Episode Discussion: TFGH

[HeatLifer]

Dante telling Michael he needs to thank Sonny for saving him. Fine, Michael, don't go see him, send him an Edible Arrangement. Just don't include any of the chocolate dipped stuff. Chocolate is for people who didn't kill your father.

Dante has always been the most obnoxious Sonny apologist. Sonny could shoot him in the head and strangle his mother and he'd somehow come back to life to tell Michael that the old man ain't that bad.

Edited February 6, 2015 by HeatLifer

[KerleyQ]

Is that the same Ivy?  Really, I have no idea.

 

 

From certain angles, she looks disturbingly like Emily. 

 

My favorite part of today was Shawn coming in and telling Sonny that "Duke has everything under control," followed by a mental image of Duke back at Sonny's mansion, romping through a floor full of balls of yarn and catnip filled mice. 

[sometimesfan]

Oh, it's easily the soap I enjoy the most today, but at least 75-90% of that is now for all the wrong reasons - sheer comedy and ludicrous madness. It wasn't always this way under Ron and Frank, but I think their foolish choices in 2013 after their massive stroke-out when [Previous Soap Opera] returned - without them! - have crippled the show utterly. Barring some lousy characters or stories, I think it was going pretty well up til then. Since then it's been all their worst impulses and laziness, unbound, because so much of the show was then skewed to service their worst ideas and it got in the way of actually making General Hospital as opposed to making something about them and their perpetual vanity proving ground.

 

I think they fundamentally altered the show and broke the back of the Guza GH in a way no one else would, and I will alwas be grateful for that. I usually find something I can enjoy every day, every week, every month - I think there are pieces of good stories, skeletons of good ideas, and often they hit on something unique and heartfelt or fun which no one else would do (like Bobbie and the Spencers paying tribute to Ruby). They have their hearts in the right place. The problem is that now more than ever, their heads are up their asses. GH could be so good under them but they are deeply, pridefully, almost bitterly invested in making it a very specific kind of personal bad. That's what frustrates me. Because I can see where the good is and it's buried under shit and stuff that is just embarrassing (but fun).

 

GH has actually become my #4 soap which is shocking in that once it was my favorite soap, and also that up until three years ago I hadn't ever watched The Bold and The Beautiful (ridiculous name), and I hadn't watched the other two soaps in over 25 years. I had become, thanks to the era of hour-long soaps (and before the era of recording devices), a strictly ABC soap gal. Frank and Ron using OLTL's death to prop up their new toy GH did little to help the latter and destroyed so much of the former that I am no longer an invested viewer.

Three words: Fuck this show. 

 

Another T-shirt in the offing.

[CPP83]

Not that any of that helps if this is your favorite soap and you aren't enjoying it

 

 

 

I've been with GH since day one and I've taken long breaks, my last being basically eight years away, I started tuning back in regularly about two years ago.

 

But at this point I just have no hope for the show I once considered a highlight of my day for entertainment to wow me again. To impress me and to improve.

 

Instead of a Monica sighting after almost losing so many family members and friends in a terrible explosion, I get this little terror named "Ivy" running around, acting as if she's the new bees' knees in town that should matter so very much to viewers for some unnamed reason and she's made it her personal mission to "save" Sonny on top of it all.

 

I just can't stand it.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

Oh, I'll remember. This has nothing to do with what kind of pretzels the writers put Michael through. Seasons change and time passes but Morgan remains an idiot. I like the character a lot sometimes but this has been his angle since the day the truth about A.J. came out - 'jeez, get over it, bro!' Fuck off, Morgan, you wanted everyone to bleed for you when your college girlfriend didn't want to stay guilt-married to you at 21.

 

Eh. My sympathy is still mostly with Morgan, who was put in literally the worst position anyone can ever be in. Let's pretend that he came clean to Michael about what really happened the moment he found out about it. How do you start the conversation "My father killed your father."? Let's even act as if Morgan hasn't played second fiddle to Michael for his entire life, when the only reason for it is that Mikey (God, I hate that fucking-damn name) is because Carly squirted him out first. Also, Michael is the original Stupid Little Shit, who made googly eyes at his brother's girlfriend/fiancee/wife while actively lying about how he wanted nothing to do with her. Maybe Morgan broke the brother code "worse" than Michael did, but I happen to think that what Michael did was still pretty damn shitty. Now he's all  mad because his grease-bucket of a "father" and his lying cow* of a mother worked together to completely destroy AJ's life, then murder him and cover it up, and Morgan is the one he can't/shouldn't forgive?

 

Is 'cow' allowed? I know 'heifer' isn't, so if this is inappropriate let me know and I'll edit.

[ulkis]

Dante has always been the most obnoxious Sonny apologist. Sonny could shoot him in the head and strangle his mother and he'd somehow come back to life to tell Michael that the old man ain't that bad.

 

I think his ma is front of him in line for that title. Luckily for Robin she's not on the show anymore, otherwise she'd be right behind them in line too.

 

Obviously, Carly is technically the biggest winner but I don't know if she counts, not having any morals or integrity herself really.

[JaneDigby]

 It wasn't always this way under Ron and Frank, but I think their foolish choices in 2013 after their massive stroke-out when [Previous Soap Opera] returned - without them! - have crippled the show utterly. Barring some lousy characters or stories, I think it was going pretty well up til then. Since then it's been all their worst impulses and laziness, unbound, because so much of the show was then skewed to service their worst ideas and it got in the way of actually making General Hospital as opposed to making something about them and their perpetual vanity proving ground.

 

This makes a ton of sense. I wasn't watching GH at the time but from the soap press and board fall out I observed R/F were in a tailspin. Vampires are just never a good sign, unless its 1968 and the show is called Dark Shadows. As a non-viewer my reaction to RoHo as Franco was sublime disbelief. At least ME and KA got new characters to play. ABC shoulders most of the blame for the Prospect Park debacle, imho. R/F's insistence on moving forward with the actor pairings, however, is all on them. RoHo got a dead end character to play. ME and KA got train wrecks to play. Train wrecks in lead stories from day one. 

[Cattitude]

How do you start the conversation "My father killed your father."?

 

Well to be fair I don't think Morgan is smart enough to figure this sentence out much less say it.

[ulkis]

Is that the same Ivy?  Really, I have no idea.  And I don't understand this commissioner fellow- he's like the cartoon villain version of himself. 

 

It is.

[OnceSane]

Holy cow! STFU, Dante!! You too, Morgan. You both can eat a bag of dicks.

[Chairperson Meow]

God, if it's 2015 and we've had to wait a damn year to hopefully see TG's last story, then how long with the End of Sonny be? And how terrible will it be?

[Bishop]

Oh yeah, I forgot about that one. *****, he hasn't spoken to you in weeks! Maybe you should find someone else to tell stuff to.

It is beyond ironic that Kiki has the nerve to want to cry on Michael's shoulder about her possible murdered mother but had no problem lying to Michael about the murder of HIS father.  GOD I hate her character with the hate of 1,000 suns.  I am so happy she is going away.

 

I've actually loved GH these last few days.  I think it's been some good drama the last few days, but I LOATHE that Fluke is actually Luke Spencer.  That is so much BS, I can't even begin to express it here.  There is no way that Luke was brainwashed or that he has D.I.D., and those are the only two explanations as to how he can be Luke and also be a dick to everyone he has ever loved in trying to murder them all.  RC thinks he's being so clever with this "twist" that Fluke has been Luke this whole time, but it's another destroyed GH character.  Luke Spencer could never be controlled.  Ever.

 

I foresee Michael becoming the character that everyone hates soon because clearly no one thinks AJ's murder is a big deal.  Michael should just get over it and beg everyone for their forgiveness for him being so mean to them all these months.  It's incredibly sad that NO ONE has taken Michael's side in AJ's death or even understands why he is so hurt and angry.  Everyone wants him to forgive Carly and Sonny - Bobbie, Lucas, Dante, etc.  He has zero allies anywhere.  Watch RC turn him into the next AJ Quartermaine, and RC hated AJ Quartermaine.  I hope I'm wrong because I do like Chad Duell and Michael is a decent guy - when he's not getting shot or blown up.

 

As for Morgan, he needs to STHU.  His whining and petulance over anything related to Michael is starting to grate again.  I would hardly call AJ's murder "a grudge."  

Edited February 6, 2015 by Bishop

[JaneDigby]

God, if it's 2015 and we've had to wait a damn year to hopefully see TG's last story, then how long with the End of Sonny be? And how terrible will it be?

 

It will involve a mobster named Judas who betrays Sonny, leading to DA Pontius Pilate sentencing Sonny to lethal injection. While nailed to the cross / strapped to the gurney, Carly comes and prays ...

[jsbt]

I'm still not convinced it's Luke (or not Bill).

[Mrs. Stanwyck]

"Sonny saved everyone on that boat" is one of those plot points that didn't actually happen* that will bug the shit out of me for the rest of time.

 

Sonny did not save everyone on that boat.  Maybe, maybe, he saved Michael but even that is doubtful because Michael was on the deck and could have flung that bomb overboard if Sonny hadn't gotten in his way, or since Sonny went overboard with the bomb and survived, who says Michael couldn't have gone overboard with the bomb and survived?  Anyway, the point being that due to Michael's actions, everyone on the boat was going to be fine before Sonny ever showed up.  Also, Sonny was the only one with advance knowledge that someone was going to happen but did he bother to let anyone know?  No. 

 

* See also "AJ pushed a pregnant Carly down the stairs".  Didn't happen but it gets referenced as if it was a fact and every time it does, I have a violent urge to hurt someone.  I can see it now that "Sonny saved those people" is going to elicit the same kind of response. 

[LeftPhalange]

STFU Nik. I don't even know why you bothered trying to defend yourself to Lulu.

 

STFU Ivy you stupid baboon. Nik should have thrown her off the parapet.

 

I'm not sure I believe ABC would let Ron pull a massive retcon like this. They may not care about soaps, but still. This is Luke Spencer not some useless newbie.

Edited February 6, 2015 by LeftPhalange

[OnceSane]

IDK what was worse: TG practically fellating himself on camera or the town-wide licking of Sonny's asshole.

[TeeVee329]

I'm still not convinced it's Luke (or not Bill).

 

I think, at this point, it's not Bill.  Ron's being all, "Hahaha, losers, you thought it was Bill, but you were capital W WRONG hahaha!".

 

Whether it's actually Luke, though?  I dunno.  The crap with the eldest Spencer sister still needs to come into play.

Edited February 6, 2015 by TeeVee329

[HeatLifer]

I think his ma is front of him in line for that title. Luckily for Robin she's not on the show anymore, otherwise she'd be right behind them in line too.

Obviously, Carly is technically the biggest winner but I don't know if she counts, not having any morals or integrity herself really.

There's no way I'll ever believe Robin would be OK with Sonny killing AJ, though. I'm sure Ron will try to go there. You know, after he's done with his years of chaining Robin to a wall.

[Lillybee]

I hate the fact that almost everyone expects Michael to forgive and love Sonny and forget that Sonny killed his bio dad.

[Harmony233]

I betcha if it had been AJ or Ric or scotty  done what sonny had done they wouldn't be hailed as heros.

[TeeVee329]

STFU Ivy you stupid baboon. Nik should have thrown her off the parapet.

 

For real, talk about someone begging to be parapet-ed.

Edited February 6, 2015 by TeeVee329

[Lillybee]

Sonny going on and on about not killing a child's parent was so bogus. If Michael hadn't stopped him, Ava would have been dead in the brownstone. Sonny is so fake.

[ulkis]

I hate how the show acts like being a parent sanctifies one in general. Oh, Obrecht is so worried for Nathan, she has a good side. Fuck that! 

[Francie]

Whether it's actually Luke, though?  I dunno.  The crap with the eldest Spencer sister still needs to come into play.

 

I think we're far from done. With this storyline I mean.  We're all at varying stages of being done with it all, though.

[ulkis]

Oh, I forgot to say, I totally agreed with Lulu reading Nikolas the riot act, but what stood out is she said if it weren't for Sonny she would have died too. Yeah, except he was already at the hospital with Dante when Michael grabbed the bomb! Freaking Scott Sickles. And also another example of how this latest sweeps "event" was a disjointed mess.

[Tiger]

Today's show didn't actively make me hate myself the way Wednesday's show did. And Monday actually looks good.

I hate to admit this, but I am curious to see how far they take this "Lewq has been secretly evil for years' thing. But i still don't understand how they do this story without Laura & Lucky.

[backbiter]

...the train is off the rails. That ship has sailed, the bus lost its wheels. Elvis has left the building, no use crying over spilled milk. The bloom is off the rose, I'm not playing with full deck, ...

[IWantCandy71]

So I think the whole Luke fingerprint thing is a misdirection. I've gone from thinking Fluke is Luke with DID to thinking he's Anthony, etc....and now I think the clone thing someone mentioned once is looking more plausible.

Would a clone have the same fingerprints? Because if not, there are actually ways around that. I'm reminded of an episode off "Elementary" from last season where one of the bad guys lifted the fingerprints off a corpse and attached them to his own fingers somehow, so that the crimes he committed were attributed to a dead man. Not that Luke has to be dead for it to happen(I know, some of you would like it if he were).

[Lillybee]

I guess that we are now going to get the santification of Sonny. I want it to stop.

[KerleyQ]

I can't imagine that there is any way that Fluke's rant in jail about all the idiots guessing who he is and being wrong, wrong, wrong, wasn't Ron talking about the fans trying to guess who Fluke is. 

[ch1]

I hate how the show acts like being a parent sanctifies one in general. Oh, Obrecht is so worried for Nathan, she has a good side. Fuck that!

 

 

Big bugs bunny kiss to you because I sooooo agree with that. 

[ulkis]

I can't imagine that there is any way that Fluke's rant in jail about all the idiots guessing who he is and being wrong, wrong, wrong, wasn't Ron talking about the fans trying to guess who Fluke is. 

 

Oh, yeah, I mean did anyone not think that? It's okay, you can admit it!

[Lillybee]

Not only did they insult the governor of New York by making him dumb enough to pardon Sonny but they just had to cast an actor who looks a lot like Newt Gingrich to play him.

[ulkis]

I guess that we are now going to get the santification of Sonny. I want it to stop.

 

He loves his kids! He does absolutely nothing for them except risk his life for them and occasionally get their wrestler friends a heart on the black market. Otherwise he does nothing but humiliate and hurt them.

 

Like, really. Why can't Sonny be laid up in the damn hospital for a week even? It's kinda insane. When he took the bullet for Dante, again, all that happened was he got stitches! How about paralyzing the guy for 6 months at least?

[jsbt]

I mean, I can still see Ron trying to lord it over people with "haha! See, you thought Bill was just his cousin but he's his twin brother! Totally not what you predicted!" I had, grudgingly, all but dismissed Bill as a possible ID until the other day when Dante kept saying Beef Jerky Man in the basement was probably Luke/Bill/whoever. And the way a few other people were talking about Eckert suddenly seemed less like a dodge. But I'll have to wait and see. I think it's most likely Luke.

[Lillybee]

I said it before but I am so happy that Nathan was the one who rescued Dante instead of Sonny. Imagine if it were Sonny, the psalms of praise to Saint Sonny would be deafening.

[KerleyQ]

Oh, yeah, I mean did anyone not think that? It's okay, you can admit it!

 

It's disturbing that nobody said to Ron "hey, maybe you might not want to call your viewers idiots like this".  

[Lillybee]

Now, that Sonny is no longer facing more prison time, let the custody battle for poor Avery commence.

[IWantCandy71]

I disagree they sanctify you on this show *because* you're a parent.

Yeah Dr O is a mom but the show has never tried to say she's a nice person. Nor have they ever tried to say we're supposed to see her as anything other than who and what she is.

People can do horrible things and actually be GOOD parents. (not saying she is one, just look at Brit). I'm just saying the two things are not mutually exclusive, and I don't think the show is saying they are.

 

In Sonny's case, they might be trying to show a parent's love for their child does outweight their own need for safety- and a lot of times IRL, that's true. And yeah Sonny'll get off and that's not fair.

But Sonny isn't going to win the one thing he wants most-Michael's love and forgiveness(yet), so I still see him as "paying" at this point.  If the character is going to remain on canvas, he can't remain in jail, even if we want him there. It's not realistic.

[fishsanwitt]

Nice that Sonny *still* won't say he murdered AJ. Just 'shot' him. And how about that heart-warming scene in Sonny's hospital room? Aw - I wish there was a bomb in there.

 

STAY STRONG, Michael! Dante - shut up!

 

I liked the fight between Nikolas and Lulu.

 

And the biggest question of the day - why is Puke channelling Bette Davis (and 'All About Eve') in his jail cell?

[Gigi43]

I wish it had been Morgan's body decaying in the basement so I wouldn't have had to hear him today. Michael's the one with "a grudge"? Isn't Morgan's whole life about how Michael always got the biggest cupcake in the box, last slice of pizza, whatever.

Oh that's right, AJ has consumed many cupcakes and pizza's in his life so gives a damn about his murder. He probably bled strawberry jam that stained Ava's carpet. How dare Michael care.

[ulkis]

I said it before but I am so happy that Nathan was the one who rescued Dante instead of Sonny. Imagine if it were Sonny, the psalms of praise to Saint Sonny would be deafening.

 

Did Sonny even ask about Dante in between the time he woke up and the time Dante walked into the room? Dante, your ass is so dumb.

[Francie]

I mean, I can still see Ron trying to lord it over people with "haha! See, you thought Bill was just his cousin but he's his twin brother! Totally not what you predicted!" I had, grudgingly, all but dismissed Bill as a possible ID until the other day when Dante kept saying Beef Jerky Man in the basement was probably Luke/Bill/whoever. And the way a few other people were talking about Eckert suddenly seemed less like a dodge. But I'll have to wait and see. I think it's most likely Luke.

 

Yeah, I just posted in the spec thread, but I think you may be on to something.  I scanned the transcripts for this week, because I've hit my tolerance limit for the cheesiness and overt stupidity of this show. 

 

Based on Fluke's speech about the dark, awful things that transpired in that home, I'm sure we're going to be treated, using that term very loosely, to an in depth description -- complete with Viki Buchanan and Connie level recreations -- of the awful, dark things that happened in that home. 

 

I've always said that the culprit is given away in the introduction, which would still point to Bill. But I wouldn't be shocked if it wasn't some heretofore unspoken lookalike sibling who great up in that dark, awful place.

 

They won't commit it to being Luke himself. They'd never recover from the fall out of ruining Luke and Laura by having him suffer, undiagnosed, DID for 35 years. But they will flirt with that idea just like they flirted with having Sonny pay for his crimes.  They'll beat it again and again until the fans cry uncle and accept that it is really is Luke.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

Well to be fair I don't think Morgan is smart enough to figure this sentence out much less say it.

 

Well, you know how it goes. When your father shoots your mother in the head while she's giving birth to you (as people will do), you're probably going to end up with a few issues. There's a conversation I'm still waiting for "Good Man Who Loves His Kids" Sonny to have with Morgan. You know, on a day when he can be arsed to remember what the kid's name is in between all the slobber-drooling about Michael.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Cobalt Stargazer

[Evolution101]

So Sonny spends two months in jail for AJ's murder, which pretty much amounts to little more than a slap on the wrist...all because he saved some nobody who's been on the show for all of five seconds.  I think I hear the barge calling my name, and since there's nothing else on this show that's holding my interest, I'ma head on over.  Hope there's some Bailey's on hand.

[Rick Kitchen]

If Fluke really is Luke, that means that Luke was running around running the Jerome crime family far before any of this Fluke crap ever began.

[kellog010]

I just can't with people acting like Michael is acting like a five year old pouting in the corner because he's not prostrating himself before Sonny. Like Sonny stealing Michael, lying to him his entire life and finally killing AJ isn't some big deal that he has a right to be angry about. Also, Nicholas may have earned being read the riot act but I can't even enjoy it because there are far worse people on this show that deserve to be put on blast and yet never are.

[peachmangosteen]

Who's the old dude with Lauren?

 

LOL! 

 

Sonny should be in prison because he saved everyone on that boat.

 

LOL again! Also, yes, this.

 

Yes, it wears its budget cuts on its tattered sleeves but at least people still have homes ...

 

They really don't though. Anna still lives in a fucking hotel.

 

GH could be so good under them but they are deeply, pridefully, almost bitterly invested in making it a very specific kind of personal bad. That's what frustrates me. Because I can see where the good is and it's buried under shit and stuff that is just embarrassing (but fun).

 

This.

 

And how about that heart-warming scene in Sonny's hospital room? Aw - I wish there was a bomb in there.

 

I kept thinking dammit Fluke, why couldn't you have put a bomb in there?!

Edited February 6, 2015 by peachmangosteen

[ulkis]

I disagree they sanctify you on this show *because* you're a parent.

Yeah Dr O is a mom but the show has never tried to say she's a nice person. Nor have they ever tried to say we're supposed to see her as anything other than who and what she is.

People can do horrible things and actually be GOOD parents. (not saying she is one, just look at Brit). I'm just saying the two things are not mutually exclusive, and I don't think the show is saying they are.

 

In Sonny's case, they might be trying to show a parent's love for their child does outweight their own need for safety- and a lot of times IRL, that's true. And yeah Sonny'll get off and that's not fair.

But Sonny isn't going to win the one thing he wants most-Michael's love and forgiveness(yet), so I still see him as "paying" at this point.  If the character is going to remain on canvas, he can't remain in jail, even if we want him there. It's not realistic.

 

I don't care if Sonny is in prison or not, I always said I only expected Sonny to go away for a month or so. I care that most everyone is telling Michael to get over it, even characters who should know better.

 

I disagree they sanctify you on this show *because* you're a parent.

Yeah Dr O is a mom but the show has never tried to say she's a nice person. Nor have they ever tried to say we're supposed to see her as anything other than who and what she is.

 

 

no, but it is trying to say, "well please forgive her/get over the fact that she helped torture Robin, see, she loves her son, she has a good side too!" I was just using O as an example, she's hardly the only example, just the most egregious.

 

I think you can be a good parent and do horrible things at the same time (although to a certain extent I question that - if i murder and abuse and cheat other people but don't hurt my kids, how good of a parent am I really? Isn't part of being a parent setting an example for your children?) but the show seems to say a lot, well hey, Sonny shoots innocent people in the chest, but he loves his kids, so please overlook while the same parade of people stoke his hair and give him a cookie.

 

I don't hate Sonny on the show completely. He moves plot along. But the thing was his throwing the bomb in the water was so lame. Didn't Joe Jr die because he gave Tracy the antidote? Or he did give Tracy the antidote, even if he didn't exactly die from the fever, right? That was a much better act of sacrifice than what Sonny did, even though it was technically the same thing, just because it felt a lot more was at stake, we saw him physically suffer. It was just so lame, Sonny jumps off screen and then comes back 40 minutes later! Give me something other than "sonny really loves Michael!" I already knew that.

Edited February 6, 2015 by ulkis