S02.E08: Revelations

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Quote

Relationships are irreparably damaged when Damon reveals the secrets others have been hiding.

Promo:

Original air date: 8/6/19

[Ohwell]

I was hoping Damon would burn Ricky's ass with that hot pan of pizza rolls.

Pray Tell.  I have no words. 

This is fucked.up.

[Scarlett45]

I just got home, I haven’t seen the episode yet but Instagram spoiled things, Ricky and Pray Tell huh?!!

Ill stick the post in the media thread. 

[BloggerAloud]

I really liked this episode, especially the way they kept having people arguing and managing to have everybody be right in their own ways in each argument. That's far more interesting than writers telegraphing who you are supposed to be "rooting" for.

[Blakeston]

When did Angel develop such a grudge against Damon that she'd antagonize him at his celebration?

That seemed like very lazy writing to me. They should have established that she had a problem with him, or at least shown that the coke was making her lash out at people indiscriminately.

[MelloYellow]

You know an episode is a hot mess when Elektra is the rational one.

[Lonesome Rhodes]

What an enormous juxtaposition.  From the wonderful high of the earned praise, truth, and love, between Blanca and Helena to the evil scrum for attention resulting in total betrayal of family.  Pretty much the spectrum of humanity right there.

I did love Elektra's double and triple takes as she was witnessing a fair representation of her at her best, which is to say, worst.  Remy Mar-tan, indeed.

$450/month for that place in 1991?  I wish I had known about it!  

The queens' council meeting would have been so much more fun if it weren't about Predator Tell.

Of course Damon was going to take Ricky back.  He did not deserve what he got.  On his day of days, his "sibling" turned on him out of jealousy and she ended up being supported.  Blanca chose poorly.   Very, VERY, poorly.

And now the Ball becomes a Boor.  Pray was his usual instigating and fun self.  And had lost his "mother."  The contestants brought it.  Esteban won!  Nobody cared.  Damon won.  He did not care.  So damnably sad.  Tragic, actually.

This ep should have been called, "Humpty Dumpty."

[Irlandesa]

1 hour ago, BloggerAloud said:

I really liked this episode, especially the way they kept having people arguing and managing to have everybody be right in their own ways in each argument.

Yep.  The old school soap fan in me loved all the drama that made sense.  Even Ricky and Pray made sense to me and I didn't hate it.  Yes, Ricky was vulnerable and probably was attracted to how Pray was caring for him.  But Pray also clearly had shut himself off recently and I don't blame him for giving in.  His fight later on in the episode with Blanca was just terrific as were the MCs giving him grief.

The dinner scene was also great.  Elektra's reaction to hearing about Pray and Ricky is an instant meme. 

1 hour ago, Blakeston said:

When did Angel develop such a grudge against Damon that she'd antagonize him at his celebration?

I'm guessing it was the coke. She apparently did some in the bathroom.  This makes me nervous. I'm so happy for Angel. I don't want her to get ruined.

Edited August 7, 2019 by Irlandesa

[LittleIggy]

1 hour ago, Blakeston said:

When did Angel develop such a grudge against Damon that she'd antagonize him at his celebration?

That seemed like very lazy writing to me. They should have established that she had a problem with him, or at least shown that the coke was making her lash out at people indiscriminately.

I didn’t understand that either. I got so pissed at Angel who I adore. I’m glad she fessed up.

Poor Blanca eating alone at home. ☹️

The MC’s meeting was hilarious.

Didn’t know Rent a Center carried nipple clamps. 😏 Elektra has legs that don’t quit!

[Irlandesa]

Oops, two other random things I forgot to mention.

Blanca's pig tails were cute.

And they really let the fuck flags fly in this ep, didn't they?  I can't remember the last time language was so free on basic cable. (They can use the language but often self-censor.)

[tennisgurl]

So...that escalated quickly. You know things are bad when even Elektra is calling out how weird things are getting. 

Edited August 7, 2019 by tennisgurl

[AgentRXS]

I loved Elektra at the family showdown. She was everything.

I get Billy Porter's stance on the importance of showing a love scene between 2 black men on TV, but god, I really wish it wasn't Pray Tell and Ricky. I get the attraction on both sides, but it just doesn't feel right. But I guess from their perspectives, they  are on limited time anyway so they might as well enjoy each other's company. 

Poor Blanca and her empty nest. At least now it gives us an opportunity to see Blanca as the young woman she still is, and not just Mother Blanca.

Edited August 7, 2019 by AgentRXS

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Elektra's reaction to finding out Pray was sleeping with Ricky was everything!

Elektra's wrath is often wildly out of proportion and directed at the wrong people, but in this case her amount of anger was perfect. As she said, Pray shouldn't have been sleeping with Ricky. And Pray definitely deserved Elektra yelling at him, especially after he reprimanded Damon with his "don't speak to your mother like that in front of me."

Poor Papi finally won a trophy and Blanca couldn't even be bothered to watch his performance, let alone pretend to care that he won.

For the record, when someone says, "I'm a grown ass man," 99% of the time it means they're acting like a child.

Pray was right to point out to Blanca that she doesn't treat her children equally because it's true.

I'm sure the show wants me to think Ricky is growing up and being sweet because he took his supplements and made breakfast for Pray Tell, but no. It wasn't that long ago that Ricky cheated on Damon, lied to him about it, and exposed him to HIV.

Would Angel have been urging Blanca to kick her out if Papi hadn't already lined up that apartment for her?

On a shallow note, some of the outfits were so perfect, from the Body Glove ensemble to Damon's acid washed shortalls.

[Empress1]

8 hours ago, Lonesome Rhodes said:

$450/month for that place in 1991?  I wish I had known about it!  

In the Village! That's $880 today, which is still completely out of reach for an entire apartment, and would be a GREAT deal on a single room.

6 hours ago, AgentRXS said:

Poor Blanca and her empty nest. At least now it gives us an opportunity to see Blanca as the young woman she still is, and not just Mother Blanca.

She needs some friends! She's only in her 30s, right? She needs to go out and have some fun. I get that she would have a hard time dating, but still. She and Damon's teacher could stay friends, couldn't they?

So did Damon just not get tested? I can 100% understand why he would want to get out of Dodge, plus that's a job and money is money, but he still needs to get tested.

2 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Would Angel have been urging Blanca to kick her out if Papi hadn't already lined up that apartment for her?

Nope. Also when she said the last time she had a place of her own, a guy got it for her, I was like "... And this place too. Your dude presented this place to you." I assume she's paying for it herself, but it's not like she did the leg work and found the place herself.

2 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Elektra's reaction to finding out Pray was sleeping with Ricky was everything!

Elektra's wrath is often wildly out of proportion and directed at the wrong people, but in this case her amount of anger was perfect. As she said, Pray shouldn't have been sleeping with Ricky. And Pray definitely deserved Elektra yelling at him, especially after he reprimanded Damon with his "don't speak to your mother like that in front of me."

Right. No one batted an eye when Pray started dating his late boyfriend, who was considerably younger than he is, but with Ricky, as Elektra and Blanca both pointed out, the power dynamic is skewed. Plus Ricky JUST got a life-altering diagnosis. Really, he probably shouldn't be jumping into anything with anyone, but he really shouldn't be sleeping with Pray. And Pray knows better. I can understand his perspective, but he should look for that comfort elsewhere - they both should.

How tall is Elektra?!

[Ohwell]

I am so disappointed in Pray Tell.  While I can certainly understand that he'd want a relationship, having one with Ricky is one of those "don't shit where you eat" situations.  Pray knows it's wrong.  And I wanted to like Ricky but I'm beginning to think that he is a snake.  Watching him lying in Pray's nice bed, I couldn't help thinking that he thinks he's got it made now, living in a nice place with a sugar daddy. 

I'm just glad that Damon saw the light and is moving on.  I just hope he gets tested.

And when did Angel and Damon start to have conflict?  The writing for this story was very poor.

Also, Lulu is growing on me and I like her much more than Candy, R.I.P. 

[SimoneS]

Those of you who predicted a Pray Tell/Ricky hook up were right. I totally missed it and boy was that yucky. I was embarrassed for Pray Tell succumbing to the seduction of an emotionally vulnerable young man. When Elektra of all people rightly tells you off, you know you are dead wrong. 

The rest of the episode was a debacle. I couldn't figure out why Angel and Damon were going at each other. It was manufactured drama.

All my sympathy lay with Blanca who started off so happy about Damon's success only to be bewildered by the horrible behavior of everyone around her and then was left alone in that apartment.

Blanca's scene with Damon's teacher was beautifully moving and made me tear up as did that final moment with Elektra who will always be her mother no matter what happens between them.

Elektra was so freaking tall in that final scene with Blanca. Blanca barely reached her chest.

Edited August 7, 2019 by SimoneS

[ItCouldBeWorse]

1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

3 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Would Angel have been urging Blanca to kick her out if Papi hadn't already lined up that apartment for her?

Nope.

Agreed. It's almost like Angel confessed and urged Blanca to make her leave so that she wouldn't have to tell Blanca that she had found a nicer place to live and wanted to leave!

I was also surprised that Little Papi didn't try to sock Damon after he made the crack about Angel and the piers. He pretty much stayed out of the argument,  whereas I would have expected him to erupt. I guess he's distracted by his knowledge of Angel's coke use. Damon could also have said in front of Blanca that Papi knew Angel was using. I think if asked directly,  Papi wouldn't have lied about it.

[12catcrazy]

2 minutes ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Agreed. It's almost like Angel confessed and urged Blanca to make her leave so that she wouldn't have to tell Blanca that she had found a nicer place to live and wanted to leave!

I believe this 100%.  I also think that Angel is her own worst enemy.  Her career is taking off and now she's using drugs and acting like an asshole.  She is going to wind up taking a fall.  

I felt so bad for Blanca - nothing like having a nice little party to celebrate a graduation, and have the thing degenerate into a big family fight.   Totally loved Elektra's reaction during the fighting!

And I shouldn't confess this here but feel that I must: the sex scene between Pray Tell and Ricky made me squirm.    I am a hetero white woman in her 60s, and have gay friends of both sexes.  I consider myself more open-minded than many people but that scene was uncomfortable to watch and I can't figure out why.  I'm not a stranger to man on man stuff in porn films, but most of what I've seen with that stuff was kind of mechanical.   The scene in "Pose" was so intimate for lack of a better term for me.    I felt like a voyeur and I was embarrased.      I'm probably not the target audience of "Pose" but I'll bet that scene pushed some buttons with non-target viewers.  

[SnarkEnthusiast]

I would've been fine if that opening scene was revealed as a sex dream. Thought that was where it was going. To have it be real felt very fanfiction-y. "I know you told me to sleep on the couch, but oops, I slid in bed with you and woops! Your hand is suddenly on my dick."

*small voice* I guess I'm in the minority here, and I think Ricky's a grifter and don't like Pray/Ricky as a pairing at all, but I did think it was kind of condescending that everyone piled on Pray. Ricky's an adult who can take responsibility for his own poor decisions. How embarrassing for Pray though to almost come to blows with your new boy toy's 21-year-old ex. I'm fine with the booty calls, but the idea that Pray would be flustered and swooning like a high schooler after one night with Ricky is pushing it.

Angel was a real unsympathetic shithead this episode, wasn't she? I've never been more put off by her. Her new off-screen coke habit apparently went from 0-60 with the side effect of making her a smug, gaslighting asshole. I think Papi stayed out of her and Damon's petty fight because a) she started it and he knew she was being kind of a douche and b) remember Papi really likes Damon even though we barely see their friendship, so he can get away with a lot more, Looks like between the coke and vengeful photographer, the finale could be rough for Angel.

[MelloYellow]

Steven Canal missed a huge opportunity for drama. The show has conveniently ignored that since Ricky ditched Evangelista for Wintour, Elektra has become his Mother, not Blanca.

However the entire crux of everything to do with Ricky, during the graduation dinner, was about Blanca's place in Ricky's life.

Total missed opportunity.

[Blakeston]

I have many thoughts about this episode!

- MJ Rodriguez nailed all of her scenes. She had to go toe-to-toe with Billy Porter, and she absolutely held her own. She was unpolished when the series began, but she's become a force to be reckoned with.

- Dyllon Burnside, who plays Ricky, was also fantastic in the scene where he told Damon about his diagnosis. The actor who plays Damon was clearly trying his best, but couldn't compare. He's just not that strong at acting. I honestly hope they drop Damon from the show after this season. His dancing school storyline is done, and there's not much depth to the character.

- I'm dreading watching the upcoming episodes, because Angel's career is bound to be wrecked, just as she's moved out of the house and signed a lease on a new place. Most likely the creepy photographer will be responsible (he's obviously back in the storyline for a reason), although I guess he could just be a red herring. One way or another, she's going to lose out.

- Shouldn't at least one of the other emcees at the diner have taken issue with the abuse of power in the Pray Tell/Ricky relationship? Blanca and Elektra made it seem like it's a huge no-no in the ball community for an elder to date one of the "children," and the other emcees should know that better than anyone.

(That scene came across like a reinforcement of a lot of ugly stereotypes about gay men. "They don't care about sexual morality - what's important to them is getting some gossip, and finding out how well-hung Ricky is!" Blech.)

[Ohwell]

1 hour ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

*small voice* I guess I'm in the minority here, and I think Ricky's a grifter and don't like Pray/Ricky as a pairing at all, but I did think it was kind of condescending that everyone piled on Pray. Ricky's an adult who can take responsibility for his own poor decisions. How embarrassing for Pray though to almost come to blows with your new boy toy's 21-year-old ex. I'm fine with the booty calls, but the idea that Pray would be flustered and swooning like a high schooler after one night with Ricky is pushing it.

I agree with all of this, especially the bolded part.  Also, while I'm sorry about Ricky's diagnosis, I still think he sees lonely Pray Tell as someone who can take care of him.  That big breakfast he fixed for Pray Tell (with Pray's own food, I assume) didn't fool me, and it shouldn't fool Pray Tell.  

2 hours ago, 12catcrazy said:

And I shouldn't confess this here but feel that I must: the sex scene between Pray Tell and Ricky made me squirm.    I am a hetero white woman in her 60s, and have gay friends of both sexes.  I consider myself more open-minded than many people but that scene was uncomfortable to watch and I can't figure out why.  I'm not a stranger to man on man stuff in porn films, but most of what I've seen with that stuff was kind of mechanical.   The scene in "Pose" was so intimate for lack of a better term for me.    I felt like a voyeur and I was embarrased.      I'm probably not the target audience of "Pose" but I'll bet that scene pushed some buttons with non-target viewers.  

I felt the same way.  I thought the scene between them could have shown intimacy without being so graphic.  I didn't need to see all that.  (And yes, I've watched my share of all kinds of porn.) 

[SimoneS]

2 hours ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

*small voice* I guess I'm in the minority here, and I think Ricky's a grifter and don't like Pray/Ricky as a pairing at all, but I did think it was kind of condescending that everyone piled on Pray. Ricky's an adult who can take responsibility for his own poor decisions. 

I can't agree. It is the power differential. Elektra made the point, mothers, fathers, and elders don't have sex with the children in their community. Yes, these children are technically adults, but mothers, fathers, and elders are emotionally and physically responsible for them. They provide the parenting that they desperately need as they are thrown out into the world with no one else to care for them.  Pray Tell was wrong as hell to break that cultural norm and commit that more, especially with Ricky who just found out that he is positive. Ricky needed Pray' support and guidance, not his penis. I haven't felt this disappointed in a tv character in a long time.

2 hours ago, Blakeston said:

I have many thoughts about this episode!

- MJ Rodriguez nailed all of her scenes. She had to go toe-to-toe with Billy Porter, and she absolutely held her own. She was unpolished when the series began, but she's become a force to be reckoned with.

I wouldn't say that MJ Rodriguez is a "force to be reckoned with," but her acting has definitely improved this season. There are still moments when I cringe, but I give her a lot of credit for her stronger performances.

Edited August 7, 2019 by SimoneS

[Scarlett45]

17 minutes ago, SimoneS said:

I can't agree. It is the power differential. Elektra made the point, mothers, fathers, and elders don't have sex with the children in their community. Yes, these children are technically adults, but mothers, fathers, and elders are emotionally and physically responsible for them. They provide the parenting that they desperately need as they are throw out into the world with no one else to care for them.  Pray Tell was wrong as hell to break that cultural norm and commit that more, especially with Ricky who just found out that he is positive. Ricky needed Pray' support and guidance, not his penis. I haven't felt this disappointed in a tv character in a long time.

I agree with you. Yes Ricky is a legal adult, but Pray Tell is an elder in the community AND has been fulfilling an elder role in his life. This wasn’t some young guy he just met randomly. These young people gave been thrown out of their family of origin and depend on Blanca and Pray Tell types for unconditional love, emotional support, financial support etc- when sex happens it gets really squicky and lines get blurry really fast.

It’s not incestous in a biological sense but in a social sense. Same reason it’s frowned upon to have romantic and sexual relationships with God Parent figures and the like- the power dynamic is screwed. I also think Ricky is a user and a schemer who is looking for a meal ticket. He saw one in Pray. 

In my head Pray is the most wrong as an elder figure but Ricky isn’t an innocent who was taken advantage of. 

[Lonesome Rhodes]

As was amply demonstrated in this ep, the young folk have all had their emotional growth significantly stunted.  Their basal age is much lower than their age from birth.  Abuse will do that.  

This is why Preying Tell's actions are despicable.  He, of all the characters, gets what it means to deal with a stunted and difficult growth throughout a life.  He let lust overtake him.  Way to perpetuate that evil, dude.

There's no fully coming back from the breaks we witnessed.  Those are wounds that will never close entirely.  Pose insists it is about something greater than gender identity.  It took real guts to portray the all-too common fissures and emotional immaturities manifested in the gay community.  There are individual exceptions in the real world, but none in this story.  I am at a loss as to how the show goes much further without blowing away its integrity.  I severely doubt it will simply document the declines of the folks many of us have come to love.  Will it be enough that, say, Blanca comes through strong?  It's Lather.  Rinse.  Repeat, at this point.  New families?  Another murder?  Sickness?  Forgiveness, followed by betrayal, followed by forgiveness, followed by...  

[Ohwell]

Since we saw Damon give two dances last night, I wonder if this is the actor's last season?  It almost seemed like they were his farewell performances.

[Angelsmom1009]

12 hours ago, AgentRXS said:

Poor Blanca and her empty nest. At least now it gives us an opportunity to see Blanca as the young woman she still is, and not just Mother Blanca.

Definitely! I think Blanca is only in her late 20s, and she has so lovingly given her life to her kids. She deserves some self-serving happiness in her life. And not going to lie, I got a little misty watching her sit there alone at her table, and started thinking about when my kids "leave the nest" (mind you, my kids are 7 and 1 LOL).

8 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Elektra's reaction to finding out Pray was sleeping with Ricky was everything!

Elektra's wrath is often wildly out of proportion and directed at the wrong people, but in this case her amount of anger was perfect. As she said, Pray shouldn't have been sleeping with Ricky. And Pray definitely deserved Elektra yelling at him, especially after he reprimanded Damon with his "don't speak to your mother like that in front of me."

For the record, when someone says, "I'm a grown ass man," 99% of the time it means they're acting like a child.

Pray was right to point out to Blanca that she doesn't treat her children equally because it's true.

I'm sure the show wants me to think Ricky is growing up and being sweet because he took his supplements and made breakfast for Pray Tell, but no. It wasn't that long ago that Ricky cheated on Damon, lied to him about it, and exposed him to HIV.

Agree with the bolded. Elektra was on point with her reprimand, and I am legit SO disappointed in this pairing. I get  Pray feeling vulnerable and weak in the moment. I also get feeling wanted despite being HIV+. But like Elektra said, Pray is an elder and knows how these youngins are. And sleeping with someone you are supposed to be a father figure to is so damaging to a young person who is dealing with so much. I'm sure it's comforting, but also confusing, and I don't think it's going to end well. But I also think Ricky is a bit of a grifter and is a willing participant in "survival sex." What better way to solidify your future than taking up with an older man in a nice apartment, who can take care of you financially because he has a steady job, gives you great access to meds and vitamins, and you don't have to worry about infecting because he's already infected? So they're both not innocent parties in this and I don't think it's going to end well.

5 hours ago, Empress1 said:

In the Village! That's $880 today, which is still completely out of reach for an entire apartment, and would be a GREAT deal on a single room.

Right?! Again, my husband and I both went "Oof!" when Papi mentioned the monthly rent. You can't even get a decent room in Manhattan for that price. There are handful of rent controlled apartments scattered in NYC that people are holding on to with bloody fingernails, and I totally get why.

4 hours ago, 12catcrazy said:

And I shouldn't confess this here but feel that I must: the sex scene between Pray Tell and Ricky made me squirm.    I am a hetero white woman in her 60s, and have gay friends of both sexes.  I consider myself more open-minded than many people but that scene was uncomfortable to watch and I can't figure out why.  I'm not a stranger to man on man stuff in porn films, but most of what I've seen with that stuff was kind of mechanical.   The scene in "Pose" was so intimate for lack of a better term for me.    I felt like a voyeur and I was embarrased. I'm probably not the target audience of "Pose" but I'll bet that scene pushed some buttons with non-target viewers.  

You're not alone. I felt the same, and it's probably because there was no build up to this passionate tryst between Pray and Ricky. No flirting or side looks, literally Ricky just began lusting after Pray in the previous episode. So that made it weird. And I get Billy Porter's stance on seeing two black gay men making love on network television, but honestly...Noah's Arc did it better 10 years ago. #noahandwade

3 hours ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

Angel was a real unsympathetic shithead this episode, wasn't she? I've never been more put off by her. Her new off-screen coke habit apparently went from 0-60 with the side effect of making her a smug, gaslighting asshole. I think Papi stayed out of her and Damon's petty fight because a) she started it and he knew she was being kind of a douche and b) remember Papi really likes Damon even though we barely see their friendship, so he can get away with a lot more, Looks like between the coke and vengeful photographer, the finale could be rough for Angel.

Good lord, yes she was. This was the first time I was not a fan of hers, and I want to blame the coke...but I also think that she's really feeling herself because of this new found fame and fortune, and is looking down her powdered nose at everyone now. It's so ridiculous because a model's career can be just as short lived as a dancer's but at least Damon has a degree to fall back on. He could at least teach dance at a school or something once the tours dry up. What is Angel going to do once the industry decides her look isn't "it" anymore and they move on to the next girl? Combine that with a very expensive drug habit...I hope she doesn't piss away this opportunity.

2 hours ago, Blakeston said:

I have many thoughts about this episode!

- MJ Rodriguez nailed all of her scenes. She had to go toe-to-toe with Billy Porter, and she absolutely held her own. She was unpolished when the series began, but she's become a force to be reckoned with.

- Dyllon Burnside, who plays Ricky, was also fantastic in the scene where he told Damon about his diagnosis. The actor who plays Damon was clearly trying his best, but couldn't compare. He's just not that strong at acting. I honestly hope they drop Damon from the show after this season. His dancing school storyline is done, and there's not much depth to the character.

Yes to both of these! MJ has come a long way with her acting skills for sure. Dyllon (Ricky) also nailed his scene. The actor that plays Damon however (I think his name is Ryan Jamaal Swain)....eh. I kept waiting for him to pull out more emotion, more SOMETHING when Ricky told him his diagnosis, and it was just...flat. He's definitely not a strong actor and hasn't made any improvement since the first season. It looks like his character is going to be written off the show for a while, if not permanently, which is probably for the best.

[Empress1]

4 minutes ago, Angelsmom1009 said:

Right?! Again, my husband and I both went "Oof!" when Papi mentioned the monthly rent. You can't even get a decent room in Manhattan for that price. There are handful of rent controlled apartments scattered in NYC that people are holding on to with bloody fingernails, and I totally get why.

My grandmother lived in her Brooklyn 2BR/2bath for 30 years and I think she paid $850, which is a ridiculously good deal. She's no longer living there (or ... living, heh, gallows humor) and I should look up what it costs now. I have a cousin living in a rent-controlled place in Brooklyn too. I have a college friend who grew up in NYC (we went to school there) and his parents retired and moved to a place they own outside the city, and he lives in the rent-controlled apartment he grew up in. He's like "I hope my son wants to stay in the city!" 

I used to know someone who was living in her late grandmother's apartment in Stuy Town (very big but definitely looked like someone's grandmother had lived there, heh) and she eventually had to move, but I forget why. (She left NYC altogether.)

9 minutes ago, Angelsmom1009 said:

He could at least teach dance at a school or something once the tours dry up.

And he already has teaching experience, and a mentor who I bet would help him any way she could. He's positioned pretty well. He could dance, teach, choreograph ...

I kind of assume an addiction storyline is coming for Angel. I was glad when someone mentioned her coke sweats because they were so obvious (though Pray was sweaty too, so maybe it was just warm on set that day!), and I think we're supposed to see that the "party favor" has become something she does more often.

Totally agree with those who say Ricky is at least low-key grifting here.

[Ohwell]

While I love that Papi is being supportive of Angel, I do think he's being too supportive and he thinks of her as some kind of goddess that he should worship.  I'm not looking forward to the inevitable letdown when she kicks him to the curb, because she's already started smelling herself.

I'd like to know what he's doing for himself.  Where is he working?  Has that come up? 

[Irlandesa]

1 hour ago, Angelsmom1009 said:

but honestly...Noah's Arc did it better 10 years ago. #noahandwade

Sure.  10 years ago.  And I think that's why the writer/director decided to go all out because it's not like people have tons of other scenes to compare it to. No one says we've already had a straight hetero love scene on TV, no need to see more.  They might think it but it's rarely a complaint found with straight love scenes. It wasn't about what straight women who haven't minded watching man-on-man action before do or don't need to see. Because of the lack of buildup, I found it to be a little clinical and fan fictiony but whatever, since there's such a dearth of similar representation, I can handle it.

I also am not that affronted or think it was necessarily a violation.  Both are facing a death sentence.  It's not like they have an expectation of having to know how to live with HIV for the next few decades like they might now.  Sex can be comfort and they're taking advantage of that.  They might be low key using one another but I don't always see that as a bad thing.

[SimoneS]

4 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

I also think Ricky is a user and a schemer who is looking for a meal ticket. He saw one in Pray. 

In my head Pray is the most wrong as an elder figure but Ricky isn’t an innocent who was taken advantage of. 

Ricky learnt those skills to survive on the street. Like the other children, Ricky lost his family, was homeless and engaging in prostitution to survive. If Blanca hadn't rescued him, after a year living on the streets Damon likely would have been Ricky, a desperate grifter. And Pray Tell knows this! I don't know the show's intent here, but it is so disappointing to see Pray Tell abandon his role as elder, mentor, and father so he can have sex. 

Edited August 7, 2019 by SimoneS

[SimoneS]

I was so upset at Pray Tell that I forgot to mention that I really enjoyed Damon's dance at the theater. I saw the Alvin Ailey II dancers perform, his signature work, Revelations was my favorite of all their numbers and that piece that Damon did was performed. 

ETA: I just saw the episode was titled, Revelations. Doh!

Edited August 8, 2019 by SimoneS

[tennisgurl]

Yeah, I am super not into this Ricky/Pray hook up, for numerous reasons to be honest. First of all, it’s so totally out of nowhere, then getting it on just gave me whiplash. They had, like Pray and most of the younger guys on the show, had a kind of surrogate father/son relationship until Ricky awkwardly hit on him out of nerves when he was getting tested, and now it’s straight down to bone town? What now? But what really gets me is that, as multiple people pointed out in the episode, this is a really messed up power dynamic, a major taboo in their culture, and it just feels...wrong to me. I mean the age difference is certainly a thing, but the real issue is that before this, he was a mentor/father figure for Ricki, so him now sleeping with him just seems like he is abandoning that role of mentor to the next generation (which he’s been talking about all season!) so that he can get some, and that’s just deeply disappointing to me. Besides, Ricki literally just found out he was HIV positive and really seems to be looking for something solid to hold onto, and sex is something he knows really well, and Pray has to be aware of all of that, but he just went ahead with it. Yeah Rickis an adult, but Pray has to know that this is messed up when it comes to power dynamics between them, being his houses unofficial team dad. And while I totally respect Billy Porter and his excitement to do a sex scene between two black men and what that means for representation, the greater context really hurts the positive representation that it looks like on paper. Yeah it was sweet and earnest (but also looked kinda mechanical and awkward to me, like not even the character buy this) but it also blew up all the characters lives and was a guy having sex with a person who until this thought of them as a parental figure and role model. It’s just not where I wanted this show to go, and I don’t really get the point if it besides to cause more drama.

Edited August 7, 2019 by tennisgurl

[ItCouldBeWorse]

2 hours ago, Ohwell said:

While I love that Papi is being supportive of Angel, I do think he's being too supportive and he thinks of her as some kind of goddess that he should worship.  I'm not looking forward to the inevitable letdown when she kicks him to the curb, because she's already started smelling herself.

I'd like to know what he's doing for himself.  Where is he working?  Has that come up? 

It was mentioned in a previous episode that he got his GED and has been working at a hotel, at times picking up extra shifts.

[Ohwell]

Sadly--and I hate to say this--but I think Billy Porter started smelling himself, just like the character Angel did on this show.

19 minutes ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

It was mentioned in a previous episode that he got his GED and has been working at a hotel, at times picking up extra shifts.

Oh, ok thanks.

[mtlchick]

When Electra is the one that's rational, it's both an eye opener and a problem.  

I guess Pray and Ricky felt "we may as well screw since we're both screwed health wise.  What's the worst that can happen to us now?"  As a straight woman, I will say that scene was hot enough.  But at the same time I was like "why did either of them think this was a good idea?"  And I'm trying to think who was dumber, Pray for giving in because of loneliness or Ricky who, despite getting a diagnosis, still cheated repeatedly and was tested a few times before.   Ricky may look like a "grown ass man" but he's still just a "kid."  And Pray, being a grown ass man, should have thought how bad this looks.  I didn't think about the grifter angle but it wouldn't surprise me if it leads to that. 

The beginning and the end of the episode were of two extremes.  It started with Pray giving in partly due to his loneliness, it ends with Blanca being lonely as her kids left her.  

[Starchild]

You want a revelation? I've got a revelation for you.

Billy Fucking Porter, bitch!

[Scarlett45]

I got to see the episode. I still concur with my posts up thread. After viewing I wonder if Blanca plays favorites with Angel because she identifies with her more as another trans woman of color. It’s not right, but I can see her thinking that Damon, Ricky and Papi don’t need her protection as much because they have their male privilege. 

Yes Electra was the voice of reason and I love her in this episode. 

Angel was a bitch to Damon for no reason- it must be the drugs. 

[Empress1]

4 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

And while I totally respect Billy Porter and his excitement to do a sex scene between two black men and what that means for representation, the greater context really hurts the positive representation that it looks like on paper.

This is the crux of it, for me.

[MelloYellow]

Blanca definitely plays favorites.

How quick was she to believe Papi led Angel astray? Or when was the last time she had a conversation with Ricky which didn't involve interrogation?

Angel & Damon are her clear favorites, but at the end of the day it's Angel who Blanca views as a potential surrogate.

[Irlandesa]

10 minutes ago, MelloYellow said:

Angel & Damon are her clear favorites, but at the end of the day it's Angel who Blanca views as a potential surrogate.

I think she sees Angel as the person who would become "mother" should she die.

[dmeets]

58 minutes ago, MelloYellow said:

Blanca definitely plays favorites.

How quick was she to believe Papi led Angel astray? Or when was the last time she had a conversation with Ricky which didn't involve interrogation?

Angel & Damon are her clear favorites, but at the end of the day it's Angel who Blanca views as a potential surrogate.

Blanca thinks so poorly of Papi that I feel awful for him.

Edited August 8, 2019 by dmeets

[RealReality]

18 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Pray was right to point out to Blanca that she doesn't treat her children equally because it's true.

I'm sure the show wants me to think Ricky is growing up and being sweet because he took his supplements and made breakfast for Pray Tell, but no. It wasn't that long ago that Ricky cheated on Damon, lied to him about it, and exposed him to HIV.

Would Angel have been urging Blanca to kick her out if Papi hadn't already lined up that apartment for her?

I really like Ricky and never expected to. 

I was proud of him for telling Damon.  I know it's the right thing to do, but it must have been scary on so many levels for him and he is just trying to come to terms with it himself.  I think it's a sign of maturity, because the easier route would be to say nothing (even though pray would have eventually said something)

You're right, can't discount that he exposed Damon to HIV.  But I still feel that he felt he couldn't get it for whatever reason he gave himself.

Kudos to you all for predicting that pray and Ricky would happen.  

Angel was looking to get kicked out, which I thought was kinda mean on her part to force Blanca to do it.  If you want to move and you're an adult say that you want to move so you can do your medical grade cocaine in peace. 

On 8/6/2019 at 8:49 PM, MelloYellow said:

You know an episode is a hot mess when Elektra is the rational one.

I love me some Electra.....getting her Remy Martin and refusing to leave cause the drama was too juicy!  

23 hours ago, LittleIggy said:

The MC’s meeting was hilarious.

Didn’t know Rent a Center carried nipple clamps. 😏 Elektra has legs that don’t quit!

Yes please more MCs!!!! I loved that scene!  Loved the dialogue, I hope we get more of that!

Edited August 8, 2019 by RealReality

[RealReality]

9 hours ago, Angelsmom1009 said:

Definitely! I think Blanca is only in her late 20s, and she has so lovingly given her life to her kids. She deserves some self-serving happiness in her life. And not going to lie, I got a little misty watching her sit there alone at her table, and started thinking about when my kids "leave the nest" (mind you, my kids are 7 and 1 LOL).

Agree with the bolded. Elektra was on point with her reprimand, and I am legit SO disappointed in this pairing. I get  Pray feeling vulnerable and weak in the moment. I also get feeling wanted despite being HIV+. But like Elektra said, Pray is an elder and knows how these youngins are. And sleeping with someone you are supposed to be a father figure to is so damaging to a young person who is dealing with so much. I'm sure it's comforting, but also confusing, and I don't think it's going to end well. But I also think Ricky is a bit of a grifter and is a willing participant in "survival sex." What better way to solidify your future than taking up with an older man in a nice apartment, who can take care of you financially because he has a steady job, gives you great access to meds and vitamins, and you don't have to worry about infecting because he's already infected? So they're both not innocent parties in this and I don't think it's going to end well.

Right?! Again, my husband and I both went "Oof!" when Papi mentioned the monthly rent. You can't even get a decent room in Manhattan for that price. There are handful of rent controlled apartments scattered in NYC that people are holding on to with bloody fingernails, and I totally get why.

You're not alone. I felt the same, and it's probably because there was no build up to this passionate tryst between Pray and Ricky. No flirting or side looks, literally Ricky just began lusting after Pray in the previous episode. So that made it weird. And I get Billy Porter's stance on seeing two black gay men making love on network television, but honestly...Noah's Arc did it better 10 years ago. #noahandwade

Good lord, yes she was. This was the first time I was not a fan of hers, and I want to blame the coke...but I also think that she's really feeling herself because of this new found fame and fortune, and is looking down her powdered nose at everyone now. It's so ridiculous because a model's career can be just as short lived as a dancer's but at least Damon has a degree to fall back on. He could at least teach dance at a school or something once the tours dry up. What is Angel going to do once the industry decides her look isn't "it" anymore and they move on to the next girl? Combine that with a very expensive drug habit...I hope she doesn't piss away this opportunity.

Yes to both of these! MJ has come a long way with her acting skills for sure. Dyllon (Ricky) also nailed his scene. The actor that plays Damon however (I think his name is Ryan Jamaal Swain)....eh. I kept waiting for him to pull out more emotion, more SOMETHING when Ricky told him his diagnosis, and it was just...flat. He's definitely not a strong actor and hasn't made any improvement since the first season. It looks like his character is going to be written off the show for a while, if not permanently, which is probably for the best.

It may be survival sex.  Ricky has lost Damon, he has a deadly disease, he doesnt have a family.  He is house of wintour, but you know Elektra isn't the huggy type.  Even when Ricky was at Blanca's he seemed to be tolerated.

He has nothing....it may not be for the money but for the stability that he is clinging to pray.  It is sad in a way because I think that had pray kept his distance he could have made Ricky feel that he was more than a piece of hot meat.  But Ricky can trade on the one thing that he has always had to fall back on.  So sad.  

I might have a soft spot for the actor, I think he is adorable and everytime he smiles I want to hug him.

[MelloYellow]

I don't think Ricky's a grifter.

He just one of those people who struggles to distinguish emotional intimacy from physical intimacy.

[JohnnyGilda]

I felt a decent degree of uncomfortable watching Pray cross a line he probably shouldn't cross with Ricky, but I was glad to see that scene in this show, and on TV. Not since Noah's Arc, and all that...and I wasn't watching Noah's Arc.

The Angel v Damon battle did come on fast, but once Lulu jumped in, I think that signaled what the show was going for (the medical grade blow strikes again), so I went with it.

Council meeting was a hoot. Maybe the emcees can work out a rotation schedule with the ladies who took their booth. And Femme Queen Vogue is one of my favorite categories, too, Pray!

[Mattipoo]

Loved the diner scene with the emcees. Reminds me of Sex and the City. I would watch a show featuring the 4 emcees and their sex lives.

Elektra's reaction to Ricky and Pray Tell was everything. Her actress's acting has definitely improved since last season.

The sex scene between Pray and Ricky was pretty hot, but the power differential between them is a little icky to me.

Blanca crying at the end was heartbreaking. Loved the montage set to Mariah's Love Takes Time.

Damon should get tested shouldn't he?

[Gummo]

I get the feeling that his whole life Ricky has only been valued for his looks and sexuality, so that is the only way he knows how to relate to others, as a seducer, whether emotionally or physically or both.

So when he felt gratitude to Pray Tell for helping him thru the clinic visit and everything that came after, the only way he knew how to express it was as a sexual feeling. When we've seen him get in trouble with Damon or Blanca, he does the same thing - turns on that smile and tries to charm/seduce them out of their anger. Because his whole life, Ricky's been told that's all he has to offer.

IOW, he's a mess. Add to that a deadly medical diagnosis, and his decisions are not to be trusted. 

So I blame Pray. He knew what was right. And if he was feeling weak, he had plenty of support to call on to talk it out. Instead, he took the easy way out.

I mean, we've found the line even Elektra won't cross! Break Damon's foot, destroy his career, all for a ball trophy? No problem! But crossing that divide and sleeping with one of the "children" was too much even for her.

[SimoneS]

Elektra was a star in the episode. From her enjoyment of the drama in House of Evangelista to laying into Pray Tell to comforting a heartbroken Blanca. I loved how she pointedly told Blanca that they are raising children to leave them not to be parasites, reminding Blanca about how she left Elektra and then telling her that her children will appreciate their mother when she was dead. Her acting is still shaky, but Elektra is the woman.

Edited August 8, 2019 by SimoneS

[ElectricBoogaloo]

One thing I loved about the council meeting is how they went from sulky about Pray being late to elated when he revealed he was seeing someone. They might bitch at each other all the time but they clearly love each other and were happy for him when they saw how happy he was.

I loved Elektra's speech to Blanca because when I was in middle school, I read something that said the purpose of being a parent is to raise your children to become independent adults who can make good decisions and don't need you to take care of them. Blanca is used to be in the role of being a mom to toddlers - having to tell them what to do, remind them that they still haven't done it, set goals for them, nudge them, monitor their behavior, reprimand them when they break the rules, etc. Her children were pretty emotionally stunted when she became their mother, but under her care they have been growing up and now they feel like they're ready to leave the nest (whether or not they're actually ready to leave and take care of themselves is another story - ANGEL). She should be proud of herself for getting them to this point, but it's hard to see that when you feel abandoned and alone. I hope that she takes this opportunity to make herself happy. She has her nail salon and she has frenemies like Elektra but there's a whole world out there of other people to meet, things to see and do.

I really don't think Angel is ready to be on her own. Sure, she's making enough money to pay her own rent but that doesn't mean she's a mature responsible adult. She just wants to play house with Papi and do coke without sneaking around. I have a feeling she's going to make some big mistakes and then have to move back in with Blanca.