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S06.E18: Fundamentals


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In his darkest place yet, Oliver wonders if he has failed at everything – being a father, a mayor and a hero. His frustration rising, Oliver lashes out at Felicity and William. A surprising visit from an old friend has Oliver questioning his next move.

 

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This has been one weird season, with Diaz, the NTA, Diggle splitting, Thea leaving...  

 

but the "I'm glue, baby"?  Makes up for a lot of it.  I actually shed a tear.  

 

Then I was reminded Diaz was still there and we took 20 steps back. 

  • Love 20
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I really liked this episode, it was well done. Good acting, good writing and well paced. Got a bit slow in the middle but, ended well.

I don't get Oliver's lesson. He had to go back to basics and be alone in his mission like in S1 when he had Diggle and Felicity?

Whatever show ?

I love Chase, I miss Chase but, surprisingly, I found that Diaz worked for me tonight.

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For however many seasons the lesson Oliver had to learn was "you can't do it alone!" Now, in a shocking twist, he must learn that he has to do it alone! Sigh. Poor SA.

This was a really fun episode, though.

  • Love 6
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Fast paced episode that had me at the edge of my seat. 

I missed Lance making sense.

The line "Your dad's on drugs" made me chuckle. 

But Oliver, come on. It was only after you took on a team that things started to WORK.

"I'm glue, baby. Please." Loved her hand on his heart and his hand over it and the emotion in this scene --

Edited by Soulfire
  • Love 12
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That Olicity scene in the police station was everything. "I'm glue, baby" was the best. 

As I said multiple times in the live thread, bringing back Chase when we're expected to see Diaz, a guy who just waits and waits and doesn't do anything when Oliver's just hanging out right outside the door, as a Big Bad? Stupid. So, so stupid.

On the one hand, we didn't have to deal with Lance's "not my daughter is my daughter, sort of, could be, here, read a law book and become a lawyer" nonsense. On the other hand, as soon as Oliver told him he was dosed, he should have done something. Anything.

At least Arrow's made it clear BS isn't going to be redeemed? And acknowledged how stupid it was to make Laurel BC?

And while I get that Oliver may think he should be going at it alone, he's not being fair to Felicity considering he has to know how much being Overwatch means to her? 

Did get a laugh out of Rene in a hospital bed in full Wild Dog costume. 

Wasn't a fan of Diggle in this episode. This isn't my Diggle. I miss my Diggle. 

And again, why is everyone so scared of Diaz? All he does is stand back, surrounded by cops he's happy to send to their deaths, and sit in a chair. 

  • Love 16
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Its amazing how much better this show is when it focuses on our core characters, and doesn't waste time with pain in the ass useless Newbies. Or Johns recent lobotomy. This was actually a pretty good episode, miles better than the last few. Quentin and Oliver were really good (they've come so far!) and Quentin actually acted like himself, and Olicity! Oh my God, that was perfect. Save your poor, mess of a man Felicity! In your sensible shoes that your step son got you! The cuteness, it hurts so good!

God I miss Chase. Diaz truly is the poor mans Prometheus, with the "I will take him apart" stuff. But Chase as the devil on Oliver's shoulder was pretty amazing. "Why did you let her be Black Canary! Shes a lawyer! Who took a few self defense classes!" Ghost Chase speaks the truth!

Even when he has his wife and son, poor Oliver is such a mess, that he still ends up two seconds from a nervous breakdown. It makes Diggle turning on him so brutally with everything else falling apart. He knows how Oliver is and he knows his issues! Even if he had issues with him, I still dont buy that he would turn on his best friend and brother when he needs him. Diaz hardly needs to so anything, his friends and teammates are doing enough to mess Oliver up. Poor guy has serious issues he needs to fully deal with. 

"I`m not going anywhere. I`m glue baby." My heart!

  • Love 15
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I really liked that ep minus a few glaring weaknesses. Phantom! Chase can stay forever as far as I'm concerned. Bad move bringing JS back in an ep with KA and DDDiaz. One is sooo much better than the other that I'm bummed I have to spend the rest of the season with Diaz. 

That's a top five Olicity moment. I wasn't a fan of the acting (he's still so wooden,) but I did like Jack and Felicity and him bringing her sensible shoes. And I loved Felicity running to get her man. Oliver's decision doesn't make any sense, but I guess this is how TPTB are stripping everything away from him. Who cares about logic?

  • Love 16
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This was certainly the best episode of the season. Rarely does Arrow keep me on my toes but I didn't know what was going to happen. Wasn't expecting Chase, wasn't expecting Laurel, kind of surprised they didnt have Thea.

Oliver is going back to basics, he did spend half of the first season without OTA though he still had Diggle for majority of that time to help him so I think OMA/One Man Arrow will learn very fast that he can't do it all TRULY alone. 

I hope they just stick with Black Siren being a villain because I dont want anymore back and forth after this. Having her paired with another male big bad is boring as hell but this is still Arrow despite it being their best episode of the season.

  • Love 2
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I was pleasantly surprised with this episode. Chase made it better. Felicity made it right.

Oliver proved at the end that he can’t do it alone. If she hadn’t been there to talk him down he would have died. He can not do this without help. Felicity as usual saved the day. 

  • Love 17
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Still can't stand William... Like  dude.. Ur dad and stepmom are obviously having a heated discussion stop bitching abt being late... Loved having chase around again... I'm sorry I get they wanted an olicity strong episode... But I'm calling ducktales on felicity taking off her heels and running after  Ollie... And not calling Jon... Hell even the newbs but def John... Running in a corrupt cop precinct... Smh totally tanked the episode a bit for me

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"It's no surprise to me / I am my own worst enemy / 'Cause every now and then / I kick the living shit out of me" - Lit

Oliver needs a hug. Lots of hugs. Fuck it, the Legends can draft him for the first part of their next mission. He knows most of them already, right? They have to deal with massive amounts of bullshit, but at least it's insanely awesome. Instead, he gets loopy on Vertigo, hallucinates Diaz and Chase, and gets heavy-handed lessons smacked into him. Then he gets impeached. He last almost two years. That's basically makes him Joe Torre in the Steinbrenner era of the Yankees, lasting a lot longer than most people had imagined. I imagine Quentin will be flying off the wagon when he takes the oath. I'm not disparging the guy, but Star City is a place where you'd have to be numb 24/7. And most people don't even have to deal with alternates versions of their dead kids. The man is fraying. Fuck it, bring him on the Waverider with Oliver! Make him spend time with the daughter that's actually alive and way more awesome than Laurel ever was. Oh, and "Chase" quipping about Laurel's prep in becoming Whack Canary . . . it's like the writers are trolling us at this point.

Seriously . . . Diaz doesn't do it for me at all. Not as vengeful as Prometheus, not as snarky and dark like Damien, not as twisted as Slade. Maybe he's better than Merlyn, but Merlyn was an assclown of the highest order. He just looks good because he was played by John Barrowman.

Hi, Broken Arrow! Bye, Broken Arrow! Eh, at least the actors got to suit up. Still expecting Rene to wake up, unable to say anything but the word "Hoss."

  • Love 3
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Funny thing about Oliver "going it alone" is that he still has all Felicity's computers and programs.  He's kidding himself if he thinks he's really going it alone but I wonder if part of him thinks that the best way to protect his relationship with Felicity is to take her off the team since everyone else on the team has chosen to leave?  

Beyond that I guess I could understand him wanting some time to process losing Diggle and do some digging and see if he can adjust back to going it alone but kicking out your tech support makes zero sense.  Unless what he really was doing was kicking out the sensible voice of reason?  

I feel like right now Felicity is just humoring him and hoping he gets it out of his system.  

Oh the part were Felicity mentioned Oliver's other option than saying it was proof the GA gave him was to say it was from his hacking wife makes me really think there are

Spoiler

NOT dropping that earlier thread where Felicity got framed.  So end of season  maybe she does get arrested.

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Edited by BkWurm1
  • Love 5
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Season 1 Oliver was a murderous thug who alienated his family because he had to keep lying to them and couldn't come up with a way to help people in his civvies.  Season 6 Oliver is a man who inspires other heroes and has led them in battles to save the world while also trying (kind of poorly, but let's ignore that) to help the city as mayor.  Clearly we need season 1 Oliver back.  I'd sure like to know how they came up with that.

  • Love 10
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Loved this episode. Loved Felicity saving Oliver.  Lance was somehow both the voice of reason to drugged Oliver and the moron who let him wander around the city and didn't even bother to call his wife and let her know her husband was drugged/hallucinating. But sadly the moments as the voice of reason still put him way ahead of his behavior for most of the season. I do wish they'd decide if William is a 12 year old genius or a somewhat dim 9 year old. Impairment/impeachment, come on, show!

  • Love 7
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Really great episode which surprised me because I usually hate the episodes SA hypes. LOL.

The only thing I don't like is the show acting like Diggle and the newbies are in the right and Oliver's leadership and being spread too thin is affecting him being GA. That's bullshit tbh and makes no sense. I also don't understand why Felicity can't be Overwatch. She's not in the field, she's literally a guide in his ear and extra eyes. How is that distracting? 

William giving Felicity sensible shoes so she can run was the actual cutest OMG. I like how they've built up Felicity and William's relationship. One of the few good things about this season.

I LOVED all of the Olicity scenes, obviously. Duh. Oliver is legit terrified of losing his wife and son and that gets me in the heart space tbh. Felicity being the only one to pull him out of his hallucination? Ugh, Olicity are so powerful. ? Seriously though. "I'm glue, baby" just about killed me. I don't need much to make me happy tbh and this made me very happy. Also yay for Olicity stunts. I've missed them!

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That was such a good episode. Surprisingly strong showing for Lance, tons of Chase, a hilarious Laurel slam (“She's a lawyer. What, after a couple self defense classes and a few sparring lessons with you she was ready to handle thugs and killers?“), great acting by Amell (his face where he realizes she’s not wearing her ring killed me), Felicity admitting she’s done drugs, nice moments with William and Raisa, and Olicity. So. Much. Olicity. And old school stunt, a million wife/husband comments, “I’m glue baby,” “I have to go save my husband,” “My man was in there.” Gah! 

Too bad the ending makes no sense. What kind of tactical strategy is it to not take advantage of access to a genius hacker? Especially since this “back to basics” time Oliver is waxing poetic about barely even existing in the first place. 

Also, when did the hallucinations start to actually happen? Did she not tell Oliver to leave after he broke William’s project? I thought that part was real but she told Quentin she didn’t...

  • Love 12
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3 minutes ago, Trisha said:

That was such a good episode. Surprisingly strong showing for Lance, tons of Chase, a hilarious Laurel slam (“She's a lawyer. What, after a couple self defense classes and a few sparring lessons with you she was ready to handle thugs and killers?“), great acting by Amell (his face where he realizes she’s not wearing her ring killed me), Felicity admitting she’s done drugs, nice moments with William and Raisa, and Olicity. So. Much. Olicity. And old school stunt, a million wife/husband comments, “I’m glue baby,” “I have to go save my husband,” “My man was in there.” Gah! 

Too bad the ending makes no sense. What kind of tactical strategy is it to not take advantage of access to a genius hacker? Especially since this “back to basics” time Oliver is waxing poetic about barely even existing in the first place. 

Also, when did the hallucinations start to actually happen? Did she not tell Oliver to leave after he broke William’s project? I thought that part was real but she told Quentin she didn’t...

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After that is when the hallucinations started. The Vertigo though made him snap like that. 

I realize now I kept saying in the live thread that it had to have been after the first Felicity scene but I was so unhappy with the first Felicity scene aka the failed Diggle reconciliation that I must have blocked its existence from my mind, lol.  So the SECOND Felicity scene was the last real one of her until she and William walked into the door.  

But Quentin must have showed up right after phantom Felicity departed.  And Quentin, I don't care if a wife just left her husband, you still call to let her know her husband is whacked out on Vertigo.  

Edited by BkWurm1
  • Love 2
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In this episode, Felicity called Oliver her husband, her man, and told Oliver that she wasn't going anywhere, "I'm glue, baby." Ugh, I love them so much. Then, they both flew away on one of Oliver's arrows that can reach the moon. Give this episode an Academy Award! Heh. No, but seriously, I loved that whole moment between Oliver and Felicity at the precinct and this whole episode was pretty damn solid, actually. However, putting Josh Segarra's Adrian Chase in the same episode as Avocado's DDDiaz was a huge mistake. It really showed how much better JS was at playing a big bad and how much of a sadsack the "villain" we got this season is.

As for the entire story arc of this whole dumb season with Diggle, the NTA, the FBI investigation, the impeachment, and everything else that led to whatever Oliver supposedly figured out this time around that doing this thing alone is what he should do, when the show has spent every season for 5 years telling us that no, in fact, going at it alone and alienating everyone in your life is not the way to being the hero this hapless city needs:

tumblr_p2jdiwErQw1w4vgb7o9_250.gif

  • Love 19
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I forgot to mention Chase which is dumb because he really made the episode. It wouldn't be as good without him and that's just facts. Josh Segarra is a national treasure. Protect at all costs!

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2 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

After that is when the hallucinations started. The Vertigo though made him snap like that.  

Right but then did Felicity actually tell him to get out? I thought that part was real,  but then later Quentin tells he Oliver said she’d kicked him out and she says “no, I would never.”

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4 minutes ago, calliope1975 said:

I liked that in the live thread we all thought Lance giving good advice was a hallucination. 

Oops.  I missread this.  :D

Edited by BkWurm1
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I enjoyed this episode more than I thought I would. It does not take much to make me happy. Good acting, good villian  (Chase), Olicity, William being useful, good job with the shoes. The only thing I am bummed about is Diggle.  This rift is so stupid and I don't like my fav's acting stupid.

Chase, boy did I miss you. How am I suppose to take marbles seriously.  I am not joking when I say I don't understand half the stuff that comes out of his mouth.  The guy is not intimidating. Chase gave me chills in 5 minutes whereas marbles has given me nothing but thinking I need to get my hearing checked.

  • Love 12
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7 minutes ago, Trisha said:

Also, when did the hallucinations start to actually happen? Did she not tell Oliver to leave after he broke William’s project? I thought that part was real but she told Quentin she didn’t...

Yeah, I think her telling him to get out was the start of the hallucinations.

Also, should we put Quentin on a death watch? We know what happens to every Star City mayor not named Oliver Queen.

  • Love 3
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2 minutes ago, Trisha said:

Right but then did Felicity actually tell him to get out? I thought that part was real,  but then later Quentin tells he Oliver said she’d kicked him out and she says “no, I would never.”

She told him to get out of the apartment, not that she left him or wanted space.  Real Felicity had William thank her for helping him fix his project.  So I'd say she did tell him to leave.  

Edited by BkWurm1
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1 minute ago, Trisha said:

Right but then did Felicity actually tell him to get out? I thought that part was real,  but then later Quentin tells he Oliver said she’d kicked him out and she says “no, I would never.”

The get out was real, the break up scene in the lair was a hallucination.

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2 minutes ago, ladylaw99 said:

I enjoyed this episode more than I thought I would. It does not take much to make me happy. Good acting, good villian  (Chase), Olicity, William being useful, good job with the shoes. The only thing I am bummed about is Diggle.  This rift is so stupid and I don't like my fav's acting stupid.

Chase, boy did I miss you. How am I suppose to take marbles seriously.  I am not joking when I say I don't understand half the stuff that comes out of his mouth.  The guy is not intimidating. Chase gave me chills in 5 minutes whereas marbles has given me nothing but thinking I need to get my hearing checked.

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There was some big line that KA shouted that I understood absolutely nothing of.  

  • Love 1
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I LOVED THIS EPISODE. ZOMG!

Phantom Chase is everything.

"I have to save my husband"

SA killed this episode. So great. I'm so happy.

Chase>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>....you get the idea....>>>>>>Diaz.

  • Love 19
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4 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

There was some big line that KA shouted that I understood absolutely nothing of.  

I am glad I am not the only one because I was legit in thinking there was something wrong with my hearing.

Edited by ladylaw99
  • Love 2
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5 minutes ago, ladylaw99 said:

I am glad I am not the only one because I was legit in thinking there was something wrong with my hearing.

That's why I call him Marblemouth. I never understand him the first time around. 

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How can I forget the best lines going to Chase about LL being a lawyer, taking a few self defense classes, few sparring lessons, thought she was ready to handle killers, spill the truth tea my friend.

  • Love 15
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It's hilarious that I thought the only time Quentin gave good advice this whole season was when Oliver was high on Vertigo. LMAO. But seriously, Quentin is not bad at all when he's not wrapped up in that BS/Laurel mess. Sigh. Poor PB.

And now he's mayor so IDK how I feel about his odds for seeing out the season tbh.

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So Emily’s comments about Felicity questioning Oliver, that was about his decision tonight. I’m so relieved it wasn’t about supporting the noobs.

Redemption looks good on BS.

  • Love 12
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12 minutes ago, ladylaw99 said:

How can I forget the best lines going to Chase about LL being a lawyer, taking a few self defense classes, few sparring lessons, thought she was ready to handle killers, spill the truth tea my friend.

I had a good chuckle at that and, since this is ALL Oliver, that's what he really thinks.

  • Love 24
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There was a lot of good stuff in this episode:

William and Felicity's relationship and William bringing Felicity shoes she can actually save Oliver in;

Quentin speaking sense for a change;

The reason for Oliver being impeached because he tried to fire the person investigating him;

Chase!!!  You're so very much better than Diaz, it makes Diaz look ever more lame;

Chase truth-telling that Laurel shouldn't have been a mask;

Raisa!!!!  I hope Oliver got her an apartment in the same building given how often she has to emergency babysit.  Does she know yet he's the Green Arrow?

And of course the "glue" scene.  Kudos to the show for avoiding drama in Oliver and Felicity's relationship.

I still didn't like the (lack of) logic and empathy from Diggle.  And Oliver is putting his head in the sand if he thinks going it alone is going to protect Felicity, William and Raisa.  Diaz knows where they live.

6 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

And now he's mayor so IDK how I feel about his odds for seeing out the season tbh.

We know that being mayor of the city puts a target on your back.

1 hour ago, UNOSEZ said:

Still can't stand William... Like  dude.. Ur dad and stepmom are obviously having a heated discussion stop bitching abt being late... Loved having chase around again... I'm sorry I get they wanted an olicity strong episode... But I'm calling ducktales on felicity taking off her heels and running after  Ollie... And not calling Jon... Hell even the newbs but def John... Running in a corrupt cop precinct... Smh totally tanked the episode a bit for me

She tried that at the start of the episode and Diggle just fought back even worse than before. Curtis and Dinah told Oliver to go away and never call them.

So I can understand when it's an emergency and someone has to stop Oliver from going through that door and getting killed, Felicity didn't want to waste time trying to persuade people who had given up on Oliver multiple times already to try to save him.

  • Love 13
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About that time for Arrow to do it's trippy, hallucination episode, I see.  Thanks to the majority of this season, I thought it was easily one of the better episodes.  Quentin actually got to be useful and not a dumbass, Stephen Amell did a great job throughout it all, and Felicity got to be the big damn hero, and be the one to finally talk him down.  Oh, and then there was Chase.  Honestly, it might have arguably been a mistake to bring him back, because even though I wasn't wild about him last season, he was ten times better than Diaz has ever been this season.  Josh Segarra just has the ability to command the screen and sell himself as a main villain that Kirk Acevedo lacks (and, again, I actually have enjoyed Kirk in other tings.)  Frankly, considering how many preposterous twists and crazy moments have happened on this show, I would be perfectly fine if this ends with Diaz pulling his face to reveal himself as Chase and he's all "It was me, Oliver!  It was me all along!"

Of course, it wouldn't be Arrow if a few WTF?! moments, and it being revealed that Oliver still feels some guilt for how he handled the Noobs (and the show even freaking showed that Rene TOOK A FUCKING HATCHET too him!), and his big takeaway is that he has to go back to "the basics."  Which is to got at it alone.  No Diggle, No Felicity (as Team Arrow), nothing.  Oh, Oliver!  You really are your own worst enemy.  Vertigo Chase was right about that!

Oh, and William apparently doesn't know what impeach is.  That kid is so doomed.  Makes me wonder how awful everyone else at the science fair was since he still managed to win second place.  Star City's education system must have gone to shit during Oliver's watch.

Barely any Diggle and the one we get is still being a dick.  Not cool, show!

Oliver's hallucination about Laurel and his responsibility for her death would be more enjoyable if I was too busy thinking about how this is just going to make Katie Cassidy continue to believe that Oliver/Laurel are soulmates or some shit.

Interesting that Chase name-dropped himself, Damien, and Ra's as Oliver's biggest threats from the past, but no mention of either Malcolm or Slade.

Edited by thuganomics85
  • Love 2
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I'd watch the hell out of a show that had Oliver, Felicity, Diggle and Phantom Chase on Oliver's shoulder.

56 minutes ago, ladylaw99 said:

Chase, boy did I miss you. How am I suppose to take marbles seriously.  I am not joking when I say I don't understand half the stuff that comes out of his mouth.  The guy is not intimidating. Chase gave me chills in 5 minutes whereas marbles has given me nothing but thinking I need to get my hearing checked.

As others have said, the contrast between Chase and Diaz in the same episode is impossible not to see.

39 minutes ago, Soulfire said:

 

The relief on his face when he realizes it's really Felicity Sometimes SA just knocks these small moments out of the park

16 minutes ago, thuganomics85 said:

Oh, and William apparently doesn't know what impeach is.  That kid is so doomed.  Makes me wonder how awful everyone else at the science fair was since he still managed to win second place.  Star City's education system must have gone to shit during Oliver's watch.

What I find more frightening is the number of people of voting age, many of them holding office or prominent on social media, who don't know what impeachment is or how it works.

  • Love 6
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