S11.E06: A Beautiful Miracle

[Barb23]

13 hours ago, Chicklet said:

I would like to know exactly how Lauren managed to look so put together during labor. No sweat, no running makeup. Maybe it was Jchelle's magic fan, or they had the temperature down to 50 in that room.

My mother didn't even recognize me after the birth of my son. She swears my hair changed color in the process.  I think it was just that my hair turned darker with all the sweating I did. For some reason I found it comfortable to lay one of my arms across my forehead squishing whatever hairstyle I had started out with.  A ponytail could have been worn sometime along the way too.  I ended up with an emergency C-section so the OR shower cap only added to my birthing coiffure.

My one epidural only numbed the top of my left thigh.  I kept telling them this all along including when they were getting me quickly prepped in the OR.  I didn't want them cutting into me when I could still feel my stomach.  The last thing I remember hearing was the OB telling the anesthesiologist to  "Knock her out."  They were the best words I heard all day besides the nurse telling me I had a healthy baby boy when I came to.  

[Zella]

I don't think it's a contradiction for Derick to have been kicked off the show but Jill still to be allowed to appear in episodes. She wasn't the one spouting hateful shit on Twitter (about another TLC personality, no less). He was. 

[Whyyouneedaname]

my take from the gingerbread house contest: Jana would act just like Lauren did at the couples retreat, the minute things weren't going well she's out. Whether it be with the siblings or with a mate she taps out when things start going a little south.  The Duggar Dash she had the same reaction, she wanted to give up.  & if they had left Kendra alone she would've birthed that baby in a matter of minutes instead of laying there in pain for an hour, was that even a push when the nurse gave her to okay lol. 

[Squirrely]

17 minutes ago, Whyyouneedaname said:

my take from the gingerbread house contest: Jana would act just like Lauren did at the couples retreat, the minute things weren't going well she's out. Whether it be with the siblings or with a mate she taps out when things start going a little south.  The Duggar Dash she had the same reaction, she wanted to give up. 

In the fundie world of arrested development, everything is a competition. They don't even realize how juvenile it is, since they all brag about it nonstop. Yeah, we all get frustrated and want to quit things, but to them it's not worth doing at all if they can't win. It's pretty pathetic. And it's not even the younger generations' fault. They had to learn very early on to compete for half a second of parental attention. Except Josie. She just has to stay the "baby" which is probably why her actions and art projects appear to be carried out by a 2 year-old. 

[doodlebug]

3 hours ago, absnow54 said:

I thought TLC canceled Derick for his transphobic comments, and Derick acts like it was his choice to no longer be involved. Jill appeared on camera during Ivy’s birth special last season, and she’s been showing up to more family gatherings on social media (always sans JB, but Michelle is usually there) so the estrangement might be lifting. 

At the time Derick made ugly comments about a transgender child; TLC issued a statement that he was no longer appearing on the show.  They didn't specifically say he had been fired.  It later came out that, probably during the latter stages of Jill's pregnancy with Sam, Derick asked for TLC to pay the bills they'd accumulated from Israel's birth and they declined.  At the same time, he was apparently finally figuring out how much JB was making from the show and feeling that he and Jill were not getting their fair  share.  Presumably, since Sam was due, Derick wanted payment for them to film that labor and birth as well as guarantees that their expenses would be covered if she delivered in a hospital.

I think, most likely, TLC declined to negotiate a separate deal with Derick and he burned his bridges with JB prior to the Jazz mess and TLC was happy to tell the world that he was no longer appearing on the show.

[doodlebug]

14 hours ago, absnow54 said:

I had back labor with my first, and while my epidural worked (although I could still feel every contraction... just less) I was still in A LOT of discomfort due to the back labor. My first delivery was similar to Lauren’s and it was awful. Second delivery was positioned much better and was a breeze. 

I forgot to mention this earlier: back labor pain is caused by different nerve pathways than regular labor contractions and an epidural is less likely to provide as much relief when the baby is positioned sunny side up.  It's gotten a lot better over the years, epidurals are miles better than they were 30 years ago, but it is still more difficult to relieve the pain of back labor.

[Calibabydolly]

Oh! One of the older Duggar boys (Jason?) called the ginger bread "graham crackers"! They must have been already prebaked in those kits, so they do probably look like a graham cracker. But they should smell different. They really do live a sheltered life!

[crazy8s]

51 minutes ago, Calibabydolly said:

Oh! One of the older Duggar boys (Jason?) called the ginger bread "graham crackers"! They must have been already prebaked in those kits, so they do probably look like a graham cracker. But they should smell different. They really do live a sheltered life!

i did not watch, but in looking at the pics they seemed to have used the kits that are graham crackers.  i have done them with my grand kids a few times. people call them "gingerbread houses" but they are graham crackers shaped in pieces for a house

[Absolom]

Ratings time!  Up a hair.  9:00 PM: 1.160 M viewers and a .18 rating.  44th cable show of the day.

8:00 PM: 578 K viewers and a .08 rating.   106th cable show of the day.

 

[ehall1052]

20 hours ago, Vandy10 said:

Did I just hear Jana say “collapse-id?”

My closed captioning said “collapses”.

[RedDelicious]

8 hours ago, Absolom said:

I'm waffling on whether Josie can't or won't do things at least with a moderate effort and result.  The way she's been babied by Michelle, I tend to think she's never been made to conform to any standards and doesn't understand what effort really is. 

Then again it's possible she has the healthiest attitude of them all with screw it, I'm not performing for the dog and pony show of doing crafts, games, and competitions just to create a TV episode.  

Totally agree with your assessment.  She can make a pile of dog shit and Michelle will squeal 🤡

[Sew Sumi]

6 hours ago, doodlebug said:

At the time Derick made ugly comments about a transgender child; TLC issued a statement that he was no longer appearing on the show.  They didn't specifically say he had been fired.  It later came out that, probably during the latter stages of Jill's pregnancy with Sam, Derick asked for TLC to pay the bills they'd accumulated from Israel's birth and they declined.  At the same time, he was apparently finally figuring out how much JB was making from the show and feeling that he and Jill were not getting their fair  share.  Presumably, since Sam was due, Derick wanted payment for them to film that labor and birth as well as guarantees that their expenses would be covered if she delivered in a hospital.

I think, most likely, TLC declined to negotiate a separate deal with Derick and he burned his bridges with JB prior to the Jazz mess and TLC was happy to tell the world that he was no longer appearing on the show.

Yeah, this is how I read the situation.

[toomuchtv]

Why was Lauren (and everyone else) so against a c-section, praying she wouldn’t need one? If I had a long labor with intense back pain an epidural wouldn’t touch I probably would have been begging to get that baby out any way possible!

 

(disclaimer, I did have a csection. My epidural worked wonderfully and my labor was ok, but my daughters heart rate kept dropping if I changed from one position so they did a csection and guess what, she had a true knot in her cord so it ended up being good I had a csection.)

[doodlebug]

10 minutes ago, toomuchtv said:

Why was Lauren (and everyone else) so against a c-section, praying she wouldn’t need one? If I had a long labor with intense back pain an epidural wouldn’t touch I probably would have been begging to get that baby out any way possible!

 

(disclaimer, I did have a csection. My epidural worked wonderfully and my labor was ok, but my daughters heart rate kept dropping if I changed from one position so they did a csection and guess what, she had a true knot in her cord so it ended up being good I had a csection.)

Because these people are quiverful and having cesareans might make it difficult to have a passel o'kids.  Yes, she could attempt to VBAC, but that is still puts her at risk for uterine rupture and, once a woman has had a cesarean for any reason, she is far more likely to have cesareans with her subsequent children.  If you're thinking you want double digits, you don't want a c-section.

As far as medically, a woman is 7 times more likely to die after a cesarean than after a vaginal birth.  That includes healthy women who have scheduled cesareans without going into labor although women who have been in labor and need a cesarean are at highest risk.  There is a far greater likelihood of having a life threatening hemorrhage, a serious anesthesia complication or a major infection with a cesarean.  Having a cesarean is far more likely to result in additional surgeries including emergency hysterectomy, repair of injury to the bladder or ureters, removal of ovaries, etc, repair of incisional hernias.  Chronic pain from scar tissue is also more likely with a section.  Most doctors don't recommend more than 3 or 4 cesareans total because the risk of uterine rupture, which can be catstrophic and life threatening for both mother and baby rises with each one.  Women who've undergone a cesarean are also more likely to develop blood clots in the veins in their legs or pelvis which can travel to the lungs and be fatal. After a cesarean, a woman is much more likely to have a placenta previa or placenta percreta, increta or accreta (placenta that goes into the uterine wall or through it rather than lying on top of it) with any future pregnancy which can result in massive hemorrhage and might result in emergency hysterectomy or even death.

So, really, IMO, most women should be praying to avoid a cesarean if possible.

Edited August 13, 2020 by doodlebug

[Pingaponga]

Odd question, but after seeing Kendra give birth to Addison last week and Lauren give birth this week, I'm wondering if it is common for women in the US to give birth flat on their backs? Because I was propped up a heck of a lot when I had Baby Ponga here in Canada, and all the reading I did beforehand indicated that it's easier to deliver when the mum is more upright. Delivery rooms at the hospital I delivered at have "squat bars" for mums to use if they want when pushing, as squatting helps open the pelvis.

It's kind of interesting that Abbie, Lauren and Kendra have all chosen hospital births with doctors. The only Duggar daughter-in-law who has delivered at home is Anna.

[Sew Sumi]

In Anna's defense, those Keller girls are made to give birth. I think all of Esther's and all of Prissy's have been homebirths.

[AussiesRule]

14 hours ago, Tikichick said:

I think I would struggle to give in to my normal instincts to find Kendra's laugh annoying because she repeatedly shows herself to be constantly kind and thoughtful to a fault.  Hopefully Joe is as mellow and easy going as he appears and treats Kendra just as thoughtfully. 

I agree! I meant when she was first introduced she was super giggly and annoying. Probably nerves more than anything. She's my favourite in law now.

[Temperance]

Jill isn't featured on the show anyway. She's in the background. 

[Churchhoney]

5 hours ago, crazy8s said:

i did not watch, but in looking at the pics they seemed to have used the kits that are graham crackers.  i have done them with my grand kids a few times. people call them "gingerbread houses" but they are graham crackers shaped in pieces for a house

Gosh, it's hard enough to get big chunky pieces of gingerbread to stand up and act like walls.....Can't imagine what  it takes to get little skinny graham crackers to do it. 

[Zella]

Kendra seems like one of the more functional in-laws. In fact, I'd say she's probably the most functional daughter-in-law. I'm sure she has her own set of issues from being raised by fundie parents, but by functional, I mean, she seems like the type of person you could go somewhere with and not be completely embarrassed by. (Compared to, say, going somewhere with Lauren or pretty much any of the Duggars.) I doubt you'd have a super interesting conversation with her, but she seems to have manners and some semblance of social norms at least. 

Kendra actually reminds me of the kids we used to call "well-baked" at College of the Ozarks. "Crispies" were the really insufferable religious kids. The "Well-baked" were just as religious but not annoying. You may not be friends with them or want to hang out with them extensively, but you could eat occasionally at a table with the "well-baked" and not want to stab your eyes out with a spork is what I'm saying. 

[mrs ra]

On 8/11/2020 at 6:22 PM, madpsych78 said:

Also: WAY TOO MUCH MICHELLE TALKING in this episode. 

Thanks for the warning. 

[Sew Sumi]

Is it true that Jeremy might have said "Oh shit!" when Jana's gingerbread house collapsed? I mean, they obviously would have muted the sound, but we can read lips. 😁

[Tikichick]

12 hours ago, Temperance said:

Jill isn't featured on the show anyway. She's in the background. 

Or just a disembodied voice with closed caption identification seems to be preferable.  Yet Lolli and Pops are back to being the show leads this season despite sheltering their daughters' abuser from consequences and depriving the victims access to therapy. 

[RedDelicious]

Truth ☝️ @Tikichick 

[CouchTater]

20 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

In Anna's defense, those Keller girls are made to give birth. I think all of Esther's and all of Prissy's have been homebirths.

In many rapid-reading, trying to catch up on everyone's awesome posts, I read Prissy's as Pussy's.  I guess either would work in this case. 😆  I really do crack myself up.  

Edited August 13, 2020 by CouchTater

[Tdoc72]

 

On 8/12/2020 at 8:53 AM, sleepysuzy said:

 

The exhaustion really wears down the ability to handle pain. I don't care how annoying or dramatic Lauren is in her everyday life; she can complain and whine as much as she wants to in a long labor and I'm going to sympathize. 

I had sympathy for her labor pains but I also still think she is a #dramallama.  Josiah must have the patience of a saint because I would find her exhausting to deal with.  I admit that’s just what I see on the show. She could be completely different IRL.

[Zella]

12 minutes ago, Tdoc72 said:

 

I had sympathy for her labor pains but I also still think she is a #dramallama.  Josiah must have the patience of a saint because I would find her exhausting to deal with.  I admit that’s just what I see on the show. She could be completely different IRL.

I am still taken aback every time I think about her melodramatically lying on that couch during the marriage retreat last year (or earlier this year?) when she claimed she wasn't feeling well. I feel like a normal person would have, you know, made like Elvis and left the building (or the room) to go lie down. But nope Lauren just plonks herself down right there. It just seemed so passive-aggressive and attention-seeking. 

Edited to add: I just went back to reread some of the thread from that episode. I had forgotten that she ended up admitting she wasn't sick and was just irritated with him. I also forgot about her peacing out of the vow renewal, so Josiah had to awkwardly read his vows into the phone to her. LOLOL

But yeah I don't think I would last for about five minutes with her. 

Edited August 14, 2020 by Zella

[graefin]

4 hours ago, Zella said:

I also forgot about her peacing out of the vow renewal, so Josiah had to awkwardly read his vows into the phone to her.

Which episode was this?

[Marshmallow Mollie]

7 hours ago, Zella said:

I am still taken aback every time I think about her melodramatically lying on that couch during the marriage retreat last year (or earlier this year?) when she claimed she wasn't feeling well. I feel like a normal person would have, you know, made like Elvis and left the building (or the room) to go lie down. But nope Lauren just plonks herself down right there. It just seemed so passive-aggressive and attention-seeking. 

Edited to add: I just went back to reread some of the thread from that episode. I had forgotten that she ended up admitting she wasn't sick and was just irritated with him. I also forgot about her peacing out of the vow renewal, so Josiah had to awkwardly read his vows into the phone to her. LOLOL

But yeah I don't think I would last for about five minutes with her. 

See, this is what I like about her. She didn’t keep sweet. Subvert the patriarchy, Lauren!

[Zella]

5 hours ago, graefin said:

Which episode was this?

It's called Marriage Bootcamp. 

[Nysha]

11 hours ago, Marshmallow Mollie said:

See, this is what I like about her. She didn’t keep sweet. Subvert the patriarchy, Lauren!

I like that interpretation of Lauren's actions. She's not being bitchy and entitled, she's refusing to even pretend that Duggar life is all joy, joy, joy.

[Zella]

3 hours ago, Nysha said:

I like that interpretation of Lauren's actions. She's not being bitchy and entitled, she's refusing to even pretend that Duggar life is all joy, joy, joy.

I'd be more willing to view it that way if she wasn't such a passive-aggressive "look at me!" whiner about it. If she just flat-out told them, "Fuck you! I'm not going to be a dancing bear for you!" I'd actually enjoy that. LOL But I think she actually likes being on camera and is just a c*** when she doesn't get her way. 

Edited August 15, 2020 by Zella

[Sew Sumi]

44 minutes ago, Zella said:

I'd be more willing to view it that way if she wasn't such a passive-aggressive "look at me!" whiner about it. If she just flat-out told them, "Fuck you! I'm not going to be a dancing bear for you!" I'd actually enjoy that. LOL But I think she actually likes being on camera and is just a c*** when she doesn't get her way. 

Spot on! 

[Albanyguy]

I occasionally stop by the Duggars facebook page because the leghumpers’ comments are hilarious. The constant over-the-top adoration of All Things Duggar is only matched by the vicious attacks on anyone who voices any opinion they don’t agree with. But, amazingly, even the most besotted leghumpers don’t like Lauren. They think she’s whiny and high-maintenance and she doesn’t seem to appreciate how lucky she is to have a wonderful man like Josiah and in-laws like the Duggars.

[Sew Sumi]

Hey, she married into that family. But her whining and high maintenance have nothing to do with who she married. She seemed pretty bitchy from her first appearance. 

[Jeeves]

8 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

Hey, she married into that family. But her whining and high maintenance have nothing to do with who she married. She seemed pretty bitchy from her first appearance. 

I think it's been said here before, that she probably expected to walk in and become the new Breakout Star™ of the Duggar TLC franchise. Instead, after the engagement/wedding episode(s), it was just "hey, yeah, glad you're here, now take your place down there at the end of the line."

I think Lauren's got a better sense of style than the rest of the Duggars, and is fairly attractive. IMO when it comes to looks and fashion style, she's way ahead of the doughy-looking Duggar sons, the raggedy-dressed minor Duggar daughters, and the hot mess that is the kidult Duggar daughters. So she might have shone out better than the rest.

But the Duggars aren't about style or good looks. They are all about doing the will of JB and Michelle, for the greater glory and wealth of JB and Michelle. Lauren's not going to have a chance in hell of outshining any Duggar whether on TV or IRL.

And, then, there's Lauren's personality. Urgh. She's no Kendra. 

[Nysha]

On 8/14/2020 at 7:31 PM, Zella said:

I'd be more willing to view it that way if she wasn't such a passive-aggressive "look at me!" whiner about it. If she just flat-out told them, "Fuck you! I'm not going to be a dancing bear for you!" I'd actually enjoy that. LOL But I think she actually likes being on camera and is just a c*** when she doesn't get her way. 

I agree that Lauren probably has a pretty entitled personality to begin with, but people raised in the gothard cult don't have many options besides being passive-aggressive or getting their discontent beat out of them. I don't like her methods, but I do like that she's not willing to fall in line with the rest of the clan. 

[lascuba]

On 8/14/2020 at 7:40 AM, Marshmallow Mollie said:

See, this is what I like about her. She didn’t keep sweet. Subvert the patriarchy, Lauren!

 

On 8/14/2020 at 7:31 PM, Nysha said:

I like that interpretation of Lauren's actions. She's not being bitchy and entitled, she's refusing to even pretend that Duggar life is all joy, joy, joy.

I think she's bitchy and entitled. I also think she's refusing to pretend for the cameras. I dig it. I think I posted here about how much I LOVED how she acted during that marriage retreat. It was glorious. She was annoyed with Josiah, she was annoyed with the asinine marriage retreat they were doing only because TLC needs something to film, so she passive-aggressively noped out because openly saying, "You're pissing me off and this scripted shit we have to do is stupid. I'm out" isn't an option for her. Watching Josiah speak vows to a phone because Lauren refused to leave her room, while his siblings had their spouses with them...*chef's kiss."

[Totally]

Lauren will fall in line when it benefits her.. she’s just a whiny complaining child 

[Honey]

Sorry, but that baby freaked me right out.  With it's huge eyes wide open, only seconds after birth.  I kept thinking.......alien.