S08.E10: Fadeout

[scarynikki12]

Quote

After eight seasons, and the launch of countless superheroes, the series wraps up the story of the Green Arrow.

 

 

[apinknightmare]

[mtlchick]

As for series finales go, this was all over the place, with more meh than yay.  There's still a lot of stuff unanswered especially about Dinah and won't be until Green Arrow gets the go ahead.

 

Then Olicity happened one. last. time.  And I'm tearing up.

 

Oliver Queen, you sort of saved the city, the multi verse.  Didn't really save your series ending which should have ended last season.  You did save the DCTV for the CW for years though, so that's a plus. 

Aside: my brother reminded me that the Green Lantern series is happening for HBO Max so I guess we see John end up there at some point. 

 

 

[calliope1975]

That was terrible, but I'm still going to miss this stupid show. 

[Writing Wrongs]

I put this in live thread but:

I'm confused. Are the resurrected people from other Earths or are they the original ones? Because they are acting like they are all interchangeable.

And I thought Dinah was in 2040 in the last episode.

[apinknightmare]

Just now, calliope1975 said:

That was terrible, but I'm still going to miss this stupid show. 

Same and same. What I saw of the last scene was nice - until the local affiliate cut in over the rest of it with a Blackish commercial, thank you for the final middle finger CW, I will never watch your dumb channel again!

[Primal Slayer]

For the most part there was a lot of wasted story in this finale. Why did we have to have the whole William subplot? They could've skipped that and just focus on how Oliver impacted everyone's lives. We start out with a documentary style thing only to throw it out the window for the remainder of the episode. 

 

Laurel goes out the way she's been treated this entire series...as the blacksheep of Arrow, never really fitting real. I really wanted a scene with her Lance/Sara and would've been great to see a married Tommy/Laurel. And she doesn't even get a real ending like the rest of the series regulars did. 

Arrow in general went out in a very Arrowy way...I always had high hopes for them even though I knew how it'd likely go and they always went...how I knew they'd likely go...for the most being let down. 

[calliope1975]

Just now, apinknightmare said:

Same and same. What I saw of the last scene was nice - until the local affiliate cut in over the rest of it with a Blackish commercial, thank you for the final middle finger CW, I will never watch your dumb channel again!

The last scene was great and the only one to really get an emotional reaction out of me. SA still has really great heart eyes.

 

[tennisgurl]

That was uneven as hell, but that last scene hit me right in the gut, and I am now searching for those damn onions someone left around here. For better or for worse, we have been with this show for a LONG time, and seeing it go is tough.

So long, and thanks for all the warehouses. 

[Soulfire]

For your rewatching purposes. Will be back to post GIFs for the last time ever later on. Sniff.

 

Edited January 29, 2020 by Soulfire

[Featherhat]

Just now, Writing Wrongs said:

And I thought Dinah was in 2040 in the last episode.

She mentioned she was magically and mysteriously transported to 2040 after Oliver's funeral so it hadn't happened yet. 

Oliver went back and saved people from his Earth/the merged Earth Prime except Laurel. So they're all the people he remembers and remember him. 

[Primal Slayer]

This was very much like COIE to me...the saving graces were the little character crossover moments: Barry/Kara showing up, Sara/Quentin, Sara/Nyssa/Talia, Laurel/Tommy, The entire Queen family (though they really couldn't have Felicity/Moira interact? lol). But SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO many missed opportunities. Mia doesn't even get to react to seeing her grandmother.

[janeta]

3 minutes ago, Soulfire said:

For your rewatching purposes. Will be back to post GIFs for the last time ever later on.

 

THANK YOOOOOOOU! 🥰🥰

[Trisha]

That was messy and rushed, too much of the reset was unexplained, I hate that they basically confirmed that Oliver didn’t pick up the phone once in S8 to call his wife and tell her their adult kids had time travelled to the present, and I still don’t know the point of those Oliver/Diggle flashbacks. But...the last 10 mins sold it for me. From the second Mia approaches Felicity right through to Oliver’s last line, I was tearing up.

[GHScorpiosRule]

2 minutes ago, calliope1975 said:

That was terrible, but I'm still going to miss this stupid show. 

Thank God. I thought I would be the only one who thought this. I mean, WTF was that? That Wild Dong is “the most like Oliver”? FUCK THAT NOISE.

But... ANATOLY!!!!!🥰🥰🥰

And Green Lantern!!!

1 minute ago, apinknightmare said:

Same and same. What I saw of the last scene was nice - until the local affiliate cut in over the rest of it with a Blackish commercial, thank you for the final middle finger CW, I will never watch your dumb channel again!

I KNOW!!! I thought it was my new teevee acting up again, but nope. So I’m left wondering-Are Oliver and Felicity in some kind of...time bubble?

At least he shaved, so, yay?

[Writing Wrongs]

5 minutes ago, Featherhat said:

She mentioned she was magically and mysteriously transported to 2040 after Oliver's funeral so it hadn't happened yet. 

That's what is confusing. It seemed like Mia was remembering William's kidnapping from the future and referencing it to Dinah. Wasn't that after the Canary Caper of 2040?

Edited January 29, 2020 by Writing Wrongs

[Mellowyellow]

If Oliver can't raise his baby and son with Felicity then reuniting in the paradise dimension with his eternally hot young Felicity is really not a bad end at all!

So what happens there? Are there groceries? Is it like the Good Place but not run by demons? Are there other people? Can they get pregnant from all the sexy times I assume they will have? 

[insomniadreams88]

First of all, LOVE that Oliver and Felicity get eternity together. We really struck gold with those two. But the finale needed more of them together somehow. 

What we should have gotten: more Felicity/Mia, more Felicity/Diggle, more Felicity/Sara, even just one Felicity/William scene, maybe Felicity/Rory... I guess I should be happy that Felicity and Tommy finally stood near each other?

Loved Diggle's eulogy. Liked the hint about his future ... if we get to see it! 

The explanation for E2 and not E1 Laurel MAKES NO SENSE. They even had E1 Laurel's father say he prefers NOT HIS DAUGHTER to his own daughter? 

We didn't need the William-gets-kidnapped again plot — especially since we didn't even get a Felicity/William reunion out of it! We needed more character moments like we got at the end of the episode. 

[Angel12d]

Honestly, that was GARBAGE. The pacing was atrocious, the plot was a mess. They spent more time rounding off stories for characters who almost ruined the show back in S6. I felt like it was a waste of time.

The only moment I felt something was when we saw 2040 Felicity saying she'd waited a long time to see him (the scene from 722) and the Olicity scene was really sweet but far too short.

Not enough Felicity, not enough Oliver. No honoring of OTA. Just yikes.

[Writing Wrongs]

8 minutes ago, Featherhat said:

Oliver went back and saved people from his Earth/the merged Earth Prime except Laurel. So they're all the people he remembers and remember him. 

But that wasn't his mother who died, that was a Moira from somewhere else. Same for Tommy. But Thea is acting like that Moira is her mom. So are they just interchangeable now?

Edited January 29, 2020 by Writing Wrongs

[Featherhat]

2 minutes ago, Writing Wrongs said:

That's what is confusing. It seemed like Mia was remembering William's kidnapping in the future and referencing it to Dinah. Wasn't that after the Canary Caper?

Yeah Mia came to the past before Dinah was transported to the future. Her past of the last few weeks is still in Dinah's future. They're in two different time streams/personal timelines right now. Dinah hasn't yet met Mia in the future, that's the stuff Sara had warned her about talking to Dinah about. 

[scarynikki12]

1 minute ago, Writing Wrongs said:

But that wasn't his mother who died, that was a Moira from somewhere else. Same for Tommy.

It’s a new timeline but the same people. Oliver basically arranged for some do-overs: Moira and Tommy don’t die, the mansion doesn’t burn down, Emiko is good, and Sara Diggle is back. 

[Writing Wrongs]

2 minutes ago, Featherhat said:

Yeah Mia came to the past before Dinah was transported to the future. Her past of the last few weeks is still in Dinah's future. They're in two different time streams/personal timelines right now. Dinah hasn't yet met Mia in the future, that's the stuff Sara had warned her about talking to Dinah about. 

[Primal Slayer]

3 minutes ago, Writing Wrongs said:

But that wasn't his mother who died, that was a Moira from somewhere else. Same for Tommy. But Thea is acting like that Moira is her mom. So are they just interchangeable now?

This is Prime Moira, we are (supposed to be) living in a "new Earth". The past changed, just everyone apparently gets to remember a pre-Crisis world and have two set of memories, one that is never addressed.

[kickingnames]

Whelmed.

6 minutes ago, Writing Wrongs said:

I put this in live thread but:

I'm confused. Are the resurrected people from other Earths or are they the original ones? Because they are acting like they are all interchangeable.

The one consistent through-line of this show — they couldn’t possibly abandon it right at the end.

 

[scarynikki12]

7 minutes ago, Writing Wrongs said:

That's what is confusing. It seemed like Mia was remembering William's kidnapping from the future and referencing it to Dinah. Wasn't that after the Canary Caper of 2040?

The events of last episode already happened for Mia while still in the future for Dinah and Siren. That’s how she’s able to attend the funeral and be in the episode. 

[apinknightmare]

They didn't need poor William being kidnapped for the 100th time - it didn't even result in anything good. No conversations about him having a sister, no reunion with Felicity, no seeing what his relationship was like with this Moira. I wish they'd scrapped the whole dumb storyline and really spent the last hour mourning Oliver and setting up the new changes.

Although I guess I'm not surprised to be let down one last time. Prochnost, you dumb show!

[insomniadreams88]

Just now, Primal Slayer said:

This is Prime Moira, we are (supposed to be) living in a "new Earth". The past changed, just everyone apparently gets to remember a pre-Crisis world and have two set of memories, one that is never addressed.

This is the problem. They didn't have enough time to do this. Should've been two hours, then they could've included the William kidnapping in part of it, addressed post-Crisis stuff, and honored Oliver — and other aspects of the series. 

[Featherhat]

1 minute ago, kickingnames said:

The one consistent through-line of this show — they couldn’t possibly abandon it right at the end.

Except for the Nazis, They made sure the Nazis were totally separate assholes. Other asshole/murderous but less Nazi doppelgangers were interchangeable however. 

[Featherhat]

2 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

They didn't need poor William being kidnapped for the 100th time - it didn't even result in anything good. No conversations about him having a sister, no reunion with Felicity, no seeing what his relationship was like with this Moira. I wish they'd scrapped the whole dumb storyline and really spent the last hour mourning Oliver and setting up the new changes.

I suppose we might find out about that if the spin off is picked up. The fic will be amazing at least.

It is kind of what I feared, the series went AU and we have no time to deal with it and the writers pat themselves on the back because they brought back so many characters for nostalgia and don't even have to explain it. They're all Oliver's actual friends/family with Prime memories though not like in Batwoman or Supergirl I think, my feed wasn't brilliant. 

[apinknightmare]

1 minute ago, Featherhat said:

It is kind of what I feared, the series went AU and we have no time to deal with it and the writers pat themselves on the back because they brought back so many characters for nostalgia and don't even have to explain it.

It didn't even feel nostalgic because the people they brought back were barely in it and we didn't get any of the interesting interaction I would've wanted from anyone. Emiko/Moira could've been interesting but it was all so...just boxes for them to check off. 

[Primal Slayer]

I'm going to assume that they didnt get the rights to Green Lantern because MG should know that the rings dont come in boxes....there is a whole speech that goes along with it..

[calliope1975]

I appreciate that Oliver's been thinking so much about reuniting with Felicity that he had the exact room and outfit picked out for her. 

OK writers - I expect a dozen PWP starting from that last scene when I wake up tomorrow. 😁

[Featherhat]

4 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

It didn't even feel nostalgic because the people they brought back were barely in it and we didn't get any of the interesting interaction I would've wanted from anyone. Emiko/Moira could've been interesting but it was all so...just boxes for them to check off. 

Oh yeah not disagreeing. A lot was unsatisfying and I wish it had been two hours or even on par with some of the "lets just chuck plot out the window and concentrate on emotions" they had going in some eps this season. But it could have been a lot worse for me. I admit whilst I would have done it differently the Olicity scene made up for a lot.

But they aren't the only thing I care about and I have about 500 other relationships I wish ended on a better/more satisfying note. And would have been better set up for if the spin off actually does go to series. 

Edited January 29, 2020 by Featherhat

[Angel12d]

What was with that weird cringe-y scene where LL is crying about E1 LL not coming back? And Quentin saying nothing about her needed changing. I laughed. WTF was that???

Edited January 29, 2020 by Angel12d

[Soulfire]

...

 

 

 

Bonus:

 

 

 

Edited January 29, 2020 by Soulfire

[Mellowyellow]

2 minutes ago, calliope1975 said:

I appreciate that Oliver's been thinking so much about reuniting with Felicity that he had the exact room and outfit picked out for her. 

OK writers - I expect a dozen PWP starting from that last scene when I wake up tomorrow. 😁

He had twenty years to obsessively plan it down to the finest details!

I just adore that he had her looking like when they first interacted and with the pen right there! The one good consistent thing about Arrow was always how smitten Oliver Queen is with Felicity Smoak. Until the very end and beyond life and death. 

[Trisha]

The big sigh SA gave when he finally hugged her after all this time. I felt that.  

[apinknightmare]

2 minutes ago, Trisha said:

The big sigh SA gave when he finally hugged her after all this time. I felt that.  

I was like yes, same and felt a calm wash over me until a clip of Blackish started playing over it

[statsgirl]

I didn't mind the William kidnapping subplot because it gave a coherence to something that would have otherwise been call backs and sadz but it really should have been 2 hours long to properly explain everything and have enough of the new re-made scenes from earlier seasons.

Loved that Nyssa considers Sara to be her beloved (not an Ava fan). I like that Mia got to tell Felicity that Oliver trained her on how to be a hero. Presumably after Nyssa had trained her how to fight.

Still resent Kara and even Barry being there.  As @Lantern7 said, there must have been a cut scene of Barry apologizing to Sara Diggle.

I will re-watch and have more to say later. Mostly I'm just sad that it is all over.

38 minutes ago, Featherhat said:

She mentioned she was magically and mysteriously transported to 2040 after Oliver's funeral so it hadn't happened yet.

But Dinah said in 2040 that all trace of her existence had been erased. After she was transported?  Doesn't make sense.

34 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

I KNOW!!! I thought it was my new teevee acting up again, but nope. So I’m left wondering-Are Oliver and Felicity in some kind of...time bubble?

In the Paradise dimension. Oliver told Felicity that he wanted to meet her again where he had first seen her. Felicity said that that would have been 7 floors down in the IT department, not his mother's office, and Oliver replied that they had all the time in the world for him to explain.

[Primal Slayer]

So they go through with this funeral....only for Sara to be like "you know....it isnt right that adult Mia doesnt get to be there to see her father laid to rest..." so essentially Sara lives through this funeral twice....is William's kidnapping due to Sara changing the timeline ever so slightly? 

[Soulfire]

17 minutes ago, Trisha said:

The big sigh SA gave when he finally hugged her after all this time. I felt that.  

When Oliver said "Glad you could finally make it" he was all of us. 

Edited January 29, 2020 by Soulfire

[bmoore4026]

OK, I'm confused.  Was that Lyla that ended up with Oliver or Felicity?  Why is Oliver's heaven his office? 

EDIT: Oh, my God!  It just hit me we're never going to see Felicity again!  I don't want Felicity to go!  I don't want Felicity to go!

Edited January 29, 2020 by bmoore4026
FELICITY!!!

[tennisgurl]

So we come not to bury Arrow, but to praise it...or something like that at least. This wasnt an awful finale or anything, it wont retroactively hurt the show for me like some shows finales (looking at you, How I Met Your Mother) but it was just so much...whatever. This really either needed to be two hours, if they so desperately thought they needed William to get kidnapped, or they needed to dump that whole plot and deal with the fallout from Oliver's death as well as exploring the post-crisis world. So many people are now back, and we hardly got to see them or what their relationships are like (is Moira close to William? Did she and Felicity ever warm to each other? How does Tommy being alive impact any of the Malcolm plots?) and what people know and what they dont. Or even interactions between characters like Felicity and William, who we never even got to see reunite! It almost felt like a normal episode (just with no Oliver) until the last ten minutes or so. 

It was great to see so many characters from seasons past, but they hardly even got to DO anything because of how rushed everything was. Plus we had to waste time with Laurel angsting about how E1 Laurel isnt here, while her Not Dad tells her how glad he is that she is there and not his daughter (wtf) and spent WAY too much time on the Newbies, and while I loved seeing some of season one style Oliver and Diggle and the List back again, the whole flashback seemed pretty pointless. I really wanted more flashbacks of everyone with Oliver as they all remembered him at different times in his life, or something so that the main hero of this show could spend more time on the actual show!

The last ten minutes or so were quite affecting though, as they desperately tried to squeeze in tons of characters and interactions into a few minutes, but those interactions did really work. It was great seeing Nyssa and Talia, Anatoly, Rory, resurrected Moira and Tommy and Quentin, even no longer dead and evil Emiko. I especially liked the brief scene between Barry and Felicity, Barry feeling guilty about Oliver dying and Felicity telling him that she knew he did everything he could was all very consistent with both their characters, and Felicity and Barry were always a friendship I enjoyed, as I always loved Barry and Oliver. I also liked the focus on how much Diggle was struggling with losing Oliver, DR just looked so hallowed out and miserable, he really sold the hell out of his grief. Plus, of course, the return of the one, the only, Felicity! And her reunion with Oliver in the office where he first saw her in their first outfits (the pen! the creepy pic! we just needed the fern!) getting to be together forever in a paradise (that looks like Queen Consolidated!) world is finally the happy ending that they deserve! One last wonderful Olicity moment for the road!

I have kind of mixed feelings about all of the resurrections. I like that some stuff did change in Crisis, probably spurred on by it being Oliver's baby universe, and I terribly missed Moira and Tommy, and Quentin when he wasnt acting like a crazy daughter stalker, and I happy thinking that they have a chance at life. On the other hand, them being retroactively brought back to life raises a TON of questions about how this timeline worked and what happened and what was affected, and everyone being alive now kind of, I dont know, cheapens all of the drama from when it happened, and Oliver's journey. I mean, if Tommy never died, when did Oliver promise to stop killing people? Its so confusing, and retroactively changes so much about the show, that I dont even know what happened now and what didnt. Moira and Tommy's deaths are some of the biggest dramatic moments in the shows history, and them now being ret-coned out of existence just takes something from the whole story. 

Really, I just didnt want this ending for Oliver. I didnt want him to die, no matter how noble of a death it was, before he got a chance to really know some peace. I wanted him and Felicity to get to live a life together, to get to raise his children, to get to know the baby Diggles, find out what he wants to do when he doesent have to beat the shit out of bad guys all of the time, work on cooking and dream journals, be a mentor and a dad. Going back to season one times just makes it even sadder for me. He was so convinced that he was made to save the city and then die after he accomplished his goal, and while he did become healthier and happier and have many more happy days...that is basically what happened. He saved the city/multiverse, and he died. I am glad that he at least gets to be with Felicity again, and has been posthumously hailed as a hero, but I thought that the best end for his story, the story of a deeply traumatized and mentally tortured person who didnt care about his own life and seemed to at times have serious death seeker tendencies and was drenched in self loathing and was seemingly desperate to sacrifice his life, actually managed to finish his fight alive, found a family and friends and things that he loved that didnt involve revenge or justice, and went on to learn to see the beauty in not only life, but in his OWN life, and that he has more to give the world than his own life.   

 

[quarks]

Ah, Arrow. You died as you lived: wildly inconsistent and with far too many scenes in warehouses and inexplicable stock footage shots, but with stunt sequences, a salmon ladder and character moments to sorta smooth over the cracks.

Sorta.

Good things:

1. Moira! My beloved Moira returned! Saved the episode for me right there.

2. Me, seven years ago: "Hey, you know who Oliver really should kill? John Byrne!"

Arrow, today: Does putting him on that list count?

3. Oliver shooting arrows up and just zip zip zipping away for one last time! YAY!

4. At least one of the news reporters survived all the way to the end! YAY!

5. Roy and Thea, united and happy at last! Yay!

6. The Queens kept their mansion! (We kinda knew that from last week's episode, but still.) YAY!

7. I'm assuming that happened largely because Spectre Oliver realized what an idiot he'd been during portions of season two, so, triple yay for some much belated character growth there, Oliver! Pity you had to die to figure that out.

8. The final funeral scene with (most) of the previous major Arrow cast members, plus Barry and Kara. I may have sniffled. I'm not saying I did, but I may have.

9. Aww, Oliver and Felicity got a happy if rather dead ending. Complete with serial killer pictures, the QC set and that red pen.

10. Aww, they ended on a shot of QC!

11. AND AFTER SEASONS AND SEASONS AND SEASONS OF TEASING THIS I OK WE FINALLY GOT GREEN LANTERN. 

12. The live posting thread. That's been fun, guys.

13.  At least the entire episode wasn't in a warehouse.

Questionable things:

1. Diggle: "I feel certain that Oliver's legacy is not over!"

Diggle, about a half hour later: "Ok, yes, even though we just had to rescue a kidnap victim, Oliver's legacy is very definitely over. See you in Metropolis!"

2. The reminder of just how many freaking people know where the Arrow Cave is and how to get into it and I'm not even counting the bad guys. "Secret bunker." Seriously?

3. Just how many people went through Cisco's doohickey thing and did they really need to? On a related note, why does everyone on Arrow - including people that probably don't need to know the truth about merged Earths and so on and indeed seem to be having problems processing this info, hi, Tommy - get to know about this while pretty much no one on Batwoman and Supergirl do?

4. I know the answer to this is "did you see our existing guest star budget?" and in the case of at least one actor, scheduling difficulties, but, gotta say, where were Team Flash (with the exception of Ralph) and Ray and, well, Malcolm and Slade? 

5. Aww. Oliver has decided that paradise is....a multibillion dollar corporation? I mean, yes, I get the nostalgia purposes here, but, a rather major change from season one's "Let's take down corporate criminals," isn't it?

6. Not to sound demanding or anything, Arrow, but you started teasing Kord Industries back in season two and kept teasing Kord in what is now four separate shows. You couldn't have had Ted Kord sneak into into the funeral? Or is this something that will be coming up on Flash or Batwoman?

7. Just me, or is it kinda sad that Oliver could only save his city by dying and becoming someone else? And that it took Oliver dying to end crime - more or less - in Star City?

8. Can we - can we REALLY - expect to see Green Lantern on the upcoming Lois and Clark show?

DON'T DISAPPOINT ME AGAIN, BERLANTI. I'VE SUFFERED THROUGH YEARS OF THESE SHOWS. I DESERVE GOOD THINGS.

Bad things:

1. I know it's not really Arrow without terrible sets, but for nostalgia's sake I feel the need to mention them just one more time.

I am also trying very, very hard to overlook just where this show decided to put Oliver's statue, while also noting that shooting at night does not cover all sins, Bamford, and this was certainly one of them.

2. Once again, nearly everything to do with Laurel - both Original Laurel and Not Laurel. I did like her scene with Tommy, and Tommy saying that it was nice to see a version of Laurel again. But, er, wait. Spectre Oliver let Tommy and Original Laurel get married and then killed off Original Laurel anyway so that Not Laurel could live? Like, is it just me or does this seem distinctly unfair to Tommy?

I can't even handwave this by saying that Moira was correct - Spectre Oliver needed to let some people die and stay dead so that he could remain Spectre Oliver, because, uh, in canon, Tommy's death affected Oliver far more than Laurel's death did. Tommy's death was what set Oliver on his "I won't kill" path, even if he broke that for Felicity's sake a few episodes later. It was a huge part of his journey to be a hero. Laurel's death, really not so much.

And Quentin's explanation was even less convincing.

Auugh. Right down to the end Arrow kept failing this character. I'm sorry, All Versions of Laurel. It's awful that even I - never one of your fans - liked you more than this show did.

3. I realize Arrow wanted to go out with everyone in costume for a final stunt scene, but, seriously not sure that kidnapping younger William was the way to go here. Not just because William has been kidnapped enough at this point that he really should be wearing a Professional Kidnap Victim T-shirt by now, but also because, hey, these guys just helped save the world and take down Beebo, and you're trying to tell me that saving a kid is on the same level and the most important thing you've ever done? No.

And, also, it completely threw off the pacing of the episode - and meant that several characters who really needed to interact more didn't get to interact more. Like, not at random, Emiko and literally everyone, Thea and Tommy, Quentin and Rene, Felicity and Thea, Kara and everyone, and so on.

But I gotta say, those last few minutes, and seeing everyone come around to honor Oliver, got me anyway.

Bye, Arrow. For all of your ups and downs, horrific sets, and hours and hours spent fighting in warehouses, it's been fun. 

[Bulldog]

I'm not even going to try to make sense of how COIE has changed realities on any Arrowverse shows anymore.  I thought the other shows had established that there were a few strays from the other Earths who were somehow thrust to this Earth when crisis occurred, sort of like some intergalactic hobos who caught the last train out of town.  Tonight, it seemed like crisis had the ability to resurrect the dead (subject to the portrayer's availability, apparently).  Oh well, I'll just go with it.

Still, all can be forgiven for that final scene.

Good bye, show.  I enjoyed you more often than not.  It was a good ride.   

[quarks]

56 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

This is Prime Moira, we are (supposed to be) living in a "new Earth". The past changed, just everyone apparently gets to remember a pre-Crisis world and have two set of memories, one that is never addressed.

More specifically, everyone on Arrow gets to remember a pre-Crisis world and have two sets of memories - or at least gets told about it. The non-superheroes/documentary filmmakers on Batwoman, Supergirl and Legends of Tomorrow seem mostly clueless. 

[Primal Slayer]

I still don't really understand how there isn't a Prime Oliver....he was able to make this new Earth with new history but he still turns into the Spectre and kind of lives outside of the timeline? This Oliver should still have a body?? that is dead?? but Oliver's soul is kind of like The Spectre? 

And why are they hellbent on making everyone's secret identities known? And is E2 Laurel still having to use E1 Laurel's identity? Does Star City know that Laurel is dead or is she thought to be alive? 

1 minute ago, quarks said:

More specifically, everyone on Arrow gets to remember a pre-Crisis world and have two sets of memories - or at least gets told about it. The non-superheroes/documentary filmmakers on Batwoman, Supergirl and Legends of Tomorrow seem mostly clueless. 

I dont understand why Moira had to know about Pre-Crisis timeline....just why? I feel like everyone knows about Pre-Crisis because they all seem to know that Oliver is the reason why this new world exists???

[scarynikki12]

21 minutes ago, bmoore4026 said:

Why is Oliver's heaven his office?

The office is where he first saw her. 

[Chaser]

After following along in the live thread  I expected to hate the episode, but I’m surprisingly fine with it? Maybe my expectations were super low. I don’t know. There were about a dozen interactions I would have loved to have seen, there were some massive logic fails and some plot that I have no idea why it was there. I mean pretty Arrow all and all. And yet, nothing made me rage. I think I only rolled my eyes once (Rene is not like Oliver) and the Laurel stuff made me laugh (they really hated E1 Laurel, like a lot). 

I liked the focus on Diggle. I like that when they couldn’t get EBR back for longer, they didn’t give us Oliver and irrelevant people flashbacks. I don’t care about 80% of the characters but I didn’t find their wrap ups offensive. 

The only time I got choked up was when Olicity was reunited. It was perfect. My OTP is immortal. 

Really I feel it could have been so much worse and I’m so relieved it wasn’t (for me).