S03.E12: Destiny Rides Again

[Primetimer]

Give it up for the 'Destiny Rides Again' Visual Aids!

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[Primetimer]

Reek returns, with foreseeable yet still kind of surprising results.

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[AndySmith]

it's weird to see that Donna sleeps on hand-me-down bedding from her grandma's condo in Tampa.

 

What better way for the show to remind us that she is a virgin? I mean, in case we didn't get it the first 3 dozen times it was mentioned.

 

Cindy loves being reacquainted with Reek

 

For once, Cindy gets to live vicariously through one of her kids!

 

And hellooooooo, Blondie!

 

The stick insect finally devours his leafy meal...while the Melrose Place Wailing Guitar of Lust plays in the background.

 

Edited February 4, 2016 by AndySmith

[lovinbob]

Oh my god, all of the hatred I had for that kid's stupid ponytail just came rushing back at me.

[Lea]

I'm going to have this song in my head all day.

[SoupThrower]

Oh God someone put her out of misery. That accent, so bad.

Way to jump from girl to girl Dylan. Aren't you a nice guy....

So basically Donna kicks out David because of her dreams at like late in the night. Poor guy.

Needed more Nikki and less Rosie O'Donnell.

[SoupThrower]

Brandon and Nikki look nice together.

Not gonna lie but feel so bad for David. Basically she teases him, kicks him out her house because of dream stuff, tells Rosie O'Donnell on TV about the situation and basically says wait till end of high school to talk about itand we know that how that ends like a season later....dear God we have another season of this. Should have just did the Dylan thing and moved over to Brenda only because I hate this David gets hornier and Donna gets him so close and she's like no.

I get why Dylan doesn't want to take it again but goes on and on and on about it and it gets worse leading to that horse lady. Times like this where Brandon's braying is needed.

Eugh Dylan is horrible. The whole honesty crap and lies to her and moves on over to Kelly straight away. Worst. Then he has that horse lady later on.

lol Zuckerman.

[Narla]

I'm curious to see how I feel about this storyline this time, because when I was 17 I felt VERY STRONGLY about this whole thing and I was heavily on Brenda's side... Though in my memory that is mostly because of the reaction of all her friends. It seemed so unjust!

Also, great that Linda Holmes did her part to make the podcasts have a Dean Cain theme this week.

[TeeVee329]

That was some very "Melrose Place"-y musical wailing at the end there.

[MyAimIsTrue]

Nat saying hello to "Reek" is forever burned into my memory banks.

How is it that I didn't know until right now, this very moment when I consulted the oracle at Google, that the actor playing Herbert is the real life son of the great ventriloquist Willie Tyler?

[Tooch]

I am firmly on Bren's side and always have been, but even more so now that I'm re-living it. She was mature and honest with Dylan all through this final act in their relationship. She told him immediately about her fling upon returning from Paris and asked him flat out what it meant for them. She was honest again about him showing up. She was rightfully angry when Dylan admitted his own infidelity and didn't let him get away with the "you cheated too!" bs since she rightfully pointed out that she didn't keep it from him for weeks and weeks after the fact. And their breakup made sense and she handled it totally maturely, whereas he made a fucking BEELINE immediately to his mistress' bedroom.

 

In short: What. A. Dick.

 

Already dreading the next couple episodes. Dreading. Because not only is everyone terrible to Brenda (HOW does no one in their circle of friends point out to Kelly and Dylan how completely shitty they are? Donna almost does, but she seems to only do so because she wants to make peace between them, not because she's truly disgusted by the whole thing.), but Brenda is also terrible. If I recall, there is a LOT of slut-shaming towards Kelly, which, ugh. I mean, anger? Yes. Feeling of betrayal and disgust? Yes? "Well, I am not surprised since you ARE a gigantic whore." No. Just no. Oh god I cannot wait until Monday!

Edited February 4, 2016 by Tooch

[sinkwriter]

I cringe at the thought of having to hear Brenda say "Reeeeek" again, but I really love listening to your 90210 podcasts, so I guess I have to steel myself and suck it up. (LOL.)

[AndySmith]

You might be dreading it, but I'm loving the frothy soapy teen drama angst of it all. Till now, Brenda/Dylan/Kelly is one of my favorite triangles ever, on any show.

 

The only thing I am curious about is how the show would have gone had it not been for the SD behind the scenes drama.

[gesundheit]

The only thing I am curious about is how the show would have gone had it not been for the SD behind the scenes drama.

I think the triangle still would have happened because teen shows like to mix and match, and I still think Kelly/Dylan would have given it a go. I think the major change is that they wouldn't have kept Brenda either dating total duds or being incapable of moving on from Dylan. They really gave her the short end of the stick on that one -- not losing Dylan, because that's not really that big a loss, but on what that opened up for her. No way were they going to keep one teen couple together for the next ten years, that would be pretty weak primetime soap. Even David and Donna, the Royal Couple, broke up 35 times and both had other very-long-term relationships that were given serious weight before they came back together at the end. They would have split up Brenda and Dylan regardless, but they certainly would have given Brenda a viable next great love herself.

[sinkwriter]

Wow... apparently I "hack" into many websites every day, Herbert. I had no idea I was such a computer expert. Just give me a computer and a password and I can do anything!

(*groan* LOL.)

[Narla]

Tooch & AndySmith - I think the behind-the-scene stuff plays a big role in the rest of season 3/4. Because the way I remember it, no one is on Brenda's side and it seems insane to me that, in a high school drama like this, people wouldn't be on Brenda's freaking side! Her boyfriend is screwing around with her best friend. That's the highest of high school drama. I remember a guy leaving one girl for another in my high school -- the two were not even friends, but EVERYONE across all five grades (Ontario) knew about it and no one was on the boyfriend/new girlfriend's side. Even teachers were giving them the evil eye. The fact that it plays out so differently on BH90210 has GOT to be because everyone was sick to death of Shannen.

[sinkwriter]

Despite the cringe-cringe-CRINGE-worthy mess of Brenda's "French" accent and that whole story, I like Dean Cain a lot. As cheesy as that show could be, I really did love watching him on Lois & Clark.

[Tooch]

That does make sense. The scene I think of is Brenda sobbing in Jim's arms and saying how "he dumped me for my BEST friend and I feel like I'm drowning" and my heart just breaks for the character. Because seriously, no one gave a shit even after the truth came out that her serious boyfriend of two years cheated on her with her best friend and then they got together like it was no big deal. Even Brandon didn't give a shit, and he was the one who didn't even want D/B together in the first place because he was worried he would break her heart.

 

HOW was this not a bigger deal! I remember another scene where Kelly has her awkward first meeting with Iris, shortly after her and Dylan get together for good. And she complains to Donna about how Iris asked about Brenda and Donna was all "right in front of you? Rude!" Donna was more defensive on Kelly's behalf over this non-slight than she was for Brenda who was thoroughly betrayed by the two people she cared about the most. It's so infuriating and I hate that the writers were so influenced by the fact that their leading lady (gasp!) had a bad personality. Grow up, 90210 team.

[AndySmith]

 

That's the highest of high school drama. I remember a guy leaving one girl for another in my high school -- the two were not even friends, but EVERYONE across all five grades (Ontario) knew about it and no one was on the boyfriend/new girlfriend's side.

 

Funny, we had something similar happen at my school. In my senior year, a fellow senior left his girlfriend (also a senior) after they had been dating for a couple of years for a sophomore. Of course, her girlfriends were on her side, but the rest of the school? None of our business (of course people gossiped about it), and nobody really chose sides.. And I know the faculty definitely didn't express any opinions, because, they're not Gils.

 

I'm not sure how things would have played out, ie, if they would have hooked up Dylan with Kelly. But I do think the writers don't start punishing Brenda/SD until season 4, when the character starts doing questionable things (the research lab break in, the Roy Randolph drama, etc).

[Narla]

Tooch -- I KNOW, NOT EVEN HER BROTHER GAVE A DAMN AND IT MADE ME INSANE! I am about this like Tara is about Mary's husband dying in a car crash. I just can't conceive of a world in which one's twin freaking brother doesn't stop hanging out with his buddy who dumped you for your best friend -- who he had been screwing around with behind your back in the first place. I get it, Reek, she's no angel... but, again, some more, how is no one on her side??? Where is your self-righteous bray NOW, Brandon? It makes no sense!

[gesundheit]

I feel like everyone I knew in high school dated each other's exes, though. And Dylan didn't dump Brenda for her best friend. Brenda broke up with Dylan, then wanted him back, then Dylan dated Brenda and her best friend at the same time, and both of those girls went along with it for a bit until they told him to choose, and he did. And not many people knew about the summertime Dylan/Kelly indiscretion.

None of this is to say that it wasn't a betrayal, it was. But it's not as black-and-white as one day Dylan up and leaving Brenda for Kelly.

And even if it had been? They're kids. You can be friends with people who've done shitty things and not bail on the friendship because of it. Some people just like to stay out of that sort of thing, and everyone who loved both Brenda and Kelly just wanted to keep both of them in their lives. It's obvious who did wrong and who got done wrong, and both Brenda and Kelly knew that. Dylan did not, but Dylan is Dylan. Dylan never thought he did anything wrong at any point.

 

And of course the MAIN reason nobody froze out Dylan and Kelly: it was a show about a group of 8 people, not 2 and 6!

Edited February 4, 2016 by gesundheit

[MissEwa]

I know! I know! (Don't ask me why I know!) Gabrielle Carteris had to have surgery on both her feet, hence the wheelchair. So Sarah you were on the right track. 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/lifestyle/tv/1993/03/07/90210s-gabrielle-carteris/ad4f1d4e-53e1-40f6-be0f-552319138739/

(Also the rest of the story is... interesting. She thought it would have been discrimination if she was good but they were worried about her age? It's acting. I don't think it works that way.)

And am I completely misremembering or did Dylan not leave early from the SATs last year but just... not take them at all? He was all 'that's why I only do this one time, senior year'. 

[gesundheit]

Thanks for that link, MissEwa!

 

It has some gems: 

 

At 32, Carteris looks not much older than the teenager she plays. 

 

 

True, because the teenager she plays looks 40.

 

 

 

Jennie Garth (Kelly Taylor) made a fitness video for the 12- to 34-year-old set that was released in December.

 

( How dare they! I used this workout video long past 34!)

 

 

The Fox press material describes Andrea Zuckerman as the "moral voice" on the show. She rolled her eyes at this.

"I'm going to change that. That was how we first described Andrea. Would you describe her as the moral voice?" she asked. "My husband is always laughing -- she's kissed most of the boys on the show. She's really been out there."

 

Kissed most of the boys on the show??

[Narla]

gesundheit -- Yeah, lots of people dated each other's exes at my high school, too -- but if anything like what 90210 is showing us happened, it would have been extremely dramatic. This isn't dating an ex, this is your BFF screwing around with your boyfriend when you're away, not telling you about it, and then eventually all your friends expecting you to get over it immediately. That's not how teenaged girls work, and when I was a teen it absolutely infuriated me. If there had even been a three a episode arc in which Brenda and everyone else comes to terms with what happened, I'd feel differently -- but the way I remember it, everyone was immediately all "get over it, Brenda."

Even her flipping brother, the Indignation Machine.

[adam807]

What's on Kelly's arm in that last GIF??

[sinkwriter]

Gabrielle Carteris (pronounced gabb-ree-EL car-TARE-ez)

This part of the article cracked me up. Almost 3/4 of the way through the article and THEN they mention how to pronounce her name? And I get "Carteris" might give one pause for a split second but is "Gabrielle" that challenging a pronunciation to figure out? Heh.

[gesundheit]

gesundheit -- Yeah, lots of people dated each other's exes at my high school, too -- but if anything like what 90210 is showing us happened, it would have been extremely dramatic. This isn't dating an ex, this is your BFF screwing around with your boyfriend when you're away, not telling you about it, and then eventually all your friends expecting you to get over it immediately. That's not how teenaged girls work, and when I was a teen it absolutely infuriated me. If there had even been a three a episode arc in which Brenda and everyone else comes to terms with what happened, I'd feel differently -- but the way I remember it, everyone was immediately all "get over it, Brenda."

It was quite a few months in between the first Dylan/Kelly date that everyone knew about, then Brenda getting over that and being friends with Kelly again and starting to date him again after dumping Rick, and then the girls making the ultimatum, and then Dylan making the "choice" and then Dylan and Kelly confessing to Brenda. To a teenager, that's basically years of watching all the drama unfold like molasses. I think the pace of it is the reason there wasn't some big taking-sides blow-up, there was no "big event" to the friends. They got it in increments.

 

Plus those in-group breakups in high school are torture for the odd-man out, the one who gets "left," so it was important to see how isolated she felt. Nobody told her she was wrong to be sad but there's only so much they can do and they're teenagers, they care a lot more about getting on with their own lives and so the jilted feel left behind. It's hell, but it's frequently how it works.

 

(I have no defense for Brandon, because he rarely deserves one. I'm just talking about all the mutual friends.)

 

Oh, teenage heartbreak. It was all such agony! 

[Earmuffs Mom]

I hate that Dylan says it doesn't matter who he cheated with over the summer because Kelly wasn't some random girl. D-bag! I am firmly Team Brenda even all of these years later because she was so isolated after Dylan chooses Kelly and her moping and heartbreak were so sad the rest of the season.

Oh, and I would have loved for Brenda to have brought Rick to the prom later, even if just as a friend, instead of moping around with boring old Tony Miller. Rick would have been foxy in a prom tux.

[Lisin]

What's on Kelly's arm in that last GIF??

 

It's blue paint because she's painting her bedroom. 

[MissEwa]

There really is no excuse for Brandon not cutting Dylan dead but I feel like at least Donna (and therefore David) were just doing that typical teenager thing of social self-preservation. Dylan and Kelly were supposed to be pretty high up in the WBev social stratosphere, Donna's known both of them for much longer, and David's her boyfriend/Kelly's stepbrother. Steve... well, he's hardly going to go out on a limb for anyone, nevermind Brenda, and Andrea wasn't really involved. It sucks, and they're all awful, but it makes sense to me. 

 

To be honest not only am I surprised that Brenda kept trying to hang out with any of them but I'm kind of surprised they let her.

 

When I was in high school a close friend of mine got dumped for someone more popular and ended up in a vaguely Brenda-like situation. I was one of the few who stayed 'on her side' and, honestly, while we're still good friends and I don't regret it, at the time it sucked. It wasn't "oh, that sucks, get over it and we'll all be friends," it was "so... we're friends with *those guys* now. Bye." Sucked much worse for her, but it definitely made my high-school experience worse than it would have been. So I guess it could have been worse? 

Andrea kissed... Brandon. And Steve. And Jay. And Jordan. I guess? 
 

"...Andrea's a happening babe," she chuckled.

 

I can so see that chuckle and it's the indulgent chuckle of a great-aunt. 

[AndySmith]

I think Donna is just the type to play peacemaker, because that's who she is. She wouldn't want to divide her time or choose between her 2 best friends.

 

For Steve, it might have been a similar situation, his best friend's sister or an ex-girlfriend who he still cares about?

 

But yes, Brandon should at least have given Dylan the cold shoulder for a while.

Edited February 4, 2016 by AndySmith

[marny]

I really don't get why Kelly would still want Dylan when the only reason he came to her is because Brenda broke up with him. If he really wanted Kelly, he would have broken up with Brenda to date her. And if he really didn't want to be with Brenda, he would have broken up with her after Paris-- regardless of whether Kelly was an option. He totally treated Kelly like the back-up girl.

[KateeBar]

Any way you slice it, Reek > Dylan. I really wish he'd been a longer-term character. And Dylan was just such a tool in this episode. God. I mean, he must have followed Brenda out the door to get to Kelly. Still, I'm excited about all the drama headed our way via the podcasts.

[SoupThrower]

While Brandon should have been better sibling (No surprise there) and froze out Dylan or at least punched him in the face. I can see the only reason is that he was so god damn sick of the triangle and he didn't know about the whole summer of deception until it was too late or something.

But one could say from then he was less buddy buddy with Dylan until it crashed and burned. I mean no one cared that Brandon and Kelly had their thing as well.

So in short Brandon should have been a better brother and Kelly is a witch that used magic to protect herself whatever

[MissEwa]

Or course, where I fail is buying into the myth the show is selling (Brandon Walsh, Everyday Hero), instead of looking at the reality (Brayndon Braysh, Awful Windbag). It actually makes perfect sense that he didn't have Brenda's back - he was petty enough to probably be secretly thrilled that the summer she spent swanning around Paris while he worked his fingers to the bone twenty hours a day in the pits of hell backfired on her. 

[SoupThrower]

lol yeah Dylan is the worst though. Even on his wedding day he's like "Thanks for telling Brenda." instead of her sending some notice or whatever. Brandon was a better 'brother' to Valerie (minus a few things) than he was with Brenda, so at least he learned something for being a crappy brother then again in some parts she was a crappy sister. They are crappy siblings. 

 

Kind of wanted that scene where Dylan and Kelly look at each other with the music and David comes in and is "Hey Dylan, what up?" just to ruin the whole scene.

Edited February 5, 2016 by SoupThrower

[SnideAsides]

The show never really did TV sets that looked good, did they? Compared to the dating show episode with Brayndon and Steve, and the Newlywed Game knockoff with Noah and Kelly Donna, the one for this special is easily the best one.

 

I'd also like to reiterate something I've said elsewhere: After seeing Luke Perry naked in Oz, I'm pretty sure sex with Dylan would be a little disappointing.

[Racj82]

The thing I just learned is that people in dating their friends exes in high school was a known thing. Like anywhere. That was not the case in my high school or any school I knew.

 

I love the triangle but none of it is okay with me from a logic standpoint.

 

Dylan is an asshole. He could play like he's being noble by going after Kelly after they broke up but he's been totally waiting for his opportunity to get back with her while being "in love" with his girlfriend.

 

Kelly is a idiot for wanting a guy that basically left you on standby until he was ready.

 

Brenda is justified for any anger she had towards those two. It still makes no sense that she became the black sheep of the group coming out of this but I think that's life reflecting art.

[SoupThrower]

Regarding the whole Shannen thing. I don't think they would have had a triangle if she didn't piss off the cast. It would probably have involved Kelly but with Brandon or a Donna/David triangle with some guy in Paris. Heck wouldn't think there would have been a Paris thing if Shannen didn't annoy. So far reading around I think the only person who hasn't said anything bad or not good about Shannen seemed to be Brian. 

[profreader]

Speaking of "what were you looking for in here, musical comedy?": there used to be a store called Broadway Video in NYC, on Broadway and 80th or 81st. In the upstairs section, the musicals were grouped together on one shelf. Right behind it was gay male porn. You could grab Meet Me In St. Louis with one hand ... and Meat Me in St. Louis with the other.

Or so I heard. From a friend.

[adam807]

Ohhhhh. This is what I get for looking at the visual aids before listening to the podcast.

[jenrising]

No, Brenda did tell Dylan about seeing someone in Paris, when she came back. He graciously forgave her (eyeroll), but didn't admit that he'd cheated, too. So it's worse because he had every opportunity to come clean when she did, and he decided not to. Even without the best friend thing, it makes him much worse, in my book.

[Earmuffs Mom]

 

Steve... well, he's hardly going to go out on a limb for anyone

 

In the senior skip day episode, I remember Steve ragging on Dylan about how he treated Brenda, even though I am sure it had more to do with Steve's residual feelings for Kelly more than anything else.  It seemed like that was the only time someone really said something to Dylan's face about what he did.  Donna says something about Brenda and Kelly being ridiculous to fight over a guy that bailed on them during the horse lady episode too.  Otherwise, I can't think of any other time the gang really talked about what happened.

[filmgirl]

I'm so Team Brenda it's not even funny. I was back when I was 9 and in the 4th grade. I still am 23 years later. Like, I remember actually getting into fights with other little girls on the school bus over Kelly/Dylan or Brenda/Dylan. It was peak teen soap love triangle (until Dawson/Joey/Pacey).

 

And Dylan/Brenda/Kelly is so much worse than Dawson/Joey/Pacey because they fucked around BEFORE the breakup. Like, it's one thing to break up and then ask out another friend in the group. It's gross and you should probably wait a few weeks first before doing so (especially if you're going after YOUR BEST FRIEND'S BOYFRIEND, KELLY), but whatever, it happens. It winds up sucking hardcore for one person, but it happens. But like, when you go behind your friend's back with the boyfriend, you are a trash person. The boyfriend is clearly the scum of the earth (though 9 year old me was still totally Team Luke Perry) and should be cursed with losing his money and his wife to a mobster in the future, but the best friend is also just the absolute worst. Like, part of the reason I could never deal with the retconned "Kelly Taylor is saint" bullshit of 90210: College Years and beyond was this moment. 

 

Still, I totally understand how/why the friends basically chose Kelly over Brenda. She's OG WBev and Brenda is still an outsider. And she's Steve's ex (not that Brenda and Steve ever liked each other anyway), David's stepbrother, and Donna's fellow spoiled rich bitch. But for her own brother not to care? That's some bullshit.

 

You do have to wonder how the gang would have reacted had they all known explicitly that Dylan and Kelly just-the-tipped all summer while Brenda was in Paris. Donna, anyway, might have been like "yeah, fuck you" -- but I still see Brenda getting the short shaft. 

 

My second-favorite line happens next episode,  Brenda: "Well my mother always told me 'if it looks like a duck and talks like a duck,'" Kelly: "Go to hell Brenda!" And now we're just a long Christmas and "Have You Ever Had to Make Up Your Mind" montage away from the greatest 90210 line ever, "I hate you both, never talk to me again!" Brenda stomp off.

 

God, this show. I live for it.

[Nanna]

Dylan is an a-hole, sure. I'm sure that I and my fellow teenagers at the time still found him hot and totally got why both Brenda and Kelly were in love with him, but now I just wanna scream "he's just not that into you" to both of them. God, I need to get these episodes on dvd and rewatch them for the millionth time so I can do that. I'm clearly still invested in this more than 20 years later.

[txhorns79]

I died a little when the podcast suggested that Gabrielle Carteris asked for the car accident because she just didn't feel like walking.   Too funny.         

Edited February 5, 2016 by txhorns79

[marceline]

This was peak Dean Cain sexiness. I remember wondering why Brenda was remotely conflicted. Choosing between Rick and Dylan was like choosing between a massage and getting run down in the street like Andrea. Speaking of which, I agree that there has to be a BTS reason for Andrea's accident.

[Sarah D. Bunting]

 

Dylan and Kelly just-the-tipped all summer

 

HA HA HA HA HAAAAAA "just the tip" as a verb. Dying.

[Maharincess]

Nat saying hello to "Reek" is forever burned into my memory banks.

How is it that I didn't know until right now, this very moment when I consulted the oracle at Google, that the actor playing Herbert is the real life son of the great ventriloquist Willie Tyler?

Willie Tyler and Lester!! I haven't thought about him in years, thanks for the tidbit, I didn't know either.

[bilgistic]

Before Blockbuster took over everything (those seem like heady days now, eh, Blockbuster?), there was a video store in a strip mall in our town. It was called Action Video, which was funny because it had a porn section. I can't remember if that part was curtained off, but it was definitely another nook. It was super hilarious for us bored high schoolers to go to Action Video and sneak-read the titles off the porn and crack ourselves up. What innocent times.

When I was in elementary school, one of my friends parents owned a video store. They rented out both VHS and Betamax formats. I'm only as old as the kids on 90210; believe it or not.

Edited February 6, 2016 by bilgistic