S04.E06: Terra Nullius

[AZChristian]

13 minutes ago, benteen said:

Sorry, Di, "Mummy" doesn't really do the whole compassion thing.  If you want cold stare, harsh judgment and side-eyes, Elizabeth can do that in bunches!

I thought her calling the Queen "Mama" with the talking baby-doll pronunciation was weird.  Didn't the upper crust call their parents "Ma-MAH" and "Pa-PAH"?

[Roseanna]

53 minutes ago, benteen said:

Diana's fit in Australia

You mean "I must see my son first"? I believe that was "artistic license" for they hardly changed the program that was announced to the Australians. If Diana protested, she did it at home.

It's well-known that she demanded that their son would come along and the Queen finally allowed William even travel in the same plane (which the heir and his heir don't normally do). 

Some have noticed how Charles talked ill about Diana to Camilla by phone, and of course he shouldn't have done it for it was gross disloyalty towards her wife. But he was at least half right by saying that his wife couldn't handle even the simplest task. Although Diana couldn't do anything for it that she couldn't climb in the heat, she hadn't done her schoolwork (or the staff had neglected to brief her) in the first press conference, remembered names of places wrong and Charles had to whisper her the right ones. But maybe that was "artististic license" too in order to show how she began to blossom after the vacation?    

[Umbelina]

52 minutes ago, Roseanna said:

 Although Diana couldn't do anything for it that she couldn't climb in the heat,

According to that link I posted in here a while ago, Diana didn't stop climbing because of the heat.  The dress wasn't working in that wind, it was flying apart and up and she couldn't keep the dress together.  So it was either flash the world's cameras or stop the climb.

That article seemed quite sure, and if it was true, it's odd that they didn't just say it, that basically Diana was trying to avoid an even worse photo than the see-thru preschool dress in the light.

[Conotocarious]

I have to disagree that Emma Corrin is too simpering as Princess Diana. I am absolutely loving her performance and even though from certain angles facially she doesn’t resemble Diana from others (particularly the profile) she looks so much like her and sounds so much like her I start to get chills while watching. I think her casting and performance are extraordinary. Same with Josh O’Connor as Charles. I enjoy the episodes featuring them the most by far.

[Roseanna]

17 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

According to that link I posted in here a while ago, Diana didn't stop climbing because of the heat.  The dress wasn't working in that wind, it was flying apart and up and she couldn't keep the dress together.  So it was either flash the world's cameras or stop the climb.

That article seemed quite sure, and if it was true, it's odd that they didn't just say it, that basically Diana was trying to avoid an even worse photo than the see-thru preschool dress in the light.

Interesting because I initially thought that it was madness to wear a dress when climbing and that she should have had pantsuit. 

[Umbelina]

6 minutes ago, Roseanna said:

Interesting because I initially thought that it was madness to wear a dress when climbing and that she should have had pantsuit. 

I assume it was much like The Queen's trip, in that the palace or establishment chose her clothes, but I am not sure of that.

[bijoux]

45 minutes ago, Conotocarious said:

I have to disagree that Emma Corrin is too simpering as Princess Diana. I am absolutely loving her performance and even though from certain angles facially she doesn’t resemble Diana from others (particularly the profile) she looks so much like her and sounds so much like her I start to get chills while watching. I think her casting and performance are extraordinary. Same with Josh O’Connor as Charles. I enjoy the episodes featuring them the most by far.

Josh O’Connor looked exactly like Charles to me when they were shown on TV during that disasterous interview* and there was a profile shot of Emma Corrin in the episode that made me go whoa. 

*Does anyone have either recollections or evidence that Diana was this much of a disaster during it? Because that was BAD. 

[Conotocarious]

1 minute ago, bijoux said:

Josh O’Connor looked exactly like Charles to me when they were shown on TV during that disasterous interview* and there was a profile shot of Emma Corrin in the episode that made me go whoa. 

*Does anyone have either recollections or evidence that Diana was this much of a disaster during it? Because that was BAD. 

I think that was episode three and one of the profile shots that made me get the chills was one where she’s reading the fan letters that have been carted in for her. 

I know it’s not just us, my husband who watched episode three last night (he’s a couple behind me) stopped the episode to remark on it to me. 

[bijoux]

16 minutes ago, Conotocarious said:

I think that was episode three and one of the profile shots that made me get the chills was one where she’s reading the fan letters that have been carted in for her. 

I know it’s not just us, my husband who watched episode three last night (he’s a couple behind me) stopped the episode to remark on it to me. 

It was definitely this episode for me. It was one of the shots from them being out and about greeting crowds. 

[Conotocarious]

1 hour ago, bijoux said:

It was definitely this episode for me. It was one of the shots from them being out and about greeting crowds. 

That shot from the crowd greeting! I know exactly what you are talking about. You are right! It was absolutely uncanny. 

[kaygeeret]

On 11/16/2020 at 7:59 PM, Umbelina said:

I'm not sure about that.

Isn't it part of the Queen's duty to ensure the future King is emotionally stable enough to take over when she dies?  In addition, that the future Queen be both reasonably happy, trained, and able to raise healthy children who will be the future of the monarchy?

She, above all people presently alive, should know that training the future King and Queen is one of her primary duties, and also to understand the challenges that will face them both.  She should also be concerned about publicity.  She's been trying to keep that (IMO ridiculous) monarchy going for most of her adult life.  Does she only care about it until her life ends, or does she wish it to continue?

I'm not so sure.

Admittedly my impressions are formed by historical fiction and biographies, as well as reading Georgette Heyer.  So....I could be wrong.

I genuinely believed the aristocratic children were largely raised by nannys, tutors  and others, not really by parents.

The parental unit was forged thru dynastic, financial or political concerns.  The famous "heir and the spare" referred to the main responsibility of aristocratic parents.  Pop out two kids (boys) whose parentage is undisputed and then both parents are free to please themselves with other partners....

PROVIDED, no scandal is caused.  If a scandal arises then, of course all sorts of judgement is rained on the person's head.

Charles and Diana were raised in that milieu.

They were both emotionally stunted and Diana was clearly mentally ill on some level.  Charles had been raised to a standard none of us can imagine.  While his parents clearly didn't care for him, everyone else pretty much did what he wanted.

 

[Megan]

As others have mentioned the fact that they never address, other than saying Diana is so young and immature, that Charles and Camilla are in their 30's! They are both such assholes. Diana is only 20. She can't blame her youth forever but the treatment of her from the get go sets up the failures of the future.

These people create all their own problems and could fix most of them fairly easily but are all so far up their own asses that they will not.

I also think this is one of the few times that the entertainment version of a person is less attractive than their real counterpart. Diana had the awful 80's hair and fashion but was much prettier than this actress.

Edited November 19, 2020 by Megan

[swanpride]

I disagree...I actually think that the actress looks better than Diana, whose only truly beautiful feature were her eyes. Diana had the typical englisch nose and her chin was fairly big (though not as big as Camilla). If you just go by looks, I wouldn't have called her a beauty, what she mostly had was charisma.

[Umbelina]

4 minutes ago, swanpride said:

I disagree...I actually think that the actress looks better than Diana, whose only truly beautiful feature were her eyes. Diana had the typical englisch nose and her chin was fairly big (though not as big as Camilla). If you just go by looks, I wouldn't have called her a beauty, what she mostly had was charisma.

She also had an abundance of charm, and long legs, beautiful skin, but yeah, I never thought it was her looks that won people over.  

[bijoux]

I think what most works about the actress's looks for me personally is that she has a baby face. Diana didn't really, but I feel this distinction works really well here because it's a constant reminder of her youth. 

[swanpride]

Well, young Diana did, but the Diana which is most remembered had lost all her baby fat through age and bulimia already. The actress works mostly because she has the right eyes, and she manages to copy the typical Diana look.

[PRgal]

21 hours ago, AZChristian said:

I thought her calling the Queen "Mama" with the talking baby-doll pronunciation was weird.  Didn't the upper crust call their parents "Ma-MAH" and "Pa-PAH"?

The Queen and Margaret called their mom, “Mummy,” but their father was “Pah-PAH.”  Same with the Queen’s children.   

Edited November 19, 2020 by PRgal

[BitterApple]

10 hours ago, swanpride said:

I disagree...I actually think that the actress looks better than Diana, whose only truly beautiful feature were her eyes. Diana had the typical englisch nose and her chin was fairly big (though not as big as Camilla). If you just go by looks, I wouldn't have called her a beauty, what she mostly had was charisma.

I agree. For me, Diana is a lot like Jackie Kennedy. Charm, style and poise were the major contributing factors to their appeal. I think Diana had gorgeous eyes, but wasn't a classic beauty like a Grace Kelly. 

[Domenicholas]

Damn. The Queen was more sympathetic to the guy who broke into her house.

[methodwriter85]

5 hours ago, Domenicholas said:

Damn. The Queen was more sympathetic to the guy who broke into her house.

Because she felt a duty to help him while she thought that someone in Diana's position of privilege and fame shouldn't feel anything but gratitude. Anyway, I really thought Diana feeling faint and too hot was supposed to be a consequence of her bulimia. I was impressed they didnt just show it in the third episode and called it a day. They really did a great job of depicting how eating disorders come with all these rituals. 

Edited November 20, 2020 by methodwriter85

[Roseanna]

17 hours ago, Domenicholas said:

Damn. The Queen was more sympathetic to the guy who broke into her house.

She might really be sympathetic and she certainly was curious: finally she met someone who wasn't awed by her and told honestly "what really happens in my realm".

But she also have to seem sympathetic in order to keep the man quiet until she was rescued - she behaved like a  hostage: keep calm and try to create a human connection, so that he may not hurt you (for she couldn't be sure of his intentions although he seemed harmless).

[Neurochick]

On 11/15/2020 at 6:15 PM, leighdear said:

Ok, I loved the joke Charles & Camilla told.

The punch line of the joke:  You didn't come here to hunt, did you?  Was said many times on the show The Wire.  But no one ever heard the beginning of the joke.

[swanpride]

The joke was somewhat uncomfortable because rape isn't a laughing matter, but I admit that I kind of snorted over the punchline nevertheless. But it is beyond me how so many people were laughing beforehand about the raping part.

[Roseanna]

1 hour ago, swanpride said:

The joke was somewhat uncomfortable because rape isn't a laughing matter, but I admit that I kind of snorted over the punchline nevertheless. But it is beyond me how so many people were laughing beforehand about the raping part.

Aren't jokes mainly about things that are somehow uncomfortable irl? Cf. Townsend told a dirty joke to George VI to calm him, Margaret and LBJ told dirty limericks to each other. 

The scene showed Charles and Camilla with their friends - he could be free from conventions which bound him in public and his friends laughed beforehand partly because they knew or anticipated some funny turn, but partly probably also to please him.  

[bijoux]

4 hours ago, swanpride said:

The joke was somewhat uncomfortable because rape isn't a laughing matter, but I admit that I kind of snorted over the punchline nevertheless. But it is beyond me how so many people were laughing beforehand about the raping part.

I didn't find it remotely funny, but it served its purpose here. It showcased how well these two complemented each other. 

[Clanstarling]

On 11/16/2020 at 12:06 PM, Roseanna said:

Not entirely. What kind of people laugh when somebody falls from the horse?

People who aren't too fond of the person on the horse.

On 11/17/2020 at 11:27 PM, ProudMary said:

Not just nowadays either. Each time we saw "Eeyore" (as Anne calls Charles) moping because his charming and lovely wife was getting more attention than he was, I couldn't help but think of JFK, ~20 years earlier than the Waleses Australian trip, when Jackie was such a huge hit as they visited France, saying "I'm the man who accompanied Jacqueline Kennedy to Paris" and being cheered for it. Even the smallest touch of self-deprecating humor would have endeared Charles to the crowds, instead of being so jealous of his wife.

Me too.

Regarding Bob Hawke, here's a video montage with him talking. I'm thinking the accent was pretty on the nose in the episode: Robert Hawke

[dubbel zout]

7 hours ago, swanpride said:

The joke was somewhat uncomfortable because rape isn't a laughing matter, but I admit that I kind of snorted over the punchline nevertheless. But it is beyond me how so many people were laughing beforehand about the raping part.

I thought the joke was one of those dumb ones that everyone finds hi-larious, but it's really not that funny. Like, of course these twits are laughing at a rape joke.

4 hours ago, Roseanna said:

his friends laughed beforehand partly because they knew or anticipated some funny turn, but partly probably also to please him. 

And this. No one is going to tell the Prince of Wales his joke sucks.

[Umbelina]

8 hours ago, bijoux said:

I didn't find it remotely funny, but it served its purpose here. It showcased how well these two complemented each other. 

Yes, shared a low sense of humor, but what a difference in Charles when he adores someone.  He included Camilla in everything, always praised, adored, and included her whenever possible.  

I can't help but think that if he had shown even 1/10th of that affection and attention to Diana?  She might have even been able to deal with him having a mistress.

6 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

I thought the joke was one of those dumb ones that everyone finds hi-larious, but it's really not that funny. Like, of course these twits are laughing at a rape joke.

And this. No one is going to tell the Prince of Wales his joke sucks.

Exactly.

He's the top of their circle of friends and facilitators, whatever he says or does will be brilliant in their eyes, and certainly in Camilla's.  (at least outwardly)

For me, I was bored with that joke, it went on FOREVER, and the ending was obvious from the start.  Camilla helped make it more palatable, but good God these people are stupid.

[lavenderblue]

You know, another thing about that joke and the reception of it -- in isolation, it's just a standard scene of people enjoying off-color humor, but in the context of this season, it feels like another reminder that actually, these high-class people are vulgar and crass and not collectively that bright; they just have enormous wealth and status. 

I spent a lot of time this episode realizing that my old sentiment of "Shut up, Philip" has transformed into "Shut up, Charles" (I did Shut Up Philip Philip in the premiere though). I mean, it's obvious, too, that Diana was basking in the public adulation; she was getting from them something she hadn't gotten from people close to her, and it did go to her head to a degree. But gawd Charles is a douche.

[Wordsworth]

How difficult it is to watch Charles and Diana on this show.  You just think that, if only they were of a closer age and shared some interests, it might have been better.  That cringe-worthy scene of Diana embracing the Queen who couldn't think of anything to do but flail her arms impotently as if she were being mauled by a vengeful stag was heart-breaking.  Diana just wanted to be loved; Charles just wanted to be loved.   They were looking for it in all the wrong places.

 

 

[Neurochick]

1 hour ago, Wordsworth said:

How difficult it is to watch Charles and Diana on this show.  You just think that, if only they were of a closer age and shared some interests, it might have been better.  That cringe-worthy scene of Diana embracing the Queen who couldn't think of anything to do but flail her arms impotently as if she were being mauled by a vengeful stag was heart-breaking.  Diana just wanted to be loved; Charles just wanted to be loved.   They were looking for it in all the wrong places.

 

 

I thought this episode was sad.  Charles drove Diana crazy. 

First Charles was upset when Diana flopped at the press conference in Australia. 

Then they had an honest conversation, their first.  They realized they were a married couple, and their events went smoothly, until Diana started to get more attention.  Charles got jealous, he turned cold and Diana turned to her addiction. 

The Queen should have sat both of them down; told them they were a married couple and a united front.  When she has a success it's good for all of them.  But everybody's ego got in the way. 

It's like being hired to do a job; first the boss chastises you for not doing a good enough job; then when you do a great job, he gets pissed because you're better than everybody else.  WTF!!!

[BuckeyeLou]

1 hour ago, Wordsworth said:

How difficult it is to watch Charles and Diana on this show.  You just think that, if only they were of a closer age and shared some interests, it might have been better.  That cringe-worthy scene of Diana embracing the Queen who couldn't think of anything to do but flail her arms impotently as if she were being mauled by a vengeful stag was heart-breaking.  Diana just wanted to be loved; Charles just wanted to be loved.   They were looking for it in all the wrong places.

 

 

Yes, watching Diana hug the Queen & call her "Mama", was Heart-breaking!  Diana was like a child looking for love & reassurance.  Diana had never gotten love from her own Mother(who abandoned her children), and Charles had never gotten the love he wanted from his Mother, so the 2 of them were both very needy & empty inside.

[Umbelina]

I wanted to mention about people laughing at Charles when he fell off the horse.

Has he ever met Australian men, specifically when they are partying or watching or playing sports?  They would laugh at anyone who screwed up in sports, and he was obviously not hurt.  They are a rowdy, rough and tumble, fun loving, and rather hard drinking bunch, and wow, did I just generalize there!  Sorry about that, but I used to work for Club Med, and whenever we had a bunch of Australians coming we knew two things.  The women were nearly all charming, smart, and pretty, and the men were going to have a party, and raise hell.  Our worst nightmare was when we had a large group of Australian guys, AND a large group of French Canadians the same week.  The two sets of macho and egos together with vacationing and drinking?  Not a good mix.

Anyway, I do say all of that with love, and of course I am only talking about certain situations, but a sporting match is one of them were I would expect them to laugh (especially when it was obvious he wasn't hurt.)  They would have laughed at anyone on that field, it wasn't just because the Prince of Wales fell.  IMO of course.  Hell, I think they would have laughed at themselves falling harder than anyone else.  

Had he only shown an ounce of charm, a little bow, or grin, he would have had the entire crowd in his pocket, instead?  He sulked and let everyone see he was offended.  Boob.

[Roseanna]

6 hours ago, Umbelina said:

I wanted to mention about people laughing at Charles when he fell off the horse.

Has he ever met Australian men, specifically when they are partying or watching or playing sports?  They would laugh at anyone who screwed up in sports, and he was obviously not hurt.  They are a rowdy, rough and tumble, fun loving, and rather hard drinking bunch, and wow, did I just generalize there!  Sorry about that, but I used to work for Club Med, and whenever we had a bunch of Australians coming we knew two things.  The women were nearly all charming, smart, and pretty, and the men were going to have a party, and raise hell.  Our worst nightmare was when we had a large group of Australian guys, AND a large group of French Canadians the same week.  The two sets of macho and egos together with vacationing and drinking?  Not a good mix.

Anyway, I do say all of that with love, and of course I am only talking about certain situations, but a sporting match is one of them were I would expect them to laugh (especially when it was obvious he wasn't hurt.)  They would have laughed at anyone on that field, it wasn't just because the Prince of Wales fell.  IMO of course.  Hell, I think they would have laughed at themselves falling harder than anyone else.  

Had he only shown an ounce of charm, a little bow, or grin, he would have had the entire crowd in his pocket, instead?  He sulked and let everyone see he was offended.  Boob.

A good explanation - thank you!

Yet, laughing when somebody fails is simply bullying. The Australians seems to have no sporting spirit which means cheer on every individual.   

[swanpride]

Laughing when someone falls unexpectedly is a human reaction.

[merylinkid]

8 hours ago, Umbelina said:

Had he only shown an ounce of charm, a little bow, or grin, he would have had the entire crowd in his pocket, instead?  He sulked and let everyone see he was offended.  Boob.

THIS.    Just laugh with them and they will love you.

You said it several times and I think this is important -- it was clear he was not hurt.   If he had been injured I doubt they would have laughed.  we all do it.   You are out with friends and someone does something that causes them to fall, hit their head, whatever.   You make sure they are okay, then if they are you die laughing.   They were treating Charles as a friend.   He got all butt hurt because he's Emo Charles.

[dubbel zout]

11 hours ago, merylinkid said:

Diana had it right -- the Queen is in charge of how things are done.   ONE word from her, and they would stop treating Diana like an outsider to be ignored.   

I'm not so sure. They might be nice to Diana superficially, but Charles's secretary is going to be on Charles's side. The royal households are notoriously territorial.

[Blakeston]

2 hours ago, merylinkid said:

THIS.    Just laugh with them and they will love you.

You said it several times and I think this is important -- it was clear he was not hurt.   If he had been injured I doubt they would have laughed.  we all do it.   You are out with friends and someone does something that causes them to fall, hit their head, whatever.   You make sure they are okay, then if they are you die laughing.   They were treating Charles as a friend.   He got all butt hurt because he's Emo Charles.

The people holding up signs mocking him (and his ears) were not treating him as a friend. Neither were the crowds who outright booed him. Or the people who told him they only showed up to see Diana. Or the prime minister talking about how if Charles had come by himself, the Australian people probably would have agreed to leave the commonwealth.

Charles could have handled things better, but the way he was treated was humiliating.

[Roseanna]

3 hours ago, swanpride said:

Laughing when someone falls unexpectedly is a human reaction.

...if children aren't taught at home or school that it is cruel.

Edited November 22, 2020 by Roseanna
Correcting a letter

[swanpride]

That has nothing to do with cruelty. It is basically in instinctive reaction, most likely hotwired in our brains. Naturally it depends on the so called "play frame"...basically if we realise that someone is in danger, we won't laugh, but a surprise fall in a "safe" situation basically overrides our empathy at least for a moment. And naturally if we are standing in a crowd, one person laughing encourages others to laugh too.

[Neurochick]

6 hours ago, Roseanna said:

A good explanation - thank you!

Yet, laughing when somebody fails is simply bullying. The Australians seems to have no sporting spirit which means cheer on every individual.   

I don't see bullying as a "one off" but something that goes on and on and on.

2 hours ago, Blakeston said:

he people holding up signs mocking him (and his ears) were not treating him as a friend. Neither were the crowds who outright booed him. Or the people who told him they only showed up to see Diana. Or the prime minister talking about how if Charles had come by himself, the Australian people probably would have agreed to leave the commonwealth.

Charles could have handled things better, but the way he was treated was humiliating.

Someone should have sat Charles down and told him that the world is unfair, I mean he didn't do anything to achieve his position except be born.  Also people will ALWAYS defer to a beautiful, young woman, not Diana's fault that she was attractive and people wanted to see her. 

[TaurusRose]

 

On 11/16/2020 at 12:18 AM, Deputy Deputy CoS said:

The more Anne displays jealousy of Diana, the more she looks and sounds dour. Keep it up princess 

Maybe Diana wouldn't need to be reassured if she wasn't married with a self-centered cheating cad. Just maybe.  She enjoys the attention but I don't see where she went out of her way to seek it. Reaching out to the queen in her state is not needy, it is human.

I don't know much about the real HRH Anne.  But I'm not a fan of the this one on The Crown.  She's entitled, waspish, and unlikable.  Much like the rest of them.  If Charles had stayed away from Camilla, treated Diana with just a little kindness and paid half as much attention to his marriage as he did whining and pining over Camilla when he wasn't plotting to see her, their marriage might have had a fighting chance.  But he didn't have kindness or empathy within himself.  It's telling that the only person he could care about wholeheartedly was Camilla.  It says volumes about who he and what he is.

On 11/21/2020 at 10:30 AM, dubbel zout said:

I thought the joke was one of those dumb ones that everyone finds hi-larious, but it's really not that funny. Like, of course these twits are laughing at a rape joke.

And this. No one is going to tell the Prince of Wales his joke sucks.

I thought it was funny.  I don't see it as a rape joke.  It dawned on the bear that this person was using hunting as a cover to get his freak on.  Geez, not everything is about rape.

On 11/21/2020 at 4:52 PM, Umbelina said:

Yes, shared a low sense of humor, but what a difference in Charles when he adores someone.  He included Camilla in everything, always praised, adored, and included her whenever possible. 

Yes.  It's kind of pathetic that only one person in the world can lift him out of gloom, doom and woe is me.

15 hours ago, swanpride said:

Laughing when someone falls unexpectedly is a human reaction.

Pretty much.  But you can't expect a pampered, self-indulgent creature to think that way.

Edited November 23, 2020 by taurusrose

[Umbelina]

3 minutes ago, taurusrose said:

I don't much about the real HRH Anne.  But I'm not a fan of the this one on The Crown.  She's entitled, waspish, and unlikable.

Which is why her entitled, waspish, unlikable father adores her so.  Two peas in a pod.

Her humor saves her for me though, her honestly when questioned, but apparently keeping her opinions to herself unless directly questioned do as well.  

[swanpride]

Anne on the show doesn't come off as particularly entitled imho....

[TaurusRose]

3 hours ago, Umbelina said:

Which is why her entitled, waspish, unlikable father adores her so.  Two peas in a pod.

Her humor saves her for me though, her honestly when questioned, but apparently keeping her opinions to herself unless directly questioned do as well.  

I cracked up when Philip said Anne is his favorite without missing a beat. He was unapologetically gleeful.

[chocolatine]

On 11/16/2020 at 6:52 PM, DarkHorse said:

Yeah they did, although they both look awkward and clumsy. Charles is going much faster than Diana would like. I would have figured they would have had dance lessons given they both come from the upper classes.

 

I knew Diana struggled with bulimia, but didn't realize just how thin she was at that time. I've only been aware of her (and the other Royals) since the early 90s, after my family and I left the former Soviet Union, and by that time she was in her 30s and looked much less fragile.

I thought it was utterly ridiculous that Diana was expected to climb Uluru in a dress and what looked like ballerina flats. Charles was wearing a safari suit and what looked like hiking boots; why wasn't she allowed to wear something more appropriate for the activity?

I think the shared rape/bestiality joke between Charles and Camilla was supposed to be another example how well suited they've always been for each other, but I still find both of them irredeemable. For all of the Queen's coldness, she is a strong, principled woman who puts her duty above all else. Charles has only ever put his own needs and wants first. He disgusts me. 

[Blakeston]

19 hours ago, Neurochick said:

Someone should have sat Charles down and told him that the world is unfair, I mean he didn't do anything to achieve his position except be born.  Also people will ALWAYS defer to a beautiful, young woman, not Diana's fault that she was attractive and people wanted to see her. 

I think Charles could have handled Diana simply getting more attention than him. What we saw in this episode was way beyond that. I can't even imagine how Diana would have reacted to a crowd of people booing her and holding up signs calling her ugly.

[TaurusRose]

On 11/22/2020 at 12:13 PM, Roseanna said:

...if children aren't taught at home or school that it is cruel.

Yeah, well, what can I say?  I had home training as a child, but I'll still laugh if it's funny. 

[buttersister]

On 11/23/2020 at 10:29 AM, Blakeston said:

Also people will ALWAYS defer to a beautiful, young woman, not Diana's fault that she was attractive and people wanted to see her. 

Hey, Charles, I'd like to introduce you to JFK. The French went nuts for Jackie on their first trip there and you know what he did? Introduced himself as the man who accompanied Jaqueline Kennedy to Paris. Then continued on with his duties as the President. You whiny, needy, selfish oaf.

So here's a question: Diana sidelines their Australian trip and suddenly, Charles discovers he loves her? Has no qualms about complimenting her beauty? Is suddenly able to articulate his needs to her? As happy as I was to see them as a couple for a couple of minutes, that seemed like brother from another planet. And I thought that the Crown dance scene was a whole lot smoother than the real one, so thanks for the confirmation.

Do we know if Diana ever met with the cold-fish Queen? Or jealous Queen? Or whatever emotion/lack of emotion gene she carries that enables her to act like that to another human being (one she never did right by in the first place). Maybe Elizabeth will take the Crown with her when she goes. 

[Roseanna]

8 hours ago, taurusrose said:

Yeah, well, what can I say?  I had home training as a child, but I'll still laugh if it's funny. 

In situations of all kind? Also in funerals? Also to a child?

I have watched sport and have noticed how differently the watchers of different react react in similar situations. Nobody laughs if a figure skater falls - on the contrary, he/she is applauded, when he/she then succeeds even in a easier jump. Instead, hockey watchers can be quite cruel and even yell obscenities - but not everywhere, supporters of some teams are quite nice and even congratulate the supporters of the winning team.

So I have drawn a conclusion that whether we laugh aloud (instead being amused inside) is a social norm.