S03.E10: Daddy Darhkest

[Machiabelly]

9 hours ago, Proteus said:

 

Constantine was fun. Anyone know the backstory to his damned soul and if that happened on his NBC show?

Kind of short answer...long before the TV show he convinced some friends to help him raise a demon to kill a monster a young girl had summoned to protect her from abusers. The monster wouldn't leave so he decided a demon would work.

He could not control the demon so it tormented his friends and took the innocent girl to hell. 

 

Voila a tortured hero is born.

Edited February 13, 2018 by Machiabelly

[Bruinsfan]

5 hours ago, cambridgeguy said:

Cisco can send him back so hopefully he'll pop up on the Flash before he heads off for good.  To be honest it never made sense for him stick around in the first place (the man you love is off fighting Nazis on Earth-X and you're going to hang out on Earth-1?) but he will be missed.

Yeah, why exactly did Alt Snart decide to go galavanting off to a parallel world with new acquaintances while the man he loved stayed back on HIS home earth to clean up the Nazi Empire they'd both been fighting? Aside from fanservice, I mean.

I thought it was interesting that Sara and Nora were able to communicate when possessed by the demon in two different time periods. That brings up the question of exactly how demons (and anyone in Hell in general, I guess) experience time in relation to the physical world. Does Mallus also have knowledge of future encounters/conflicts that are happening simultaneously for it?

[Starfish35]

6 minutes ago, Bruinsfan said:

Yeah, why exactly did Alt Snart decide to go galavanting off to a parallel world with new acquaintances while the man he loved stayed back on HIS home earth to clean up the Nazi Empire they'd both been fighting? Aside from fanservice, I mean.

I think mainly because he'd lost his Mick and needed some closure, and maybe thought he could get it by helping this Mick out with some things.

[Proteus]

27 minutes ago, Machiabelly said:

Kind of short answer...long before the TV show he convinced some friends to help him raise a demon to kill a monster a young girl had summoned to protect her from abusers. The monster wouldn't leave so he decided a demon would work.

He could not control the demon so it tormented his friends and took the innocent girl to hell. 

 

Voila a tortured hero is born.

Thanks a lot!

[Princess Lucky]

I never liked this guy's version of Constantine, and this was no exception. I found him to be overacting (which I didn't think was possible on a show like this) and I was annoyed by everything he said and/or did.

Darhk, on the other hand? Always welcome in my book. It's all about the acting. Neal McD is fantastic. Anyone else, and I'd hate Darhk's guts. He makes it work. I still hate him, but I love watching him.

Ray and Zari make a great team. They are very different characters, but the fact their interactions are based on a) their shared science skills and b) their shared decency is really working for their dynamic.

Len was a blast. That line, "I hope nobody was seducing anybody while I was about to be lobotomized" (paraphrasing), it was amazing. Mostly because that's exactly what I was thinking. I will miss him.

Joining the chorus of "Nate is definitely Kuasa's grandfather." And is it wrong of me to be more sympathetic to Kuasa now that I know what she went through? That's an undeniable supervillain origin story. I can't even blame her. It is starting to look like Amaya and Nate might leave together once the season ends.

Not gonna lie, after this episode, I'm a little more sympathetic to Nora, too. Letting a demon inside you so you can one day revive your dead father? I get it. Might she find redemption, now that we've seen her young innocent self? Or is she too far gone?

Mick is the best. Always. "Likewise." Aw. And "Ray????" killed me. So happy he and Snart got another emotional (for Mick's standards) goodbye.

I love Ava and Sara, to be honest. I've always been partial to the Enemies to Friends to Lovers trope. And I LOVE the actress who plays Ava. She's so sexy, and now that Ava's allowed to show some heart, she's shining. I can't wait for them to actually get together.

Oh and Haircut needs a haircut.

(is what I thought, until i saw Ray's hair in the promo pictures for the next episode)

Edited February 13, 2018 by Princess Lucky

[StaceyNotStacie]

I didn’t care for the Nora storyline. I had a hard time following it. I found the Amaya story more interesting. I lol’d with Mick giving orders while trying to watch the football game. 

The show isn’t usually this dark, so I’m hoping that the future episodes are a bit more lighthearted. 

[Barlowe]

7 hours ago, Sakura12 said:

I don't have a screenshot, but yes it was a white canary flying over a black canary, or I guess it could be the shadow of the white canary. Either way I think it was to represent Sara's dark and light side. I hope we see that card in her room at some point just to see that she kept it as a reminder. 

Nate's over protectiveness bro culture is why I can't get behind their relationship. He knows Amaya is strong and powerful woman, maybe trust her once in awhile. He can be by her side and talk to her about it instead of just demanding she listen to him. I'm also thinking we will be losing Amaya this season, she does need to go back to her time at some point and start her family line. I wonder if Nate goes with her because Kuasa never mentioned a grandfather, if he is the grandfather she never met him. 

Horror never really bothered me so I didn't mind the exorcism especially since they just kept it to the contorting body. The actress did well what had to be a really physical role. I'm interested in seeing how and when Sara's being taken over by Mallus will happen. That will be bad for all involved. Of course John really should've have told Mick or Amaya about it, I don't think Ray will be able shoot Sara when he needs too. 

I loved that little scene where John's ears perked up and then he waited until he was alone with Ray  to be point blank about keeping the anti-magic weapon handy

[GHScorpiosRule]

18 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

I really felt the moment when Leo and Mick said their final goodbyes.   Actually teared up a tiny bit.  

 

Don't worry! They'll soon be back together again as Linc and Michael! When Prison Break returns. Yes, it's coming back!

[MissLucas]

Well at least this show is not succumbing to the Olympics!

And boy - the DC curse of the bad wig has now jumped from Arrow (every damn Ollie flashback) to Flash (emo-dark Barry) to this show! (I don't watch Supergirl - has it managed to escape so far?)

Ava'with her hair loose looks a lot like Giselle Bündchen. I loved cheeky Gideon. Not a big fan of Constantine but he's okay for one episode. I prefer original Brit in a trenchcoat.

And just when I got used to Alt-Snart he's leaving again, sniff.

Edited February 14, 2018 by MissLucas

[johntfs]

7 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

I have to be honest; I'm not fond of Mick's small moments of being some dumb guy. Him not being able to tell him and Rip apart? I know it was supposed to be funny, but it didn't hit it for me. I think, after three seasons, we can have a smarter Mick, yeah?

I fanwank that Mick is actually quite a bit smarter than he seems to be and often plays dumber than he actually is.  Mick could certainly tell Rip and Constantine apart, the "all skinny trench-coat" Brits looks alike was more meta-commentary than anything else.

Speaking of said "skinny Brit," I liked the little bit at the end with Ray and John that lets you see the other side of John, the side that's the ruthless, stone-cold motherfucker who will do whatever it takes to beat the devil.  He has his nice little scene with Sara with Mallus as code for sex and then tells Ray to be ready to shoot her once Mallus turns her soul into a chew-toy.  It was cool that along with showing the rakish, fun bit of John, the show didn't forget about the total bastard part of him either.

Edited February 14, 2018 by johntfs

[tennisgurl]

On 2/12/2018 at 9:03 PM, Sakura12 said:

Maybe Ray can get through to Nora by singing some musicals to her. 

 

It worked for a baby Dominator :) 

[jhlipton]

10 hours ago, Princess Lucky said:

I never liked this guy's version of Constantine, and this was no exception. I found him to be overacting (which I didn't think was possible on a show like this) and I was annoyed by everything he said and/or did.

Darhk, on the other hand? Always welcome in my book. It's all about the acting. Neal McD is fantastic. Anyone else, and I'd hate Darhk's guts. He makes it work. I still hate him, but I love watching him.

Agreed.

And the played-out "innocent girl possessed" (run twice here!) was boring and ended up being totally meaningless.  If I had wanted to watch the "John Constantine Hour", I would have watched his awful show.  BLECH!

[Jacks-Son]

Glad that the show is back; I really missed it. Surprising, considering how the show started. They will have to figure out how to replace Stein and Jefferson but they did a good job getting rid of the Hawks and replacing them with Nate, Amaya, and Zari.  Sorry, but now they have to figure out out how to replace Mick, he's absolutely useless. Perhaps Ava will join the team but they'll need another male character. Perhaps Rip will make a comeback since Leo is now gone. I don't mind Sara and Ava, as they make an interesting couple and I think they're both game at trying a relationship. Both were obviously flirting with each other.

[Sakura12]

13 hours ago, johntfs said:

I fanwank that Mick is actually quite a bit smarter than he seems to be and often plays dumber than he actually is.  Mick could certainly tell Rip and Constantine apart, the "all skinny trench-coat" Brits looks alike was more meta-commentary than anything else.

Speaking of said "skinny Brit," I liked the little bit at the end with Ray and John that lets you see the other side of John, the side that's the ruthless, stone-cold motherfucker who will do whatever it takes to beat the devil.  He has his nice little scene with Sara with Mallus as code for sex and then tells Ray to be ready to shoot her once Mallus turns her soul into a chew-toy.  It was cool that along with showing the rakish, fun bit of John, the show didn't forget about the total bastard part of him either.

 

I didn't see that as John being a bastard, I saw that as a warning that was needed. An evil demon Sara would destroy the world, the Legends needed to be warned about it. He couldn't tell Sara in case Mallus could read her mind. He should've actually told Mick since he would be more likely to actually shoot Sara if she became possessed than Ray. Ray would think about hurting Sara while Mick would shoot her with no questions asked. He would also know that Sara would understand why he shot her and be thankful that he did. 

They showed that Constantine like most likes Sara and he would want to help her too. I don't think he's met many people that would play around with being dead. Death means nothing to Sara being possessed by an evil being that will use her to maim and kill is much worse.  Constantine knows that Sara doesn't want more sins on her ledger.  They bonded over being kindred damned souls. That's why I think we'll see him again this season to help with demon Sara. 

Edited February 14, 2018 by Sakura12

[johntfs]

3 minutes ago, Sakura12 said:

I didn't see that as John being a bastard, I saw that as a warning that was needed. An evil demon Sara would destroy the world, the Legends needed to be warned about it. He couldn't tell Sara in case Mallus could read her mind. He should've actually told Mick since he would be more likely to actually shoot Sara if she became possessed than Ray. Ray would think about hurting Sara while Mick would shoot her with no questions asked. He would also know that Sara would understand why he shot her and be thankful that he did. 

They showed that Constantine like most like Sara and he would want to help her too. I don't think he's met many people that would play around with being dead. Death means nothing to Sara being possessed by an evil being that will use her to maim and kill is much worse. That's why I think we'll see him again this season to help with demon Sara. 

Constantine told Ray because of the anti-magic gun.  But the main point is that Constantine thought Sara was fucked.  He really knew she'd be fucked when he did his summoning of Mallus, but he didn't tell her that and did it anyway because they need to get "back to the future" to deal with the situation.  That's where Constantine is a total bastard.  He'll do whatever he thinks he needs to do (including withholding some fairly important information) to resolve whatever current situation he's in and he'll with no real concern for the costs to himself or anyone in his wake at the time.

[Sakura12]

Actually Sara told him to do it, he was the one that kept asking if she was sure and her response is do you want to stay in 1969 forever. I think Sara knows she's fucked, Mallus was already communicating with her before they summoned him to her. Sara has always taken one for the team, she wanted to get back to the present too.  That's why I think Sara will try to enjoy whatever time she has left, knowing she invited a demon through the door. Sara's been to hell and back too she knows what's up. She'll just bottle it up and pretend everything is okay for her team.  She's taken her own life before she would probably do it again if stopped her from losing her soul again. 

If they meant to show Constantine has some horrible bastard, I didn't see it. 

Edited February 14, 2018 by Sakura12

[lurker22]

Sara would probably order Ray (or anyone one else on her team) to shoot her if there was a chance she would lose control to Mallus.

I think Sara letting Mallus possess her was his plan all along. He was uncharacteristically quiet while Sara went into his realm and didn't try to stop her or anything. Plus, he was the one who sent them back to 1969. Now it seems he has a backdoor into her mind. What if Kuasa's "I must protect the moment she became his" isn't referring to Nora (she was already Mallus' vessel), but to Sara?

[darkestboy]

That was fantastic. While I don't think we need Constantine as a regular, he does make for a great guest character. Loved his flirting with Leo and the hook up with Sara was done pretty well too.

Nice bits of horror with the exorcism scenes and I really felt bad for Nora. Both Zari and Ray were getting through to her and Damien completely wrecked that at the last minute.

Similarly Amaya was making an effort to get through to Kuasa as well, even if Nate did blunder in at times. I do think Kuasa might be on a redemptive path towards the end of the season.

I like that Mallus's storyline is pulling in everyone on the team in varying ways and the stuff with the totems is interesting to me as well.

Mick had bugger all to do here but his scenes were still entertaining as hell, 9/10

Edited February 14, 2018 by darkestboy

[Miss Dee]

2 hours ago, Sakura12 said:

An evil demon Sara would destroy the world, the Legends needed to be warned about it. He couldn't tell Sara in case Mallus could read her mind. He should've actually told Mick since he would be more likely to actually shoot Sara if she became possessed than Ray. Ray would think about hurting Sara while Mick would shoot her with no questions asked. He would also know that Sara would understand why he shot her and be thankful that he did.

See, I'm hoping this is where Season 3 is going. Sara, Ray and Mick are the Legends Original Crew. I'd like to see a scene somewhere in the middle of 3B where this gets discussed and Sara puts her faith in them - her two longest-running companions, her stalwarts, her Spock and McCoy - to do what needs to be done when the time comes. It's understood among the three that Ray will have the gun, and Mick has to ensure it gets used because they know Ray won't shoot it.

So once everything happens with the totems (whatever that is), they all think they're home-free - except Mallus is in a fight for his life and Sara is the battleground. It gets to the point where she can't stop him; she loses the battle for control, and Mallus takes out the Legends one by one. Eventually Mick gets his hands on the gun...and he can't do it. He freezes. It's Ray who takes it and shoots. Mallus being strong, he withstands the first blast. Ray tries again - and this time, he can't do it. Mick puts his hand over Ray's (not in a romantic way, I swear to Beebo) and together the two people who love, respect and trust her the most take Mallus down, killing her in the process. It nearly kills them inside - they have a cathartic moment layer where they both grieve their role in this together - and the season ends with them resolving to continue Sara's work on the Waverider.

Of course, Sara being Sara, she's not dead; the Legends just think she is. The tag finds her coming to herself in whatever surroundings the writers want in order to set up Season 4.

[Sakura12]

Of course being her oldest companions, they would continue her work while waiting her to come back because they know that Sara Lance never stays dead. You really have to triple and quadruple check with her. She even fakes dead now. Lol. 

Edited February 14, 2018 by Sakura12

[Wishing Well]

I think I’ve decided where I like Nate.  With Jax and Martin gone, I like that he’s sort of become Sara’s partner when she’s in captain mode.  I liked it in the freaky Friday episode where he was coming to her with what he found, and she called the team.  It was also good earlier in the season when he was helping her and I liked it this episode when he was there as she was talking to Constantine.  I like that he’s supportive, gets his research done, and gets called out on any shit he says or pulls by Sara.

If only he could be like this around Amaya.  Though I don’t blame him for what happened this time - Amaya had orders from Captain Mick to not thaw out Water Bitch/Kuasicle, who has the power to harm or kill Amaya and the others. 

[KirkB]

I think Sara should definitely have a conversation with Ray and Mick where she makes certain they know what to do if/when the time comes. Ray needs to make sure the gun is kept in working condition and Mick is the only one on the ship who could actually fire it.

But to lighten the mood I'd also like there to be a running gag (which this show does so well) through the rest of the season where every time Sara is talking, giving an order, or whatever, Mick is in the background pointing the gun at her. "Not now, Mick!"

And I also think there is a 50/50 chance that when the time does come, Mick will accidentally leave the gun in the fridge and have a beer in his hand instead.

[tennisgurl]

I think it would be interesting if, after Sara tells Mick and Ray that they have to kill her if needs be, that Mick cant do it, after all his angst losing Snart, and then Ray ends up killing her. It would be super depressing and heartbreaking, but it would be really interesting from a character perspective. Even if they dont go that high drama, it would be nice to have the three of them talk about how they're the only ones left of the original crew that was recruited by Rip to take on Savage, back in the day. 

Of course, no way could Sara actually die. Even in this episode, she was faking out John just for the laughs. 

Also, can I say that I freaking loved the music this week? The show always has nice music, but I thought this episode was one of the most memorable so far. Not just the 60s style music, but also the extremely mysterious, adventurous music that played while Constantine was doing his thing, and the horror movie style choirs when creepy stuff was going on. Even the Legends theme song to a creepy beat was really cool. It set a great atmosphere. 

Edited February 14, 2018 by tennisgurl

[Lokiberry]

On 2/12/2018 at 8:18 PM, HunterHunted said:

In one episode, Legends allows John Constantine to do all of the things NBC never let him do--smoke on camera, show that he's bisexual, and actually talk about hell and his damned soul.

Constantine's showrunner  David Goyer straightwashed Leonardo da Vinci so we were never getting a bisexual character out of him.

If the show is going to shed a character at the end of the season (looking at you, Nate) I wouldn't mind John joining the crew. His skills are sufficiently different so as to not be stepping on anyone else (again, looking at you Nate). Also, despite his cool snarky persona, he IS a cold bastard that you should  never entirely trust, and that could create an interesting dynamic.

I loved Leo in the crossover, but except for the scene in the last episode where he had his talk with Mick, I haven't really felt him.

Sara is clearly the sixth element: heart, love, badassery, I am Woman Hear Me Roar, or whatever it is, and will eventually prove when Mallus decided to mess with her, he made a fatal mistake.

[Starfish35]

I'm not a fan of the idea of Constantine as a regular.  I like him as a character, but I don't like what comes with him.  The demon/exorcism stuff just creeps me out, and if that was to be become a more regular element of the show, I think I'd have to drop it.  I am not a horror fan. At. All.  And this episode was not the easiest to get through. 

[wingster55]

Hopefully Kuasa can be redeemed...the Arrowverse already has a bad track record with their anti-blackness/colorism (i.e casting a bi-racial as a an African character)..would suck if they turned her evil again.

[jhlipton]

I'm obviously all alone in my distaste for Constantine.  Sara dies (again) is equally repulsive.  I might have to skip the rest of this season.

On 2/14/2018 at 8:30 AM, Miss Dee said:

See, I'm hoping this is where Season 3 is going. Sara, Ray and Mick are the Legends Original Crew. I'd like to see a scene somewhere in the middle of 3B where this gets discussed and Sara puts her faith in them

I certainly hope not!  One of things I love about LoT is how integrated the team is -- there's not a lot of "OGs" vs "newbies".  I'd hate for them to lose that.

[Miss Dee]

Don't worry, @jhlipton, I don't want an original vs. newbies clash on the Waverider. Nor do I want a permanent Star Trek: Original setup, where The (White) Big Three loom over the supporting (diverse) cast. But I think they can build a bond between Sara, Ray and Mick based on their shared comradeship without going to one of those extremes.

[MarkHB]

On 2/14/2018 at 11:30 AM, Miss Dee said:

So once everything happens with the totems (whatever that is), they all think they're home-free - except Mallus is in a fight for his life and Sara is the battleground. It gets to the point where she can't stop him; she loses the battle for control, and Mallus takes out the Legends one by one. Eventually Mick gets his hands on the gun...and he can't do it. He freezes. It's Ray who takes it and shoots. Mallus being strong, he withstands the first blast. Ray tries again - and this time, he can't do it. Mick puts his hand over Ray's (not in a romantic way, I swear to Beebo) and together the two people who love, respect and trust her the most take Mallus down, killing her in the process. It nearly kills them inside - they have a cathartic moment layer where they both grieve their role in this together - and the season ends with them resolving to continue Sara's work on the Waverider.

Well, they were going to do that, but since you put it on the Internet now they'll go to the CW backup plan and have Sara saved by the power of Ava's love.  I blame you.  :)

 

I loved seeing Constantine as a guest, but I agree that making him a regular would take the show down the occult path permanently and I'd rather stick with the light and airy sci-fi with this one :) .

[johntfs]

13 minutes ago, MarkHB said:

Well, they were going to do that, but since you put it on the Internet now they'll go to the CW backup plan and have Sara saved by the power of Ava's love.  I blame you.  :)

 

I loved seeing Constantine as a guest, but I agree that making him a regular would take the show down the occult path permanently and I'd rather stick with the light and airy sci-fi with this one :) .

I don't think Constantine's presence, even as a regular, necessarily takes the show to an occult/demonic place.  Amaya and Zari (shit, I just now got it.  A and Z) both have mystical totems that power their abilities, but that didn't push the show down a mystical road - at least not a mystical road it wasn't going to travel anyway.  As characters they both work fine dealing with non-mystical stuff, too.  John C would fill the role of the grifter-type who can talk (or magic talk) his way into anywhere.  Demonology aside, he's a pretty fun, almost playful character - until he does that thing that makes you go "Jesus Christ!  Did he really just do that?!"

[Sakura12]

Maybe Sara should ask Zari to shoot her, so we'll see how willing she is to change something if it means hurting someone in the process. 

Quote

Well, they were going to do that, but since you put it on the Internet now they'll go to the CW backup plan and have Sara saved by the power of Ava's love.  I blame you.  :)

Ray: EARTH!
Mick: FIRE!
Zari: WIND!
Kuasa: WATER!
Amaya: SPIRIT!
Ava: HEART!
Sara: By your powers combined...I AM CAPTAIN SARA!

Edited February 16, 2018 by Sakura12

[KirkB]

I personally wouldn't want Constantine on a weekly basis. He's the guy you call in a specific situation. But unless the they're dealing with is magical or demonic there isn't going to be a lot for him to do. So he'd probably spend most of his time on the ship trying to get into Sara's pants. Or Ray's. Or Amaya's. Or Nate's. Or Zari's. Or Gideon's, if he can find the proper access. Then he'd try it with Mick and Gideon would alert the rest of the crew that "Mr. Constantine is on fire."

[Starfish35]

7 hours ago, KirkB said:

and Gideon would alert the rest of the crew that "Mr. Constantine is on fire."

And they would say, "yeah tell us something we don't know, Gideon."

[Sakura12]

Constantine wouldn't really work as a regular, he's more of a once in awhile character like Jonah Hex. 

[jhlipton]

13 hours ago, MarkHB said:

I loved seeing Constantine as a guest

It became the John Constantine Hour as he led the Legends, not the other way around.  Guests should remember their place!

13 hours ago, johntfs said:

John C would fill the role of the grifter-type who can talk (or magic talk) his way into anywhere.

John C becomes the deus ex machina, just as he did in this episode.  No thanks.

[johntfs]

4 hours ago, jhlipton said:

John C becomes the deus ex machina, just as he did in this episode.  No thanks.

No more than any other team member becomes a deus ex machina when dealing with something they know about.  Sure, John talked his way into the asylum, but as seen here he frequently gets in over his head with his wink and a nod/wing and a prayer attitude.  For all the dues ex, recall that it was Sara who got the Legends home.

[tarotx]

How was John the deus ex machina? He couldn't even save Nora. I mean Darhk arriving to use the Daddy card aside, JC's magic didn't save the day. He got the Legends thrown back in time. He helped Sara allow herself to be processed. He doesn't know the answers. He has occult knowledge and was and probably will be useful in the future but he was no more than other guest stars. Especially ones that are considered crossover (either from the comics or other shows). 

I rewatched episode 3.9 before this episode and from Bebo to exorcism. This show has variety. 

Edited February 17, 2018 by tarotx

[Miss Dee]

I liked a previous suggestion that John hangs out for a mission on the Waverider with 0 occult shenanigans going on, and as a result feels completely lost and out of his depth.

[tennisgurl]

I would love it is they call in John to help with what they originally thought was a demon or something...and it turns out to be an alien or lab experiment run amok or something science fiction based. It would be hilarious to see two genres literally coming to a head and trying to deal with each other. 

[dingochick]

Ugh, Constantine is by far my most loathed character ever. I didn’t like him on Arrow, didn’t like him here. There is too much about him, both character and actor, that bugs me. Having him eat up screentime for one of my fave shows was super annoying, plus, it had been so long since I saw the last ep, I forgot what the hell was going on. 

 

I love Snart, all versions, so am sorry to bid him farewell. I hope we see him again on the show, or Flash, etc., even though it may not happen. The door isn’t closed completely I guess. 

In closing..please, DCverse, stop trying to make Constantine happen on LoT, etc.

[johntfs]

On 2/17/2018 at 7:53 AM, Miss Dee said:

I liked a previous suggestion that John hangs out for a mission on the Waverider with 0 occult shenanigans going on, and as a result feels completely lost and out of his depth.

The thing about John Constantine is that he isn't Dr. Strange (or Dr. Fate).  He doesn't rely on the raw power of magic to get him through.  He know a lot of about the occult.  He knows various rituals and has access to some relatively minor artifacts, but he mostly gets by through bluff, innuendo, reputation and deception.  Those are things that would serve him pretty well in dealing with non-magical situations too.  The other thing is that because he's so often completely out-powered by whatever god-awful thing he's dealing with, he's absolutely ruthless about hitting the enemy when he sees that it's in (or has manipulated it into being in) a vulnerable position.  That's another thing fairly useful in even non-magical situations, even if it might horrify other people around him.

Edited February 18, 2018 by johntfs

[Sakura12]

He seemed pretty out of his depth with the whole time travel thing. He said it was weird even for him and wanted to go back right away. I think taking him to the far future or back to meet Gertrude the T-Rex might freak him out. How would he manipulate a dinosaur? 

[Miss Dee]

Well, the best scenario would be the best of both worlds: Constantine has a number of gifts the Legends can use even when there's no magic, built-in basis for character conflict, and can still encounter situations where the character feels out of his depth, useless or even vulnerable. The Legends characters are very well-rounded and the writers know how to use them in thematically-logical ways that show them at their best and their worst, their highs and their lows, and the perfect storms these can create in different character mixes. If they can do the same for Constantine, I'd be open to him joining.

Of course, I think he works acceptably well as a frequent or yearly guest star too - and if the actor is busy that might be more feasible. Not to mention it could free him up for appearances on the other two shows for Antagonist of the Week type episodes.

Edited February 18, 2018 by Miss Dee

[jhlipton]

On 2/17/2018 at 10:21 PM, dingochick said:

Ugh, Constantine is by far my most loathed character ever. I didn’t like him on Arrow, didn’t like him here. There is too much about him, both character and actor, that bugs me. Having him eat up screentime for one of my fave shows was super annoying,

In closing..please, DCverse, stop trying to make Constantine happen on LoT, etc.

OK, so Constantine may not be a deus ex machina, but he became the primary focus for far too much of the episode, and I loathed him more than the Hawks.   Good bye and good riddance.

+1000 to @dingochick

[Maelstrom]

To me Constantine is like cayenne pepper - a little can make things interesting, but too much ruins the whole dish. I could never really get into his series, and only watched a handful of episodes. I’m fine with spooky and supernatural, but I cannot handle gross and gory, and Constantine tends to tip the balance toward the latter too much for my taste. YMMV, of course.

As for his appearance here on Legends, his presence added a new dynamic to the team that was interesting, but I do feel he took up too much of the episode. Which sucks not only as the first ep back after a long break, but because it was also Snart’s last appearance ever, apparently.