B&B: What's Up Today at Forrester Creations? - Daily Chat

[GHScorpiosRule]

Maybe I’ve been under a rock (and I’ve been watching soaps since the Ice Princess days, including ABC’s other soaps, as well as NBC and CBS), but when did these stoopid writers decide that every.single.person must be in a relationship? I remember the days when it was okay if you were single-whether you were a man or woman! Oh, the HORROR! I know. And I know I’m also a hypocrite, but explaining why would be off-topic, so I’ll end it here.

Edited July 18, 2023 by GHScorpiosRule

[Skarzero]

24 minutes ago, KerleyQ said:

It's been multiple months since I tuned into Y&R, but if Liam found his way over there, I'd have to watch, just to see if something happens between him and Sally, since they did have good chemistry when they were in storyline together. I could totally see Liam getting Bill to transfer him somewhere else so he can get out of town for a while, and then he runs into Sally at a bar, and the two of them start bonding. (I admittedly know nothing about where Sally is in storyline right now to know if a romantic thing there is possible, but it seems that neither show has a history of letting Sally be happy for long, so...) 

I hope Liam doesn't go to Y&R, that show has enough problems without that weasel joining the cast. The quota is filled by Nick, Kyle, and Nate already. 

Sally has had her head shoved up Nick Newman's ass for the better part of a year, and if Adam wasn't an incentive enough for her to snap out of her Nickmatized state, then Lame Spencer(a knock off version of Nick) does not stand a chance in hell. 

Sally has gotten on most watchers nerves since being a Nick cheerleader and her disregard of Adam. Add that to what happened with their baby & her reaction, she has only made it worse for herself. At this point even people that liked her originally would rather see her gone. Myself included. And Abby is paired with Y&R's other golden character Devon. That pairing is actually turned out to be decent despite how it started. If it wasn't tanked for hot guy Chance, it won't be tanked for that waffling weasel either. Liam is better off overseas or staying here and growing the fuck up. Too bad we probably won't get either scenario, not for long enough anyway. 

[backhometome]

Finn and Hope both know how Liam operates. 😉

Smart of Finn not to trust vulnerable Liam. 💯

Of course he doesn't admit anything about the kisses he planted on Steffy.

Ridge salty that Thope took the spotlight off his and Brookes 54465468477 reunion. 

No word from Brooke to him about what she saw at Thomas` house. Off to a great start with him, Brooke. 

Well, Hope you were that woman for years. 10 years too late for this wake up call. 

I do think she is using the history a bit to go after Thomas or at least guilt free.

Plus she did ask Steffy to talk to Liam about Thomas a few times. 

[CountryGirl]

9 hours ago, RuntheTable said:

After weeks and weeks of listening to the same conversation, and actually tuning out for a while because of the dulldom of it all, I find Show on fire right now. It is unfortunate that it took Hope sleeping with Thomas to achieve that, but holy cow, that has certainly caused the gloves to come off. 

I never expected Hope to be the one to highlight to her mother what a fool she has been, but that is exactly what she is doing as the truisms rain down:

Hope - "You refuse to let me repeat your mistakes? Ok, yeah, ok fine mom, I don't want to. I don't want to be with a man who is in love with another woman."

Brooke - "Don't throw it all away. Save yourself from the pain and heartache."

Hope - "Don't you see that is exactly what I am doing. I am saving myself. Mom did you ever stop to maybe ask yourself why it was so easy for Liam to walk out on our marriage? How he was able to just give it up like that? After all those years that I have forgiven him for so much worse? He couldn't allow me that same forgiveness mom?"

Brooke - "He loves you he is committed to you."

Hope - "Oh, in the same way that Ridge is committed to you? I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I know that sounded harsh and I don't mean to hurt you mom. But I don't want to live my life like that. I mean sure, yes, you and Ridge have managed to smooth things out of late, but how many decades has it been of you chasing after him begging for his love, worrying that he is thinking about someone else? I don't want that."

Brooke - "But it will be too late. But its not too late right now honey; you can still fight, you can fight for Liam, you can fight for your family, you can fight for your marriage."

Hope - "I am fighting for myself mom."

Brooke - "Thomas is not gonna make you happy."

Hope - "Were you happy? All those years that I had to scrape you up off the floor heartbroken? Were you happy?"

Brooke - "Steffy is married to Finn!"

Hope - "Like that has ever stopped anyone before."

Hope - "I can only ask that you keep what you have seen here tonight between us, because this is my life and these are my choices and I will live with the consequences. I deserve more than half of Liam's heart. I deserve a man who is not in love with another woman."

So, this makes me wonder if this is a SL about Hope coming of age, and choosing to break the waffle cycle, or is it instead a SL about Brooke coming of age, and finally laying Destiny to rest? 

Good ole Wyatt got it out of him and was properly appalled. It will only be a matter of time now before the jig us up. Maybe Wyatt will inadvertently spill the beans to someone? But it is going to bite Liam and Steffy in the ass. I do feel a little bad for Steffy because Liam is the one who thinks he can pick up his toys and play with them whenever he feels like; commitments and marriages be damned. On the other hand, Steffy didn't push him away too quickly, and she hasn't come clean to her husband. But she has found it in her to try to make Hope out to be a trollop of the first order. 

Your post is a thing of beauty. Hope getting to say to Brooke what I have wanted her (or Bridget or Rick or RJ) to say to her for so long was so damn amazing. 

Especially these lines:

Hope - "Don't you see that is exactly what I am doing. I am saving myself. Mom did you ever stop to maybe ask yourself why it was so easy for Liam to walk out on our marriage? How he was able to just give it up like that? After all those years that I have forgiven him for so much worse? He couldn't allow me that same forgiveness mom?"

Brooke - "He loves you he is committed to you."

Hope - "Oh, in the same way that Ridge is committed to you? I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I know that sounded harsh and I don't mean to hurt you mom. But I don't want to live my life like that. I mean sure, yes, you and Ridge have managed to smooth things out of late, but how many decades has it been of you chasing after him begging for his love, worrying that he is thinking about someone else? I don't want that."

Brooke - "But it will be too late. But its not too late right now honey; you can still fight, you can fight for Liam, you can fight for your family, you can fight for your marriage."

Hope - "I am fighting for myself mom."

Brooke - "Thomas is not gonna make you happy."

Hope - "Were you happy? All those years that I had to scrape you up off the floor heartbroken? Were you happy?"

Brooke is a decent person and a loving mother but damn if she didn't fail in both departments when she dragged her children, especially when they were literally kids, through her heartbreak. It wasn't Rick or Bridget or Hope or RJ's job to parent Brooke but all of them picked her up off the floor and dried her tears every time she got dumped or she dumped someone. They've paid the price for years. Hope, worst of all, for being the product of an affair, and feeling on some level that she has to apologize for her mere existence. She had paid and paid and paid some more. Including doing penance and forgiving perennial cheat Liam time and again.

It's true, she did tolerate his ish for a good decade but does that mean she has to lie down like a dog like her mother did and keep on taking it for another decade or two?

I may hate that it was partially through Thomas that Hope finally saw the light through Liam's window that night (so to speak) but the important piece is that she did and she is fucking done. 

IMO, Thomas is what is known as an exit affair - no real intent to have a relationship but a way of burning down the house (marriage) to ensure nothing is left to salvage.

I hope they eventually pivot to a Hott reunion now that Hope has her head on straight for the first time in possibly ever and when she has some single time to contemplate life as a grown-ass woman. Thomas is a non-starter, chemistry or not, and Liam could grovel and eat glass the way Ridge did when Brooke was pregnant with RJ (who was thought to be Nick's) and I still wouldn't want that waffling weasel anywhere near her. 

[Waldo13]

Hope is 100% correct about Liam and Liam is too stupid to realize or take into account Hope’s feelings. Once again I have to say is that my only objection it’s Lurch she might be running too. In addition, I know to many men and woman who look for excuses to explore the greener grass.  

[ybrik]

Man Hope was on fire again today. Liam looked like he didn’t know what hit him. It was hysterical seeing his expression change when he realized she wasn’t going to be begging for forgiveness and that she was accepting his wanting a divorce. 

Liam seemed to really give away that he was looking to have Hope keep asking for forgiveness when he mentioned that he had to do a lot more to earn back her trusts when he cheated. All his talk about not being able to forgive Hope seems like it was more bluster than what he really wanted. I think he wanted Hope show how sorry she was to earn back his trust by probably firing Thomas and/or Hope walking away from HFTF, possibly limit Thomas’ access to Douglas and other things for Hope to prove her devotion to him.

I was a bit worried Hope was going to backslide at the beginning when she wanted to talk to Liam about their marriage and their future. However it seems she wanted to see if Liam could have an honest conversation about all the problems in their marriage but Liam couldn’t or wouldn’t do it and instead dismissed Hope’s feelings. Once he did that Hope just flipped a switch and continued standing up for herself.

I have to agree with others saying that Thomas and Hope should not be a long term couple. Let them both realize that this isn’t about them being in love and is about Hope looking to move on from Liam. Don’t think she should move onto Wyatt. She needs to steer clear of that family. Have someone new come in for Hope. hell maybe even two new people. Hell maybe even a lady for Hope. Hell just let Hope have her fun till she finds a real one true love that isn’t Liam or Thomas. 

also if you do it right, you can have Thomas move on and give him a love interest without it being icky. 

[CharlizeCat]

Hope, girl, go! Loved the way she laid Waffles out flat. I was kinda hoping she would have said something like, "A kiss is very different from causing Steffy to need her second paternity test in one year." But, knowing Bell, Hope will probably end up pregnant and having her own WTD debacle.

It also would have rocked if she had said, "And you have repeatedly cheated with the one woman who is a deal-breaker for me -- Steffy!"

I hope not. ITA with everybody else who doesn't want a long-term relationship for Thope. After they've burned off their lust, I don't see any way forward for them beyond HFTF and co-parenting Douglas.

Steffy is such a lying hypocrite. Now, once the kisses with Liam are revealed, her marriage is a ticking time bomb. I have a sinking feeling that the "daddy" who is going to disappear is Finn. I can see him getting disgusted with Steffy's lies and allegiance to Liam and just bailing. Serves her right.

I wonder if JMW suddenly sporting wigs with bangs is to conceal recent "work" or "recent work gone bad?" 

[kitmerlot1213]

I think I replayed the moment Liam's face dropped when he realized that not only was Hope no longer wearing her wedding ring, she was no longer going to beg for them to get back together.  She is one hundred percent done with his waffling ass--FABULOUS!!

[Artsda]

So Ridge went on and on about Thomas and Brooke lied. She attacked him hours ago blaming him. Ridge needs to start taking his son side against her. 

So Brookes concern is the others impacted if Hope and Liam don't reunite? Who cares about her daughter. 

Finn is right on about Liam.  He knows who he is. 

Steffys been a non issue for a long time? Then he goes to admit what Steffy told him, he just proved Hope point.  

"I had to earn back your trust for months" he only cheated.  Heaven forbid she take time to deal with his cheating.  

This new Hope I like.  She totally knows Liam chased Steffy already.  She calls Liam out for never taking responsibility and not giving her the same grace. 

"I refuse to be that woman." Go Hope. 

Lol at Liam seeing her rings off. 

[Skarzero]

1 hour ago, ybrik said:

Liam seemed to really give away that he was looking to have Hope keep asking for forgiveness when he mentioned that he had to do a lot more to earn back her trusts when he cheated.

Which is such BS because he asked Hope for insta-forgiveness after mannequingate and even went as far to cajole her into forgiving him faster by her sending her pictures of them with the kids & all other types of manipulative shit. 

Not gonna lie, Hope's timing of all this kinda sucks, but she didn’t tell a single lie nor was she being retroactive about Steffy. She has always been a looming, dooming presence in the Lope marriage/relationship way before Thomas was(not to excuse him). All Hope is wrong about so far is Steffy being smart enough to turn down Lame for once. Though for some reason, that smartness was short lived and she still won't tell Finn that Liam kissed her and wanted to reconcile. I guess digging at Hope's blown up marriage is more important, which in that case, Steffy deserves to get left all the same*.

*I'm not sure how confident I am that will happen though. Finn is already a stepford soap spouse that when he got cheated on he blamed Liam, and upon hearing about his wife's ONS with her ex-FIL he clenches his fist & stupidly assumes that she was assaulted despite her not alluding to that or him not even being around when most of the cast jumped on that annoying bandwagon. He should be mad enough to leave Steffy of course, but will he?*

Thomas needs to be transition dick and nothing more. Hope should hang him up and be done, sooner rather than later. For Beth's sake if no one else's. Lame is not her responsibility anymore, but her daughter still very much is. 

[KerleyQ]

"You beat me to it." Yes she did. Suck on it, Waffle. I laughed so hard at his face when she showed him her ring was gone. 

And, yes, Liam totally showed up there ready for her to beg him to give her another chance. My guess is that, since Steffy already told him she wasn't interested, and he's had Wyatt and RJ working on him for a couple days, his plan was to go over, let Hope beg for a while, and maybe give her some lingering hook of "maybe we can keep talking," fully intending to eventually "forgive" Hope, provided she agrees to completely cut Thomas out of her life, up to and including leaving HFTF and having someone else handle custody exchanges. And, instead, Hope changed the game on him and said "you're right, we need a divorce."  It was amazing. 

Oh, Steffy, you are in so much trouble when Finn finds out about those kisses. You sat there reassuring him that the exact fucking thing Liam did was absolutely not something he needed to worry about. You're dumber than Liam. Also, I will be disappointed if he doesn't ask "why didn't you tell him this shit wasn't happening after the first kiss instead of after the second one?" 

[GHScorpiosRule]

2 hours ago, kitmerlot1213 said:

I think I replayed the moment Liam's face dropped when he realized that not only was Hope no longer wearing her wedding ring, she was no longer going to beg for them to get back together.  She is one hundred percent done with his waffling ass--FABULOUS!!

I LOVED it! His “D-HUH?” expression when he saw the ring was gone and she wasn’t begging for forgiveness again, had me cackling. Like he was all set to be “magnanimous” with her only to have Hope pull that hypocritical rug from underneath him.😆😆😆😆😆

As for Brooke not telling “Ridge” (Sorry, even if he couldn’t act for SHIT, Ron Moss will always be Ridge for me) about what she saw, I don’t consider it lying. Why? Hope asked her to say nothing. 🤷🏽‍♀️

[Anna Yolei]

On 7/18/2023 at 7:26 PM, GHScorpiosRule said:

As for Brooke not telling “Ridge” (Sorry, even if he couldn’t act for SHIT, Ron Moss will always be Ridge for me) about what she saw, I don’t consider it lying. Why? Hope asked her to say nothing. 🤷🏽‍♀️

Even if Hope hadn't asked her to stay quiet, Brooke was going to look worse for barging into his home unannounced to read him the riot act anyway. I felt the same way about Liam strolling up to Eric's mansion to shit on Quinn, even in spite of what she had done.

Frankly, there was nothing Ridge needed to know either since the last time he gave a damn about Tom-Ass being a danger to others was when it impacted his life with Caroline and he's just gonna be shitty to Hope for breathing once he finds out so he can preemptively go kick rocks too.

On 7/18/2023 at 2:42 PM, CountryGirl said:

It's true, she did tolerate his ish for a good decade but does that mean she has to lie down like a dog like her mother did and keep on taking it for another decade or two?

I may hate that it was partially through Thomas that Hope finally saw the light through Liam's window that night (so to speak) but the important piece is that she did and she is fucking done.

Better late than never. When Brooke was Hope's age (or maybe slightly older than she is now), she was throwing away a happy marriage to Thorne to chase after Ridge for no conceivable reason anyone could think of at the time. Regardless of the inevitable clusterfuck Thope will become once the sex gets boring--either by Thomas' own behavior, one or more of their parents getting in the way or what I hope will be a dragged out custody battle for Beth--if Lope never reunite, it'll be too soon for me.

 

On 7/18/2023 at 3:59 PM, ybrik said:

Liam seemed to really give away that he was looking to have Hope keep asking for forgiveness when he mentioned that he had to do a lot more to earn back her trusts when he cheated. All his talk about not being able to forgive Hope seems like it was more bluster than what he really wanted

Which is about what I expect since Lope's fatal flaw has always been their inability to communicate clearly what they were looking for in a relationship and/or hearing what they wanted to hear. Hope at least seems to have grown out of that and isn't playing the dumbass games that most of us outgrew by the eighth grade, so bravo to that.

On 7/18/2023 at 5:44 PM, Artsda said:

So Brookes concern is the others impacted if Hope and Liam don't reunite? Who cares about her daughter. 

LOL WHUT?! Who else would possibly be impacted if they don't reunite?!

Actually, scratch that. What I mean to say is: who, other than the two kids in their custody, would matter in the slightest if Lope didn't get back together?! Good God, the entire Logan Forrester clan has their own express lane for divorces at the LA county courthouse, this is nothing to anyone here.

Edited July 20, 2023 by Anna Yolei

[RuntheTable]

Annika has been so, so good these past few episodes, bringing layers and dimension to some really good dialogue. If this is the work of the replacement writers, then I suggest B&B hire them as full-time regulars because they are giving us more than we have had in years. 

My fellow posters have done such a bang up job of commenting on yesterday's sizzling episode, that I will just applaud you all, and say that I am in agreement. 

As far as Brooke goes though, I will say she is doing what her daughter asked her to do. Given how she feels about Thomas and the situation in general, I am sure that wasn't easy for her. 

I found Finn's words interesting too. He totally contradicted himself by saying that he didn't want Liam coming over whenever he wanted, especially when Liam was emotionally freefalling and was vulnerable. Then he quickly assured Steffy that he wasn't threatened or jealous of Liam, and that he had complete faith in her, but then said that he just didn't trust Liam. So, then, you are threatened by him? 

But for me, the best was Finn's line about "Maybe some people can't control themselves. They can't fight the power and romance of Rome."

Well, buddy, it might not have happened in Rome, but your wife wasn't able to control herself not long ago. I give you exhibit A; Hayes Finnegan. 

[dovegrey]

1 hour ago, RuntheTable said:

I found Finn's words interesting too. He totally contradicted himself by saying that he didn't want Liam coming over whenever he wanted, especially when Liam was emotionally freefalling and was vulnerable. Then he quickly assured Steffy that he wasn't threatened or jealous of Liam, and that he had complete faith in her, but then said that he just didn't trust Liam. So, then, you are threatened by him?

I can buy that Finn isn’t threatened by Liam but would find it aggravating/unacceptable to never know if he’ll be coming home to find Liam emotionally leeching off Steffy. No one wants their spouse to be emotionally enmeshed with another person, whether that’s a parent, coworker, sibling, BFF, or an ex-husband. That cord needs cut, period. It’s just that Finn, while often naively dim, is the only character on this show with anywhere close to real-world boundaries, and it’s funny that he’s been around for all of five seconds compared to others and already has Liam’s number, full stop. He already knows that Liam is going to try to fall back onto Steffy and try something; he just doesn't know that Liam has already forced himself onto Steffy, twice. I think he's smart (this once) and doesn't want to share his marriage with Steffy's ex; that's reasonable.

Overall and in general, I’m curious where this is all going and have been since last summer's Sinn story, because no couple on this show stays together…but they really went all-in on both Steffy and Finn not being able to function without each other. Boring, even-keeled, aw-shucks Finn even tried to kill Sheila to get back to Steffy. So, I don’t see him leaving Steffy over two kisses that she didn't want; I think he'll be disappointed/upset with her for not telling him but absolutely furious with Liam for forcing himself onto her. But I wonder... if the story is leading to Liam raping Steffy (he is coming off as creepy unhinged to me), Liam then goes after Hope in some way because he can't handle her actively choosing Thomas over him (which is what happened yesterday, essentially; he just lost complete control of the situation), and then almost the entire canvas ends up with a motive to kill Liam and we have a long “who killed Liam?” SL (surprise, he’s not dead) (and it was Sheila, because of course...but she actually takes the fall for Finn 💀) (I'm bored and task-avoiding).

[nkotb]

Pretty sure I’ve used the clapping reaction, to more posts in the last week, than all of the years I’ve spent on this forum, combined. 😏 You’re all on fire!
 

I didn’t realize how intensely I dislike Liam, until I saw how amazing a Liam-free Hope is. This is the Hope I want to see, backbone, genuinely sorry for hurting Liam, but not groveling, afterglow-glowing, AN is absolutely crushing Hope right now.
 

Like some of you, I’m wondering if this material is from the regular writers, or the ones filling in during the strike (I presume they have temp writers). Whoever is writing for Hope, I wish they’d stay, she’s been awesome for a month or so. 

[KerleyQ]

5 hours ago, RuntheTable said:

If this is the work of the replacement writers, then I suggest B&B hire them as full-time regulars because they are giving us more than we have had in years. 

It seriously feels like someone who has been watching the show for a long time got a hold of the reins and got to finally give characters lines they've been dying to hear from them for years. 

[norcalgal]

1 hour ago, nkotb said:

Like some of you, I’m wondering if this material is from the regular writers, or the ones filling in during the strike (I presume they have temp writers)

Hopefully I don’t derail this thread, but I was curious why B&B has no issues with using non-union writers?  And if it comes to it, would the B&B actors still work if the actors’ strike is still ongoing by X time? 

[backhometome]

Why do RJ and Brooke care so much about Hope and Liam's marriage. You would think as brother to both Hope/Steffy that he would be iffy about him.  🙄

How did Hope get divorce papers so fast. Did she call her lawyer in-between sessions with Thomas the other day. 

I have a bad feeling about Finn/Sheila. Like him softening on her and Steffy going back to the waffler. 

It would be ooc for Finn to want anything to do with her after what she did to his family. But if it paves a way for Liam to get in with Steffy then OOC writing it will be. I hope I am wrong about this. 😒

Edited July 19, 2023 by backhometome

[CountryGirl]

6 hours ago, RuntheTable said:

But for me, the best was Finn's line about "Maybe some people can't control themselves. They can't fight the power and romance of Rome."

Well, buddy, it might not have happened in Rome, but your wife wasn't able to control herself not long ago. I give you exhibit A; Hayes Finnegan. 

Except Steamless did kiss in Rome - she did start to kiss him back, out of habit, sympathy, whatever, their kiss in Rome was decidedly not one-sided. The one at the beach house, I didn't see her as being all that into it, but she definitely didn't push him away that time either. 

[nkotb]

I’m completely over Liam, completely, but, SC was really good today. His shock that Hope has papers already (mine, too, wasn’t Carter in a meeting with Katie & Ridge, while Hope was boning Thomas, & stepping up to Brooke, which was like 15 minutes ago?), his grief at the loss of the marriage, his sorrow at walking out the door. Again, Liam is a dolt, to be generous, but SC brought it today. AN is totally upping her game, too, I’ve never been more impressed with her. 

[Crashcourse]

That was a well-acted breakup scene between Hope and Liam.

I have no snark to give.

My only question is, wouldn't there be a lawyer or someone else to witness them signing the divorce papers?

[KerleyQ]

8 minutes ago, Crashcourse said:

My only question is, wouldn't there be a lawyer or someone else to witness them signing the divorce papers?

Since Douglas married them, I assume that Beth making a little X with a crayon counts? 

[SweePea59]

1 hour ago, backhometome said:

I have a bad feeling about Finn/Sheila.

I have a fun feeling about Finn/Sheila. Can't wait to see what hijinx ensues! You know it will be prompted by Waffles and Stuffy smooching. Good times ahead.

But as much as I love both Deacon and Sheila, I don't like them as a couple. It doesn't make sense for me.

[backhometome]

8 minutes ago, SweePea59 said:

I have a fun feeling about Finn/Sheila. Can't wait to see what hijinx ensues! You know it will be prompted by Waffles and Stuffy smooching. Good times ahead.

But as much as I love both Deacon and Sheila, I don't like them as a couple. It doesn't make sense for me.

I did find it interesting that Steffy/Finn mentioned needing a new nanny. 🤔 I wonder if Sheila does something crazy there. We all know she isn't long for prison. 

[CountryGirl]

So I'm going to do something I haven't done in a very long time - a recap. Of course, it's probably not at all necessary as my fellow posters have done a smashing job of relaying yesterday's episode but I need somewhere to get out all the feelings I had for yesterday's episode.

The continuation of The Awakening of Hope Logan Sharpe.

The alternate title is When You Get What You Asked For Only You Didn't Really Mean It and Hope Called Your Fucking Bluff. 

I'm not going to give much time to Finn/Steffy or Brooke/Ridge because the only character deserving of a recap right now is Hope.

Except for a few key moments with Finn and Steffy. 

Finn: "Look, I’m not being insensitive to what Hope and Liam are going through." 

Steffy: "Well, it sounds like you want them to patch things up so it doesn’t upset our life." Projection, much? But can you blame your husband considering Hayes' paternity being a question mark courtesy of you hopping into bed, ahem, couch, on Mannequin night with Liam? "Liam won’t be coming here and unloading all of his issues with Hope on us." He already did. Finn just doesn't that yet or about the kisses.

Finn: "No, wait a minute, that’s not what I’m saying. Look, if Liam can find it in his heart to forgive Hope, that’ll be the best thing for all of us. And I totally support Liam playing a big part in Kelly’s life, but I don’t want Liam coming around here whenever he chooses, spending too much time with you if it doesn’t work out with Hope, especially now when Liam’s feeling vulnerable." He knows Liam so well already, but not sure I follow his comments about Kelly. Liam, douche that he is, is still Kelly's father and has never been shown to be a shit father, so not sure where Finn is going with sounding like he's dictating that relationship. Which he doesn't get a say there. That's between Steffy and Liam.

Later, I'm thinking Finn is protesting too much - about his feelings and his wife's track record where her ex-husband is concerned: "Just to be clear, I am not jealous or insecure in the least when it comes to Liam." Ehhhhh..."And I would never, ever question your love or your commitment." Really? After Hayes? "I just don’t trust Liam. Not when he’s emotionally freefalling." I would never trust him. Ever. So Finn's not wrong at this part.  "Look, this is what he does. He may be reminded of all the history that you two share." Oh, he's also doing the reminding.

Steffy: "That’s all it is, Finn. History." Your lying lips would say otherwise.

Finn: "Well, I’m just saying, Liam better not forget that." Finn, Liam hasn't forgotten. He just doesn't care like the infant he is. 

Steffy: "Baby, you have nothing to worry about. I am committed to you, our marriage, our life together." Then why kiss Liam back?

Finn: "I know and look, I really do feel for what Liam’s going through, I just don’t want his mind wandering to thoughts of you and Kelly." Again, not sure why he keeps bringing Kelly into this.

Steffy: "We’re solid. Liam knows that." And doesn't give a shit.

Finn: 'Well, knowing how Liam feels about Thomas, I can only imagine the blow it was to Liam to see that kiss." Was it worse than when you found out your girlfriend cheated with her ex (again, Liam)?

Steffy: "I can’t believe it happened." Something tells me she's not talking about Thope anymore. 

Finn: "Maybe some people can’t control themselves. They can’t fight the power and the romance of Rome taking over." Steffy's expression is very much "thank goodness he can't read minds" as she sighs, saying, almost to herself, "my gosh." Her cheatin' heart and all that. 

It would be all kinds of delicious karma if Finn finds out, moves out, and finds a shoulder to cry on, which leads to other kinds of comfort with MIL Taylor. Let Crowing about the Logans Steffy have some chickens coming home to roostfor her the way poor Phoebe did years ago. 

But on to the good stuff with Annika/Hope, who deserves an Emmy for her performance yesterday.

Her whole demeanor was perfection as Liam entered the cabin, full of righteous indignation, and you just know he expected her in tears and groveling. Yet there she stood, every inch the composed, confident woman. One he doesn't even begin to know how to handle.

Liam: "Hey." Quiet as he is is clearly caught off guard.

Hope, coolly: "Hi."

Liam: "I, uh, take it you got my text."

Hope: "Yeah. I was a little surprised by it, but, uh… I agree. We need to talk. About our marriage and… our future." Whatever he was expecting, he was not expecting her to go on the offensive.

She doesn't even let him speak as she opens the conversation: "I have, um, been thinking a lot about… our future, our past. I mean, how we wound up here. And I am not making excuses for what happened in Rome. I hate that I hurt you. I really do." Her eyes and softer tone convey this even if he is too caught up in his man-pain to accept.  "But I think we need to figure out where do we go from here? And if there is hope for our marriage, then I think we need to have a very honest conversation with each other about… everything."

Liam: "You and Thomas?" He was just waiting for this opportunity to pounce with what he thinks is his ultimate trump card. He doesn't realize Hope holds all the cards and is in the driver's seat.

Hope:" And you and Steffy."

She lets that thought percolate for a moment where he stands there, flabbergasted that she, the one who is supposed to stand there in her wrongness and be wrong and again, groveling in a messy heap, is anything but.

Liam is so snotty here and don't you dare get on your high horse. When you have to deal with a WTD, then you can saddle up. Until then, shut it. "All right, so, you think I went to Steffy?"

You DID.

TWICE.

ASS HOLE. 

Hope: "I take full responsibility for what happened in Rome. I'm not proud of it. I don't know if I got caught up in the moment or I was looking for an escape, but it happened. I know you don't want to hear it, but the passion was real. That said, Thomas is not the only one who has interfered in our marriage. In fact, I suspect you've already done what you always do - run to Steffy."

She eyes him closely and under the weight of her thousand-yard stare, his expression changes from one of accusation to...guilt.

She shakes her head, not surprised in the slightest but still disgusted that he is as predictable as ever and, what's worse, she tolerated it all these years as her due. 

Liam continues his wounded bear act: "I’m pretty sure you’ve seen Thomas since you’ve been back in town. What do we do here? What’s the plan? I mean, Steffy’s happily married." Which you didn't give a shit about. "Nothing’s happening there..." Because Steffy, for now, won't let it. "But Thomas isn’t, so what do you want? Do you want a relationship with him now?

Hope is deadly serious as she looks at him: "We’re not talking about Thomas right now." Mama is done playing and begging for forgiveness for finally committing an apparently unpardonable sin of her own.

Liam: "We’re not?" I know, that must be so inconvenient for you. 

Hope: "No. We are talking about your relationship with Steffy that you have had throughout our entire marriage.

Liam: "No, that’s clearly what you want to talk about to deflect. Is that your excuse for kissing Thomas?" And fuck him forever for gaslighting her when he knows good and well not only did he break landspeed records to race to Steffy to kiss her, he did it TWICE. I don't even care that she fucked Thomas at this point. Liam already told her he couldn't (wouldn't) forgive her and that the marriage was over. She owes him nothing at this point but yet is giving him the time of day, which is more than he deserves.

Hope: "No, Liam. When I apologized to you for that, I meant it. I own what I did." Which is more than he ever did. He inspected insta-forgiveness after Mannequin night and I remember well how he blamed her for not actually kissing Thomas back then. And he had her mother, looking to win the Liam sweepstakes as a dig against archnemesis Taylor, aiding and abetting him in the insta-forgiveness shenanigans. She continues: " Look, the more I think about that kiss and why it even happened, why I would allow myself to risk so much… the more I begin to think that it is about something far deeper than just that. It is about the cyclical dynamic that we have had with Steffy that has eroded the foundation of our relationship throughout so many years."

Liam: 'So you kissed Thomas because– I’m sorry. This doesn’t make any sense to me. You’re gonna have to connect these dots." He's so snottily sanctimonious and acting like he's brand new in the history he started and perpetuated.

Hope is more patient than I would be at this point, telling him: "Okay, fine, look. If you look at the bigger picture, Liam, I think this has to do with the fear deeply ingrained inside of me. And that is a childhood where I had to watch my mother shed countless tears over Ridge and his divided loyalties between two women and that changes things. And that changed something inside of me, and Liam, I refuse to be that woman."

Is he going to now lie that he's a one-woman man? I dare him. Ivy, Hope, and even Steffy would like a word.

Also, one would think he would want his life partner to be a happier, healthier woman who is with him because of, not in spite of. He is well-aware of her history with her mother and her failed relationships, Ridge included, and their relationship on top of that.

Liam is not liking this. At all. He again tries to rewrite history and turn the tables on  her, sputtering: "Okay, so… let me get this straight. Steffy’s been a non-issue in our relationship for a long time." She wasn't a non-issue not mere days ago when you had your tongue in her mouth at the beach house or in Rome a few days before that. "You kiss Thomas in Rome and now, suddenly, retroactively, this is about Steffy? Hope, I know what you’re doing."

He has no fucking clue and never has.

He continues: "I love you and perhaps naively, I never questioned your commitment to me or our marriage." Why would you? The woman has been nothing but loyal to you for the better part of a decade with one brief interlude with Wyatt after she tired of your waffling ass for a time. She has given you chance after chance...to break her heart. And she is just DONE with all of that.

Oh lord, he's still whining: "I mean, even when Steffy told me rightly that you had something going on with Thomas, I didn’t believe it. I– I– I defended you because I always defend you." Then you should defend her and defend your marriage now as she did when you fucked Steffy after Mannequin night and had to suffer for months over whether or not the bun in Steffy's oven was her husband's or Finn's.

Hope is not about to let him turn this around on her. Not anymore. She is as resolute as I've ever seen her: "That’s the problem. You always turning to Steffy." She is not wrong here and one could argue that she tolerated it for so long but her accepting it as her due doesn't mean she cannot stop the madness and get off the merry-go-round. "It is like her shadow has been cast upon the entirety of our relationship. I mean, Liam, anytime I wasn’t able to give you what you needed, what you couldn’t communicate to me, you would go and run to her." And he's STILL doing it.

Liam: "Yeah, I’m sorry for that. I hurt you. I made mistakes." Talk is cheap. "But you didn’t forgive me as quickly as you clearly expect me to forgive you. I had to earn back your trust for months."

Me, looking askance at this crew. There were days, Liam, not months.

He's still talking: "And we’re not here right now because of my mistakes. We’re here because of yours. We’re here because of what you did and you didn’t just do it with anyone. You did it with the one guy who tried over and over to destroy our family." Like Steffy didn't do the same, a hundred times over? "You wanna know why I want a divorce? It’s because I don’t understand you. I don’t know who you are and I still don’t know what’s going on between you and Thomas, so if you wanna tell me, great."

No, you want a divorce because you are butt hurt that Hope finally had a backbone and chose to give you 1% of the payback you deserve.

But also? Be very careful what you ask for, Liam. Because I think Hope is finally to send your sorry, cheating, waffling ass packing. 

Because Hope is holding up her hands for him to clear see there is no wedding ring on her left hand.

Ruh Roh!

Didn't see that coming, did ya, Waffle Boy?

Hope is deadly calm as she tells him: "You wanted a divorce, okay. Fine. Then that means your life is yours."

Hope: "And mine is mine."

Hope: "You wanted it. I accept that."

Liam is stunned, stupefied. He wasn't expecting that from his doormat of a wife, raised by a doormat. He tries to hide his shock here as he says: "You beat me to it. You took off your ring first. You know, I cherished what we had. I still will. I didn’t think it would end, especially not like this, but Hope, you gotta stop telling yourself it’s because of me and Steffy. It’s not. It’s because of you and Thomas. I haven’t done anything wrong." He wont even look at her and just keeps shaking his head like she's a bad child and GFY, Liam.

That he would say that last piece, after everything, shows me how Hope should run as fast and far as she can away from him. If he cherished what they had, he would never have done all of the things he has done to destroy it, including the two most recent kisses with Steffy.

Hope counters and I have never loved her or Annika more: "Except you have. You have planted seeds of betrayal throughout the years, Liam, and you have never truly faced any sort of consequences for that, and that, that’s my fault."

She takes ownership for her part in his treatment of her, which is some serious freaking growth right there.

She continues: "Because I was always trying to do the right thing for our family, for our marriage, I would try to forgive and move on. But I really need to thank you for not allowing me the same grace because it’s opened my eyes. I’m sorry I hurt you. Truly, I am..." and here, her voice breaks just a little because he is the father of her precious Beth after all, "But I don’t want to spend the rest of my life with a man wondering where his affections truly lie." Her voice grows frosty once more. "I won’t do that."

She whispers this last bit and I think Liam would find yelling preferable as she breathes out: "So… go. Find love. Hell, even go find Steffy."

Her face could not be more serious.

 

Annika was pure 🔥 and I haven't wanted to worship at the Temple of Hope since she bitch-slapped Flo into the next century. 

Bravo!

[norcalgal]

59 minutes ago, CountryGirl said:

She continues: "Because I was always trying to do the right thing for our family, for our marriage, I would try to forgive and move on. But I really need to thank you for not allowing me the same grace because it’s opened my eyes

This here for me was the key. As you posted @CountryGirl, Liam didn’t expect historically doormat Hope, raised by her doormat mother to finally stand up for herself!  Bravo Hope, bravo!  Long overdue. 

[Waldo13]

Hope you have a very good argument up until you defended Lurch about being committed to you and only you. Lurch’s commitment is not a commitment. It an obsession.  Hope is actually caught up in Lurch’s psycho babble to recognize that it’s more gratitude than passion for Lurch. It’s almost like Hope can only see the good in an abuser than the abusive behavior.  Hope is further destroying her argument by interpreting Liam’s feelings for Stuffy.  Once again I have to say Hope is rationalizing her feelings for Lurch. 

I know it’s very hard to tell the time or what day it is in LA, but Hope to have divorce papers drawn up very fast looks like Hope made up her mind, to divorce Liam, even before their talk.  Hope don’t put this on Liam even if he deserves it.  If he really wanted a divorce, then you should have let him serve you with papers not the other way around.  By you acting first Hope, clears the way for you to be with Lurch not for Liam to be with Stuffy. 

What 🐂💩. Just in a blink of an eye, Liam signed the divorce paper without even reading it or have a lawyer go over it.  I guess, Liam knew that Hope wouldn’t rake him over the coals.  

 

 

[Artsda]

Hope's on fire.  Handing him the papers and saying he's who wanted it when he acted confused and shocked. 

It's sad she knew so well that he was jumping back to Steffy and waffling back to choices, just like he realized before he ran to Steffys house to kiss her again.

What is RJs purpose to obsess over Liam and Hope? We already have his mother for that. 

[KerleyQ]

Hope, I was with you for most of this episode, but then the defense of Thomas popped up. First, of course he's devoted to only you, that's how obsessed stalkers work. Second, Liam is perfectly within his rights, after all that has happened, to consider Thomas a bad guy, forever and ever, amen. 

But, that's my only quibble. I totally love that the Waffle went over there, ready to magnanimously allow Hope to grovel for his forgiveness, and he left having signed the divorce papers she sprang on him instead. 

Why do I have a feeling that Steffy is going to find out about Finn's patient he was heading out to see being Sheila right around the same time Finn finds out about the kisses, so Steffy can act like him keeping that from her is remotely the same thing? 

1 hour ago, Artsda said:

What is RJs purpose to obsess over Liam and Hope? We already have his mother for that. 

My guess is that RJ's story is going to turn out to be that he was in a relationship before he came home, and he fucked up somehow, so now he's working out his own regret by trying to help Hope fix her marriage. He's made multiple comments over the course of this that make it sound like he's speaking from experience and regret. 

[Snaporaz]

How amazing would it be if Hope slips Liam's ring on Thomas' finger?

[CharlizeCat]

So, do substitute writers get to make up their own SLs and dialogue? If so, then this replacement crew needs to stay on full-time. Even though I despise Liam almost as much as I do Steffy, SC's lines have been on point and his performance has been stellar, of course, along with AN. She has been brilliant.

My problem with all of this has been, as I have said before, I don't get the sudden swerve to the Lope implosion being all about Liam and Steffy. Don't get me wrong, I am glad Hope finally read that trifling waffle for filth and dumped his whiny ass, but as she pointed out, Steffy has been a third party practically throughout Lope's entire relationship, even pre-marriage. Why now? She should have dumped his sorry ass after Mannequin night.

Hope's feelings for Thomas seemed to come out of nowhere, as she and Liam gave the appearance of being happy with their family in the claustrophobic cozy cabin. I agree that Liam shouldn't tell Hope how to run HFTF and who she can and cannot work with. However, he tried to be supportive and Hope ran with that, working long nights with Thomas, defending him, and shutting down Liam's concerns. 

I don't see Thope lasting for the duration. I think by the time that fizzles, Steffy and Finn will have broken up and Hope will have a "destiny epiphany" or a pinecone will drop on her head or she'll peep through a keyhole, or a seagull will shit on her head and we'll return to the ToD. 

In the meantime, I am loving Hope with a backbone and I don't feel sorry for whiny Liam. I just don't see this ending in a manner that doesn't insult our intelligence by rehashing a tired trope that should have been put to bed in the late '90s. 

[KerleyQ]

1 hour ago, CharlizeCat said:

My problem with all of this has been, as I have said before, I don't get the sudden swerve to the Lope implosion being all about Liam and Steffy. Don't get me wrong, I am glad Hope finally read that trifling waffle for filth and dumped his whiny ass, but as she pointed out, Steffy has been a third party practically throughout Lope's entire relationship, even pre-marriage. Why now? She should have dumped his sorry ass after Mannequin night.

What I'm getting from it is that she was fully intent on begging his forgiveness and trying to repair their marriage. She wasn't even thinking about Liam/Steffy. She kissed Thomas, but, in the light of day, when she was headed home, she felt guilty and just wanted to put it behind her and refocus on her marriage and family. But, the way Liam was so ready to just jump right to divorce, despite how many times she has given him the grace to work on things and repair their marriage, it became, to her, about how she has hung in, multiple times, despite his obviously divided heart, and he doesn't love her the same way, because he knows he has Steffy on the back burner. And he pretty much confirmed it at the end of their first confrontation, when he (falsely) told her that he hadn't been having those thoughts about Steffy, but he certainly was going to now. That's the thing that pushed her to stop fighting for their marriage and realize that it was never good and healthy for her in the first place. Liam asked for a divorce because of Thomas. Hope jumped to accommodating him because he made it clear that he felt he had options, so he didn't have to forgive her the way she's forgiven him. 

[kitmerlot1213]

Re:  Sheila and Finn, I wonder if they're going to bring in some history of mental illness to explain her actions which in turn will explain Finn's suddenly helping her?

I loved Hope's pulling out the divorce papers because she took Liam at his word--he can't trust her any longer, he can't deal with her divided feelings--and he has a meltdown that one of his puppets is cutting their strings.  I hope Liam does show up at Steffy's looking for comfort and Finn gives him the beat down of his life.

[RuntheTable]

Hope doesn't play; you ask her for something, and she is going to see you get it lickety-split. 

And yes, how did she get those divorce papers so quickly. 

The real question though, is why did Liam sign without reading them? Money isn't an issue for either of them, and of course we have the fifty percent thing in CA, but what about Beth? For all Liam knows Hope could have had a clause in there about her retaining full custody. 

There is definitely a reason why we are hearing about a nanny, and right on the brink of Sheila's trial. I can't imagine how she could beat the charges, but this is Bell LA, and we all know that legalities we deal with in the real world don't exist. 

[GHScorpiosRule]

On 7/19/2023 at 1:54 PM, norcalgal said:

Hopefully I don’t derail this thread, but I was curious why B&B has no issues with using non-union writers?  And if it comes to it, would the B&B actors still work if the actors’ strike is still ongoing by X time? 

From what I read on another soap's thread (as this same question was asked), the actors on soaps are under a different contract, which ends in 2024, and so they have to continue to work, or they'll be in breach.

14 hours ago, RuntheTable said:

Hope doesn't play; you ask her for something, and she is going to see you get it lickety-split. 

And yes, how did she get those divorce papers so quickly. 

 

I just can't wrap my brain around this and my inner child is going: "neener!neener! You SAID you wanted a divorce, and she gave it to you!" And the crying at the end as Liam's leaving? PUH-LEAZE. Maybe I should have some more grace and understanding? But I'm new and based on what I've been reading and seeing, nope. Even though I ADORE Scott Clifton since his GH days as Dillon.

I'm guessing Hope got those divorce papers drawn so fast, because well, television/soaps, and she's...rich?

It's pretty obvious Liam expected Hope to beg and ask for forgiveness AGAIN, and he was going to be world-weary and say he changed his mind about divorce, but forgiveness? She'd have to "work" for it.

So, was it just me, or does Finn not believe what Steffy is saying if the look on his face is anything to go by? Or is that his standard look? And this was before the phone call. And did something happen? I mean, other than them and every.damn.body talking about Hope kissing Thomas in Rome. The way they've been talking about how their marriage means EVERYTHING! blah, blah, fishcakes, it sounds like they've just recovered from some, as my man, Bugs Bunny would say "CAT-A-STROPHEE" the dialogue is so boring. Who talks that way? EVERY DAY? And I don't mean My Bugs!😅

And boy, Sheila doesn't look like a creepy crypt keeper at all. Nope. Not at all.

Edited July 21, 2023 by GHScorpiosRule

[Tippi]

10 hours ago, CharlizeCat said:

So, do substitute writers get to make up their own SLs and dialogue? If so, then this replacement crew needs to stay on full-time. Even though I despise Liam almost as much as I do Steffy, SC's lines have been on point and his performance has been stellar, of course, along with AN. She has been brilliant.

My problem with all of this has been, as I have said before, I don't get the sudden swerve to the Lope implosion being all about Liam and Steffy. Don't get me wrong, I am glad Hope finally read that trifling waffle for filth and dumped his whiny ass, but as she pointed out, Steffy has been a third party practically throughout Lope's entire relationship, even pre-marriage. Why now? She should have dumped his sorry ass after Mannequin night.

Hope's feelings for Thomas seemed to come out of nowhere, as she and Liam gave the appearance of being happy with their family in the claustrophobic cozy cabin. I agree that Liam shouldn't tell Hope how to run HFTF and who she can and cannot work with. However, he tried to be supportive and Hope ran with that, working long nights with Thomas, defending him, and shutting down Liam's concerns. 

I don't see Thope lasting for the duration. I think by the time that fizzles, Steffy and Finn will have broken up and Hope will have a "destiny epiphany" or a pinecone will drop on her head or she'll peep through a keyhole, or a seagull will shit on her head and we'll return to the ToD. 

In the meantime, I am loving Hope with a backbone and I don't feel sorry for whiny Liam. I just don't see this ending in a manner that doesn't insult our intelligence by rehashing a tired trope that should have been put to bed in the late '90s. 

I sure hope they don't go with the (beyond done to death) who's the daddy Liam or Thomas storyline on this.  So far the writing has been spot on with very good performances.  To end this with Hope running back to Liam because she's pregnant with his child would be a huge letdown.  Of course, that is what B&B is famous for.....

[KerleyQ]

8 minutes ago, Tippi said:

I sure hope they don't go with the (beyond done to death) who's the daddy Liam or Thomas storyline on this.  So far the writing has been spot on with very good performances.  To end this with Hope running back to Liam because she's pregnant with his child would be a huge letdown.  Of course, that is what B&B is famous for.....

I fear either outcome in that WTD equally. I don't want her running back to Liam, but I also don't want it to be Thomas's kid, and she sees that as a sign they should be together, with all kinds of "we're giving Douglas a sibling! And we're going to be a family!"  

From a planning for future generations perspective, it makes more sense for any pregnancy to be Liam's, since a kid who's biologically Hope's and Thomas's would be biologically related to literally every single member of their generation so far.

But, seriously, let's just not have a pregnancy, show. Hope being freed up to live her life loses its punch if she's immediately pregnant and tied right back down to either one of them. 

[backhometome]

😑 Yep, Finn is going to, out of the blue, sympathize with Sheila. Paving the way for Liam to swoop in on a white horse. I am not going to watch Finn be destroyed for hero Liam and Steam reunion. 🤢💩😔

 

 

[Chatty Cake]

I definitely see Shelia dressed as Mrs. Doubtfire in the very near future. And a break up shortly after.

Edited July 20, 2023 by Chatty Cake

[CharlizeCat]

If Steffy and Finn are so stupid that they wouldn't be able to recognize Sheila in any type of disguise, well then, they deserve what they get. (That doesn't mean I want Sheila to cause harm to Kelly or Hayes.)

And also coming soon to the snot blankie-covered sofa ... another tequila night where Steam drunkenly commiserates over both Finn and Hope defying ORDERS by daring to interact with *gasp* Sheila or Thomas. 

"If it was ANYBODY other than Thomas ... "

"I don't care if Finn took the Hippocratic oath. How DARE he see Sheila as a patient after I FORBADE him to have anything to do with her ... EVER!" 

Cue up the sex-y times music ... Cha! Cha! Cha! BARF!

I wish this would end once and for all with it being revealed that Bill is Kelly's bio-dad. (STILL holding out hope!) Hope would be happily involved with Wyatt (or anybody other than Thomas) and Bill with Li or Brooke. I would happily gloat at the irony of Liam having to raise his half-brother/stepdaughter with Steffy!

 

[Anna Yolei]

On 7/19/2023 at 4:53 AM, RuntheTable said:

As far as Brooke goes though, I will say she is doing what her daughter asked her to do. Given how she feels about Thomas and the situation in general, I am sure that wasn't easy for her. 

One thing I'll give Brooke is with rare exception, she does come through for her kids and tries to support them after they have their say....unlike Taylor, who was all too ready and willing to spill the beans about Steffy's first pregnancy despite Steffy telling her to let her handle this AND being in her exact situation.

As for Finn, my take on that is if were truly jealous, he would've bailed a long ass time ago but I can understand that he'd rather not be disrespected in his own home. Liam doesn't need to pal around the house to raise Kelly.

On 7/19/2023 at 6:39 AM, dovegrey said:

But I wonder... if the story is leading to Liam raping Steffy (he is coming off as creepy unhinged to me)

I hope TF not. He's already the biggest villain on the show to most people so they don't need to go full Ridge.

Personally, I don't think he will because choosing to violate another person involves...you know...making a *decision,* and we all know Liam is incapable of that. 😒

On 7/19/2023 at 2:14 PM, CountryGirl said:

Liam: 'So you kissed Thomas because– I’m sorry. This doesn’t make any sense to me. You’re gonna have to connect these dots." He's so snottily sanctimonious and acting like he's brand new in the history he started and perpetuated.

God help me, but even Ridge has had more self-reflection in his past. Back when he had the nerve to come running back after he learned about Taylor and James, a very single Brooke shut his ass down and sent him packing and he spend actual time reflecting on that and working to win Brooke back for months.

Hell, Ridge was even willing to give grace over that foundry boink AND stayed with Brooke despite thinking RJ's was Nick's. When you have even less awareness than the show's biggest egotistical blowhard, you may as well turn in your Leading Man card, it's over.

On 7/19/2023 at 2:14 PM, CountryGirl said:

She takes ownership for her part in his treatment of her, which is some serious freaking growth right there.

I was clapping when she said this. A not insignificant portion of why they've put up with this is because of their mothers encouraging this, be it Brooke encouraging Hope to sleep with him despite his marriage to Steffy, Taylor telling Steffy to go after him two seconds after their marriage was deemed invalid, Brooke setting up another surprise wedding while Steffy was out of town, and Taylor showing her entire bony ass at Lope's wedding in 2018 despite Steffy having no interest in Liam by then.  The two of them have absolutely been the products of a very dysfunctional upbringing but thankfully they seem more committed to ending the generational curse that's been going on ever since Eric left Beth Sr for Stephanie over 70 years ago.

Like others have said, there's no reason for Hope to keep on being stupid just because of the last decade over a sunken cost fallacy. Liam was the guy that was there at a low point in her life that she should've cut ties with the minute he gave her ring to Steffy.

Better late than never.

On 7/19/2023 at 4:16 PM, Waldo13 said:

Once again I have to say Hope is rationalizing her feelings for Lurch. 

I'd be lying if I said that wasn't part of it, but even still...imma be real honest, I just don't care at this point. As I heard one fan say it elsewhere, it's a "wrong guy, right reason" deal. Nothing will ever get me onboard with Thope but anyone would be well within their right to be tired of Liam at any point in their relationship.The biggest reason I hate Thomas is for the abuse of Douglas but him destroying Lope was a net benefit IMO.

That said, I agree that the timing is just....so incredibly bad and there were any number of better points to make this happen

13 hours ago, RuntheTable said:

Hope doesn't play; you ask her for something, and she is going to see you get it lickety-split. 

NGL, that was Hope 1.0's default and while she often picked some stupid ass hills to die on, she was quick to call bullshit when she saw it. I miss that.

Edited July 21, 2023 by Anna Yolei

[Anna Yolei]

4 hours ago, KerleyQ said:

fear either outcome in that WTD equally. I don't want her running back to Liam, but I also don't want it to be Thomas's kid, and she sees that as a sign they should be together, with all kinds of "we're giving Douglas a sibling! And we're going to be a family!"

Ugh, I didn't think I could think of a WTD story worse than Sally's on Y&R but this one would blow it well out of the water for awfulness. Hope is mentally free for the first time in her adult life and she should be able to enjoy that without another baby in tow.

 

1 hour ago, backhometome said:

😑 Yep, Finn is going to, out of the blue, sympathize with Sheila. Paving the way for Liam to swoop in on a white horse. I am not going to watch Finn be destroyed for hero Liam and Steam reunion. 🤢💩😔

God, SAME. Please just let Steffy and Hope both be done with this loser. The guy came into their lives as low points when they were on the rebound and both should have outgrown him like mint in a garden bed.

[SweePea59]

5 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

So, was it just me, or does Finn not believe what Steffy is saying if the look on his face is anything to go by? Or is that is standard look?

You mean this look? It's Finn's standard look! LOL!

[GHScorpiosRule]

1 minute ago, SweePea59 said:

You mean this look? It's Finn's standard look! LOL!

That's perfect! Though this is the one I was thinking of:

[Waldo13]

And there you have the omen of things to come.  Not knowing if Wyatt and Flo are still married but is there going to be a redux of Wyatt and Hope?  How about Stuffy getting very upset with Finn because of Shiela paving the way for Stuffy and Liam?  Round and round we go. Where it stops only the moneys with a keyboard know.  

The American Indians had their own version of revolving relationships. It was called “Passing the Buck”. 

[Artsda]

Wyatt knows that Liam jumped to kiss Steffy twice and yet he's going to try and tell Hope there's nothing with Liam and her? Then Steffy and Liam going to have the save conversation that Hope is the wrong one here. Steffy looked scared someone heard while Liam keeps mentioning the crossing the line. 

This whole episode minus Sheila and Finn was gaslighting Hope. 

Sheila and Finn is gross.  She almost murdered the real mom who raised him.  On top of the shooting him and Steffy. 

 

[KerleyQ]

52 minutes ago, Waldo13 said:

Not knowing if Wyatt and Flo are still married

I don't think they ever got married. If they did, I blinked and missed it. They were just engaged, but I'm going to assume even that is no longer a thing, since we haven't seen or heard of her in God knows how long. (Not that I'm complaining. I'm cool with pretending she never existed.)

[JNavarro]

Erstwhile viewer who begrudgingly got a curious about the Lope break up.

The good side of things is that from what I've seen, they're really giving Hope a good rationale for why she's handling it the way she is.  It makes you look back on all the insecurity and unease that marriage rested on, from both Liam's waffling and Hope's childhood with Brooke that she's talked about. At least on THIS point, it's actual good writing here.  Plus they're lucky to have AN- she's playing this as hurt but with newfound strength SO well.  

I just can't with Thomas.  I doubt I can ever see this character as anything but a creep, because the "reformed" version just comes off as nice guy creep.  The only time I ever bought that the character had legit non obsessive feelings towards someone was PF's version with Sally at the beginning (and that might have been Courtney Hope working her magic more than anything). 

And dude straight up abused up his kid and kept Hope thinking her daughter was freaking dead.  I can buy that this is Hope working through a bunch of crazy feelings and it's an outlet or something, but I'm noping TF out f this is actually meant to be some kind of Tru Love LT couple.  

 

 

[CharlizeCat]

I see Finn more like this. Especially the way he was glaring at Sheila.