn't cover bloodwork.  What is she getting paid? Being Batwoman is clearly a fringe benefit.  

[Trini]

I'm kinda afraid to ask where Alice got a corpse to stand in for Ocean.... Did they find it? Steal it from a morgue? Went out and killed someone??

[AnimeMania]

3 hours ago, Trini said:

I'm kinda afraid to ask where Alice got a corpse to stand in for Ocean.... Did they find it? Steal it from a morgue? Went out and killed someone??

Alice and Ocean killed a number of people at the motel, I am sure one of them could stand in for the body and she could piece together a new face from all the leftover faces.

[possibilities]

Do Our Heroes know Alice is killing and sewing faces on people? The way they give her a pass on killing their loved ones, and stealing faces off others, is really too much to handwave.

Ryan is right that the BatTeam has fucked up loyalties and execrable standards. But then she's in love with Angelique, so... she can't throw too many stones.

[sugarbaker design]

On 3/1/2021 at 12:38 PM, Proteus said:

There's no way I believe Ryan & Angelique are done for good. Angelique is easily redeemable.

Everyone's redeemable in Gotham.  Alice has murdered countless people and is now a romantic heroine.

[Trini]

So now that Alice knows that Safiyah erased her memories, can she stop believing what she says? I've always thought that Safiyah doesn't actually have Kate, and I just know that the episode is coming (my spec not spoilers) where everyone ends up on the island and Kate won't be there in any case.

I don't mind the search for Kate as an arc for the season, but Coryana just feels like a dead end/red herring to me; so it's like a waste of time.

[Loandbehold]

20 hours ago, Trini said:

So now that Alice knows that Safiyah erased her memories, can she stop believing what she says? I've always thought that Safiyah doesn't actually have Kate, and I just know that the episode is coming (my spec not spoilers) where everyone ends up on the island and Kate won't be there in any case.

Kate may not be there, but there's a chance we'll see a polar bear. Maybe a smoke monster. 

[John Potts]

Jake is going to have to get a counter in his office saying "7 Days without being kidnapped!" that he sadly resets to 0 - that's twice in 2 episodes he's been abducted! Also, not great for the guy who is tasked with protecting the people (well, the rich people) of Gotham from harm if he can't protect himself.

On 3/1/2021 at 2:02 AM, scarynikki12 said:

Jacob you should fund the clinic, hire licensed doctors, nurses, and staff and have Mary be the administrator while she finishes med school instead of shutting it down.

Exactly. Call it the Catherine Hamilton Kane Memorial Clinic to honour your wife to make you both feel better and maybe build some bridges with the daughter you still have?

On 3/1/2021 at 8:29 PM, thuganomics85 said:

Apparently the Crows have some lame ass tech, if Angelique was able to figure out she was being spied on that easily.  Luke could have probably whipped up something more effective in his sleep and with stuff he found at a yard sale!

Probably true, but underestimating the paranoia of criminals is probably consistent in law enforcement (real and fictional).

On 3/2/2021 at 5:53 AM, quarks said:

2. Did like the pointed reminder that hospitals/doctors tend to undertreat Black women - especially when it was pretty much immediately followed up by a doctor saying, yeah, that looks kinda bad. Here, have some antibiotics! And now I'm off! I'm not a huge fan of Angelique so far, but she was spot on there.

While that's true, she called the Doctor away from somebody who was coding (if TV dramas have taught me anything, that means critical) at the time. Ryan could still walk (just about) so wasn't in as dire need.

On 3/3/2021 at 11:14 AM, possibilities said:

Do Our Heroes know Alice is killing and sewing faces on people?

If they don't have any lines, they don't count as people!

* Only semi-official because presumably it needs to operate like Dr Nick's Clinic - "You don't stitch and we don't snitch!"