S05.E23: Lian Yu

[Primal Slayer]

I just remembered that Evelyn is locked up in a cage...alone...lol. They all just left her there instead of dragging her to the plane. Same with the Argus guy that Oliver knocked out. 

[leopardprint]

No, seriously, WTF happened with Diggle? ?

So glad that Myson gets a dad while NotBabySara loses his, right Oliver?

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

So one thing that annoyed me. Oliver was a total dumbass hugging William being all "my boy. Secure the villain! FFS you idiot 

This bugged me too. But not just for logical reasons but the fact that he was acting like he's known William his whole life, hugging and kissing him. It's just not realistic to me? He barely spent any time with him. IDGI. 

[wonderwall]

I really liked the episode but it definitely as amazing as it was hyped up to be... 

Things I loved:

• That sweet Olicity scene
• Thea/Felicity's talk about evil fathers which I thought was something that's wonderful for them to bond over
• Quentin clocking BS and giving Dinah the BC name. LOL this episode just 'disrespected' KC at every turn. Yeah, they totally wanted her back lol can't wait to see more of this in season 6. I need good laughs
• The cliffhanger was the best because I know my faves are alive. So that spares me from any worry
• Nyssa winning over Talia. Really liked that scene and I hope to see more of it next season
• Chase not technically losing. He was a formidable villain from start to end. 
• Slade Wilson. I can't believe I"m saying this, but as much as a can't stand Manu, Slade was easily one of my most favorite characters in this episode
• Malcolm dying. And I really don't care how underwhelming it was
• No hint of BS redemption this episode. In fact it reinforced that she won't be getting one lol
• MOIRA QUEEN. That scene was easily the most heart wrenching and emotional scene. I miss Susanna so much it made me cry. It was such a touching and heartbreaking scene. I loved how Oliver sounded like a child and Susanna's acting was brilliant. You rest in peace you bad ass bitch. I love you, boo.

Things I'm meh about:

• William. Didn't love him or hate him. I just didn't care about him enough for this episode to be centered around him.
• Evelyn. Why was her irrelevant ass even there

Things I hated:

• Samantha - shut your god damn mouth up. God what an odious character. She was actually so bitchy to Felicity in their scene. I want her to die but I also don't want her to die

Things that would've made this episode a lot better:

• It being a 2 hour finale to let the emotional moments breathe and to make the action a lot more exciting
• More Olicity/OTA
• The journos not hyping this episode up.

Edited May 25, 2017 by wonderwall

[catrox14]

3 hours ago, calliope1975 said:

A beard he had to cut off in the pilot. Instead of, you know, just taking it off. /side eyeing this story choice 

This is really the most disappointing thing in all of Oliver's journey. I was really invested in Oliver's grungy, gross beard, and him running and running in bare feet to launch an arrow into that pyre in the first moments of the show.  I don't like the retcon and IMO it is a retcon. I see no reason why they couldn't have had Oliver be stuck on that island for another few months with no way to shave. Then he grows the gross beard and hair, and then does the same running thing and is rescued. Grrrr. Show....Grrrrr.....dislike.

Edited May 25, 2017 by catrox14
run on sentenes run on

[insomniadreams88]

I can't help but think of how much more we could've gotten out of the finale if they had taken out some of those "Where's my son?!"s from Oliver.

I really don't get the point of this cliffhanger. We know that the team survives. Unless now MG is going to go on Tumblr and be like, "So, those people I said were sticking around in season 6? J/K. Wait until the fall to see who is staying." 

[BkWurm1]

1 minute ago, leopardprint said:

She talked about doing stuff but didn't get to actually do it. Sigh.

1038472038 steps ahead.

But screentime at least?  Dig didnt' even get that.  

This episode was kind of what I was afraid it would be.  More about the island being wrapped up than what I care about on the show.  Hence why there was so much Slade.  And yes, it was good Slade stuff and if it had been something other than a season finale, I'd have liked it a lot more. It's just Slade hasn't been around for three years.  And not at all this season.  It's nice he's there but kind of dilutes the impact of tying off the season.  SLade and Nyssa effectively cut him off from the team and I just don't enjoy Oliver running around doing stuff without the team.  Ok the OTA part of the team.  

[Tallis]

What was the 'one of the best lines of the episode' from Black Siren that was mentioned in several of the early reviews? 

[Guest]

I think we can probably consider Evelyn dead seeing as she was locked in that cage alone and probably didn't have time to hide underground like the rest of them, at least I'm assuming that's what they're gonna do.

Does anyone understand why she joined Chase though? I still don't get it. She hated Oliver being a murderer so she joined up with an even worse murderer. Where's your logic, Evelyn?! Weirdo!

[leopardprint]

Oliver didn't even choose myson's life over everyone else's lives, he chose hugging his son over everyone else's lives.

Edited May 25, 2017 by leopardprint

[apinknightmare]

1 minute ago, Angel12d said:

Does anyone understand why she joined Chase though?

Because she's a flaming moron who is even dumber than Oliver, which is saying a lot.

[madhacker]

If Oliver didn't call Cisco as a emergency "escape" plan than he's even dumber than Barry.

BTW, when he was recruiting his team to take out Adrian why the hell didn't he call in some metahuman help?  Cisco and Wally alone would've tipped the scales. Hell Cicso could've just bopped over to Earth-31 and gotten Kara. Adrian and his whole army wouldn't have lasted 2 seconds against Supergirl.

At the very least why didn't Oliver call Roy? Or is Colton involved in something else these days (besides his upcoming wedding)?

And since they mentioned Slade's son Joey they had better introduce Jericho next season (and he'd better have his "possession" powers!!)

Edited May 25, 2017 by madhacker

[Primal Slayer]

Just now, Angel12d said:

I think we can probably consider Evelyn dead seeing as she was locked in that cage alone and probably didn't have time to hide underground like the rest of them, at least I'm assuming that's what they're gonna do.

Does anyone understand why she joined Chase though? I still don't get it. She hated Oliver being a murderer so she joined up with an even worse murderer. Where's your logic, Evelyn?! Weirdo!

It's so disappointing that they didn't care about that storyline. If you're gonna adapt Artemis/Terra doublecross storyline, at least do it decently. 

[statsgirl]

That was .... kind of disappointing.  Especially with all the hype from the people who got screeners.  And the reason is because the whole episode was driven by the need to find William and I just wishing he and his mother would die.

32 minutes ago, mtlchick said:

All because he needed the save "the son he never knew he had." And not the 20 other people that he's known a lot longer.

Exactly.

The whole episode was driven by the need to find William, and I really don't care.  Why is Oliver abandoning Thea and Felicity and everyone else for William?

Why didn't William try to escape on his own?

29 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

Or maybe we get a Lost spin off: Lian Yu. Everyone spends 5 years trying to get off the island only to find out they've been dead all the time and just running around in circles.

Well it is the true meaning of Purgatory.

 

26 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

How does it rank in comparison to the Supergirl finale?

Because I loved that finale!

I thought this was better. But I didn't like the Supergirl finale except for the Cat Grant parts.

Edited May 25, 2017 by statsgirl

[Lady Calypso]

1 minute ago, catrox14 said:

This is really the most disappointing thing in all of Oliver's journey. I was really invested in Oliver's grungy, gross beard, and him running and running in bare feet to launch an arrow into that pyre in the first moments of the show.  I don't like the retcon and IMO it is a retcon. I see no reason why they couldn't have had Oliver be stuck on that island for another like few months with no way to shave and he grow an actual gross beard and hair and then do the same running thing and be rescued. Grrrr. Show....Grrrrr.....dislike.

What would have been interesting if he was left to die alone on the island, for good this time, and he spends months alone, going a little crazy and thinking way too much, which leads to his whole crusade or whatever. But yeah, so disappointed with the flashbacks. I mean, they brought it full circle, but it was poorly done. 

 

2 minutes ago, Tallis said:

What was the 'one of the best lines of the episode' from Black Siren that was mentioned in several of the early reviews? 

I think it was the whole "You're going to steal my life" bit, maybe? Not that I pay attention to the reviews, but that's the only memorable line I heard, since I just guffawed at it. All I heard was Katie Cassidy speaking it, because why would Black Siren be concerned with Dinah stealing her life? 

[leopardprint]

Oliver might be at Barry levels for me after this episode, guys. Barry Allen Levels! ?He looked at the abyss and the abyss looked back!

Edited May 25, 2017 by leopardprint

[catrox14]

9 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

Was that a surprise though? I mean he literally gave his blessing episodes ago.

Well it was to me in that he would do it that directly. But it was still glorious and wonderful and I'm pleased as punch that it happened.

[SmallScreenDiva]

I'm underwhelmed. There were some good moments — Felicity surprising Oliver with a kiss, her chat with Thea, Slade & Oliver — but a huge part of the ep was Oliver screaming about "my son," which was annoying AF. I really wanted the kid to die. Just so tired of him. 

I think the best part of the night was Quentin hitting BS with a stick while she was doing her drunken walk. So much disrespect for this character, LOL! I hope this becomes a running gag on the show. Every time BS starts talking, somebody just punches her to shut her up. 

So disappointed.

[catrox14]

1 minute ago, Lady Calypso said:

What would have been interesting if he was left to die alone on the island, for good this time, and he spends months alone, going a little crazy and thinking way too much, which leads to his whole crusade or whatever. But yeah, so disappointed with the flashbacks. I mean, they brought it full circle, but it was poorly done. 

Yes, this is really what I had always imagined happened with the Oliver we got in the pilot.

[apinknightmare]

2 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

I think it was the whole "You're going to steal my life" bit, maybe? Not that I pay attention to the reviews, but that's the only memorable line I heard, since I just guffawed at it. All I heard was Katie Cassidy speaking it, because why would Black Siren be concerned with Dinah stealing her life? 

Yeah, that line makes no sense. Even if Laurel was Black Canary before she was Black Siren on E2 Dinah still wouldn't be stealing her life, because this isn't her earth. Dumb as per usual.

[Morrigan2575]

2 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Well it was to me in that he would do it that directly. But it was still glorious and wonderful and I'm pleased as punch that it happened.

And completely fucking meta.

[insomniadreams88]

I'd like to know why they felt the need to have a cliffhanger at all. Why not end it with Oliver leaving the island behind with everyone? They could still blow up the island if they wanted to, maybe have Oliver leave Chase behind and he kills himself but everyone gets off the island before the explosives go off.

And we could've had the feeling of "what next" for everyone knowing that Chase is really gone but there's still stuff up in the air. Not knowing what's going to happen with William and Samantha and if Oliver's going to be part of his son's life. Oliver and Felicity reuniting. Thea dealing with losing Malcolm. Etc. 

Also, was Black Siren left knocked out in the temple? Are they going to go back for her? 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

I think it was the whole "You're going to steal my life" bit, maybe? Not that I pay attention to the reviews, but that's the only memorable line I heard, since I just guffawed at it. All I heard was Katie Cassidy speaking it, because why would Black Siren be concerned with Dinah stealing her life? 

This. Like @apinknightmare said, that line makes no sense. If anything Dinah's replacing E1 Laurel not E2 Laurel and I guess only in the sense that she's taking her BC name.

Are they gonna make E2 Laurel a bit cuckoo or something? Does she want to steal E1 Laurel's life? IDGI. That line was confusing tbh.

[Primal Slayer]

I love that Siren is always about to lay the finishing blow but always gets knocked out by someone else from behind. If that's how you gotta beat her then continue to do so since it just shows that she is good at what she does (except learning to turn around)

[Lady Calypso]

Just now, insomniadreams88 said:

Also, was Black Siren left knocked out in the temple? Are they going to go back for her? 

I assume she'll wake up and either escape on another boat that she stored away, or she'll go help the team escape because of a redemption story or whatever. I'm afraid of the latter because even though it makes no sense, this show usually makes no sense to get from point A to B.

[KenyaJ]

22 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Slade being a Psycho-Therapist to Oliver.

I see what you did there, and I salute you.

[BkWurm1]

22 minutes ago, bettername2come said:

Quote

That was good. That was good and heartwrenching and no way are the principal characters dead, but damn that was terrifying and a game changer and a great send off for the island and the flashbacks. I thought they did a nice job with showing Oliver as a son vs. Oliver as a father in that final flashback with Moira. I thought Stephen Amell brought the emotional depth in his worry for William.

 

He was emoting the hell out of that scene, but I got a bit too lost in how someone dying would actually be a deadman's switch if he's not holding the switch while he's alive.  The bad writing took me out of the moment.  

I think that I will eventually rewatch this episode and enjoy it more.  But as it is, there's just so much more it COULD have been.   My expectations weren't huge and there were a lot of good parts but somehow the sum of the whole became less?  

Edited May 25, 2017 by BkWurm1

[Primal Slayer]

1 minute ago, Angel12d said:

This. Like @apinknightmare said, that line makes no sense. If anything Dinah's replacing E1 Laurel not E2 Laurel and I guess only in the sense that she's taking her BC name.

Are they gonna make E2 Laurel a bit cuckoo or something? Does she want to steal E1 Laurel's life? IDGI. That line was confusing tbh.

I think Chase just gave her the dl on the team recruiting DD to replace LL as BC and that she was hesitant about it so she wanted to play some mind games on her.

1 minute ago, Lady Calypso said:

I assume she'll wake up and either escape on another boat that she stored away, or she'll go help the team escape because of a redemption story or whatever. I'm afraid of the latter because even though it makes no sense, this show usually makes no sense to get from point A to B.

I think she is going to run up a cliff, jump off, and scream her way to safety lol

[Mellowyellow]

2 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

I think that I will eventually rewatch this episode and enjoy it more.  But as it is, there's just so much more it COULD have been.   My expectations weren't huge and there were a lot of good parts but somehow the sum of the whole became less?  

Saving grace is that Felicity is part of the cliffy like 20 other people and has not taken off somewhere!

[Morrigan2575]

6 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

This. Like @apinknightmare said, that line makes no sense. If anything Dinah's replacing E1 Laurel not E2 Laurel and I guess only in the sense that she's taking her BC name.

Are they gonna make E2 Laurel a bit cuckoo or something? Does she want to steal E1 Laurel's life? IDGI. That line was confusing tbh.

It makes no sense In Show. That line was total meta, they basically just shat all over KC this episode. LOL

Edited May 25, 2017 by Morrigan2575

[benteen]

It was a good thing that Oliver secured Chase right after he shot him with that arrow.  Oh, that’s right…he DIDN’T!  Come on, Ollie, Chase killing himself at the end was the most obvious play he could have made.  Even Laurel could have seen that one coming and she’s dead!  Just like Team Flash last night with Savitar, Oliver never learns.  Never change, old friend.  Never change.

I thought this was a good episode though I felt way too much time was spent with everyone walking through the jungle.  It felt like a rush by the end.  Not to mention I was hoping for a more final resolution to the past five years as the show moves beyond the flashbacks to Season 6.  But instead we have a cliffhanger that’s not much of a cliffhanger because we know this show is not about to become Oliver and Son.

I loved the Oliver and Slade scenes.  So good getting those two back together again.  Moira returns for an outstanding flashback with Oliver.  I do like the way that Oliver and Kovar fight because it just looks brutal and vicious.  Nyssa is always a welcome presence on this show and it was awesome to see so many familiar faces.

Malcolm deserved a more epic death than the rushed piece of shit.

While I wasn’t as high on the season finale, this was a strong, bounce back season for Arrow. 

Edited May 25, 2017 by benteen

[Lady Calypso]

Also, did Oliver promise Evelyn that he'd come back for her? But then nobody seemingly did. She's so going to show up, looking like Two Face, yearning for revenge...only to be shot with an arrow by Thea. 

Yeah, that's the dream. 

But I wouldn't be surprised if somehow, Team Arrow and Allies had time to do all of this stuff on the island before it blew up and killed them all, such as saving Evelyn, having a conversation with each other, bumping into Black Siren and debating whether to fight her and keep her trapped on the island, etc.

[leopardprint]

Things I liked about the episode:

• Thea's hair!
• the lighting on Lian Yu was really favorable, everyone's skin looked amazing
• Nyssa, start to finish
• Yay Lance, maybe Slade can provide him with some therapy too

Things that were unintentionally hilarious:

• Oliver and Chase's fight on the world's smallest tug boat (?) like did they spend all their money on that screech off?
• Slade's third super helpful and wise personality (after Slade and Deathstroke) I'll call him Wilson. 

Edited May 25, 2017 by leopardprint

[thuganomics85]

Can't believe the show remembered that Digger Harkness/Captain Boomerang was also a prisoner on the island and he played a part!  I was way, way too giddy over how many scenes there where between him, Nyssa, and Slade, and seeing Manu Bennett, Katrina Law, and Nick E. Tarabay playing off one another.  They just needed to resurrect Amanda Waller and find a convoluted way for Oliver to bring The Weather Wizard over, and the Spartacus reunion would have been perfected!  At least they had one scene of Slade being the shit out of Harkness, because, of course, Crixus would aways kick Ashur's ass on any show!

Plenty good finale, but it might have been a case of too much of a good thing, because there were several moments that weren't long enough and I wanted more.  I wish we got more Nyssa/Talia (really got a Gamora/Nebula from Guardians of the Galaxy vibe there), more of everyone's reaction to working with freaking Slade Wilson (especially Felicity), and more of the Malcolm/Thea relationship.  The moments we got were great, but I wanted more!

The battle between Black Siren and New Black Canary would have had more impact if I cared about either one of them.  Instead, it's a battle between a character I barely know vs. one played by the actress who the show can't seem to quit for whatever reason.  At least  Quentin gave it a fun and fitting end!

As with most things, not enough Diggle.

Damn, it feels like Kovar might have given Oliver the majority of his scars, considering that final fight!  Wish they built him up better, but Dolph Lundgren was a good physical presence thought.  Glad the flashbacks are over.  Mixed on the Moira appearance, because on one hand, yes, Susanna Thompson was fucking awesome as always, but on the other hand, I'm remembering how great a character she was, and the mistake it probably was offing her like that.

Doubt Malcolm is dead.  Boomerang probably got caught in the blast, but he probably weaseled his way out.

Can't wait to see what Josh Sergarra does next.  Even when I found Chase to be too all knowing, he was fantastic in these final episodes.

I figured there was going to be some big moment where Oliver has to choose between William and the rest, and now the island has been blown sky high.  Of course, I just spent the entire time yelling at Oliver to just fucking restrain Chase and it could have been all avoided, so if anyone dies, it was partially thanks to him being a big dummy as always.  Of course, I doubt anyone major will die, but I'm worried about the side characters.  Well, I could give a shit about Samantha (sorry, Anna Hopkins!), but they better not kill Slade or my beloved Nyssa.  Unless it ends up they are no longer needed in this timeline, so the Legends shows up and recruits them.  That said, I wouldn't be surprised if Malcolm magically shows up and plays a part in working things out.

Overall, good finale for a solid season.  Not quite as good as the second season, but a sizable improvement over the fourth and especially the third.  Not to mention whatever hell The Flash is trying to do.  I do hope they not squander this, although it would be hard to have a resolution to this cliffhanger without feeling like a copout or pissing people off for killing characters.

[BkWurm1]

Just now, Mellowyellow said:

Saving grace is that Felicity is part of the cliffy like 20 other people and has not taken off somewhere!

True.  I kind of wonder if they did this cliffhanger in a desperate attempt to make sure as many viewers as possible would come back.  Everyone knows Oliver is fine.  So taking no chances, EVERYONE else on the show is in danger.  Well except for the ones that JUST got a new contract as a regular.  

[insomniadreams88]

Maybe they all decided to swim around the island. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if they did. I'll probably be disappointed by however they resolve the cliffhanger. 

[wonderwall]

8 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

It makes no sense In Show. That line was total meta, they basically just shat all over KC this episode. LOL

[BkWurm1]

1 minute ago, insomniadreams88 said:

Maybe they all decided to swim around the island. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if they did. I'll probably be disappointed by however they resolve the cliffhanger. 

Ha!  That was actually my thought as a way to survive.  The boat though might not have survived the blast but I suppose they can just have it on a long dock and it would be fine.  

[Morrigan2575]

Is the Japanese sub till there? We saw part of The Amazo too. I guess they could have made it to the bunker or just jumped in the ocean?

Edited May 25, 2017 by Morrigan2575

[Soulfire]

Maybe I'll feel different in the morning, or... in a week or so, but right now I'm underwhelmed and kinda disappointed. 

Thought the ending they pulled is a cheap ploy to get viewers to tune in next season. 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[apinknightmare]

2 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Is the Japanese sub till there? We saw part so The Amazo too. I guess they could have made it to the bunker or just jumped in the ocean.

They probably all just hopped into or on to S.S. Plot Device That Isn't Named William. Boom! Saved.

[Writing Wrongs]

How was Rene able to hold his own against trained assassins? Isn't he just a street fighter?

[wonderwall]

This is the 2nd time KC had to outright admit that her character had been replaced in a meta statement. The writers are BRUTAL.

The first one being:

[Cthulhudrew]

46 minutes ago, calliope1975 said:

A beard he had to cut off in the pilot. Instead of, you know, just taking it off. /side eyeing this story choice 

Maybe he attached it with... Super glue. 

Ba-dum-dum! I'll be here all week folks!

Edited May 25, 2017 by Cthulhudrew

[Morrigan2575]

Other things I liked. I liked that we got Thea/Felicity bonding over Evil Dads.

I liked that we got very little Curtis but, he still annoyed me...way to ruin a moment Curtis.

I liked the Moira flashback, SA has always done great work with ST (even over a phone in separate scenes).

I hated how little Diggle we got but, enjoyed his piece of the Royal Rumble.

Liked the Nyssa/Talia fight scene. I hope we get more of them next year. 

Edited May 25, 2017 by Morrigan2575

[wonderwall]

I'm SO looking forward to Oliver/Felicity reuniting in the new 9pm timeslot though. 

I honestly can't wait for season 6 lol

[Cthulhudrew]

42 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

I just remembered that Evelyn is locked up in a cage...alone...lol. They all just left her there instead of dragging her to the plane. Same with the Argus guy that Oliver knocked out. 

They seemingly freed Digger (I'm assuming Team Arrow locked him up along with Evelyn, although we didn't see him in a cage), so I'm guessing they also freed Evelyn. Either way, not too concerned. 

I'm still half-convinced she'll turn out to be "Vigilante."

Also, Digger was very under-utilized. Hope they didn't kill him off, although with all the "never see the body" action going on (Malcolm, Digger, Evelyn, Team Arrow) I suspect Chase is the only one who actually died this episode. Him and the red shirt faux-League.

Overall, I enjoyed it. Definitely agree that it was too rushed, and there was too much going on to give any of it justice. I think it would have been better served as a two-parter. Really enjoyed seeing Digger and Slade back, as well as Nyssa. I'd be cool with them being the new Team Arrow and replacing Canary, Wild Dog, and Mr. Terrific.

[leopardprint]

21 minutes ago, leopardprint said:

Things that were unintentionally hilarious:

• Oliver and Chase's fight on the world's smallest tug boat (?) like did they spend all their money on that screech off?

No for real, this looks like a bath toy, not the setting for a final boss fight? 

[SmallScreenDiva]

1 hour ago, leopardprint said:

The season died as it lived, with Oliver being stupid. 

I'm gonna steal this line, OK? Unless you want credit on Twitter :)

[Cthulhudrew]

Could be that Team Arrow survived by hiding in the Dharma Corporation hatch.