S13.E01: Lost & Found

[Diane]

THEY’RE BAAACKK… — Season 13 begins exactly where we left off, with Sam (Jared Padalecki) and Dean (Jensen Ackles) left to pick up the pieces after the loss of their mother, the demise of Crowley (Mark Sheppard) and the heartbreaking death of Castiel (Misha Collins). The birth of Jack (Alexander Calvert) leaves the Winchester brothers with differing opinions on how to deal with a Nephilim. After being dragged into the breach, Mary (guest star Samantha Smith) must learn to survive Lucifer (Mark Pellegrino) and an apocalyptic world. Writer: Andrew Dabb, Director: Phil Sgriccia

[catrox14]

[sarvenaz]

People I am dying over here can someone please tell me what's going on? I can't watch it live but I'm ok with spoilers IM DYING PLEASE

[catrox14]

1 minute ago, sarvenaz said:

People I am dying over here can someone please tell me what's going on? I can't watch it live but I'm ok with spoilers IM DYING PLEASE

Well it doesn't air for another 30 minutes, so nothing yet! :)

[sarvenaz]

Oops I miscalculated the time :) But if any of you guys could just take 5 min to update me on it when it starts I would be forever grateful.... 

[Wayward Son]

I could be wrong, but I don’t think users on here are meant to post about the episode until it has finished airing! In fact the threads usually locked until then I think? Can someone who has been on here a lot longer than me confirm? Haha

 

ETA: Although that isn’t to stop someone from choosing to share with you via PM ;)

Edited October 12, 2017 by Wayward Son

[Mick Lady]

Missed giving you your cue catrox! Was out shopping for tonight's supplies! Sorry!

[trxr4kids]

5 minutes ago, Wayward Son said:

I could be wrong, but I don’t think users on here are meant to post about the episode until it has finished airing! In fact the threads usually locked until then I think? Can someone who has been on here a lot longer than me confirm? Haha

I don't think so, at least not that I recall.

[catrox14]

9 minutes ago, sarvenaz said:

Oops I miscalculated the time :) But if any of you guys could just take 5 min to update me on it when it starts I would be forever grateful.... 

We're not allowed to live post but can post as soon as the ep finishes airing on the East Coast :)

[Whimsy]

38 minutes ago, Wayward Son said:

I could be wrong, but I don’t think users on here are meant to post about the episode until it has finished airing! In fact the threads usually locked until then I think? Can someone who has been on here a lot longer than me confirm? Haha

 

ETA: Although that isn’t to stop someone from choosing to share with you via PM ;)

 

30 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

We're not allowed to live post but can post as soon as the ep finishes airing on the East Coast :)

Correct, no live posting during the episode. The posts will stay unlocked unless this rule is broken. :)

[sarvenaz]

Awww

Thanks anyways!

[sarvenaz]

Don't mind me, just dying over here ;) 

Seriously I cannot wait till this episode is over. I have to know what's going on!!!

[IWantDean]

Dean should've been the one to kill her because she wrote BITCH on Baby.  I hate when they give important kills to other people.

 

Not a good start for a Dean girl like myself.

[bettername2come]

"Nothing Else Matters." Great song choice, happy to see they used it for the actual show. I love that Jack mistook Sam for his father. It's the fucking Eye of Sauron! Yes! Love that as the "Supernatural" of the year. Definitely in the top half of titles for me. That was a great/horrifying dream Dean had. Oh, it's a Sgriccia episode. That bodes well. Aw, Dean can't say "Cas is dead." This show does love its badass lady sheriffs. Aw, Jack smiled when he got candy. That's kind of adorable. Same for Dean calling Sam "that big fella." I wish the sheriff recognized the names Sam and Dean Winchester. I thought she did at first and was disappointed. I'm a little too amused at "Becky needs to die" because I'm picturing the Becky we know. I need that fast food employee to live and become a minor recurring character. I like that angel radio is a weakness for Jack. We haven't seen Sam or Dean pray since they learned the truth about God, so I really liked that. Very reminiscent of Dean calling John in "Home," but with more anger.  And he threw in Crowley! The hunter's funeral for Cas was nice. My heart breaks for Dean when he says Mom's dead, but damn, does Sam look pretty in that show where he looks at Dean. Yeah, Lucifer keeping Mary to use as bait makes sense. 

[Jediknight]

So this season is going to be about Nature vs Nurture.  Will Jack follow down the Lucifer path, just because Lucifer is his birth father, or will he be good thanks to Sam, Dean, Cas, and people like the sheriff, and her son?

Speaking of Jack, he looked a lot like Brian Thompson.  Are we sure he isn't related to him?

[gonzosgirrl]

Hate that Dean once again got his ass kicked while Sam got the save/kills (and I am SO keeping score this season). But Jensen saved the episode for me. His plea to Chuck and the scenes back at the cabin with Cas, the pyre, etc. Nothing short of brilliant.

[Jeddah]

Well, I liked it! As far as season premieres go, it was somewhere in the middle for me. The new title card looks cool.

When did they have time to put Cas on the table and cover him with a sheet before chasing Jack? Or did the angels do that?

It’s Joaquin from Riverdale!

The drunk girl/ angel was not a good actress. I kept wondering if “Becky” was going to be superfan Becky. I was wondering where they were going with that. I guess nowhere.

I’m liking Jack so far. He just wants Cas back! I do too, Jack. I do too. Jack causing all of the lights to burst was a nice nod to Cas’s “Lazarus Rising” entrance.

The poor boys.

I’m glad our show is back! 

[catrox14]

Didn't think it was that good. Spawn annoys me because it's just so obvious to duplicate Cas and IMO, he wasn't nearly as good at being Cas as Misha.

The pacing was way off IMO. I loved Dean's anger grief though. His angry prayer to Chuck and his face and steeling himself to ready Cas for the pyre. Those were beautiful moments but the rest of it. meh.

I really hate that the show ruins long wonderful emotional endings with some other 'gotcha' thing. Let the emotional moment of Cas' funeral pyre end the episode. Just frustrating.

I give this a 6 and that's only because of Jensen's work in the cabin with Cas and praying to Chuck.

[Katy M]

I liked the epi well enough, but I'm not sure I want to watch a season of "Raising Jack."  But, I'll reserve judgment until I see how it plays out.  I'm with Dean on trying to find a way to kill him and do it, though.  This show has apparently made me way too bloodthirsty.

@Jeddah  Me too, on immediately thinking of Becky rosen.  

And, while I'm sure he'll pop back up eventually, I was afraid Cas was going to come back to life, either via Jack, or because Chuck answered the prayer, and that wuld have annoyed me as being cheap and way too easy.

Edited October 13, 2017 by Katy M

[sarvenaz]

If anyone is in the mood, can they write maybe a short summary of the episode or pm me something? I'd really appreciate it......

[RulerofallIsurvey]

I was ridiculously excited for this show to start tonight.  This is the first time I've ever watched Live.  I watched last season semi-live: that is, the after on the CW app.  And to be honest, this is the first time I've watched any network show Live in at least a couple years (I really don't remember how long it's been).  I usually stream everything, so wait until the day after or get it beforehand OnDemand.  And I gotta tell you: it was Fun!  Fun waiting for it to start: I was like a kid again. (Only this time I had beer to drink instead of soda.  :) )  And Fun watching the show itself.  It did not disappoint.   Not what I expected at all - not that I knew what to expect even.   Both Jensen and Jared really brought it this episode, especially Jensen with showing Dean's grief.  And Jared showing Sam barely holding it together.  I strangely like Jack too.  I didn't think I would.  Too bad drunk girl was actually a dick angel.  I liked her as a drunk girl.  I also liked the sheriff's kid.  He was funny.  Knew Lucifer wouldn't kill Mary, because she's 'useful'.  Least interesting part of the episode, imo.  

[sarvenaz]

2 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Clarissa's recap: http://www.thetvaddict.com/2017/10/12/supernatural-season-13-premiere-recap-dealing-with-satans-son/

Thank you!

Maybe the recap is unaccurate, but I feel like once again Sam got noticable action scenes over Dean? (Don't want to go into bitch/jerk territory so I'm going to stop now) Imo, doing a whole season of nature vs nurture and do we trust Jack do we not would be pretty boring, so I'm hoping they can get this resolved in maybe a three episode arc? We did see Dean asking Jack how old he is before giving him alcohol, so atleast I know he's going to warm up to him......

I'm going to be annoyed if Jack turns out to be good, because not only will it be super predictable but also off character for Dean, who has always had great instincts concerning supernatural beings.

[TexasGal]

33 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Didn't think it was that good. Spawn annoys me because it's just so obvious to duplicate Cas and IMO, he wasn't nearly as good at being Cas as Misha.

 

The voice imitation was irritating to me.  But I did like the way some of his expressions mirrored Cas.

[DeeDee79]

11 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

22 minutes ago, sarvenaz said:

 

Clarissa's recap: http://www.thetvaddict.com/2017/10/12/supernatural-season-13-premiere-recap-dealing-with-satans-son/

Thanks @gonzosgirrl!

[bmoore4026]

12 minutes ago, sarvenaz said:

I'm going to be annoyed if Jack turns out to be good, because not only will it be super predictable but also off character for Dean, who has always had great instincts concerning supernatural beings.

I'm more concerned if he becomes like Connor from Angel

And Jensen Ackles did a superb job in that monologue to God

Edited October 13, 2017 by bmoore4026

[RulerofallIsurvey]

15 minutes ago, sarvenaz said:

Maybe the recap is unaccurate, but I feel like once again Sam got noticable action scenes over Dean?

I went and looked at the recap to be sure - and I didn't get that from the recap, so I'm not sure what you read that I didn't.  I also saw the episode, and don't recall that Sam got "noticeable" action scenes over Dean.  I thought it was pretty equal, as they were in most scenes together.  

56 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Hate that Dean once again got his ass kicked while Sam got the save/kills (and I am SO keeping score this season).

I certainly didn't see Dean getting his ass kicked while Sam didn't.  Sam definitely got his ass kicked in the cell, while Dean got the best of the angel he was fighting.  But if you must keep score, please remember to take it to the appropriate thread.  Thanks!  :)

[gonzosgirrl]

The new title card:

[catrox14]

1 minute ago, gonzosgirrl said:

The new title card:

I do not like that title card at all. It's like my 2nd least favorite after s3. ( I KNOW I'm the worst!)

[Wayward Son]

2 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

The new title card:

I haven’t seen the actual episode yet, so I can’t comment on that, but the new title card is gorgeous! I like that they’ve a whole eye of Sauron thing going on :D

[companionenvy]

I really liked it. 

Jensen was fantastic, and sold me on this not just being  a retread of other grieving Dean scenes. The anger, the immediate, horrified acceptance that his loved ones were gone, the prayer to Chuck -- we've seen elements of this kind of reaction before, but this is distinctly different from, for instance, the Dean we get after Sam is killed at the end of S2. 

Jack interests me. His manner is a little too on similar to Cas - if Alex Calvert will playing a young Cas, it would work, but as he's not, its a bit too much -- but again, given his different circumstances, I don't think the character himself is merely Cas 2. There was a lot original recipe Cas didn't understand about Earth, but he knew who he was and why he was there. 

I did like Sam's speech on grieving, especially the line "We say we're sorry." I don't think that's something most people would describe as integral to mourning rites, but it is a very Winchester sentiment. There's always guilt.

I did find the "we hope there's a better place" line slightly odd. Sam knows what happens after we die - true, he doesn't know what happens to angels, specifically, but he seemed to be speaking more generally. I wonder if the line was in there to set up a plot where Jack does try to create that better world - probably in extremely misguided ways, at first. I don't think the kid is evil, but right now he's radioactive putty in the hands of anyone who spins him a pretty story.

Question: when Jack said that he "chose" Cas as his father, did you all assume that he meant that metaphorically, or biologically? This is a kid who could open portals to another dimension from the womb. It isn't outside the realm of possibility that he could do some kind of imprinting that actually changed his DNA, especially given that Cas was a vessel for Lucifer for a while. I'm leaving the possibility open, especially given the aforementioned extremely Cas-like mannerisms and affect. 

One thing that bugged: Crowley should NOT get mentioned in Dean's goodbye to Cas. Mary, fine. Kelly, maybe Dean feels obligated. But Crowley? I'll buy that Dean feels ambivalent about his death at this point, but not to the point that he'd mention his loss in the same breath as the others at their funeral. 

I'll reserve judgment on why Lucifer isn't immediately killing Mary, but they better have a decent explanation. Way Out Guess: could it be that, as with purgatory, there's a doorway that could be accessible only by humans from another dimension, and Lucifer needs Mary in order to have a chance at getting back? 

[gonzosgirrl]

I think we already knew this, but officially, the credits were: Starring Jared Padalecki, Jensen Ackles, Mark Pellegrino, Alexander Calvert "and Misha Collins". Guest starring Samantha Smith.

[Katy M]

16 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

I do not like that title card at all. It's like my 2nd least favorite after s3. ( I KNOW I'm the worst!)

I actually like the title card.  I can't say that I've taken the time to rank the season on them, though:)  I didn't care for 7 because it seemd the same as 5(?) except that it was black goo instead of blood. 2 or 6 might be my faves.  

 

9 minutes ago, companionenvy said:

Question: when Jack said that he "chose" Cas as his father, did you all assume that he meant that metaphorically, or biologically?

I'm assuming metaphorically. Powerful as he is, I doubt he can change his DNA.  I'm also assuming the reason that th eangel blade didn't kill him is because he's an archnephilim (made up a word, live with it), as to just a run-of-the mill Nephilim.  Cas was able to just kill the regular one in whatever epi that was at the end of season 8 with just a regular blade.

 

10 minutes ago, companionenvy said:

One thing that bugged: Crowley should NOT get mentioned in Dean's goodbye to Cas.

Yeah, that seemed off to me, too.  Maybe an olive branch to MS since he seemed to be a bit peeved at the end of last season.

 

11 minutes ago, companionenvy said:

I'll reserve judgment on why Lucifer isn't immediately killing Mary, but they better have a decent explanation. Way Out Guess: could it be that, as with purgatory, there's a doorway that could be accessible only by humans from another dimension, and Lucifer needs Mary in order to have a chance at getting back? 

This is icky, but I was thinking he may want to make a new Nephilim to open the door.

[MysteryGuest]

I think the action scenes were pretty evenly divided, but I do agree with whoever mentioned above about punching angels...why?  You'd think they'd have learned by now that it doesn't work very well.  

The episode didn't shock me or necessarily make me desperate to see more, but it also didn't annoy me, so I'm taking that as a win.  We know Jack can re-open the portal, so I'm thinking we'll end up in the AU sooner rather than later. 

[Katy M]

2 minutes ago, MysteryGuest said:

I think the action scenes were pretty evenly divided, but I do agree with whoever mentioned above about punching angels...why?  You'd think they'd have learned by now that it doesn't work very well.  

The episode didn't shock me or necessarily make me desperate to see more, but it also didn't annoy me, so I'm taking that as a win.  We know Jack can re-open the portal, so I'm thinking we'll end up in the AU sooner rather than later. 

I actually thought Dean got more action, because I thought Sam got beaten pretty quickly.  And, apparently, punching angels worked out fine tonight.  Better than usual, at any rate.  I know they won't, but they should leave the portal alone. From sam and dean's viewpoint, I mean.  Dean says he knows Lucifer killed Mary, and even if they don't know/think that, she is not more important than keeping Lucifer locked up.

[companionenvy]

5 minutes ago, Katy M said:

This is icky, but I was thinking he may want to make a new Nephilim to open the door.

Oh Goodness, I think you're right. My only hope is that if that were the case, he wouldn't need Mary, specifically, whereas if the escape hatch were only for humans who had come over from our dimension, he might.

Also, though the show has kind of handwaved the discrepancy between Mary's actual age at death and her present appearance, Samantha Smith would be pushing it in terms of fertility. 

You're right. This is icky. 

[RulerofallIsurvey]

15 minutes ago, Katy M said:

This is icky, but I was thinking he may want to make a new Nephilim to open the door.

Ew, Ew!  You did NOT just go there!  Holy Moly!  I never even thought of that!  You have a truly wicked mind! ;)

[Boopsahoy]

56 minutes ago, TexasGal said:

The voice imitation was irritating to me.  But I did like the way some of his expressions mirrored Cas.

Well if the actor was trying to imitate Cas he failed for us. It didn't even cross our minds that he was acting like Cas! YMMV

I enjoyed the episode. I really liked the road so far.  I loved the Dean praying scene, Jensen really moved me.  I really liked the sheriff. She listened to Dean instead of over-reacting.

I'm so happy our show is back!

[catrox14]

2 minutes ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

Ew, Ew!  You did NOT just go there!  Holy Moly!  I never even thought of that!  You have a truly wicked mind! ;)

I TOLD YOU GUYS in the Bitter Spoiler thread, there would be some kind icky business between Lucifer and Mary. Only thing is I still think it will be that Lucifer falls for Mary and Mary falls for him because sometimes this show is so stupid and they think something like that will be EDGY!

[RulerofallIsurvey]

1 minute ago, catrox14 said:

I TOLD YOU GUYS in the Bitter Spoiler thread, there would be some kind icky business between Lucifer and Mary. Only thing is I still think it will be that Lucifer falls for Mary and Mary falls for him because sometimes this show is so stupid and they think something like that will be EDGY!

I'm sure I blocked that out.  Just as I am now trying to scrub the image from my mind due to @Katy M's post!

[catrox14]

2 hours ago, Wayward Son said:

I haven’t seen the actual episode yet, so I can’t comment on that, but the new title card is gorgeous! I like that they’ve a whole eye of Sauron thing going on :D

If they give us an actual dragon this season it might be worth it.

I really need to know why Dean saw Mary burn up again. Like why would that be the thing he sees in unconscious land and also, pretty freaking traumatizing I would think. 

[AuntTora]

I thought the actor looked incredibly like Misha.

[Bessie]

That episode was fairly good. It was also very Dean-centric so I hope all you Dean girls appreciate that. I actually liked it more than I expected to in regards to jack. It was kind of fun to follow along with him.

[Katy M]

What did Jack mean when he was around to see the bad woman burn?  I was trying to think if there were some Biblical story with a bad woman burning, and all I could think of was Jezebel getting licked up by dogs.  He didn't mean Mary did he?  Are they going to try and tell us that Mary has been evil all along?  Confused as she was last season, that would be  a serious retcon, I think.

[companionenvy]

3 minutes ago, Katy M said:

What did Jack mean when he was around to see the bad woman burn?

Dagon? 

[ae2]

38 minutes ago, Katy M said:

What did Jack mean when he was around to see the bad woman burn?  I was trying to think if there were some Biblical story with a bad woman burning, and all I could think of was Jezebel getting licked up by dogs.  He didn't mean Mary did he?  Are they going to try and tell us that Mary has been evil all along?  Confused as she was last season, that would be  a serious retcon, I think.

I guess it has to be Dagon burning when Cas was infused with his powers and destroyed her.

But with Dean's otherwise unexplained flashback to his mother burning, it seems like there is some parallel or connection I am missing.

[Wayward Son]

11 hours ago, Katy M said:

I actually thought Dean got more action, because I thought Sam got beaten pretty quickly.  And, apparently, punching angels worked out fine tonight.  Better than usual, at any rate.  I know they won't, but they should leave the portal alone. From sam and dean's viewpoint, I mean.  Dean says he knows Lucifer killed Mary, and even if they don't know/think that, she is not more important than keeping Lucifer locked up.

They should, but that wouldn’t be very Sam and Dean. Those two aren’t exactly what you would call big picture thinkers and are arguably rather selfish, in the sense they’re happy to completely mess the word up and doom an untold number of people to their deaths just to save someone they care for. Just look at the refusal to close the gates of hell for instance, or Sam unleashing Amara.

 

2 hours ago, companionenvy said:

Dagon? 

3 hours ago, Katy M said:

What did Jack mean when he was around to see the bad woman burn?  I was trying to think if there were some Biblical story with a bad woman burning, and all I could think of was Jezebel getting licked up by dogs.  He didn't mean Mary did he?  Are they going to try and tell us that Mary has been evil all along?  Confused as she was last season, that would be  a serious retcon, I think.

As companion envy said, he is referring to Dagon. There was a flashback to Cas burning her, using borrowed power from Jack, when he said that. 

2 hours ago, ae2 said:

I guess it has to be Dagon burning when Cas was infused with his powers and destroyed her.

But with Dean's otherwise unexplained flashback to his mother burning, it seems like there is some parallel or connection I am missing.

Sorry, we had a post clash!

Personally, I think the burning Mary dream was meant to be symbolic. It indicated the fact that Dean believes Mary is dead and since the image of her burning on the ceiling has been ingrained in Dean since he was four years old that’s the imagery his mind supplies when he thinks of her “death” this time around. 

Edited October 13, 2017 by Wayward Son

[Aeryn13]

Quote

That episode was fairly good. It was also very Dean-centric so I hope all you Dean girls appreciate that.

Quality over quantity anytime so meh. Season is not off to a good start by annoying me with the very same thing that annoyed me for 20+ episodes last year. Hopefully, some writer can break the losing streak.

Overall, I found it pretty lackluster. They spoiled all major events way in advance which is why the moments when the characters are twenty steps behind the audience are less impactful.

I liked the actor for Jack on Arrow and he is fine here but I already roll my eyes about the supposed "nurture vs. nature" angst that it`s gonna spin.  

Quote

I guess it has to be Dagon burning when Cas was infused with his powers and destroyed her.

I agree. The Mary dream was just supposed to set up the "she is dead", followed by the almost pun-like "nope, she isn`t" by showing how Lucifer conveniently lets her live.   

[ILoveReading]

4 hours ago, Bessie said:

It was also very Dean-centric so I hope all you Dean girls appreciate that.

I didn't find this particularly Dean-Centric, since Sam did all the heavy lifting, and saved the day.  Jensen was fantastic, but it didn't amount to much more than  Dean was sad.  (I don't mean this in a bitch/jerk context, just explaining why I didn't find it particularly  Dean-centric). 

[Jediknight]

11 hours ago, Wayward Son said:

I haven’t seen the actual episode yet, so I can’t comment on that, but the new title card is gorgeous! I like that they’ve a whole eye of Sauron thing going on :D

It's Jack's eye.  Whenever he gets mad or scared, his eyes get that fiery ring, and his power is unleashed.

[Myrelle]

1 hour ago, Aeryn13 said:

Overall, I found it pretty lackluster. They spoiled all major events way in advance which is why the moments when the characters are twenty steps behind the audience are less impactful.

IA. It was Predictable and little else.

I also disagree that it was Dean-centric. If anything, it was Jack-centric which was very predictable. It goes into the Jensen save column for me and for the most part because he nailed his scenes, as usual, but Dean-centric-no-not IMO, and far from it.

The rest of my comments will be in the Bitterness or Bitch/Jerk threads when I get around to it, but this one didn't even really feel like a premiere to me. Not really at all.