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Artistic Gymnastics: Stick the Landing!

HartofDixie

By HartofDixie
in 2016 Olympics

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Growsonwalls

Growsonwalls

Just got home from work. Wow beam is truly #teamdrama -- no one is immune to bad falls/stumbles. Shocked about Simone but glad the Dutch girl won -- her beam routine was so beautiful. Her calculating scores in her notebook was adorable.

As for Bela they panned to him in the stands. He looked so thin and dare I say it ... not all there. They quickly panned away. It wasn't the screaming Bela in the stands at all anymore. 

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GreyBunny
GreyBunny

Gabby has worked her ass off for years, has been a proud member of the US team, and is a great role model for young kids who are up and coming. To say that her not putting her hand over her heart nega

KBrownie
KBrownie

It's not about being "PC" as you put it.  He literally tried to erase her parents from her life to fit whatever narrative he has in his head about what family means.  It's not some trite quibble over

walnutqueen
walnutqueen

Protocol is not law, and has nothing to do with being an American.  Fortunately, Americans live in a free country where they have the right to disagree with your sentiments and still be Americans (and

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Daisy

Daisy

Just now, Growsonwalls said:

Just got home from work. Wow beam is truly #teamdrama -- no one is immune to bad falls/stumbles. Shocked about Simone but glad the Dutch girl won -- her beam routine was so beautiful. Her calculating scores in her notebook was adorable.

As for Bela they panned to him in the stands. He looked so thin and dare I say it ... not all there. They quickly panned away. It wasn't the screaming Bela in the stands at all anymore. 

I remember seeing Bela during the team final... I was stunned. It wasn't the "Keri, listen to me, YOU CAN DO EEIT!" Bela i remembered. 

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PepSinger

PepSinger

(edited)
41 minutes ago, Daisy said:

If your hands touch the ground on vault - it's 1 point off. 
if you fall off bars - its one point off. 
if your hands touch the ground on floor - it's one point off. 
The beam itself is the floor. Ergo - if you touch it. it's .5 off (if not a point)
If you fall off it's a full point

Why is it bull? Hasn't this been in place for at least 20+ years?  You're not supposed to use the ground (or the beam) to aid in support/balance, if you do it's a very harsh deduction. 

Well, that's not the way the announcers made it seem. They said that touching the beam is equal to a fall. If my interpretation is wrong, I blame it on them because that's exactly what they said.

Edited by PepSinger
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windsprints

windsprints

7 minutes ago, PepSinger said:

Well, that's not the way the announcers made it seem. They said that touching the beam is equal to a fall. If my interpretation is wrong, I blame it on them because that's exactly what they said.

That's what I heard as well, that its a 1 point, not .5, deduction and considered a fall. 

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maraleia

maraleia

1 hour ago, AuntieDiane6 said:

Disagree.  The men have a democratic committee (12 minutes to choose a team!) and you saw how that turned out.  

Pleasing Marta is no different than soldiers following their leader into battle or students trying to impress a brilliant but notably tough teacher.  Marta raised the bar for women's gymnastics.  Love her or hate her, but she gave these young women a focus.  Marta is no different than Simon Cowell.  No other judge's opinion matters.

And now the Olympic gymnastics committee is $200 richer.  (To prevent frivolous inquiries, a team is charged $100 for every inquiry request.  If the requester wins, they get their money back.)

I read on twitter that it's actually $300 an inquiry.

DawnDavenport

DawnDavenport

59 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

Exactly the men's system relies on numbers from competitions (trials/nationals). While Martha's system goes by current/performances. 

Right. Part of the selection for the lineups is done after trials in the training camps and prep leading up to the events. If you based everything just on scores and performances Nationals and Trials, and ignore the 2-3 weeks after, then you're at a disadvantage. You don't wan to peak your athletes at Trials and have them spent and unfocused when it really counts. I think the last time the lineups were determined entirely by Trials and Nationals scores was the '96 team. Of the seven gymnasts, they took the top 7 scorers from Nats and Trials (Miller and Moceanu used Nats scores for Trials) and the lowest score sat out that event: Chow on Beam and Floor, Borden on Bars and Vault. But that was a different time when compulsories were so important that they counted them 60% at both competitions so that weak compulsory but strong optionals gymnasts couldn't make the team. Of course the team total was determine by compulsory+optionals so the teams had be strong in both. Of course this paid off since the US paid attention to the compulsory routines and make sure they were at or near the top in terms of quality.

The Men haven't seemed to move past that mindset even though they did take Rothelisberger over Jamie Natalie in '00 and that created quite a bit of controversy so they stuck with the top qualifiers and don't seem to make adjustments unless there is an injury. This essentially ensure the men are required to peak too soon and don't have anything in the tank by the time the Olympics roll aroud.

AuntieDiane6

AuntieDiane6

(edited)
Quote

Martha said  she was retiring after the London Olympics. Instead they put Rybacki in charge of elite programs and Valeri in charge of development. So Martha could focus on the national team.

I've heard she may go back and help Romania get back on its competitive feet.

Quote

As for Bela they panned to him in the stands. He looked so thin and dare I say it ... not all there. They quickly panned away. It wasn't the screaming Bela in the stands at all anymore. 

Aw, gee.  I hate to think of him being sick or having Alzheimer's.  You'd think though that they couldn't keep THAT a secret...  On the other hand, it would explain why he's not doing any interviews now, especially since he's in Rio. I never knew him to avoid a camera.

Edited by AuntieDiane6
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Growsonwalls

Growsonwalls

3 minutes ago, AuntieDiane6 said:

I've heard she may go back and help Romania get back on its competitive feet.

Aw, gee.  I hate to think of him being sick or having Alzheimer's.  You'd think though that they couldn't keep THAT a secret...  On the other hand, it would explain why he's not doing any interviews now, especially since he's in Rio. I never knew him to avoid a camera.

Well it was the team final and he looked completely lost. But I haven't really seen any pictures or interviews with him, and he used to always do a hilarious schtick with Bob Costas where he'd go crazy in the studio while watching routines. None of that this year. He looked rather infirm. This could be why Marta's retiring and her tears after the team final. If all is not well at home then I could see why she's just retiring and emotional about it.

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Daisy

Daisy

45 minutes ago, PepSinger said:

Well, that's not the way the announcers made it seem. They said that touching the beam is equal to a fall. If my interpretation is wrong, I blame it on them because that's exactly what they said.

 

36 minutes ago, windsprints said:

That's what I heard as well, that its a 1 point, not .5, deduction and considered a fall. 


That's what I heard too - that's what the Canadian person said anyway. I know before it used to be .5  either way, it has always been a major major ding. for me - considering what the rules/conceptions of the beam is - which is you treat the beam like the floor - and if you touch the floor in 3 out of 4 events, it's a massive deduction then touching the beam is the same. that's why sometimes you see them grabbing their ankles (which is still a massive deduction as well). 

choclatechip45

choclatechip45

(edited)
Quote

Right. Part of the selection for the lineups is done after trials in the training camps and prep leading up to the events. If you based everything just on scores and performances Nationals and Trials, and ignore the 2-3 weeks after, then you're at a disadvantage. You don't wan to peak your athletes at Trials and have them spent and unfocused when it really counts. I think the last time the lineups were determined entirely by Trials and Nationals scores was the '96 team. Of the seven gymnasts, they took the top 7 scorers from Nats and Trials (Miller and Moceanu used Nats scores for Trials) and the lowest score sat out that event: Chow on Beam and Floor, Borden on Bars and Vault. But that was a different time when compulsories were so important that they counted them 60% at both competitions so that weak compulsory but strong optionals gymnasts couldn't make the team. Of course the team total was determine by compulsory+optionals so the teams had be strong in both. Of course this paid off since the US paid attention to the compulsory routines and make sure they were at or near the top in terms of quality.

The Men haven't seemed to move past that mindset even though they did take Rothelisberger over Jamie Natalie in '00 and that created quite a bit of controversy so they stuck with the top qualifiers and don't seem to make adjustments unless there is an injury. This essentially ensure the men are required to peak too soon and don't have anything in the tank by the time the Olympics roll aroud.

I agree. In '08 Chelsie and Sam Peszek were in top form at trials and they both were injured by the time the games came around. Bridget came in 7th I believe did well at camp and did a good job. The only person who seems to do well peaking at trials/nationals is Aly. I do think it is better that they choose the Olympic team at trials now. Too many unnecessary injuries were happening in '04 and '08. We really should have won the gold in '04.

Quote

I've heard she may go back and help Romania get back on its competitive feet.

Bela said Martha was going to visit family in Romania for awhile. I think everyone myself included thought  would not be surprised if she ends up helping them.

Quote

Aw, gee.  I hate to think of him being sick or having Alzheimer's.  You'd think though that they couldn't keep THAT a secret...  On the other hand, it would explain why he's not doing any interviews now, especially since he's in Rio. I never knew him to avoid a camera.

Quote

Well it was the team final and he looked completely lost. But I haven't really seen any pictures or interviews with him, and he used to always do a hilarious schtick with Bob Costas where he'd go crazy in the studio while watching routines. None of that this year. He looked rather infirm. This could be why Marta's retiring and her tears after the team final. If all is not well at home then I could see why she's just retiring and emotional about it.

He's been doing Facebook Live interviews with Sam Peszek. I thought he was keeping a low profile because he publicly criticized Martha for Jordyn's lineup positions and why she didn't make AA in 2012. From what I remember Bela kept saying going into the Olympics Jordyn would beat Gabby in the AA.

Great article about Aimee and Simone http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/international/ct-simone-biles-coach-aimee-boorman-olympics-spt-0815-20160814-story.html?utm_content=buffer122ad&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Hopefully Gabby really does feel better

Edited by choclatechip45
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Crs97

Crs97

When I saw Bela onscreen, he looked thin and not focused, but someone said something to him and he started to smile as the camera pulled away.  I am hoping they caught him at a pensive moment.  I thought someone said earlier in an interview that he is happy on the ranch with his chickens and retired from gymnastics.

An earlier poster said something about Martha's mistakes in choosing the team.  Did I misread the post, or could they explain the mistake?  Because I don't see a wrong choice regarding this Olympics and these five.

Growsonwalls

Growsonwalls

3 minutes ago, Crs97 said:

When I saw Bela onscreen, he looked thin and not focused, but someone said something to him and he started to smile as the camera pulled away.  I am hoping they caught him at a pensive moment.  I thought someone said earlier in an interview that he is happy on the ranch with his chickens and retired from gymnastics.

An earlier poster said something about Martha's mistakes in choosing the team.  Did I misread the post, or could they explain the mistake?  Because I don't see a wrong choice regarding this Olympics and these five.

I didn't say it was a mistake. But that in the gym interwebs there were a lot of criticisms directed at Gabby first for being picked and then being slated to do All-Arounds over Laurie. One of the girls (Makayla Skinner) even retweeted an extremely offensive racist photo of Gabby after she (Makayla) wasn't picked for the team. Laurie's coach also made it clear she wasn't happy with the decision. But I was saying all those decisions were Marta's and not Gabby's, so it's unfair that so much anger was redirected at her from the tiny world of elite gymnastics and then from the hardcore fans. 

I think a lot of it is sexism. Last night after Usain Bolt won the race I saw that other racers congratulated him but a clearly devastated Yohan Blake quietly walked off the field. I'm sure if the camera was focused on Blake he wouldn't have been a smiley person either. Later on Blake tweeted some very gracious things. I think he needed a moment to collect himself. Gabby has been gracious on twitter too. I just think she's not a Kodak moment person. 

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choclatechip45

choclatechip45

Quote

An earlier poster said something about Martha's mistakes in choosing the team.  Did I misread the post, or could they explain the mistake?  Because I don't see a wrong choice regarding this Olympics and these five.

I said I think it is unfair that Gabby is getting all the hate for her being on the team. I think NBC made her out to be a villain during trials which I don't think it is fair to her.  USA Gym hasn't chosen The top 7/6/5 since 1988. The way teams  have been chosen in the past you actually have a better a chance making the team if you get 7th than 4th. This article shows trends in picking worlds team and how #4 is almost never chosen http://olympics.nbcsports.com/2015/09/24/simone-biles-gabby-douglas-aly-raisman-usa-gymnastics-nominative-roster-world-championships/.

I agree I don't see a wrong choice this Olympics.

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fireice13

fireice13

I thought Sanne's beam was gorgeous and her beautiful leo made it look even classier. I liked what Kupets said about making the Code of Points work for you. She was better with leaps and turns so they made a routine with enough of those to get a high difficulty and she did well with execution giving her that high score. 

I'm happy for Laurie and Simone. I hope Laurie comes back in four years and gets a chance to compete for AA. 

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Dots And Stripes

Dots And Stripes

I didn't see NBC making Gabby the villain. IMO, Nastia and Tim both explained what Gabby brought to the team and were generally supportive of her making the team. Maybe they could have done a little bit of a better job explaining how Gabby did more to help the team than someone like MyKayla, but even disagreeing with the choice doesn't make Gabby a villain. I think it's fine to say someone else would have been a better choice, it's not fine to insinuate Gabby has no talent or is unworthy. For me it's about whether you can make your case respectfully. Unfortunately, some in the media digging for controversy and online trolls don't need any help creating malicious drama or making arguments that are completely disrespectful. Where Mykayla went wrong was by flagging tweets which implied Gabby wasn't worthy. That was poor sportsmanship and possibly worse given her history of saying unacceptable things.

As for Laurie not making all-around, I fully expect her coach to be unhappy about that. All of those coaches are going to be advocating for their athletes. Four of those coaches had legitimate arguments that their gymnast should be in the all-around but only one was an absolute lock (Simone). Someone was going to be disappointed. Laurie may very well have qualified if given the chance and even medaled. It has to be frustrating. I have massive respect for the way Laurie handled herself in the situation. She admitted she cried but she managed to put it behind her and have an absolute blast at the Olympics competing and supporting her teammates. 

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choclatechip45

choclatechip45

Quote

I didn't see NBC making Gabby the villain. IMO, Nastia and Tim both explained what Gabby brought to the team and were generally supportive of her making the team. Maybe they could have done a little bit of a better job explaining how Gabby did more to help the team than someone like MyKayla, but even disagreeing with the choice doesn't make Gabby a villain. I think it's fine to say someone else would have been a better choice, it's not fine to insinuate Gabby has no talent or is unworthy. For me it's about whether you can make your case respectfully. Unfortunately, some in the media digging for controversy and online trolls don't need any help creating malicious drama or making arguments that are completely disrespectful. Where Mykayla went wrong was by flagging tweets which implied Gabby wasn't worthy. That was poor sportsmanship and possibly worse given her history of saying unacceptable things.

I thought Tim was overly harsh towards Gabby until she hit her bar routine the second night and he realized she would be on the team. I thought they could have done a better job explaining why she would be chosen like they did in 2012 with Nastia. Since everyone knew as long as Nastia hit her bar routines she would have been on the team. Gabby was in the exact same position. I don't remember what Nastia said during trials to be honest so I can't comment on that. I do agree that it shouldn't matter as long as it is done respectfully. I also 100% agree with you on MyKayla it really wouldn't surprised me if USA Gymnastics didn't want her on the team solely based on her past comments.

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windsprints

windsprints

(edited)
Quote

As for Laurie not making all-around, I fully expect her coach to be unhappy about that. All of those coaches are going to be advocating for their athletes. Four of those coaches had legitimate arguments that their gymnast should be in the all-around but only one was an absolute lock (Simone). Someone was going to be disappointed. Laurie may very well have qualified if given the chance and even medaled. It has to be frustrating. I have massive respect for the way Laurie handled herself in the situation. She admitted she cried but she managed to put it behind her and have an absolute blast at the Olympics competing and supporting her teammates. 

Agree 100%. I just spent a few minutes googling to read comments from Laurie's coach and she was frustrated Laurie didn't have the chance to compete but she never placed any blame whatsoever on the gymnasts. I honestly do not see why Laurie's coach is wrong for being upset that Laurie was left out due to rules yet there's been quite a bit of annoyance/frustration that Gabby was left out of the AA due to rules. Seems hypocritical to me.

IMO, the women themselves have handled everything better than the media and everyone around them.  They've been supportive and happy for one another and I genuinely hope that each one of them is finding a way to enjoy the Olympics.

Hopefully the last event for the women will be only about the event and all the extra drama will be set aside. 

Quote

For those of you who liked the Dutch leo's, I found out today that they were all designed by Sanne.

Someone is multi-talented :) Perhaps she can design/market some for all the little girls who will now be trying to become a gymnast like her.

Edited by windsprints
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ExplainItAgain

ExplainItAgain

43 minutes ago, EVS said:

Sorry if this has already been posted, but I found this cute video of Laurie competing on floor when she was younger (8 years old).  I think the video said she was level 4. 

 

http://www.elle.com/culture/news/a38531/baby-laurie-hernandez-floor-routine-video-olympics/

Oh my gosh, that is just the cutest thing. She's adorable. I want to carry her around in my pocket so she can smile and wink at me all day. Haha.

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cesstar

cesstar

What a delightful win for Sanne Wevers! She has such unique and interesting choreography on beam, it's nice to see that style recognised by the judges. And what a boost for the Netherlands gymnastics program! Hernandez and Biles did great too. Hernandez has beautiful form on beam. Looking forward to Biles closing out the meet tomorrow with her electrifying floor routine!

The international media have picked up on the Gabby Douglas story - https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2016/aug/15/gabby-douglas-hounding-american-champion-olympics

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choclatechip45

choclatechip45

This article is interesting article the author writes Gabby started getting upset when the Reporters were asking her “Do you think your Olympics got ruined?” and some other harsh questions

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/olympics/gabby-douglas-shouldnt-have-had-to-account-for-judgements-outside-the-arena/2016/08/15/59a0c0fc-6302-11e6-96c0-37533479f3f5_story.html

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Minneapple

Minneapple

1 hour ago, cesstar said:

The international media have picked up on the Gabby Douglas story - https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2016/aug/15/gabby-douglas-hounding-american-champion-olympics

God, my heart just breaks for her. I sometimes say that the female gymnasts are the strongest competitors out there. They go out there, on their own, with a ton of pressure to perform. They are young women, sometimes teenagers, who are hounded by the press and on social media. And then add in the fact that Gabby is black and that is another whole dimension. 

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“I read certain comments, and I’m like: ‘whoa, whoa, whoa, that is far from me and far from my personality,’” Douglas said. “And people just attacking you and your hair, blah, blah, blah. I mean, did I chose my hair texture? No. And I’m actually grateful, you know, having this hair on my head. Sometimes it’s like: ‘wow!’”

It makes me SO ANGRY. People will claim that they're not being racist when they criticize Gabby's hair, but they are. This is latent racism, casual racism, whatever you want to call it. Gabby's hair was beautiful before and it's beautiful now. The woman has three Olympic gold medals and people are still bagging on her hair. Sometimes I hate humanity.

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Mumbles

Mumbles

Nice shot of Madison, Aly and Gabby lapping for Laurie, I hope Gabby was smiling enough for the trolls. (She was, she looked thrilled for her. And Aly is so less robotic when she's a civilian. She was whooping it up.)

Inspired by the commenters, I just googled Betty Okino's 1992 balance beam routine. Elegant and balletic. Loved Sanne's routine for the same reasons.

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Bewitched

Bewitched

I think for people like me who only watch every four years, it is hard to judge Sanne's routine because it is SO different than anything else we saw.  

It was beautiful and I appreciated that she took skills that she did well and didn't try to force things she couldn't do as well just to get the points (ahem, vault finals).  

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choclatechip45

choclatechip45

(edited)
Quote

Nice shot of Madison, Aly and Gabby lapping for Laurie, I hope Gabby was smiling enough for the trolls. (She was, she looked thrilled for her. And Aly is so less robotic when she's a civilian. She was whooping it up.)

She did get up and quickly sat down! She does look happier today! Natalie said Aly sent her an encouraging text message  which was nice of Aly. Interesting Aly has Gabby's mom number. I think that dispels all the rumors they aren't close. I don't have too many of my friends mothers cell phone numbers in my phone.

Edited by choclatechip45
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choclatechip45

choclatechip45

Quote

Uuuuuuugh Al

"What is that, a DIARY? Is she writing her feelings?"

Nastia: "Actually she's calculating her score."

Al: "Well I'm going to ignore that and call it a DIARY ABOUT FEELINGS, because I am a dismissive pig"

 

That pissed me off so much. If Mikulak did that he would have never made the diary comment! I was happy Nastia defended her. Finally she does something useful!

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Raachel2008

Raachel2008

(edited)
8 hours ago, DawnDavenport said:

Nellie Kim lost the '76 AA to Nadia and is partly responsible for overseeing implementation of the code after '04 that emphasized difficulty over execution and artistry.

I was rewatched Nadia's routine from 76 and, sure, compared to nowdays gymnasts, her routine was not that difficulty, but it was perfectly executed, and the artistry was sublime. 

Personally, I miss the artistry A LOT. I liked Sanne's routine because there was a level of artistry/graciouness there that - for my untrainned eyes - Simone and others didn't have - maybe Flavia. There was a dance like element there that is generally missing from gymnastics - but that is just me.

Simone wasn't booed, but people weren't that enthusiastic and it seemed to me that there was more screaming than appaluse. At least that's what I thought watching on TV.

I feel like I've been watching Ponor execute the same routine for the last 12 years - someone please correct me if I'm wrong. Maybe that is why she was the only Romanian there, because Romanian gymnastics didn't adapt enough?

Edited by Raachel2008
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Growsonwalls

Growsonwalls

1 minute ago, choclatechip45 said:

That pissed me off so much. If Mikulak did that he would have never made the diary comment! I was happy Nastia defended her. Finally she does something useful!

Seriously Al is just reinforcing every stereotype that WAG is some twee beauty pageant. These ladies are all tough athletes. Would he say something similar about Allyson Felix or Serena Williams? "Dear diary, today I had a shitty Olympic competition." It's such a lack of respect for the sport. And I don't get this vibe with ANY other commentators, Tim and Nastia included. They have their quirks but they come across like real fans of the sport. Al honestly sounds like he's getting his rocks off. Ugh. Shut up Al. 

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RedheadZombie

RedheadZombie

What's not to love about the women's gymnastics play by play being performed by a man who's never been on a fricking balance beam, and won his gold over thirty years ago. It's not like there's an actual woman's gymnast available, sitting right there, who won a silver medal on the beam this century.  

Ugh. He talks like he's personally experienced these things while Nastia sits by silently. 

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