S13.E12 Will Returns to China

[bichonblitz]

Bill's dad crying on camera over what a great kid Will is did nothing for me. Was he crying for his kids when he left them and their mom had to go on welfare and work 3 jobs to keep a roof over their heads while he lived in a 4 bedroom house with his new woman? 

Bill's mom and stepdad are sweet people. I noticed  his mom really did not interact with his dad at all. She is keeping the peace in order to have a relationship with her grandkids. That is all. I wouldn't expect anything more from her. She's a classy lady. 

[DkNNy79]

22 minutes ago, readheaded said:

Me, too.  And, stature didn't seem to hurt Matt Roloff's extracurricular activities, even before he was on reality TV.

Bill's dad didn't retire from the military, so there wouldn't have been any financial benefits from his service to be had for him or his family.   

Bill was, indeed, industrious and successful well before reality TV, which is why I think some people find the whole idea that he couldn't or doesn't pull his financial weight a strange idea.  

Agree.  Both Bill and Jen are very smart, ambitious and successful in their own right even before TLC came along.  Wow, I didn't know about Bill's family struggles when the dad left.  That is a pretty shitty thing to do.  I definitely would've resented my dad if he and his "other" family were thriving while we were barely getting by on welfare.  I'm glad that everyone seems to have made amends and are able to have a normal if not at least cordial relationship.

I have such a greater admiration for Barbara and Judy for the way they supported their families when their husbands jumped ship.

[readheaded]

25 minutes ago, DkNNy79 said:

Agree.  Both Bill and Jen are very smart, ambitious and successful in their own right even before TLC came along.  Wow, I didn't know about Bill's family struggles when the dad left.  That is a pretty shitty thing to do.  I definitely would've resented my dad if he and his "other" family were thriving while we were barely getting by on welfare.  I'm glad that everyone seems to have made amends and are able to have a normal if not at least cordial relationship.

I have such a greater admiration for Barbara and Judy for the way they supported their families when their husbands jumped ship.

Me, too, especially while they were trying to successfully parent kids with special needs.  

[humbleopinion]

 Barbara's thought bubble when watching her ex hijack the rickshaw...What a jackass.....

[BitterApple]

50 minutes ago, humbleopinion said:

 Barbara's thought bubble when watching her ex hijack the rickshaw...What a jackass.....

It's funny because I'm sure Barbara was devastated when she was abandoned with the kids, but looks like she won in the end. Her husband seems like a very kind, considerate man. 

[humbleopinion]

Chuckster Fan Club...

[readheaded]

2 hours ago, bichonblitz said:

Bill's dad crying on camera over what a great kid Will is did nothing for me. Was he crying for his kids when he left them and their mom had to go on welfare and work 3 jobs to keep a roof over their heads while he lived in a 4 bedroom house with his new woman? 

Bill's mom and stepdad are sweet people. I noticed  his mom really did not interact with his dad at all. She is keeping the peace in order to have a relationship with her grandkids. That is all. I wouldn't expect anything more from her. She's a classy lady. 

Yeah, Bill's dad seems like a blowhard to me and I don't completely buy his emotion, but I get where he's coming from.  Having 2 kids with a chronic illness, I remember when they were first diagnosed and feeling so afraid that they'd never be able to have "normal" lives and fearing that they'd have a diminished future.  As they've gotten older (one's now a college grad and working a "big boy" job and the other's doing well in high school and pursuing things he loves), I find I have flashes of emotion where I'm so grateful that some of my fears aren't coming to fruition.  It has to be so gratifying for Bill and Jen's parents to see them successful and happy with children of their own given that they both wanted that for themselves.  

[JerseyGirl]

How did Bill and family pay for NYU?  It's a very expensive private university, not a State university where I could see him getting scholarships and State aid.  The tuition alone is over $40,000 a year!

[Spike]

16 minutes ago, JerseyGirl said:

How did Bill and family pay for NYU?  It's a very expensive private university, not a State university where I could see him getting scholarships and State aid.  The tuition alone is over $40,000 a year!

If I recall he wasn’t very happy there and came close to jumping from a building.

[readheaded]

25 minutes ago, JerseyGirl said:

How did Bill and family pay for NYU?  It's a very expensive private university, not a State university where I could see him getting scholarships and State aid.  The tuition alone is over $40,000 a year!

It's just as possible that he got grants and scholarships there as it would have been if he'd gone to a state school.  

[Libby]

In the scene with the hats where Bill was pretending he was a zombie and the kids were hiding behind the table, was that a restaurant?

If it was a restaurant, that was totally low class behavior. A restaurant isn't a playground. Other people are trying to eat in peace.

Jen said that she didn't think that daddy should play that game here. That makes me think that it was a restaurant.

Bill and his dad have no class. They think that they are funny, when in reality, they are annoying. It's sad that they are teaching the kids their bad behavior.

[chicorex1]

On 12/5/2018 at 6:03 AM, Honey said:

The presence of chicken feet, in a food market

Hi, I'm asian and live in Hawaii and have bought chicken feet and cooked the feet. I  cook and simmer the feet for and hour  to soften the cartilage then put some shoyu for taste of a drink if you like.They cost abou 1.60 a lb. Their is a little meat on them, I remember when Jen was talking with her co-workers and they asked if she ate chicken feet.I also liked if the could visit NEW DAY FOSTER HOME again. I still read about them and keep in touch with them.

[sATL]

8 hours ago, JerseyGirl said:

How did Bill and family pay for NYU?  It's a very expensive private university, not a State university where I could see him getting scholarships and State aid.  The tuition alone is over $40,000 a year!

I'm sure he did get some academic scholarships if he had the HS grades & test scores to get in. Plus he's the oldest of 3 , and his mom was making a small salary so  possible that would have qualified him for financial aid awarded directly from the school. NYU does has a considerable university endowment fund. And there is always loans.

Same is true for Jen. who completed her  undergrad at University of Miami in Florida, which is private, then a  medical degree at Johns Hopkins.

People spend (or borrow) money on what they want to. That is why I take a small step back on stories where there is "no money" - sometimes the lack of $$ can open a door.  Yes, there might have not been $$ for vacations, fancy cars, and other things, but when it comes to education, there is no financial limit and where's there a will , there is a way.

Edited December 8, 2018 by sATL

[floridamom]

I watched the episode yesterday. Did I actually see Zoe swat Jen's hand a couple of times in the chef's kitchen? Can't believe that. She's going to be a force to reckon with when she's 14. Not cute at all; I don't really care for their parenting style at all. I have 2 of my own and I would NEVER tolerate any behavior of that type. They will be 'doormat' parents, afraid of losing their children's "love"; they already don't have their respect. I put love in quotation marks because I think those children are likely bribed in to their lives with Bill and Jen. I don't think they have a true sense of real life. Who lives so lavishly as they do; go to Disney World on a whim, travel internationally like they do. A child Will's age wanting to go to China has no real basis of desire IMO. He asks; he gets. No idea of the magnitude of a trip like that. Mostly wasted on a child of his age; perhaps when he's older and would/could appreciate it. I also noticed that Will was placed in a pre school class with 4 and 5 year olds who seemed more mature than he did. Why not put him in an appropriate grade level class? 

[pdlinda]

8 hours ago, floridamom said:

I watched the episode yesterday. Did I actually see Zoe swat Jen's hand a couple of times in the chef's kitchen? Can't believe that. She's going to be a force to reckon with when she's 14. Not cute at all; I don't really care for their parenting style at all. I have 2 of my own and I would NEVER tolerate any behavior of that type. They will be 'doormat' parents, afraid of losing their children's "love"; they already don't have their respect. I put love in quotation marks because I think those children are likely bribed in to their lives with Bill and Jen. I don't think they have a true sense of real life. Who lives so lavishly as they do; go to Disney World on a whim, travel internationally like they do. A child Will's age wanting to go to China has no real basis of desire IMO. He asks; he gets. No idea of the magnitude of a trip like that. Mostly wasted on a child of his age; perhaps when he's older and would/could appreciate it. I also noticed that Will was placed in a pre school class with 4 and 5 year olds who seemed more mature than he did. Why not put him in an appropriate grade level class? 

I have many of the same thoughts. 

I wonder if Will and Zoey have any understanding and/or appreciation of the fact that MOST children in the USA do NOT live the lavish lifestyle they do???  Even parents, who may be financially comfortable, do NOT access their children to all these material things ad infinitum seemingly to excess. 

I know the kids are on the young side; however,these are the years when values are instilled.  Constantly indulging them with excessive creature comforts on demand may not result in success in the character-building department of life.

[sATL]

8 hours ago, floridamom said:

I watched the episode yesterday. Did I actually see Zoe swat Jen's hand a couple of times in the chef's kitchen? Can't believe that. She's going to be a force to reckon with when she's 14. Not cute at all; I don't really care for their parenting style at all. I have 2 of my own and I would NEVER tolerate any behavior of that type. They will be 'doormat' parents, afraid of losing their children's "love"; they already don't have their respect. I put love in quotation marks because I think those children are likely bribed in to their lives with Bill and Jen. I don't think they have a true sense of real life. Who lives so lavishly as they do; go to Disney World on a whim, travel internationally like they do. A child Will's age wanting to go to China has no real basis of desire IMO. He asks; he gets. No idea of the magnitude of a trip like that. Mostly wasted on a child of his age; perhaps when he's older and would/could appreciate it. I also noticed that Will was placed in a pre school class with 4 and 5 year olds who seemed more mature than he did. Why not put him in an appropriate grade level class? 

the class in china ? My guess is that they were learning into to  calligraphy (ie arts/crafts) - which Will does not know. If Zoey was awake, that would be her class.

Did the teacher say the class was learning something about self discipline? That was about when I lost satellite.. I truely wanted to see that lesson...

This might be a bad rumor, but it is possible that classes overseas are not on the same pace level as classes in the US. A 6-7 yr old class in china, could be like US 3-4 grade. 

now I would love to see his class/teacher/room in FL or even the old one in Houston.. Based on age, that would make him a rising 1st grader right ?

Edited December 8, 2018 by sATL

[Absolom]

If this was filmed fall last year he would have been 7 and if in an age placement class would have been in second grade.   If the rumors that the kids are not placed in their age norm class are true, then Will probably was in a kindergarten class at the time.  

[Libby]

4 hours ago, sATL said:

 

Did the teacher say the class was learning something about self discipline? That was about when I lost satellite.. I truely wanted to see that lesson...

 

Yes, it was a very nice lesson. It was teaching the children to be polite, courteous, and to respect their parents.  This is a lesson that the Arnold-Klein children desperately need. Will and Zoey are definitely not taught these behaviors by their parents.

[SabineElisabeth]

16 hours ago, pdlinda said:

I wonder if Will and Zoey have any understanding and/or appreciation of the fact that MOST children in the USA do NOT live the lavish lifestyle they do???  Even parents, who may be financially comfortable, do NOT access their children to all these material things ad infinitum seemingly to excess. 

On 12/8/2018 at 5:30 AM, floridamom said:

I don't think they have a true sense of real life. Who lives so lavishly as they do; go to Disney World on a whim, travel internationally like they do. A child Will's age wanting to go to China has no real basis of desire IMO. He asks; he gets. 

As Will and Zoey learn more about the circumstances surrounding their adoptions, they will no doubt continue to develop an understanding that  many, many children/people around the world are impoverished, as well as an appreciation of the fact that they themselves were born into a "lifestyle" where they didn't have access to many of the most basic life necessities.  In addition, doing things such as helping during the holiday party held at the children's hospital, choosing gifts to donate to children for Christmas, etc, will give them first hand knowledge of just how fortunate they are, in all areas of their lives.  IMHO, a large number of people go through their whole lives having only an intellectual understanding of what is to them an abstract concept, whereas Will and Zoey will have actual experiential understanding of their current standard of living as compared to that of others - both from having lived it and if not actually having concrete memories, at least maintaining an awareness of that past and its after effects, as well as from the volunteer activities to which they are exposed by Bill and Jennifer.  All of which will give them a much more authentic, accurate "basis of desire" than most of us will ever have.

On 12/8/2018 at 5:30 AM, floridamom said:

I also noticed that Will was placed in a pre school class with 4 and 5 year olds who seemed more mature than he did. Why not put him in an appropriate grade level class? 

14 hours ago, Absolom said:

If this was filmed fall last year he would have been 7 and if in an age placement class would have been in second grade.   If the rumors that the kids are not placed in their age norm class are true, then Will probably was in a kindergarten class at the time.  

 I too noticed that Will was filmed in a class with slightly younger children;  however, I don't recall any reason for this being given?  (And I definitely don't recall it being said that it was done due to delays on his part as compared to other children his age).  Personally, I can think of many reasons why he might not have been placed in a class of 7 year olds and honestly, I'm not sure why it really matters.  Then again, I also don't understand why there is such focus on unearthing and exposing evidence that Will and Zoey have developmental delays (e,g, speech, learning, and behavioral delays).  Let's just say they do have speech, learning, and behavioral delays.  Okay..... And....?  It's not as if this indicates some moral failing on their part or their parents' part, some level of denial a problem exists, or neglect in the care of the delay(s).  It would simply mean that they have some developmental delays.  Period.  And actually, it would follow that the kids and their parents are due some grace if the kids' behavior is currently found to be lacking, as it's logically inconsistent to say the kids have delays, including behavioral ones, while at the same time expecting behavior from them comparable to other kids in the same age range.

Edited December 9, 2018 by SabineElisabeth

[lookeyloo]

4 hours ago, SabineElisabeth said:

As Will and Zoey learn more about the circumstances surrounding their adoptions, they will no doubt continue to develop an understanding that  many, many children/people around the world are impoverished, as well as an appreciation of the fact that they themselves were born into a "lifestyle" where they didn't have access to many of the most basic life necessities.  In addition, doing things such as helping during the holiday party held at the children's hospital, choosing gifts to donate to children for Christmas, etc, will give them first hand knowledge of just how fortunate they are, in all areas of their lives.  IMHO, a large number of people go through their whole lives having only an intellectual understanding of what is to them an abstract concept, whereas Will and Zoey will have actual experiential understanding of their current standard of living as compared to that of others - both from having lived it and if not actually having concrete memories, at least maintaining an awareness of that past and its after effects, as well as from the volunteer activities to which they are exposed by Bill and Jennifer.  All of which will give them a much more authentic, accurate "basis of desire" than most of us will ever have.

 I too noticed that Will was filmed in a class with slightly younger children;  however, I don't recall any reason for this being given?  (And I definitely don't recall it being said that it was done due to delays on his part as compared to other children his age).  Personally, I can think of many reasons why he might not have been placed in a class of 7 year olds and honestly, I'm not sure why it really matters.  Then again, I also don't understand why there is such focus on unearthing and exposing evidence that Will and Zoey have developmental delays (e,g, speech, learning, and behavioral delays).  Let's just say they do have speech, learning, and behavioral delays.  Okay..... And....?  It's not as if this indicates some moral failing on their part or their parents' part, some level of denial a problem exists, or neglect in the care of the delay(s).  It would simply mean that they have some developmental delays.  Period.  And actually, it would follow that the kids and their parents are due some grace if the kids' behavior is currently found to be lacking, as it's logically inconsistent to say the kids have delays, including behavioral ones, while at the same time expecting behavior from them comparable to other kids in the same age range.

agree, and, we really do not know what goes on in their every day lives without cameras.  I thought Will was very appropriate in the class with the translator/teacher -maybe because it was one on one, or maybe, in real life, at school, etc. no cameras, he is just more in control of himself because he knows it is expected of him.  Plus Bill didn't have easy access to clown around.  Who knows if Bill prods them for the outrageous behavior while filming is going on.  In these scripted reality shows, there is always more than meets the eye of what we see edited down for an episode, in my opinion.  YMMV

[BitterApple]

Regarding appreciation, that has to be taught. It won't come automatically just because Will and Zoey were once impoverished orphans. My uncle has two adopted children from Russia. They're teenagers now and both are spoiled rotten and very nasty. 

Ironically, their family environment strongly mimics the Kleins. My uncle is a wealthy attorney, there was no discipline, an overabundance of material objects and a whole horde of extended family members who thought it was just adorable when the kids would be sassy as toddlers. Fast forward fifteen years and a mouthy teenager isn't quite as darling. 

I'm 50/50 on whether Bill and Jen will instill those values. There's times when I think they're grounded and times when I think they've come to believe their own hype. Time will tell.

[BitterApple]

Regarding Will and the school, I don't think there's any big conspiracy. The initial plan was for both him and Zoey to participate, correct? So the producers needed to find a place that, a) was willing to film, b) had a small class size and c) was doing an activity that would appeal to both the kids and the viewers. The calligraphy and Will learning to write his name in Chinese (or is it Mandarin?) is much more interesting to watch than seven year-olds doing math in a public school. I think the aesthetics factored into it more than Will's delays.

[Libby]

13 hours ago, SabineElisabeth said:

Then again, I also don't understand why there is such focus on unearthing and exposing evidence that Will and Zoey have developmental delays (e,g, speech, learning, and behavioral delays).  Let's just say they do have speech, learning, and behavioral delays.  Okay..... And....?  It's not as if this indicates some moral failing on their part or their parents' part, some level of denial a problem exists, or neglect in the care of the delay(s).  It would simply mean that they have some developmental delays.  Period.  And actually, it would follow that the kids and their parents are due some grace if the kids' behavior is currently found to be lacking, as it's logically inconsistent to say the kids have delays, including behavioral ones, while at the same time expecting behavior from them comparable to other kids in the same age range.

 

Nobody would speculate or discuss whether the children are delayed if their parents didn't broadcast them on nationwide TV. Bill and Jen obviously have decided that they don't mind the public commenting on their children's shortcomings. TLC money seems to be more important to them than what people discuss regarding their children.

Edited December 10, 2018 by Libby

[pdlinda]

2 hours ago, Libby said:

Nobody would speculate or discuss whether the children are delayed if their parents didn't broadcast them on nationwide TV. Bill and Jen obviously have decided that they don't mind the public commenting on their children's shortcomings. TLC money seems to be more important to them than what people discuss regarding their children.

I don't think any of the Klein/Arnold families have any interest in reading these boards nor do I think they directly read the Facebook posts that are prolific.  I think the publicity/production people from TLC read them but don't pass along negative comments.  

I noticed that there were many negative comments regarding the children's behavior on Facebook a while back; however, recently I noticed a change.  With very few exceptions, only favorable comments are posted.

[Christine]

The first time I took my husband for dim sum in a San Francisco place famed for DS, he opted for the chicken feet.  I thought he was nuts; he said it was too much work for too little to eat.  If you go to a butcher or meat stand in any Italian market, they always have the chickens with their feet still attached and sometimes their head.  You'll see rabbit with some fur.  I was told this is an indicator of how old the item is.

Bill's father did back-track on the tour guide at one point, saying he was wrong and she was right about the age of the Forbidden City.

Cute show but I tend to fast forward through most of the episodes; this one was too interesting to do so, at least for my taste.

[JerseyGirl]

On 12/8/2018 at 6:30 AM, floridamom said:

I watched the episode yesterday. Did I actually see Zoe swat Jen's hand a couple of times in the chef's kitchen? Can't believe that. She's going to be a force to reckon with when she's 14. Not cute at all; I don't really care for their parenting style at all. I have 2 of my own and I would NEVER tolerate any behavior of that type. They will be 'doormat' parents, afraid of losing their children's "love"; they already don't have their respect. I put love in quotation marks because I think those children are likely bribed in to their lives with Bill and Jen. I don't think they have a true sense of real life. Who lives so lavishly as they do; go to Disney World on a whim, travel internationally like they do. A child Will's age wanting to go to China has no real basis of desire IMO. He asks; he gets. No idea of the magnitude of a trip like that. Mostly wasted on a child of his age; perhaps when he's older and would/could appreciate it. I also noticed that Will was placed in a pre school class with 4 and 5 year olds who seemed more mature than he did. Why not put him in an appropriate grade level class? 

 

Yes, that's what I've been saying all along.  Zoey is NOT CUTE in her actions and words, that is a major discipline problem that seems to be getting more and more out of hand, between the swatting and the talk back - I don't see cuteness at all!  And then I watch Jen and Bill, both just look over by the cameras and laugh or say something lame to the kids, such as "that's not nice".  

Edited December 10, 2018 by JerseyGirl

[gunderda]

I had to wonder... if zoey was falling asleep during the day, does that mean she was waking up in the middle of the night? Which then means someone would have to wake up with her right? 

 

I would also image that market may have had a lot of smells so maybe that combined with the chicken feet just sent Jen's mom over the edge.

[readheaded]

47 minutes ago, gunderda said:

I had to wonder... if zoey was falling asleep during the day, does that mean she was waking up in the middle of the night? Which then means someone would have to wake up with her right? 

 

I would also image that market may have had a lot of smells so maybe that combined with the chicken feet just sent Jen's mom over the edge.

My own mom doesn't feel great after traveling a long way, so something that might not bother her too much at home might send her over the edge if she wasn't feeling quite right to begin with.

[humbleopinion]

As long as Zoey didn't leave the room or ordered herself room service, she probably just entertained herself with a ipad, books, toys while the others slept in the night...

She seems very independent about keeping herself occupied...she probably narrated her play so Jen and Bill could hear she was okay as they tried to sleep....

[SMama]

6 hours ago, humbleopinion said:

As long as Zoey didn't leave the room or ordered herself room service, she probably just entertained herself with a ipad, books, toys while the others slept in the night...

 

Oh come on, the girl missed a few meals, room service should have been OK. 😃

[humbleopinion]

You are right,  Zoey ordered room service of chicken fingers and fries with a milkshake on her ipad to her suite...put it on the TLC corporate account....

[CaliCannoli]

On 12/5/2018 at 6:56 PM, Libby said:

Jen's parents divorced and then remarried some time later.

In my opinion, Jen's dad wasn't husband of the year either.

Here's a quote of Jen's from their book. Make of it what you will. I know what I think...

"To complicate matters, not long after the divorce, my father got remarried to his longtime secretary"

Some years later, Dave got cancer, divorced the secretary and went back to Judy. I didn't bother to quote that part from the book.

Wow. I'm reading the book again. Totally missed that.

[Kid]

I’ve just finished watching both episodes and here are my thoughts:

1.  Zoey is adorable but her behavior is not. I could not believe she swatted away her mother’s hand.  Let’s just say, if she were my kid,  we would’ve had a “come to Jesus” as they say in Texas.

2.  I thought Will’s behavior in China was great.  He was mannered (except for licking his hands then touching food) and he looked like he was very comfortable.  I think that Bill’s mother was correct in the reason why he did not want to leave.

3.   I found it odd that Bill‘s mother and her husband always seem to be relegated to the backseat both literally and figuratively. That is unfortunate because they appeared to be very lovely people. 

4.  Bill’s father is a bit much. I will leave it at that.

5.  If Jen got that forceful with her kids when they swat her hands away or push her or run around screaming in public places as she did when they were sampling the food in the chef’s kitchen, they would be much better mannered children.  I understand her concern but her behavior was insulting to her hosts.  Of course, if they did not totally dismiss her when she talks, she would’ve only had to tell them once rather than repeatedly.

Edited December 18, 2018 by Kid

[Evangeline]

I'm surprised at the reactions here about them going to China. Even if it wasn't funded by TLC, I wouldn't question their decision to go if it was something Will expressed an interest in. Many do not have that same opportunity, but most were not abandoned there as babies either. Regardless, I don't think it's necessary for the kids to understand that at this point. It's not a material thing, and really, it's not a luxury for those kids - it's a learning experience for them (whether they remember it or not - we're shaped by experiences we may not remember as well as by those we remember).

I also don't get the envy that I sometimes detect as a result of their financial position. Jen must have worked damn hard for her success, and the show stems from an aspect of their life I am grateful I don't have to deal with - I don't know how much money it would theoretically take for me to be truly envy of their life, but it's way more than they have.

They obviously still need to make sure they raise kind, polite children. Children are inherently self-centered, they have time and from what I've seen, I don't share the concern over their behavior.

[Sew Sumi]

Well, this isn't entirely a fan board, so there are going to be criticisms/concerns voiced here that wouldn't be seen on media that monitor content to skew a certain way. 

There are differing opinions here, and I personally appreciate it because a post may come from a perspective that I might not have previously considered. MMV, of course. 😊

Edited December 20, 2018 by Sew Sumi

[pigeon]

6 hours ago, Evangeline said:

I'm surprised at the reactions here about them going to China. Even if it wasn't funded by TLC, I wouldn't question their decision to go if it was something Will expressed an interest in. Many do not have that same opportunity, but most were not abandoned there as babies either. Regardless, I don't think it's necessary for the kids to understand that at this point. It's not a material thing, and really, it's not a luxury for those kids - it's a learning experience for them (whether they remember it or not - we're shaped by experiences we may not remember as well as by those we remember).

I also don't get the envy that I sometimes detect as a result of their financial position. Jen must have worked damn hard for her success, and the show stems from an aspect of their life I am grateful I don't have to deal with - I don't know how much money it would theoretically take for me to be truly envy of their life, but it's way more than they have.

They obviously still need to make sure they raise kind, polite children. Children are inherently self-centered, they have time and from what I've seen, I don't share the concern over their behavior.

I agree with you:)

[winsomeone]

I found it scary that Will as a 7 year old wanted to stay in China so he would be around people who were just like him. How much damage is being done to these kids' long term mental health by being adopted by white American parents? If they have to be adopted by whites, maybe they should require that they be around other Chinese people at frequent intervals while growing up...just something so they don't feel like one of a kind?

[Kid]

31 minutes ago, winsomeone said:

I found it scary that Will as a 7 year old wanted to stay in China so he would be around people who were just like him. How much damage is being done to these kids' long term mental health by being adopted by white American parents? If they have to be adopted by whites, maybe they should require that they be around other Chinese people at frequent intervals while growing up...just something so they don't feel like one of a kind?

As a survivor of severe, persistent child abuse, my opinion is that he is lucky to have loving parents of any race.  I suspect some of any alienation he feels with his peers comes from his behavior and not his race.  He acts much younger than he is.

[jumper sage]

On 12/7/2018 at 6:41 PM, chicorex1 said:

bought chicken feet and cooked the feet

Somewhere the Family Chantel collective head is exploding.

2 hours ago, winsomeone said:

I found it scary that Will as a 7 year old wanted to stay in China so he would be around people who were just like him. How much damage is being done to these kids' long term mental health by being adopted by white American parents?

I think adoption by "like" people is a slippery slope.  The same sort of thinking is what has been used for same-sex parents and parents of different ethnic groups.  Jen and Bill have adopted children who were up for adoption but weren't adopted.  They changed those kid's lives forever.

Note - My family is from Sicily and I too wanted to stay and look like everyone else.  My long-term, but never married him, boyfriend is Polish and that family is more foreign to me than hanging with my black best friend.

[winsomeone]

At least let the child be around Chinese Americans, so he doesn't feel there is no one like him. Seems like a mixed family could be found..white and Chinese...taking him back to China once or twice isn't the same thing as being around people who look like him on a frequent basis. I guess I am wrong, but the child seemed so sad about it at the time.

[Kid]

If they had not adopted him because he was Chinese, they would be criticized as racist.  They did adopt him so now the criticism is that it keeps him away from his kind.  So, you can’t win.  

They go out of their way with both children to educate them on their cultural background.  And more importantly, love abounds in that family.

Edited December 20, 2018 by Kid

[jumper sage]

6 minutes ago, winsomeone said:

At least let the child be around Chinese Americans, so he doesn't feel there is no one like him. Seems like a mixed family could be found..white and Chinese...taking him back to China once or twice isn't the same thing as being around people who look like him on a frequent basis. I guess I am wrong, but the child seemed so sad about it at the time.

You can't even find a Chinese-American adoption group.  A mixed family WAS NOT FOUND.  This is why they adopted the unadoptable.

Here is a quote from Life Among the Little People of the Dwarf Empire:

THE KINGDOM OF THE LITTLE PEOPLE

Unfortunately, age-old Chinese beliefs leave vulnerable populations behind. A widespread conviction persists that disability represents a punishment in this life for sins committed in the previous ones. As a result, those with perceived disabilities endure brutal treatment at the hands of their families and the general public.

[Mollysmom]

6 hours ago, winsomeone said:

I found it scary that Will as a 7 year old wanted to stay in China so he would be around people who were just like him. How much damage is being done to these kids' long term mental health by being adopted by white American parents? If they have to be adopted by whites, maybe they should require that they be around other Chinese people at frequent intervals while growing up...just something so they don't feel like one of a kind?

Wow. I think I need to stay away from this show's forums. I'm disabled, and there is not one person like me, at least where I live, and I have acclimated just fine looking way different than Will does. These forums have opened my eyes to why I still get stared at, and rude comments from people, even though as a society we are supposed to be more open minded about and understanding of different people. 

[Sew Sumi]

8 hours ago, winsomeone said:

I found it scary that Will as a 7 year old wanted to stay in China so he would be around people who were just like him. How much damage is being done to these kids' long term mental health by being adopted by white American parents? If they have to be adopted by whites, maybe they should require that they be around other Chinese people at frequent intervals while growing up...just something so they don't feel like one of a kind?

Paging @SMama! 

[viewer]

Will is being raised by parents with dwarfism.  His sister Zoey also has dwarfism.   It is not unusual to see Asian people.  Seldom do I see a dwarf.  Will is too young to understand that his family either didn't want him or couldn't afford him because of his disability.   I am sure that child would not leave Bill for any other person.  Both Will and Zoey are learning not to let dwarfism rule them.

[Libby]

The first orphanage that Will was in put him in a bed, didn't feed him, and left him to die.

New Day rescued him and truly tried their best. However, they have quite a few children to take care of and are always strapped for money.

Disabled children in countries like India and China don't have the luxury to wait for the perfect cultural adoption. Will and Zoey are very, very lucky children.

I don't think that Bill and Jen should be putting the kids on TV for their own financial gain, but the kids are still extremely lucky that they were adopted by the Kleins.

[winsomeone]

My son is a person with a disability, we don't consider him a disabled person. To live in an area where no one has disabilities of any sort, then it must be a utopia?

[PrincessPurrsALot]

People,

As always, let's think about how we're saying things.  As long as people are talking about the people on TV, they can.  We have strong opinions.  That's ok.  Let's not take it down an accusatory route.  We are right at that line, getting close to going over.  Step away from the line. 

Thanks.

Should you feel stressed, enjoy these GIFs. 

[readheaded]

On 12/20/2018 at 11:51 AM, jumper sage said:

Somewhere the Family Chantel collective head is exploding.

I think adoption by "like" people is a slippery slope.  The same sort of thinking is what has been used for same-sex parents and parents of different ethnic groups.  Jen and Bill have adopted children who were up for adoption but weren't adopted.  They changed those kid's lives forever.

Note - My family is from Sicily and I too wanted to stay and look like everyone else.  My long-term, but never married him, boyfriend is Polish and that family is more foreign to me than hanging with my black best friend.

The other thing is that Will and Zoey look more like Jen and Bill in that they're all little people, which would seem to be an important similarity, too.  

While it isn't of the same magnitude, I'm a redhead and I can say that growing up, there were times it might have been nice not to have been the only redhead in a room.  People in general have a natural tendency to want to be with people like them, whether in looks or thinking.  

On 12/20/2018 at 2:10 PM, Kid said:

If they had not adopted him because he was Chinese, they would be criticized as racist.  They did adopt him so now the criticism is that it keeps him away from his kind.  So, you can’t win.  

They go out of their way with both children to educate them on their cultural background.  And more importantly, love abounds in that family.

And, they're all little people which seems to be a commonality that would be harder to come by than race or ethnicity.  My thinking is that there are no perfect families or circumstances, that's why people can adapt and even flourish in less-than "ideal" circumstances, provided they're healthy.  Would Will be better off with a Chinese family of average sized people than he is with white parents who are little people?  Who knows, but it's evident that Bill and Jen are doing the best they can to raise him with love.

[viewer]

Bill and Jennifer specifically asked for children with dwarfism.  The case worker agreed they were perfect for Will.  Will and Zoey are where they need to be and loved!