S04.E03: Luck Be a Lady

[vb68]

2 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

She went to prison for robbing a bank. So yeah, she really did deserve the whole prison treatment.

Oh yeah, that. Totally forgot that she did that. Again proof that the episode was a little too silly for me.  I didn't take  her seriously at all.

Edited October 25, 2017 by vb68

[TV Anonymous]

So it is $15k to repair the plumbing in the West house? How much did it take to completely build the roof after King Shark ripped it apart?

[DavidJSnyder]

Was that existing footage of Violet Beane for the little bit from the breakup cube or did they film new material for just that?

[notagain]

Joe must have a great home and property insurance policy.

Edited October 25, 2017 by notagain

[BkWurm1]

On 10/25/2017 at 5:41 AM, cambridgeguy said:

 

The pregnancy makes no sense.  Normally I'd say this is leading to Joe, Cecile, and/or the baby dying but that would be a complete 180 from this season's goal of being a lighter show. 

1

Maybe it will turn out to be a false positive? 

Or maybe they will end up giving the

Spoiler

Tornado Twins to Joe and Cecile, that way Iris doesn't get bogged down with Baby Duty instead of being on the team.  

[ruby24]

No WAY do they give the Tornado Twins to Joe and Cecile. I'd be stunned.

[VCRTracking]

I'm glad Hazard got at least more motivation than Psi in Supergirl last week. Psi inexplicably gained new powers and started robbing banks, both were unexplained. Here we see how Becky got her powers and why she felt the universe now owed her.

I liked the "Final Destination" feel in the scene with Barry and Hazard at Jitters. So tense even though she's cute as a button!

Edited October 25, 2017 by VCRTracking

[Trini]

If anything, this season will be good for reaction shots /gifs:

[phoenics]

On 10/25/2017 at 4:07 PM, BkWurm1 said:

 

Or maybe they will end up giving the

Spoiler

Tornado Twins to Joe and Cecile, that way Iris doesn't get bogged down with Baby Duty instead of being on the team.

  

I would burn The CW studios down if they did that.  

[phoenics]

I never gave my thoughts on this episode.  I thought it was super cute and fun.  The church scene with Barry and Iris made me laugh long and hard for at least 10 minutes.  "You're okay ... shake it off Father!"  LMAO - and Iris climbing up to turn the picture and Barry and Iris scooting past the coffin, "Is that cedar?"  And Barry's face when Iris climbed up to turn the picture, lol.  That was hysterically funny.

Loved Harry/Cisco's banter - awesome.  But TC's portrayal is off.  Harry felt like a combination of HR/Harry - not Harry.  The rambling on and on and the jokes that didn't land and the awkwardness - it just didn't land right as Harry - more like HR.  I'd almost think HR swapped with Harry last season but then Harry was the key behind them solving the meta mystery this week.

Thought Wally's exit was poorly handled - he seemed so forlorn and unhappy about leaving.

One thing bothered me though - Joe was actually going to sell the house without ever talking to IRIS?  She grew up her whole life in that house - he should have talked to HER  - not Barry!!  God writers - IRIS is Joe's actual daughter.  Barry is NOT Joe's son - Wally is, but Wally didn't grow up in that house.  Iris did.  And I was infuriated that Joe talks to Barry about it but not his own daughter.  When my parents were contemplating selling the house I grew up in - even though I was an adult - they talked to me about it and got my feelings about it before ultimately selling.  Joe?  Well, half the time he can't remember he has a daughter named Iris rather than a son (who isn't his son) named Barry, so whatever.  Do the writers want me to hate Joe again?   Because that was S1 levels of fucked up.  And all because the writers didn't THINK.

About the villain.  I was struck in a slightly different way by her.  First the name - Becky.  Then by thinking of "luck" as privilege and looking at how she behaved once she knew SHE had all of the privilege/luck and everyone around her was now screwed.  She didn't care.  I don't know if the writers meant to write an analogy to how privilege works amongst the privileged, but damn.

And glad the team was smart in figuring out that Cisco/Caitlin created the new metas when they brought Barry back - I wish Cisco or someone had looked at Iris and said, "Maybe you had a point." since they ragged on her so much for it before.  My only question is whether or not The Thinker wanted them to do what they did to get Barry out so the metas could be created?  And if so, if Thinker is so smart, why didn't he get Barry out himself?  Does he know of the Speed Force?  He'd have to know Barry was 1) in the speed force 2) that the speed force exists.  If he knew that, then why couldn't he get Barry out himself and make the metas?  Or was this just a happy accident he's taking advantage of?  What's his plan for the metas?  And why?

All in all I loved this episode.  The Joe thing was the only rage inducing part, but I'll get over it.

[Argenta]

Re. Joe discussing the possibility of moving with Barry - I'd say that only happened because Barry dropped by at that time. It's not as if Joe actively sought Barry out to talk to him about it.

Great to see Harry/Tom back, although I agree with you all that he seemed a bit off initially. Love him to bits though!

Man, Becky's voice was shrill and annoying...

[mxc90]

13 hours ago, cambridgeguy said:

Those were power dampening cuffs.

Thanks.

So Cisco was told to remove all the tech from the suit and he leaves the cuffs in?! He must not respect their decisions. Barry and/or Iris should have given him hell for this. 

Also, what was the purpose for the huge supply of marbles at the arcade? What sort of games are they running!?

[notagain]

14 minutes ago, mxc90 said:

Thanks.

So Cisco was told to remove all the tech from the suit and he leaves the cuffs in?! He must not respect their decisions. Barry and/or Iris should have given him hell for this. 

Also, what was the purpose for the huge supply of marbles at the arcade? What sort of games are they running!?

Barry had the cuffs to arrest Becky. 

[mxc90]

3 minutes ago, notagain said:

Barry had the cuffs to arrest Becky. 

I see.  Thanks.

[Trini]

One of the writers for the episode tweeted some behind-the-scenes info:

 

 

[allyw]

I enjoyed this episode for the most part. The actress playing Becky/Hazard did a really great job and so did Grant and Candace. However, I hated that Wally has left and wells is back. I know I'm in the minority but I 'm not a fan of TC and don't understand why there needs to be a version of his character every season.

Edited October 26, 2017 by allyw

[dkb]

12 hours ago, doram said:

If they were writing off Wally, why couldn't they just have him go to Earth-3 to be with Jesse? Why break them up and then boot him off?

This so much^^^ Makes no sense at all to have them break up and then have Wally leave. Whats the point?

I liked this episode, really feeling the lighter vibe this season. Iris's dress was awesome.

[Trini]

2 hours ago, phoenics said:

About the villain.  I was struck in a slightly different way by her.  First the name - Becky.  Then by thinking of "luck" as privilege and looking at how she behaved once she knew SHE had all of the privilege/luck and everyone around her was now screwed.  She didn't care.  I don't know if the writers meant to write an analogy to how privilege works amongst the privileged, but damn.

Answering in Lightning Rods.

[phoenics]

2 hours ago, Argenta said:

Re. Joe discussing the possibility of moving with Barry - I'd say that only happened because Barry dropped by at that time. It's not as if Joe actively sought Barry out to talk to him about it.

Great to see Harry/Tom back, although I agree with you all that he seemed a bit off initially. Love him to bits though!

Man, Becky's voice was shrill and annoying...

I get why Joe did that - because Barry stopped by - but he still needed to talk to Iris.  If Joe hadn't talked to Barry, it'd still be messed up that he still didn't discuss it with Iris.  That's a writing fail, imo.

[legaleagle53]

On 10/25/2017 at 4:10 PM, ruby24 said:

Spoiler

No WAY do they give the Tornado Twins to Joe and Cecile. I'd be stunned.

 

Spoiler

Besides, where would the Twins inherit their speedster powers from?  There's a reason that they're called the Tornado Twins.

[phoenics]

On 10/25/2017 at 9:21 PM, legaleagle53 said:

Spoiler

Besides, where would the Twins inherit their speedster powers from?  There's a reason that they're called the Tornado Twins.

 

Exactly.

The cynical part of me says there could be another "dark matter" incident, but I would feel so robbed.

If they make it so that Cecile was on the bus when Barry came out of the Speed Force, they could make it happen that way.  But I would be hella pissed if they took Barry & Iris' kids away from them and gave them to Joe and Cecile.  No!

[legaleagle53]

12 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

She's actually on Earth-2. I don't think we've seen Earth-3 yet. 1, 2, 19, and 38 (I think is Kara/Supergirl's Earth). Guess there was no room on her team for Wally?

Yes, we have seen Earth-3.  Earth-3 is where Jay Garrick is from.  Jessie moved there to take over for him when he went into the Speed Force.

[GHScorpiosRule]

4 minutes ago, legaleagle53 said:

Yes, we have seen Earth-3.  Earth-3 is where Jay Garrick is from.  Jessie moved there to take over for him when he went into the Speed Force.

 

[legaleagle53]

1 minute ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

 

You really need to do something about this memory issue you have!  ;-)

[iRarelyWatchTV36]

I hope they can do something with the character - either on Flash, or another Arrowverse show - but looking back on it, the thing with Wally last night was realizing that I knew he was absent for most of the episode, but it was considered beneficial so didn't put much rumination into it.  It wasn't that I just completely forgot him.

However, other than shipping him off to E-38 and Supergirl, though, he would completely overpower the other two shows' [Arrow & LoT] heroes - unless they nerf him so much that his fastest speed is severely limited (somehow).

[Maverick]

 This season is definitely leaning toward a little over the top.  I've decided that Season 4 is to the first 3 seasons as The Orville is to Star Trek.  

[JoyGirl]

On 10/24/2017 at 8:14 PM, Terrafamilia said:

That was a very indulgent casino to just let Hazard go on winning without "suggesting" that she had had enough. Or maybe they tried...

LOL, Terra.  As a blackjack dealer for a dozen or so years, I know for a fact they would have been all over that chick.  Especially when she was winning so much as the craps table.  No way would they have allowed her to be blowing on the dice or kissing them.  Those dice would have been pulled and replaced with fresh ones, again and again, cause they would be looking for loaded dice.  

[wilnil]

57 minutes ago, JoyGirl said:

LOL, Terra.  As a blackjack dealer for a dozen or so years, I know for a fact they would have been all over that chick.  Especially when she was winning so much as the craps table.  No way would they have allowed her to be blowing on the dice or kissing them.  Those dice would have been pulled and replaced with fresh ones, again and again, cause they would be looking for loaded dice.  

But maybe, as luck would have it, that was the shift when the brand-new assistant floor manager had to take over when the regular manager went home sick?

[legaleagle53]

7 hours ago, wilnil said:

But maybe, as luck would have it, that was the shift when the brand-new assistant floor manager had to take over when the regular manager went home sick?

Exactly.  The reason that Hazard was unstoppable until the particle explosion temporarily negated her powers is that she can alter probabilities in her favor at will while skewing them horrifically against anyone else who tries to stop her.  How do you stop someone from constantly winning when she can continually arrange it so that you can never get close enough to her to pull the dice or shut her down?

[GHScorpiosRule]

11 hours ago, legaleagle53 said:

You really need to do something about this memory issue you have!  ;-)

Sure, go ahead and mock me, just because my memory hasn't been so good this week. I We lost Benson and Fats this week, man!

[benteen]

16 hours ago, phoenics said:

One thing bothered me though - Joe was actually going to sell the house without ever talking to IRIS?  She grew up her whole life in that house - he should have talked to HER  - not Barry!!  God writers - IRIS is Joe's actual daughter.  Barry is NOT Joe's son - Wally is, but Wally didn't grow up in that house.  Iris did.  And I was infuriated that Joe talks to Barry about it but not his own daughter.  When my parents were contemplating selling the house I grew up in - even though I was an adult - they talked to me about it and got my feelings about it before ultimately selling.  Joe?  Well, half the time he can't remember he has a daughter named Iris rather than a son (who isn't his son) named Barry, so whatever.  Do the writers want me to hate Joe again?   Because that was S1 levels of fucked up.  And all because the writers didn't THINK.

This seems to be pretty par for the course as far as Joe is concerned.  Remember him talking about not having a son to give his watch to in Season 2?  Iris seems to be an afterthought when Barry in concerned.

[Rachel RSL]

On 10/25/2017 at 8:58 PM, phoenics said:

I get why Joe did that - because Barry stopped by - but he still needed to talk to Iris.  If Joe hadn't talked to Barry, it'd still be messed up that he still didn't discuss it with Iris.  That's a writing fail, imo.

I have to respectfully disagree. Why would a parent have to consult their child, adult or not, about selling their house? Iris is a grown woman with her own home and her own life, it doesn't strike me as odd at all that Joe wouldn't discuss selling his house with her. Whether she grew up there or not is kind of irrelevant. Kids grow up, move away and parents tend to downsize after that, it's nothing out of the ordinary. Discussing how their kids feel about selling the home is something that parents would probably do when the kids are still young and live at home, but calling their adult child who doesn't even live there anymore to discuss their feelings about it just seems odd to me. 

On 10/25/2017 at 9:21 PM, legaleagle53 said:

Spoiler

Besides, where would the Twins inherit their speedster powers from?  There's a reason that they're called the Tornado Twins.

 

Spoiler

I keep seeing people reference these twins and I feel like I missed something. Was that mentioned in one of the scenes about the future or is this just something people know about from the comics? (Also, how are Barry's powers hereditary? Didn't he only get them because of the explosion?)

[Trini]

On 10/26/2017 at 11:08 AM, Rachel RSL said:

Spoiler

I keep seeing people reference these twins and I feel like I missed something. Was that mentioned in one of the scenes about the future or is this just something people know about from the comics? (Also, how are Barry's powers hereditary? Didn't he only get them because of the explosion?)

 

Spoiler

It's from the comics; but the show has also had a few subtle references to Barry & Iris' descendants.

[TwistedandBored]

I liked the episode. It was funny. I am really sad to see Wally go and that the group didn't even notice he was gone. Also, the look on Joe's face when Cecile said she was pregnant had me rolling. I hope this is false positive and not true or it could be something they could use to write out Joe in the future if the show wants to do that. 

[phoenics]

6 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

I have to respectfully disagree. Why would a parent have to consult their child, adult or not, about selling their house? Iris is a grown woman with her own home and her own life, it doesn't strike me as odd at all that Joe wouldn't discuss selling his house with her. Whether she grew up there or not is kind of irrelevant. Kids grow up, move away and parents tend to downsize after that, it's nothing out of the ordinary. Discussing how their kids feel about selling the home is something that parents would probably do when the kids are still young and live at home, but calling their adult child who doesn't even live there anymore to discuss their feelings about it just seems odd to me. 

 

As I said in my original post, when MY parents were thinking of selling my childhood home, they consulted me as an adult - because it would affect me.  First of all, it would have eventually been my inheritance and second of all, we're a close family, which Joe claims he and Iris are (and Barry).  So for me - having Joe talk about it with Barry, but NOT Iris was jarring - but even without that, given how close they are supposed to be, Joe should have at least mentioned selling the place Iris grew up in.

[Trini]

I'm not even sure how to speculate about this Joe/Cecile pregnancy plot twist, because it's so out of left field. Normally I'd say it's a setup for tragedy, but they seem committed to the lighter tone this season, so far.

Joe is in the regular cast, but Cecile isn't. Why do a pregnancy storyline when we won't even be spending much time with Cecile? I don't see how this adds to/helps Joe as a character; he already has the 'dad' role. Is this a way to reduce his screentime? Or Cecile's? (but she's already just recurring.)

However, all that assumes that this pregnancy is happening, and that we'll see a baby 8-ish months from now. If that's not happening -- I can't see how somehow losing the baby fits with the new tone. And I doubt they'll do "oops, it's actually menopause", because we're in the 21st century now, plus Cecile isn't that old. A false positive? Possibly; but that also seems improbable.

Maybe they doing this to tie it back to Barry and Iris eventually having children, but that's a ridiculous way to get from here to there.

Edited October 30, 2017 by Trini

[iRarelyWatchTV36]

On 10/25/2017 at 5:52 PM, Trini said:

If anything, this season will be good for reaction shots /gifs:

Caption time....

Iris:  I finally just beat Angry Birds!

"Barry, due to the past 2 years of indiscretions and liberties taken with it, the timeline is suing you for unpaid child support."

Harry:  "So, hey guys.  Funny joke time.  The other day I was working on the quantum mechanics math of multiverse travel and after much calculations and deliberation, the answer was right there, but I just couldn't quite breach it!  Get it?  Breach it.... *trails off*"

[Trini]

Has anyone ID'd Iris' two wedding dresses in this episode?

Edited October 27, 2017 by Trini

[iRarelyWatchTV36]

Looking at those gifs, and watching this season's episodes, you can tell the actors are having a blast with the new lighter tone.  It wasn't just Barry - & his Flash alter-ego - that was reborn on October 10, the whole series experienced a rebirth.

My enthusiasm for the show was also reborn that night.

[ottoDbusdriver]

I just thought it odd that Barry was brought down by marbles -- he can run on water, and falling debris in mid-air no less, and yet gets taken down by some marbles.

[legaleagle53]

14 minutes ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

I just thought it odd that Barry was brought down by marbles -- he can run on water, and falling debris in mid-air no less, and yet gets taken down by some marbles.

Different physics.  Barry can run on water and on falling debris in mid-air because he's too fast for gravity to keep up with him in those cases, but he can slip on marbles because his feet simply slide out from under him.  That has nothing to do with gravity but rather with simply losing control while running at his speeds.

[DrBriCa]

On 10/25/2017 at 11:59 AM, notagain said:

Joe must have a great home and property insurance policy.

You'd think they would have replaced the pipes back in late season two when one of the villians (King Shark, I think?) ripped the roof right off the house!

On 10/25/2017 at 7:31 PM, legaleagle53 said:

Yes, we have seen Earth-3.  Earth-3 is where Jay Garrick is from.  Jessie moved there to take over for him when he went into the Speed Force.

Did we actually see Earth-3 though, other than hear references to it being Jay's origin? Also, Jessie should be back on Earth-2 now that Jay is also free from the Speed Force... It would make sense that Harry would be able to find her "Quicksters" on their own Earth.

[Trini]

4 minutes ago, DrBriCa said:

Did we actually see Earth-3 though, other than hear references to it being Jay's origin?

They had a scene on Earth-3 in 3.08 (mid-season finale/ Christmas episode).

[Trini]

Re-watch thoughts:

So that flashback with Becky probably showed us the next two metas that we'll meet this season.

I really didn't miss Harry/Cavanugh in the first 2 episodes (even though I like him). He really isn't necessary to the Team. And it's also annoying that Wally leaves as soon as he comes back. Even if Jesse kicked him out of the Quicksters, I'm sure he's got stuff to do on his own earth? The only bright spot is the Cisco/Harry bickering -- which they better keep in small doses lest they ruin it.

Becky/Hazard was fun, and I'd love to see her again (I'm sure we will if The Thinker uses her later on). As long as they can figure out how to nullify her powers without an accelerator explosion.

So yeah, they did write Iris kind of out of character with her last minute wedding plan; however, I can also see her wanting to make them 'official' ASAP since crazy stuff is always happening to Team Flash and Central City. I did get a kick out of Barry going along with it anyway, even though he thought it wasn't a great idea. He'd do anything for Iris!

Theory: That second white dress was going to be Iris' reception dress.

Ways in which the show screwed over Wally:
• They knew they writing him (a regular) out, but they didn't even write a sub-plot for him. He only had two significant scenes.
• The break-up with Jesse could have been that sub-plot, but they didn't even get the actress to come back.
• And if the break-up was going to be the catalyst for Wally leaving, they couldn't even have him talk to any of the other characters about it?? But then again they've been botching the Jesse/Wally relationship for a while.
• Everyone is just "Well, okay, bye" at him leaving.
• In general the show not knowing what to do with two speedsters on the team. I mean, did no one foresee this when they gave Wally powers?
• Usually after a major plot twist they release comments from the producers and/or the cast -- there's been silence so far about Wally/Kid Flash leaving (and Cecile's pregnancy).

Edited October 30, 2017 by Trini

[Ottis]

I don’t care how many venues Iris and Barry go through, and I don’t care where Joe and Cecile live and I really don’t care if anyone is pregnant. Isn’t this a superhero show?

The silly dialogue by The Thinker at the opening pretty much took away any dread of him as a villain. 

If Barry had hit those marbles at speed, he would have flown several blocks away not three feet in the air. 

Don’t understand the meta. Bad stuff just stops when she leaves? So the overheating latte machine just stopped overheating?

Iris was plain nuts in the church. 

I’m barely hanging in with this show. If they start with the babies, I’m done. 

Edited October 31, 2017 by Ottis

[Trini]

Iris' wedding dresses ID'd: https://twitter.com/fashionofcomics/status/925494236409204737

https://twitter.com/fashionofcomics/status/925490360784179200

[AudienceofOne]

On 25/10/2017 at 0:20 PM, SnoGirl said:

Refrigerator.

He was wearing a Haiku. 

I loved it a lot.

I hated this episode. I thought it was really boring and I didn't find the "humour" particularly funny. Maybe I'm jaded by how silly this meta thing is but "luck" is not a thing so "quantum blah blah" didn't make any sense as an explanation for "powers" that didn't make sense either. Was that a little bah humbug? If so I'm sorry.

But... that shirt! That shirt made my day. I basically just watched the shirt hoping to catch the last line and then I did and it was awesome. So, well done shirt! You were the most interesting thing in this for me at least.