Party of One: Unpopular TV Opinions

[Mabinogia]

48 minutes ago, sistermagpie said:

I think this is now the trendier opinion. I know I've seen at least two jokes about Hamilton being overrated on TV this year. 

Anything that gets the amount of universal love that Hamilton got is bound to get backlash eventually. I've never seen it, have no desire to see it. I know enough about it to get the countless pop culture references. That's good enough for me. 

[Hiyo]

I remember the episode Seinfeld did about The English Patient, where Elaine thought it was overrated and people thinking she was weird for doing so.

Wonder if anyone will do an episode like that based on Hamilton.

[Blergh]

1 hour ago, Hiyo said:

I remember the episode Seinfeld did about The English Patient, where Elaine thought it was overrated and people thinking she was weird for doing so.

Wonder if anyone will do an episode like that based on Hamilton.

Don't hold your breath! I'm still waiting for a mainstream sitcom   have a character opine that re all post-Return of the Jedi Star Wars adaptations!

Edited May 6, 2022 by Blergh

[bluegirl147]

11 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

Anything that gets the amount of universal love that Hamilton got is bound to get backlash eventually.

This is true but how much is backlash just because and how much is maybe it's just not the greatest show on earth?  I haven't seen it either and I have no desire to. I think most of it's appeal is due to the fact it was something different.  

2 hours ago, Hiyo said:

I remember the episode Seinfeld did about The English Patient, where Elaine thought it was overrated and people thinking she was weird for doing so.

I agree with Elaine.  There was also the Friends episode where we found out Rachel says her favorite movie is Dangerous Liaisons but it's really Weekend at Bernie's.  For whatever reason people will say they like things that I guess they think make them look smart or discerning or who the fuck knows.  

There is nothing wrong with liking the English Patient or Dangerous Liaisons. There is nothing wrong with liking Weekend at Bernie's.   To each his own.  

[Ohiopirate02]

2 hours ago, Blergh said:

Don't hold your breath! I'm still waiting for a mainstream sitcom   have a character opine that re all post-Return of the Jedi Star Wars adaptations!

Edgar Wright and Simon Pegg did this in Spaced after The Phantom Menance came out.  

 

[Crs97]

We took our boys to see Hamilton in Chicago several years ago.  It was at its highest peak of hype, and the performance we saw actually surpassed it.  Everything about it was brilliant.  YMMV

Here’s my UO - I don’t like Seinfeld and never understood its acclaim.  I’ve seen some of the episodes and find myself saying some of the catch phrases, but if I am flipping through the channels and my only choice is Seinfeld I turn off the tv.  Again YMMV

[Bort]

I don’t like Seinfeld either but I do like that English Patient episode. I very much identified with Elaine, who kept getting dragged to a movie she hated because people thought she wasn’t watching it correctly or something. I’ve definitely had that experience with not liking something that’s mostly beloved and then people seem to judge you for it.

[Hiyo]

Well, I guess you could substitute anything in the place of The English Patient in that episode and it could probably still work, Hamilton included.

[bluegirl147]

20 minutes ago, Crs97 said:

Here’s my UO - I don’t like Seinfeld and never understood its acclaim.  I’ve seen some of the episodes and find myself saying some of the catch phrases, but if I am flipping through the channels and my only choice is Seinfeld I turn off the tv.  Again YMMV

I watched Seinfeld when it was on in the 90s and watched it after it went into syndication (before streaming gave me a lot more options).  I never thought it was great but I found it amusing.  Years later I realized the episodes were always built around a joke. With Seinfeld people remember the punchlines.  Yadda Yadda Yadda.  Master of my domain.   I much prefer (and rewatch) shows that are built around the characters like Cheers.  With Cheers you remember storylines.  Sam and Diane.  Norm's never paid bar tab.   Cliff being a know it all who knew nothing.  

15 minutes ago, kariyaki said:

. I’ve definitely had that experience with not liking something that’s mostly beloved and then people seem to judge you for it.

Inevitably whenever someone tells me I'm going to love something I do not in fact love that something.  I used to try to be polite and say oh OK I will check it out but now I just say nope not my kinda thing.

[sistermagpie]

28 minutes ago, Hiyo said:

Well, I guess you could substitute anything in the place of The English Patient in that episode and it could probably still work, Hamilton included.

Curb Your Enthusiasm (heir of Seinfeld) did at least have the main character fall asleep during Hamilton. (Granted, iirc, he had taken something that made him sleepy.)

[Crs97]

1 hour ago, kariyaki said:

I’ve definitely had that experience with not liking something that’s mostly beloved and then people seem to judge you for it.

I hear you!  Try being from Texas and not liking Tex-mex food.  My ears still ring from the shrieks.

[Shannon L.]

46 minutes ago, Crs97 said:

I hear you!  Try being from Texas and not liking Tex-mex food.  My ears still ring from the shrieks.

It's like living in Los Angeles and not liking Mexican food.  Every time my husband and I were invited to have dinner with another couple for the first time and they picked the restaurant, I could've won a lot of money by betting on it being Mexican.

Back on topic: Since it was brought up--I couldn't make it past the Bob Odenkerk episode of Curb Your Enthusiasm. I could see that it had some cute moments, but overall, I just didn't care to keep going.

Edited May 6, 2022 by Shannon L.

[Domestic Assassin]

I tried to watch Curb Your Enthusiasm twice, and hated it with the white hot intensity of a thousand bursting suns. I usually don't get that angry at a tv show, but this one infuriated me. Just seemed to be a half hour of Larry David droning on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on about the piddliest of piddly shit. 

In short, I guess it's just not for me.

Edited May 6, 2022 by Domestic Assassin
spelling

[DrSpaceman73]

3 hours ago, sistermagpie said:

Curb Your Enthusiasm (heir of Seinfeld) did at least have the main character fall asleep during Hamilton. (Granted, iirc, he had taken something that made him sleepy.)

That's my unpopular opinion.  I don't like curb your enthusiasm.  Mostly because Larry David is just over the top annoying. I know George in Seinfeld is based on him. And I like George. Not Larry David.  

I like Seinfeld and many similar shows to curb. But not curb,  just annoying.  

1 hour ago, Domestic Assassin said:

I tried to watch Curb Your Enthusiasm twice, and hated it with the white hot intensity of a thousand bursting sons. I usually don't get that angry at a tv show, but this one infuriated me. Just seemed to be a half hour of Larry David droning on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on about the piddliest of piddly shit. 

In short, I guess it's just not for me.

Yes!!  Exactly why I don't like it.  

[AstaCharles]

 

I have a weird dislike for the When Calls The Heart programs. I've seen maybe 20 minutes of it and it just annoyed me. Too "squeaky clean"  : the costumes, the hair, the makeup.. no one looked frumpy or disheveled from field work. I find it distracting and annoying .

 

Edited May 6, 2022 by AstaCharles

[Ohiopirate02]

12 minutes ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

That's my unpopular opinion.  I don't like curb your enthusiasm.  Mostly because Larry David is just over the top annoying. I know George in Seinfeld is based on him. And I like George. Not Larry David.  

I love George because Jason Alexander has enough charm to make the character palatable.  Larry David lacks the charisma for me to overlook the character's numerous shortcomings.

[ABay]

24 minutes ago, AstaCharles said:

I have a weird dislike for the When Calls The Heart programs.

The title alone is so precious I never tried to watch the show.

[Cinnabon]

20 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

Anything that gets the amount of universal love that Hamilton got is bound to get backlash eventually. I've never seen it, have no desire to see it. I know enough about it to get the countless pop culture references. That's good enough for me. 

I’ve never seen it and wouldn’t have gone out of my way to see it, but now that I have access I feel like I should so I can judge for myself, lol. 

8 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

This is true but how much is backlash just because and how much is maybe it's just not the greatest show on earth?  I haven't seen it either and I have no desire to. I think most of it's appeal is due to the fact it was something different.  

I agree with Elaine.  There was also the Friends episode where we found out Rachel says her favorite movie is Dangerous Liaisons but it's really Weekend at Bernie's.  For whatever reason people will say they like things that I guess they think make them look smart or discerning or who the fuck knows.  

There is nothing wrong with liking the English Patient or Dangerous Liaisons. There is nothing wrong with liking Weekend at Bernie's.   To each his own.  

What was great about Elaine was that she didn’t give a fuck. I have always been similar and have often been seen as socially awkward for being too blunt and opinionated.

Edited May 6, 2022 by Cinnabon

[Mabinogia]

7 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

Inevitably whenever someone tells me I'm going to love something I do not in fact love that something.  I used to try to be polite and say oh OK I will check it out but now I just say nope not my kinda thing.

Same here. I have a friend who is very into bleak prestige TV. She keeps trying to recommend stuff to me and in the beginning I was like "oh, that sounds really good. I'll check it out" though I never did. Now I just say "oh, glad you like it" and change the subject. 

I am just at a point in society where I don't want to watch things that are as depressing as real life. I want light and fluffy. I don't care if that makes me seem simple or uninformed or whatever. My favorite movie is Clue. Why? Because I've seen it dozens of times and it still entertains me and makes me laugh. 

I really don't care if a movie used cutting edge tech, or throws in super fancy camera angles, or focuses on a tree blowing in the wind to signify the constant pressures of the world around us or whatever. I just want to be entertained. I love (some) MCU movies. Are they great movies? Not really, but the entertain me. There are pretty people, there are some cool action scenes, and there is humor. 

I never liked Seinfeld or Friends. I didn't find either of them enjoyable because I just didn't like most of the characters. They both had funny moments, I wouldn't say either of them are bad. They just don't interest me at all. 

2 hours ago, ABay said:

The title alone is so precious I never tried to watch the show.

OMG, I thought I was the only one who saw that title and thought "nope, not happening". It's just so nauseating to me. 

[Cinnabon]

2 hours ago, ABay said:

The title alone is so precious I never tried to watch the show.

Same. 🤣

[DoctorAtomic]

8 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

There is nothing wrong with liking Weekend at Bernie's.

Weekend at Bernie's is Peak 80s Jonathan Silverman and should be included on deep space satellites. 

And Clue is a master class in comedic timing and line delivery. 

 

 

[sistermagpie]

1 hour ago, Mabinogia said:

Same here. I have a friend who is very into bleak prestige TV. She keeps trying to recommend stuff to me and in the beginning I was like "oh, that sounds really good. I'll check it out" though I never did. Now I just say "oh, glad you like it" and change the subject. 

 

I don't understand why people don't just let people alone with this. Not only do people just have different tastes, but I'd much rather just have somebody not be interested in what I like than have them dislike it even more because I assigned it to them like homework. 

[Mabinogia]

35 minutes ago, sistermagpie said:

I don't understand why people don't just let people alone with this. Not only do people just have different tastes, but I'd much rather just have somebody not be interested in what I like than have them dislike it even more because I assigned it to them like homework. 

OMG that's exactly what it feels like, homework. Every time she's all "you must watch this show" I'm thinking to myself "why? is there going to be a quiz? Does our friendship depend on it? Is there a cash prize? I might slog through some depressing prestige show if I know there's a million dollars in it for me. Otherwise, nope, don't have to watch anything I don't want to. It's a free country with countless entertainment options to choose from and I am a spoiled brat so I'm not gonna watch anything I don't wanna. (folds arms and stomps foot like an angry toddler). 

 

 

[Irlandesa]

15 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

Inevitably whenever someone tells me I'm going to love something I do not in fact love that something. 

If I'm feeling out someone about their viewing preferences and they don't know mine, I'm okay with recommendations.  But if it has been years and it's clear we don't share preferences, let's stop trying to talk TV.  

I have a neighbor who always tries to small talk me by telling me what she's watching and asking what I'm watching. I get it.  Small talk is hard. I'm terrible at it.  But the thing is, she will watch what I'm watching, even if I haven't exactly recommended it to her. Knowing she does this, I absolutely avoid  mentioning things I know she won't like, like almost anything considered prestige.  The next time I see her, she comes to tell me she hates it. 

OK.  Fine.  But let's stop talking TV then especially since we don't watch the same things.  I certainly don't tell her that the shows she watches are the kind of shows I'd watch to go to sleep.

Edited May 7, 2022 by Irlandesa

[Zella]

After doing way more required reading than I ever wish to repeat in grad school, I have a very strong "this shouldn't feel like homework" policy when it comes to movies, TV, and books. I want to feel like I'm being entertained. And for me that does include a lot of prestige TV, as well as guilty pleasures, but if I'm not feeling it, I'm not finishing it. And if I know it's not my thing, I'm not trying it. 

I'm more than happy to listen to recommendations but I don't like when people are pushy about it. 

I do have a standing agreement with three separate friends that have similar taste to me. If one of us pops up with a recommendation, usually of the batshit crazy variety, the other one follows down the rabbit hole, so we discuss. And this is how I ended up watching Cats, Bad Vegan, Abducted in Plain Sight, and Tiger King. 😂

[Annber03]

1 hour ago, Zella said:

I'm more than happy to listen to recommendations but I don't like when people are pushy about it.

Same. And I make sure to avoid being pushy when I recommend things to others, too. Obviously I hope people do like things I recommend to them, but if it's not their thing, so be it. That's fine. 

[DrSpaceman73]

7 hours ago, ABay said:

The title alone is so precious I never tried to watch the show.

My god right?  Who came up with that name?  

The name and knowing Lori Loughlin used to be on it, plus being a heterosexual adult male all rules it out for me. 

But the name alone is enough. Not only is so sickeningly sweet, wtf does it mean?  I'm not tuning in to find out. 

Edited May 7, 2022 by DrSpaceman73

[Zella]

18 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

Same. And I make sure to avoid being pushy when I recommend things to others, too. Obviously I hope people do like things I recommend to them, but if it's not their thing, so be it. That's fine. 

Yeah working in a library and doing readers advisory has made me better at making recommendations that I think mesh with what people are saying they like without a personal attachment to the results. But I still am loathe to make those recommendations unless I know the person really well or am being paid. Because really there is so much stuff on paper that I should like and can't stand. So if I do recommend something that I am petty confident someone will like, there's still a lot of me repeating over and over again that they may not like it and it's fine if they don't like it. 😂

Edited May 7, 2022 by Zella

[DrSpaceman73]

I cam pretty well tell based on who recommends a show if I'll like it or not. 

Have a group of friends from college and if they like it, I probably will too. 

Others...

Ok I might check it out. 

[janie jones]

I feel like I keep up with the goings-on of When Calls the Heart well enough from the commercials that play incessantly during Golden Girls reruns. I'll pass on the actual show.

[Hiyo]

Quote

Weekend at Bernie

I could die happy and content if I never see that movie again.

Quote

I'm more than happy to listen to recommendations but I don't like when people are pushy about it.

I think giving recommendations is fine, just don't be pushy or obnoxious about it. Mention the show to someone once and then just let it go. If they watch, it cool. If not, also cool.

Quote

My god right?  Who came up with that name?  

Yoda.

[Scout Finch]

I gave Hamilton a try on Disney+ but stopped before the first act was even over. The reason I wasn't interested before is because I intensely dislike rap/hip hop and, sure enough, that was the reason I turned it off. It seems like most people who don't like it either still go nuts over Hamilton but there was little to hold my interest during brief non-musical scenes, too. Even though I'm 58 I'm primarily into obscure alternative and neo-psychedelic music, played loud in my car so it's not an age thing--I've just never liked rap. It also probably doesn't help that I don't like musicals, aside from a couple of classic ones. 

[SusanM]

11 hours ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

My god right?  Who came up with that name?  

It's the first book in the Canadian West series by Canadian author Janette Oke.  It's probably enough to say she considers herself an Evangelical Christian.  I want to like the series because, hey, Canada, but inspirational fiction is not for me.

[Shannon L.]

5 hours ago, Scout Finch said:

I gave Hamilton a try on Disney+ but stopped before the first act was even over. The reason I wasn't interested before is because I intensely dislike rap/hip hop and, sure enough, that was the reason I turned it off. It seems like most people who don't like it either still go nuts over Hamilton but there was little to hold my interest during brief non-musical scenes, too. Even though I'm 58 I'm primarily into obscure alternative and neo-psychedelic music, played loud in my car so it's not an age thing--I've just never liked rap. It also probably doesn't help that I don't like musicals, aside from a couple of classic ones. 

I'm one of the Hamilton die hards and I hate rap music.  I'm not going to push--you tried it and didn't like it.  It happens and, once the shine wore off, even I could admit it had some issues. But I never understood rap music being the problem with the exception of people who hate it being turned off immediately because rap music was being pushed as the hook for younger people to get interested.  The reason my friends and I, who hate rap, liked it is because it was like rap-lite. Very old school.  And, it wasn't only rap--there were ballads/love songs, dirges, comedic songs, jazzy songs, your typical Broadway type songs (I can't think of a word that describes what I mean there)......."Rap" was simply what got people talking about it and curious to see what it was like. 

Edited May 7, 2022 by Shannon L.

[DrSpaceman73]

9 minutes ago, SusanM said:

It's the first book in the Canadian West series by Canadian author Janette Oke.  It's probably enough to say she considers herself an Evangelical Christian.  I want to like the series because, hey, Canada, but inspirational fiction is not for me.

Yes I looked it up based on a book series but still an odd name. 

Also apparently Michael Landon Jr, son of the late Michael Landon, is the producer. 

Still can't bring myself to watch. 

[Enigma X]

I listen more to rock than rap but recognize the talent some of those artist have and understand why this being the first rap musical is important, especially to those cultures who cultivated it. Wrapping it in a history where those cultures are often excluded was part of the point.

With that said, I love Hamilton, the man. So, I was very happy for him to get some recognition. (Even if not 100% accurate.)

I totally understand that we all don’t have to like the same things though.

Edited May 7, 2022 by Enigma X

[sistermagpie]

27 minutes ago, Shannon L. said:

I'm one of the Hamilton die hards and I hate rap music.  I'm not going to push--you tried it and didn't like it.  It happens and, once the shine wore off, even I could admit it had some issues. But I never understood rap music being the problem with the exception of people who hate it being turned off immediately because they rap music was being pushed as the hook for younger people to get interested.  The reason my friends and I, who hate rap, liked it is because it was like rap-lite. Very old school.  And, it wasn't only rap.  There were ballads/love songs, dirges, comedic songs, jazzy songs, your typical Broadway type songs (I can't think of a word that describes what I mean there)......."Rap" was simply what got people talking about it and curious to see what it was like. 

Yes, it's kind of rap written by a musical theater lover and lots of other styles.

[Mabinogia]

14 hours ago, Zella said:

Because really there is so much stuff on paper that I should like and can't stand.

This is me exactly. I should probably love Hamilton. I love history, I love musicals, I like old school rap (think MC Hammer, Salt n Pepa, that era) but I have zero interest in it. I've seen clips and that was enough. Same with Downton Abbey. On paper that is like my wet dream of a show. Maggie Smith, an English manor house, post WWI/20s era, the clothes, the accents, the opulence. Again, tried it, didn't like it and have no interest in trying again. 

It's why it is almost impossible for people to recommend things to me. I'm also prone to loving something obsessively for a while, then just stopping. I was obsessed with House, MD back in the day. I actually lost a temp job over my obsession at one point, but then one day I was just over it. Now I don't even want to watch reruns of the early eps that I once loved. 

Because of this I also don't like recommending things to others as I like things for weird reasons. 

[Zella]

1 minute ago, Mabinogia said:

This is me exactly. I should probably love Hamilton. I love history, I love musicals, I like old school rap (think MC Hammer, Salt n Pepa, that era) but I have zero interest in it. I've seen clips and that was enough. Same with Downton Abbey. On paper that is like my wet dream of a show. Maggie Smith, an English manor house, post WWI/20s era, the clothes, the accents, the opulence. Again, tried it, didn't like it and have no interest in trying again. 

It's why it is almost impossible for people to recommend things to me. I'm also prone to loving something obsessively for a while, then just stopping. I was obsessed with House, MD back in the day. I actually lost a temp job over my obsession at one point, but then one day I was just over it. Now I don't even want to watch reruns of the early eps that I once loved. 

Because of this I also don't like recommending things to others as I like things for weird reasons. 

Yes everyone kept recommending Hamilton to me because I love history. I have a degree in history! I can understand that it obviously sparked something for a lot of people, and that's great for them! I don't begrudge them that or their liking it. But it did nothing for me. 

That was also how Outlander got recommended to me by multiple people. You like history and you like Scotland--you'll like this! Um no. 

You probably dodged a bullet with Downton. I stayed with it to the bitter end, but those last few seasons are ugh. 

[Enigma X]

Downton sucked to me and I love history. I am sure after a season or two the Gilded Age will suck for me. My love for the era and the urban planner in me watches for the scenery. Fellowes is overrated to me.

[Ohiopirate02]

25 minutes ago, Mabinogia said:

This is me exactly. I should probably love Hamilton. I love history, I love musicals, I like old school rap (think MC Hammer, Salt n Pepa, that era) but I have zero interest in it. I've seen clips and that was enough. Same with Downton Abbey. On paper that is like my wet dream of a show. Maggie Smith, an English manor house, post WWI/20s era, the clothes, the accents, the opulence. Again, tried it, didn't like it and have no interest in trying again. 

I tried Downton, but gave up after the second episode.  The show should have been catnip to me--historical drama with high production values, like you said Maggie Smith being Dame Maggie Smith, plus soapy melodrama.  I found the soapy melodrama to be bad soap vs. good soap.  The show manufactured drama for the sake of drama instead of mining the inherent drama found in the premise of the show.  I read some recaps of the first 3 seasons, and every time the show could have done some rich and interesting storytelling about the dying class system and the inanities found in the lifestyle of an earl, the show went with cheap storytelling.  Cora's late-in-life pregnancy is one example.  Just imagine what could have been, Cora finally gives birth the the son and heir while Mary and Matthew have fallen in love.  Do they still marry for love even though he's no longer the heir to Downton? The show could have had the long-awaited male heir have some kind of developmental issue due to Cora's advanced maternal age.  Instead we get Cora's maid hiding the soap from her and causing Cora to miscarry in the bath.

[Scout Finch]

While I watched the whole series, overall I'm ambivalent about Downton Abbey. Although Edith ending up eclipsing Mary in stature and opulence was rather satisfying. There's some reality show called Bringing Up Bates and all I can think of is Bringing Up Mr. Bates!

[Shannon L.]

1 hour ago, Zella said:

Yes everyone kept recommending Hamilton to me because I love history. I have a degree in history! I can understand that it obviously sparked something for a lot of people, and that's great for them! I don't begrudge them that or their liking it. But it did nothing for me.

I was glad to see that it sparked interest for a lot of kids.  When my daughter got to that period in history class, she actually recalled some of the lyrics to help her answer test questions (she'd listened to the soundtrack enough that she pretty much knew all the songs by heart).

I resisted at first because I don't like rap and I don't like pre-WW2 history, but after my husband (who also resisted at first) caved to her constant "Please give it a try!", he came to me and said "You should listen to it.  Give it a few songs.".  I was hooked after the introduction of the Schuyler sisters.

[Zella]

1 hour ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

I tried Downton, but gave up after the second episode.  The show should have been catnip to me--historical drama with high production values, like you said Maggie Smith being Dame Maggie Smith, plus soapy melodrama.  I found the soapy melodrama to be bad soap vs. good soap.  The show manufactured drama for the sake of drama instead of mining the inherent drama found in the premise of the show.  I read some recaps of the first 3 seasons, and every time the show could have done some rich and interesting storytelling about the dying class system and the inanities found in the lifestyle of an earl, the show went with cheap storytelling.  Cora's late-in-life pregnancy is one example.  Just imagine what could have been, Cora finally gives birth the the son and heir while Mary and Matthew have fallen in love.  Do they still marry for love even though he's no longer the heir to Downton? The show could have had the long-awaited male heir have some kind of developmental issue due to Cora's advanced maternal age.  Instead we get Cora's maid hiding the soap from her and causing Cora to miscarry in the bath.

I put a lot of thought into what I would have done differently for season 2, and mine would have been having Mary and Matthew marry different people rather than the silly contrived way they both ended up free of their inconvenient engagements. I think that would have been a much more interesting story than what he gave us. 

[andromeda331]

2 hours ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

I tried Downton, but gave up after the second episode.  The show should have been catnip to me--historical drama with high production values, like you said Maggie Smith being Dame Maggie Smith, plus soapy melodrama.  I found the soapy melodrama to be bad soap vs. good soap.  The show manufactured drama for the sake of drama instead of mining the inherent drama found in the premise of the show.  I read some recaps of the first 3 seasons, and every time the show could have done some rich and interesting storytelling about the dying class system and the inanities found in the lifestyle of an earl, the show went with cheap storytelling.  Cora's late-in-life pregnancy is one example.  Just imagine what could have been, Cora finally gives birth the the son and heir while Mary and Matthew have fallen in love.  Do they still marry for love even though he's no longer the heir to Downton? The show could have had the long-awaited male heir have some kind of developmental issue due to Cora's advanced maternal age.  Instead we get Cora's maid hiding the soap from her and causing Cora to miscarry in the bath.

I agree I should have liked it too for similar reasons. It looked like it would explore the dying class system also at a time when there were new opportunities for women. But then it didn't do anything with it. Sybill was the only one to do a little. It went with boring Mary and Edith drama and boring Mr. Bates drama while almost everyone was unlikeable. Anyone who was against the class system either later forgot (Tom) or they made horrible (Sarah Bunting).

[scarynikki12]

With regard to rap and Hamilton, it serves a purpose within the narrative. After the opening song we meet Ham's friends: Laurens, Mulligan, and Lafayette. They rap in the early manner as they introduce themselves and then My Shot begins which immediately moves away from the early form into the faster and more wordy versions that helped the genre skyrocket in popularity. As the first act progresses rap is used to underscore the Revolution and differentiate from King George who is given a British pop singing style. Lafayette was a superstar in real life and he's given the same aura in Act 1 with Diggs' lighting fast rapping that blows the roof off the theater. We get some more rap in Act 2 with the Cabinet rap battles and the duels but otherwise it's got more traditional Broadway music as the characters themselves move away from who they were during the war. Every style of song has a purpose for the characters.

On a completely unrelated note, I was in the mood to rewatch parts of One Tree Hill. Don't ask as I can't explain. Anyway, my forever UO is that the only shows that should be set in high school are the ones who will actually let the kids be teenagers. OTH should have been set in college from the start. Within the story these characters, who were underage for the first four years of the show, did the following: got married, had a baby, lived on their own, started a fashion line, opened and managed a nightclub, and went on tour to be a singer. Now, within that list there are some things that high schoolers can do but the rest don't require all the suspension of disbelief if they're in college.

It would also explain how Lucas and Nathan never spoke to each other until they were on the same basketball team despite living in the same small town and being in the same classes at the same school. Make it so that they knew about each other but they lived in different towns and met for the first time freshman year. Haley and Nathan get so swept up in their relationship that they decide to get married? Far more believable if we're dealing with a couple of 18 year olds at the end of their freshman year. Then we could have Haley's parents going with the flow because she's an adult now and they can't stop her rather than their blasé "eh she's sixteen and they have no way to support themselves but we're going to allow it and trust it will work out" stance. Peyton and Brooke? Best friends who wanted to go to the same college and choose this one because Peyton wanted to follow boyfriend Nathan. Change the setting to college and you can still do so many of the thing the early seasons of the show did without all the parents (even the loving ones) looking like they didn't give a damn about their kids. 

Speaking of parents on OTH my final UO is that Dan's season 8 finale ending was much better for his character than dying to save Nathan. I checked and the season 8 finale was filmed before their season 9 pickup so they knew there was a chance they'd get canceled. Nathan going to see Dan to give him Lydia's baby picture and Jamie's baseball before leaving again was a surprisingly great understated moment for the show. So they ruined that by bringing back Dan to rescue Nathan and dying for it. Don't get me wrong, Dan's death scene was effective and Paul Johannson and Craig Sheffer absolutely sold Dan and Keith's afterlife reconciliation but I still think it was a lesser ending for the character. I will acknowledge that said reconciliation could be interpreted to just be in Dan's mind rather than real since they made a point of showing that Dan hallucinated a reconciliation with Nathan earlier in the episode so I tell myself that his mind created these moments to help him accept that he was about to die. 

Finally, Lucas was a terrible character and shouldn't have ended up with either Brooke or Peyton. I love the moment at Lucas' aborted wedding to Lindsay when Brooke reveals that she wants a baby and Peyton responds "with me????" YES. Let Brooke and Peyton go to a sperm bank, get knocked up from the same donor, and be BFF raising their babies. The hell with Lucas that should have been their post-high school personal story.

[Ambrosefolly]

11 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

Finally, Lucas was a terrible character and shouldn't have ended up with either Brooke or Peyton. I love the moment at Lucas' aborted wedding to Lindsay when Brooke reveals that she wants a baby and Peyton responds "with me????" YES. Let Brooke and Peyton go to a sperm bank, get knocked up from the same donor, and be BFF raising their babies. The hell with Lucas that should have been their post-high school personal story.

I think that a reason they show college age people in high school, versus college is because it not only show the economy levels with some kids with very little hope of going to college all the way to others who are college tracked, it is the one time people can go "way back" to even childhood. Everyone in college, those people are on a path to upward mobility. Take Gilmore Girls, while Marty had the realistic struggle of supporting himself and feeling less than Logan, he was in Yale; he will eventual have a better story than Logan and his dipshit friends about working his way up. Once you leave for college, everything scatters, even if you are from a cosmopolitan city like New York.

I agree about Lucas. Not only was One Tree Hill a poorly written show in general (though it managed to turn itself somewhat around by abandoning and embracing storyline during the first season), but Chad Michael Murray lacked Zach Gifford's innate decency or Angus Cloud's zen energy to pull off the "good guy down on his luck." He can play the asshole with a bit of depth, like in Gilmore Girls, no problem, but his good guy became a Nice Guy.

[Shannon L.]

1 hour ago, scarynikki12 said:

With regard to rap and Hamilton, it serves a purpose within the narrative. After the opening song we meet Ham's friends: Laurens, Mulligan, and Lafayette. They rap in the early manner as they introduce themselves and then My Shot begins which immediately moves away from the early form into the faster and more wordy versions that helped the genre skyrocket in popularity. As the first act progresses rap is used to underscore the Revolution and differentiate from King George who is given a British pop singing style. Lafayette was a superstar in real life and he's given the same aura in Act 1 with Diggs' lighting fast rapping that blows the roof off the theater. We get some more rap in Act 2 with the Cabinet rap battles and the duels but otherwise it's got more traditional Broadway music as the characters themselves move away from who they were during the war. Every style of song has a purpose for the characters.

Lafayette's rap was insane and The Cabinet Battles were fun.  I also liked how Thomas Jefferson's song "What Did I Miss?" was more jazzy while others had moved on to something more modern like rap and hip-hop.  It showed that while he was gone, America was moving right along into a new phase.  LMM is brilliant, imo.

[Crs97]

And King George sings a 1950’s pop song  like an abusive boyfriend.  “Unimaginable” will always make me cry.

[Enigma X]

2 minutes ago, Crs97 said:

And King George sings a 1950’s pop song  like an abusive boyfriend.  “Unimaginable” will always make me cry.

I think you mean "It's Quiet Uptown" 😀. This is my favorite song from Hamilton and I like them all. I am always bawling on this one.