S02.E05: No Room At The Inn

[stillshimpy]

Wow, I adore Fiona Apple's theme song at the beginning of The Affair, but admit that I'm not super jazzed about the Twangy theme song here.

It's interesting, I never questioned that Mary woke up and I still don't. This is a show in which the central premise is there is some unseen force that removed 2% of the population from everyone's known reality. Call it God, gods, aliens or stray wizards, there is something going on here that goes beyond what we understand of reality. Tower dude totally saw Matt talking to the departed GR woman, so there's something going on.

So on the subject of that theme song and "just let the mystery be" , I think all of the trouble that Matt runs into is that he desperately tries to assign a specific meaning to something he doesn't understand. He thinks it is evidence of the God of the bible, when really all the departures are evidence of is "Yeah, there's something we don't understand and can't define at play here."

The only person we saw Matt in bed with last year was with Mary and it was in a flashback to their anniversary, where they were having sex.

My own personal take is that there are unseen spiritual forces operating in the Leftovers universe; some people can see and hear them, they are however in the minority. But the show is about uncertainty (as well as grief and loss) and is never going to give either the characters or the audience a definitive answer. Some who do get access will believe, will make a leap of faith as do Kevin's dad and Matt. Others, like Kevin, will view the visions as insanity. Meanwhile, people without access will continue to do all sorts of crazy and destructive things because they cannot tolerate not knowing.

I think one of the most interesting things that the show does is absolutely show us that there is something unseen, that we do not understand (The box with the bird buried in it comes to mind) going on here and then refuses to truly define it. Matt keeps getting screwed over because he is desperate to make it fit his own, pre-existing definition.

I don't think he replaced himself in the Stockade because he feels subconscious guilt about impregnating Mary, because I don't think he raped a woman in a vegetative state after a particularly vivid lucid dream. I just think that there's actually a real possibility that the Mary he spoke with and the Mary in that chair are not necessarily one and the same. I mean, if Mary's consciousness is no longer really attached to her, and we see head characters that seem to actually have some idea of what is going on that can't be explained (Jill's grandfather rescuing her from that fridge last season) ...then I think it's possible that Matt interacted with that form of Mary in some kind of fugue state (like Kevin seems to achieve on a fairly regular basis).

So I think something is pulling Matt's puppet strings, but as to what it is? I don't know.

Plus, you just freaking know that the next time Nora goes out to that camp that stockade will remain standing for exactly zero full minutes. Matt's trying to assign everything that happens to this pre-existing Judeo-Christian narrative and keeps getting himself into trouble because he can't really believe in something other than that.

But there has to be something real going on and I don't think it is an accident that the wristband thief ended up dead. Matt wants to perceive a particular guide for the hand of whatever is manipulating events, but something pretty clearly is going on there.

Birds don't survive being buried. There's something more going on and the only real question is whether or not it has a purpose and a direction.

As for Matt unceremoniously dumping Mary on Nora, well of course he did. He's Matt, he's so fixated on his Christian narrative and bending all events to fix it, it would not occur to him to do otherwise. He thinks he is enacting the plan of some God he knows. But it also makes perfect sense that Nora was of the mindset of "Oh crap, fine. I'll do it." because this is a woman who was saved from hopelessness and despair by finding an abandoned baby, as a gift seemingly from on high.

She wanted to get her patched together family unit into the one place she thought might keep them from spontaneously disappearing. If Matt was going to have any natural ally in the "Mary's carrying a miracle baby!" it was going to be in Nora.

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

Holy Smoke Wafts Through The Leftovers
Some shocking things and people happened on a very religious-y Leftovers this week. Let us count them for you!

[WearyTraveler]

Feel like I am at a bit of a loss since I never watched Lost and reading these comments I don't think I ever will. 

 

Well, I loved Lost, and I loved the ending, so, there's another perspective for you.  I say you give it a try and judge for yourself.  Maybe you won't like it, maybe you will.

[editorgrrl]

Matt tells the lady living in a "house" covered with framed images and art (what's up with that? an inside-out house?) under a large wooden cross that his favorite book of the bible is Job.

In the screenshot at the top of the recap you can see the photos are of children, and there's a brass sponsorship plaque "For the Children."

The end of this ep I said out loud to myself. "WTF was that?" Sorted things out and realized Matt was off to punish himself but really? You have a vegatative wife who requires round the clock care and you're off to the pillory for however long it takes some other moron to come along and take your place? What a nincompoop.

At the end of this episode, I said to myself, "Was that a prosthetic penis?"

Edited November 3, 2015 by editorgrrl

[ToastnBacon]

@stillshimpy

Matt spent most of last season trying to convince people that the departure was not the rapture of the righteous.

So, I'm not sure I would say he is incapable of viewing the situation outside of a religious context.

About him going to take that guy's place in the stocks, I think he genuinely wanted to set that guy free. I had the impression that it was more his anger and frustration of the day's events that made him want to be take a stand.

[stillshimpy]

Matt spent most of last season trying to convince people that the departure was not the rapture of the righteous.

So, I'm not sure I would say he is incapable of viewing the situation outside of a religious context.

He was trying to prove it was not the Rapture by detailing how bad the people were who were taken, not in the "cannot view this in a religious manner" but rather, in the Rapture, the saved (the believers) are supposed to be taken. Matt had religious reasons for not wanting people to believe that was the Rapture (it was also missing ye olde second-coming), but his reasons for trying to convince people it was not the Rapture were actually religious ones.

He kept holding (ever diminishing in size) church services, but seemed to think it was a test of faith.

Edited November 3, 2015 by stillshimpy

[meep.meep]

What you all and I hate about Matt is the whole everything gets worse and worse for him by his own action and stupidity. Kinda like what happens in every Ben Stiller movie except it's not funny. Oh no wait, it's the same. He s nails on a chalkboard pathetic to watch and always on the verge of tears and mental collapse. It's not interesting and it's annoying as all hell. I really wish he was not a part of this season at all. And John's over the top ignorant self righteousness is wearing thin too. Other than that, love this season. More naked dudes please.

And now we know his favorite book of the Bible is Job ....... Suffer suffer suffer

[Save Yourself]

But that was Matt's point, this guy was an assshole before his loss, before his wife loss her hearing, before he loss his daughter.

I mean, I definitely knew he was a nasty one, when he took that pie over to Kevin and his family.

He was afraid to eat it, thought it might have been poisoned, yet he takes it over to offer to other human beings who have done nothing to him and just moved into the neighborhood?

And he knows they have an infant!

I was like, OK, that's just nasty.

Can someone explain what it is with him and his supporters in that town? Is it that they don't want to believe in miracles? So he goes around trying to control the narrative and anyone who is saying things like Matt or like his childhood friend whose home he burned down? So he tries to shut them down by any means necessary.

And if this is the case, why is he trying to do this? Why does he feel the need to control the narrative?

I get the impression that everyone in town is scared of John so that's why they give him free reign. The other firefighters clearly didn't want to burn down that guys house but didn't want to defy John. In all the interactions he had (except with his wife) people seemed very wary and frightened, I thought even his kids were fearful.

This is way out there but I wonder since the show has such a strong religious theme running through it that he is God from the Old Testament (or thinks he is)? I'm thinking probably not but thought I'd throw it out there and see what sticks. Just following the writers example really in that regard!

[represent]

I get the impression that everyone in town is scared of John so that's why they give him free reign. The other firefighters clearly didn't want to burn down that guys house but didn't want to defy John. In all the interactions he had (except with his wife) people seemed very wary and frightened, I thought even his kids were fearful.

 

Interesting and I agree pretty much, except Evie didn't seem afraid of him at all and neither does his wife. He definitely seemed to have a close/cheery relationship with Evie unlike the one he has with his son. 

But the boy, being that he is so religious does seem to give him the side eye. They do not seem to have the close father/son connection. 

 

And on my same note of John being nasty and giving that pie to the Garvey's, I was also like WTF? when he allowed his son to put his hand down the garbage disposal. I didn't get that at all, it seemed to me like he was afraid it might go on by itself if he put his hand down there, yet let his son put his hand down there instead. 

 

He's something alright.

Edited November 4, 2015 by represent

[shapeshifter]

About him [Matt] going to take that guy's place in the stocks, I think he genuinely wanted to set that guy free. I had the impression that it was more his anger and frustration of the day's events that made him want to be take a stand.

That's how I saw it too.

[revbfc]

Continuity issue: Where were Matt's bandages when he was in the stocks?

For my opinions on this episode please refer yourself to any other post I've written about this show. I guess I just tune in each week hoping I'll be proved wrong...

...And to yell at my TV.

One last thing. For those making Job connections, please remember that readers of that story got answers.

Edited November 4, 2015 by revbfc

[Joimiaroxeu]

And now we know his favorite book of the Bible is Job ....... Suffer suffer suffer

Yes but that's not really the point of that book, I think. It's more about having one's faith tested in the face of severe, continuing adversity that is completely outside of one's control. I think it could be argued that Matt brings/has brought a lot of his troubles upon himself. His wife didn't get herself pregnant. How did he seriously think that was going to look when it became publicly apparent? I also think there's a fine line between wanting to be seen as a Good Samaritan to someone who appears to be in need, and exercising normal caution near a place that people would literally kill to get into. A guy his age can't be that big of a naif, IMO.

 

Also, in this episode I saw two things I could have done without seeing. (Re a comment upthread, yeah, my vote would be "prosthetic".)

[stillshimpy]

Yes but that's not really the point of that book, I think. It's more about having one's faith tested in the face of severe, continuing adversity that is completely outside of one's control

The book of Job is just one of the more thoroughly depressing adventures in "Holy cats, so Old Testament God is kind of butt-munch!" but the point isn't "suffer, suffer, suffer" as it is "pass all (incredibly trying) tests of faith" . Neil Simon even wrote a play about it, trying to find the satire in it, called God's Favorite. It's a genuinely awful play because the ending is a forgone conclusion, knowing that it was inspired by the Book of Job. The lead character essentially yells at the sky (after some bad shit of truly biblical proportions) , bawling out God, screaming that he still believes...but that he is angry....at which point all of his misfortunes (giant understatement) begin to lift.

Strange play. Didn't help that the production I saw sucked, "Hi dad, that God you believe in randomly blinded me because he finally figured out there was nothing he could to to break your faith, other than hurt me" is not stuff that is inherently funny.

But that's what Matt appears to believe he is living. The Trials of Job, only since he's a Christian, he would believe that if he comes through everything with his faith intact, then there will be eternal salvation. Now personally, I don't get it. Even as a kid I could spot the "Uh, does this stuff seem kind of ....made up to control people...?" and the church I went to actually was not a literal interpretation church, so basically the answer to that was "These are illustrative tales, not to be taken literally." Apparently Matt was not raised in the lower Episcopal church though and he's going full-on "Bring it, Higher Power! Ain't Nothing Gonna Break My Stride!"

Matt is annoying as hell as a character but he makes for a good illustration of the things that are done with "Hey, there seems to be something beyond our immediate understanding". In a weird way, Matt is in his unshakeable "Totally God-driven world!" conviction is no different than John in his wholesale rejection of "There are no miracles here." Absolute conviction of being right, regardless of any evidence to the contrary.

John's just that scary-ass "Threaten you into agreement" jackass for whatever reason, and Matt demonstrates the survival skills of a piece of bacon at brunch buffet. But they're weirdly manifesting kind of the same thing: Unreasonable levels of conviction.

I don't know what happened the night they arrived in Miracle, but it really does seem like this force is more likely to be Loki-esque than "God of Divinity" because whatever Unseen force is at work here, it's certainly fucking with people hardcore in Miracle.

I do love the practicality of Nora, calling in sighting of the missing girls to scramble the resources at the gate. Her conviction that they are faking their disappearance (which with all that bizarre nude running and joyless driving after water collection, I kind of wonder if maybe they didn't....because pretty much the only way to get away from John would be to full-on fake a Departure) . Kevin's being batted about like a piece of string by a kitten in all of this. Matt's taken the really questionable "I'll just lean into the madness because I think I know what it means" approach and John, for whatever as-yet-to-revealed reasons seems to be "I will cut you for saying this shit is happening."

I like Nora's approach best. "Screw it! I will work around this weird force. Handcuffs. Anonymous tips. Ludicrous sums of money for a derelict pile. I don't care what is causing this. I just want to thwart whatever is fucking with us all."

[A Boston Gal]

 

Feel like I am at a bit of a loss since I never watched Lost and reading these comments I don't think I ever will. 

 

I don't mind Matt but this was rather a large dose of him. I loved his devotion to Mary at the beginning which what brought me to be incredibly annoyed with him at the end. Why leave such a burden on someone else with their own responsibilities just to go stand in a stockade with your junk swinging in the breeze?  Seems selfish.

I, too, never saw Lost. Good to know I'm not alone.

 

I felt that last season, Matt brought on many of his own afflictions (not Mary's condition, but other unnecessary troubles, like his handing out flyers, etc.).  This season however, his troubles are certainly more influenced by others or the Universe. Why shouldn't he be able to take his wife out of the city for a full screening, if no proper hospitals exist in Jarden? Yes, now we know he shouldn't have stopped for the man and his son by the side of the road, but that's Matt, the Good Samaritan. Is he being punished for wanting to know what his wife's full medical condition is? And as others have observed, what the hell is going on with the U.S. Government that a tent city operating outside the law, continues to controll the area outside a federal national park? What's next, Thunderdome?

 

Speaking of Mary's medical "conditions"...wouldn't Matt, as her primary caregiver, know if she had missed her period?  Or, are we to assume as a 40-something, Mary is peri-menopausal? Or, is this all part of the virgin birth retelling?

[RedHackle]

I don't have the previous episodes so I can't check but I think the man leading the goat was the same man who sacrificed a goat in the diner an episode or two ago.

 

Yes, same guy, different goat.  The towns people’s reactions to his sacrifice made it seem that this is a fairly regular activity for the goat-killer.

 

Wait a minute, I'm having another flashback to a piece of season one that I watched.

Now was there a scene, with Matt in bed with someone other than his wife, I think it was Laurie? Was he having an affair at one time or maybe he was just having a "wet dream" or something about what he wanted to happen with her?

I know I saw a scene with him in bed with someone other than his wife, but I never stuck around long enough to figure out if he had an affair or it was just wishful fantasizing on his part.

 

I could be wrong, but I think you’re mistaken.  I believe you’re confusing the flashbacks that Kevin was having with his one-night stand who he was shaking the sheets with when she disappeared.  I have very vague recollection of Matt and Mary making love, very briefly (thank gods) prior to her accident.

 

I'm thinking that he raped her. At first I didn't understand why he closed the laptop cam when he was upset, but now I think that he felt guilty about the rape when saw the image of himself with his catatonic wife in bed.

 

I don’t think so. I believe it was only after her waking up (whether real or only imagined) that Matt started running the camera all night.

As to Matt and the episode itself: when it was revealed Mary is pregnant I almost threw up – as much as I liked Eccleston as the Doctor, he skeeves me out to an almost inexplicable degree as Matt.  As others have said, I think we may never know for sure if she really woke up, except for the fact that they threw in what was obviously a hallucination of Matt’s of her waking in the car.  Only reason I can think for the writers to show that is to demonstrate that he has hallucinated her waking at least once.

 

But like the season one episode that focused on Matt, this one had a similar vibe; as he makes one catastrophic decision after another, you almost want to strangle him for his gullibility – but in the end, he‘s almost heroic.  I did like the way he confronted John and saved that poor boy in the end.

And also, yes, great to see Brett Butler again.

Edited November 5, 2015 by stacey
Fixed quoting problem

[Lady Iris]

I did like the way he confronted John and saved that poor boy in the end.

 

That gave the day a bit of redeeming quality. 

 

Were Matt's rambling ravings in the water tunnel and resulting flushing out unintentionally funny or was it just me? I know I shouldn't have been amused but man those two had one shit day.

[Broderbits]

I've watched this show since the beginning because it really spoke to me after a sudden devastating loss, but at this point there is no one I can pull for except maybe the goats. This new town is everything that's bad about small towns, on steroids. Loathe the fire chief. I'd rather go back and see what Amy Brenneman is up to.

[stillshimpy]

Were Matt's rambling ravings in the water tunnel and resulting flushing out unintentionally funny or was it just me? I know I shouldn't have been amused but man those two had one shit day.

Pretty sure that was intentionally funny.

Scene: It begins to rain as Matt, in yet another brain-trust move, contemplates walking into a storm drain.

Matt to Vegetative Wife, in tones best described as chipper: "What do you think, Mary? Shall we take our chances?"

Mary's Wheelchair: Oh you have to be fucking kidding me with this shit.

Mary: *_____?*

Everyone in our living-room: "Uh.....Matt? It's a STORM DRAIN (implication: Dude, there are dim five-year-olds and the vast majority of Labrador Retrievers who have already worked out the "Maybe wait until it's not actively raining?" math)

Matt, forges ahead. Holding Bolt Clippers, pushing a woman in a wheelchair, over rocks. The only reason he's not holding a half-cocked shotgun is that no one thought to give him one, otherwise? Totally.

Matt: (wailing unintelligibly) "______ BOLT CUTTERS!"

I personally think they staged a coup, because someone needed to put an end to the madness.

Cut to Matt being flushed out of the storm drain like a turd down the crapper in what is a fitting metaphor for his entire existence and ability to logically process a fact set.

End scene.

Pretty sure we were meant to at least grimly chuckle.

[Lady Iris]

Matt: (wailing unintelligibly) "______ BOLT CUTTERS!"

 

Yeahhhh, that was pretty much when I started to laugh and I'm laughing again! Thank you for the replay!

Edited November 4, 2015 by Lady Iris

[A Boston Gal]

I've watched this show since the beginning because it really spoke to me after a sudden devastating loss, but at this point there is no one I can pull for except maybe the goats.

Not even Nora?

Edited November 4, 2015 by A Boston Gal

[Broderbits]

Re:Nora

 

The actress is wonderful, but for some reason I just can't muster much enthusiasm. I might be burned out after expending so much energy on the first season.

[meep.meep]

About him going to take that guy's place in the stocks, I think he genuinely wanted to set that guy free. I had the impression that it was more his anger and frustration of the day's events that made him want to be take a stand.

 

I think he wanted to set the guy free.  But, more than that, I think he realized that Mary waking up was a hallucination, and that he had taken advantage of her, and that he actually wanted to repent.  

[ToastnBacon]

I think he wanted to set the guy free.  But, more than that, I think he realized that Mary waking up was a hallucination, and that he had taken advantage of her, and that he actually wanted to repent.

Sure, there could have been that going on.

However, I do think he was furious at what happened during the day. When he originally encountered that young lady who challenged him on wanting to set the stock guy free, he looked pissed that he couldn't do it then and there.

After his showdown with John and his promise that, "we'll have a talk" he practically marched off to the stocks.

I picked up an air of defiance in him, he seemed to have the walk of a crusader and not the sheepish gait of a shamed sinner.

But you could be right too. That is only how I processed the scene.

[editorgrrl]

I'm having another flashback to a piece of season one that I watched. Was there a scene, with Matt in bed with someone other than his wife, I think it was Laurie? Was he having an affair at one time or maybe he was just having a "wet dream" or something about what he wanted to happen with her?

In "Two Boats and a Helicopter," Matt was beaten in an attempted robbery in the casino parking lot. Later, he tried to help two members of the Guilty Remnant who were being attacked. He was unconscious for three days, and hallucinated that he was having sex with a healthy Mary—who morphed into Laurie.

I never questioned that Mary woke up and I still don't. Tower dude totally saw Matt talking to the departed GR woman, so there's something going on.

We saw Kevin talking to Patti from Kevin's perspective. This season has been all about replaying scenes from another POV, and we've already seen Kevin staring at thin air in John's kitchen. Pillar Man's exact words were, "Hey, who's your friend?"—so we might see that scene again, but with Kevin talking to an imaginary friend.

[stillshimpy]

We saw Kevin talking to Patti from Kevin's perspective. This season has been all about replaying scenes from another POV, and we've already seen Kevin staring at thin air in John's kitchen. Pillar Man's exact words were, "Hey, who's your friend?"—so we might see that scene again, but with Kevin talking to an imaginary friend.

We might, but we've seen characters in season one, seemingly guided by an unseen force: Kevin's dad, who again, came running out of the woods and saved Jill from that fridge.

Besides, again: Bird, buried in box. Not dead. Also, a stranger said something to Matt about Mary's baby, so ...yeah, I just don't feel any particular need to refute the "Something really fucking strange happened"....because on this show....really fucking strange things happen and I've no real reason to believe that Matt's really strange thing is any more, or less likely than an earthquake that keeps Kevin from drowning. Or the palmist who knew something bad was going to happen. Or a bird being unburied and flying away.

Invisible characters and weird deer sightings don't seem any more, or less plausible than 2% of the population, including Laurie's fetus disappearing mid-ultrasound.

For whatever it is, or isn't worth, Matt told John to his face, that he would never do what John was telling him to do: Which is say that he raped Mary in a moment of weakness. If Matt believed he did that and wen to the stockades to repent for it, why was he so righteous in the face of John telling him to ....do exactly that? Cop to "sin" ?

He saved the guy from the stockades because that's what priests and the clergy are supposed to do. Lead others towards salvation.

I'm not a believer. I'm not a person of faith. I think the various churches and religions of the world have done heinous shit in the name of their institutions or structures, but everything we've seen of Matt is that he's trying to live his values. Walk his talk and be who he is supposed to be in this life.

And he apparently doesn't think he's done suffering his trials. I don't think he climbed in the stockades to repent of any sin, but rather to offer the other guy salvation and forgiveness, because that's kind of Matt's "There are miracles in Miracle schtick."

I'm guessing. Beside, Mary's supposed to be infertile and just got zapped with baby warping dye.

I grant you, it's not like it seems all that likely, but then neither does anything else that has ever happened on this show so....yeah.

Edited November 4, 2015 by stillshimpy

[ToastnBacon]

@stillshimpy

I like your analysis of Matt.

Despite being a bungler, he does try to stand tall and has done some very brave things as a preacher.

[Clanstarling]

I despise this year's nasally folksy theme song more with each listen.

.....

The no one is laughing at God song was cool, but then they had to play another nasal folk song as the credits rolled.

Just goes to show how different we all are. I am growing to like the song - it's one of the few themes I don't fast forward through, and I hated, absolutely hated, the God song. And I'm neither religious nor atheist. 

 

One part that made me sort of laugh was watching Kevin's face when after John told Matt what he needed to say with Mary when she started to show was when Matt asked"what happened to you to make you like this"? you could just see Kevin's face go, "oh, no. What is he doing?"

He is a pretty great reactive actor, I'll have to say. This is the first thing I remember seeing him in, and it's been a pleasure.

 

I know there've been a lot of complaints about this episode -too Matt-centric- but I have to admit: I burst into tears as the frightened little boy shakily offered the wristband to Matt. I knew in that moment Matt was not going to leave him there.

I didn't burst into tears, but I did choke up.

 

I found this a really unpleasant episode - interesting on several levels - but unpleasant. The story of Job has always been the one the stories that bother me. "Let's tear down this guy's life on a bet to prove he loves me." Ick. So stories reminiscent of it don't sit well with me.

 

I didn't recognize Brett Butler - just kept trying to figure out who she was. It's been a very long time since she's been on my radar.

[thuganomics85]

Well, I guess I know how Doctor Who could have turned out if it was TV-MA.  Never would have predicted Christopher Eccleston would be down with the full-frontal nudity.  I guess the ball (heh) is now in David Tennant and Matt Smith's court, unless they've already gone down that path (although, I actually think Peter Capaldi would do it before those two.  He strikes me as someone who would be more willing to, um, let it all hang out like that, if the script called for it.)

 

Knowing this was Matt-centric, I was prepared for it to be even more dark and depressing, so I enjoyed it enough on that level.  I really have no idea if Mary truly did wake up, or if Matt raped her during a craze moment, when he actually thought she was awake.  And is he repenting because of that, or does he simply just want to help that guy out, because that's how Matt is?  I really don't know, but I knew this episode was going to end with him taking his place.

 

I kind of love that Kevin was pretty much wearing a "What the hell, Matt?" expression throughout his few scenes.  He really does have the best reaction shots on this show.  I also have to admit I loved that Nora claimed the missing girls were in the area, in order to sneak them across the bridge.  That is certainly something she'd do.

 

It was kind of fun to see someone briefly challenge John like that.  I do wonder what is deal was.  I agree that he probably always was an asshole, so I wonder if a certainly situation caused this, or is this just how he is?

[Clanstarling]

Continuity issue: Where were Matt's bandages when he was in the stocks?

I don't think it was a continuity issue - I think they were removed as part of stripping himself bare.

 

Also, in this episode I saw two things I could have done without seeing. (Re a comment upthread, yeah, my vote would be "prosthetic".)

I didn't think prosthetic - I thought uncircumsized.

[numbnut]

I'm thinking that he raped her. At first I didn't understand why he closed the laptop cam when he was upset, but now I think that he felt guilty about the rape when saw the image of himself with his catatonic wife in bed.

 

I don’t think so. I believe it was only after her waking up (whether real or only imagined) that Matt started running the camera all night.

 

I didn't think that he taped the rape. I meant that he was reminded of it when he saw himself in bed with Mary (e.g. a mirror would have the same effect).

 

I think he wanted to set the guy free.  But, more than that, I think he realized that Mary waking up was a hallucination, and that he had taken advantage of her, and that he actually wanted to repent.

 

That's what I thought too.

Edited November 5, 2015 by numbnut

[RedHackle]

I notice a lot of people are frustrated with the show and this episode in particular.  Here's the weird thing for me - I can NOT stop watching this show.  There have been other shows in the past that I had to stop watching because they were too stupid, confusing, derivative or just plain pointless.  But this one just keeps me coming back. Something about the combination of the writing and the acting.  Oh, and I also teared up when the little boy held up the wrist band to Matt.

I'm not religious at all, but I also know that sometimes things happen to us that we aren't able to explain. And an event that I perceive as a simple coincidence, someone else might see as an omen, or a miracle. 

Much as some people view a TV show as really gripping and entertaining, but other people think it's crap.

[freebie]

 

What you all and I hate about Matt is the whole everything gets worse and worse for him by his own action and stupidity.

 

And yet I was cheering for him when he straight up asked John what the hell had happened to him to make him so freakin' damaged. Eccleston was killing it this episode. And I really loved that tiny interval where Janel Moloney got to be awake Mary for once. The dialogue sounded so natural between a loving wife and husband, and her delivery was spot on. It was nice to get a glimpse of what their relationship might have been like before this whole mess. Or, they had a horrible relationship, and Matt half-conscious is just as delusional as he is most of the rest of the time. Who knows?

 

 

Nora's awesome. Cold, but awesome.

 

It was totally inappropriate because it was a pretty heavy moment, but I positively *cackled* when she snapped, "Get in the car, Kevin," while he was standing there befuddled as usual.

 

And, yes, Brett Butler was so compelling in that role. I'd almost like to see more of her and her character. But then I remind myself how many unanswered questions I still have, so I'll learn to live without her.

[Pallas]

As others have said, I think we may never know for sure if she really woke up, except for the fact that they threw in what was obviously a hallucination of Matt’s of her waking in the car.  Only reason I can think for the writers to show that is to demonstrate that he has hallucinated her waking at least once.

 

Another would be, to demonstrate that when Matt does hallucinate about Mary awakened, he quickly recognizes his mistake. The ambiguity is calibrated.

[Blakeston]

I felt this episode did a lot to explain John's motivations - he can't bear to hear anyone say that miracles exist in Miracle, because that would mean that God is willing to perform miracles for some of its residents, but not for his hearing-impaired wife.

As for Matt, I think he willingly went to the stocks to repent for what he believes was a lack of faith on his part. He was angry at God for Mary's situation, and he was doubting that he'd ever get to talk to her again. (Which is why I think he turned off the camera - he'd given up hope of seeing anything on the video.)

Then he found out Mary was pregnant, and his faith was restored, and he felt shame for his doubts.

[Clanstarling]

I felt this episode did a lot to explain John's motivations - he can't bear to hear anyone say that miracles exist in Miracle, because that would mean that God is willing to perform miracles for some of its residents, but not for his hearing-impaired wife.

As for Matt, I think he willingly went to the stocks to repent for what he believes was a lack of faith on his part. He was angry at God for Mary's situation, and he was doubting that he'd ever get to talk to her again. (Which is why I think he turned off the camera - he'd given up hope of seeing anything on the video.)

Then he found out Mary was pregnant, and his faith was restored, and he felt shame for his doubts.

Great insights!

[Pallas]

I think that Matt went into the stocks not only to save the man previously held there, or to atone for his own doubts, but also to take on the sins of the world, as Jesus was said to. Acting as Job and Jesus -- and uniting what Christians view as two Testaments -- by a willful act of sacrifice.

Matt took a place on the block because he feels he's among his own people, and this is how he'll make himself known to them. He's right: he doesn't belong in Jarden; he's not one of the 9,621 and never was. But all the crazy souls squatting outside the National Eden are there because they do believe there are miracles in Miracle. The man of faith has found his folk, and maybe his flock.

[shapeshifter]

I felt this episode did a lot to explain John's motivations - he can't bear to hear anyone say that miracles exist in Miracle, because that would mean that God is willing to perform miracles for some of its residents, but not for his hearing-impaired wife.

As for Matt, I think he willingly went to the stocks to repent for what he believes was a lack of faith on his part. He was angry at God for Mary's situation, and he was doubting that he'd ever get to talk to her again. (Which is why I think he turned off the camera - he'd given up hope of seeing anything on the video.)

Then he found out Mary was pregnant, and his faith was restored, and he felt shame for his doubts.

I agree with all of this except the part I bolded. I am pretty sure he turned it off because he saw himself getting frustrated to the point of anger with her, which then makes viewers wonder if he might have inpregnated her when she was unresponsive (I'm still not sure and didn't initially think so).

[Blakeston]

I agree with all of this except the part I bolded. I am pretty sure he turned it off because he saw himself getting frustrated to the point of anger with her, which then makes viewers wonder if he might have inpregnated her when she was unresponsive (I'm still not sure and didn't initially think so).

 

You mean he turned it off because he was going to have sex with her that night?

[BetyBee]

I thought Matt turned off the camera when he realized that it was not on the day that she woke up and talked.  He looked at it and realized that he was recreating that day and the camera shouldn't have been included.

[shapeshifter]

You mean he turned it off because he was going to have sex with her that night?

No. I just thought that he saw himself being angry with someone who was unconscious, and it embarrassed him and made him feel otherwise bad (guilty, sorry, inadequate as a spiritual leader, etc.). Just not one of his finer moments, so not something he wanted to see again later, so he turned off the recorder. At least, that's how I interpretted it when I viewed it before reading posts here. But I may have been influenced by having spent the previous 10 days with my recently widowed elderly mother with whom I found myself losing patience and to whom I made some unkind remarks. So I am not necessarily seeing Matt through the intended lens of the writers.

[represent]

 

I thought Matt turned off the camera when he realized that it was not on the day that she woke up and talked.  He looked at it and realized that he was recreating that day and the camera shouldn't have been included.

Actually, it looked like he finally realized that she wasn't going to "wake up" again. We had seen him looking at the video in the mornings while eating breakfast to see if she had awoken while he was asleep. He studied that video closely looking for signs. On the final day or third day, you see him getting more agitated while eating breakfast and once again watching the video and seeing that nothing changed. That she wasn't at least waking up while he was asleep because in his mind she just had to wake up then because he "knows" she woke up before so he "must" be missing it, because now she "must" be waking up at night while he's asleep.

 

Finally, he loses it on the last  night asking her out loud why she won't wake up and talk to him, and grabbing her face to almost force it out of her in his desperation. But, he gets no response and finally shuts the video down losing hope that she might wake up at night and the video would capture it. 

Edited November 8, 2015 by represent

[Milburn Stone]

No. I just thought that he saw himself being angry with someone who was unconscious, and it embarrassed him and made him feel otherwise bad (guilty, sorry, inadequate as a spiritual leader, etc.). Just not one of his finer moments, so not something he wanted to see again later, so he turned off the recorder. At least, that's how I interpretted it when I viewed it before reading posts here. But I may have been influenced by having spent the previous 10 days with my recently widowed elderly mother with whom I found myself losing patience and to whom I made some unkind remarks. So I am not necessarily seeing Matt through the intended lens of the writers.

 

FWIW, I had the same interpretation you did, and I wasn't with your mother.

[WearyTraveler]

I think the intention is to keep Matt's actions ambiguous, but, given what he was saying right before he shut off the camera, I tend to agree with BettyBee.

 

Matt was going on about how he was doing everything he had done that same day exactly the same way, down to the food they were eating; then he suddenly stopped mid-phrase, and looked at the camera as if realizing that filming was not something he had done that day, and so he immediately turned it off.

[shapeshifter]

I think the intention is to keep Matt's actions ambiguous, but, given what he was saying right before he shut off the camera, I tend to agree with BettyBee.

 

Matt was going on about how he was doing everything he had done that same day exactly the same way, down to the food they were eating; then he suddenly stopped mid-phrase, and looked at the camera as if realizing that filming was not something he had done that day, and so he immediately turned it off.

I hadn't thought of that, but now that you point it out it seems obvious. But if that is why he turned off the camera, wouldn't he want to do all the same things again without filming it (since that was the one thing he didn't do when he remembers her waking up) at least one more time in hopes that she would wake up again? But he doesn't.

[RedheadZombie]

I watched "The Others" a few days ago and Christopher Eccelstone is quite good in his tiny role in that. He was also quite an attractive man 14-15 years ago. I'll give him props for doing the full frontal nude scene. It wasn't something I necessarily wanted to see like Tom's full frontal scenes or Kevin jogging but I admire the fact that the actor agreed to it. Once again, your move Justin Theroux. All the other actors playing major male characters are doing it.

 

He was pretty hot as the Duke of Norfolk in Elizabeth.  He played a powerful and sinister character.  So different than Matt.

 

Another throwaway unexplained occurrence: when the guy in the visitor's center tells Matt, "she" (supposedly, Mary) says they have to get back home to protect the baby.  Are we just supposed to assume/accept that Mary's randomly communicating telepathically with strangers?

 

Mary said that the baby was in danger.  The man simply said "he".  I wondered if "he" was the little boy who lost his father.  If Matt hadn't presented him to John, he might not have survived.

 

Having pregnant Mary in a vegetative state creates an interesting conundrum for John and his witch hunt.

Oh, and her name, "Mary," as in the pregnant Virgin Mary. When Matt was amazed at the conception I momentarily wanted/expected him to say they had not had sex--but that would have implied someone really did take advantage of her.

 

Add in the episode title - No Room at the Inn.  Is Mary carrying the hope for salvation?

[RedheadZombie]

He was trying to prove it was not the Rapture by detailing how bad the people were who were taken, not in the "cannot view this in a religious manner" but rather, in the Rapture, the saved (the believers) are supposed to be taken. Matt had religious reasons for not wanting people to believe that was the Rapture (it was also missing ye olde second-coming), but his reasons for trying to convince people it was not the Rapture were actually religious ones.

He kept holding (ever diminishing in size) church services, but seemed to think it was a test of faith.

 

I think Matt revealing his favorite bible book is Job is a signal that he will view everything as a test, and never lose faith.

 

In "Two Boats and a Helicopter," Matt was beaten in an attempted robbery in the casino parking lot. Later, he tried to help two members of the Guilty Remnant who were being attacked. He was unconscious for three days, and hallucinated that he was having sex with a healthy Mary—who morphed into Laurie.

 

I'm not sure if this came up last season (because I wasn't watching then) but Two Boats and a Helicopter is a joke that serves as a parable.  There's a flood and a man is trapped on the roof of his home.  As two boats and a helicopter come by to offer help, he waves them off and tells them that God will take care of him.  After he drowns he goes to heaven and confronts God about not saving him.  God responds:  I sent you two boats and a helicopter, what else did you want.

[iggysaurus]

I'll give him props for doing the full frontal nude scene. It wasn't something I necessarily wanted to see like Tom's full frontal scenes or Kevin jogging but I admire the fact that the actor agreed to it.

 

Part of the inequality between female vs. male nudity on TV is that female nudity is usually shown in a sexual context and meant to be titillating, while male nudity almost never is. Tom's brief nudity was related to a sexual situation with Meg, but there was nothing sexy about it, as he was basically raped.  Matt's nudity while getting up on that cross or whatever was also not supposed to be remotely sexual, so why does it matter how attractive he is or isn't.  If they showed Kevin being tortured while naked, or something like that, would everyone be celebrating? I wouldn't be all "Yay, penis!" no matter how hot I might find Justin Theroux, if the overall scene was disturbing/morbid/unpleasant (which it almost certainly would be, on this show).  If TV's standards for male nudity ever progress to the point where they can show a penis in a scene that's legitimately supposed to be erotic, then that might be a different story. But otherwise I just don't really see the point in even evaluating these brief penis glimpses on the basis of the actor's hotness or lack thereof. 

Edited November 30, 2015 by iggysaurus

[michellesings]

Excellent opening scene creating "Groundhog Day" with the repetition.

I despise this year's nasally folksy theme song more with each listen.

The freaks in the camp are worse than the chain smoking GR assholes, and John is an asshole.

Matt is a dumbass and I didn't enjoy spending this episode with him until his showdown with John.

What a badass move to take that dude's place in the stocks, stupid but badass.

The no one is laughing at God song was cool, but then they had to play another nasal folk song as the credits rolled.

This episode sucked compared to last week's episode.

When Kevin and Nora showed up, I was hoping it would get better, but the damn goats cut our time short with them

everyone has different musical tastes. I understand that it can get to you after a while, but I kinda like the song. Perhaps it's because of the show. My two daughters, both in their 20's, love the song. 

[iggysaurus]

everyone has different musical tastes. I understand that it can get to you after a while, but I kinda like the song. Perhaps it's because of the show. My two daughters, both in their 20's, love the song.

 

I like the theme song on this show AND the Fiona Apple song from "The Affair." Both Fiona and Iris DeMent (who sings the Leftovers theme) are amazing artists and respected in their genres. I'm glad the people who pick songs for shows on HBO/Showtime generally seem to be smart about music and they pick things that are a bit quirky and interesting.

[mansonlamps]

On 11/30/2015 at 2:59 PM, iggysaurus said:

 

I like the theme song on this show AND the Fiona Apple song from "The Affair." Both Fiona and Iris DeMent (who sings the Leftovers theme) are amazing artists and respected in their genres. I'm glad the people who pick songs for shows on HBO/Showtime generally seem to be smart about music and they pick things that are a bit quirky and interesting.

I like the theme song here, but the Fiona Apple song from The Affair makes my ears bleed.  I guess there's something for everyone.