S02.E13: Date of Death

[nodorothyparker]

44 minutes ago, Ohwell said:

Didn't Chris witness Travis and Madison shooting his mother?  Of course, we know she was bitten and wanted to be put out of her misery, but the point is that he saw his father and stepmother shoot his mom.  I don't blame him for being psycho and fucked up in the head because I don't know many people, especially a teenager, who wouldn't be in that situation. 

I like Chris and I dream of him shooting Madison in the head. 

No, they shot her and went off to have their own From Here to Eternity moment down the beach and left her laying there for Chris to find with the bullet hole still fresh in her forehead.  But I think you're right that he's pretty clear that that's exactly what they did.

I haven't even gotten around to watching this mess yet.  An 18th-century trial I already knew the outcome of because I'd already read the book on Masterpiece Theater won out.  I didn't miss the show at all but I did miss the live snarking.

Edited September 26, 2016 by nodorothyparker

[Ocean Chick]

Madison: "Your daddy committed suicide, Alicia, and that's why I decided to leave you to raise yourself and concentrated on your older brother - he reminds me so much of your dad (talk about your Oedipus Complex!).  And Nick's smile can light up a room (and your's doesn't, you little sadsack of a daughter).  And I'm telling you all this now because I need someone to tell me that they love me, and you're the only one around.  So tell me you love me and forgive me for loving Nick more than I love you"

Alicia:  "Sure, mom.  I love you and forgive you, because I can read on your face just how sorry you are for forgetting that I was alive.  Or I could, if only your face could move."

Yep, that was some stellar storytelling right there.  But man, I was rooting for Travis to leap off that balcony in the worst way.  Right in front of Madison.  They both deserve it.  I'm sure that Travis saying HE'D left Chris was referring back to when Travis and Liza split up and Travis hooked up with Madison, not to when Chris left with the Bromigos.  Travis was probably too wrapped up with his new love to pay attention to his son who was hurting.  And thus Psycho Chris was started.  And now Psycho Chris has achieved adulthood.  But don't worry - Chris and the Bromigos are too stupid to live long.  Honestly, who kills the chickens when they could be eating the eggs instead?  Talk about poor planning.

[diebartdie]

Quote

Honestly, who kills the chickens when they could be eating the eggs instead?

Idiot teenagers who cant conceive of "tomorrow"?

[ghoulina]

1 hour ago, nitrofishblue said:

 

Watching Madison 's face when she was talking to her daughter almost made me barf all over my TV. MAN, is she terrible!!!!!! Her facial expressions range from none to none to none.  She would be better as a zombie.

 

And what was up with her when Travis was walking with her away from the gate, after he had just arrived? She looked so PAINED. As if she had been shot. Nothing on her face said relief, love, affection. Don't even get me started on their weird, arms-around-each-other body language. 

 

1 hour ago, icemiser69 said:

He probably killed himself so he wouldn't be stuck with his lousy family, or cast on this piss poor show.  Who the heck would want to be around any of these people?  

He probably killed himself because based on the constant look on her face she was thoroughly disgusted with him. 

[NorthstarATL]

2 hours ago, ghoulina said:

I think, for Christ, it was more about fitting in. No, he doesn't really know what these guys have been through and how they'll react in every situation. But he likely just gets a sense about them. More than that, he liked that THEY LIKED how he responded in the store. Christ talked with his dad about not fitting in. Now these older guys like him and think he has what it takes, so he's all over that. 

That's pretty much how I see it as well. On top of that, Chris has/had some serious issues with the blended family thing, and what happened to his mother, and worked out a lot of his aggression killing zombies. Once he realized that the "he/she was about to turn" excuse (I can't recall whether he knows that this is precisely what happened with his Mom or not) gave him "permission" to give in to his darker side, he was all in. AND Travis comes off as weak and indecisive, as opposed to morally strong, and Chris already feels, from what we are told about his childhood, that he is trying to fight those same impulses in himself, so he goes all in on being the bully/alpha whatever.

  I think someone said this last week (or maybe this week?) on this forum, but I would not have thought last season that Chris and Alicia would be the more engaging characters on the series. I may not "like" Chris, but his story is more interesting than some others'.

[Omar G.]

13 hours ago, riverheightsnancy said:

Not a single walker this episode. That doesn't even seem possible. 

There was a handful of them walking on the beach, but that was it. It was like garnish next to a bad steak.

[qtpye]

2 hours ago, natyxg said:

No, I don't think he did. IIRC he was with Alicia in Strand's house when they heard the shot.

I think it's because the implication is that the Zombie Apocalypse gave Chris the excuse to be a psycho and he enjoys it. Even if he did "what was necessary" regarding Elias and the other dude, he had zero remorse which is expected from a normal person, specially so early on. It was as if saying that they did what they had to was supposed to be the excuse, but deep down he didn't even need an excuse. Leaving his dad behind was more of the same psycho attitude because if it was really about Travis not "getting it", not understanding that this is the world now, then a more normal person would have preferred to stay with him to protect him and to do what Travis isn't willing to. But Chris basically leaves him to die, his own dad, and leaves him to be with some dudebros he barely even knows. He enjoys the sense of power and freedom, and I fully expect him to screw over the dudes he left with, not the other way around.

I still hope he dies, though.

 

2 hours ago, ghoulina said:

I think, for Christ, it was more about fitting in. No, he doesn't really know what these guys have been through and how they'll react in every situation. But he likely just gets a sense about them. More than that, he liked that THEY LIKED how he responded in the store. Christ talked with his dad about not fitting in. Now these older guys like him and think he has what it takes, so he's all over that. 

 

Overall, I agree with both of these posts.  We know that Chris was bullied in school and probably had a hard time making friends.  I remember in the first season when the crowd cheered Chris filming what the crowd thought was police brutality (but what we knew as police killing a zombie) and he was so happy because he was "a part of something".

I doubt if Chris ever felt welcome in hatchet faced Madision's home and I bet his mother worked long hours as a nurse.  I am sure like a lot of bullied kids, he felt like a total loser and he did not have very much in the way of family support.

I think Travis always thought of Chris as a sweet misunderstood sensitive kid.  He thought Chris had a good heart and that is why he did not fit in with the harder more mean boys.  The truth is Travis does not know Chris, he has been to busy helping Maddie enable Nick, to give him much thought.

The zombie bros represent the guys that Chris always wanted to hang out with in school.  He probably thinks of them as bad ass and they do not try to stifle his natural tendencies toward "kill or be killed" violence.  As a teenager, your peer group has more influence on you then your parents.

Chris felt weak before the ZA and now because of the lawlessness, he feels empowered and will never be that scared lonely ignored bullied kid, again.

[Gobi]

I am convinced that the people posting here about this show are giving it far more thought and analysis than any of the writers for the show.

[JackONeill]

I don't care how old you are or what "tragedies" you think you've faced, but if the ZA isn't the best reason to forget all the petty bullshit and grow a pair, then I don't know what will. This is no time for whiney, navel-gazing, soul-searching.

You don't see Judith pitching a bitch.

[AngryCarrot86]

25 minutes ago, JackONeill said:

I don't care how old you are or what "tragedies" you think you've faced, but if the ZA isn't the best reason to forget all the petty bullshit and grow a pair, then I don't know what will. This is no time for whiney, navel-gazing, soul-searching.

You don't see Judith pitching a bitch.

This so much.  This group of fools should have been zombie chow week one of the ZA, the only exception being Strand.

During the scene where Travis is making a grave for the farmer, I couldn't help but to think Rick would have done the same during season 1 or 2.  But...fast forward a few seasons and

Spoiler

Rick is ripping out the jugular of rapey motorcycle gang guys with his teeth.  He's RICK GRIMES, BITCH!  Travis Manawa will never have that ring to it.

Nobody in this group has the gull to deliver such entertainment to me.  Nobody.  This is why this show sucks.  Strand, Alicia, and a few episodes ago I might have said Nick, HAD potential to become interesting characters.  Sadly, the writers are more interested in making them one dimensional, entitled, whiny bitches. Or even worse, they magically go from being broken and possibly suicidal, to totes badass zombie killing machines with absolutely no character development or storyline explaining how they got to that point (Ophelia). 

Edited September 26, 2016 by AngryCarrot86
Because spellcheck changes "Strand" to "Stand"

[kj4ever]

I totally got the "they like me, they really like me!" vibe from Chris.  It seemed like it was more like he was happy the cool kids like him than survival.

Madison is such an A-hole.  Selfish, plastic A-hole.  I don't know if it is because Kim Dickens is like the worst or if the writers are the worst, but it sure seems like her speech to Alicia was for her to feel better and possibly to be able to talk about Nick.  Telling Alicia about her Dad was the high of selfishness.  She could have just said she was always worried about Nick OD'ing and dying and apologizing for treating her bad but Nope!  We actually rewound the scene and her face did not change expression, not one time.  She still looked like she was mildly amused because she had smelled a fart.  God how can the dumb asses running this show not see how horrible she is?

[Gobi]

When Mads said that her late husband was a man of few words, I expected her next line to be: "The suicide note read 'Goodbye, and thanks for all the fish.'"

[atiyah9369]

18 hours ago, tiredofwork said:

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz-zzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

Why oh why do the directors of this series think we want to see up close the one and only look the actress that plays Madison has which is the open mouth, something smells face??????

She is a true mouth breather!

[atiyah9369]

17 hours ago, riverheightsnancy said:

Not a single walker this episode. That doesn't even seem possible. 

They did show some stumbling on the beach.

[riverheightsnancy]

3 minutes ago, atiyah9369 said:

They did show some stumbling on the beach.

I stand corrected by all of you eagle-eyed posters. But again, I ALWAYS do other work while watching this show so I missed the walkers in the background.  lol

[madam magpie]

Good lord, Madison. Really?? You drop the suicide truth bomb now? She even backtracked when Travis said she'd been right to choose Alicia at the vineyard! She really is infuriating...and emotionless. She was like a robot talking to Alicia on the bridge 

I was a bit surprised by Alicia's reaction to seeing Travis at the beginning. At first she looked scared. But then she seemed worried about him and Chris, worried for their well-being, I mean, not that Chris might hurt her.

Chris is awful, and Travis is as much an enabler as Madison. I am with those who wished he'd jump off the balcony. I can't believe these people are back with sweet Alicia. Leave her alone, and she'd survive the zombies fine.

Was Strand not in this episode? I missed him. And Chris wasn't with the bros at the end, right?

[Gobi]

Chris was not with the bros at the end. In the preview, Travis called out Chris' name, but I couldn't tell if he was shown.

[madam magpie]

1 hour ago, Gobi said:

Chris was not with the bros at the end. In the preview, Travis called out Chris' name, but I couldn't tell if he was shown.

Ah! Ok, thanks. I watch on Amazon and don't get the previews...

I hope he's gone gone.

[Smitty227]

3 hours ago, madam magpie said:

Ah! Ok, thanks. I watch on Amazon and don't get the previews...

I hope he's gone gone.

Perhaps I misunderstood the intent of the scene, but I thought showing the bros without Chris insinuated that they killed him.  I'm pretty sure he's gone.  That would tie in with Travis' tearful confession.

Even watched it again to see if the guy who said "hola" was Chris with a beard.  Happily, it was not!

[Ohwell]

If Chris is, indeed, gone, then that finally frees Travis up from his family.  He can now be the weak-kneed turd of a stepfather to his new family.  I can't stand him and I want him to die.

[ChipBach]

On 9/26/2016 at 3:11 AM, LocimusPrime said:

These directors and writers really suck bad. 

• The characters are terrible. The only kinda cool character is Strand. He should be the leader hands down 
• Ok somehow, this group needs to gather some firearms. Go visit strands old place and see if there are still weapons there, barter with the grocery store cartel guys or on house to house searches. This is getting ridiculous. 
• Chris is a terrible person with an evil face/ smile. I want to choke him 
• what was/ is the colonias plan for when they ran out of water or things to barter for water. Wouldn't it be wiser to set up a colony near some resources. 
• Ricks group would have taken over the hotel, supermarket, and colony by now. Lol

Barter for water?  I have to believe that a huge Mexican resort has some sort cistern system?  No?  How about re-routing the water from the flat roof drains into a big old water tank?  It would literally take an afternoon, some flexible hose, and an empty tank...  Silly show...

20 hours ago, riverheightsnancy said:

I stand corrected by all of you eagle-eyed posters. But again, I ALWAYS do other work while watching this show so I missed the walkers in the background.  lol

I would amend to say:  "A Zombie show whose only Zombie threat came from Kim Dickens acting..."

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

Things Get Talky, Not Showy, On A Penultimate Fear The Walking Dead

Who's well-positioned for survival heading into next week's double-sized season finale?

[Ohwell]

The thing I noticed was the giant zit in the middle of Chris's forehead.  Need to put some pee on that, ASAP.

[Raven1707]

The Sunday Cable Ratings are in for "Date of Death":

“Fear the Walking Dead” and “Power” were the two top-rated original shows on cable Sunday.

“Fear” was down a tenth of a point in adults 18-49 week to week, but its 1.5 was still easily the day’s best performance. [3.491 million viewers]

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2016/09/27/sunday-cable-ratings-sept-25-2016/

 

And here are the Live + Same Day ratings for Season 2, so far:

04-10-16 “Monster” 6.674 million
04-17-16 “We All Fall Down” 5.581 million
04-24-16 “Ouroboros” 4.726 million
05-01-16 “Blood on the Streets” 4.803 million
05-08-16 “Captive” 4.414 million
05-15-16 “Sicut Cervus” 4.486 million
05-22-16 “Shiva” 4.388 million

08-21-16 “Grotesque” 3.864 million
08-28-16 “Los Muertos” 3.661 million
09-04-16 “Do Not Disturb” 2.991 million
09-11-16 “Pablo & Jessica” 3.401 million
09-18-16 “Pillar of Salt” 3.616 million
09-25-16 “Date of Death” 3.491 million

[meep.meep]

On 9/26/2016 at 0:11 AM, LocimusPrime said:

 

• Ricks group would have taken over the hotel, supermarket, and colony by now. Lol

Rick's group would have destroyed the hotel, supermarket, and colony by now.  They are like the plague.  Madison's brilliant idea to turn on the hotel neon sign is right up there with Rick's let's try to herd thousands of zombies for miles and miles - is it worse to be impulsive or short sighted?

[MissScarlett]

My impression of Madison is that she is stoic because she's had a hard-ish life. She's not overly emotional and kind of keeps a wall up. With that said, unfortunately, I don't think the actress does this characterization very well. It kind of comes across as always looking "pained" (or always smelling something rotten). The tough southern gal has always been one of my favorite characterizations and I can think of other actresses on other shows who have done this better. I digress.

I was excited about the reunion between Maddy and Travis initially because they sort of presented him as the "prodigal husband returns", but when they started to speak, I had forgotten how much I hate them as a couple.

I like Maddy best without Travis. I like Travis best without Maddy. Can they get a divorce in a ZA?

As a parent, I get both Maddy and Travis's realizations / ruminations over their children. Travis blames himself for Chris's psychotic turn and Maddy regrets how she handled the situation when her husband committed suicide. She had good intentions when she told Alycia and I think she wanted her to understand that she always loved Alycia just as much as Travis but feared that Travis would end up like his dad in the end. He was the child she had to save, whereas Alycia was "okay". At least in Maddy's eyes. I can relate to Alycia's relationship with her mom.

Chris is not my favorite character but his story arc is one of the most interesting arcs at this point. I really hope that they take him to super-villain status and that he becomes a very dangerous leader of a large group. I will be pissed if the douche bros kill him off because that would be another missed opportunity for the writers.

Speaking of... I get that the writers are trying to establish this show in its own right by not repeating any storylines as seen on the original, but I think they are doing a huge disservice to their fan-base because they are removing everything (aka the zombies) that made us tune into this show in the first place.

I don't get any feeling that there is a sense of urgency for these people to fight to survive at this point. There have been no zombie hoards to get through and no one is even really scared of these things, which takes all the fun out.

Still, I will watch this show to the bitter end. If for no other reason than cross-over potential.

[ghoulina]

1 hour ago, MissScarlett said:

like Maddy best without Travis. I like Travis best without Maddy. Can they get a divorce in a ZA?

I agree. I don't like Maddie at all, but they're both better apart. I was really hoping there would be no reuniting. I think it would be interesting to show a couple separating like that, because of their children, and never finding each other again. 

[Pixiebomb]

Since the separation at the Casa de Cecelia, Maddie has (understandably) been worrying (obsessing) about Nick. But I don't think she has mentioned Travis once.  So when she saw him I was actually surprised to see her react. She actually looked glad to see him not just "oh, it's you". 

Maddie/Travis or Maggie/Beth. Who missed who (whom?) more?

[txhorns79]

Quote

Since the separation at the Casa de Cecelia, Maddie has (understandably) been worrying (obsessing) about Nick. But I don't think she has mentioned Travis once.  So when she saw him I was actually surprised to see her react. She actually looked glad to see him not just "oh, it's you". 

I agree.  She hasn't seemed like she even cared Travis was gone, but she's ready to put everyone in danger on the off chance Nick might see a lit up hotel sign. 

Quote

Chris is not my favorite character but his story arc is one of the most interesting arcs at this point. I really hope that they take him to super-villain status and that he becomes a very dangerous leader of a large group. I will be pissed if the douche bros kill him off because that would be another missed opportunity for the writers.

I think his storyline is interesting as well.  There are always going to be winners and losers in the ZA, so it's interesting to see how an angry, but otherwise normal teenager transforms into a dead eyed psycho. 

[natyxg]

Frankly, I don't think that Chris' story will end with him becoming some leader of a group or anything like that. Mostly because of two reasons:

1. This feels more like Travis' story, not Chris'. I don't feel like we've been getting his point of view or anything like that, specially since they separated from the group. To me it seems more like it's the story of Travis' agony over seeing his son becoming a monster and him mourning his loss and his own failure as a father. It feels, to me, like Chris' actual story ended a while ago and he became who he was gonna become, and that's it. We didn't even get a scene with him thinking about betraying Travis or anything remotely like his point of view at all. So I find it more likely that it will all lead to like, Travis killing him or something like that.

2. Because he is too young. He couldn't even drive two like episodes ago. Unless we're talking about him disappearing for a looong time, enough for him to grow into a scary man people might actually follow/fear, I have a hard time seeing his story leading anywhere but stupidity, recklessness and death. Unless we're talking about his having like a teenage gang or something, I guess.

We'll see.

[Muffyn]

On ‎9‎/‎26‎/‎2016 at 7:44 AM, nitrofishblue said:

Watching Madison 's face when she was talking to her daughter almost made me barf all over my TV. MAN, is she terrible!!!!!! Her facial expressions range from none to none to none.  She would be better as a zombie.

I'm not sure Madison could sell her desire to eat human flesh if she were a zombie.  She would just hang back looking like the zombie smell offends her. 

[smartymarty]

Quote

and no one is even really scared of these things, which takes all the fun out.

And makes the title of the show, Fear the Walking Dead, meaningless.

[ganesh]

"Wow, I can't imagine there'd be consequences to turning on the hotel light" --no one on this board.

I don't get why they had to shoot the wounded kid when they were leaving Travis behind anyway. 

Quote

Perhaps I misunderstood the intent of the scene, but I thought showing the bros without Chris insinuated that they killed him.  I'm pretty sure he's gone.  That would tie in with Travis' tearful confession.

No, it's typical ham fisted misdirection with this show imo. Because then they'd kill the bros in 2 seconds and plot over. 

Edited October 5, 2016 by ganesh

[spiderpig]

I have given this show more chances than any other in the history of television.  I had some unwatched eps on the DVR and decided to force-march my way through them.

Not worth the effort.  I'm done.

[The Mighty Peanut]

Ok so I'm binge watching because apparently I forgot the second half of the second season happened. Is...is there any episode I should actually watch? Seriously. I am not trying to be a hater but I have not given a single fuck about anything that has happened so far. Also there are a bunch of new rando beautiful women, and gross, sweaty men who go to the Nick school of hygiene and self-care. 

[Canada]

On ‎2017‎-‎03‎-‎19 at 2:05 PM, The Mighty Peanut said:

Ok so I'm binge watching because apparently I forgot the second half of the second season happened. Is...is there any episode I should actually watch? Seriously. I am not trying to be a hater but I have not given a single fuck about anything that has happened so far. Also there are a bunch of new rando beautiful women, and gross, sweaty men who go to the Nick school of hygiene and self-care. 

None of it is worth watching.  They actually managed to make season 2 worse than season 1, which I didn't think would be possible.  But they did it.

[The Mighty Peanut]

22 hours ago, Canada said:

None of it is worth watching.  They actually managed to make season 2 worse than season 1, which I didn't think would be possible.  But they did it.

Thanks for answering. I can't believe how much this show sucks. The only thing I remotely enjoyed was the pharmacist/junkie relationship. Otherwise it was watching a long, boring drug deal with zombies. I wound up skipping a bunch and going to the finale, which was also a waste of time. TWD on its worst day--and it's had some bad, bad days--is still 100x better.

[Canada]

43 minutes ago, The Mighty Peanut said:

Thanks for answering. I can't believe how much this show sucks. The only thing I remotely enjoyed was the pharmacist/junkie relationship. Otherwise it was watching a long, boring drug deal with zombies. I wound up skipping a bunch and going to the finale, which was also a waste of time. TWD on its worst day--and it's had some bad, bad days--is still 100x better.

I hear ya.  I desperately wanted to like this show, especially since The Walking Dead has been disappointing me in recent seasons.  But it was just awful.  I watched all of season two, convinced that it would become completely awesome.  Nope, the awesomeness never materialised.  Unless there's a complete overhaul, I can't imagine a season three being any better.

[Gobi]

18 hours ago, Canada said:

I hear ya.  I desperately wanted to like this show, especially since The Walking Dead has been disappointing me in recent seasons.  But it was just awful.  I watched all of season two, convinced that it would become completely awesome.  Nope, the awesomeness never materialised.  Unless there's a complete overhaul, I can't imagine a season three being any better.

Perhaps my biggest problem with the show is that it tends to focus  on the least interesting characters, and kills off the interesting ones.