S06.E08: Going Deep

[Happy Camper]

9000+ explant surgeries and Our Lady of Lemons, Yolanda Hadid-Foster was the worst one by far. Of course! 

Let's not forget this woman "broke her back" during childbirth. Cannot wait for LVP to call ¥oFo out for alleging her two spawn that aren't international modeling sensations are likewise inflicted with the Lyme's.

If I were in her social circle, I would so want to play that game with her.

"Oh, yes, I know how you feel, but I actually just had a 3 foot parasite removed from my body, the doctor actually asked if they could include a photo in a medical journal."

"Did you say you had 3 back fusions? That is almost as bad as my four".

"My surgeon has completed 10,000 explant surgeries. She says that mine was the worst. Ever."

"Would you care to see my second closet full of medications?"

"If only I had to have weekly colonics, these daily ones are really becoming too much."

"You are so lucky that only 2 of your children are suffering with the Lyme. My four babies can hardly function."

" I was once bedridden for 10 years. Do you have any idea of how many white robes I went through?"

Edited January 21, 2016 by Happy Camper

[swankie]

Cedric is obviously gay.  IIRC he was simply a con man who played on Lisa (and Ken's?) sympathies with a bunch of made up stories about his abusive/deprived childhood.  Lisa enjoyed his company, and I don't think Ken minded him too much in the beginning.  After a while, cracks began to show, and Ken got sick of his freeloading ways.  Maybe because Cedric came on RHBH the truth about his lies soon began to surface, and Lisa had to face who this guy really was.

 

I'm not sure if it shows Lisa's soft heart or stupidity, or both.

 

Cedric, like Brandi, was one of Lisa's pet projects that ended up turning on her.  She adopts these leeches and blindly welcomes them into her home.  Lisa believes she can control people like Cedric and Brandi and have their undying loyalty, but what she doesn't realize is they have no souls and the more she gave, the more they wanted in return until they ultimately betrayed her.  I would say it was more stupidity.

[Petunia13]

Cedric is obviously gay. IIRC he was simply a con man who played on Lisa (and Ken's?) sympathies with a bunch of made up stories about his abusive/deprived childhood. Lisa enjoyed his company, and I don't think Ken minded him too much in the beginning. After a while, cracks began to show, and Ken got sick of his freeloading ways. Maybe because Cedric came on RHBH the truth about his lies soon began to surface, and Lisa had to face who this guy really was.

I'm not sure if it shows Lisa's soft heart or stupidity, or both.

It was a ripoff of Six Degrees of Separation .

[motorcitymom65]

I know a lot of people have problems with this, but it makes sense to me.   There are three different issues at work, IMO.  First of all, Kyle will be held accountable (by the other K's) for what she says, doesn't say, "allows" others to say about Kim.  That's been made clear, and I don't think anyone disputes it.  The second issue is that Kyle knows the rest of the cast despises Kim.  No matter how hurt or angry Kyle is with Kim, she doesn't want to hear her trashed.  In contrast, Faye and Beth have been friends of the family for years.  They have a relationship with Kim outside Kyle, genuinely care about Kim, and have watched this dysfunctional relationship for decades.  Kyle feels they discuss Kim with genuine concern.  The third issues is Kim's children.  Even if Kyle wanted to humiliate and eviscerate Kim on camera, she knows how much she would hurt her nieces and nephew.  She knows the rest of the cast have little to no concern about the rest of the Richards family.

 

But the bottom line, IMO, is Kyle just doesn't like to criticize family - period.  She defends that horror show of a mother, she defends the childhood their mother pushed onto them, she defends even her most irresponsible nieces and nephews.  She also seemed really close with the aunt and cousin that showed up, whereas I'm sure Kathy holds herself above them.

 

And why wouldn't Kyle wish discuss Kim on her terms?  She has Eileen saying dramatic shit like Kim escaped from rehab.  LVP is desperately trying to get Kyle to trash the other two Ks on camera, and Lisa R. is manufacturing an unresolved blood feud with Kim, and she's just furious that she cannot discuss Kim Richards!  Kyle is trusting and gullible, but she's seen through LVP's machinations for years now, and her experience with Carlton has probably made her a little gun shy about being casual and open.

 

 

 

Great post.  I completely agree, and IMO it is one of the most human of all the emotions raging on this show. Lisar and Lisa V in particular don't care for Kim. They have felt slighted by her, been insulted by her, are mad at her. True, they work with her, but they don't have any real relationship with her or care about her. When they speak of her it naturally puts Kyle in a defensive position. She would like to work on a relationship with Kim, and certainly wants to remain close to Kim's children. I agree that she can and should shut it down if it upsets her, but I think that she has. She tried to shut Lisa down when she brought it up around her family on the first or second episode, cut Lisa short when she was talking about it on the phone,and told them when they were all asking questions in the Hampton's that she couldn't talk about it (when they were getting into details about the arrest and asking if Kim was "on something"). Lisar said in her blog that the one thing they all know is that Kyle is very sensitive to this line of discussion. Certainly, they have the right to talk about whatever they want, but if they know she doesn't like it and they do it anyway, they would have to expect her to be hurt by it. It probably feels completely different when she talks about it with people who don't hate Kim, like Faye or Beth. 

 

The thing that really cracks me up right now is Lisar acting as if it is hurtful to her that she cannot talk about it with Kyle. Like it is such a huge burden on her; something she needs help from Kyle to get over. The issues with Kim from last season haven't caused any long-term damage to Lisar in her life, yet she knows that the very real issues Kyle has with Kim have done, and continue to do, real long-term emotional damage to Kyle. If she is her friend and she cares about Kyle, she needs to just let it go and move the fuck on. If she knows that Kyle is in a delicate position with her family, and being judged by the way she handles issues with Kim, she needs to just be supportive if she is her friend and not just in it for gossip. 

[ottergirl]

It will be interesting to see how this plays out. Lisa is the same to me as she always was...the difference this year is that she is being questioned by folks who are smarter than some of the others who questioned her in the past. Eileen is a smart cookie, and so is Erika. They aren't dazzled by her, nor are they afraid. Before she had people like Kyle (who I like, but she lives in fear of not being liked), or Brandi who is too self-destructive to do any real damage. The tide has turned a little bit this season. I did find it interesting that when questioned on WWHL, Kyle said that she loves Lisa V, and acted like they are OK. They posted several pics of themselves together at some Pet event near the end of the season, and they looked close at the time. I still believe a lot of the issues are going to come from Lisar, and I just don't think she has the credibility to pull anything off. I think that Kyle is kind of starting to doubt Lisar a little bit - not liking the way she in particular talks about Kim. I think that if Kyle has to make a choice between Lisar and Lisa V, Vanderpump is going to win.

 

Totally co-sign.  I think production really wanted to take LVP down in Season Four - it was her turn, and I've no doubt she is way too big for her britches off screen -  but they didn't have anyone capable of doing it.  Kyle is a pathological people pleaser (you're so right), and she gets emotional in the moment, can't think well on her feet.  Brandi is so erratic and untrustworthy herself, the only way she will ever get someone else taken down is as she did with Adrienne (and almost Kyle) - do something so horrible that they implode in fury.  Now you've got Eileen and, especially, Erica, who see through LVP and know how to play it.  And Yolanda has always wanted to take down LVP, although I think Yolanda is too compromised this season to do it, because the way she's handled her illness undermines her own credibility. So I think the LVP takedown might actually come this year.  Which, I admit, doesn't bother me too much. (I think LVP suspects it too, which is why she is dragging Ken around everywhere.)

 

On a separate note - I still think the entire series would have been different if Adrienne had been smarter in her response to Brandi's surrogacy reveal.  That still makes me furious.  Adrienne tried to control the storyline by implementing a gag order; Bravo and Andy were so mad about that, they constructed the season to make Adrienne look like the bad guy - Adrienne, whose only crime was trying to protect her kids from finding out about their parentage before she was ready to tell them.  It's disgusting.  I wish Adrienne had just realized you can't unring a bell; if she had said, "Yes, I used a surrogate for my twins.  As you yourself say, Brandi, everyone knows that, but I would have preferred it not be public until my boys are old enough to understand.  What I don't understand is why, if you're angry at me for not returning your phone calls, you would use private medical information to hurt my children."  

 

Who in God's name could possibly defend Brandi after something like that? I think it would have ended her run on the series - or totally changed the power dynamic.  Instead, Kyle and Camille, trying to defend Adrienne, ended up being on the wrong side of history, and it set up the vicious "dream team" of Brandi, LVP and Yolanda, thinking they could do no wrong.  Out Adrienne's surrogacy!  Spread tabloid rumors about Kyle's marriage!  And don't pay any consequences! Those were gross years.  I'm glad they're gone.

 

(PS I don't particularly like Adrienne.  She brought Brandi into the group in the first place, to take down LVP, thinking the (fake) Cedric connection would make LVP look bad.  LVP very smartly outplayed her on that front. But Brandi's actions towards Adrienne were disgusting; Brandi's entire run on the show was a living example of the tale of the scorpion and the frog. One HW after offered her a ride across the pond, only to end up stung and sinking.)

[Smacky55]

Faye is pretty ticked Bravo is using the murder of her friend for reality show fodder. People may not appreciate Faye's memories of her slain friend and she has been outspoken about violence against women. I think it is very hard for her and Kris Jenner to have both heard their friend say she would be murdered by OJ (Kathryn and Marcus' friend at the time of the murder and trial) and OJ would get away with it. What a horrible thing to come true.

It came across to me as somebody else said aren't you ticked off about it and then Faye agreed. Unfortunately I can't muster up any sympathy for her because she seems to have been one of the people to have capitalized the most from her friend's murder.

[talula]

I heard "empaty," too. Didn't she also have difficulty understanding a particular word that Andy used at one of her earlier reunions? Why doesn't someone on production lecture her about speaking English since she lives in America?

This season I definitely hear more of the Dutch accent then in past season. I believe something has changed and Yolanda is revealing the way she really talks. There are quite a few words she doesn't say correctly in English. With all the time/money she has she might wish to take English lessons to up her speaking ability especially since she's on TV, IMO.

[motorcitymom65]

I think I'm in the minority, but the OJ stuff is still interesting to me. It cracks me up that Faye would be irritated by it, since this remains her biggest claim to fame. The entire deal has always fascinated me, and when I hear her name, I think of the OJ deal. I wouldn't know any of the Kardashian's if they came up and slapped my face, but when I hear the name, I think OJ. When I hear the name Marcus Allen, I think of OJ. I think that with Faye, it has always been the elephant in the room, and was the reason she was named the MCFR to begin with. To explore more of that story is IMO interesting. I am surprised that a famewhore like Faye wouldn't want the opportunity to explain her side of the story, considering how many people have judged her for her behavior in this matter for years.  I include myself in that category. I never disliked Faye for the Brandi stuff - hell, I kind of loved her for all of that and wished she would have been around last year to give Brandi a little bit more. My feelings about her are entirely about her behavior surrounding the book and the trial. Since it's actually a timely subject with the movie coming out, I don't mind hearing more about it. 

[SheTalksShit]

I liked this episode - it seemed to be zeroing in, once again, on Lisa Vanderpump's personality. 

 

I like LVP. I think she's a good person, generous, loyal, loves to help people and animals, smart, funny and most definitely persuasive and entertaining to watch. But time and time again, her co-stars have said she's manipulative, calculating, holds grudges, can't admit she's wrong and likes to be in control. There has to be some truth to it - in fact, I know there is because watching her, I can see it. 

 

Instead of just apologizing to Eileen, she tried to make it seem like Eileen was not justified in the way she felt because she opened up about her abusive ex. It's like every small slight towards her, she holds onto and brings it up in every conversation about that person. I also think Erica was spot on that she likes to make people uncomfortable sometimes so she can be in control. She likes to be the dominant one in every relationship she has. 

 

I don't think Eileen is tough enough to handle LVP, but I think Erika is. 

 

When I first watched the trailer for this season, months ago and saw Lisa R. say "she manipulates all of us with it," and Erika say, "I think she doesn't want to leave any fingerprints," t thought it was Yolanda they were talking about, since this season looked like it was gonna focus on her lyme disease and whether or not she had it. Now, I think they may have been talking about LVP. 

[SheTalksShit]

I actually think Brandi and Faye have a lot in common, so it's funny to me they don't get along. They're cut from the same cloth. They both repeat gossip as if it's fact, both can't stop meddling in other people's business and both seem to leave a trail of drama and chaos everywhere they go. 

 

I find Faye more likable, for some reason, but maybe I wouldn't if she were a full-time cast member of the show. 

I think I'm in the minority, but the OJ stuff is still interesting to me. It cracks me up that Faye would be irritated by it, since this remains her biggest claim to fame. The entire deal has always fascinated me, and when I hear her name, I think of the OJ deal. I wouldn't know any of the Kardashian's if they came up and slapped my face, but when I hear the name, I think OJ. When I hear the name Marcus Allen, I think of OJ. I think that with Faye, it has always been the elephant in the room, and was the reason she was named the MCFR to begin with. To explore more of that story is IMO interesting. I am surprised that a famewhore like Faye wouldn't want the opportunity to explain her side of the story, considering how many people have judged her for her behavior in this matter for years.  I include myself in that category. I never disliked Faye for the Brandi stuff - hell, I kind of loved her for all of that and wished she would have been around last year to give Brandi a little bit more. My feelings about her are entirely about her behavior surrounding the book and the trial. Since it's actually a timely subject with the movie coming out, I don't mind hearing more about it. 

[LIMOM]

This season I definitely hear more of the Dutch accent then in past season. I believe something has changed and Yolanda is revealing the way she really talks. There are quite a few words she doesn't say correctly in English. With all the time/money she has she might wish to take English lessons to up her speaking ability especially since she's on TV, IMO.

In time of stress, many people regress, IMO.

I am not a native English speaker and my accent goes from bad to worst depending on what is going on in my personal life.

In addition, if Yolanda spends a lot of time conversing in Dutch, it could be hard for her to transition back and forth.

[ryebread]

This season I definitely hear more of the Dutch accent then in past season. I believe something has changed and Yolanda is revealing the way she really talks. There are quite a few words she doesn't say correctly in English. With all the time/money she has she might wish to take English lessons to up her speaking ability especially since she's on TV, IMO.

FWIW, my dad is a highly intelligent man. Very well spoken.  A brilliant writer.  Three years into his Alzheimer's diagnosis, he began using the crude versions of words he used as a boy growing up in the south. "I need to worsh my face."   "I ain't feeling good.."  "Git me my glasses, Sugar."

 

The doctors explained that the part of his brain that is affected by the Alz kills his short term memory.  He's reverting back to his long term.  He never called me 'Sugar' my whole life but he does all the time now.  Turns out, his mother called all 8 of her kids 'Sugar' throughout their childhood seventy years ago. The brain is a complex thing.  I believe that's what's happening to Yolanda.  Some disconnection in her brain is making her revert back to her childhood speak pattern/language.

Edited January 21, 2016 by ryebread

[SheTalksShit]

You're correct on the Cedric thing.

 

And RadarOnline even specifically said, after the Reunion, that Lisa had never sold any stories to them. And I don't believe she would because she's super wealthy and in no way that desperate for cash. 

 

Lisa is way too clever to do either of those things. She's way too smart to ever leave a trail like that. 

It was in the e mails from PRODUCTION to Cedric, NOT from any e mail Lisa sent Cedric or any she sent production! Again, production has done this type of thing time and time again across the franchise.

 

Lisa was upset that Adrienne believed a lie, didn't bother to ask her directly and instead tried to get the others to go against her at the reunion.

Edited January 21, 2016 by SheTalksShit

[Yours Truly]

 

Also, about Camille, yes, she said she was also told it was Lisa BUT that she didn't believe it and was able to confirm it was in fact NOT Lisa well before the reunion was filmed.

See this I remember. I remember the conversation getting messy and no one was controlling the OFFICIAL outcome just what fueled all the suspicion and I remember that once Camille agreed that she heard the same thing the wives started tittering and all that and it was hard to get back to Camille and her declaration that she did not believe it and in fact it turned out not to be true but by then everyone was so into going for Lisa that the vibe was still stuck in the atmosphere even with proof that Lisa didn't do it.

Edited January 21, 2016 by Yours Truly

[SheTalksShit]

I agree Lisa R. sucks, but I don't think she's manipulative and I don't think she sounded proud of what happened w/Kim. I think she genuinely felt guilty (as she should, IMO, because I think she did stress Kim out and what she did may have certainly influenced Kim's decisions/behavior and she certainly stressed her out w/the rumors). 

 

I don't think Lisa R. ever has bad intentions, I think she means well, but has a big mouth and terrible judgement and doesn't know when to keep her thoughts to herself. 

LisaR is the worst. She feels "somewhat responsible" for Kim spiraling out of control. She acts proud that she 'stressed' Kim out and that she was Kim's "worst nightmare".  That's really something to be proud of, isn't it?  Her tendency to poke and kick someone when they're down is cruel.  Imo.  Kim was awful to her, true story.  I'm not quite sure what Yo did to her, but Lisa is 'supposedly' healthier in mind and body than both.  She should act like it. I know people say, 'fuck being the bigger person', this is just my personal feeling.

 

Yesterday, listening to the news about the Massachusetts teen who urged her boyfriend to kill himself via text message. I know this is an extreme example but Lisa Rinna popped into my head as I was thinking how heinous that is.  Not saying she'd do something like that, just that my mind went there. 

 

When she was exposed on the reunion for sending threatening texts to Kim, she turned that around by suddenly throwing her dad under the bus and crying.

Edited January 21, 2016 by SheTalksShit

[ryebread]

I am surprised that a famewhore like Faye wouldn't want the opportunity to explain her side of the story, considering how many people have judged her for her behavior in this matter for years.

 

Oh, I think she will take any opportunity to get her mug on TV. She might say she doesn't want to go there, but she does. To get her side out? For airtime? I don't know,  but I think she welcomed the opportunity.

[Yours Truly]

They e-mails are dated and it clearly states an 8:30 arrival tomorrow and Lisa has been told.  It does not get much clearer than that.  Sorry but it is in print, the last shoot of the year so there is no real surprise factor.

 

 

I think the real point is that these are emails from people OTHER than Lisa so in matters where someone is denying something unless you are producing an email straight from Lisa's account where the message can be seen as coming directly from HER than it's not really proof. To put it simply, it's very possible the producers were not being a hundred percent truthful in that email which wouldn't be a surprise considering that they pull these sort of things all the time. I mean, tactics like these are pretty much the whole premise of the Housewives. Not a far stretch to believe that production can be a bit underhanded when it comes to getting that REAL REACTION. What it basically comes down to is whether people are willing to take the producers word for it and I have to say I know I wouldn't since they can't be trusted. This sort of debacle seems right up their alley to coordinate if you ask me.

Edited January 21, 2016 by Yours Truly

[SheTalksShit]

Oh, I think she will take any opportunity to get her mug on TV. She might say she doesn't want to go there, but she does. To get her side out? For airtime? I don't know,  but I think she welcomed the opportunity.

yup. I think Faye is an attention-whore who is addicted to drama. 

[Duke2801]

QuoteI think I'm in the minority, but the OJ stuff is still interesting to me

 

 

I fully admit I'm anticipating watching The People v. OJ Simpson.

 

I'm already cringing at Ross playing Robert Kardashian though!

[zoeysmom]

I think the real point is that these are emails from people OTHER than Lisa so in matters where someone is denying something unless you are producing an email straight from Lisa's account where the message can be seen as coming directly from HER than it's not really proof. To but it simply, it's very possible the producers where not being a hundred percent truthful in that email which wouldn't be a surprise considering that they pull these sort of things all the time. I mean, tactics like these are pretty much the whole premise of the Housewives. Not a far stretch to believe that production can be a bit underhanded when it comes to getting that REAL REACTION. What it basically comes down to is if people are willing to take the producers word for it and I have to say I know I wouldn't since they can't be trusted. This sort of debacle seems right up their alley to coordinate if you ask me.

These are people with contracts who work with the production company all the time.  They have to make arrangements prior to filming.

 

LVP has had prior "surprises" and been called out on it.  Twice with Faye Resnick (once at her tea and again at her renewal ceremony) and Kyle points out that Faye is on the production schedule, of which LVP has a copy of.  Another time with having Scheana at her house and not telling Brandi and pretending she had no idea it would happen.  So I am not buying any excuses for LVP and her alleged surprise guests or help.  I believe LVP likes to keep things moving along and to do so she has to have a little nudge from production.   What made the situation with Cedric unique was production was saying they did not want the other RH to know he would be attending. The producers said in the e-mail Lisa was not thrilled with the olive branch idea but that it was set.  So my money is on LVP knowing and deciding she wanted nothing to do with Cedric and brushing him off quickly. 

[Yours Truly]

These are people with contracts who work with the production company all the time.  They have to make arrangements prior to filming.

 

LVP has had prior "surprises" and been called out on it.  Twice with Faye Resnick (once at her tea and again at her renewal ceremony) and Kyle points out that Faye is on the production schedule, of which LVP has a copy of.  Another time with having Scheana at her house and not telling Brandi and pretending she had no idea it would happen.  So I am not buying any excuses for LVP and her alleged surprise guests or help.  I believe LVP likes to keep things moving along and to do so she has to have a little nudge from production.   What made the situation with Cedric unique was production was saying they did not want the other RH to know he would be attending. The producers said in the e-mail Lisa was not thrilled with the olive branch idea but that it was set.  So my money is on LVP knowing and deciding she wanted nothing to do with Cedric and brushing him off quickly. 

Makes sense.

 

I'm just asserting that someone else's word (whether verbal or in print) can't be considered 100% proof though. That's all. There's room for deception on both sides so it boils down to who believes who would be more likely to do what in what situation which brings it all back to maybe, maybe not and not so much there being absolute proof one way or the other. I mean the way this proof was presented as some smoking gun I thought I would be seeing emails directly from Lisa not an email with producers speaking "on her behalf" with very little details about the who what when and where. That's my take anyway.

Edited January 21, 2016 by Yours Truly

[ottergirl]

These are people with contracts who work with the production company all the time.  They have to make arrangements prior to filming.

 

LVP has had prior "surprises" and been called out on it.  Twice with Faye Resnick (once at her tea and again at her renewal ceremony) and Kyle points out that Faye is on the production schedule, of which LVP has a copy of.  Another time with having Scheana at her house and not telling Brandi and pretending she had no idea it would happen.  So I am not buying any excuses for LVP and her alleged surprise guests or help.  I believe LVP likes to keep things moving along and to do so she has to have a little nudge from production.   What made the situation with Cedric unique was production was saying they did not want the other RH to know he would be attending. The producers said in the e-mail Lisa was not thrilled with the olive branch idea but that it was set.  So my money is on LVP knowing and deciding she wanted nothing to do with Cedric and brushing him off quickly. 

 

Yep.  This is where LVP gets on my nerves and always has.  Manipulating production, fine - but then claiming ignorance when it suits you, to make others look bad, that's crappy.  She raked Kyle over the coals for bringing Faye to that event; but as Kyle said, Faye that season was a paid FOH, member of the cast, and was expected to be there.  Same with Scheana.  I couldn't have real sympathy for Brandi, though - she used Eddie and Scheana to get attention and sympathy for herself early on; to then claim it was too hurtful and that LVP was an awful person for bringing it up again - eh.  

 

I also always found it interesting, in that production email, that LVP knew Cedric was coming but the other wives didn't. I wonder how many rules are different for LVP.

[zoeysmom]

Makes sense.

 

I'm just asserting that someone else's word (whether verbal or in print) can't be considered 100% proof though. That's all. There's room for deception on both sides so it boils down to who believes who would be more likely to do what in what situation which brings it all back to maybe, maybe not and not so much there being absolute proof one way or the other. I mean the way this proof was presented as some smoking gun I thought I would be seeing emails directly from Lisa not an email with producers speaking "on her behalf" with very little details about the who what when and where. That's my take anyway.

I don't think LVP has disputed the production e-mail.  Rightfully she has discredited Cedric who just breaks out with diarrhea of the mouth when it comes to Lisa but she did not dispute production's assertion. 

 

I think maybe one of the most thinly veiled production set ups is this whole OJ nonsense and Kathryn and Faye.  Lisar had a horrible segue and I am glad Kathryn called her out on it even if it was in her blog, Kyle was clumsy as hell and had little regard for the victim or her friends and family in the quest to make RHOBH relevant with the upcoming OJ mini-series.  So I think production is doing a horrible job this year with the planting of storylines. 

[zoeysmom]

Yep.  This is where LVP gets on my nerves and always has.  Manipulating production, fine - but then claiming ignorance when it suits you, to make others look bad, that's crappy.  She raked Kyle over the coals for bringing Faye to that event; but as Kyle said, Faye that season was a paid FOH, member of the cast, and was expected to be there.  Same with Scheana.  I couldn't have real sympathy for Brandi, though - she used Eddie and Scheana to get attention and sympathy for herself early on; to then claim it was too hurtful and that LVP was an awful person for bringing it up again - eh.  

 

I also always found it interesting, in that production email, that LVP knew Cedric was coming but the other wives didn't. I wonder how many rules are different for LVP.

What was great about that event was Brandi, who had recently bonded with LVP, look of panic when LVP looked at her when she saw Cedric.  Brandi was real in her-I didn't bring him.  That same event I believe saw Scheana just starting her new job assignment at SUR,who LVP claimed she had no idea had ever had an affair with Eddie.  Can't stand Brandi but there is just no way a restaurant owner, who is actively recruiting people to be on her new TV show, just passed over the fact that Scheana had been in the news for having shagged Eddie. 

 

Since they are going down the rabbit hole I will be interested to see how long it takes LVP to be connected with one of the dozens of players in the OJ Simpson saga.

[Rosebud1970]

 

 

 

 

Eileen telling the women she was in an abusive relationship showed a sign of strength to me.  Yet I don't know what she quite meant when she said "When people see a person like me they don't think that."  Umm Eileen abuse comes in all walks life it just doesn't come with economic class or how you look.  Anyone can be subjected to a violent relationship.  Just saying.

 

 

I believe what Eileen was referring to was not her 'walk of life' or her income level, but Eileen herself. Eileen comes across as a very strong woman, one who knows what she wants and someone who does what she has to do to get it. Someone who would never allow herself to be abused. Or...someone who would never be in an abusive relationship. Yet, she was. I think that people who have never been in abusive relationships think that the women who are, are weak and somewhat helpless.

 

Eileen presents herself, and is, the opposite of that.

 

I believe that is what she meant by that comment.

[kokapetl]

Cedric's emails from a producer mostly just proved that Cedric is an untrustworthy idiot. That email was an executive producer essentially detailing how they planned to get some conflict on film, the manipulation was laid bare in it. The last thing the executive producers want is for one of the performers to ruin the illusion by exposing the manipulation of crew behind the camera, even if the performer is too stupid to know what he actually did. The producer essentially says in the email that they're misleading other performers, if Cedric had a brain he should've figured out that there's a chance he was also being mislead, and even Lisa may have been too.

Lisa knows it's never a good idea to irritate the executive producers. Using "producer shenanigans" as part of her defense, even if it's the truth, would irritate them. She argued her case within the boundaries of the production. She knows her place, she knows how these shows work, she got to be an executive producer on her own spin off.

Edited January 21, 2016 by Kokapetl

[Almost 3000]

I don't think LVP has disputed the production e-mail.  Rightfully she has discredited Cedric who just breaks out with diarrhea of the mouth when it comes to Lisa but she did not dispute production's assertion. 

 

I think maybe one of the most thinly veiled production set ups is this whole OJ nonsense and Kathryn and Faye.  Lisar had a horrible segue and I am glad Kathryn called her out on it even if it was in her blog, Kyle was clumsy as hell and had little regard for the victim or her friends and family in the quest to make RHOBH relevant with the upcoming OJ mini-series.  So I think production is doing a horrible job this year with the planting of storylines.

Yeah, you'd think all the actresses would be able to sell the story better. Its oh so obvious but making it even worse the editing is clunky. Edited January 21, 2016 by Almost 3000

[Wings]

 

 

 

I fully admit I'm anticipating watching The People v. OJ Simpson.

 

I'm already cringing at Ross playing Robert Kardashian though!

 

 

I agree.  Wimpy Ross with his monkey, Marcel, haunts my brain.  

[phoenix780]

I wonder if the actresses and editing are sometimes deliberately clunky to make the rest of it feel more authentic.

Edited January 21, 2016 by phoenix780

[BlackMamba]

I never disliked Faye for the Brandi stuff - hell, I kind of loved her for all of that and wished she would have been around last year to give Brandi a little bit more.

Same here. Faye spotted that rotten egg in Brandi which always pissed off Brandi because she couldn't pull an emotional con on Faye.

[LIMOM]

Same here. Faye spotted that rotten egg in Brandi which always pissed off Brandi because she couldn't pull an emotional con on Faye.

Game recognizes game.

[zoeysmom]

I think I'm in the minority, but the OJ stuff is still interesting to me. It cracks me up that Faye would be irritated by it, since this remains her biggest claim to fame. The entire deal has always fascinated me, and when I hear her name, I think of the OJ deal. I wouldn't know any of the Kardashian's if they came up and slapped my face, but when I hear the name, I think OJ. When I hear the name Marcus Allen, I think of OJ. I think that with Faye, it has always been the elephant in the room, and was the reason she was named the MCFR to begin with. To explore more of that story is IMO interesting. I am surprised that a famewhore like Faye wouldn't want the opportunity to explain her side of the story, considering how many people have judged her for her behavior in this matter for years.  I include myself in that category. I never disliked Faye for the Brandi stuff - hell, I kind of loved her for all of that and wished she would have been around last year to give Brandi a little bit more. My feelings about her are entirely about her behavior surrounding the book and the trial. Since it's actually a timely subject with the movie coming out, I don't mind hearing more about it. 

I do not know how to start a new topic but from what I have read and seen the OJ topic will play out throughout the season.  For those who want to talk about Faye and the various OJ players and how they have crossed the lives of the RHOBH it might be great to have a separate topic.  There seems to be lots of extemporaneous material out there.

 

I have always thought that Faye felt her portrayal of Nicole was honest and heartfelt. Nicole wasn't a perfect person.  In terms of this show she was a "home wrecker" coming between OJ and his first wife who was pregnant with their third child at the time. I don't think Faye went into that aspect of Nicole's life. Since there have been literally hundreds of books and articles written about Nicole, OJ and the trial, I think it is somewhat unfair that Faye is singled out as the one capitalizing on the friendship/tragedy.  To this day the Brown family, who certainly had their own integrity issues with the money and the memory of Nicole, are still mad at Kris Jenner for making money off the situation. 

 

Most of all it shows a pretty low threshold of intelligence why Kyle would think Faye and Kathryn would have run in the same circles.  I would have been more curious to find out if Kathryn was ever friends with Nicole.  If they are going to bring it up then they need to acknowledge at the heart of it all was a 35 year old mother of two was murdered.  Not a "shit storm".

[heatherchandler]

I agree.  Wimpy Ross with his monkey, Marcel, haunts my brain.  

 

Could he BE anymore wimpy?

[LIMOM]

I do not know how to start a new topic but from what I have read and seen the OJ topic will play out throughout the season.  For those who want to talk about Faye and the various OJ players and how they have crossed the lives of the RHOBH it might be great to have a separate topic.  There seems to be lots of extemporaneous material out there.

 

I have always thought that Faye felt her portrayal of Nicole was honest and heartfelt. Nicole wasn't a perfect person.  In terms of this show she was a "home wrecker" coming between OJ and his first wife who was pregnant with their third child at the time. I don't think Faye went into that aspect of Nicole's life. Since there have been literally hundreds of books and articles written about Nicole, OJ and the trial, I think it is somewhat unfair that Faye is singled out as the one capitalizing on the friendship/tragedy.  To this day the Brown family, who certainly had their own integrity issues with the money and the memory of Nicole, are still mad at Kris Jenner for making money off the situation. 

 

Most of all it shows a pretty low threshold of intelligence why Kyle would think Faye and Kathryn would have run in the same circles.  I would have been more curious to find out if Kathryn was ever friends with Nicole.  If they are going to bring it up then they need to acknowledge at the heart of it all was a 35 year old mother of two was murdered.  Not a "shit storm".

How did Kris Jenner make money out of the situation?

[Missmissie173]

Lisa and Ken are starting to seem like granny and grandpa who bring their damn dog when they come to stay at your house during the holidays.

Good Gravy Yes!  Preach on Sister!  Why are they trying to age LVP this season?  LisaV is only mid 50ish...production is making her look like look mid 70s, what with her prim and proper attitudes and her over the hill  "English Ladies that lunch" clothes and make-up.  She needs a new stylist pronto.  Drop the dippy hats.

 

AND.  Make sure the door is locked at the Rest Home so Ken can no longer totter out with sedated Giggy in tow,

Edited January 21, 2016 by Missmissie173

[zoeysmom]

How did Kris Jenner make money out of the situation?

I am repeated what I read -allegedly Kris Jenner in her book had a chapter about Nicole and Denise Brown is unhappy and apparently now claims she is mentally ill.  Like I said we need a thread.  All these periphery players might prove to be interesting.

 

Here is one example of people making money off the Nicole tragedy/OJ trial.  Al Cowlings, driver of the slow chase Bronco and former boyfriend of OJ's first wife, decided to announce a 900 telephone number to answers all questions not related to the crime.  At $2.00 a minute it is estimated he made over a million dollars.

[LIMOM]

I am repeated what I read -allegedly Kris Jenner in her book had a chapter about Nicole and Denise Brown is unhappy and apparently now claims she is mentally ill.  Like I said we need a thread.  All these periphery players might prove to be interesting.

 

Here is one example of people making money off the Nicole tragedy/OJ trial.  Al Cowlings, driver of the slow chase Bronco and former boyfriend of OJ's first wife, decided to announce a 900 telephone number to answers all questions not related to the crime.  At $2.00 a minute it is estimated he made over a million dollars.

In her new Book?

The one where she details her own affair?

[PhilMarlowe2]

Here is one example of people making money off the Nicole tragedy/OJ trial.  Al Cowlings, driver of the slow chase Bronco and former boyfriend of OJ's first wife, decided to announce a 900 telephone number to answers all questions not related to the crime.  At $2.00 a minute it is estimated he made over a million dollars.

 

See, in a weird way, I can actually respect this because at least he's owning what he's doing - "Hey, I have 15 min of fame, I'm cashing in!" There is no disguising that he wants to capitalize on the fame while he's got it. And if he made a million, god bless him. Faye, on the other hand, would never cop to her true intentions and I'm sure would dress it up in some moral righteousness of needing to "get the story out there."

[kassa]

Faye is pretty ticked Bravo is using the murder of her friend for reality show fodder.

 

 

In the words of the late, great Nora Ephron... that's rich.  That's really rich.

Since there have been literally hundreds of books and articles written about Nicole, OJ and the trial, I think it is somewhat unfair that Faye is singled out as the one capitalizing on the friendship/tragedy.

 

 

She published a (particularly unflattering) book about her murdered friend within four months of the murder.   Books aren't created overnight -- the body was barely cold when she must have agreed to do it.  She hit every talk show pimping her association with Nicole (and the book itself).   

 

Faye's biography painted Nicole in a nasty light before her murderer was even brought to trial.  Jury selection had to be halted while they figured out how badly the book might have tainted the jury.

 

Sure, she wrapped up her money grab with "I just wanted everybody to know how awful OJ was to my dear, sweet, murdered friend" but she made sure that everybody also knew every sordid thing Nicole may have ever done (or possibly never done).  Drugs, lesbian kisses, affairs -- not exactly the sort of thing that most murder victim advocates highlight in their impassioned fights for their lost loved ones.  Especially when that would provide fodder for the very dirtbag they think murdered their friend who is spreading alternative theories about who could have killed her.  

 

Kathryn is now here as somebody whose (first) husband was directly impacted by the book, which implicated him as not only an adulterer and betrayer of his friend, OJ, but possibly one of the cogs in the wheel that ended in her murder.  Kathryn obviously still cares for him (she told the ladies he was a great guy) and the showdown looms.  

Edited January 21, 2016 by kassa

[zoeysmom]

In the words of the late, great Nora Ephron... that's rich.  That's really rich.

 

She published a (particularly unflattering) book about her murdered friend within four months of the murder.   Books aren't created overnight -- the body was barely cold when she must have agreed to do it.  She hit every talk show pimping her association with Nicole (and the book itself).   

 

Faye's biography painted Nicole in a nasty light before her murderer was even brought to trial.  Jury selection had to be halted while they figured out how badly the book might have tainted the jury.

 

Sure, she wrapped up her money grab with "I just wanted everybody to know how awful OJ was to my dear, sweet, murdered friend" but she made sure that everybody also knew every sordid thing Nicole may have ever done (or possibly never done).  Drugs, lesbian kisses, affairs -- not exactly the sort of thing that most murder victim advocates highlight in their impassioned fights for their lost loved ones.  Especially when that would provide fodder for the very dirtbag they think murdered their friend who is spreading alternative theories about who could have killed her.  

 

Kathryn is now here as somebody whose (first) husband was directly impacted by the book, which implicated him as not only an adulterer and betrayer of his friend, OJ, but possibly one of the cogs in the wheel that ended in her murder.  Kathryn obviously still cares for him (she told the ladies he was a great guy) and the showdown looms.  

See there is a lot of discussion.  Faye was not the only one repeating what Nicole had said about Marcus Allen.  Others knew and repeated the story.  I can see why Kathryn is angry at Faye.  I always ask the burning question-if your ex is such a great person, why aren't you still married?

 

I never got the impression Faye released every sordid detail of Nicole's life.  Again, Nicole had an affair with the husband of a pregnant woman. The LA Times article at the time said she disclosed, an affair with Marcus Allen, a one night stand, after she divorced and making out with Faye.  The victim was not on trial -OJ was.  The alternative theories were readily available through say Robert Kardashian or OJ himself.  Here is the USA Today review of the book:  http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/life/enter/books/lebj03.htm

 

I can see where Kathryn probably had a lot of hatred towards Faye.  It would be such a bizarre thing to make up about Marcus Allen for Faye to pull his name out of thin air.

[ryebread]

She published a (particularly unflattering) book about her murdered friend within four months of the murder.   Books aren't created overnight -- the body was barely cold when she must have agreed to do it.  She hit every talk show pimping her association with Nicole (and the book itself). 

 

She didn't just pimp her association with Nicole.  She wrote a sleazy book about her friend - her slaughtered BEST friend - whom she said she loved. The book hit the stands before the final jury was even selected.

 

But the worst part...Faye made OJ's defense teams job easy.  They needed to paint an unfavorable picture of Nicole.  Faye gave them every thing they needed.  She not only threw her beloved, brutally murdered best friend under the bus, she helped the defense protect her murderer. 

[kassa]

Faye was not the only one repeating what Nicole had said about Marcus Allen.

 

She sold it for money. 

[HumblePi]

This episode proved to me that Bravo is reaching deep into their pocket of desperation by introducing Kathryn Edwards into the group. This will rehash some horrible things that a lot of people would rather forget. Faye Resnick is always the catalyst for some serious shit-stirring. Faye enjoys stirring the pot as much as any of them, she loves creating drama as they all do. I thought at one time that she would be introduced as one of the new housewives. Faye has made quite a few appearances on the show over the past few years, she can thank Kyle for that.

 

Faye Resnick was an admitted cocaine addict who was also a good friend to Nicole Brown Simpson and Kris Jenner. Faye's drug problem was serious enough to require an intervention from her family. After the intervention, she agreed to enter treatment. Prior to entering rehab, she stayed with Nicole in her condo for several days. Four days later, Nicole Brown Simpson and Ron Goldman were murdered at Nicole's condo. Faye Resnick was served papers by O.J. Simpson's lawyers to testify in the trial. Coincidentally when the process servers for the papers found Faye, she was at a Los Angeles park with her daughter Francesca who was playing softball with her friend Khloe Kardashian. Faye Resnick, Nicole and O.J.. Simpson, Kris and Bruce Jenner and Robert Kardashian were all a part of a very exclusive circle of friends.

 

In 1994, Faye Resnick wrote a book called "Nicole Brown Simpson: The Private Diary of a Life Interrupted," In the book she contends that Nicole had a very passionate affair with Marcus Allen while he was married to Kathryn Edwards. (Allen was Kathryn's first husband)  Marcus was best friends with O.J. Simpson at the time and also a NFL football player. Marcus Allen has always denied this affair. Faye Resnick suggested that it was this affair that 'set off' O.J. Simpson and enraged him enough to murder Nichole and Ron Goldman.

 

I think that Kyle Richards is a total witch for bringing up Faye Resnick's name to Kathryn Edwards with everyone else present at the table. Kyle knows the history as reported by Faye Resnick and she's very aware she's doing nothing more than stirring the pot in a very evil way. For anyone in this forum that is old enough to recall the days of the O.J. trial, you will as I do have a sinking feeling of 'oh no, not this again'. Of course it was the trial of the century and people followed every day on live television from the courtroom where Kris and Bruce were usually seated in the gallery.  I happened to be vacationing in California the week the trial ended and the not guilty verdict was announced as we drove through L.A. and past the courthouse. Helicopters and press were everywhere. Truthfully it was a sickening, long, dark trial that didn't end with any justice for the two people murdered. Simpson was acquitted of the murders in that trial but was later found liable for Goldman's death in a civil trial.

 

For Bravo to bring this all up again after these things are ancient history is sort of disgusting to me. Intertwining the alleged affair between Marcus Allen and Nichole Simpson while introducing Kathryn Edwards as a new cast member is cheap and unnecessary. It's very interesting since there's a correlation to all this becoming a story-line right about the time the OJ miniseries airs.

Edited January 21, 2016 by HumblePi

[LIMOM]

She didn't just pimp her association with Nicole.  She wrote a sleazy book about her friend - her slaughtered BEST friend - whom she said she loved. The book hit the stands before the final jury was even selected.

 

But the worst part...Faye made OJ's defense teams job easy.  They needed to paint an unfavorable picture of Nicole.  Faye gave them every thing they needed.  She not only threw her beloved, brutally murdered best friend under the bus, she helped the defense protect her murderer.

Faye acted in a way that is unforgivable and unspeakable IMO.

I am glad that Kathryn did not claim her whatsoever.

Just thinking about her, make my blood pressure rises.

The original Frenemy.

[ryebread]

For those who want to talk about Faye and the various OJ players and how they have crossed the lives of the RHOBH it might be great to have a separate topic.  There seems to be lots of extemporaneous material out there.

 

I agree. There will probably be a separate forum for the mini-series because there usually is.  It's going to get hot in there, I'm afraid.  I don't want to see Faye and OJ overrun the HWs boards so I'm onboard with keeping most of the chatter that isn't related directly to the RHOBH episodes some where else.  Because as sure as I am that OJ did it, I'm sure the conversation about the trial is going to be turbulent.  I'm sort of excited but also a little scared. LOL

[Umbelina]

She didn't just pimp her association with Nicole.  She wrote a sleazy book about her friend - her slaughtered BEST friend - whom she said she loved. The book hit the stands before the final jury was even selected.

 

But the worst part...Faye made OJ's defense teams job easy.  They needed to paint an unfavorable picture of Nicole.  Faye gave them every thing they needed.  She not only threw her beloved, brutally murdered best friend under the bus, she helped the defense protect her murderer. 

 

 

This episode proved to me that Bravo is reaching deep into their pocket of desperation by introducing Kathryn Edwards into the group. This will rehash some horrible things that a lot of people would rather forget. Faye Resnick is always the catalyst for some serious shit-stirring. Faye enjoys stirring the pot as much as any of them, she loves creating drama as they all do. I thought at one time that she would be introduced as one of the new housewives. Faye has made quite a few appearances on the show over the past few years, she can thank Kyle for that.

 

Faye Resnick was an admitted cocaine addict who was also a good friend to Nicole Brown Simpson and Kris Jenner. Faye's drug problem was serious enough to require an intervention from her family. After the intervention, she agreed to enter treatment. Prior to entering rehab, she stayed with Nicole in her condo for several days. Four days later, Nicole Brown Simpson and Ron Goldman were murdered at Nicole's condo. Faye Resnick was served papers by O.J. Simpson's lawyers to testify in the trial. Coincidentally when the process servers for the papers found Faye, she was at a Los Angeles park with her daughter Francesca who was playing softball with her friend Khloe Kardashian. Faye Resnick, Nicole and O.J.. Simpson, Kris and Bruce Jenner and Robert Kardashian were all a part of a very exclusive circle of friends.

 

In 1994, Faye Resnick wrote a book called "Nicole Brown Simpson: The Private Diary of a Life Interrupted," In the book she contends that Nicole had a very passionate affair with Marcus Allen while he was married to Kathryn Edwards. (Allen was Kathryn's first husband)  Marcus was best friends with O.J. Simpson at the time and also a NFL football player. Marcus Allen has always denied this affair. Faye Resnick suggested that it was this affair that 'set off' O.J. Simpson and enraged him enough to murder Nichole and Ron Goldman.

 

I think that Kyle Richards is a total witch for bringing up Faye Resnick's name to Kathryn Edwards with everyone else present at the table. Kyle knows the history as reported by Faye Resnick and she's very aware she's doing nothing more than stirring the pot in a very evil way. For anyone in this forum that is old enough to recall the days of the O.J. trial, you will as I do have a sinking feeling of 'oh no, not this again'. Of course it was the trial of the century and people followed every day on live television from the courtroom where Kris and Bruce were usually seated in the gallery.  I happened to be vacationing in California the week the trial ended and the not guilty verdict was announced as we drove through L.A. and past the courthouse. Helicopters and press were everywhere. Truthfully it was a sickening, long, dark trial that didn't end with any justice for the two people murdered. Simpson was acquitted of the murders in that trial but was later found liable for Goldman's death in a civil trial.

 

For Bravo to bring this all up again after these things are ancient history is sort of disgusting to me. Intertwining the alleged affair between Marcus Allen and Nichole Simpson while introducing Kathryn Edwards as a new cast member is cheap and unnecessary. It's very interesting since there's a correlation to all this becoming a story-line right about the time the OJ miniseries airs.

Great posts!

 

I agree, a separate thread is a good idea. 

 

Many think the OJ trial was the first "reality television" as well.  It pretty much helped kill the soaps, and in a very weird way, helped to create the Real Housewives shows.  I think that although discussion will be normal in the show threads, the volumes of background information that help explain what we see on the show would be much better handled in it's own thread, and yes, here, not just in a separate forum.

 

Obviously, most of the talk would be about the RHBH connections, but it will stray at times, background and setting count too.

 

As for Faye?  She is disgusting, and I so agree with Rye, her greed and lack of morals DID have a direct impact on that verdict.  For money.  Ugh.  That entire trial leaves such a bad taste in my mouth, as does Faye.

 

ETA

To create a thread click "start topic" at the top.  It would need to be something that shows this is the RHBH connection.

 

Nicole Simpson another Real Housewife of Beverly Hills

RHBH does OJ

RHBH, Now With Dead Housewives

 

I suck at thread titles, but you get the idea.

Edited January 21, 2016 by Umbelina

[Duke2801]

Rosebud1970, on 21 Jan 2016 - 12:04 PM, said:

I believe what Eileen was referring to was not her 'walk of life' or her income level, but Eileen herself. Eileen comes across as a very strong woman, one who knows what she wants and someone who does what she has to do to get it. Someone who would never allow herself to be abused. Or...someone who would never be in an abusive relationship. Yet, she was. I think that people who have never been in abusive relationships think that the women who are, are weak and somewhat helpless.

 

Eileen presents herself, and is, the opposite of that.

 

I believe that is what she meant by that comment.

 

Oh yes I totally agree. I meant to comment on that earlier and I forgot, so I'm glad you mentioned this. 

 

I truly in my heart of hearts don't think she meant that "someone like her" was somebody well-off or famous/successful or attractive.  She was referring to her personality. 

[zoeysmom]

She didn't just pimp her association with Nicole.  She wrote a sleazy book about her friend - her slaughtered BEST friend - whom she said she loved. The book hit the stands before the final jury was even selected.

 

But the worst part...Faye made OJ's defense teams job easy.  They needed to paint an unfavorable picture of Nicole.  Faye gave them every thing they needed.  She not only threw her beloved, brutally murdered best friend under the bus, she helped the defense protect her murderer. 

What did the defense use from Faye's book to discredit the victim?  IIRC the case hinged primarily on blood evidence. 

[Umbelina]

What did the defense use from Faye's book to discredit the victim?  IIRC the case hinged primarily on blood evidence. 

The defense used it many ways.  Probably the most important way they used it was to offer the alternative scenario of Nicole being killed by Faye's drug connections.  It also tainted the jury pool, in a blame the victim way.  She was a druggie!  She cheated on her husband!  She had disgusting friends!  Those friends murdered Nicole.

 

That trial was a circus, and Faye contributed to that, not just with her book, but with her many (paid) interviews.  Judge Ito was the main culprit, but Faye is right up there.

 

The jury REJECTED the blood evidence.  If the trial had hinged on that, he would have been convicted.  He was convicted later, in civil court.

Edited January 21, 2016 by Umbelina

[StevieRocks]

I finally remembered to watch! My gawd, why does everything have to be so dramatic with these women? They're exhausting to watch, much less, be around. They would be horrible friends. They're so busy talking about themselves, and gossiping and judging others, that they never even consider listening to another even though they pretend to "entasize" - Yolandaism. And Kyle's "It's just a question..." So innocent.

Honestly. And they never discuss anything interesting or cultural. Again, they're conjuring the image of a gaggle of hags sitting outside their trailers gossiping and playing canasta with half-smoked cigarettes dangling from their lips. Good grief--the women in the break-room at Norma Rae's old textile factory were probably more erudite.

 

And yes--Vyle, try as she might, is just too dumb to conceal her true identity--a nasty, jealous, dull rube who can't hide her glee when there's even a hint of someone else's discomfort. She's like a mean-spirited, slow-witted sneak.