S08.E19: Reunion Part 2

Misslindsey · March 28, 2016

I think Kandi is in a bit of a hard spot regarding Apollo. Todd and Apollo were pretty good friends, as were Kandi and Phaedra, so I can see her trying to just be middle of the road with it all. I feel like last season (and it is possible that I am not remembering it well) it was all about if Phaedra was going to take the boys to visit Apollo. She seemed pretty adamant at that time that she was not. I remember thinking at that time that if she was not going to visit Apollo with the boys would she do phone calls, letters, or emails (letters and emails more so when the boys were older) to let Dylan and Aidan have some sort of contact with their father. That never seemed to be discussed. Now this season we see her send cards and accept phone calls from Apollo, but maybe if Phaedra said they will be in contact via phone calls and such that would shut the women up regarding the visiting issue for the time being.

I dread next week with Nene and her opinions.

I do feel like Kenya had every right to get Glen out of the house. He was aggressive. I do think when Kenya jumped in when I believe Tammy was trying to get them to leave is when it all went crazy. So I wasn't wild about her way of handling the whole situation. If Tammy wasn't successful in getting them out Kenya should have asked security, instead of shouting the reasons why Glen had to leave to him. In a way I do think there is a bit of truth to Phaedra saying that Glen did not like her so she got irritated and wanted him gone. Though if Kenya felt threatened and wanted him gone, then that is fine as well. She just mishandled the situation a bit. I do think it did not do her any favors that earlier in the season she tried to kick Shamea off of the boat and now she was trying to kick someone out of the house.

CaughtOnTape · March 28, 2016

Here's my issue with Kenya...and why I make her more responsible for her digs below the belt than I do the other women.

Kenya is one of those people who thinks that because she had a rough childhood that others should automatically take that into account when interacting with her. So if someone doesn't kiss her ass immediately then she's offended by it. She takes off on her victim role and there's no going back from there. But the moment someone mentions her mother or her family problems they are hitting below the belt. She wants understanding and compassion for what she's been through in her life, we all do, but she doesn't want to give that in return. Kenya is the eternal victim. She DID poke the hornet's nest with Glen as she did with Porsha as she does frequently with the other women. Then when she gets her reaction "OH MY GOD DID YOU SEE WHAT HE/SHE/IT DID TO ME!?!! DID YOU SEE THAT!?!? THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR THAT!??!" *pearl clutching* *wipes away non-existent tears*

So no, I don't think what Glen did was ok but yes, I think Kenya provoked it. Those two things can exist. And yes, I think the women did dismiss it because Kenya was the one suggesting he was violent...but I have no sympathy for her on that front because she is quite simply, the girl who cried wolf. They have seen her push buttons to get reactions before, it's just this time, Kenya got more than she bargained for and now no one wants to empathize with her over it. And to be honest, she has only herself to blame for it.

Kenya is a shitty person and not someone I would be friends with. You never know what she's saying about you behind your back. She seems to think she's just the bees knees and never at fault for any situation.

Primetimer · March 28, 2016

Kandi finally has shows signs of life as everyone else winds down for the hiatus.

Read the story

ZaldamoWilder · March 28, 2016

I still can't believe these smart, educated women continue to defend that piece of shit Glen for being violent, even after SEEING THE FOOTAGE.

Child, I can't.

Me either. Wholeheartedly agree with Cynthia and Kandi that the women were dismissive of her concerns because it's her. While I can absolutely agree that after about the fourth or fifth time you've heard Peter cry, that sixth time you ain't likely to believe there's a wolf, even if you can see him. I get it, her credibility is busted. But most people don't have the benefit of their hindsight actually being preserved on tape. Kandi was absolutely right in breaking it down and then holding her hand behind her ear but as I've said, right or no, nobody comes through for a hater. With the exception of Cynthia only recently, she has not demonstrated once having another woman's back so when it comes to her? Baby they are #unbothered. Which is a damn shame. I think one of them should have been big enough to say I know we don't see eye to eye on the regular and that I didn't show my support at the time, but when I watched the footage back, I have to admit you were absolutely right, even if I wasn't feeling your method. I don't know if it was that she was being ignored by him or his lightweight clapback on the boat but whatever we think her motives were, it was clear he was devolving. She did ask Tammy to ask him to leave. Then he started getting crunk with her (Tammy). That's when she was like uh uh, this already too many words for a muffucah who's unnecessarily belligerent, get the fuck out. Tammy and Security were not moving Glen towards the door. I'm sorry to even think this but the bear poke may have been intentional, his demonstration of aggression was all that was required to make sure he got outta there. I don't think anybody anticipated that he would push Tammy to the ground.

I agree with you on Kim. However, Kandi has the cheapest looking weave that I've ever seen. I know that some people lose hair after having a baby, but she has to much money for her hair to look like that.

On a shallow note, I just had a baby 2 weeks ago. The entire pregnancy I was hoping that my nose didn't spread like Kandi's. I wouldn't have minded it spreading, but I have a pointy nose and it wouldn't have been cute.

Girl congratulations!! How you feel? Yeah look I'm with you, I don't really like asymmetrical, I hate *invisible* parts because they're misnamed and that baby doll razac shininess it has screams weaviest weave that ever weaved. She looks amazing when she parts her hair in the middle with a lot of leave out.

it goes to show you that you have to watch what you say because someone will fact-check you. This site did just that with Kenya's claims about her mother in 1993

http://www.eonline.com/news/751773/the-real-housewives-of-atlanta-reunion-part-2-is-kenya-moore-telling-the-truth-about-her-mom

I don't know what to think about what she told Andy, but isn't it possible that both could be true? Patricia calls the day after the pageant to congratulate her but obviously this isn't enough time for People to have gathered her personal information and obtain a quote from anybody. So in theory phone call one happens then People decide to do a story on a historic Miss USA, then they find Patricia and she calls back and says don't tell them anything about me? The thing she allegedly said to Kenya's cousin to tell Kenya is pretty consistent with what has been reported she's said present day - a la leave me alone I'm a private person. p.s. I'm not sure we can refer to her upbringing as an adoption, let alone a closed one. Her paternal family raised her and sporadically exposed her to her maternal family. Patricia's physical and emotional response to that has simply been withdrawal. That isn't closed, that just means your bio mom is an asshole.

TexasGal · March 28, 2016

Peter: I could be in the army and live away from my wife and no one would talk about it.

Ummm....except you're not. But thanks for trying.

I forgot to mention - Ayden was just the cutest. It cracks me up how much Andy loves him but I did have a moments concern when he had Ayden start asking questions lol.

Edited March 28, 2016 by TexasGal

ZaldamoWilder · March 28, 2016

I think Kandi is in a bit of a hard spot regarding Apollo. Todd and Apollo were pretty good friends, as were Kandi and Phaedra, so I can see her trying to just be middle of the road with it all. I feel like last season (and it is possible that I am not remembering it well) it was all about if Phaedra was going to take the boys to visit Apollo. She seemed pretty adamant at that time that she was not. I remember thinking at that time that if she was not going to visit Apollo with the boys would she do phone calls, letters, or emails (letters and emails more so when the boys were older) to let Dylan and Aidan have some sort of contact with their father. That never seemed to be discussed. Now this season we see her send cards and accept phone calls from Apollo, but maybe if Phaedra said they will be in contact via phone calls and such that would shut the women up regarding the visiting issue for the time being.

I dread next week with Nene and her opinions.

I do feel like Kenya had every right to get Glen out of the house. He was aggressive. I do think when Kenya jumped in when I believe Tammy was trying to get them to leave is when it all went crazy. So I wasn't wild about her way of handling the whole situation. If Tammy wasn't successful in getting them out Kenya should have asked security, instead of shouting the reasons why Glen had to leave to him. In a way I do think there is a bit of truth to Phaedra saying that Glen did not like her so she got irritated and wanted him gone. Though if Kenya felt threatened and wanted him gone, then that is fine as well. She just mishandled the situation a bit. I do think it did not do her any favors that earlier in the season she tried to kick Shamea off of the boat and now she was trying to kick someone out of the house.

Forgot to say something about Kandi and her Apollo opinions. We might've discussed it before but Kandi is accustomed to the men in her family being unavailable for various reasons, not the least of which is jail. It's probably colored her experience about how you're "supposed" to react to that. Coupled with how important relationship loyalty is to her in general, there is no way what Phaedra said she intended to do struck her as normal. My problem with any of it is that she should be entitled to an opinion about it at all. The fuck? Wait, you want to go to the trouble of telling me what I should and should not do with MY children about their relationship with their father? Who the hell told you this shit was a democracy? MY kids, MY raggedy ass husband and MY choices, you ain't gotta like it, it doesn't affect you.

Aging Goth · March 28, 2016

Ever since i heard a little more about Kenya's mom and how she is reacting to Kenya I have entertained a theory based on my work at rape crisis centers that Kenya may have been a product of rape. The way Patricia's family protects her and the fact that they also have nothing whatsoever to do with Kenya's father or his family is very telling. Most victims of rape almost always have a serious disconnect with their child that is a product of said rape. It usually culminates in a severe resentment of the child or they may give up the child and not want anything to do with it because it is a constant reminder of such a horrible event in their lives. A lot of traumatized women of rape never want to see the child and it takes a ton of therapy to get them to the point of even acknowledging the child even exists.

When Patricia reached out to Kenya in 1993 it might have been the only time she could get herself to the point that she could connect. but that was completely blown by the bitterness Kenya feels for being "abandoned" not realizing that her mother, even though she cannot face Kenya is actually keeping in touch through her sister. That is probably why Kenya's aunt has been by her side for so long.

WireWrap · March 28, 2016

Me either. Wholeheartedly agree with Cynthia and Kandi that the women were dismissive of her concerns because it's her. While I can absolutely agree that after about the fourth or fifth time you've heard Peter cry, that sixth time you ain't likely to believe there's a wolf, even if you can see him. I get it, her credibility is busted. But most people don't have the benefit of their hindsight actually being preserved on tape. Kandi was absolutely right in breaking it down and then holding her hand behind her ear but as I've said, right or no, nobody comes through for a hater. With the exception of Cynthia only recently, she has not demonstrated once having another woman's back so when it comes to her? Baby they are #unbothered. Which is a damn shame. I think one of them should have been big enough to say I know we don't see eye to eye on the regular and that I didn't show my support at the time, but when I watched the footage back, I have to admit you were absolutely right, even if I wasn't feeling your method. I don't know if it was that she was being ignored by him or his lightweight clapback on the boat but whatever we think her motives were, it was clear he was devolving. She did ask Tammy to ask him to leave. Then he started getting crunk with her (Tammy). That's when she was like uh uh, this already too many words for a muffucah who's unnecessarily belligerent, get the fuck out. Tammy and Security were not moving Glen towards the door. I'm sorry to even think this but the bear poke may have been intentional, his demonstration of aggression was all that was required to make sure he got outta there. I don't think anybody anticipated that he would push Tammy to the ground.

I don't know what to think about what she told Andy, but isn't it possible that both could be true? Patricia calls the day after the pageant to congratulate her but obviously this isn't enough time for People to have gathered her personal information and obtain a quote from anybody. So in theory phone call one happens then People decide to do a story on a historic Miss USA, then they find Patricia and she calls back and says don't tell them anything about me? The thing she allegedly said to Kenya's cousin to tell Kenya is pretty consistent with what has been reported she's said present day - a la leave me alone I'm a private person. p.s. I'm not sure we can refer to her upbringing as an adoption, let alone a closed one. Her paternal family raised her and sporadically exposed her to her maternal family. Patricia's physical and emotional response to that has simply been withdrawal. That isn't closed, that just means your bio mom is an asshole.

Porsha did say just that. She said that after seeing the footage, they all realize that Glen was off his rocker (not her exact words) and that Kenya was right to want him gone but that she disagreed with how Kenya went about it and Kenya insulted her for saying that. Just as much as Kandi/Cynthia say that the others blame Kenya just because it is Kenya, Kenya does the exact same thing to them, be it Porsha, Phaedra, Nene or Kim. According to Kenya, anything that comes out of their mouths is suspect/wrong/nasty.

At this age, Kenya should be mad at her father and Aunt Lori for how things went down when she was a child, not her mother. Patricia didn't want anything to do with Kenya, gave all her parental rights over to the father. It was her father that told her who her mother was at a very young, too young to understand, age and it was Lori that kept forcing Patricia/Kenya in the same room/events together when she knew that the child craved her mothers attention and a sister that didn't want anything to do with her biological child. By now, Kenya should be able to differentiate between a "Mom" and a "birth mother", Patricia was/is her "birth mother", not her "Mom".

ZaldamoWilder · March 28, 2016

Ever since i heard a little more about Kenya's mom and how she is reacting to Kenya I have entertained a theory based on my work at rape crisis centers that Kenya may have been a product of rape. The way Patricia's family protects her and the fact that they also have nothing whatsoever to do with Kenya's father or his family is very telling. Most victims of rape almost always have a serious disconnect with their child that is a product of said rape. It usually culminates in a severe resentment of the child or they may give up the child and not want anything to do with it because it is a constant reminder of such a horrible event in their lives. A lot of traumatized women of rape never want to see the child and it takes a ton of therapy to get them to the point of even acknowledging the child even exists.

When Patricia reached out to Kenya in 1993 it might have been the only time she could get herself to the point that she could connect. but that was completely blown by the bitterness Kenya feels for being "abandoned" not realizing that her mother, even though she cannot face Kenya is actually keeping in touch through her sister. That is probably why Kenya's aunt has been by her side for so long.

Girl I do not doubt your level of experience with women who've been through this. The thing that blows it to high hell for me is that the bolded sentences oppose Patricia's actions of repeatedly going to family functions where she knew Kenya would be. I don't think anyone can deny that if this is what happened it had tragic consequences for both of them. But in your experience, do these women typically avoid everything about it by going towards it?

bosawks · March 28, 2016

Someone should explain to Porsha that the believability factor of even the worst waitress in the world forfeiting pay in favor of Peter's dick is exactly zero.......

drivethroo · March 28, 2016

Kenya has zero credibility with this group and always will. She's instigated and escalated situations too many times for her to be believed.

From Porsha, Sheree & Phaedra's perspective that night, they were having a good time with Glen, he wasn't acting crunk or turnt up around them enough to be bothered, Kenya tried to engage him, Kenya got shut down, all of a sudden Kenya wants him thrown out.

From Kim & Kandi's perspective that night, they were sitting minding their business when this dude doesn't get the reaction he liked & got aggressive with a pregnant woman for no reason. They told Kenya their concerns & she wanted him thrown out.

Porsha said looking back at the footage, she agrees he had to go. But when you are dealing with someone who is known for instigating and escalating situations & who was fine with the person she wanted thrown out until she didn't get the reaction she wanted...yeah, they're gonna be skeptical of Kenya & her motivations.

So yeah, if Glen had gotten crunk on anyone else that night, they would've been believed because they wouldn't have had the same history of instigation and escalation that Kenya has.

ZaldamoWilder · March 28, 2016

Porsha did say just that. She said that after seeing the footage, they all realize that Glen was off his rocker (not her exact words) and that Kenya was right to want him gone but that she disagreed with how Kenya went about it and Kenya insulted her for saying that. Just as much as Kandi/Cynthia say that the others blame Kenya just because it is Kenya, Kenya does the exact same thing to them, be it Porsha, Phaedra, Nene or Kim. According to Kenya, anything that comes out of their mouths is suspect/wrong/nasty.

Ya'll can tell me if I'm quibbling lol. She did say that but without validating Kenya's feelings if that makes sense. "Yeah he was more aggressive than I thought at first" is not the same as I'm sorry for doubting what you said because it was you saying it, you're right, that guy was a psycho, I'm glad you got him out of there. When she is right, somebody just needs to take the opportunity to render her speechless by acknowledging that she is.

CaughtOnTape · March 28, 2016

Me either. Wholeheartedly agree with Cynthia and Kandi that the women were dismissive of her concerns because it's her. While I can absolutely agree that after about the fourth or fifth time you've heard Peter cry, that sixth time you ain't likely to believe there's a wolf, even if you can see him. I get it, her credibility is busted. But most people don't have the benefit of their hindsight actually being preserved on tape. Kandi was absolutely right in breaking it down and then holding her hand behind her ear but as I've said, right or no, nobody comes through for a hater. With the exception of Cynthia only recently, she has not demonstrated once having another woman's back so when it comes to her? Baby they are #unbothered. Which is a damn shame. I think one of them should have been big enough to say I know we don't see eye to eye on the regular and that I didn't show my support at the time, but when I watched the footage back, I have to admit you were absolutely right, even if I wasn't feeling your method. I don't know if it was that she was being ignored by him or his lightweight clapback on the boat but whatever we think her motives were, it was clear he was devolving. She did ask Tammy to ask him to leave. Then he started getting crunk with her (Tammy). That's when she was like uh uh, this already too many words for a muffucah who's unnecessarily belligerent, get the fuck out. Tammy and Security were not moving Glen towards the door. I'm sorry to even think this but the bear poke may have been intentional, his demonstration of aggression was all that was required to make sure he got outta there. I don't think anybody anticipated that he would push Tammy to the ground.

Thing is, had one of them done that, Kenya would not have taken a seat and been ok with the fact that she got validated. She would have kept up her assault on whoever said it with her nasty comments about dicks in mouths or someone's convict husband or gay husband. I can see why, when it comes to Kenya at least, there is no "I'm going to be the bigger person" attitude. Kandi and Kenya haven't really ever had an issue that was serious so Kandi can sit over there with her righteous indignation over it all she wants...but she's never had Kenya say anything truly nasty to her.

There is a lot more at play in the situation than JUST the situation. There's history behind how the other women are treating Kenya and to be honest, I don't really blame them.

Kenya gets an apology from someone and she still won't ever let how she was wronged go. She brings up Porsha pulling her down every chance she gets. And yeah, I get it...Porsha was wrong, never should have happened. Shutup about it already.

I wouldn't ever give her the satisfaction of hearing me apologize to her for shit if I was Kim. Phaedra and Porsha, they give as good as they get...fine. But Kim? Hell no.

Aging Goth · March 28, 2016

Girl I do not doubt your level of experience with women who've been through this. The thing that blows it to high hell for me is that the bolded sentences oppose Patricia's actions of repeatedly going to family functions where she knew Kenya would be. I don't think anyone can deny that if this is what happened it had tragic consequences for both of them. But in your experience, do these women typically avoid everything about it by going towards it?

Actually yes they do. My first ever rape case at the crisis center where I worked, a woman was raped by a cop. She was pregnant with a son and she tried to drown him right after she brought him home from the hospital because she could see the policeman's features in his face. More often than not, the women will either get an abortion which at the time was illegal or they would give the child up for adoption. One woman was kicked out of her parent's home because she was raped by her uncle and they blamed her. She threatened to kill the baby she had if the home for unwed mothers didn't put her child up for adoption. She didn't even want to even know the sex of baby.

ZaldamoWilder · March 28, 2016

^^ girl I get it, for real I do. I just honestly feel like, including what we know about Kenya's personality, it's hard (for anybody) to argue with somebody who ain't arguing with you. Maybe I'm being delusional but that woo woo woo I agree, works well with babies and teenagers lol.

Actually yes they do. My first ever rape case at the crisis center where I worked, a woman was raped by a cop. She was pregnant with a son and she tried to drown him right after she brought him home from the hospital because she could see the policeman's features in his face. More often than not, the women will either get an abortion which at the time was illegal or they would give the child up for adoption. One woman was kicked out of her parent's home because she was raped by her uncle and they blamed her. She threatened to kill the baby she had if the home for unwed mothers didn't put her child up for adoption. She didn't even want to even know the sex of baby.

Ok but you're confirming the opposite of my question. It makes perfect sense to avoid everything associated with the rape. It makes no sense to go where you know the baby you don't want is going to be.

AuntiePam · March 28, 2016

Re Kenya and her birth mother: Kenya said (paraphrasing) that she was raised with plenty of love, from her father and the rest of her family. If I remember right, she was defending herself from a comment made by Porsha, or maybe Kim (?) that Kenya's negative behavior/personality is because she was abandoned by her mom. So Kenya -- if you really feel that way, that your upbringing didn't lack for love, let it go. Recognize that your mother's behavior isn't what you want it to be.

Maybe it's relativist of me, but many children don't have what you had -- be thankful that your dad and the rest of your family stepped up.

WireWrap · March 28, 2016

Ya'll can tell me if I'm quibbling lol. She did say that but without validating Kenya's feelings if that makes sense. "Yeah he was more aggressive than I thought at first" is not the same as I'm sorry for doubting what you said because it was you saying it, you're right, that guy was a psycho, I'm glad you got him out of there. When she is right, somebody just needs to take the opportunity to render her speechless by acknowledging that she is.

Andy that asked why the women thought Kenya was "wrong" about wanting Glen to leave and Porsha was just answering his question.

ToukieSmith · March 28, 2016

This. Now I love Porsha... lawd knows I do... but she acts like a bratty defensive teen instead of owning her rage problem. I mean, isn't she like 35? Porsha please grow up - I think you have a lot of potential.

I think she has a lot of potential as well. She is going to run across folks like Kenya all day, every day in the business that she is in so she needs to learn not to react when someone calls her dumb. If she is going to engage verbally sophisticated people in an argument, then she needs to prepare better for the conversation. She started that exchange with Cynthia/Peter and she should have been ready with receipts. She came across as looking unprepared which made her appear to be dumb. No mas. If you want to shed the dumb label, then you need to put a little work into it.

The male protectionism at all costs couple with the lack of protection of black women turns my stomach. It just so lopsided. It always seems to be 'oh won't someone think about all the poor black boys and men' while the girls are left out there dangling and having to fend for themselves and in some instances (like the whole Glen thing) villainized for calling a threatening black man, a threatening black man. When they were running previews of the reunion, I rolled my eyes super duper hard at Matt falling on the sword for Kenya, but now I'm loving and looking forward to it even though he is doing it for the likes of Kenya.

Kandi was the MVP of Part 2. I agreed with her on everything EXCEPT what she had to say about Dylan's lack of a relationship with his father being somehow Phaedra's responsibility. I've felt for a while that Kandi has been somewhat lackadaisical towards Apollo's conviction. Not saying she condoned his actions but she just seemed more understanding and sympathetic of him than she did of Phaedra and obviously Phaedra got the same feeling. This maybe an unpopular opinion but I did think that Kandi failed to show up for BFF duty when Phaedra was going through the most. YMMV.

There are no black men without black women.

I don't think Kandi intended to be in conflict with Phaedra. I think Kandi's world view is to work with the situation at hand. Apollo is going to jail so lets make the best of it kind of approach. Based on her life experience, she does not see anything wrong with the children visiting their father. He was a felon before they were born; he is a felon now. It is what it is and they will have to thrive with that as part of their life history. She expressed her opinion and it differs from Phaedra. I hate that their seemingly genuine friendship is over. I liked them together.

I forgot to mention - Ayden was just the cutest. It cracks me up how much Andy loves him but I did have a moments concern when he had Ayden start asking questions lol.

Those women say such horrible things to each other and the environment is so hostile that I think its inappropriate to bring a child anywhere near that building much less the stage.

WireWrap · March 28, 2016

^^ girl I get it, for real I do. I just honestly feel like, including what we know about Kenya's personality, it's hard (for anybody) to argue with somebody who ain't arguing with you. Maybe I'm being delusional but that woo woo woo I agree, works well with babies and teenagers lol.

Ok but you're confirming the opposite of my question. It makes perfect sense to avoid everything associated with the rape. It makes no sense to go where you know the baby you don't want is going to be.

According to Kenya, herself, most of the time she saw Patricia was at Patricia's parents home, where Patricia was living. Kenya even says that Patricia would stay in her bedroom, away from everyone and Kenya would go into her room to try and talk with her.

And what is up with her revisionist history about her father? She claimed when she first came on the show that she didn't have a good relationship with her father as a child, that she was raised by her Paternal grandparents, not her father. That the 1 time he tried to be a father to her, moving her to Texas with them, she ran away and refused to speak to him for years and years. She needs to stick to 1 story and quit changing it to garner sympathy from the viewers.

ZaldamoWilder · March 28, 2016

Andy that asked why the women thought Kenya was "wrong" about wanting Glen to leave and Porsha was just answering his question.

Again, without really attempting to validate her feelings.

About the hair drag, it isn't that Kenya is incapable of accepting an apology. First of all, Porsha never did apologize, she's allergic to accountability. Kenya apologized to her for provoking her. So in reference to Kenya continuing to pull that out of her ass? Context. She only ever brings that up when Porsha (and in response to Porsha) fixes her mouth to call Kenya on her behavior. That's when her brain goes to wait a minute bitch are you trying to check me about behavior? I'm not the one with a rap sheet. And I can firmly say that I remember not blaming Porsha about the hair pull, but seriously? glass houses.

CaughtOnTape · March 28, 2016

Again, without really attempting to validate her feelings.

About the hair drag, it isn't that Kenya is incapable of accepting an apology. First of all, Porsha never did apologize, she's allergic to accountability. Kenya apologized to her for provoking her. So in reference to Kenya continuing to pull that out of her ass? Context. She only ever brings that up when Porsha (and in response to Porsha) fixes her mouth to call Kenya on her behavior. That's when her brain goes to wait a minute bitch are you trying to check me about behavior? I'm not the one with a rap sheet. And I can firmly say that I remember not blaming Porsha about the hair pull, but seriously? glass houses.

I don't personally think that Kenya's behavior is any better than Porsha's. Granted she's never put her hands on anyone physically, but IMO words hurt a lot more than fists in some cases and Kenya is in a league of her own with the nastiness that comes out of her mouth. She's the only one I've ever actually physically reacted to with a mouth drop when I've heard some of the things she says. I think my problem with it mostly is the fact that she seems to be totally unphased by saying something like that about someone. And she just keeps twisting the knife. She gets this hateful look on her face and she's so damn loud about it so as to make sure that everyone hears what she said. I've never been around someone like that before so it's shocking to me to see her seem to get actual pleasure out of taking someone down like that.

I also don't think her apology to Porsha was genuine, nor do I think her apology to Kim was genuine. So she doesn't get any points from me for simply saying the words.

WireWrap · March 28, 2016

Again, without really attempting to validate her feelings.

About the hair drag, it isn't that Kenya is incapable of accepting an apology. First of all, Porsha never did apologize, she's allergic to accountability. Kenya apologized to her for provoking her. So in reference to Kenya continuing to pull that out of her ass? Context. She only ever brings that up when Porsha (and in response to Porsha) fixes her mouth to call Kenya on her behavior. That's when her brain goes to wait a minute bitch are you trying to check me about behavior? I'm not the one with a rap sheet. And I can firmly say that I remember not blaming Porsha about the hair pull, but seriously? glass houses.

I think she did "validate" Kenya's feelings and explained why she still thinks Kenya did something wrong at the same time. These 2 are never going to "validate" anything about the other except that they believe the other is wrong.

Porsha was wrong, wrong, wrong, to lay hands on Kenya, or anyone, in anger. And, Yes, Porsha never did apologize to Kenya (she was wrong not to) and Kenya did a generalized, weak, "I am sorry for my part in it" (she never acknowledged exactly what she thought she did that was wrong) to Porsha. Neither of these 2 women will ever acknowledge anything good about the other, ever. They will always look for the negative in anything the other says or does at this point.

Aging Goth · March 28, 2016

Ok but you're confirming the opposite of my question. It makes perfect sense to avoid everything associated with the rape. It makes no sense to go where you know the baby you don't want is going to be.

According to Kenya, Patricia was ready to give her up for adoption when the paternal grandmother intervened and begged her to let her raise Kenya. She agreed only if she had absolutely nothing to do with the child. It didn't matter if she was close by, it was probably even more traumatic but that was her daughter and what better way to know that she grew up with someone who could love her than to be sent away to strangers. If you look at it differently, she may love Kenya but mentally could not and still cannot handle seeing her. However, she would always know how Kenya was doing even though she wasn't face to face with her.

Edited March 28, 2016 by Aging Goth

Ubiquitous · March 28, 2016

I forgot to mention - Ayden was just the cutest. It cracks me up how much Andy loves him but I did have a moments concern when he had Ayden start asking questions lol.

Ayden's a cute kid, but the whole thing reeks of Phaedra trying to be manipulative. I find it hard to believe he just happened to drop by wherever they were filming the reunion. I also find Phaedra spouting off about "our endangered black sons" strange after she had no problems with Glenn and his thuggish friend in Miami.

mothmonsterman · March 28, 2016

To me Cynthia looks so tired since she married Peter. It is like he literally is sucking the life out of her.

ZaldamoWilder · March 28, 2016

According to Kenya, herself, most of the time she saw Patricia was at Patricia's parents home, where Patricia was living. Kenya even says that Patricia would stay in her bedroom, away from everyone and Kenya would go into her room to try and talk with her.

And what is up with her revisionist history about her father? She claimed when she first came on the show that she didn't have a good relationship with her father as a child, that she was raised by her Paternal grandparents, not her father. That the 1 time he tried to be a father to her, moving her to Texas with them, she ran away and refused to speak to him for years and years. She needs to stick to 1 story and quit changing it to garner sympathy from the viewers.

In addition, she says she saw her mother at family functions. Where the events took place didn't preclude Patricia from leaving. Also an assertion that none of Patricia's relatives deny. I know we did this when the episode first aired so I don't take you back through my original position which was that to physically deny a child is (from what I remember from psych 101) a passive aggressive method called withdrawal of affection. Ya'll are right, Patricia wasn't required to do anything, I simply maintain that doing that particular thing makes her a monster (to me). A monster who could also be a rape victim.

I don't think it is revisionist. They didn't get along when she was young because he wasn't forthcoming about the circumstances of her childhood. He tried to get all his kids under one roof and she ran away because her school, house, friends, none of it was familiar to a child of 14 years old who'd already spent the first 13 years with his mother. She didn't refuse to talk to him, she reached out to him for years thereafter. It was he who refused to talk to her. The repair of the relationship include him saying how hurt he was by her rejection so when she says she knew her father loved her, I don't doubt that and I don't doubt he did but this girl was screwed royally by her parents and I don't want to rob her of that acknowledgement just because she's an asshole too. She came by it honestly.

I don't personally think that Kenya's behavior is any better than Porsha's. Granted she's never put her hands on anyone physically, but IMO words hurt a lot more than fists in some cases and Kenya is in a league of her own with the nastiness that comes out of her mouth. She's the only one I've ever actually physically reacted to with a mouth drop when I've heard some of the things she says. I think my problem with it mostly is the fact that she seems to be totally unphased by saying something like that about someone. And she just keeps twisting the knife. She gets this hateful look on her face and she's so damn loud about it so as to make sure that everyone hears what she said. I've never been around someone like that before so it's shocking to me to see her seem to get actual pleasure out of taking someone down like that.

I also don't think her apology to Porsha was genuine, nor do I think her apology to Kim was genuine. So she doesn't get any points from me for simply saying the words.

Well, lol. We used up a lot of mileage debating this one for a while too. The essential difference here would be Kenya didn't owe one to Porsha.

Ironically, I don't disagree with you, the point I'm making about Porsha is that of all the people to try and get Kenya together behaviorally? She is the last mofo qualified to talk to her.

Yours Truly · March 28, 2016

Glen was wrong no doubt. The women only giving an inch in hindsight because it's Kenya is spot on.

But here's the deal. I'm in Kim's camp about hornets nests. Look pointing out that Kenya's messy ways is dangerous doesn't mean that Glen wasn't wrong. I absolutely hate it when someone counts on the grace of what's right in order to act how they please. Was Glenn wrong? Absolutely! Does that justify Kenya ignoring the dangerous uncertainties of the situation and bringing the drama for more effect therefore possibly creating a MORE volitale environment that ALL of the women are subjected to because she feels like it and because he isn't SUPPOSED TO knock her or anyone else on their ass?

I think about people in mall parking lots, walking out of the store and directly into the street where cars are driving and looking for spots. Don't care just step right out in front of a car. I get pissed and bark in my car, "now when I run ya ass down it won't feel good" and my man always says to me "ummmm, but they have right of way". Okay true but does the concept of "right of way" make me hitting them with my car any less painful? Does it become a physical force that hits my brakes just in time not to hit them? No it doesn't so yes technically I'm not "supposed" to hit them with my car but what happens if I'm just an incompetent driver? YOUR ASS GETS HURT because you wanna fall back on what SHOULDN'T happen instead of what CAN happen and then be reckless about it. Duh, that's the stupidest shit I've ever heard. I KNOW a car shouldn't hit me but does that mean I jump in front of one that's headed right for me while I'm holding my son's hand? Shit I see this shit all the time and they be having stank looks on they faces too. "You better fucking stop" looks. Okay but what would have happened if in that moment I was reaching over to get something from the glove compartment or turned my head to look and see if a spots opened up? It's just recklessness based off of the theory that cars are supposed to let me cross no matter what. Got it, but ya might want to also take some caution your damn self cause ya never fucking know and why oh why would you hand over your own safety and that of your child to some stranger in a car anyway? Dumbass. Better safe than sorry. Oldie but goodie and a good rule of thumb. Simple. That's what Kenya's actions remind me off. Because someone shouldn't TECHNICALLY do something she be acting reckless as fuck and right or wrong won't change a black eye. Sure she can file charges and all that jazz but I for one don't think thats a good consilation for an ass whooping. I'd rather just not have the ass whooping and make sure I'm not setting myself up for one cause right or wrong they do happen when you act out. Just sayin'

This is the only place where I'm annoyed by Kenya in this situation. And in others. You can't COUNT on what shouldn't happen. You have to behave in a manner taking into account what CAN happen. Because she ignores this way of reasoning she's dangerous and I know I would be pissed if someone is constantly escalating situations with straight arrogant disregard to possible negative outcomes. Kenya isn't stupid. Just by her stank look on her face she knows that she's provoking and whether or not it's wrong for someone to take the bait is neither here nor there when fists are flying and innocent bystanders are at risk for physical harm. It's the overall disregard she has about what she's possibly setting the stage for. You can't completely absolve her in that respect.

To me it's like that annoying thing siblings do to each other. One puts there finger close to the other while chanting and taunting "but I'm not touching you, I'm not touching you". Yes people shouldn't put their hands on anyone else but if it does happen that doesn't mean the other party is all of a sudden absolutely right in their own behavior. I personally don't feel that Kenya actually meant to create such a scene but it's her lack of restraint, good sense and need to be extra nasty that creates bad things to happen. She shouldn't get a pass on such disrespectful and antagonistic behavior just because she technically doesn't throw the first punch. I mean she still oversteps boundaries by leaps and bounds. That's what I feel is the position of Kim anyway. Porsha and Phaedra are more hesistate to be in agreement but Porsha did acknowledge that what Glen did was bad so that's something.

I would take offense that Kenya constantly behaves in ways that could make my immediate environment more dangerous than it needs to be and that is something that I would have no tolerance for. I would definitely tell her about herself.

Edited March 28, 2016 by Yours Truly

ZaldamoWilder · March 28, 2016

According to Kenya, Patricia was ready to give her up for adoption when the paternal grandmother intervened and begged her to let her raise Kenya. She agreed only if she had absolutely nothing to do with the child. It didn't matter if she was close by, it was probably even more traumatic but that was her daughter and what better way to know that she grew up with someone who could love her than to be sent away to strangers. If you look at it differently, she may love Kenya but mentally could not and still cannot handle seeing her. However, she would always know how Kenya was doing even though she wasn't face to face with her.

Thanks for painting it in a new perspective. My problem is that I don't look at it differently but I guess I could try.

Queena · March 28, 2016

Me either. Wholeheartedly agree with Cynthia and Kandi that the women were dismissive of her concerns because it's her. While I can absolutely agree that after about the fourth or fifth time you've heard Peter cry, that sixth time you ain't likely to believe there's a wolf, even if you can see him. I get it, her credibility is busted. But most people don't have the benefit of their hindsight actually being preserved on tape. Kandi was absolutely right in breaking it down and then holding her hand behind her ear but as I've said, right or no, nobody comes through for a hater. With the exception of Cynthia only recently, she has not demonstrated once having another woman's back so when it comes to her? Baby they are #unbothered. Which is a damn shame. I think one of them should have been big enough to say I know we don't see eye to eye on the regular and that I didn't show my support at the time, but when I watched the footage back, I have to admit you were absolutely right, even if I wasn't feeling your method. I don't know if it was that she was being ignored by him or his lightweight clapback on the boat but whatever we think her motives were, it was clear he was devolving. She did ask Tammy to ask him to leave. Then he started getting crunk with her (Tammy). That's when she was like uh uh, this already too many words for a muffucah who's unnecessarily belligerent, get the fuck out. Tammy and Security were not moving Glen towards the door. I'm sorry to even think this but the bear poke may have been intentional, his demonstration of aggression was all that was required to make sure he got outta there. I don't think anybody anticipated that he would push Tammy to the ground.

Girl congratulations!! How you feel? Yeah look I'm with you, I don't really like asymmetrical, I hate *invisible* parts because they're misnamed and that baby doll razac shininess it has screams weaviest weave that ever weaved. She looks amazing when she parts her hair in the middle with a lot of leave out.

I don't know what to think about what she told Andy, but isn't it possible that both could be true? Patricia calls the day after the pageant to congratulate her but obviously this isn't enough time for People to have gathered her personal information and obtain a quote from anybody. So in theory phone call one happens then People decide to do a story on a historic Miss USA, then they find Patricia and she calls back and says don't tell them anything about me? The thing she allegedly said to Kenya's cousin to tell Kenya is pretty consistent with what has been reported she's said present day - a la leave me alone I'm a private person. p.s. I'm not sure we can refer to her upbringing as an adoption, let alone a closed one. Her paternal family raised her and sporadically exposed her to her maternal family. Patricia's physical and emotional response to that has simply been withdrawal. That isn't closed, that just means your bio mom is an asshole.

Thank you! I feel great!

I agree with you on invisible parts, and Kandi's hair looking like doll hair. She can afford the best of the best hair.. Her hair looks as if she went to Pookie's auntie shop, because she missed her appointment with her regular stylist. I saw Good Hair by Chris Rock, so I know that there are people (Ms. J?? He used to be on ROHOA as a friend) who can slay some hair...and they can keep it natural.

I really don't like Kenya, but my heart goes out to her. I don't know the situation with her Mom. Maybe it was post partum depression, or maybe she never wanted kids. I don't think that I could reject my child in such a way. I hope that they're able to establish a relationship one day. I think that would heal a lot of hurt that Kenya feels.

sasha206 · March 28, 2016

I still can't believe these smart, educated women continue to defend that piece of shit Glen for being violent, even after SEEING THE FOOTAGE.

Child, I can't.

I can't either. It really disgusts me particularly when Phaedra shares her concern about the violent stereotype. Maybe you're part of the problem making excuses for a violent asshole?

Yours Truly · March 28, 2016

I don't think Kandi intended to be in conflict with Phaedra. I think Kandi's world view is to work with the situation at hand. Apollo is going to jail so lets make the best of it kind of approach. Based on her life experience, she does not see anything wrong with the children visiting their father. He was a felon before they were born; he is a felon now. It is what it is and they will have to thrive with that as part of their life history. She expressed her opinion and it differs from Phaedra. I hate that their seemingly genuine friendship is over. I liked them together.

I do understand Phaedra's reservations about taking them to see Apollo that's all well and good too but to act like people weren't supposed to have any opinions or thoughts about it is just all kinds of overboard. Kandi was her close friend at the time and Kandi grew up with personal experiences regarding this type of situation so she's just pointing out that it isn't impossible to keep the boys in touch. I don't think she was browbeating Phaedra just that she felt strongly about the boys having a relationship with their father and that Apollo being in jail isn't an obstacle that's impossible to overcome. That was Kandi's position. If Phaedra decides the opposite then there you have it but to act like Kandi was screaming from the roof tops that in no way shape or form should Phaedra be allowed to keep those kids away from their pops is ridiculous. She had an opinion and she shared it with a personal edge to it since she has experience with it. That's all she did.

Aging Goth · March 28, 2016

I do understand Phaedra's reservations about taking them to see Apollo that's all well and good too but to act like people weren't supposed to have any opinions or thoughts about it is just all kinds of overboard. Kandi was her close friend at the time and Kandi grew up with personal experiences regarding this type of situation so she's just pointing out that it isn't impossible to keep the boys in touch. I don't think she was browbeating Phaedra just that she felt strongly about the boys having a relationship with their father and that Apollo being in jail isn't an obstacle that's impossible to overcome. That was Kandi's position. If Phaedra decides the opposite then there you have it but to act like Kandi was screaming from the roof tops that in no way shape or form should Phaedra be allowed to keep those kids away from their pops is ridiculous. She had an opinion and she shared it with a personal edge to it since she has experience with it. That's all she did.

Actually it was a bit of a browbeating of sort. The last time Phaedra was over Kandi's house when they were allegedly on good terms, Kandi invited her cousin over to explain to Phaedra why is would be a good thing to have the kids see their father in prison. However, the fail was even though the cousin was grateful for seeing his father, he too entered a life of crime and ended up in jail. It was like Kandi was trying to do an intervention on Phaedra. After that, Phaedra simply stopped communicating with Kandi as Kandi was most unwilling to even hear Phaedra's point of view.

ZaldamoWilder · March 28, 2016

I do understand Phaedra's reservations about taking them to see Apollo that's all well and good too but to act like people weren't supposed to have any opinions or thoughts about it is just all kinds of overboard. Kandi was her close friend at the time and Kandi grew up with personal experiences regarding this type of situation so she's just pointing out that it isn't impossible to keep the boys in touch. I don't think she was browbeating Phaedra just that she felt strongly about the boys having a relationship with their father and that Apollo being in jail isn't an obstacle that's impossible to overcome. That was Kandi's position. If Phaedra decides the opposite then there you have it but to act like Kandi was screaming from the roof tops that in no way shape or form should Phaedra be allowed to keep those kids away from their pops is ridiculous. She had an opinion and she shared it with a personal edge to it since she has experience with it. That's all she did.

She tried to make it sound like all she was doing was giving her opinion. I think she said something like I'm just saying what I would do in the situation. Great, noted. But Kandi rode too hard and too long and too loyally for Apollo's perspective with that for it to look objective and her specific opinion aside, I can see how Phaedra's reaction would be well shit, if you're my friend there is no need to recruit your cousin louis to talk about how close he is with his father plexiglass be damned. Because at the end of the day? It was up to Louis' mother to decide what was in her son's best interest. Oh and by the way, let's not leave out that exposure to this environment and his family's support of it normalized that Louis now himself has a record. <--- When Phay said that I was like, now drop ya tambourine and sashay out the door because you said that. Kandi should've knocked it off then.

janie2002 · March 28, 2016

The whole Glenn miss is crazy. They could all talk shii about Kenya, if Glenn apologized for making anyone feel uncomfortable and left . Instead he called her a b, bucked up to security and pushed his aunt to the floor where she banged her head pretty hard. Kenya didnt do a disservice to young black men, if anyone did it would be Glenn. Kenya thought he was aggressive but she probably didn't think he would be THAT aggressive. I can see Kims saying dont poke the nest, Im guessing she meant it as dont put yourself in a dangerous situation and act surprised, once Glenn made her feel unsafe she should have just dealt with security. She went further, I'm guessing she thought itd be like when she kicks a woman out and they just leave while cursing her out.

I used to like Kanya but she is so HARD. She is hard to like, hard to laugh at herself hard to stay relevant. Porsha has anger issues so she can sit down trying to lecture anyone on how to act.

CaughtOnTape · March 28, 2016

Well...did Phaedra ever ask for Kandi's opinion on the situation? I don't ever remember seeing it and concerning the fact that she's so sensitive about people giving their unsolicited opinions I can see why Phaedra takes issue with Kandi giving hers.

Kandi being Phaedra's friend doesn't mean she's allowed to give an opinion on the situation because she has it. Kandi has not been supportive of Phaedra through this and in the end, that's the burn Phaedra feels and it is warranted.

ZaldamoWilder · March 28, 2016

The other thing about that whole Glen shit that all of them seem to have trouble remembering is that when he returned with Tammy and they realized who was at the door, all of a sudden everybody was pearl clutchy and skirt gathery. This was hours after Kenya had already gone to sleep. All that jumping up and crouching down nonsense contradicts what they said they believed about him at the time. Unless now hiding from people who aren't scary is a thing all of a sudden.

I don't remember Phaedra asking Kandi for her opinion. Bravo may be holding onto that if it's around. And I think it's natural to tell your girl what you think but once you know how she feels about it and it's not the same as how you feel, go into low battery mode until or unless she asks again. I gotta say this about sides too. I think generally Kandi does try to stay neutral but that's impossible in this situation. There are sides, you're on his or you're on mine. Now the fact that that's one of Todd's friends shouldn't mean more to Kandi than the fact that Phaedra was her friend. She's on the wrong side of history on that one.

Rlb8031 · March 28, 2016

Ever since i heard a little more about Kenya's mom and how she is reacting to Kenya I have entertained a theory based on my work at rape crisis centers that Kenya may have been a product of rape. The way Patricia's family protects her and the fact that they also have nothing whatsoever to do with Kenya's father or his family is very telling. Most victims of rape almost always have a serious disconnect with their child that is a product of said rape. It usually culminates in a severe resentment of the child or they may give up the child and not want anything to do with it because it is a constant reminder of such a horrible event in their lives. A lot of traumatized women of rape never want to see the child and it takes a ton of therapy to get them to the point of even acknowledging the child even exists.

When Patricia reached out to Kenya in 1993 it might have been the only time she could get herself to the point that she could connect. but that was completely blown by the bitterness Kenya feels for being "abandoned" not realizing that her mother, even though she cannot face Kenya is actually keeping in touch through her sister. That is probably why Kenya's aunt has been by her side for so long.

I recall that either Lori or the dad said that the issue was that the maternal grandfather was a minister, of the "y'all ain't bringing illegitimate babies up in here" type. The mother was "the good girl" who had never gotten in trouble and who wanted to maintain that view in her father's eyes. That was why she gave her daughter up without looking back and why she continued to act as if the child had never been born. The impression that I got was that the mother wanted the child to disappear so that she could live down the shame of the pregnancy. The paternal grandparents didn't want the child given to strangers and therefore were able to convince her to let them raise the child. That was also why the mother's family was okay with Lori having a relationship with Kenya that was arms-length, but never moved to the "why don't you come live with us" level. While I think that you may be right from the trauma perspective, that trauma was driven by Patricia's relationship with her parents and their reaction to the pregnancy and not from anything that the father had done to the mother. Kenya's dad may not have been father of the year, but the story as it's been laid out on RH has him as the party who (grudgingly) accepted his role in what happened and the unexpected child that resulted. For all of his immaturity both at the time of her birth, and when she ran away, her Dad has at least acknowledged that some of what transpired between them was because he wasn't adult enough to put his feeling aside and address Kenya's pain. Her mother on the other hand has continued to live in the "if I don't want to acknowledge you, I shouldn't have to" space which has everything to do with her inability to deal with the pregnancy as a whole and the fact that a person walking the earth has resulted from that pregnancy. At least as a rape victim, she could say (and Kenya could understand) "this was just too traumatic to deal with and simply seeing you reminds me of that trauma", but she doesn't have that to fall back on. She is just saying "I choose not to acknowledge you" and expects Kenya to understand why.

Edited March 28, 2016 by Rlb8031

swankie · March 28, 2016

When she is right, somebody just needs to take the opportunity to render her speechless by acknowledging that she is.

Kenya has proven that even if someone did take that opportunity to tell her she was right and apologize, she would still stew and kvetch and leave bitch bites all up and down that person. Case in point, Kim was giving Kenya all kinds of compliments on "Life Twirls On" and instead of Kenya accepting the compliments and actually eeking out a thank you, she still argued and criticized Kim for praising her. People like Kenya don't have it in them to do the normal thing most of us would do if someone was actually trying to be nice to them. She wants to remain in her victim mode and bitch and moan which is the state of mind she's comfortable with. Face it, the child is mentally challenged. I'm going to borrow a nickname for her from the movie "Life" and start calling her "Can't Get Right".

bosawks · March 28, 2016

Kenya has proven that even if someone did take that opportunity to tell her she was right and apologize, she would still stew and kvetch and leave bitch bites all up and down that person. Case in point, Kim was giving Kenya all kinds of compliments on "Life Twirls On" and instead of Kenya accepting the compliments and actually eeking out a thank you, she still argued and criticized Kim for praising her. People like Kenya don't have it in them to do the normal thing most of us would do if someone was actually trying to be nice to them. She wants to remain in her victim mode and bitch and moan which is the state of mind she's comfortable with. Face it, the child is mentally challenged. I'm going to borrow a nickname for her from the movie "Life" and start calling her "Can't Get Right".

I work with the "mentally challenged". Kenya isn't "mentally challenged" she's just a run of the mill bitch.

Yours Truly · March 28, 2016

She tried to make it sound like all she was doing was giving her opinion. I think she said something like I'm just saying what I would do in the situation. Great, noted. But Kandi rode too hard and too long and too loyally for Apollo's perspective with that for it to look objective and her specific opinion aside, I can see how Phaedra's reaction would be well shit, if you're my friend there is no need to recruit your cousin louis to talk about how close he is with his father plexiglass be damned. Because at the end of the day? It was up to Louis' mother to decide what was in her son's best interest. Oh and by the way, let's not leave out that exposure to this environment and his family's support of it normalized that Louis now himself has a record. <--- When Phay said that I was like, now drop ya tambourine and sashay out the door because you said that. Kandi should've knocked it off then.

I don't think there was anything wrong with offering up information so that Phaedra had more information than her own speculations. I mean just because the experiences she offered up weren't ideal they were at least real and personal examples. Obviously none of it is ideal and I think Kandi was coming from a place where just because something isn't all candy and rainbows doesn't mean it's something to completely dismiss. That there are in fact options. Whether or not you like them. I do think Kandi took offense at Phaedra making it seem like its such a cut and dry situation when in all actuality Phaedra obviously made allowances about Apollo when she decided to lay up with him but is now all pearl clutching because she's faced with undesirable circumstances. Phaedra isn't wrong to be protective of her children but to me I think it was her quick dismissiveness over the subject that seemed a bit rash to Kandi. Like another poster said. Trying to make the best of a bad situation isn't such a bad thing. That's where I think Kandi was coming from.

WireWrap · March 28, 2016

I work with the "mentally challenged". Kenya isn't "mentally challenged" she's just a run of the mill bitch.

True, very true. Kenya is smart, intelligent but she is Emotionally "challenged/stunted". The damage has been done and sadly, Kenya refuses to get real help/therapy to heal and that is on her.

Yours Truly · March 28, 2016

The other thing about that whole Glen shit that all of them seem to have trouble remembering is that when he returned with Tammy and they realized who was at the door, all of a sudden everybody was pearl clutchy and skirt gathery. This was hours after Kenya had already gone to sleep. All that jumping up and crouching down nonsense contradicts what they said they believed about him at the time. Unless now hiding from people who aren't scary is a thing all of a sudden.

I don't remember Phaedra asking Kandi for her opinion. Bravo may be holding onto that if it's around. And I think it's natural to tell your girl what you think but once you know how she feels about it and it's not the same as how you feel, go into low battery mode until or unless she asks again. I gotta say this about sides too. I think generally Kandi does try to stay neutral but that's impossible in this situation. There are sides, you're on his or you're on mine. Now the fact that that's one of Todd's friends shouldn't mean more to Kandi than the fact that Phaedra was her friend. She's on the wrong side of history on that one.

Well I got some ride or die girlfriends who have go in on me HARD about sensitive shit so..... I guess this is why I also see where she's coming from with regards to her Kandi Koated clique. Your ride or die peeps don't just clam up cause your feelings are hurt. At least mine don't. If it's about some waaaayyy important shit they gonna let you know regardless. Have I gotten into some ugly back and forths because of this YUP. But there's nothing like knowing that ya'll are THAT ride or die that ya'll can do that with each other. That's how I know Kandi really thought of Phaedra as a real friend. Because she took those liberties with Phaedra. I mean not saying that it isn't you know fragile topic but there are certain things I know I will say to my girl without worrying or let me say not caring about her getting mad. Oh well, bitch you need to hear it. If it turns into "a thing" then sure we'll drop it and soak our butts in some soothing ointments to cover being butthurt over it then keep it moving.

Edited March 28, 2016 by Yours Truly

EmZeeGee · March 28, 2016

Well I came with my stick so I could beat the dead horse too. Regarding the Glen situation, the reason why I can't accept anything less than Glen being at fault and am resistant to these attempts at Zaprudian analysis of what Kenya did is because of the naked attempt to completely invalidate Kenya's feelings and Tammy's hospital visit by Sheree and Phaedra attempting to link this incident to BLM. That's well beyond the pale for me and proves what low behavioral expectations many hold for Black men. He was audibly aggressive, hollering, calling the whole group "bitches," and yet, there's this investigation of Kenya. No ma'am.

"Well Kenya invited him." And she's allowed to tell him to leave. She can't ask him to go if he's out of line? "Well Kenya liked him." And Kenya is allowed to change her mind. "Well Kenya got rejected and wanted him gone." And Kenya being the hostess is permitted to tell him to leave. Why does Kenya need some excuse for him to leave? He has no right to the space. "Kenya should have let security handle it." Should've, could've, would've, but we're here now, so explain Glen's aggression.

Too many equivocations, not enough addressing the rut.

Kenya did not turn this into an act of violence (as Phaedra stated in her blog at the time) Glen did. End of.

WireWrap · March 28, 2016

I don't think there was anything wrong with offering up information so that Phaedra had more information than her own speculations. I mean just because the experiences she offered up weren't ideal they were at least real and personal examples. Obviously none of it is ideal and I think Kandi was coming from a place where just because something isn't all candy and rainbows doesn't mean it's something to completely dismiss. That there are in fact options. Whether or not you like them. I do think Kandi took offense at Phaedra making it seem like its such a cut and dry situation when in all actuality Phaedra obviously made allowances about Apollo when she decided to lay up with him but is now all pearl clutching because she's faced with undesirable circumstances. Phaedra isn't wrong to be protective of her children but to me I think it was her quick dismissiveness over the subject that seemed a bit rash to Kandi. Like another poster said. Trying to make the best of a bad situation isn't such a bad thing. That's where I think Kandi was coming from.

I get the sense, and I could very well be wrong, that Phaedra didn't mind Kandi expressing her opinion initially until she brought in her cousin as an "example" and for him to "talk to/explain things" to Phaedra without making sure that Phaedra was open to hearing him first. It is one thing for friends to express their personal opinions to each other, it is another thing entirely to bring in a stranger to do it. Add to that, that Kandi wasn't really there for Phaedra, despite what Kandi now claims, she took Todd's opinion about Apollo's/Phaedra's marriage over her friend's feelings/opinions about her own marriage.

AuntiePam · March 28, 2016

People like Kenya don't have it in them to do the normal thing most of us would do if someone was actually trying to be nice to them. She wants to remain in her victim mode and bitch and moan which is the state of mind she's comfortable with. Face it, the child is mentally challenged. I'm going to borrow a nickname for her from the movie "Life" and start calling her "Can't Get Right".

Exactly. When she gets some positive attention, she's all "I don't need your approval". She wants to be a strong, independent woman, and seems to think that accepting sympathy and understanding will make people see her as weak and needy. Cuts off her nose to spite her face, she does.

Maybe not "mentally" challenged, but certainly emotionally challenged.

RHJunkie · March 28, 2016

Porsha did say just that. She said that after seeing the footage, they all realize that Glen was off his rocker (not her exact words) and that Kenya was right to want him gone but that she disagreed with how Kenya went about it and Kenya insulted her for saying that. Just as much as Kandi/Cynthia say that the others blame Kenya just because it is Kenya, Kenya does the exact same thing to them, be it Porsha, Phaedra, Nene or Kim. According to Kenya, anything that comes out of their mouths is suspect/wrong/nasty.

Porsha did acknowledge it... very briefly. She spent two seconds mentioning it and then spent 10 minutes explaining why Kenya was partially to blame. Her energy was spent mostly rationalizing Glen's behaviour when she should have spent that energy speaking up against his aggressive behaviour and making it clear that it was in no way acceptable. Kenya deserves a lot of blame for a lot of things but how Kenya blames the other girls for things is not the same as them trying to find blame for something as serious as instigating male aggression and violence.

When Kandi told Phaedra 'you chose him' I didn't see it as her placing any blame on Phaedra for Apollo's action. I think what she meant was that Phaedra knew the man she married and that the kids shouldn't miss out on the opportunity to know their father because of decisions that either of their parents make. I can't remember the context of Kandi's advice to Phaedra. If Phaedra was talking about her situation and Kandi shared her opinion then I think that's fine. If Kandi brought it up completely on her own, then I think she's out of line for sharing her opinions about Phaedra's situation without any context.

Edited March 28, 2016 by RHJunkie

ZaldamoWilder · March 28, 2016

I recall that either Lori or the dad said that the issue was that the maternal grandfather was a minister, of the "y'all ain't bringing illegitimate babies up in here" type. The mother was "the good girl" who had never gotten in trouble and who wanted to maintain that view in her father's eyes. That was why she gave her daughter up without looking back and why she continued to act as if the child had never been born. The impression that I got was that the mother wanted the child to disappear so that she could live down the shame of the pregnancy. The paternal grandparents didn't want the child given to strangers and therefore were able to convince her to let them raise the child. That was also why the mother's family was okay with Lori having a relationship with Kenya that was arms-length, but never moved to the "why don't you come live with us" level. While I think that you may be right from the trauma perspective, that trauma was driven by Patricia's relationship with her parents and their reaction to the pregnancy and not from anything that the father had done to the mother. Her dad may not have been father of the year, but the story as it's been laid out on RH has him as the party who (grudgingly) accepted his role in what happened and the unexpected child that resulted. For all of his immaturity both at the time of her birth, and when she ran away, her Dad has at least acknowledged that some of what transpired between them was because he wasn't adult enough to put his feeling aside and address Kenya's pain. Her mother on the other hand has continued to live in the "if I don't want to acknowledge you, I shouldn't have to" space which has everything to do with her inability to deal with the pregnancy as a whole and the fact that a person walking the earth has resulted from that pregnancy. At least as a rape victim, she could say (and Kenya could understand) "this was just too traumatic to deal with and simply seeing you reminds me of that trauma", but she doesn't have that to fall back on. She is just saying "I choose not to acknowledge you" and expects Kenya to understand why.

I don't have enough likes to give. I promise if she got more of this it would soothe her crazy.

Kenya has proven that even if someone did take that opportunity to tell her she was right and apologize, she would still stew and kvetch and leave bitch bites all up and down that person. Case in point, Kim was giving Kenya all kinds of compliments on "Life Twirls On" and instead of Kenya accepting the compliments and actually eeking out a thank you, she still argued and criticized Kim for praising her. People like Kenya don't have it in them to do the normal thing most of us would do if someone was actually trying to be nice to them. She wants to remain in her victim mode and bitch and moan which is the state of mind she's comfortable with. Face it, the child is mentally challenged. I'm going to borrow a nickname for her from the movie "Life" and start calling her "Can't Get Right".

Lol. Now I can't unsee Martin nicknaming him.

I'm gonna get mad any second now - ya'll are making me defend this girl left and right and I don't wanna! lol. We've seen her accept an olive branch with grace before. In (Savannah?) when she was upset over the possibility of either never having a baby or having one and fucking it up because of her relationship with her mom. And when she and Phaedra peaced it up in (some other fabulous vacation locale). She apologized to Phaedra for being the 3rd string. Pheadra apologized to her for the Moore Whore-ism she carried all season. So I propose that she is in fact, capable of giving/receiving apologies and being normal, even gracious about it. When Kim complimented her, granted her reaction was silly but I understood that she was going about 40 mph. Stopping and putting the car in park would've taken some doing, she is not good at getting disarmed, that's why she stay mad at Kim.

WireWrap · March 28, 2016

"Well Kenya invited him." And she's allowed to tell him to leave. She can't ask him to go if he's out of line? "Well Kenya liked him." And Kenya is allowed to change her mind. "Well Kenya got rejected and wanted him gone." And Kenya being the hostess is permitted to tell him to leave. Why does Kenya need some excuse for him to leave? He has no right to the space. "Kenya should have let security handle it." Should've, could've, would've, but we're here now, so explain Glen's aggression.

Something that is getting lost in all of this is the simple fact that Porsha was also the "Hostess", not just Kenya. This was a joint trip, planned and hosted by both women but Kenya did not include the other hostess in any of this, she could/should have talked to Porsha about making Glen leave.

swankie · March 28, 2016

The other thing about that whole Glen shit that all of them seem to have trouble remembering is that when he returned with Tammy and they realized who was at the door, all of a sudden everybody was pearl clutchy and skirt gathery. This was hours after Kenya had already gone to sleep. All that jumping up and crouching down nonsense contradicts what they said they believed about him at the time. Unless now hiding from people who aren't scary is a thing all of a sudden.

Yeah, but by this time they had seen the hornet burst out of his nest. They all witnessed him trying to get at Kenya, knocking Tammy down and aggressively fighting with the security guards. I would have been pearl clutchy and skirt gathery too at that point.

ZaldamoWilder · March 28, 2016

Well I got some ride or die girlfriends who have go in on me HARD about sensitive shit so..... I guess this is why I also see where she's coming from with regards to her Kandi Koated clique. Your ride or die peeps don't just clam up cause your feelings are hurt. At least mine don't. If it's about some waaaayyy important shit they gonna let you know regardless. Have I gotten into some ugly back and forths because of this YUP. But there's nothing like knowing that ya'll are THAT ride or die that ya'll can do that with each other. That's how I know Kandi really thought of Phaedra as a real friend. Because she took those liberties with Phaedra. I mean not saying that it isn't you know fragile topic but there are certain things I know I will say to my girl without worrying or let me say not caring about her getting mad. Oh well, bitch you need to hear it. If it turns into "a thing" then sure we'll drop it and soak our butts in some soothing ointments to cover being butthurt over it then keep it moving.

Girl I'm a bish who yells in traffic. I have exactly zero problems with passion. Or the fact that your ace squad should be able to bring it to you, boudreaux be damned. My thing is if I tell my #1 speed dial accomplice how I've felt, zen diagrams, what I'd do if I should soever have a little boy and be in this situation and she turns to me, me, her #1 speed dial accomplice and says in her best miss millie voice, I respectfully disagree, that is the end of that. It's not the level of honesty that was the problem. It was as though Kandi was trying to force Phaedra to see the disadvantage of not taking the boys up there, when frankly, it's not her call to make. Because to Phaedra's current point, you're so concerned about my sons but haven't taken them for ice cream one time since their father was sentenced Auntie Kandi? Myeah, ok.

eta: and now she's explaining masturbation to a five year old - there are no winners here.

Edited March 28, 2016 by ZaldamoWilder

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