S01.E02: Stronger Together

[that one guy]

My favorite thing about this episode was honestly the shout outs to classic Doctor Who. "Greyhound to Trap One" - these were the call signs for the Brigadier and Sgt. Benton in the UNIT era, and of course the DEO is UNIT. Also Princess Astra was sort of a "twin" since the actress returned the next season to play a different character. That's some advanced level geekery on somebody's part, either the episode writer or Ali Adler herself.

My least favorite thing is how Kara talks about being Supergirl right in front of all her coworkers.

[Chicago Redshirt]

Anybody else half-expected Vincent Price to laugh when Henshaw's eyes glowed red? Or am I dating myself?

 

I got the reference, but I'm old. :)

 

Seriously, though, other than "here's a mystery for you, dear viewers," I'm not sure why his eyes would have grown red at that particular time.

 

The thing I found MOST interesting was the show choice to have James fully in the know that Clark and Superman are the same guy (which is basically a first for television).

I am thinking it's relatively rare for any mainstream version of the mythos where there's a Jimmy Olsen. Henry James Olsen in Smallville found out about Clark's secret before his death. (still bitter that he was not THE Jimmy Olsen, even though he was billed as such.)

 

But I can't think off the top of my head of any instance where a mainstream Jimmy Olsen knew Clark was Superman. 

 

I'm on the fence about this episode. I love that Kat somehow unknowingly (?) became Kara's hero, but on the other hand, I'm not a fan of her getting what she wants through blackmail.

 

I like that Jimmy, sorry James, has an interesting backstory, but on the other hand, get a backbone. You're a Pulitzer prize winner, she needs you not vice versa. Also, stop the frigging close talking. I get it, you're Kara's love interest.

 

 

Seriously, threatening to fire you when you are a) a stellar employee b) have a pipeline to the most powerful man in the universe is not a good idea.

 

Also "Oh no, I'm going to be forced to go back to Metropolis and take a job with the best paper in America again and work with people who don't go out of their way to demean and bully their employees."

 

Since the show is so big on exposition - and there are likely so many new viewers not familiar with the Superman canon, a little explanation of how Kryptonian powers work in this universe might be nice.  Ok, we get that whole "I've got the same powers as my cousin" thing, but what does that mean exactly?  Do you both have micro-scopic vision?  Infra-red vision?  In this new universe, the writers have a really nice opportunity to re-define things just like Byrne did 30 years ago.  His Supes had some really cool little quirks, like being able to sense when he's been photographed.

 

I'd figure that they will explain the lesser-known powers when/if they plan to use them. Although I thought in this episode, Kara would do a sweep of the crime scene with her various vision powers.

[dusang]

The one part I appear to be wrong about is the age of Superman. I (wrongly) assumed he was quite young in Man of Steel, not in his 30s.

 

Yeah, I remember the 33 line because at that point in the movie they were slamming us over the head so hard with the Jesus allusions I had started making a list.

[Misanthrope]

What makes you think that? Did I miss something, because I haven't seen any indication of that.

The dialogue about how much Metropolis is spending on rebuilding, mostly.

 

I suppose it's entirely possible they're in some other universe with a Superman, given DC Comic's obsession with the multiverse, and the introduction in The Flash, but I got the impression they're definitely implying it's the same.

 

Time will tell, of course.

[VCRTracking]

I also noticed how buff Melissa Benoists arms are in this episode.

[cambridgeguy]

 

My least favorite thing is how Kara talks about being Supergirl right in front of all her coworkers.

She also uses her very bright heat vision to warm up coffee right in the middle of that newsroom. I guess no one saw the flash of light?

 

I do wonder where she's keeping her costume - Superman wearing his under his suit was always a stretch because of the cape and boots but Kara wears sleeveless tops and also has the skirt.  Maybe she stuffs it in a desk drawer? 

 

 

I also noticed how buff Melissa Benoists arms are in this episode.

She's obviously very fit but I'm pretty sure she has a body suit under the costume that could be enhancing the muscles.

[Chicago Redshirt]

The dialogue about how much Metropolis is spending on rebuilding, mostly.

 

I suppose it's entirely possible they're in some other universe with a Superman, given DC Comic's obsession with the multiverse, and the introduction in The Flash, but I got the impression they're definitely implying it's the same.

 

Time will tell, of course.

Battles with supervillains capable of giving Superman a hard time necessitate a lot of destruction almost by definition.

 

Like others have pointed out, there are various discrepancies between the Man of Steel-verse and what's been presented in Supergirl thus far.

[legaleagle53]

She also uses her very bright heat vision to warm up coffee right in the middle of that newsroom. I guess no one saw the flash of light?

 

The classical explanation in the comic books is that the beams of her and Superman's heat vision are invisible to ordinary humans.  We only see them so that we'll know when she's using it.

[sjohnson]

I'm sorry but I find pretty much everything with the DEO dreary. 

 

James is hot, Supergirl seems legitimately interested. But I'm not sure why she'd love him rather than just screw him. Also, I'm not dating either and the show's not going soft porn either, so the love story isn't doing it for me yet. 

 

I'm surprised how effectively Grant was used in this. Her implication Kara was on a track for a big career was interesting. 

 

Metal bending like putty when she squeezed too hard was a lovely touch. Very CBS, I think. Most of us want to suspend disbelief, but it's so nice when they help us out with getting some details right. 

 

Winn's mad sewing skills are definitely not butch, but he's definitely straight. And he's the only character who seems likely to be interested in Krypton. Most intriguing character by far. 

 

In the end, though, you have to be invested somehow in the lead. Melissa Benoist is more like Grant Gustin thatn Stephen Amell, but she's working for me so far. Coming back, despite the DEO.

[ratgirlagogo]

 

Anybody else half-expected Vincent Price to laugh when Henshaw's eyes glowed red? Or am I dating myself?

I heard him laugh in my heart.  Do you even have to be an old to get that, given that Vincent's movies have been playing constantly for the previous month all over TV, the same way they do every October?

 

I do wonder where she's keeping her costume - Superman wearing his under his suit was always a stretch because of the cape and boots but Kara wears sleeveless tops and also has the skirt.  Maybe she stuffs it in a desk drawer?

I've been wondering when they're going to explain that one too.

 

As to the line about the costume not being bulletproof, the comics have gone back and forth on that for ages... originally it was just clothes and they didn't put much thought into it, by the silver age it had been made using fabric from the indestructable baby blankets he came to Earth in

 But  her sister already gave her some of the baby blanket material last episode - I thought that was that.  And I still wonder how she was able to pierce her ears.

 

I also thought it was kind of a waste to not be able to put the Hellgrammite to use instead of killing him. Aren't they supposed to be studying the science for all these aliens?   Here the government has all these vats of DDT it's trying to gradually get rid of - and he can just eat it for them!  Maybe whatever it turns into after he excretes it might cure cancer, or repair the ozone layer or something.

[legaleagle53]

And I still wonder how she was able to pierce her ears.

 

She couldn't have done that before she left Krypton?  At 12, she would have been old enough to have it done with her parents' permission -- nowadays many parents even have their daughters' ears pierced almost from the time they're born.

[lion10]

She couldn't have done that before she left Krypton? At 12, she would have been old enough to have it done with her parents' permission -- nowadays many parents even have their daughters' ears pierced almost from the time they're born.

Word of the producer says that she did get her ears pierced on Krypton.

[ratgirlagogo]

Yeah, you're right - logically it was on Krypton.  . Probably that is true since Astra's ears are pierced as well. Now I need to go back and pay attention in the flashbacks.  Parents piercing their babies' ears isn't even a nowadays thing in many cultures anyway, it's a long established custom so I never even thought about the parental permission aspect of it.

 

ETA: I posted while lion10 was posting - so now we know.

Edited November 3, 2015 by ratgirlagogo

[iMonrey]

The thing I found MOST interesting was the show choice to have James fully in the know that Clark and Superman are the same guy (which is basically a first for television).

 

I don't follow the comics so my knowledge of Superman is limited to the films, but I was a bit surprised Jimmy Olsen knew Clark Kent was really Superman. I feel like they need to do more to explain why, exactly, Superman is missing in action in the show, like there's a reason he and Supergirl can't interact and so he sent James to National City to coach her and answer her questions. Supe's absence is understandable from a production aspect but glaring in its omission narratively.

[statsgirl]

James is grown up and no longer Jimmy so I can easily understand that he knows who Superman is.  It was only right to bring him into the loop sometime.

 

What I really liked about this episode is Kara's explanation that while Superman is used to doing it alone, she's 'stronger together'.  It's a nice way of bringing in the difference between how males and females function.  "Fight or flight" is the male response (the original studies were done on men only); women "circle the wagons" and protect the vulnerable 

 

I didn't understand why they didn't just give all the DDT to the alien. It's a safe and effective way of disposing of it and he's starving.  As far as I can see, he didn't do anything wrong on Earth except try to survive.

 

I like that this season's first Big Bad is Kara's equal.  It makes it more interesting when she has to use brains to defeat her and not just slugging it out.

 

Stupid moment #1:  when Kara and Alex stopped to hug each other even though Evil Aunt was still in the building.

 

I don't like Cat. At all.  She's the type of women who talks Girl Power while doing everything she can to keep other women down.  She's also a bitch, worse she's a stupid Bitch and I don't find her amusing.

 

Hank is a yawn/creepy but he may have potential if he goes villainous.  Stupid moment #2:  handing Astra a weapon that can hurt Kara.

 

Stupid moment #3:  if the door will only open for Kara, how did they get in to build it?  Or clean it?

 

Winn is Cisco-lite and I really hope he's not the ship with Kara.  But knowing how Kresiburg thinks that love triangles = good writing (it doesn't) I'm not holding out hope.

 

I like James's relationship with Kara but I get get T.K. out of my mind and T,K, is eons too old for her.  But the balcony scene helped.

 

This show has jumped over Flash to #2 on my DC TV-verse.

Edited November 3, 2015 by statsgirl

[Chris24601]

The dialogue about how much Metropolis is spending on rebuilding, mostly.

 

I suppose it's entirely possible they're in some other universe with a Superman, given DC Comic's obsession with the multiverse, and the introduction in The Flash, but I got the impression they're definitely implying it's the same.

Nah, the commentator mentioning damage in Metropolis said city repair bills had quadrupled since Superman showed up. That's nothing compared to the estimated $2 TRILLION in damage the end battle in 'Man of Steel' inflicted (see here) ... heck, quadrupled rates probably wouldn't even cover the interest on paying for the damage 'Man of Steel' caused (for comparison, if you quadrupled NYC's infrastructure budget it would take 500 years to just cover the costs of repairing the damage from MoS, not counting interest payments).

 

So yeah, definitely not happening in the Man of Steel universe... the Superman of the Supergirl-verse is a paragon of care and minimizing collateral damage compared to MoS Superman (to be fair to MoS Supes though... $2 trillion is still peanuts compared to global extinction of the human race and MOST, though not all, of that damage was done by Zod's crew before Superman even got back from the other side of the world).

[Trini]

Heh -- I wonder who has the bigger stockpile of Kryptonite in this universe, Henshaw or Luthor?

 

Sorry, quoting myself because I wrote this right before going to bed, and then I woke up this morning and knew what the correct answer was:

 

It's Batman.

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

Supergirl Proves There's No 'S' In Team
Everyone learns a little something about the value of co-operation. And Kryptonite.

[Chicago Redshirt]

Am I right in my understanding that in the Supergirl-verse, there are literally only two superheroes, Superman and Supergirl?

[Trini]

So far....

[Kromm]

I am thinking it's relatively rare for any mainstream version of the mythos where there's a Jimmy Olsen. Henry James Olsen in Smallville found out about Clark's secret before his death. (still bitter that he was not THE Jimmy Olsen, even though he was billed as such.)

 

But I can't think off the top of my head of any instance where a mainstream Jimmy Olsen knew Clark was Superman. 

While I didn't really expect confirmation James knew, I do get WHY they did it. Not just to serve Kara's story, and not just to get around the doubletalk that would have to exist to jump over the subject of Clark Kent, but also because Superman is so... well... old.

 

A Superman in his mid-to-late 30s is about the upper limit on Superman's age for anything other than special event comics (plenty of those have had Superman significantly older). And more importantly, they've also done something else rarely to never done in Superman comics--they've held up a definitive time against his career (AND by inference a definitive and specific age for him). We know Kara's been on Earth around 12 years. We know she was stuck in the zone for twice that, I believe (at least that's what someone upthead said, and I believe it). So... that would make Supes 36-37 (since he could have been as much as a year old when he was shoved in that capsule, I'd say and still probably count as a baby). What else do we know? We know Supes was IN COSTUME when he pulled 12 year old Kara out of her capsule. Ergo we know 100% he's been Superman at LEAST 12-13 years (although we have to infer he probably hasn't been Superman for longer than another 6 years on top of that, and probably more like only 2-3 more years, since I think logically he has to be planted as Clark Kent working for The Daily Planet when Superman's career starts... so... a college graduate).

 

Again, I don't think any ongoing implementation of Superman has EVER been this specific. It's cool and scary at once.

 

Getting back to how this relates to James, I think this sets up the whole "James is a real adult now" storyline, and him knowing the secret ID is kind of the final brick in that wall. He knows precisely because Superman has been Supermanning for so long. It's CREDIBLE for him to know and supports the whole backstory that Jimmy eventually became James some time in that whole long Superman career and eventually learned the whole truth about Supes.

Am I right in my understanding that in the Supergirl-verse, there are literally only two superheroes, Superman and Supergirl?

I'd say they're being careful to parcel out that knowledge out to us slowly. It's not just a matter of rights or franchises, I think they're maybe trying to plot out a course where Kara is more unique rather than lost in a sea of other superheroes, but they can't go TOO hard on that, because it's clear they plan Earth based enemies for her and not JUST aliens. And if you have things like

Red Tornado

, for example, coming from Earth-tech, then you probably have some other heroes squirreled away too.

Edited November 3, 2015 by Kromm

[Kromm]

The dialogue about how much Metropolis is spending on rebuilding, mostly.

There's really no reason to interpret that as Metropolis recovering from the events of Man of Steel, because even the comics admit that Superman being in that city means buildings get knocked down and streets torn up constantly.

 

Heck, even the Batman comics admit the same about Gotham and Batsy, and Batsy doesn't even have Superpowers.

Hank is a yawn/creepy but he may have potential if he goes villainous.  Stupid moment #2:  handing Astra a weapon that can hurt Kara.

 

Stupid moment #3:  if the door will only open for Kara, how did they get in to build it?  Or clean it?

I have a bridge to sell you, which looks like the Brooklyn Bridge but is somehow in Metropolis, if you think Hank isn't listening in/recording everything happening/said in that room.

[Sara2009]

I definitely thought the first half was too tropey, but the second half got so much better when they allowed the story to actually flow and not having cliches thrown in every direction. First off, I am really, really loving Kara and Jimmy. They have such excellent scenes that it makes me already want them as a couple, but I love their growing friendship too.

The Superman name-dropping felt more natural than it did in the pilot. I also liked the Clark/Lois name drops.

Kara's relationship with her sister is one of my favourite parts of the show; I also have to point out that I love that Kara knows about her aunt being the villain. Usually, they'd keep that secret going until at least episode 9 or 10.

Wynn is alright, I guess. I do really like Jeremy Jordan, but I do think his character is pretty boring thus far, and his 'rivalry' with Jimmy isn't interesting. I'd find it more interesting if Wynn wasn't interested in Kara.

I like the villain aspect, and I like Henshaw. Kara's boss isn't super interesting to me yet.

I like Jeremy Jordan as a singer, but he's never impressed me as an actor. He's fine, but he just doesn't do much for me. I WANT to like him more than I actually do.

[jaytee1812]

The Winn/Jimmy 'rivalry' is hilarious. Jimmy looks a Winn as if to say 'shut up little boy'. I think Winn is the weakest link in the show. Everything about him says NiceGuy, Kara's lovely and funny, why doesn't she have a better friend?

Also why doesn't Kara have any female friends?

[Kromm]

The Winn/Jimmy 'rivalry' is hilarious. Jimmy looks a Winn as if to say 'shut up little boy'. I think Winn is the weakest link in the show. Everything about him says NiceGuy, Kara's lovely and funny, why doesn't she have a better friend?

Also why doesn't Kara have any female friends?

One could argue her sister fills that role. Sure we got that reveal that Alex was jealous and on some level wanted to keep Kara down... but Kara didn't know that (until recently), and seemingly wasn't particularly hurt by it (because she's been written specifically as a very non-angsty character).

[LoneHaranguer]

 

She also uses her very bright heat vision to warm up coffee right in the middle of that newsroom.

I thought I was being sarcastic last week when I suggested she might do something like that.

[nksarmi]

Some of you are clearly new to following the DC television vs movie debates so as a fan of Arrow and Flash - I have read several quotes saying that the DC television and movie universes will be completely separate.  Ergo, no this is not the same verse as Man of Steel.

 

The real question is how could it possibly fit in with the Flarrow verse and the only reasonable answer seems to be the results of multiple Earths over on Flash.  So far they only have Earth and Earth2 but they could have another that contains this Supergirl/Superman story.  I would try to fanwhack their ability to exist in the same universe if we only considered the likes of Arrow, Canary, etc... as vigilantes.  But there is just no way you wouldn't call Flash (where Central City has had a Flash Day so it's pretty public) a superhero. 

[Kromm]

Some of you are clearly new to following the DC television vs movie debates so as a fan of Arrow and Flash - I have read several quotes saying that the DC television and movie universes will be completely separate.  Ergo, no this is not the same verse as Man of Steel.

 

The real question is how could it possibly fit in with the Flarrow verse and the only reasonable answer seems to be the results of multiple Earths over on Flash.  So far they only have Earth and Earth2 but they could have another that contains this Supergirl/Superman story.  I would try to fanwhack their ability to exist in the same universe if we only considered the likes of Arrow, Canary, etc... as vigilantes.  But there is just no way you wouldn't call Flash (where Central City has had a Flash Day so it's pretty public) a superhero. 

The even more compelling evidence once more relates to timelines. Flash/Arrow happens in a contemporary looking setting. Supergirl happens in a contemporary setting. Flash/Arrow established that there weren't really any public superheroes of note before Arrow. Supergirl established that Superman was bopping along as a public hero for at least 12 years. Ergo, they're not the same universe.

[TV Anonymous]

Do they deviate a bit from comic canon? IIRC, Supergirl's human first name is Linda instead of Kara, which is her Kryptonian name.

 

As well, Astra is still able to fly and flee after being stabbed with Kryptonite knife surprises me. I thought Kryptonians lost their superhuman powers when they have Kryptonite around them, not to mention in them?

[Chicago Redshirt]

There have been so many different versions of most comic characters over the years that it is hard to say that there is one canon. But yes, traditionally, Supergirl has had as her civilian ID Linda Lee or Linda Danvers. Sometimes, I think she has just gone by Kara Zor-El.

 

In terms of Kryptonite weapons, there certainly have been different effects from different versions and even within one continuity.

 

In "Superman Returns," for example, Superman gets stabbed with Kryptonite and is almost killed, but later in the same movie he is able to lift an entire island laced with the stuff.
 

It could be that the knife Henshaw had was a lower grade of Kryptonite, or some sort of artificial Kryptonite, or just laced with Kryptonite.

In the Supergirl-verse so far, the DEO has used Kryptonite tranquilizers and the Kryptonite Danger Room, and now this knife. Supergirl was able to be taken down with several shots of the tranquilizers and experienced pain. The KDR has apparently different settings, including one where Kara was reduced to a human 's power level with no apparent pain.

 

Basically it just does what the writers want it to do.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Chicago Redshirt

[legaleagle53]

As well, Astra is still able to fly and flee after being stabbed with Kryptonite knife surprises me. I thought Kryptonians lost their superhuman powers when they have Kryptonite around them, not to mention in them?

 

Green Kryptonite doesn't cause Kryptonians to lose their powers.  What it does is emit powerful radiation that can penetrate even their invulnerable skin and turn their red corpuscles green.  This in turn causes blood poisoning, resulting in a fever that is invariably fatal.  That's why Astra said that the knife was still making her sick even though it had been removed from her body -- if she had been exposed to it long enough, it would have eventually killed her.  Now, at a relatively low level (such as what Kara has so far been exposed to), it can weaken them to the point that it nullifies their strength and speed, but they still have their powers.  They are just rendered incapacitated due to the slight blood poisoning.  My guess is that the knife had weakened Astra, but not completely incapacitated her, which enabled her to escape.

 

Of course, now i wonder whether we'll see the other varieties of Kryptonite show up:  red Kryptonite, which in classical canon, had weird, unpredictable temporary effects on Kryptonians who were exposed to it; white Kryptonite, which was fatal to all plant life; and the second most dangerous variety after green Kryptonite -- gold Kryptonite, which really DID have the effect of permanently destroying a Kryptonian's superpowers.

Edited November 4, 2015 by legaleagle53

[laschifosavita]

Do they deviate a bit from comic canon? IIRC, Supergirl's human first name is Linda instead of Kara, which is her Kryptonian name.

 

As well, Astra is still able to fly and flee after being stabbed with Kryptonite knife surprises me. I thought Kryptonians lost their superhuman powers when they have Kryptonite around them, not to mention in them?

I'm not totally up to date at the moment, but the current Supergirl has only gone by Kara.  That might have played a part in it, but I would guess that they mostly just didn't want to confuse people by having her use two different names.

 

I want to like Cat, but I feel like her weekly conversations about feminism are mostly just to fluster Kara, because they don't make sense.  Wouldn't pointing out that Superman made a lot of mistakes when he was starting out be the better thing to do in this situation?  I'm guessing it's just badly written dialogue, but it seemed like Cat was the only one in the room that was demanding that women do better than men to get the same amount of recognition.

[Kromm]

Do they deviate a bit from comic canon? IIRC, Supergirl's human first name is Linda instead of Kara, which is her Kryptonian name.

 

As well, Astra is still able to fly and flee after being stabbed with Kryptonite knife surprises me. I thought Kryptonians lost their superhuman powers when they have Kryptonite around them, not to mention in them?

One of the stupider things they did, IMO, changing that.

 

I know that "Linda" is boring sounding. But "Linda Danvers" allowed Supergirl to also publicly have the name "Kara Zor-El" and now they've (stupidly) removed that capability.

 

It's another unnecessarily convoluted situation they've created, like how the DEO, Winn, and of course Alex and the Danvers parents all know who she is, but can't ever know about Clark Kent... and the audience kind of has to figure that out and the show dodge around slowing itself down explaining that.  So now added to that we have the fact that even if the public somehow knows (we don't know if they do) that Superman's actual name is "Kal-El", they can't ever know that Kara's is "Kara Zor-El", because then the girl who looks just like her and works at a media company would be too obvious a suspect.

 

Duh!

[legaleagle53]

I want to like Cat, but I feel like her weekly conversations about feminism are mostly just to fluster Kara, because they don't make sense.  Wouldn't pointing out that Superman made a lot of mistakes when he was starting out be the better thing to do in this situation?  I'm guessing it's just badly written dialogue, but it seemed like Cat was the only one in the room that was demanding that women do better than men to get the same amount of recognition.

 

Cat did have a point, though, which Kara herself recognized, and it had nothing to do with the old feminist saw about women needing to work twice as hard as men to be thought of as even half as competent (the punchline of which is "fortunately, this isn't hard to do").  As an inexperienced beginner who hadn't yet learned to control her powers so that she could use them with the precision needed to get the job done right the first time, Kara needed to build trust with the public by doing competent small jobs first and then work her way up to doing larger jobs that required more finesse.  Kara took Cat's advice to heart and did just that with Winn and Jimmy's help (loved the bit of one-upmanship by Winn -- he's clearly jealous that Kara appears to be closer to Jimmy than to him), which resulted in the city being quick to forgive her for her initial mistakes because it realized that it COULD trust her to be there when she was needed without making existing problems worse.

[Chicago Redshirt]

Green Kryptonite doesn't cause Kryptonians to lose their powers.  What it does is emit powerful radiation that can penetrate even their invulnerable skin and turn their red corpuscles green.  This in turn causes blood poisoning, resulting in a fever that is invariably fatal.  That's why Astra said that the knife was still making her sick even though it had been removed from her body -- if she had been exposed to it long enough, it would have eventually killed her.  Now, at a relatively low level (such as what Kara has so far been exposed to), it can weaken them to the point that it nullifies their strength and speed, but they still have their powers.  They are just rendered incapacitated due to the slight blood poisoning.  My guess is that the knife had weakened Astra, but not completely incapacitated her, which enabled her to escape.

 

 

Assuming for argument's sake you're technically correct, this seems to me a fancy way to say that green K causes a Kryptonian to lose powers. They are typically in so much pain that they cannot fly, or use super-speed to flee the Kryptonite. While under the effects of Kryptonite, other items like knives, needles and guns have been able to penetrate their skin, etc. (As we saw in the pilot, it allowed the tranquilizer darts to penetrate Kara's skin. Otherwise, they would have bounced off her like bullets.)

 

For instance, in Superman I, Superman couldn't himself take off the Kryptonite necklace and dump it.

 

They are weakened/in so much pain that they can't do the normal things that they can do. 

 

I want to like Cat, but I feel like her weekly conversations about feminism are mostly just to fluster Kara, because they don't make sense.  Wouldn't pointing out that Superman made a lot of mistakes when he was starting out be the better thing to do in this situation?

I don't think that is true, though. At least, in most versions of Superman, he started out as the most perfect perfection that ever perfected.

 

One of the many reasons that character is pretty boring is that he does not make mistakes that the public is aware of, or to the extent he does, he fixes them immediately.

 

One of the stupider things they did, IMO, changing that.

 

I know that "Linda" is boring sounding. But "Linda Danvers" allowed Supergirl to also publicly have the name "Kara Zor-El" and now they've (stupidly) removed that capability.

 

It's another unnecessarily convoluted situation they've created, like how the DEO, Winn, and of course Alex and the Danvers parents all know who she is, but can't ever know about Clark Kent... and the audience kind of has to figure that out and the show dodge around slowing itself down explaining that.  So now added to that we have the fact that even if the public somehow knows (we don't know if they do) that Superman's actual name is "Kal-El", they can't ever know that Kara's is "Kara Zor-El", because then the girl who looks just like her and works at a media company would be too obvious a suspect.

 

Duh!

I don't think it's that big a deal that she is just publicly known as Supergirl, and it's not as though "Kara" is that unusual a name that it would cause anyone who was not already able to link Supergirl and Kara together to have a brainstorm.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Chicago Redshirt

[Chris24601]

I don't think it's that big a deal that she is just publicly known as Supergirl, and it's not as though "Kara" is that unusual a name that it would cause anyone who was not already able to link Supergirl and Kara together to have a brainstorm.

Plus, doesn't Cat keep calling her Care-a because she's barely even on Cat's radar anyway? Cat's so self-involved she probably wouldn't even associate the name Car-A with her assistant Care-A anyway... other than perhaps to snark that they're spelled the same but Supergirl's name has a more exotic pronunciation (followed by one of Kara's "did she REALLY just say that?" looks.

[Perfect Xero]

I am sticking with it but it's not making life easy.

 

1. Kara says she only found out about Kryptonite the other day (i.e. in the pilot). So again, Superman has held out a pretty important fact of life (that there exists an element that can cause excruciating pain and possibly even death to Kryptonians) from his cousin. Also, one would think that there'd be some information about Kryptonite in the public eye, what with Superman having been operating openly for at least a dozen years (since Kara's arrival and probably some before then) and presumably having faced enemies who used it.

 

I find it really strange that Kara didn't know about kryptonite, Supes never told her about the one substance other than red sunlight that could depower and kill her?  And I'm really surprised that not!Alura didn't know about kryptonite.  If she's been here as long as Kara has, then surely she knows about Superman and has been following his exploits and so should know about kryptonite.  Idk, I'm not buying Klara and her aunt not knowing about kryptonite.  It's interesting how little it takes to affect a Kryptonian.  At 18% strength Klara was reduced to human-level and all it took were a few kryptonite-laced needles to knock her out.  Any higher than that could easily kill her.  If I were her, warning bells would be going off in my head about the fact that the DEO has a room specifically designed to subdue and kill Kryptonians, especially since the only ones they'd know of would be Clark and Kara.

 

If Aunt Astra doesn't know what Kryptonite is after being on Earth hiding and plotting for over a decade, and Kara doesn't know, it would stand to reason that there's a good chance that Superman doesn't know what it is either.

[Chicago Redshirt]

I can't swallow that Superman has no knowledge of Kryptonite, given a) he has been operating for at least a dozen years in the Supergirlverse and b) the DEO has knowledge of Kryptonite and has fashioned it into at least three sets of weapons (tranq darts, knife, KDR) and c) in basically every other mainstream version of Superman/boy Kryptonite seems to comes up within a year or two of his first appearance, if not significantly less.

[that one guy]

She's obviously very fit but I'm pretty sure she has a body suit under the costume that could be enhancing the muscles.

I think it's a little of both. She's obviously been training hard for the role, her physique says to me "I was captain of my Division III college basketball team." She definitely has muscle definition in her scenes with the sleeveless top, but it's exaggerated a bit in the suit. The boots also probably have lifts - Melissa Benoist is 2" taller than Chyler Leigh, but gains at least another inch on her in costume (although it might just be that as Kara Danvers, she slouches).

 

In fact, I sort of buy that Cat doesn't recognize her - Supergirl is taller than "Kara Danvers," has broader shoulders and better hair. Her voice is a a bit lower, she projects more, and she doesn't fidgit and squirm the same way. Ironically, she plays Danvers and Jor-El more differently than Laura Benanti plays Allura and Astra so far. I'd be more likely to say "You should totally go as Supergirl for Halloween, you look just like her" than to say "Are you Supergirl?"

[Perfect Xero]

I can't swallow that Superman has no knowledge of Kryptonite, given a) he has been operating for at least a dozen years in the Supergirlverse and b) the DEO has knowledge of Kryptonite and has fashioned it into at least three sets of weapons (tranq darts, knife, KDR) and c) in basically every other mainstream version of Superman/boy Kryptonite seems to comes up within a year or two of his first appearance, if not significantly less.

 

How long he's been operating has nothing to do with it though, nor do other continuities, he's either encountered it in this world or hasn't. The DOD having it simply means that the DOD found a way to hurt him, and have weaponized it, which, again, doesn't require his knowledge of it.

[Chicago Redshirt]

How long Superman has been operating does increase or decrease the probability of his having encountered Kryptonite. It's possible that Superman encounters Kryptonite before ever putting on the costume. It's possible that he doesn't encounter it in his entire career. 

 

It's just not very probable that he hasn't encountered Kryptonite in 12+ years of adventuring.

 

The notion that someone deduced that Kryptonite could hurt Kryptonians without the main known Kryptonian having ever been exposed to it or having any knowledge of it seems far-fetched, especially if we are to think that the DEO has had these weapons at the ready for some time.  

 

For us to believe that Superman has never heard of or been exposed to Kryptonite, we have to buy that 

a) no villain in the 12+ years Superman has been operating has ever used Kryptonite against him

b) the DEO somehow discovered/deduced Kryptonite and its harmful effects on Kryptonians independently of Superman

c) the DEO never attempted to use Kryptonite against Superman

d) Superman/Clark Kent and the rest of the Supergirlverse reporting squad never discovered the DEO's weaponizing Kryptonite

e) The first time the DEO ever deployed a Kryptonite weapon it was against Supergirl while she was en route to a good deed.

 

The simplest explanation here is that Superman for whatever reason just neglected to tell Kara about Kryptonite.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Chicago Redshirt

[ratgirlagogo]

 

in most versions of Superman, he started out as the most perfect perfection that ever perfected.

Yes.  This is why the radio writers are the ones who came up with Kryptonite as a concept - he could be that perfect perfection in a once a month comic and even in a drawn-out newspaper strip.  But three fifteen minute episodes a week, with no visuals to fill up the story - they had to do SOMETHING.

[that one guy]

The DOD having it simply means that the DOD found a way to hurt him, and have weaponized it, which, again, doesn't require his knowledge of it.

 

If Superman hadn't encountered Kryptonite, how would they know it would hurt him? Unless there's a reveal that they have other Kryptonians trapped in a secret lab as guinea pigs, the only way they could know the stuff would harm Superman is that they've seen it harm Superman. I'm guessing this is a post-General Zod timeline.

[Kromm]

Plus, doesn't Cat keep calling her Care-a because she's barely even on Cat's radar anyway? Cat's so self-involved she probably wouldn't even associate the name Car-A with her assistant Care-A anyway... other than perhaps to snark that they're spelled the same but Supergirl's name has a more exotic pronunciation (followed by one of Kara's "did she REALLY just say that?" looks.

Cat Grant isn't the only person Kara has ever met. The problem with this plotline/logic is that it acts like she is. While really, any of the hundreds of people who Kara encounters should be capable of noticing she looks like Supergirl, and on top of that if it ever came out that Supergirl's Kryptonian name is "Kara Zor-El" have the tiny little niggling thought that the girl who lives in their building has the same name and looks like Supergirl, or that girl who gets coffee at their coffee stand, or takes books out of the library where they're a librarian, or has the desk four down from them at Catco.

 

Yes, we overlook it, because it's what the formula demands. That doesn't mean it isn't worth an eyeroll, because they didn't HAVE to name her Kara (or pretend like Cat is the only possible danger to her secret identity).

Edited November 4, 2015 by Kromm

[stealinghome]

The boots also probably have lifts - Melissa Benoist is 2" taller than Chyler Leigh, but gains at least another inch on her in costume (although it might just be that as Kara Danvers, she slouches).

I could have sworn we saw a full-body shot of Kara in costume this week (I think when she busts in the warehouse looking for her sister) and her heels were huge. But maybe I imagined it because we're so used to female superheroes with ridiculous heels.

I agree that, as delightful as I'm finding the character, Cat is a problem in terms of the show's feminism. Basically I think the writers are being lazy--they're using Cat as a mouthpiece for sexist critiques Supergirl is/will encounter, and also using her as the feminist rebuttal to those critiques. Unfortunately, because they're not great writers and also because Cat does at times have legitimate critiques that end up being interwoven with the ventriloquized sexism, it ends up looking like Cat is one of those classic "tear all other women down" "feminists." I don't think that's the intention for the character, but it would go a long way if we saw someone else actually be sexist and then Cat rebutting it while saying something like "see, THIS is what women have to put up with."

Also because it's going to get old pretty quickly to have Cat just cranking about sexism at every turn. She's not wrong, at all, but if she just keeps talking and we never see much sexism, it starts to just sound like a bogeyman.

Edited November 4, 2015 by stealinghome

[Kromm]

I could have sworn we saw a full-body shot of Kara in costume this week (I think when she busts in the warehouse looking for her sister) and her heels were huge. But maybe I imagined it because we're so used to female superheroes with ridiculous heels.

One of the many articles out there on the show was about the wardrobe-mistress of the show, and she said in it that they have both boots with heels and without heels for different scenes.

 

Likely there is no in-continuity explanation for this--they won't explain it or acknowledge it and they probably generally think people won't notice--but I'm sure if we look hard enough we'll see evidence of it in the shots.  I'd assume running shots or most fighting shots with no heels and talky scenes with heels, perhaps, although your observation of that warehouse scene seems to argue otherwise.

[statsgirl]

In fact, I sort of buy that Cat doesn't recognize her - Supergirl is taller than "Kara Danvers," has broader shoulders and better hair. Her voice is a a bit lower, she projects more, and she doesn't fidgit and squirm the same way. Ironically, she plays Danvers and Jor-El more differently than Laura Benanti plays Allura and Astra so far.

Plus, as James pointed out, Cat doesn't actually see Kara at all.  I'm pretty sure she couldn't pick her out of a line-up now, and that's even before she sees Supergirl hovering above her.

 

G.K Chesterton wrote a Father Brown story (The Queer Feet) in which the thief committed his crime by changing his manner of standing and walking between a gentleman and a waiter and no one noticed that it was the same man. So I can completely understand why Cat doesn't make the connection.

 

Cat Grant isn't the only person Kara has ever met. The problem with this plotline/logic is that it acts like she is. While really, any of the hundreds of people who Kara encounters should be capable of noticing she looks like Supergirl, and on top of that if it ever came out that Supergirl's Kryptonian name is "Kara Zor-El" have the tiny little niggling thought that the girl who lives in their building has the same name and looks like Supergirl, or that girl who gets coffee at their coffee stand, or takes books out of the library where they're a librarian, or has the desk four down from them at Catco.

I think keeping the name Kara for both persona is a big problem. 

 

But in terms of physical appearance, very few people would see both Kara and Supergirl in person. And even those who do, Kara is mousy and slouching with her hair tied back, while Supergirl is super strong and has flowing hair.  Do they even know that Supergirl has a normal identity?  Unless someone is actively looking to find out who Supergirl is, assuming she has another identity, I don't think anyone would necessarily connect the two.

 

it would go a long way if we saw someone else actually be sexist and then Cat rebutting it while saying something like "see, THIS is what women have to put up with."

We did see than when she was talking about what it was like working for Perry White but it came out more as a "see, THIS is what I have to put up with" than something about women in general.

Edited November 5, 2015 by statsgirl

[Eucrid]

I'm sorry but I find pretty much everything with the DEO dreary. 

 

James is hot, Supergirl seems legitimately interested. But I'm not sure why she'd love him rather than just screw him. Also, I'm not dating either and the show's not going soft porn either, so the love story isn't doing it for me yet. 

 

I'm surprised how effectively Grant was used in this. Her implication Kara was on a track for a big career was interesting. 

 

Metal bending like putty when she squeezed too hard was a lovely touch. Very CBS, I think. Most of us want to suspend disbelief, but it's so nice when they help us out with getting some details right. 

 

Winn's mad sewing skills are definitely not butch, but he's definitely straight. And he's the only character who seems likely to be interested in Krypton. Most intriguing character by far. 

 

In the end, though, you have to be invested somehow in the lead. Melissa Benoist is more like Grant Gustin thatn Stephen Amell, but she's working for me so far. Coming back, despite the DEO.

 

Completely agree on the DEO. I really hope the evil eye bit at the end will lead to her sister leaving the DEO and joining her new gang of helpers.

 

Agree on Jimmy Olsen too, yeah we get it he's very handsome and he's a good guy, any chance you could flesh him out and make him somewhat like a real boy now?

 

And yes I too am coming back for Melissa Benoist. She's a hero I want to root for every week.

[MarkHB]

I liked the part where Kara, talking to Jimmy James contrasted her memories of Krypton with her cousin's lack thereof.  Also, regarding the "my cousin," etc. stuff, my gut feeling is that Kara would actually tend to think of him as Kal-El or just Kal, but it's likely that a decent percentage of the audience would have no idea who she meant if she said that so they're going with "my cousin," "Superman" and various alternatives thereto.

[Kromm]

Heh. How do you code that strikeout text again?  I love that "Jimmy James" thing.

 

Jimmy James without the strikeout makes me think of NewsRadio though.