S05.E04: Kirsten's Story

[Tabbygirl521]

I have only watched as far as their arrival in Houston but so far I don't blame a Neiko at all for any attitude. Not only has he had to put up with a lot, Kirsten is so damn RUDE. When they were trying to pack her into the car, she was barking at him about moving his seat, with a "You're so stupid" tone in her voice. I need my cane! Fetch my pizza! Get away! How about an occasional please and thank you? 

If these enabler families would quit laying out thousands of dollars for pizza every year, they could probably afford a home health nurse to help with bathing a couple of times a week. Or disability benefits should cover it, I would think. 

[flappa1016]

I figured she drank a lot of soda, but geez, 4 two liters a day!!!!  Without even taking into account the number of calories that is, the METABOLIC effect on the body would be horrible!!!  That's pure sugar and/or high fructose corn syrup there - a sure-fire prescription for diabetes and non-alcoholic fatty liver disease - the size of her liver alone was probably why Dr. Now didn't have the room to stuff her insides back in AND perform a proper gastric bypass.

Someone upthread mentioned the Hillshire Farm sausages in her cart - first of all, they are low carb and are a perfectly acceptable form of protein.  Secondly, those were bought for the entire family.  They showed her cooking for them that night, and I saw that everybody at the table had the sausage on their plates (except Neiko, who had a slice of pizza and what appeared to be a bread stick), and either some type of vegetable or a salad (can't remember which).  I looked at those plates and thought "Finally that family is eating healthy".  Although Neiko is old enough now that he should be eating what the family eats, or at the very least something healthier than pizza and bread.

[leighroda]

I can barely finish a whole 20oz soda in a day, I can't fathom finishing even 1 2-liter bottle in a day.

[ClareWalks]

Eight liters of soda is over 2 gallons. Two gallons. Ya know, in my training career, I have frequently advised clients who want to lose weight to "drink a gallon of water a day." They complain about how much that makes them pee, it's too much to drink, blah blah. This chick drinks TWO GALLONS of what is essentially hummingbird food EVERY DAY. I seriously cannot even fathom what that does to a person's insides. Her blood sugar must be insane. The caffeine alone would destroy someone. 

[leighroda]

7 minutes ago, ClareWalks said:

Eight liters of soda is over 2 gallons. Two gallons. Ya know, in my training career, I have frequently advised clients who want to lose weight to "drink a gallon of water a day." They complain about how much that makes them pee, it's too much to drink, blah blah. This chick drinks TWO GALLONS of what is essentially hummingbird food EVERY DAY. I seriously cannot even fathom what that does to a person's insides. Her blood sugar must be insane. The caffeine alone would destroy someone. 

So as a reformed soda drinker (I know I just commented that I can't drink a lot, and that's true now... but I have a shady past with soda... but still nowhere near a liter a day) I'm also a nurse (I know that also means I should know better) and part of the reason I preferred soda over water was because I didn't have to pee as much... I know that's horrible for me, but throughout the day it was easier to no have to stop to pee... yeah it's twisted but it's how I thought... so all of that to say, I wonder if that plays into any of these people's thought process... like since going to the bathroom can be a hassle it's easier to drink something that makes you pee less? Again I know that's not good and probably more likely they just like soda, but just a thought I had.

[ClareWalks]

23 minutes ago, leighroda said:

So as a reformed soda drinker (I know I just commented that I can't drink a lot, and that's true now... but I have a shady past with soda... but still nowhere near a liter a day) I'm also a nurse (I know that also means I should know better) and part of the reason I preferred soda over water was because I didn't have to pee as much... I know that's horrible for me, but throughout the day it was easier to no have to stop to pee... yeah it's twisted but it's how I thought... so all of that to say, I wonder if that plays into any of these people's thought process... like since going to the bathroom can be a hassle it's easier to drink something that makes you pee less? Again I know that's not good and probably more likely they just like soda, but just a thought I had.

That does make sense. I have had lots of arguments with my mom because for years she only drank about 16 oz of water a day, the rest was all soda and coffee (so she wouldn't have to pee as much!). But two gallons of fluids, that's gotta come out some kinda way. I hate to say it, but a better "no peeing, lots of sugar" strategy would have been to eat a box of Snickers bars a day.

[MrsClaus]

I don't know about Kristin, but when I was drinking Coke I didn't pee as much as I do now with drinking water and tea.  I will also admit I used to drink between 1-2  2-liter bottles a day.

[auntjess]

I know it's not supposed to be good for you, but why don't any of these people ever drink diet soda?  It sure would save a lot of calories.
I haven't had a regular soda for many years, and I think they taste a lot better than all that sugary sweetness.
Don't have but one a day, and drink mostly freshly brewed iced tea, but I could go with just Diet Coke for a bit.
I wonder if CPS from their home county saw the show, or if Neiko has already dropped out of school.  That kid deserves a break, so hope there's something good in his future.

[NYCFree]

I'm the mom of a 14 year lad son and I really felt for Neiko.  I do believe her when she said that her brother was the family favorite because the dad pretty much confirmed it in a talking head.  I think there are now repeating the dynamic with Neiko and Lexie, except this time, it the girl who is the favorite.  When the dad was talking about why he wanted Kirsten to be healthier, he said "so she can move out of here with her son." Given that Lexie and her boyfriend both lived with him, I thought it was really telling he couldn't wait to have Neiko gone but seems to feel fine about Lexie staying.  The dad also distanced himself from Neiko by not calling him by his name, or by saying "my grandson." The whole family seemed to disparage Neiko all the freaking time.

I agree that this particular stage is one of the most ungodly obnoxious ones on the planet, but it seemed like they never found anything worthwhile in Neiko at all.

I also believe her about the gang rape. She was very clear about basically prostituting herself for drugs, and she spoke about that incident in a different way.  Having multiple men have sex with you without your consent is way different from waking up with regrets after a one night stand.

The whining, crying and delusion (if I could just have a turkey sandwich, all would be right in my world) were too damn much. But I do have more hope for her than Penny. I think the continued therapy will be very beneficial, and she did lose almost two hundred pounds.

[operalover]

On 1/26/2017 at 0:21 AM, Muffyn said:

So for 2  weeks she was living in Houston with her son and the only furniture they had was her bed and a walker with a seat?  Yeah, I don't now why the kid was acting out a bit.  I'm sure he really enjoyed sleeping on the floor and staring at the walls. 

when they were in Washington, didn't she say she was sharing a room with her son, her daughter and her daughter's boyfriend?  Nothing strange there.  Nothing at all. 

Save Neiko. 

When she was on the phone with her mother in the hospital, she sounded like Gilda Radner doing Lisa Lubner.  If only someone named Todd had come to see her. 

I thought of South Park, she sounded like those boys, but Lisa Lubner is spot on! She was always yelling.

What were they thinking? The boy was going to sit around all day in the apartment with his 600 pound mother with nothing to do? She abandoned him for ten years, then comes back for 8 months, moves into his bedroom, and makes his life hell, because all she does is whine, cry, bitch and eat.  She back into his life for less than a year and she ruins it and then he has to go to Houston with her to sit around in a small room and listen to her complain? Of course he was going to act up. She deserved it for abandoning him and then treating him like shit.

All she did was cry like a toddler. Around her mother she turned into a 4 year old with the tantrums. 

[auntjess]

Re: her being a former drug addict, I wonder how this works with the pain medication.
Dr. Now has told several patients, (can't remember which ones), that were taking too many pain pills and I think he refused to write anymore for someone.
 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, auntjess said:

Dr. Now has told several patients, (can't remember which ones), that were taking too many pain pills and I think he refused to write anymore for someone.

One of them was Pauline who had an attack of the "owww-wees" nearly every time she brushed up against something. 

[notyrmomma]

Part of the reason why someone gets to 600 pounds is because they have no tolerance for any discomfort (hunger is pain to them).

[leighroda]

Something that bothered me about her episode is she always said she didn't feel good, and that's why she needed to eat, sometimes when someone is sick it does help to have a little something on your stomach, but I know for me personally if I don't feel good I don't want to eat. It just doesn't ring true to me when someone says they don't feel good and need to eat, but then eat a cheeseburger.

[OSM Mom]

7 hours ago, Giant Misfit said:

One of them was Pauline who had an attack of the "owww-wees" nearly every time she brushed up against something. 

Like the air.  

[Minivanessa]

Thanks to everyone who posted on this thread, so I got info about this episode. I tried to watch it and couldn't take very much. Right from the obligatory opening shower scene, in which Kirsten was screaming in a panic, like someone in incredible agony or danger.  Huh? She was, like, in a shower in her own home.

I flipped back to the show a few times, got a glimpse of her entering the van for the trip to Houston. More panic and whining. 

Then her nonstop crying, whining, and bitching in the hospital. Okay, at first she was post-op and in pain, but she was there for months (as I was shocked to discover), and apparently never. shut. up with the crying/whining/bitching the whole time. Kudos to the hospital staff for letting her live. Seriously. I can't imagine how far she must have stretched the professionalism of everyone who worked on that ward.

I also loved her comment of wanting to go home to her own bed and her own vomit bucket. I hope she gets real therapy to deal with the traumas of her past, and has a better future, but I don't think I'll be tuning in if they do an update show. 

[TurtlePower]

1 hour ago, Jeeves said:

Thanks to everyone who posted on this thread, so I got info about this episode. I tried to watch it and couldn't take very much. Right from the obligatory opening shower scene, in which Kirsten was screaming in a panic, like someone in incredible agony or danger.  Huh? She was, like, in a shower in her own home.

I flipped back to the show a few times, got a glimpse of her entering the van for the trip to Houston. More panic and whining. 

Then her nonstop crying, whining, and bitching in the hospital. Okay, at first she was post-op and in pain, but she was there for months (as I was shocked to discover), and apparently never. shut. up with the crying/whining/bitching the whole time. Kudos to the hospital staff for letting her live. Seriously. I can't imagine how far she must have stretched the professionalism of everyone who worked on that ward.

I also loved her comment of wanting to go home to her own bed and her own vomit bucket. I hope she gets real therapy to deal with the traumas of her past, and has a better future, but I don't think I'll be tuning in if they do an update show. 

Over-dramatic patients will test anyone's patience. 

[Tabbygirl521]

I thought it was remarkable how easily she got in and out of that white crossover in TX after the drama of trying to pack into her mom's van - when Mom tried to slam the door on her bulk. I think she had lost only 50 lbs but she was whipping in and out so much more easily into what seems like a smaller passenger compartment. 

Neiko was definitely being a brat but it seemed most understandable to me. Frankly, none of them had strong communication skills or consistent respectful behavior to each other or anyone else. I hate when the patients act like brats with the medical staff. 

I imagine Kirsten has worn the parents out so maybe they are acting out as well. But I bet their family dynamic has always been painful. And didn't she mention needing to hash something out with her dad regarding the past, but we didn't see the convo? Something ain't right with the whole gang. 

[leighroda]

9 hours ago, Jeeves said:

Thanks to everyone who posted on this thread, so I got info about this episode. I tried to watch it and couldn't take very much. Right from the obligatory opening shower scene, in which Kirsten was screaming in a panic, like someone in incredible agony or danger.  Huh? She was, like, in a shower in her own home.

I flipped back to the show a few times, got a glimpse of her entering the van for the trip to Houston. More panic and whining. 

Then her nonstop crying, whining, and bitching in the hospital. Okay, at first she was post-op and in pain, but she was there for months (as I was shocked to discover), and apparently never. shut. up with the crying/whining/bitching the whole time. Kudos to the hospital staff for letting her live. Seriously. I can't imagine how far she must have stretched the professionalism of everyone who worked on that ward.

I also loved her comment of wanting to go home to her own bed and her own vomit bucket. I hope she gets real therapy to deal with the traumas of her past, and has a better future, but I don't think I'll be tuning in if they do an update show. 

You forgot the part where she literally told the respiratory tech that she wanted to "sleep and not wake up" and then cut to the scene where she was on suicide watch because she "apparently" mentioned she wanted to sleep and not wake up... shocking. 

Btw... I'm a RN, I used to work in pediatrics, and 2 year olds take their breathing treatments better than her, normally because they are scared, not the medicine...and I would expect for it to be scary for them, she's an adult and knows better than to be scared. 

[Minivanessa]

I had forgotten about the "not wake up" statement and suicide watch. But I think I missed the reason for the breathing treatment. Was it emphysema or am I thinking of another episode?

Edited February 5, 2017 by Jeeves

[leighroda]

I'm not sure if we were given a specific reason for breathing treatments, I tend to multitask when it's on, but I do remember them mentioning oxygen therapy, I think because she kept saying she didn't feel well enough to get up, but she might have asthma or something too.

[starlightlost]

I took a peek at her facebook:

Not much on her page but..

From her mom's page:

"What did you think of Kirsten's episode?  Please remember, we have only been here 4 months,  they have projected this as a year.  The only time she gained weight was at the hospital and that was because she had extreme water weight gain on her release.  That weight came off in three weeks.  Kirsten is a little upset because they said she missed an
Appointment and a weight gain that didn't happen.  She has done remarkable well staying on her diet, 1200 calories, lean meat and vegetables only.  I am the one who has been overeating, it hard being away from all of you."

and

"Please remember that the show wants to show as much drama as possible.  Kirsten has done great while been here in Houston.  She first saw the Dr. mid-Sept. Her weight 590 her Dr. Visit 1-26 her weight was 453, she is down 147 lbs."

[leighroda]

If her mom can tolerate her then more power to her, but idk know if it was only 4 months it actually makes it worse in my eyes, I could understand more spread out outbursts, but her behavior was pretty obnoxious. Maybe her mom is used to it and not so bothered by it but I have yet to sit through her entire episode because I can't take her. I also don't buy the water weight excuse, that's everybody's first defense when there is a gain, I'm willin. To bet she was finding a way to cheat and sneak food...probably from her mom who doesn't want to be called out for enabling and is now covering for her.

[TVbitch]

I find the episodes where the person has a lot of resistance much more interesting. She was a hella mess, but I had a lot of compassion for Kirsten. Maybe because I was an alcoholic for 30-years and understand resistance, or maybe cuz she just seemed so Goddamn miserable. Aggressive misery just permeated through every interaction between that family. Too bad they can't all get counseling like on Intervention.

But maybe not with that counselor. Granted it's based on the couple minutes we saw, but that counselor does not seem up to the task of such a complex hardcore case to me. With her sweet baby whisper voice and cloying compliments, I don't think that is going to be the kind of direct, intensive therapy that a personality like Kirsten is probably going to need. In any case, hope Kirsten is able to find another coping mechanism besides her "FEWWWD!!" (I have to admit, it cracked me up every time she bellowed for it!) 

Edited February 5, 2017 by TVbitch

[TurtlePower]

15 hours ago, TVbitch said:

I find the episodes where the person has a lot of resistance much more interesting. She was a hella mess, but I had a lot of compassion for Kirsten. Maybe because I was an alcoholic for 30-years and understand resistance, or maybe cuz she just seemed so Goddamn miserable. Aggressive misery just permeated through every interaction between that family. Too bad they can't all get counseling like on Intervention.

But maybe not with that counselor. Granted it's based on the couple minutes we saw, but that counselor does not seem up to the task of such a complex hardcore case to me. With her sweet baby whisper voice and cloying compliments, I don't think that is going to be the kind of direct, intensive therapy that a personality like Kirsten is probably going to need. In any case, hope Kirsten is able to find another coping mechanism besides her "FEWWWD!!" (I have to admit, it cracked me up every time she bellowed for it!) 

I had counselors like that for anorexia. Completely useless and pissed me off. "I know why I'm anorexic and you're not helping, k?"

 

15 hours ago, TVbitch said:

I find the episodes where the person has a lot of resistance much more interesting. She was a hella mess, but I had a lot of compassion for Kirsten. Maybe because I was an alcoholic for 30-years and understand resistance, or maybe cuz she just seemed so Goddamn miserable. Aggressive misery just permeated through every interaction between that family. Too bad they can't all get counseling like on Intervention.

But maybe not with that counselor. Granted it's based on the couple minutes we saw, but that counselor does not seem up to the task of such a complex hardcore case to me. With her sweet baby whisper voice and cloying compliments, I don't think that is going to be the kind of direct, intensive therapy that a personality like Kirsten is probably going to need. In any case, hope Kirsten is able to find another coping mechanism besides her "FEWWWD!!" (I have to admit, it cracked me up every time she bellowed for it!) 

This. And similar to Intervention (with the interventionists having had experience with the particular addiction), it would be nice if the counselors know and understand what each individual is going through because they've gone through it themselves. It's more relatable than the typical counselor attitude/questions and willing to bet there are people who have had weight loss surgery who would love to counsel and help new patients. 

Edit: Sorry for the double copy. Oops.

Edited February 5, 2017 by Runnergirl
Double copy

[Pers]

17 hours ago, TVbitch said:

I find the episodes where the person has a lot of resistance much more interesting. She was a hella mess, but I had a lot of compassion for Kirsten. Maybe because I was an alcoholic for 30-years and understand resistance, or maybe cuz she just seemed so Goddamn miserable. Aggressive misery just permeated through every interaction between that family. Too bad they can't all get counseling like on Intervention.

But maybe not with that counselor. Granted it's based on the couple minutes we saw, but that counselor does not seem up to the task of such a complex hardcore case to me. With her sweet baby whisper voice and cloying compliments, I don't think that is going to be the kind of direct, intensive therapy that a personality like Kirsten is probably going to need. In any case, hope Kirsten is able to find another coping mechanism besides her "FEWWWD!!" (I have to admit, it cracked me up every time she bellowed for it!) 

Hey TVBitch - I'm glad you brought up the counselor. My husband was watching with me, and he said "What the hell? Why is she speaking like that? It's weird." I agreed, but I started thinking about it and wondered if maybe the counselor was kind of genius. On "Intervention" we often hear that the addict's emotional and mental maturity is arrested at the age they started doing drugs/drinking. Kristen started abusing drugs (and alcohol? Not sure) in her early teens and seems to have the mentality of a petulant teenager. Is the counselor speaking to her in a childlike voice in order to make Kirsten comfortable and able to open up more? Genius or just an odd voice, I don't know!

[TVbitch]

As much as I'd like to give her the benefit of the doubt, she has been on before and acted the same way, with the same voice, and, pretty much said the same things to each person. I've had counselors like this and I find it ineffective and patronizing. 

I don't think most addicts are frozen at whatever age their addiction started. In all the groups I've been in, most were high functioning. Sure there are often underlying mental disorders (depression, bi-polar, PTSD, anxiety, etc.) but very few had arrested development. Having said that, I do think Kirsten lacked a sense of personal responsibility. 

[cynicat]

On 2/4/2017 at 6:24 PM, starlightlost said:

I took a peek at her facebook:

Not much on her page but..

From her mom's page:

"What did you think of Kirsten's episode?  Please remember, we have only been here 4 months,  they have projected this as a year.  The only time she gained weight was at the hospital and that was because she had extreme water weight gain on her release.  That weight came off in three weeks.  Kirsten is a little upset because they said she missed an
Appointment and a weight gain that didn't happen.  She has done remarkable well staying on her diet, 1200 calories, lean meat and vegetables only.  I am the one who has been overeating, it hard being away from all of you."

and

"Please remember that the show wants to show as much drama as possible.  Kirsten has done great while been here in Houston.  She first saw the Dr. mid-Sept. Her weight 590 her Dr. Visit 1-26 her weight was 453, she is down 147 lbs."

I call "alternate facts" here.

[corinnemchugh]

I doubt she was a severe drug addict (for other reasons), but just because Kirsten is obese doesn't mean she wasn't addicted to meth, heroin, whatever. Don't buy into stereotypes. Addiction is possible in any body type.

[LocalGovt]

When I saw this episode for the first time, I caught it from the midpoint on. First I thought Neiko was her brother.  Then I thought she was the mother (her mother).  It was a helluva night for me. LOL!

[Oldernowiser]

She's a piece of work, for sure. OMG the WHINING.

But that kid of hers is a sadist. Gave me chills.

Does he have perfectly valid reasons to hate his mother and the situation, of course. But he wasn't just upset and angry...he was playing with her the way a cat does with a mouse, taunting her and enjoying her reaction.

Add in that the father is a dead ringer for what my alcoholic ex husband no doubt looks like now...let's just say I won't be watching the rest of the episode.

#shudder

[55Unicorns]

On 1/25/2017 at 8:22 PM, rlc said:

How old is Kirsten?

38

[Pringlescan]

On 1/31/2017 at 10:28 PM, auntjess said:

I know it's not supposed to be good for you, but why don't any of these people ever drink diet soda?  It sure would save a lot of calories.
I haven't had a regular soda for many years, and I think they taste a lot better than all that sugary sweetness.
Don't have but one a day, and drink mostly freshly brewed iced tea, but I could go with just Diet Coke for a bit.
I wonder if CPS from their home county saw the show, or if Neiko has already dropped out of school.  That kid deserves a break, so hope there's something good in his future.

Diet soda is just as bad for you as regular soda. People think the word "Diet" means better but with soda it's the same or worse.

[OSM Mom]

10 minutes ago, Pringlescan said:

Diet soda is just as bad for you as regular soda. People think the word "Diet" means better but with soda it's the same or worse.

Those artificial sweeteners are poison. Yeah, I know that the high fructose corn syrup isn't good for you either. But yeah. 

[55Unicorns]

On 2/4/2017 at 5:24 PM, starlightlost said:

I took a peek at her facebook:

Not much on her page but..

From her mom's page:

"What did you think of Kirsten's episode?  Please remember, we have only been here 4 months,  they have projected this as a year.  The only time she gained weight was at the hospital and that was because she had extreme water weight gain on her release.  That weight came off in three weeks.  Kirsten is a little upset because they said she missed an
Appointment and a weight gain that didn't happen.  She has done remarkable well staying on her diet, 1200 calories, lean meat and vegetables only.  I am the one who has been overeating, it hard being away from all of you."

and

"Please remember that the show wants to show as much drama as possible.  Kirsten has done great while been here in Houston.  She first saw the Dr. mid-Sept. Her weight 590 her Dr. Visit 1-26 her weight was 453, she is down 147 lbs."

I don't think so!!  Down to 147?!?

[Minivanessa]

24 minutes ago, 55Unicorns said:

I don't think so!!  Down to 147?!?

No, she said the weight was 453, which is down 147 pounds from her starting weight.

[Thriftykins]

On 3/2/2017 at 1:30 PM, Pringlescan said:

Diet soda is just as bad for you as regular soda. People think the word "Diet" means better but with soda it's the same or worse.

Diet soda has no calories.  Regular soda has something like 120+ per 12 ounce can.  Zero calories is a lot better.

On 3/2/2017 at 1:41 PM, OSM Mom said:

Those artificial sweeteners are poison. Yeah, I know that the high fructose corn syrup isn't good for you either. But yeah. 

I've heard that hooey before. I've been drinking diet soda for 21 years.  Probably average about a quart a day.  My health is just fine.  The idea that high fructose corn syrup or artificial sweeteners are particularly bad for you is just a trendy piece of disinformation that worked its way into the public consciousness somehow.

[Kellyee]

Quote

Diet soda has no calories.  Regular soda has something like 120+ per 12 ounce can.  Zero calories is a lot better.

Diet soda is better for your weight. Its not really any better for your overall health, but you won't hit 600 pounds drinking diet soda.

[Christina]

I have a lot of diabetics in my family, Type I and II, and all doctors say don't drink diet. The artificial sweeteners work on the brain the same way sugar does, but the major difference is that the brain sends signals that calories are coming and when the body doesn't get them, the signals about needing food get stronger and people snack and eat. It doesn't work as a weight loss measure, and cutting the calories and actual sugar out only works theoretically. It sounds good because we have had "calories in calories out" shoved down our throats forever, even though it has also been disproven, over and over. Primarily that you can exercise away the calories you have eaten. Some of the major discoveries in nutrition have come out of diabetes research, because that is currently where the funding is being spent.

People will start exercising or switch their regular soda for diet, lose some weight, and think that is why. There are many reasons to exercise and a lot of people who do find that their bodies don't operate as well when they eat junk and find it easier to avoid. If you want a carbonated beverage, drink whatever you think tastes good, but don't delude yourself into thinking that zero calories is better. It's not.

[Elizabeth9]

Works fine for me.  I drink many each day, and I've never been overweight in almost 20 years.  

[Thriftykins]

13 hours ago, Christina said:

I have a lot of diabetics in my family, Type I and II, and all doctors say don't drink diet. The artificial sweeteners work on the brain the same way sugar does, but the major difference is that the brain sends signals that calories are coming and when the body doesn't get them, the signals about needing food get stronger and people snack and eat. It doesn't work as a weight loss measure, and cutting the calories and actual sugar out only works theoretically. It sounds good because we have had "calories in calories out" shoved down our throats forever, even though it has also been disproven, over and over. Primarily that you can exercise away the calories you have eaten. Some of the major discoveries in nutrition have come out of diabetes research, because that is currently where the funding is being spent.

People will start exercising or switch their regular soda for diet, lose some weight, and think that is why. There are many reasons to exercise and a lot of people who do find that their bodies don't operate as well when they eat junk and find it easier to avoid. If you want a carbonated beverage, drink whatever you think tastes good, but don't delude yourself into thinking that zero calories is better. It's not.

Of course it's better.  Let me put it this way.  If you are looking at two new cars.  One costs $22,000.  One costs $0.  Which one will have less financial impact on you? 

 

The arguments against diet soda are specious and seem to be based on this idea that diet soda is some sort of mind control drug that forces a person to start going nuts on ice cream and candy and donuts and whatever.  It reminds me of that movie "Reefer Madness", where a person smoked a marijuana joint and immediately became a violent thug.  When I drink Coke Zero, it doesn't make me suddenly hungry. 

 

And I'm not stupid.  I didn't switch to diet soda and suddenly think that it's okay to gorge myself on whatever else I want for the rest of the day.

[Christina]

There is a lot of science to back up the claims against diet soda, and not one that supports the sugar-free diet claims made by the food industry, although the claims that aspartame causing cancer are much more limited than the media reports. It is unlikely you will get cancer from it, but if you are at risk, it will increase it. You can ignore the science if you want to but it doesn't make it wrong. The studies are from reputable studies throughout the world. I personally choose to ignore the fact that brownies have calories and you shouldn't eat an entire pan in one sitting, with or without ice cream.

The diet industry in this country IS absurd; no argument there. There is always going to be a new "Big Bad" ingredient that is responsible for all the world's ills. Right now it is sugar and TSP. Sugar comes and goes from attention every few years.

[Thriftykins]

3 hours ago, Christina said:

There is a lot of science to back up the claims against diet soda, and not one that supports the sugar-free diet claims made by the food industry, although the claims that aspartame causing cancer are much more limited than the media reports.

What claims though?  I'm not disputing your claims.  I'm disputing their relevancy.  All you've said is that artificial sweeteners make you crave sweets. 

If diet soda makes you crave more food, so what?  Being stressed out makes me crave food.  Being bored makes me crave food.  Being depressed makes me crave food.  Anyone who has ever tried to lose weight will tell you that cravings are a fact of life and that you have to fight them.  You seem to want to paint cravings as some force that subverts your free will and makes you gain weight.

 

Another poster said that artificial sweeteners are "poison".  This is the real nonsense I strenuously object to.  You don't, like me, drink over 2000 gallons of poison over a 20 year span and come out with a perfectly healthy liver and pair of kidneys. 

 

Like I said, there is a laundry list of things that just suddenly start getting vilified out of nowhere because some misinformation leaked into the public consciousness and is pushed by some charismatic non-scientist.  Vaccines, GMOs, nitrates, high fructose corn syrup, fat, cholesterol, eggs, bacon, non-organic food.... the list goes on and on.  There's so much noise that it's nearly impossible to take anything seriously.

[Elizabeth9]

What's with exercise not burning off the food you eat?  Where do people come up with this stuff?!

[Christina]

6 hours ago, Michael Stabosz said:

All you've said is that artificial sweeteners make you crave sweets. 

No, I didn't. I said it has been shown to trigger the brain chemistry that calories are coming, and when they don't the cravings for food result in people eating more than they would have if they didn't consume the zero calorie drink in the first place. I said nothing about sweets, and the fact that your brain doesn't react that way doesn't change the fact that it is a problem for many, many people. I've never gotten a "high" of eating, yet realize that many people do.

6 hours ago, Michael Stabosz said:

You seem to want to paint cravings as some force that subverts your free will and makes you gain weight.

Again, No, I haven't. I've pointed out the physiological response that happens as a result of no-calorie foods, while pointing out that you should drink what you want, but don't rely on false claims. False claims you also point out abound when it comes to nutrition, at the same time decrying the scientific studies, a summary of which I linked, that show the opposite is true.

 

6 hours ago, Elizabeth9 said:

What's with exercise not burning off the food you eat?

There is no reason to even go get the studies for this, since it will also just be ignored. If you eat a 1000 calorie meal, you cannot just exercise away that 1000 calories. The body doesn't work that way. Proven, scientific studies that have been reported over and over and are still ignored. If you were to go to a Registered Dietician or even most trainers, they will tell you that, too. You cannot shovel whatever you want into your mouth and exercise it away. You have to restrict the calories going in. You want to eat an extra hundred calories today, you have to restrict over the next few days. An extra two hours on the treadmill will not burn them off.

[Elizabeth9]

I guess I'm incapable of understanding your online articles since I only have a degree in biology and am employed as a biologist.

[frenchtoast]

While food is obviously a subject of these episodes, let's keep it to what was on the episode. And, as always, be civil. 

And remember, this isn't a contest or debate club. No one wins or loses. There is no need for everyone to agree. Sharing information is one thing, lecturing and getting short about it are another. 

[Sir RaiderDuck OMS]

On 2/2/2017 at 2:43 PM, Giant Misfit said:

One of them was Pauline who had an attack of the "owww-wees" nearly every time she brushed up against something. 

And let's not forget Penny and her oxygen mask....

[TurtlePower]

20 hours ago, Christina said:

There is no reason to even go get the studies for this, since it will also just be ignored. If you eat a 1000 calorie meal, you cannot just exercise away that 1000 calories. The body doesn't work that way. Proven, scientific studies that have been reported over and over and are still ignored. If you were to go to a Registered Dietician or even most trainers, they will tell you that, too. You cannot shovel whatever you want into your mouth and exercise it away. You have to restrict the calories going in. You want to eat an extra hundred calories today, you have to restrict over the next few days. An extra two hours on the treadmill will not burn them off.

This! The body is extremely efficient at holding onto energy. As a longtime competitive distance athlete and running coach, it would take 10 miles of running for an average person to burn off 1,000 calories. 10 miles! I don't eat much more when training hard than I do normally, especially if I'm trying to make race weight--maybe 400 extra calories a day give or take, depending on the workouts.

I guess technically the body can burn off what is consumed but folks like Kirsten eating on average 26,000 calories a day would have to basically run a marathon every day--and we know that's not going to happen. They can barely get out of bed.

[Calicocats]

On 3/29/2017 at 7:11 PM, Christina said:

No, I didn't. I said it has been shown to trigger the brain chemistry that calories are coming, and when they don't the cravings for food result in people eating more than they would have if they didn't consume the zero calorie drink in the first place. I said nothing about sweets, and the fact that your brain doesn't react that way doesn't change the fact that it is a problem for many, many people. I've never gotten a "high" of eating, yet realize that many people do.

Again, No, I haven't. I've pointed out the physiological response that happens as a result of no-calorie foods, while pointing out that you should drink what you want, but don't rely on false claims. False claims you also point out abound when it comes to nutrition, at the same time decrying the scientific studies, a summary of which I linked, that show the opposite is true.

 

There is no reason to even go get the studies for this, since it will also just be ignored. If you eat a 1000 calorie meal, you cannot just exercise away that 1000 calories. The body doesn't work that way. Proven, scientific studies that have been reported over and over and are still ignored. If you were to go to a Registered Dietician or even most trainers, they will tell you that, too. You cannot shovel whatever you want into your mouth and exercise it away. You have to restrict the calories going in. You want to eat an extra hundred calories today, you have to restrict over the next few days. An extra two hours on the treadmill will not burn them off.

It's always worked fine for me <shrugs>