S07.E16: Awfully Charitable

[AnnA]

First Look is Sunday at 8:35 pm.

 

My cable guide says it's on Sunday 8:35 - 9:00 PM EST.  That has to be a mistake.  

 

They never have a 25 minute First Look; do they?

Edited July 18, 2015 by AnnA

[Otherkate]

It was that she mentioned Heather's reaction but not Carole's and that she says that Dorinda MUST be mad at Heather as if Heather did something, not that Dorinda is a nasty drunk. In her blog, Bethenny called out Dorinda's paranoid aggressive drunk behavior but I don't think we will hear her say that on the show. Not that I think the producers would edit it out but that Bethenny would rather blame Heather instead. JMO

 

I thought she was saying exactly what Heather started to say to Dorinda in the preview - that there seems to be some underlying anger. Because, seriously, what is Dorinda's problem with Heather? It certainly seems personal and I can't figure out where it's coming from. I pretty much agreed with Bethenny's take on things.

[breezy424]

Beth is playing Switzerland.  Unusual for her so she's got a motive that includes not going against the 'countess'.

 

Skinnygirl red in the hallway.  No surprise.  I wonder if that's the place she was planning to display all her products for Bethenny Starting Over.

 

Dorinda sure does like the word 'pure'.  I still don't get what she means.

 

Kris looked fabulous as usual and Sonja looked under dressed.  No denim for Dorinda while there was a lot of Yummie jeans rocking.  With the season that Heather got, good for her.

 

I'm not looking forward to the England trip.  Dorinda just gets on my nerves.

[zoeysmom]

I thought she was saying exactly what Heather started to say to Dorinda in the preview - that there seems to be some underlying anger. Because, seriously, what is Dorinda's problem with Heather? It certainly seems personal and I can't figure out where it's coming from. I pretty much agreed with Bethenny's take on things.

I definitely get the anger-the hashtag crap about her mother being proud of her now and saying that her daughter drops f-bombs. Dorinda said she didn't like to be humiliated and Heather humiliated her to the point she left the table. Just because Heather apologized doesn't make it right. I also think after the apology the storm trooper routine did not work with Dorinda.  Dorinda was on vacation not a hostile witness in front of a grand jury.

[motorcitymom65]

In the description for this episode, it says that Ramona gets upset at the charity event because Heather's jeans are more prominently displayed than her necklaces. That should be all kinds of good.

I definitely get the anger-the hashtag crap about her mother being proud of her now and saying that her daughter drops f-bombs. Dorinda said she didn't like to be humiliated and Heather humiliated her to the point she left the table. Just because Heather apologized doesn't make it right. I also think after the apology the storm trooper routine did not work with Dorinda.  Dorinda was on vacation not a hostile witness in front of a grand jury.

But there was something even before that. The deal with Heather not waiting for her at the restaurant, while being upset at no one else, and then even having the f-bomb conversation to begin with. It seems like she was upset with her from the start of the trip, amd then there is all this talk about how "pure" their relationship was back in the Berkshires. It is just hard to understand, and Dorinda has not explained it.

[breezy424]

I definitely get the anger-the hashtag crap about her mother being proud of her now and saying that her daughter drops f-bombs. Dorinda said she didn't like to be humiliated and Heather humiliated her to the point she left the table. Just because Heather apologized doesn't make it right. I also think after the apology the storm trooper routine did not work with Dorinda.  Dorinda was on vacation not a hostile witness in front of a grand jury.

IMO, Dorinda was preaching and attempting to humiliate Heather.  That wasn't right and Heather wasn't going to put up with it.  Especially after Dorinda went on her crying jig because Heather didn't wait for her going into the restaurant which was probably the most stupid thing....  Especially for a woman who claimed to be cold stone sober at the time.

[WireWrap]

I thought she was saying exactly what Heather started to say to Dorinda in the preview - that there seems to be some underlying anger. Because, seriously, what is Dorinda's problem with Heather? It certainly seems personal and I can't figure out where it's coming from. I pretty much agreed with Bethenny's take on things.

But where did it begin? She went from loving/defending Heather to blasting her when she walked into the restaurant and then joined LuAnn on the F word shamming.  IMO, Heather has the right to be upset at Dorinda, not the other way around.

 

I definitely get the anger-the hashtag crap about her mother being proud of her now and saying that her daughter drops f-bombs. Dorinda said she didn't like to be humiliated and Heather humiliated her to the point she left the table. Just because Heather apologized doesn't make it right. I also think after the apology the storm trooper routine did not work with Dorinda.  Dorinda was on vacation not a hostile witness in front of a grand jury.

Was it nice of Heather to mention that Hannah, an adult, drops the F bomb? Maybe not but it did not come out of the blue and Heather told them both to stop. That she felt "insulted" and was getting upset, TWICE in a row. LuAnn backed off while Dorinda went in for Heather's throat. And these to bozos were using Ella to make their point, a minor child BTW that does not appear on camera very often, against Heather. How far is Heather supposed to allow Dorinda or LuAnn to go in their nasty attack before she is justified in pointing out their flaws as parents?

[breezy424]

Oh.  I forgot:  Josh wasn't wearing his 'cool' hat.  Thank you!

[AnnA]

IMO, Dorinda was preaching and attempting to humiliate Heather.  That wasn't right and Heather wasn't going to put up with it.  Especially after Dorinda went on her crying jig because Heather didn't wait for her going into the restaurant which was probably the most stupid thing....  Especially for a woman who claimed to be cold stone sober at the time.

 

Dorinda totally lost it at the FU dinner, complete with waving arms, drunken slurred speech (that we couldn't understand) and food stuck to her lip.  She later accuses Heather of "preaching" when preaching was exactly what Dorinda did at that dinner.  I didn't think Heather was out of line at all with what she said at the dinner, while LuAnn and Dorinda were bat shit crazy.  Dorinda is unstable at best and LuAnn is a hypocrite.  LuAnn even started to use the forbidden "F" word but trailed off when Sonja called her out for starting the whole thing.

 

Edited July 20, 2015 by AnnA

[zoeysmom]

Bethenny's apartment is hideous with the red and white.   Someday she will have a home and decorate it her home like a home instead of Skinny Girl headquarters.  Tacky.  So Carole got a little emotional and cynical regarding LuAnn-it doesn't feel good to be accused of something you did not do.  I noticed Carole used the words Bethenny's bedroom-not our room. Nice to see Heather and Dorinda make a little progress.  I don't think that is over yet and piss off Carole for her "letting Dorinda" accompany her to London.  Without another RH it would not be filmed or paid for by Bravo.  I am not liking this Carole she appears to think she can bet Bethenny to go along with her.  Interesting dynamic.  At least no one is fighting. . . yet.

 

Kristen looked pretty until I saw the stupid leggings under her evening dress.  It does nothing for her or the product. 

[LotusFlower]

So it seems that Bethenny is back on the it's all Heather's fault band wagon again! sighhhhh

I really hated how Carole told Bethenny that LuAnn made a fool of herself, and Bethenny said: "are you sure you're not biased?" assuming she was going to defend Heather. It's the second time Miss Know-it-all tells Carole that she's biased in a pro-Heather way because they're friends, and this time, she hadn't even heard the story yet. Yet she knows it all. Sorry to state the obvious, but who's the one with a bias here?

Dorinda sure does like the word 'pure'.  I still don't get what she means.

I don't either, but it has an Ayyan ring to it. She needs to back that shit up.

[Lemons]

I liked that little scene in Bethenny's new condo, with Carole. I mostly agree with Beth's assessment of Naked-gate.

 

That is the condo of an extremely wealthy woman.  I love that condo.

[LotusFlower]

I hate defending Dorinda but I think what she means by a pure friendship with Heather is that she considers/considered her an actual friend, not just a Housewives "friend". Pure = real.

Except the first time she said it, the time she was drunk (in vino veritas), in her rambling she said: "Our people are good. Our people are pure." I think she was talking about their families, their mothers, where they grew up in the Berkshires...

[zoeysmom]

In the description for this episode, it says that Ramona gets upset at the charity event because Heather's jeans are more prominently displayed than her necklaces. That should be all kinds of good.

But there was something even before that. The deal with Heather not waiting for her at the restaurant, while being upset at no one else, and then even having the f-bomb conversation to begin with. It seems like she was upset with her from the start of the trip, amd then there is all this talk about how "pure" their relationship was back in the Berkshires. It is just hard to understand, and Dorinda has not explained it.

 

 

IMO, Dorinda was preaching and attempting to humiliate Heather.  That wasn't right and Heather wasn't going to put up with it.  Especially after Dorinda went on her crying jig because Heather didn't wait for her going into the restaurant which was probably the most stupid thing....  Especially for a woman who claimed to be cold stone sober at the time.

I was answering why Dorinda was still angry at Heather not necessarily if she was justified.  Much like Ramona getting such a whopping pass over having the guy over, Carole seems to be getting a giant pass over her treatment of Doringa during the inquisition.  The problem is with Carole/Heather they go down as a team and refuse to see or acknowledge the other's behavior toward a third party may be offensive.  I personally thought Carole was offensive towards Dorinda.  Carole seemed more concerned with plying a clearly clueless Dorinda with questions and insulting her than Heather who was more interested in getting to the bottom of things.  If they want to support each other unconditionally then they have to take the good with the bad.  At the point they approached Dorinda she was in a fairly vulnerable place-in a swimsuit and without visual orientation and pretty much hungover and half awake.

[zoeysmom]

Sonoma, I was going to say pure to Dorinda means innocent, but I think your "real" is more likely. I don't get anything sketchy about her saying pure.

 

Love Carole saying what I thought: Painting the foyer storage area SG red. I get branding your product. But b is really taking it to a whole other level with splashing SG and red on everything. It was at the Hamptons home prominently and now her apartment. I don't get it. I posed the theory that she uses the homes as tax write offs, somehow making them a business expense. I also recognized that she is using a lot of stuff from Restoration Hardware, just going by all those boxes with RH on them. Loved Carole saying, in a kind of bewildered or baffled voice [about Bryn and an extravagantly expensive chandelier in her bedroom] "She's four..."  

 

RedheadZombie, were they YT leggings or YT jeans? I thought it was in keeping with the diamonds [fancy dress] and denim [jeans] theme. If that helps you love it again.

I remember your comment and yes it feels like a tax write off.  Murano are fairly reasonably priced chandeliers as they are glass.  http://www.murano-glass-chandeliers.com/en/96-traditional-murano-glass-chandeliers  I know Bethenny likes the decorating with products affordable to the masses and the kid's bedroom chandelier was certainly affordable.  I think she and Carole have wildly different taste so I am curious why she includes Carole in her decorating trips.

[Otherkate]

But where did it begin? She went from loving/defending Heather to blasting her when she walked into the restaurant and then joined LuAnn on the F word shamming.  IMO, Heather has the right to be upset at Dorinda, not the other way around.

 

Was it nice of Heather to mention that Hannah, an adult, drops the F bomb? Maybe not but it did not come out of the blue and Heather told them both to stop. That she felt "insulted" and was getting upset, TWICE in a row. LuAnn backed off while Dorinda went in for Heather's throat. And these to bozos were using Ella to make their point, a minor child BTW that does not appear on camera very often, against Heather. How far is Heather supposed to allow Dorinda or LuAnn to go in their nasty attack before she is justified in pointing out their flaws as parents?

 

I'm not sure how my post elicited this response, so I'll try to explain what I was saying further. I think B was saying (I agree and it sounds like Heather goes down this same road with D in the next episode) that Dorinda seems to have some underlying anger toward Heather. I wasn't saying it was justified, just that it does seem to exist since she has on more than one occasion responded very strongly to Heather for maybe no reason. The FU dinner was a display of total ridiculousness and Dorinda was the most ridiculous part of all which is saying something. So - all I was saying - and I think H will allude to - is what's up with that? 

 

I don't think what I said should elicit a big defense of Heather since I wasn't even sort of attacking her. Does that make more sense?

Edited July 20, 2015 by Otherkate

[motorcitymom65]

I was answering why Dorinda was still angry at Heather not necessarily if she was justified. Much like Ramona getting such a whopping pass over having the guy over, Carole seems to be getting a giant pass over her treatment of Doringa during the inquisition. The problem is with Carole/Heather they go down as a team and refuse to see or acknowledge the other's behavior toward a third party may be offensive. I personally thought Carole was offensive towards Dorinda. Carole seemed more concerned with plying a clearly clueless Dorinda with questions and insulting her than Heather who was more interested in getting to the bottom of things. If they want to support each other unconditionally then they have to take the good with the bad. At the point they approached Dorinda she was in a fairly vulnerable place-in a swimsuit and without visual orientation and pretty much hungover and half awake.

I don't think Carole thought Dorinda was clueless and I don't either. She didn't know if a man was in the car, she didn't know if she came back in the car with the others? How could she not have known if she was in the car or not? She would have had to have been really drunk to have not known how she got home. Carole had just witnessed Dorinda, on two occasions, be extremely aggressive and opinionated. She was no innocent victim to Carole at this point, unable to answer simple questions.

ETA: I also think that Carole thought that Dorinda would be a little more shocked by the idea that a naked man was left upstairs. Dorinda has kind of made herself the judge and jury on being "elegant" and the importance of manners and rules by this point. I would have certainly thought that she would have been shocked and understood their interest, given her own urgency in making sure that folks were behaving properly.

Edited July 20, 2015 by motorcitymom65

[zoeysmom]

I don't think Carole thought Dorinda was clueless and I don't either. She didn't know if a man was in the car, she didn't know if she came back in the car with the others? How could she not have known if she was in the car or not? She would have had to have been really drunk to have not known how she got home. Carole had just witnessed Dorinda, on two occasions, be extremely aggressive and opinionated. She was no innocent victim to Carole at this point, unable to answer simple questions.

I believe Dorinda when she said she went to bed.  I don't think she was necessarily aware of what happened once they got home or if the men even made it in the house.  She could have been the first one out of the car and headed straight upstairs.

 

This is where things get tricky-everyone knew Dorinda was drunk the night before and I for one don't like the drunk defense and if you know someone is intoxicated and prone to spew gibberish (Sonja), get paranoid (apparently Dorinda according to Bethenny), then back off.  I hate when people say-he or she says stupid things when drunk and then they engage in conversation or confront them  to only later brand the person a liar or insane.  So I don't get why Carole felt she had the right to keep pushing Dorinda for answers.  People do have the right not to answer questions and I believe Carole owed Dorinda an apology instead of lamenting having to travel to London with her.  I just see it differently-Dorinda was drunk and silly (not funny silly, ridiculous silly)during the F Bomb argument.  I still think Heather did not have to defend herself.  To me a simple master of the obvious response to a drunk Luann would have sufficed.  These women just need to be right.  Overuse of F bombs is not okay, getting drunk is not okay, using styrofoam plates is not okay but this group takes it to ridiculous extremes and argues over the obvious.  Then it becomes about apologies and moving on and they don't move on.  I do think at some point Carole and Dorinda should have had a conversation and maybe Miss Perfect Carole could for once see that she can be a snide bitch.

 

Far more barfworthy to me was Dorinda's apology.  I just don't think heartbreak and this abiding love for a person you know fairly casually is necessary.  It just makes me think she over does it in the apology department.  I also think she needs to stop using the word pure in defining relationships-it is also questionable in its sincerity and she uses it drunk and sober.

[snowblossom2]

I remember your comment and yes it feels like a tax write off.  Murano are fairly reasonably priced chandeliers as they are glass.  http://www.murano-glass-chandeliers.com/en/96-traditional-murano-glass-chandeliers  I know Bethenny likes the decorating with products affordable to the masses and the kid's bedroom chandelier was certainly affordable.  I think she and Carole have wildly different taste so I am curious why she includes Carole in her decorating trips.

I'm sorry but I don't think chandeliers that are $2000+ on sale are affordable to the masses nor are they IMO appropriate for a little girl. I agree with Carole

[motorcitymom65]

I believe Dorinda when she said she went to bed.  I don't think she was necessarily aware of what happened once they got home or if the men even made it in the house.  She could have been the first one out of the car and headed straight upstairs.

 

This is where things get tricky-everyone knew Dorinda was drunk the night before and I for one don't like the drunk defense and if you know someone is intoxicated and prone to spew gibberish (Sonja), get paranoid (apparently Dorinda according to Bethenny), then back off.  I hate when people say-he or she says stupid things when drunk and then they engage in conversation or confront them  to only later brand the person a liar or insane.  So I don't get why Carole felt she had the right to keep pushing Dorinda for answers.  People do have the right not to answer questions and I believe Carole owed Dorinda an apology instead of lamenting having to travel to London with her.  I just see it differently-Dorinda was drunk and silly (not funny silly, ridiculous silly)during the F Bomb argument.  I still think Heather did not have to defend herself.  To me a simple master of the obvious response to a drunk Luann would have sufficed.  These women just need to be right.  Overuse of F bombs is not okay, getting drunk is not okay, using styrofoam plates is not okay but this group takes it to ridiculous extremes and argues over the obvious.  Then it becomes about apologies and moving on and they don't move on.  I do think at some point Carole and Dorinda should have had a conversation and maybe Miss Perfect Carole could for once see that she can be a snide bitch.

 

Far more barfworthy to me was Dorinda's apology.  I just don't think heartbreak and this abiding love for a person you know fairly casually is necessary.  It just makes me think she over does it in the apology department.  I also think she needs to stop using the word pure in defining relationships-it is also questionable in its sincerity and she uses it drunk and sober.

I see what you are saying, but Carole's questions were as to whether there was a man with them, and if she was in the car herself. Fairly simple.  I don't think that Carole was complaining about bringing Dorinda based on that, but she seemed to be talking about Dorinda at the jean decorating deal. I think she was talking about Dorinda at that event when she mentioned being concerned about traveling with Dorinda. At that point she had witnessed Dorinda acting like a total and complete loon on several occasions, so she was probably wondering what she had gotten herself into. From the sounds of things on Twitter, all went well and they had a nice time together.  

 

The problem with all of these women is that they like to start shit, but become upset and offended when someone tries to finish it. Life in general doesn't work like that, and certainly Reality TV doesn't work like that. Dorinda is the queen of "shutting that shit down". When the ladies were talking to Sonja in AC, she was the one who said in her TH that she would never sit there and allow someone to judge her in that manner. She is the one who told Sonja she needed to be pushing back hard. She doesn't like that shit herself (we have seen her go batshit crazy when someone even takes a phone call during a lunch with her) and she isn't afraid to stand up and defend herself. Heather was on camera and I know there is disagreement at to whether her role as a mother was being judged, but there can be no doubt that she was being judged for her behavior. On camera for the world to see. Most people would have pushed back and defended themselves. Unfortunately, I have had to deal with more than my fair share of drunks, since this is an affliction that runs rampant in my family. Wisdom might say that you shouldn't argue with these people, but I don't buy into that. At all. If someone is being an asshole, I don't care if they are drunk or not. It's just not OK and it's not an excuse for bad behavior or to let someone just say whatever they want to say.  It goes back to the same old story, IMO. The person who is being attacked, or offended, or scared seems to bear the responsibility for putting a reasonable stop to whatever they feel has happened to them. They shouldn't respond, or be offended. If they do, they are the ones to blame. The person who is responsible for attacking, or judging, or bringing the guy back to the house - or in other words starting the whole thing to begin with - is seen as someone who should be able to do whatever they want to do and have others just shrug and let them be. 

[WireWrap]

I hate defending Dorinda but I think what she means by a pure friendship with Heather is that she considers/considered her an actual friend, not just a Housewives "friend". Pure = real.

But she has used it, "pure" before, in the F bomb fight as well. It did not make sense then either IMO.

 

I was answering why Dorinda was still angry at Heather not necessarily if she was justified.  Much like Ramona getting such a whopping pass over having the guy over, Carole seems to be getting a giant pass over her treatment of Doringa during the inquisition.  The problem is with Carole/Heather they go down as a team and refuse to see or acknowledge the other's behavior toward a third party may be offensive.  I personally thought Carole was offensive towards Dorinda.  Carole seemed more concerned with plying a clearly clueless Dorinda with questions and insulting her than Heather who was more interested in getting to the bottom of things.  If they want to support each other unconditionally then they have to take the good with the bad.  At the point they approached Dorinda she was in a fairly vulnerable place-in a swimsuit and without visual orientation and pretty much hungover and half awake.

All Dorinda had to do was say "I don't want involved" but instead she used needing her contacts in to answer a question. LOL But, you are correct, Carole was much more aggressive in asking her questions yet she puts sole blame on Heather. There is defiantly a pattern of blaming Heather for EVERYTHING this season! sighhhh 

 

I'm not sure how my post elicited this response, so I'll try to explain what I was saying further. I think B was saying (I agree and it sounds like Heather goes down this same road with D in the next episode) that Dorinda seems to have some underlying anger toward Heather. I wasn't saying it was justified, just that it does seem to exist since she has on more than one occasion responded very strongly to Heather for maybe no reason. The FU dinner was a display of total ridiculousness and Dorinda was the most ridiculous part of all which is saying something. So - all I was saying - and I think H will allude to - is what's up with that? 

 

I don't think what I said should elicit a big defense of Heather since I wasn't even sort of attacking her. Does that make more sense?

LOL, I was agreeing with you that Dorinda's anger with Heather doesn't make sense based on what we have seen so far. IMO, Dorinda has been the aggressor in the 2 fights they have already had, Dorinda/Heather fights, not Heather. 

[zoeysmom]

I'm sorry but I don't think chandeliers that are $2000+ on sale are affordable to the masses nor are they IMO appropriate for a little girl. I agree with Carole

Well I was speaking of Bethenny and her shopping at C&B, CB2, Pottery Barn and the recent stories of her furnishing her entire Hampton's home in affordable stuff.  My way of thinking is the child never even touches the chandelier and for an apartment that costs millions it is probably within the decorating budget to have a Murano fixture as opposed to say a Swarovski crystal chandelier.  Again my point was lost-there are many affordable fixtures on the site.  This is Carole who claims her couch is the equivalent of a French villa.

[motorcitymom65]

But, you are correct, Carole was much more aggressive in asking her questions yet she puts sole blame on Heather. There is defiantly a pattern of blaming Heather for EVERYTHING this season! sighhhh 

 

 

This is why I cannot get behind Dorinda anymore. I liked her in the beginning, but she has just lost all credibility to me. Carole was clearly the one doing the questioning of Dorinda. She was the one who was pressing her for answers. Yet Dorinda seems to be fine with Carole. I mean, if it was all so traumatic for her, if she felt like there was a need for an apology, why go to London with her? On Twitter, during her play-by-play of the action, all of the criticism was for Heather. It just makes no sense to me, because Dorinda has never explained her crazy behavior regarding Heather at this point. 

[Midnight Cheese]

I was answering why Dorinda was still angry at Heather not necessarily if she was justified.  Much like Ramona getting such a whopping pass over having the guy over, Carole seems to be getting a giant pass over her treatment of Doringa during the inquisition.  The problem is with Carole/Heather they go down as a team and refuse to see or acknowledge the other's behavior toward a third party may be offensive.  I personally thought Carole was offensive towards Dorinda.  Carole seemed more concerned with plying a clearly clueless Dorinda with questions and insulting her than Heather who was more interested in getting to the bottom of things.  If they want to support each other unconditionally then they have to take the good with the bad.  At the point they approached Dorinda she was in a fairly vulnerable place-in a swimsuit and without visual orientation and pretty much hungover and half awake.

I haven't timed it but I think Carole asked Dorinda 4 or 5 questions in less than a 2-minute span.  It's just IMO nothing like an 'inquisition.'  She kept asking because Dorinda was being shady and stupid (IMO) and evasive - acting like an innocent dumb shit is a provocation for some.

 

I truly believe you can't perceive humiliation without your own consent, to mangle and abuse Eleanor Roosevelt's quote about having to consent to be made to feel inferior by someone else.  Dorinda was pathetically drunk and out of control, ALL her own doing, and started lashing out at Heather.  She lost control and somewhere in her ur-brain knew she was out of control, and was embarrassed, and then decided that was Heather's fault, so Heather was therefore humiliating Dorinda.  Dorinda does seem to have a very soft spot when it comes to her perceptions about other people embarrassing her.  So she attacks Kristen (but not Sonja, who really did act like she would have blown John in front of Dorinda for the free dry cleaning) because Kristen is more objectively desirable IMO.  She attacks Heather, who was NOT drunk, spiteful, shitty or out of control, whereas she and LuAnn were.  Rinse and repeat.

Edited July 20, 2015 by Midnight Cheese

[zoeysmom]

But she has used it, "pure" before, in the F bomb fight as well. It did not make sense then either IMO.

 

All Dorinda had to do was say "I don't want involved" but instead she used needing her contacts in to answer a question. LOL But, you are correct, Carole was much more aggressive in asking her questions yet she puts sole blame on Heather. There is defiantly a pattern of blaming Heather for EVERYTHING this season! sighhhh 

 

LOL, I was agreeing with you that Dorinda's anger with Heather doesn't make sense based on what we have seen so far. IMO, Dorinda has been the aggressor in the 2 fights they have already had, Dorinda/Heather fights, not Heather. 

I was not blaming Heather,  It was quite the opposite-when Heather realized Dorinda was clueless as to the man sleeping in the upstairs bedroom she moved on to find a better source of information.  Carole kept picking away at Dorinda.  Dorinda could have also told Carole to STFU, as it appears that is also an acceptable response with these women--I think she was trying to be polite and stay out of the fray.

[WireWrap]

I was not blaming Heather,  It was quite the opposite-when Heather realized Dorinda was clueless as to the man sleeping in the upstairs bedroom she moved on to find a better source of information.  Carole kept picking away at Dorinda.  Dorinda could have also told Carole to STFU, as it appears that is also an acceptable response with these women--I think she was trying to be polite and stay out of the fray.

Well, for Dorinda it would have been "Back that shit up", because she "never" says the F word! LOL

 

I was agreeing with you that Carole was more the aggressor in asking Dorinda questions. LOL I didn't think YOU were blaming Heather, I said that DORINDA was blaming Heather and ONLY Heather! This is where I get ticked off at Dorinda and LuAnn, they place total/whole blame on Heather and little to none on Carole. Really, do they think so little of Carole, do they really think she can't have the same feelings as Heather in the moment? Think back to the F bomb fight......Carole, Sonja and Kristen openly MOCKED both LuAnn and Dorinda throughout most of that fight by dropping as many F bombs as possible! Yet, not 1 word was said to any of them, not 1 and Dorinda put sole blame on Heather and acts as if Heather started that fight. The same with walking into the restaurant, Heather was not alone, she was part of a group that was walking in together but Dorinda only went after Heather, she only "lectured/preached" to Heather about waiting for "her", where was her anger/ire towards Bethenny or Carole. There is a clear pattern of blaming Heather even over minor/trivial stuff that others are also guilty of, especially by Dorinda this second half of the season.

 

Somewhere near the end of the first half of filming, IMO, Dorinda and LuAnn got together and decided that they needed to jump on Bethenny's "Bad Heather" campaign and they were off to the races and they are letting Carole off the hook solely because Bethenny likes her IMO.

[IKnowRight]

I really hated how Carole told Bethenny that LuAnn made a fool of herself, and Bethenny said: "are you sure you're not biased?" assuming she was going to defend Heather. It's the second time Miss Know-it-all tells Carole that she's biased in a pro-Heather way because they're friends, and this time, she hadn't even heard the story yet. Yet she knows it all. Sorry to state the obvious, but who's the one with a bias here?

I don't either, but it has an Ayyan ring to it. She needs to back that shit up.

I noticed the word pure has been making a comeback in the last few years. It means like, real love = pure love, pure romance, natural. Nothing sinister about it.

I sensed something off with Dorinda at the beginning of the season, we are just seeing it finally play out. I just think she's struggling to keep it together after losing her husband and not being sure of her current choices.

I think bethenny, in this case, was just asking Carole about bias because time & time again, friends seem to show bias towards their friends version of events. Since Bethenny was not there to see for herself, she wanted to see how authentic Carole's description really was...

I'm not trying to take sides here, or towards any of the wives in these last few episodes. Every single one of them has been a little shady, nutty, exaggerating, jumpy and not, dare I say it, pure. I'm not sure if they are just getting sick of each other in a sibling/cabin fever way...or deciding it's time to bring it to keep their apples.

I don't know, I typically see all their actions in a black and white vision of their inner character, but lately, each lady acts cool one minute and all, like, uncool the next!

[AnnaMayWong]

Bethenny is hardly one to point out the biases of others. The ENTIRE show has promoted her bias behaviors towards both Kristen and Heather.

As far as Dorinda, I stated very early on this forum that her nasty self perceived elevation to/over John at the restaurant demonstrated an ugly character.

[AnnA]

I think bethenny, in this case, was just asking Carole about bias because time & time again, friends seem to show bias towards their friends version of events. Since Bethenny was not there to see for herself, she wanted to see how authentic Carole's description really was...

 

I agree with this.  Carole did it to Bethenny in the restaurant after Dorinda's birthday dinner/weekend.  Add to that the fact that Carole had partnered with Heather in questioning the women about naked man so it seems logical that Carole's take on LuAnn (or was it Dorinda?)  at Kristen's jean decorating party would be "biased."

Edited July 20, 2015 by AnnA

[WireWrap]

I agree with this.  Carole did it to Bethenny in the restaurant after Dorinda's birthday dinner/weekend.  Add to that the fact that Carole had partnered with Heather in questioning the women about naked man so it seems logical that Carole's take on LuAnn (or was it Dorinda?)  at Kristen's jean decorating party would be "biased."

Ahhh, but would Bethenny call it "bias" if Carole defended or agreed with her on anything? I doubt it, highly doubt it! LOL

[Otherkate]

Hasn't anyone else ever asked this question when one friend in a group of friends is relating a story of conflict to you? I've certainly asked it and I didn't mean it in the sense of "are you sure you aren't biased because no way could this be true because your friend X is the worst person in the world." When you like someone in a special BFF way, you do tend to see things through their eyes. It's kind of part of the BFF deal and there's nothing wrong with it. Seemed like a reasonable question, especially from someone who thinks the way Bethenny does - she always drills into people.

[AnnA]

Ahhh, but would Bethenny call it "bias" if Carole defended or agreed with her on anything? I doubt it, highly doubt it! LOL

 

Probably not!   LOL

 

That would be a "See?  My friend has my back."  Either way the term "biased" could be applied.

[WireWrap]

Hasn't anyone else ever asked this question when one friend in a group of friends is relating a story of conflict to you? I've certainly asked it and I didn't mean it in the sense of "are you sure you aren't biased because no way could this be true because your friend X is the worst person in the world." When you like someone in a special BFF way, you do tend to see things through their eyes. It's kind of part of the BFF deal and there's nothing wrong with it. Seemed like a reasonable question, especially from someone who thinks the way Bethenny does - she always drills into people.

Very true but Bethenny would never, ever say that her friend took her side in an argument/discussion because they were "biased" but would instead say that they believed exactly how she did. Also, Bethenny, herself, has a "bias" against Heather! LOL

[zoeysmom]

I agree with this.  Carole did it to Bethenny in the restaurant after Dorinda's birthday dinner/weekend.  Add to that the fact that Carole had partnered with Heather in questioning the women about naked man so it seems logical that Carole's take on LuAnn (or was it Dorinda?)  at Kristen's jean decorating party would be "biased."

Carole said Luann made a fool out of herself and was in her Countess mode.  With this group this year calling each other out left and right I think they have all become a little Countess mode and preachy.    If Bethenny could see Luann side of things before she even heard the story it is indicative that perhaps Heather and Carole give off a sense of wanting to catch Luann or Ramona in the act.  They have priors with this group.  I thought Carole came on way too strong with Bethenny assuming Bethenny would take her side.  I do believe the Countess when she said Carole (off camera) threw some shade Heather's way.  To me, I think Bethenny is seeing things are getting a little judgmental.  What was far more interesting was Bethenny not wanting to be Switzerland.

[shoegal]

I agree with this. Carole did it to Bethenny in the restaurant after Dorinda's birthday dinner/weekend. Add to that the fact that Carole had partnered with Heather in questioning the women about naked man so it seems logical that Carole's take on LuAnn (or was it Dorinda?) at Kristen's jean decorating party would be "biased."

I think Bethenny is right to question if it was bias, and I think it absolutely is bias...Carole and Heather were like Frick and Frack in the Naked Man drama (whomever made the comparisons to synchronized swimmers, THANK YOU, I am forever grateful for that image). LuAnn outed Carole for having a tiny bit of her own opinion about Heather being on a rampage, so Carole needed to shut that shit down quick.

Edited July 20, 2015 by shoegal

[AnnA]

Carole said Luann made a fool out of herself and was in her Countess mode.  With this group this year calling each other out left and right I think they have all become a little Countess mode and preachy.    If Bethenny could see Luann side of things before she even heard the story it is indicative that perhaps Heather and Carole give off a sense of wanting to catch Luann or Ramona in the act.  They have priors with this group.  I thought Carole came on way too strong with Bethenny assuming Bethenny would take her side.  I do believe the Countess when she said Carole (off camera) threw some shade Heather's way.  To me, I think Bethenny is seeing things are getting a little judgmental.  What was far more interesting was Bethenny not wanting to be Switzerland.

 

I think you meant to say that Bethenny said she wanted to be Switzerland.  That was very interesting, especially coming from Bethenny.

[zoeysmom]

I think you meant to say that Bethenny said she wanted to be Switzerland.  That was very interesting, especially coming from Bethenny.

I meant that Bethenny not wanting to be Switzerland is I think there is an arrogance about Bethenny that is she has an opinion and that she will tell us what is right and wrong.  Even when she does her blogs she writes as if the reader didn't watch the show and what her perception of events are the only perception..

 

While on the topic of Bethenny and First Looks I have to say her crude objectifying statements about giving the construction crews blow jobs to make them work faster is just crass and totally objectified these men.  These men could be in happy satisfying relationships and would find it offensive and hurtful to their partner for this rich middle aged woman to think they could be bribed into working faster because Bethenny offered up a blow job or worse yet performed one.  I was glad to see Carole attempt, although unsuccessfully, to correct Bethenny's absolutely whorish, exploitive statements by substituting $200.00 instead on a blow job.  That of course got Bethenny to talking about hand jobs.  Bethenny as an employer, am mother and sometimes wife and partner, might want to stop and consider that the whole world isn't tied to her lowbrow humor.  I guess what offended me is we saw part of the crew and then she started speaking that way.  Although Bethenny can be entertaining and funny this stab at humor is a total zero and she should have picked up on Carole's discomfort - of course this is Carole who was comfortable with telling Bethenny she had a sex dream about her. 

[AnnA]

I meant that Bethenny not wanting to be Switzerland is I think there is an arrogance about Bethenny that is she has an opinion and that she will tell us what is right and wrong.  Even when she does her blogs she writes as if the reader didn't watch the show and what her perception of events are the only perception..

 

If nothing else, Bethenny is opinionated but so are all of the HWs.

 

I do agree with your take on her inappropriate humor re the construction guys.  However, I'm still a bit confused because Bethenny did say she needed to be Switzerland regarding NakedManGate.

 

It's all good. Being confuddled is nothing new for me.   LOL

[jinjer]

Bethenny's apartment is hideous with the red and white.   Someday she will have a home and decorate it her home like a home instead of Skinny Girl headquarters.  Tacky.  So Carole got a little emotional and cynical regarding LuAnn-it doesn't feel good to be accused of something you did not do.  I noticed Carole used the words Bethenny's bedroom-not our room. Nice to see Heather and Dorinda make a little progress.  I don't think that is over yet and piss off Carole for her "letting Dorinda" accompany her to London.  Without another RH it would not be filmed or paid for by Bravo.  I am not liking this Carole she appears to think she can bet Bethenny to go along with her.  Interesting dynamic.  At least no one is fighting. . . yet.

 

Kristen looked pretty until I saw the stupid leggings under her evening dress.  It does nothing for her or the product. 

Kristen was wearing jeans/jeggings under the dress for the denim part of the theme.   

 

ITA that Bethenny said something along the lines that she was disappointed that she had to be Switzerland and couldn't take a side in the naked man-gate because she saw both sides.  I think she was dying to have an opinion there.  I think she basically leaned toward Luann in her not-so-Switzerland position.  

Edited July 20, 2015 by jinjer

[SCS]

While on the topic of Bethenny and First Looks I have to say her crude objectifying statements about giving the construction crews blow jobs to make them work faster is just crass and totally objectified these men.  These men could be in happy satisfying relationships and would find it offensive and hurtful to their partner for this rich middle aged woman to think they could be bribed into working faster because Bethenny offered up a blow job or worse yet performed one.  I was glad to see Carole attempt, although unsuccessfully, to correct Bethenny's absolutely whorish, exploitive statements by substituting $200.00 instead on a blow job.  That of course got Bethenny to talking about hand jobs.  Bethenny as an employer, am mother and sometimes wife and partner, might want to stop and consider that the whole world isn't tied to her lowbrow humor.  I guess what offended me is we saw part of the crew and then she started speaking that way.  Although Bethenny can be entertaining and funny this stab at humor is a total zero and she should have picked up on Carole's discomfort - of course this is Carole who was comfortable with telling Bethenny she had a sex dream about her.

Somewhere out there is a construction worker wailing, "Stud shamed! I've been stud shamed!"

[Mondrianyone]

Skinnygirl red in the hallway.  No surprise.  I wonder if that's the place she was planning to display all her products for Bethenny Starting Over.

 

Dorinda sure does like the word 'pure'.  I still don't get what she means.

 

No denim for Dorinda while there was a lot of Yummie jeans rocking.

 

Living in either one of Bethenny's residences--the Hamptons house and now the condo--must be like living inside a Target.

 

Dorinda was wearing denim, I think.  Unless I'm mistaken, those were white jeans.  You know, pure denim.  (I want my promise ring back, Dorinda.  I'm no longer crushing on you.  You're out of your mind.)

 

I get branding your product. But b is really taking it to a whole other level with splashing SG and red on everything. It was at the Hamptons home prominently and now her apartment. I don't get it. I posed the theory that she uses the homes as tax write offs, somehow making them a business expense. I also recognized that she is using a lot of stuff from Restoration Hardware, just going by all those boxes with RH on them.

 

All those RH boxes prominently behind them in that scene made me think she'd worked out a product-placement deal with Restoration Hardware as well.  I guess that's admirable.  Why pay for your own furniture if you don't have to?  The rich get richer, as my mom always said.

[Tara Ariano]

Carole visits Bethenny and fills her in on the dramas at Kristen's denim-decorating bash. Meanwhile, tension surrounds Ramona at a charity event; Bethenny is called out for her arrogance; and Carole and Dorinda face their past when they head to London.

[Trooper York]

I think it is much more interesting that Dorinda has a Purell love for Luann.

Cause I mean who knows where she has been?

[motorcitymom65]

If nothing else, Bethenny is opinionated but so are all of the HWs.

 

I do agree with your take on her inappropriate humor re the construction guys.  However, I'm still a bit confused because Bethenny did say she needed to be Switzerland regarding NakedManGate.

 

It's all good. Being confuddled is nothing new for me.   LOL

Yea, she said she needed to be in that situation, but she hated it. She has always said that Lu likes to be Switzerland, and that she hates that about her. In her words you have to "pick a side".

[Mountainair]

The practical "mother of boys" in me cringed at the chandelier in Bryn's room. I can only imagine that thing being broken into a million pieces all over the floor after a play date with friends. However, Bryn is probably not allowed play dates with friends and her room will always be prim and proper so I guess a chandelier is ok.

I liked Kristen's look at the charity event. It reminded me of Lucille Ball's look on I love Lucy. She always wore a beautiful long over shirt like that with her pants. I liked it.

[Trooper York]

I wouldn't worry about the chandelier. Bynn's only approved friends are Bethenny's assistant and the doorman.

She gets to be a normal kid when she is with Jason. Then she can eat hot dogs and break stuff.

At her Moms place she has to spend all her time hiding her pajamas so her Mom doesn't steal them.

[imjagain]

Bethenny is hardly one to point out the biases of others. The ENTIRE show has promoted her bias behaviors towards both Kristen and Heather.

As far as Dorinda, I stated very early on this forum that her nasty self perceived elevation to/over John at the restaurant demonstrated an ugly character.

While I enjoyed Dorinda early on, her treatment of John definitely had me side eyeing her. Her clear disdain for him was obnoxious and obvious to me.

I said early on in the season that I would rather they not show John because it brought out a nasty side of Dorinda that I did not like. Little did I know that her nasty side has nothing to do with John it's just Dorinda.

[zoeysmom]

Yea, she said she needed to be in that situation, but she hated it. She has always said that Lu likes to be Switzerland, and that she hates that about her. In her words you have to "pick a side".

I think the reason I brought it up is there is a scene with Dr. Amador where he advises Bethenny her "confidence" is arrogance and she looks like someone just pulled the rug out from under her.  I think it may be something Bethenny needs to experience more often-neutrality. 

[AnnA]

While I enjoyed Dorinda early on, her treatment of John definitely had me side eyeing her. Her clear disdain for him was obnoxious and obvious to me.

I said early on in the season that I would rather they not show John because it brought out a nasty side of Dorinda that I did not like. Little did I know that her nasty side has nothing to do with John it's just Dorinda.

 

I'm with you about her treatment of John.  

 

I liked her when she tended to Sonja in Atlantic City but we've seen her turn into Dasterdly Dorinda  too many times now for it not to be her SOP.

[LotusFlower]

Bethenny is hardly one to point out the biases of others. The ENTIRE show has promoted her bias behaviors towards both Kristen and Heather.

I think you mean her bias against Kristen and Heather, and I agree with you. What stood out to me was how she asked about bias before she even heard the story. Who does that? Someone with an inherent bias against Heather, quite frankly. (TM Aviva).