S07.E20: Unconditional Love

[Cherry Cola]

5 hours ago, Maharincess said:

If you've ever watched The Challenge, you'd know that Corey is not likable at all. He's fucking asshole. 

I do watch! I like him for some reason.  

[MaddyMaeboxerbabe]

I didn’t mind him that much before but only second episode in on this season’s challenge for him and he keeps saying he has to win the million for his daughter.  I think he fits in with these “teen” parents.  Career mtv’ers.  Sigh.

[GreenlinetoHarlem]

I don't see how that reflects badly on Cory. He has a daughter, she has some health issues, I'm sure he's motivated to make money for her. So what?

[IDreamofJoaquin]

@SnarkEnthusiast   Best post ever!!!!!!!!!  I wanted to read it like 20 times but read it only 2 because of time.

 

Cate does not want to watch because she will be embarrassed about how childish she is and will have to be forced to see no growth.  It's like we all have those moments in time on our Facebook where we were in bad moods and vented and posted stupid stuff. Except it's Cate's entire life on camera. No removing that!!

I felt a softness towards Amber when she was taking care of James by herself and it quickly dissolved when she was calling Leah names.  You never wanted anything to do with her and had the lamest excuses not to spend time with her. You reap what you sow. 

What was Cheyenne wearing at the BBQ?  Because when she ran into the house her sheer top flew away and her bottom was showing.  I don't know if she is dramatic just for the cameras or if she is like that all the time but that shit is unmanageable. 

[Mainer]

I was wondering what the ratings should be or need to be for the show to last? If 957,000 is low.. what did it used to be? Anyone know

[Mr. Miner]

4 hours ago, IDreamofJoaquin said:

You never wanted anything to do with her and had the lamest excuses not to spend time with her. You reap what you sow. 

I wonder if the shitbag skank ever got caught up on her child support with Gary?

[Mainer]

I’d love to see a “where are they now” in ten years after mtv drops them and they have to come to reality and have to actually do what most people do, get an education, work, pay bills etc... it would be interesting to see if they’ve sold all the nice cars houses etc.. to survive? The only thing mtv has done is stunt there growth... IMO. I would put money on Cate and Ty no longer together... I think they stay together to be that different story... the only two that have lasted... ?. I know a lot of the girls it has been brought up how they’ve blown there money... especially Janelle from teen mom 2 she blows it foolishly on every guy she meets idk it would be interesting 

 

In the past season I found myself way more into “young and pregnant “ then either of the teen mom series

Edited October 10, 2018 by Mainer

[IDreamofJoaquin]

29 minutes ago, Mainer said:

I’d love to see a “where are they now” in ten years after mtv drops them and they have to come to reality and have to actually do what most people do, get an education, work, pay bills etc... it would be interesting to see if they’ve sold all the nice cars houses etc.. to survive?

Hear, hear!  I bet some of them turn out like The Wild and Wonderful Whites of West Virginia.

[Mothra]

18 hours ago, ghertigirl said:

How are you going to criticize strangers for thinking your son is a girl when you not only keep his hair long, but you also style it like a girl.  I have never seen a boy or a man with his hair pinned half up like she had it.

A kid in my son's preschool was named Evan, which I'd assumed was a boy's name, who had shoulder-length curly hair.  All the kids, boys and girls, dressed pretty much the same, jeans and t-shirts, and really Evan could be a girl's name.  The other mothers and I whispered and wondered what sex Evan was.  It's unimaginably difficult to talk to a mom about her kid--even just to invite the kid for a play date--if you don't know the kid's gender.  And Evan's parents made a point of *not* specifying that he was a boy, and I don't know why.  Finally one of us just asked--awkward--and that was that. 

It's really cruel to a kid and rude to everybody else to disguise your kid's sex.  I mean, Maverick?  Come on.  If you want to let a little boy's hair grow long and style it like a girl's hair, or if you want to cut your little girl's hair very short and name her Lee, it's incumbent on you as parents to make sure everyone knows what your kid's sex is.  It makes your kid's--and everyone else's life--easier and better.

[gunderda]

On 10/9/2018 at 8:31 AM, Caseysgirl said:

Well, Corey landed himself another cushy MTV job just by screwing his cast mate from the Challenge. Talk about “ a soft place to fall”. We’ll see how active he’ll be in his daughter’s life when there are no cameras around.  I have no patience with Caitlin any more. If you know you have a problem with depression and anxiety that requires months of in patient treatment, you have no business bringing another child into the world. The little one you have already looks miserable. Tyler is soooooo done.  

So did Corey and Cheyanne conveniently live close to each other or did he move to be closer to his daughter? 

[MaggieG]

I cannot stand Cheyenne's voice! I did think the hugging moment between her dad and stepdad was nice. 

I actually felt bad for Tyler. He mentioned them watching the show and Cate completely shuts it down. And he doesn't want to keep pushing about it, because he needs to walk on eggshells around her. Why are these two having another kid?!

Bristol and Dakota seem like two people who got married and had kids way too fast. Living and being married to someone who that has PTST (and I'm talking real PTSD, not whatever BS PTSD Catelyn or Jennelle claim to have) is not easy. It takes work and patience and Bristol just doesn't seem up to the task. 

I'm shocked that Amber cooked a meal

[jenifaohjenny]

13 hours ago, Chickabiddy said:

I know it has been commented on before, Hell, I may have done so myself, but Christ on a cracker, I was SHOCKED by the garbled word salad that passes for speech with Nova. I even went to check her birthday - seems to be January 1 2015. Thus means she is over 3 and a half. And she goes to day care/preschool. This should only aid in her speech development, ie, playing and engaging with kids and teachers during activity time. 

I can’t even snark on it that much. Poor little thing needs an intervention STAT. 

Its a good thing she is turning out to be so pretty because her parents are truly failing her in terms of her intellectual development. She will have her looks  to fall back on...like Tyler...?

Cosign whoever posted that this show only proves that money alone can’t fix things 

oh, and Cate is on her way to being an even nastier, self absorbed, narcissistic version of her mother.

i was really struck by how her face turned into this hardened sneer when Tyler asked her to watch the past season with him.

That girl is just one super-sized, whining Id. 

I agree.  It is possible that she is at some sort of daycare that is not catching this - but what about her pediatrician?  What will most likely happen is when she gets to K the public school will notice.  That is not ideal because early intervention is SO key in these matters.  

We could hardly understand our neighbors son when he played with our kids.  The mom kept putting it off saying he would get over it and talk more clearly.  Eventually she woke up and brought him in for an evaluation and the therapy he received before school event started was a huge help.  

Edited October 10, 2018 by jenifaohjenny
typo

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

On 10/9/2018 at 5:31 AM, Linny said:

Maci and Cate in particular are guilty of believing in the power of their own myth, and I think that's hindering any potential they have to improve themselves as people and as moms. 

PREACH! This is so well-said (and concise) and it hits the nail on the head about these two girls in particular. 

Edited October 10, 2018 by MyPeopleAreNordic

[Mothra]

On 10/9/2018 at 2:01 PM, ava111 said:

How TF Catelynn doesn't think there is anything wrong in their marriage and they were "fine" the last two years? Because Tyler walks around her on the eggshells and every time there is something he would want to discuss (like him not being happy) Catelyn goes into her "mental illness" persona and shuts down any further discussion. The same goes for her mother-in-law and probably the rest of their family. So of course she thinks they are perfectly ok. She keeps getting new diagnoses just so she can keep this victim more going and doesn't have to take any responsibility about anything in their marriage. Now she comes back with PTSD diagnosis. Compare that bullshit with the real PTSD that Dakota has. She comes home after almost 6 months of nature walks and movie marathons and just couple days in she can't deal with her daughter following her everywhere. She spent all that time trying to avoid real work on herself (as little as that facility can provide) by taking naps and staying up all night watching movies so no wonder she is still not equipped dealing even with the simplest real life stuff. 

I say this as someone with severe depression diagnosis and who had to finish couple outpatient treatments. <snip>

I cut your experiences not because I thought they were not relevant but because they were so painful to read about.

What pisses me off about Catelynn is that she is happy claiming the PTSD diagnosis (and the depression and anxiety diagnoses) when she must be aware of Bristol Meyers' husband, who makes Catelynn look like a model of mental health.  It's wrong, and I realize it's not Catelynn's fault that she was given the same diagnosis as Bristol Meyers' husband, but she ought to be a little ashamed of herself for claiming that she is immobilized by her mental illness in the same way we can *see* that he is.

I can't begin to imagine the feelings one would have after placing a baby for adoption.  Frankly, I never thought T&C's open adoption was a good thing--if I were an adoptive parent, I wouldn't want those teenagers butting into the life I was trying to build with my daughter.  T&C seemed to feel that they were part of Carly's family, and outside of biology, they are not.  There would have come a time, later, when they might have had a relationship with Carly, but for her childhood, photos and written reports ought to have been enough.  I think Catelynn has been torturing herself with Carly and needs help addressing this.

People like AVA111 who have severe depression don't run off to treatment centers where they suddenly feel great.  People with severe depression are depressed wherever they are.  I think Catelynn has been milking her diagnoses long enough.  I'd like to see her examined by a *real* mental health professional, not somebody who puts earclips on you to align your brain waves.

[Pepper Mostly]

On 10/9/2018 at 11:04 AM, SuzWhat said:

How many Bristol segments were filmed on the same day, with her in her white T-shirt and overalls?   It seems like she's been in them forever.  

That's all I got.  Cheyenne is boring.  Amber, Cate and Maci are boring AF.  But at least Amber, Cate and Maci make my blood boil, so I can hate watch.  

I haven't paid any attention to Maci in years, but Amber and Cate infuriate me, so I join you in hate watching!

On 10/9/2018 at 2:23 PM, Mothra said:

Bristol smugly asserted that god had given her the opportunity to be on Teen Mom so she could help other women in her position.  Gak.  I'm sure the lord above was concerned that the eighteen thousand unwed young mothers shows on TV now aren't enough and that what was needed was Bristol's story.  If god chose Bristol for TM, I think it would be to show how awful PTSD is, both for the sufferer and for the rest of the family, especially the spouse.

 

Bristol smugly blats that God has chosen her to spread the love on Teen Mom (for a fat paycheck, too, thank you Jesus!). that was pretty damn hilarious, then the camera cut to Mama Sarah, chewing with her mouth open, eyes bugging out, and burping out "Amen!" That alone was worth suffering through this stupid show.

22 hours ago, Bridget said:

Also, what is so stressful about Amber’s life at home with a newborn baby? She doesn’t have other kids to tend to or anything to actually do during the days, so what is so damn stressful? I don’t get it. 

Amber's blathering about how "stressful" it is with a new baby. Cut to said baby, who is sleeping peacefully. Amber is, uncharacteristically, out of bed, showered, and dressed. She prepared food. So baby James can't be that demanding. What is her fucking problem?

15 hours ago, Chickabiddy said:

I know it has been commented on before, Hell, I may have done so myself, but Christ on a cracker, I was SHOCKED by the garbled word salad that passes for speech with Nova. I even went to check her birthday - seems to be January 1 2015. Thus means she is over 3 and a half. And she goes to day care/preschool. This should only aid in her speech development, ie, playing and engaging with kids and teachers during activity time. 

I can’t even snark on it that much. Poor little thing needs an intervention STAT. 

Its a good thing she is turning out to be so pretty because her parents are truly failing her in terms of her intellectual development. She will have her looks  to fall back on...like Tyler...?

Cosign whoever posted that this show only proves that money alone can’t fix things 

oh, and Cate is on her way to being an even nastier, self absorbed, narcissistic version of her mother.

i was really struck by how her face turned into this hardened sneer when Tyler asked her to watch the past season with him.

That girl is just one super-sized, whining Id. 

Nova is way behind in her speech. And would someone drag a comb through her hair once in a while?

She is pretty. She looks just like Cate. Who is also actually pretty but doesn't give a shit.

Cate is April 2.0. Nova will get knocked up at 15 too. Jesus Christ, they can't see it.

2 hours ago, MaggieG said:

I'm shocked that Amber cooked a meal

Two words--Blue Apron. Count on it. No ways she made that nice looking plate of food on her own. She could barely be arsed to open a can of green beans last season.

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

On 10/9/2018 at 1:23 PM, Mothra said:

Bristol smugly asserted that god had given her the opportunity to be on Teen Mom so she could help other women in her position.  Gak.  I'm sure the lord above was concerned that the eighteen thousand unwed young mothers shows on TV now aren't enough and that what was needed was Bristol's story. 

What a smug turd. It's really too bad that god couldn't have given her the opportunity to pick up some condoms at the drug store so she wouldn't have two accidental pregnancies while pretending to be abstinent. 

Edited October 11, 2018 by MyPeopleAreNordic

[politichick]

On 10/9/2018 at 4:00 PM, ghertigirl said:

Two beefs with Maci this week:

(1) How are you going to criticize strangers for thinking your son is a girl when you not only keep his hair long, but you also style it like a girl.  I have never seen a boy or a man with his hair pinned half up like she had it.

(2) I had to rewatch to make sure, but I'm fairly confident that Jen walked out because Maci gave her the cold shoulder, not the other way around.  Jen was in her living room waiting and playing with the babies and then Maci walks in, doesn't even acknowledge Jen's presence and just continues prattling on to Bentley about his homework.  Would it have killed her to throw an "Oh, hi!" to Jen first?  That's what you do when someone is in YOUR home.  Basic manners 101.

Plus, while Ryan was totally 100 percent wrong to make threats, her stupid husband should not have been posting mean shit online about Bentley's father and step-mother. He totally started that shit.

Glad Leah is giving Amber the cold shoulder. She's slimmed down a bit, too.

I am not a Tyler fan but like most of you I feel sorry for him being stuck with that lazy ass Caitlin. And kudos for him for getting a real therapist who did her homework by watching the show instead of the enablers that Cait seeks help from.

[Mainer]

6 hours ago, Mothra said:

I cut your experiences not because I thought they were not relevant but because they were so painful to read about.

What pisses me off about Catelynn is that she is happy claiming the PTSD diagnosis (and the depression and anxiety diagnoses) when she must be aware of Bristol Meyers' husband, who makes Catelynn look like a model of mental health.  It's wrong, and I realize it's not Catelynn's fault that she was given the same diagnosis as Bristol Meyers' husband, but she ought to be a little ashamed of herself for claiming that she is immobilized by her mental illness in the same way we can *see* that he is.

I can't begin to imagine the feelings one would have after placing a baby for adoption.  Frankly, I never thought T&C's open adoption was a good thing--if I were an adoptive parent, I wouldn't want those teenagers butting into the life I was trying to build with my daughter.  T&C seemed to feel that they were part of Carly's family, and outside of biology, they are not.  There would have come a time, later, when they might have had a relationship with Carly, but for her childhood, photos and written reports ought to have been enough.  I think Catelynn has been torturing herself with Carly and needs help addressing this.

People like AVA111 who have severe depression don't run off to treatment centers where they suddenly feel great.  People with severe depression are depressed wherever they are.  I think Catelynn has been milking her diagnoses long enough.  I'd like to see her examined by a *real* mental health professional, not somebody who puts earclips on you to align your brain waves.

I agree with you 100 percent. Unfortunately even a REAL mental health professional likes money... so there for they will take her money as long as she’s offering it out to get the same old stuff, and pity party attention... she didn’t get attention as a child because her mother was drunk so she will go pay 30k to a treatment center to get made to feel special and important... and as long as she has moneythey will take her in ten more times... no place is gonna look at her and say I’m sorry we’ve done all we can for you take your money else where. What’s so aggravating is the SELFESHNESS it shows, she is sacrificing Nova’s childhood and the fact it needs to be all about Nova because she is the child not Catelyn, and I’m sorry Catelyn didn’t get that attention that she too did deserve, but that time is over, grow up and give to your child what you didn’t have, that’s true love that’s what you do when you make a baby it’s very self sacrificing, but that’s all part of being a parent and there only little for a short time and then it’s over. It pisses me off to watch her make her daughter feel EXACTLY how she felt as a child. And that’s what she’s doing... it’s sad and hard to watch Nova crave her mother’s attention while Catelyn is stuck on getting her own attention.. and now another child?? Ugh... Carly was spared, thank god!! 

[Mainer]

On another note it would be nice if mtv would let us take a vote on new girls, show us a quick segment and let us choose. I doubt either of the two they picked would’ve been people we as viewers would have picked...

[Rebecca]

On 10/8/2018 at 8:30 PM, SuzyLee said:

The sight of Cheyenne’s father and stepdad hugging and expressing mutual love was the most heart-warming thing I’ve seen in a long time.  We need a lot more of that.  

Agree. I’m not that fond of Cheyenne and I’m LOUDLY anti-Cory but I like all the other people in Cheyenne’s family a lot so far. They seem pretty normal compared to a lot of the cast’s families. And it doesn’t hurt that they’re all damn good looking. I normally wouldn’t care but the difference in their appearances versus the appearances of almost every other person on the show is staggering. The Floyds are good looking people.

On 10/9/2018 at 12:39 AM, eskimo said:

The only thing I really need to know about these girls is in what ways will they lose their shit when no more free money rolls in.  No more award show invites, etc.  I will need a follow up about 18-24 months after they receive their last checks.

This. And Gary and Kristina will be all lulz, who is in “the ghetto of Anderson, Indiana” now, bitch? As they continue their normal lives.

On 10/9/2018 at 10:12 AM, SnarkEnthusiast said:

Catelynn's response to Tyler's therapy homework was such textbook gaslighting that it was hard to watch. I know we're not fans of Tyler here, but he made one request that didn't even come from him! All he did was ask her to watch a few of the episodes to understand what he was going through while she was at the spa. Also, these people are hardly stellar employees, but it's probably not smart to balk in disgust at the idea of watching the show has been almost your sole source of income and responsible for your quality of life for the past decade. Tyler was not accusing her of being unsympathetic or lacking empathy, although he should be. He seemed genuinely hopeful that the therapist had discovered a new means of communication for them. The marriage is obviously breaking down, but Tyler ironically is the one trying to save it. Sure he's probably milking the martyr husband card a little bit for attention, but I don't blame him at this point. Catelynn, for all her monologues and tears about feeling bad that Tyler is carrying such a burden, treats him like an ungrateful butler/nanny. She just shuffles around the house feeling sorry for herself and ignoring her kid. It's almost like she barely remembers Tyler is there until she needs him to do something. She bites his head off whenever he tries to interact with her or bring up his own topic of conversation that doesn't involve what he can do to make her feel better.

Watch how angry she gets immediately when Tyler suggests that they watch the episodes together. She knows she doesn't have a rational reason to justifiably say no, so as usual, she whips out the mental illness card. It takes a special kind of bullshit artistry to turn a calm discussion about how your mental illness is affecting your marriage into a claim that you're too mentally ill to watch yourself being mentally ill. Dumbass, you can't have it both ways. You can't demand that everyone around you restructures their entire lives on a daily basis based on your anxiety and depression while also refusing to acknowledge the aftermath of that constant restructuring. She doesn't actually care about Tyler's feelings, she just cares about appearing as though she cares about his feelings. So, predictable as ever, she finds a way to turn the conversation into an attack on her personally as a wife and mother because she knows those are forbidden criticisms.

And then I love when Cate said indignantly about the therapist, "Who is she to say I don't care? What gives her the right?" she's a therapist! You seem perfectly fine with therapists when they're kissing your ass in a desert resort or telling you the best cure for your depression is a movie marathon. You just don't like this one because she's not letting you flop all over yourself playing the victim. She's actually treating like you like an adult with, you know, accountability instead of an overemotional teenager that has to be coddled back to good health. And before you condescendingly look down your snobby little nose at Tyler's therapist, she has these things called formal qualifications, which is what you're supposed to get as an adult in order to have something known as a career. Cate's forgotten most people in the world only get paid for doing stuff other than sleep, fuck, and fuse their ass to their sofa.

Cate can fuck all the way off, honestly. I'm rooting for Tyler to divorce her at this point.

 

Tell me more, tell me more

compared to you this show is a bore! ?? 

On 10/9/2018 at 3:52 PM, ginger90 said:

I didn’t see it, but just by what you described it sounds like Leah is comfortable with Gary and able to say how she feels. Perhaps she thought if Gary went to the other room, the camera would follow him.

This. I have lots of friends with kids and in several of their homes this is just the type of relationship they have. Gary picks on and teases Leah, I think she was just doing the same. I didn’t get a brat vibe at all. I was able to joke around with my own father and say stuff like that but with my mom, not so much. I think it depends on the personality of the parent(s) too.

On 10/9/2018 at 5:00 PM, Maharincess said:

If you've ever watched The Challenge, you'd know that Corey is not likable at all. He's fucking asshole. 

He sucks so much. I’ve “hated” Johnny for years and years and Cory sky rocketed to my 2nd most hated in just a few short seasons. A true accomplishment.

21 hours ago, GreenlinetoHarlem said:

I don't see how that reflects badly on Cory. He has a daughter, she has some health issues, I'm sure he's motivated to make money for her. So what?

He should find motivation to quit embarrassing his daughter on tv too. He’s been a skank who uses women and then tosses them aside and talks shit about them. It just seems disingenuous for him to claim he’s all about getting money FOR his daughter. There are some people on the show who feel ENTITLED to win because they have a kid, hopefully he’s not going down that path. He could also get a real job and stop showing up on every MTV show. This is his 4th mtv series in 2-3 years! (Not coming at you, @GreenlinetoHarlem, I just have many feelings on Cory lol)

11 hours ago, gunderda said:

So did Corey and Cheyanne conveniently live close to each other or did he move to be closer to his daughter? 

That is a very good question I did not think of. I just googled and Cheyenne’s hometown is LA, my best guess is that famewhore Cory moved there. Googled to make sure and yep, he’s from Michigan.

Edited October 11, 2018 by Rebecca

[Rebecca]

So, James is James and Leah is booger butt, booboo and now, “butthole.” Wow. FUCK YOU, Amber. Leah is obviously already smarter than you and just because you’re now trying to “play family picnic” (thanks, Barb) she should come running? Remember when your big defense of being accused of only seeing Leah twice last summer was that you actually saw her THREE whole times? The only “butthole” I see is you, “have a picnic life, bitch.” (As Amber said to Gary long ago.)

I’m glad she showed her true self again so quickly, I was actually starting to give her a half ounce of credit for cooking a meal. Seriously, I was about to give a nearly 30 year old woman credit for cooking a meal for once. The bar is so low. Fuck that. And fuck Amber. Like Jenelle, she’ll never actually change.  So her depression prevented her from seeing Leah but now she has this new depression from NOT seeing Leah at her whim? Is she TRYING to give Leah a complex that Amber’s depression is somehow Leah’s fault?! Amber is sickening.

And, Cheyenne, who wears a thong swimming suit to a party with their family members, including dad, uncles, elderly people...? I know that style of swimming suit was everywhere last summer but, really?

The best part of the episode was seeing Taylor’s hot barber friend again. His beard doesn’t look like complete crap, Taylor should get some help from him. Maci has an in-ground trampoline? I didn’t know that was a thing. Seems like it could be safer?

[Soobs]

18 hours ago, IDreamofJoaquin said:

I felt a softness towards Amber when she was taking care of James by herself and it quickly dissolved when she was calling Leah names.  You never wanted anything to do with her and had the lamest excuses not to spend time with her. You reap what you sow. 

 

Amber and Leah don't have deep roots. Amber is going to have to do some work to win Leah over but she won't. She thinks she's entitled to Leah's affection, time and respect. The thing is that stuff is earned and Leah has another mom who already earned it. Boo hoo Amber, you made your choices.

[Blissfool]

On 10/9/2018 at 6:22 PM, Quilty said:

I ff through Cheyenne. She has a child with one man yet lives with a different one! Wow what an interesting unusual life she leads!?

And she goes to bbqs and other outings with the man she DOESN'T live with, while the man she DOES live with is probably at work earning an honest buck. 

Really, he deserves better.

 

23 hours ago, MaddyMaeboxerbabe said:

I didn’t mind him that much before but only second episode in on this season’s challenge for him and he keeps saying he has to win the million for his daughter.  

Ugh! Tony 2.0. "I'm doing it for my daughters..."

Why don't they both stop being such man-whores...for their daughters.

 

20 hours ago, IDreamofJoaquin said:

 

What was Cheyenne wearing at the BBQ?  Because when she ran into the house her sheer top flew away and her bottom was showing.  

A thong bathing suit. Clearly, she's a lot more comfortable around her family than I will ever be.

 

11 hours ago, MaggieG said:

 

I'm shocked that Amber cooked a meal

Umm..green beans. A couple of seasons ago.

[Mothra]

It occurs to me that Amber uses those nicknames with and about Leah to pretend that they are close.  That's the way you talk to a kid you're around all the time.

[CaliforniaLove]

"I've been in treatment, but they let me leave a couple days early cuz I missed Tyler & Nova". Most treatment centers I've heard of are pretty lax like that. Seriously, regardless of any issues, "treatment" is my next vacation...and maybe I can win a scholarship!!...

ETA: Bristol Palin's husband is Chris Pratt, if Chris Pratt had PTSD & was less cute & funny. Bristol is Chelsea Houska, if Chelsea had as much work as Farrah. 

Edited October 11, 2018 by CaliforniaLove

[IDreamofJoaquin]

5 hours ago, Rebecca said:

So, James is James and Leah is booger butt, booboo and now, “butthole.” Wow. FUCK YOU, Amber. Leah is obviously already smarter than you and just because you’re now trying to “play family picnic” (thanks, Barb) she should come running? Remember when your big defense of being accused of only seeing Leah twice last summer was that you actually saw her THREE whole times? The only “butthole” I see is you, “have a picnic life, bitch.” (As Amber said to Gary long ago.)

I’m glad she showed her true self again so quickly, I was actually starting to give her a half ounce of credit for cooking a meal. Seriously, I was about to give a nearly 30 year old woman credit for cooking a meal for once. The bar is so low. Fuck that. And fuck Amber. Like Jenelle, she’ll never actually change.  So her depression prevented her from seeing Leah but now she has this new depression from NOT seeing Leah at her whim? Is she TRYING to give Leah a complex that Amber’s depression is somehow Leah’s fault?! Amber is sickening.

So on point.  I really wondered about that meal.  It looked like it had been marinated and had actual ingredients in it.  I wonder if it was like one of those Costco meals you put together.  

[Rebecca]

5 hours ago, Soobs said:

Amber and Leah don't have deep roots. Amber is going to have to do some work to win Leah over but she won't. She thinks she's entitled to Leah's affection, time and respect. The thing is that stuff is earned and Leah has another mom who already earned it. Boo hoo Amber, you made your choices.

I wonder if Amber would physically attack/hit Leah if Leah “disrespected” her. For instance if Leah was at Amber’s bored, ignored and watching Netflix alone (as we know she used to do at Amber’s) and declared she wanted to go home (Gary’s, obviously) and Amber said no and Leah said something along the lines of “they’re my real family/real home” or anything calling Amber a bad mother or inferior to Gary or Kristina...I could see it happening. 

3 hours ago, Blissfool said:

And she goes to bbqs and other outings with the man she DOESN'T live with, while the man she DOES live with is probably at work earning an honest buck. 

Really, he deserves better.

 

Ugh! Tony 2.0. "I'm doing it for my daughters..."

Why don't they both stop being such man-whores...for their daughters.

 

Cheyenne’s bf does seem to deserve better. She said he was a longtime family friend, i wonder if he’s had feelings for her for a long time or something, it doesn’t even make that much sense otherwise. And word on Tony (ugh) and can’t forget Brad either. Bad company.

3 hours ago, Mothra said:

It occurs to me that Amber uses those nicknames with and about Leah to pretend that they are close.  That's the way you talk to a kid you're around all the time.

I’m around an 11 year old girl all the time (and have been since her birth) and those names have never been cute to me for a young girl. The girl I know would be embarrassed. And I just can’t help but think calling a known “accident” child “boo boo” is fucked up. Amber is totally tone deaf, as usual. 

I truly hope that Leah just has no more fucks to give and is totally fulfilled by Kristina and Gary and that Amber moving on to Andrew and having James so quickly when she couldn’t do shit for Leah because “depression” isn’t eating at her inside. Just think of all the shit Amber has put her through.

[Mainer]

I think Amber just throws it out there in conversation for us viewers that she’s trying to see Leah and Leah said no... it’s not a real attempt to be a parent it’s a half assed attempt... like oh wow she sent out an invite. Like any of us would to a friend. And wouldn’t you know Leah said no! Shucks! That’s too bad maybe next week.. umm no last I checked parents get certain visit times and scheduled time with there kids it’s not optional, she lets it be optional because she doesn’t really care. She sent an invite to look good that’s all

Edited October 11, 2018 by Mainer

[Pepper Mostly]

6 hours ago, IDreamofJoaquin said:

So on point.  I really wondered about that meal.  It looked like it had been marinated and had actual ingredients in it.  I wonder if it was like one of those Costco meals you put together.  

I'm telling ya, Blue Apron or one of those kits that they deliver to your house. You think Amber went to Costco? She'd have to go outside! (only half kidding here).

[IDreamofJoaquin]

@Pepper Mostly you are probably right.  If NuMatt wasn't there to drive her, she wouldn't be able to go anywhere.  It's def Blue Apron. 

[Mothra]

7 hours ago, Rebecca said:

I’m around an 11 year old girl all the time (and have been since her birth) and those names have never been cute to me for a young girl. The girl I know would be embarrassed. And I just can’t help but think calling a known “accident” child “boo boo” is fucked up. Amber is totally tone deaf, as usual. 

Excellent point about "boo boo."

You're right--those aren't names a real mom would normally call a real child, but Amber doesn't know what an affectionate nickname sounds like.  I bet she called Leah "booger" and Leah laughed, and Amber thought "nailed it."  Case in point:  Farrah called Sophia "boo boo" as well, and while they did seem to spend a lot of time together, no way was Farrah *present* for Sophia.

Is either of them of an age where this would make sense?

And even if it did, is this something you'd compare a little girl to?

[CandysWrapRoom]

On 10/10/2018 at 10:38 AM, Mothra said:

It's really cruel to a kid and rude to everybody else to disguise your kid's sex.  I mean, Maverick?  Come on.  If you want to let a little boy's hair grow long and style it like a girl's hair, or if you want to cut your little girl's hair very short and name her Lee, it's incumbent on you as parents to make sure everyone knows what your kid's sex is.  It makes your kid's--and everyone else's life--easier and better.

It's no one's business what sex a child is. What's in their pants is between them and their parents. As for what their gender is, there's nothing wrong with not assigning gender based on biological sex and letting the child work it out for themselves as they learn to move through the world. One could argue that being assigned no gender is better than being assigned the wrong one. Just some food for thought.

Edited October 11, 2018 by allienc

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

Maybe it's a regional thing, but I've heard people in south Louisiana called their loved ones (particularly children) "boo" as a term of endearment for over 25 years - white and black middle class & working class people, particularly in/around New Orleans.  Generally it's used like: "What would you like to drink, boo?" (so used more like "dear" rather than just referring to someone as "boo" instead of their name while talking about them). Sometimes parents will turn that boo into boo-boo with very small kids.  A toddler is crying- "What's wrong, boo-boo?"  I've heard plenty of people use it in the region where I grew up for decades (long before Amber and Farrah ever used it).  I catch myself occasionally asking my kids "what's wrong, my boo-boo?" when they cry....because I heard plenty of sweet "yat" ladies ("yat" is what we call the New Orleans area accent/dialect) use it as a term of endearment this way. I don't think it's a problem at all to use that way (I think it's cute), BUT it's not cool as the kid's actual nickname or when you only call them boo-boo.  

However, most people don't and wouldn't refer to their child who is over toddler-age as "boo-boo" on national television....and I have no idea how something I thought was a regional thing became a thing in Indiana or Iowa...unless it's actually a Southern and Midwestern thing and I just didn't know. 

My husband & I refer to our son as "Bear" (it's his nickname) occasionally when talking to each other or to him & our daughter as "Birdie." But I would never tell a co-worker "Oh, Bear loves Captain America!" or something. I'd use his real name. Same with my daughter. And I'd most certainly not refer to them as Bear and Birdie on TV and definitely not when they're school-aged.  If Amber spent any decent amount of time interacting with a child (like Leah, for example) ever in her life, she'd realize it's not cool at all to refer to your child as "bew-bew" in place of her name 99% of the time on TV (and definitely not when the child is like 9/10 years old)!  She'd also realize this if she was around other parents or people who were regularly around children (you know, like if she worked at a real job). 

Edited October 11, 2018 by MyPeopleAreNordic

[Rebecca]

Since Amber will never pick up a dictionary... 

Amber got accidentally pregnant as a teen to a guy she had a tumultuous relationship with and now “hates” and she doesn't really have a relationship with Leah. All these things make the specific situation of Amber calling Leah “booboo” horrible to me. A loving, involved parent who actually raises and WANTS their kid calling them “booboo” on occasion is a totally different scenario. Hell, it would be less biting if Gary called Leah that. It’s specific to the Amber/Leah relationship. Imagine if Adam called Aubree “booboo”? Same thing.  

Edited October 11, 2018 by Rebecca

[DangerousMinds]

2 hours ago, allienc said:

It's no one's business what sex a child is. What's in their pants is between them and their parents. As for what their gender is, there's nothing wrong with not assigning gender based on biological sex and letting the child work it out for themselves as they learn to move through the world. One could argue that being assigned no gender is better than being assigned the wrong one. Just some food for thought.

Exactly! And sex and gender are not the same thing.

[ghoulina]

8 hours ago, Mainer said:

I think Amber just throws it out there in conversation for us viewers that she’s trying to see Leah and Leah said no... it’s not a real attempt to be a parent it’s a half assed attempt... like oh wow she sent out an invite. Like any of us would to a friend. And wouldn’t you know Leah said no! Shucks! That’s too bad maybe next week.. umm no last I checked parents get certain visit times and scheduled time with there kids it’s not optional, she lets it be optional because she doesn’t really care. She sent an invite to look good that’s all

I think Amber feels that since she had James, Leah will just want to come over more. And Gary will allow it, because that's her brother. She's going to be all guilt trips and passive aggressiveness.

But kids crave routine. Leah likely won't want to just go over there on a whim. Plus, like Kristina said, she's at the age where she is getting more into her social life with friends.

I see Amber being like my stepdad. My mom divorced him when my little sisters were a bit younger than Leah. He would just show up at my mom's on a Friday night and ask them to come to a ball game. They'd tell him they had sleepover plans. He'd get pissed, drive off, and not call them for months.

Selfish and infantile, just like Amber. Ironically, he's bipolar as well. 

[Mainer]

No parent chooses jail when they have a child to begin with,  I never forgot that how can you voluntarily leave your child..

[ghoulina]

26 minutes ago, Mainer said:

No parent chooses jail when they have a child to begin with,  I never forgot that how can you voluntarily leave your child..

I have the worst memory, but I always kind of thought she chose jail because she knew it would give her a better outcome, as far as getting clean goes. It was like she was giving herself a dose of tough love and I kind of respected her for it. I thought she was looking at the bigger picture; and realizing that, yea, she'd miss out on a lot in the present, but it gave her a better chance for a future.

The most I ever liked Amber was right when she got out of jail. She seemed to really have her shit together and I was rooting for her. 

But she got lazy, didn't follow through with after care, slipped into old patterns...and here we are today. She will only be able to keep up this "perfect mom" act with James for so long.

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

37 minutes ago, Mainer said:

No parent chooses jail when they have a child to begin with,  I never forgot that how can you voluntarily leave your child..

Amber really had "left" Leah before that. Gary had custody at that time and I think Amber saw her sporadically and CPS was involved.  I think jail was legitimately the only thing that got Amber clean from the really bad stuff and she knew she'd kept failing the rehab programs. She said in her book (judge away, I read it) that she would chew fentanyl patches during/before the outpatient meetings the judge had sentenced her to go to. She knew she'd piss dirty at the testing at the meetings and didn't care. She just wanted to be high and didn't care about being sentenced to more rehab over and over.  She didn't trust herself to go to rehabs (especially a cushy one MTV might provide again), come back in a few weeks, and relapse (see: other MTV stars who've done rehabs) and she had no Fs to give when it came to the outpatient treatment she had been ordered to do.  She did seem to take a good deal of accountability for her actions when she first came out of gel and seemed to be in a much better place.  However, it didn't last long.  I don't blame it all on Matt entering the picture, but he certainly was no help.  Amber went back to being delusional, extra lazy, and was also drinking pretty quickly. Somewhat self-aware Amber disappeared.  That somewhat self-aware Amber also seemed to know she was a sh*t parent who probably shouldn't have had kids....and this delusional Amber went on to have another kid. Sigh.

As for leaving Leah, she had done that a long time before gel.  I can see how she saw gel as the only chance to get clean and not die from drugs because she knew she wasn't going to go through with treatment any other way.  I hate that she chose to go to jail and not see Leah, but she wasn't a parent to Leah for a long time before choosing gel, just like she's not a parent to Leah now.  So...it's kind of the same. I guess at least she's alive and Leah gets a chance to decide for herself as she gets older what kind of relationship (if any) she wants to have with Amber. If Amber had died from an OD because she'd never gotten off the hardcore drugs, Leah wouldn't even have the chance to make that decision about whether or not she wants Amber in her life and she'd likely have many unanswered questions about her mom.  Leah can at least know who her mom is as a person (as opposed to if Amber had died when Leah was very young when Amber's addiction was so bad). That may mean Leah will see that Amber is a crap parent, but at least Leah knows, I suppose.  

I feel like I haven't said that eloquently. I hope it makes sense. Of all the bad decisions Amber has made & for what a crap parent she is to Leah, I feel like choosing gel was probably the most self-aware, mature, positive decision Amber ever made.  It's too bad she didn't continue on the path she was on right after her release & has never gotten her crap together in regards to Leah. Thank goodness Leah has Gary & Kristina. I hope NuMatt will be there for James because we all see what's coming when that child gets to be mobile or his parents split.  I also hope James & Leah can somehow form a close relationship as the two of them will likely have the same experiences with their mother and it will likely all be played out in the public eye.  Few others will really understand that experience.  

Edited October 11, 2018 by MyPeopleAreNordic

[Mainer]

@MyPeopleAreNordic great response and I forgot how cps was involved and she wasn’t in Leah’s life really at all at that time. I think when she left tho the bond was broken between them and they never fully recovered (Leah and amber  both) and that’s also when Gary really became a great dad and knew he had to protect Leah from her mom... it’s too bad for both. I think amber thought that time would go by and then she’d pop right back into Leah’s life and they’d be just like they used to be. (Even tho Leah was very young) and that didn’t happen there was a distance and Amber got used to having her time to herself and not taking care of a child(not that she did a good job to begin with). I’m thinking that it’s possible she will realize as time goes by with James just how much she missed with Leah and it will really make her sad. I feel like she’s kimda awkward with Leah, it’s like there sisters or something not mother daughter, she wants to be close to Leah but in a sister or friend way because of that broken time together.. 

your right tho she could’ve died or never gotten off drugs which would be much worse situation, to me it’s a double edged sword, both outcomes weren’t ideal. She definitely should’ve really tried when she got out of gel to get closer with her instead of worrying about a new boyfriend, and having a few drinks and such.. 

[Mothra]

7 hours ago, allienc said:

It's no one's business what sex a child is. What's in their pants is between them and their parents. As for what their gender is, there's nothing wrong with not assigning gender based on biological sex and letting the child work it out for themselves as they learn to move through the world. One could argue that being assigned no gender is better than being assigned the wrong one. Just some food for thought.

This wasn't about gender identity per se.  It was about knowing which pronouns the parents (and the kid) wanted us to use when speaking to him.  This was no attempt by his parents to honor the child's feelings; just as high school teachers are expected to use the preferred pronouns when speaking to a transgendered kid, we parents needed to know how to address this child.

This was in 1988, btw, when such concerns were virtually unknown among professionals, totally unknown by run-of-the-mill parents.  We didn't care what was in Evan's pants.  We wanted to know whether we were supposed to call him "he" or "she".

In general, I take your point and agree wholeheartedly.  I have a trans nephew and nobody better give him any trouble.

[Guest]

Gender identity is not on topic in this thread. Please get back to the topic which is the episode of this show.

[Pepper Mostly]

19 hours ago, MyPeopleAreNordic said:

Maybe it's a regional thing, but I've heard people in south Louisiana called their loved ones (particularly children) "boo" as a term of endearment for over 25 years - white and black middle class & working class people, particularly in/around New Orleans.  Generally it's used like: "What would you like to drink, boo?" (so used more like "dear" rather than just referring to someone as "boo" instead of their name while talking about them). Sometimes parents will turn that boo into boo-boo with very small kids.  A toddler is crying- "What's wrong, boo-boo?"  I've heard plenty of people use it in the region where I grew up for decades (long before Amber and Farrah ever used it).  I catch myself occasionally asking my kids "what's wrong, my boo-boo?" when they cry....because I heard plenty of sweet "yat" ladies ("yat" is what we call the New Orleans area accent/dialect) use it as a term of endearment this way. I don't think it's a problem at all to use that way (I think it's cute), BUT it's not cool as the kid's actual nickname or when you only call them boo-boo.  

However, most people don't and wouldn't refer to their child who is over toddler-age as "boo-boo" on national television....and I have no idea how something I thought was a regional thing became a thing in Indiana or Iowa...unless it's actually a Southern and Midwestern thing and I just didn't know. 

My husband & I refer to our son as "Bear" (it's his nickname) occasionally when talking to each other or to him & our daughter as "Birdie." But I would never tell a co-worker "Oh, Bear loves Captain America!" or something. I'd use his real name. Same with my daughter. And I'd most certainly not refer to them as Bear and Birdie on TV and definitely not when they're school-aged.  If Amber spent any decent amount of time interacting with a child (like Leah, for example) ever in her life, she'd realize it's not cool at all to refer to your child as "bew-bew" in place of her name 99% of the time on TV (and definitely not when the child is like 9/10 years old)!  She'd also realize this if she was around other parents or people who were regularly around children (you know, like if she worked at a real job). 

Amber is a grown woman who calls her brother "Bubby", for crying out loud.

@MyPeopleAreNordic, I've enjoyed all your posts on this topic, thanks for your insignts!

[teapot]

I'm cynical about Amber's reasons for going to gel.  Someone (maybe it was here or maybe it was TWOP, where I was a creepy stalker but didn't participate, haha!) said that people will choose jail rather than probation because once they do their time, they're not required to pass drug tests, and they can get high to their heart's content.

Part of me has been giving Amber the side-eye ever since they said that.

[kicksave]

On 10/8/2018 at 10:49 PM, geauxaway said:

How old is Andrew chronologically?  I’m asking seriously.  Because dude acts so stunted, but looks in his 50’s.  

The dude is weird...definitely an immature geeky kind of dude...looks like he plays a lot of computer game out there and attends Cos Play every year.

[kicksave]

Some thoughts on this episode:

Cate and Tyler:  Now Cate is being diagnosed with PTSD and panic disorder? OMG! this resort/spa that is parading itself as a mental health facility seems like a joke. And the adoption gave her these disorders? Please...Carly's adoption was well planned, the agency that handled it was caring, loving and looked out for their best interests...the couple that adopted her gave them visitation and sent pictures of her as she grew and even met Cate and Tyler regularly so that they could see Carly and more recently so that Carly and Nova could meet. You couldn't ask for a better adoption...and they willingly signed off on it. They could have pulled the plug on it anytime before her birth...no one was coercing them or pressuring them. I'm not buying into the PTSD diagnosis...that's BS. Depression? check. But when she comes home from this so called rehab place she never follows through on therapy or psychiatric treatment. She just guilts Tyler and then flies off to Arizona again. I think she's extremely manipulative and shows little to no empathy or concern for Tyler at all. Why in the world they are having another child is just insane. Tyler will be the primary caregiver as Cate will abdicate her responsibilities when she experiences post partum depression and then goes for another stint at rehab in Arizona. The horse she HAD to buy will be neglected and given away and she will just hang around, sleep and mope. Her behavior when Tyler brought up the therapist's idea of them watching the show together was shocking...her anger and defiance was palpable and showed her to be the selfish, self absorbed person that she really is. Tyler needs to grow a pair and demand that she step up and be an adult. 

Bristol: Who thought it would be a good idea to put this train wreck of a marriage on TV? 

Cheyenne:  What a spoiled brat. Ugh. Does she do anything besides sit around the house and juggle two men? And the thong bathing suit in front of her parents and family...whew...her butt was hanging out for all to see...clearly she is more comfortable around her parents then I would be. 

Amber: I agree with other posters that have commented that this loving mom to baby James act will dissolve at some point and geeky nerd Andrew will be doing everything. Leah doesn't want to hang out there because it's boring and maybe she isn't all too comfortable around Andrew who is weird. Why not suggest that you take Leah to park to play and bring the baby along. Or get Andrew to babysit and do some activity with Leah alone? I know, I know...Amber doesn't like getting out of bed or off the couch.

Maci:  No storyline here...just more Ryan drama and he isn't even on the show anymore. Ryan's parents are classic enablers that are also codependent. This whole family needs intensive counseling and therapy in order for Ryan to get and stay healthy and sober. 

Edited October 12, 2018 by kicksave

[ghoulina]

1 minute ago, kicksave said:

Bristol: Who thought it would be a good idea to put this train wreck of a marriage on TV? 

I wasn't even a super big Bristol hater, but damn. That shit makes me uncomfortable to watch. That marriage was obviously in deep trouble before she made this decision and I don't know if it was fair to be so exploitative. Dakota seems to have no problem talking to the cameras; but, then again, is he even mentally stable enough to be making such decisions? I feel for him, but I also feel for Bristol - who, apparently, can't even question his behavior without having his PTSD thrown in her face. It's a nightmare, and one day their girls will be able to relive it all. Just seems wrong. 

[Mainer]

On 10/12/2018 at 2:28 PM, kicksave said:

Some thoughts on this episode:

Cate and Tyler:  Now Cate is being diagnosed with PTSD and panic disorder? OMG! this resort/spa that is parading itself as a mental health facility seems like a joke. And the adoption gave her these disorders? Please...Carly's adoption was well planned, the agency that handled it was caring, loving and looked out for their best interests...the couple that adopted her gave them visitation and sent pictures of her as she grew and even met Cate and Tyler regularly so that they could see Carly and more recently so that Carly and Nova could meet. You couldn't ask for a better adoption...and they willingly signed off on it. They could have pulled the plug on it anytime before her birth...no one was coercing them or pressuring them. I'm not buying into the PTSD diagnosis...that's BS. Depression? check. But when she comes home from this so called rehab place she never follows through on therapy or psychiatric treatment. She just guilts Tyler and then flies off to Arizona again. I think she's extremely manipulative and shows little to no empathy or concern for Tyler at all. Why in the world they are having another child is just insane. Tyler will be the primary caregiver as Cate will abdicate her responsibilities when she experiences post partum depression and then goes for another stint at rehab in Arizona. The horse she HAD to buy will be neglected and given away and she will just hang around, sleep and mope. Her behavior when Tyler brought up the therapist's idea of them watching the show together was shocking...her anger and defiance was palpable and showed her to be the selfish, self absorbed person that she really is. Tyler needs to grow a pair and demand that she step up and be an adult. 

 

I agree, I have wondered who gave out the ptsd diagnosis myself... also when she returns from rehab she walks in all happy go lucky like she’s been on a vacation... it’s not like she walks in with some seriousness and explains what went on and what she got from it, it’s just honey I’m home!! It’s odd! I wonder if being at home and with Tyler is causing her unhappiness?? Maybe there just done and they both hang on to the marriage that’s been long over... maybe that’s why she accuses him of wanting to leave her and throwing that guilt comment “I’d leave me if I were you”... because deep inside she actually wants to leave him but doesn’t know how or dare too. There clearly not in the same page or communicating well when one thinks things are fine(Catelyn choosing to not face reality) and the other saying things haven’t been good for two years.. maybe it’s not mental illness but just plain unhappiness. A lot of people are guilty of staying in a marriage long after it’s actually done. Idk just a thought 

[Caracoa1]

Cate is so codependent on Tyler... it's so pathetic....and sad.  I think her PTSD comes from choosing a relationship with Tyler over keeping Carly.  He pressured her to give Carly up so they could have a future together...so she did...now that relationship is falling apart before our eyes on national television. She can't admit to herself that you gave away Carly to keep Tyler... She chose a man over her own flesh and blood.  I believe choosing adoption for Carly was the best thing those two ever did...but the havoc it's creating in Cate's mind is destroying her.  

[ginger90]

2 minutes ago, Caracoa1 said:

Cate is so codependent on Tyler... it's so pathetic....and sad.  I think her PTSD comes from choosing a relationship with Tyler over keeping Carly.  He pressured her to give Carly up so they could have a future together...so she did...now that relationship is falling apart before our eyes on national television. She can't admit to herself that you gave away Carly to keep Tyler... She chose a man over her own flesh and blood.  I believe choosing adoption for Carly was the best thing those two ever did...but the havoc it's creating in Cate's mind is destroying her.  

Being on television rehashing it all, episode after episode certainly was not therapeutic.