Figure Skating

[AuntieDiane6]

8 hours ago, le bordel chaud said:

Don't forget a lot of the pressure athletes are under is also self-imposed. Figure skaters tend to attract harsh perfectionists. Nathan seems like that prototype -- someone who is always seeking perfection in everything he does.

Very true.  My original post was addressed to those who seem to believe that NBC needs to stop proclaiming him the next Olympic champion BECUSE it is creating pressure ON HIM.  No... NBC predicting a US gold medal is smart on their part because it will attract viewers.  That's why they're in business.  If Nathan can't handle the pressure, well, he's been through this once before so maybe gold isn't in his future. And Vincent seems to have the chops.  The winner is the one who CAN handle the pressure--whether internal or external. 

[nickp1991]

Vincent Zhou did a good job! But Chen performed a fantastic program!

[ChicksDigScars]

12 hours ago, AuntieDiane6 said:

Very true.  My original post was addressed to those who seem to believe that NBC needs to stop proclaiming him the next Olympic champion BECUSE it is creating pressure ON HIM.  No... NBC predicting a US gold medal is smart on their part because it will attract viewers.  That's why they're in business.  If Nathan can't handle the pressure, well, he's been through this once before so maybe gold isn't in his future. And Vincent seems to have the chops.  The winner is the one who CAN handle the pressure--whether internal or external. 

The difference being that NBC does not just pre-anoint a champion. They obsess over it. They pick at the scab. At the Olympic gymnastic trials, they had their cameras in Simone's face constantly. We had footage of her rooting in her gym bag, helping Jordan Chiles with her hair, all the while, other gymnasts were on the podium, performing and they were NOT showing them AT ALL. It was more compelling to called her the GOAT and let us all watch her wipe her nose as she sat. And the signs were starting to show. Simone won the trials, but she was clearly not her best (but that was still good enough to leave everyone else in the dust).

Nathan is getting the Simone treatment, but to his advantage, once he's done, he's off the ice and away from their obsession. Gymnasts have to sit and wait for the next rotation. They can't disappear into the locker rooms. The cameras are always around. 

The Fanyu's are feeding off this. Social media is a cess pool. Fanyu's tweet more about Nathan than they do about their precioussssss. There are fans that tweet at the ISU and the judges, picking apart every score that they give Nathan. He's the subject of so much petty vitriol. I'm at the point where I wish Hanyu would take his gold medals and his Pooh Bears and just retire. And I know he's a nice guy and he always seems to treat Nathan with kindness. Maybe NBC dialing it back a bit, taking some pressure off Nathan would give Fanyu's less to bitch about? It's like the Virtue/Moir stans on steroids.  I hope that this  prepared, lovely Vincent keeps it up. It's a distraction for NBC to have someone to share their focus. 

 

[healthnut]

22 hours ago, KittenPokerCheater said:

can you watch the practices/competitions after they have happened?  (I work weird hours and can't always watch live).

Yes, this year so far. Last year that wasn’t the case, you could only watch live.

[emmawoodhouse]

3 hours ago, healthnut said:

Yes, this year so far. Last year that wasn’t the case, you could only watch live.

I checked Peacock's Skate Canada schedule, and unless there's a change, they won't be airing the competition live. WTF? It's in North America, FFS! What will they do with the European and Japanese competitions if they can't even show Skate Canada live?

[peachmangosteen]

Weird. I'm pretty sure they showed them all live last season. But I always watch the replay anyway so fine by me lol.

One thing I do hate about Peacock though is they don't have the galas, at least not as replays. Do they air them live?

[emmawoodhouse]

Yeah, they showed everything live last year. Maybe the times they're listing on Peacock will change before Friday?

I don't watch the galas, so I have no clue what Peacock does or doesn't offer there. According to SCI's schedule, the gala will be on Sunday.

[specialj67]

1 hour ago, emmawoodhouse said:

I checked Peacock's Skate Canada schedule, and unless there's a change, they won't be airing the competition live. WTF? It's in North America, FFS! What will they do with the European and Japanese competitions if they can't even show Skate Canada live?

That’s odd. I just looked on the Peacock app and found the Skate Canada events among the upcoming figure skating events. Seems like they’ll be live-streamed when I compare the scheduled time in the app with the competition schedule on the ISU site.

[emmawoodhouse]

It's giving me times later Friday night, starting at 8 PT and running all night. 

How odd that we are seeing two different things. 🤔

[healthnut]

5 hours ago, emmawoodhouse said:

I checked Peacock's Skate Canada schedule, and unless there's a change, they won't be airing the competition live. WTF? It's in North America, FFS! What will they do with the European and Japanese competitions if they can't even show Skate Canada live?

They are live. The times are as follows (EST):

Friday 4pm Pairs Short, 5:35pm Mens Short, 7pm Rhythm Dance, 8:45pm Womens Short

Saturday 4pm Pairs Free, 5:45 Mens Free, 7:30 Free Dance, 9:30 Womens Free

 

[emmawoodhouse]

Yes, I know the actual times. I have no explanation for why my version of Peacock says they are airing everything late at night. 

I will go to Peacock Friday afternoon and hope for the best. 😁

[healthnut]

10 hours ago, emmawoodhouse said:

Yes, I know the actual times. I have no explanation for why my version of Peacock says they are airing everything late at night. 

I will go to Peacock Friday afternoon and hope for the best. 😁

Maybe check your time zone settings on the app…🤷🏾‍♀️

[emmawoodhouse]

6 hours ago, healthnut said:

Maybe check your time zone settings on the app…🤷🏾‍♀️

I don't run it through an app. It's on my TV as a free service tacked onto Comcast. The other events seem to be listed correctly. So weird.

[HartofDixie]

Skate Canada results page

http://www.isuresults.com/results/season2122/gpcan2021/

[honeywest]

Elizaveta Tuktamysheva, grand old lady (at 24) of Russian figure skating. Love her.

[Jeddah]

Who are these judges who gave Jason Brown 8.75s in Skating Skills and Performance? It doesn’t get any better when it comes to Skating Skills and Performance than that short program!

[emmawoodhouse]

1 hour ago, Jeddah said:

Who are these judges who gave Jason Brown 8.75s in Skating Skills and Performance? It doesn’t get any better when it comes to Skating Skills and Performance than that short program!

Sinnerman is pure genius. As Brian Orser said to Jason as he left the ice, "Didn't put a foot wrong." I agree. It was sublime.

[specialj67]

4 hours ago, Jeddah said:

Who are these judges who gave Jason Brown 8.75s in Skating Skills and Performance? It doesn’t get any better when it comes to Skating Skills and Performance than that short program!

For real! If anyone should be getting mid-to-high 9s in this particular field, it’s Jason. I’m sure part of it is because he’s not not even attempting a quad in the program.

[Jillibean]

6 hours ago, Jeddah said:

Who are these judges who gave Jason Brown 8.75s in Skating Skills and Performance? It doesn’t get any better when it comes to Skating Skills and Performance than that short program!

I think the performance scores are a real problem in this sport. They're not awarded consistently and, most times, they follow along the lines of the technical content--if the skater landed a lot of jumps, they get high performance scores even if they were sort of bobbing around with airplane arms. People like Jason and Karen who are stunning don't get nearly enough of a bump. Our esteemed commentators often appear surprised and confused by performance scores and have consistently been unimpressed by the scores for Jason in particular.  If this is something the ISU cares about being fair, they really need to come up with very specific criteria and retrain all the judges until they get reliability across the whole field. Otherwise, these scores continue to be yet another way to let political machinations get a foothold in the sport. 

[CheshireCat]

36 minutes ago, Jillibean said:

I think the performance scores are a real problem in this sport. They're not awarded consistently and, most times, they follow along the lines of the technical content--if the skater landed a lot of jumps, they get high performance scores even if they were sort of bobbing around with airplane arms.

I remember that a few years ago, someone mentioned that judges are encouraged to do it that way. Makes no sense to me as judges should judge what they're seeing and there are a few components that have nothing to do with the technical content (you can't have good technical content without decent skating skills but you can have the worst musicality/choreography/interpretation. You can also have a bad day and a bad performance but good skating skills, just to name a couple).

[healthnut]

There's been quite a bit of uproar about PCS the last couple of seasons between overinflated marks for Trusova and underscoring for skaters like Kevin Amoyz, Jason, Satoko, and Karen. If it continues throughout this Olympic season, I think they might finally take a look at this and make some changes. We'll see.

[emmawoodhouse]

Jason did win PCS over Nathan, but it was closer than you'd expect. The judge scoring him in the 8's should be horsewhipped. 

[Lady Whistleup]

So I want to like Alyssa Liu but I just can't get excited about her skating. 

[specialj67]

2 hours ago, healthnut said:

There's been quite a bit of uproar about PCS the last couple of seasons between overinflated marks for Trusova and underscoring for skaters like Kevin Amoyz, Jason, Satoko, and Karen. If it continues throughout this Olympic season, I think they might finally take a look at this and make some changes. We'll see.

As long as figure skating is a judged sport with an artistic component to the score, there will be squirrelly judging.

[Lady Whistleup]

Rough skate for all the men minus Nathan. I'm hoping Nathan ditches this program for last year's Glass program. The Mozart + techno doesn't work for me.

[Jillibean]

6 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

Rough skate for all the men minus Nathan. I'm hoping Nathan ditches this program for last year's Glass program. The Mozart + techno doesn't work for me.

And the faces he makes during that techno section are...interesting. I'm glad to see he has collected himself, though this wasn't really a threatening field for him.

Could Jason Brown be any more of a sweetheart? He is just such a light. 

Keegan's skate was painful. Literally. 

Edited October 30, 2021 by Jillibean

[specialj67]

2 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

Rough skate for all the men minus Nathan. I'm hoping Nathan ditches this program for last year's Glass program. The Mozart + techno doesn't work for me.

Even Nathan was kinda messy with some of those landings. This men’s free skate was definitely an example of medaling by making the fewest mistakes. I feel bad for the Canadian guys—Keegan had such a solid short, and Roman had such a promising start to his free skate before things got messy.

[Lady Whistleup]

Karen and Alysa didn't really make the case for the US ladies having any chance in Beijing ...

[specialj67]

I do not like Valieva’s free skate this season. The choreography has absolutely no connection to the music, and it doesn’t require her to hold a position for longer than a second. It’s like Zagitova version 2.0, but with quads.

Props to Tuktamysheva for her resurgence, but her program content outside of the jumps is hilariously nonexistent. Getting 9s for sassy wrist flicks and what amounts to a choreographed smoke break in the middle of her program?! 

Edited October 31, 2021 by specialj67

[Lady Whistleup]

I don't mind Valieva. I think she's super duper talented. I think her LP is kind of a turd, but honestly, so is Nathan Chen's this season.

[Avaleigh]

19 hours ago, Lady Whistleup said:

So I want to like Alyssa Liu but I just can't get excited about her skating. 

I like her skating and think there are a lot of positive qualities. I definitely see improvement from the last few years and I hope that trend continues. Where I'm less enthusiastic is when it comes to the jumps because weirdly enough (considering her reputation) I don't consider her to be the best jumper. I actually think that Amber is probably the strongest jumper among the American ladies. Still, I give Alysa credit for not giving up on the 3A. She's a fighter and US is going to need that when it comes to the team event. 

If only Karen had the jumps. Her artistry is miles away from the pack.

I liked Kamila's short program and love the Rippon triple axel. That being said, I really don't care for her long program. Bolero isn't right for her and it's disappointing to think of that program as an OGM winning program because it's so lacking. It's particularly frustrating because I think she is capable of great artistry she just isn't being given the right programs. 

12 hours ago, specialj67 said:

Props to Tuktamysheva for her resurgence, but her program content outside of the jumps is hilariously nonexistent. Getting 9s for sassy wrist flicks and what amounts to a choreographed smoke break in the middle of her program?! 

Lol, I agree. I'm still rooting for her to make the team but yes to everything in your post. Also, even the people who hate on Kamila for being the latest off of Eteri's assembly line have to admit that when it comes to the transitions between the jumps, that Kamila's content is far more difficult and interesting than Elizaveta's. Elizaveta channels those entries so hard it occasionally reminds me of a slightly more polished version of Surya Bonaly. The entry into the triple axel is so slow and is basically the opposite of effortless looking. Kamila just jumps up and does it. She makes it look easy and that's a big difference. 

I feel for Aliona getting left in the dust when she was leading the pack only a year and a half ago. Of the big six she seems least likely to make the Olympic team.

[emmawoodhouse]

We haven't seen her on the Grand Prix yet, but I imagine that Shcerbakova can't be left off Russia's Olympic team unless she regressed like Alena. I can't see them leaving Trusova home. Poor Liza. 

[Lady Whistleup]

Nathan's jumps have looked a bit wonky. I don;t know what it is exactly because other than Skate America he hasn't fallen. But it's as if the edges aren't as secure.

[emmawoodhouse]

Well, even if he makes the GPF, he has several weeks to address his "issues." If he doesn't make the final, he doesn't have a competition until Nats in January. Hopefully, he'll look more comfortable by then; the Olympics are something like 4 weeks after Nats.

Edited October 31, 2021 by emmawoodhouse

[KittenPokerCheater]

The only skate that's grabbing me right now is the Zorro program from the Spanish Ice Dance team.

And the Sinnerman/Jason Brown program is simply divine.

Neither may have the technical stuff to win a medal at the Olympics, but I will be rooting for them.

[annzeepark914]

I haven't been a fan of Russian ladies' skating (make that a lot of different countries' ladies skaters) for a few years. But Kamila's SP and the music she skated to reminded me of the "old days" ...well, the days of Michelle Kwan & Sasha, Shizuka, Josie Choinard., Alyssa Cizney (I'm ruining last names!)--elegant skating that matched the music. And the music wasn't raucous or vapid (but then, this was before vocals were allowed in singles). 

Edited October 31, 2021 by annzeepark914

[Lady Whistleup]

14 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

I haven't been a fan of Russian ladies' skating (make that a lot of different countries' ladies skaters) for a few years. But Kamila's SP and the music she skated to reminded me of the "old days" ...well, the days of Michelle Kwan & Sasha, Shizuka, Josie Choinard., Alyssa Cizney (I'm ruining last names!)--elegant skating that matched the music. And the music wasn't raucous or vapid (but then, this was before vocals were allowed in singles). 

Yes, if an Eteri girl has to win OGM I'd rather it be Kamila than Sasha Trusova. I feel like Kamila despite this being her first senior year has a very classic style.

Cool thing: both Kamila and Alina Zagitova are Russian Tatars and self-identify as Muslim. Nellie Kim and Aliya Mustafina are/were as well. Definitely a hardy athleticism seems to be in the Tatar blood.

[annzeepark914]

3 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

Yes, if an Eteri girl has to win OGM I'd rather it be Kamila than Sasha Trusova. I feel like Kamila despite this being her first senior year has a very classic style.

Cool thing: both Kamila and Alina Zagitova are Russian Tatars and self-identify as Muslim. Nellie Kim and Aliya Mustafina are/were as well. Definitely a hardy athleticism seems to be in the Tatar blood.

Now that's interesting! And I recall Alina, the 2018 Olympic gold medal winner, not being treated kindly because of her heritage (at least I thought I read that at the time). I'll never forget the *look* she got from her coach after she was announced as the gold medalist (if looks could kill, Alina would've been a goner).

[Lady Whistleup]

6 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

Now that's interesting! And I recall Alina, the 2018 Olympic gold medal winner, not being treated kindly because of her heritage (at least I thought I read that at the time). I'll never forget the *look* she got from her coach after she was announced as the gold medalist (if looks could kill, Alina would've been a goner).

There's a lot of discrimination against Russian Tatars. For one, most are Muslim. For instance, the famous ballerina Diana Vishneva is a Tatar and her grandfather was a mullah. But she admitted that she converted to Christianity because she lived in St. Petersburg. Dancer Rudolf Nureyev was also a Russian Tatar.

Russian Tatars however are prized for their looks -- the dark haired and high cheekbones look is considered beautiful. When you look at these faces together you can thread the needle:

A few examples:

 

[Avaleigh]

4 hours ago, emmawoodhouse said:

We haven't seen her on the Grand Prix yet, but I imagine that Shcerbakova can't be left off Russia's Olympic team unless she regressed like Alena. I can't see them leaving Trusova home. Poor Liza. 

It really sucks. I'd like to see it be Anna, Elizaveta and Kamila, but you're right--there's no way they aren't going to have Trusova on the team. Even if Liza does make the team they'll probably have Kamila do the short and Trusova do the long for the team event, so her chances of coming away with a medal aren't as strong as one would think considering that she's the reigning world silver medalist.

I'm curious how Anna's quad lutz is at the moment. Having that consistent quad helped keep her ahead of the pack for three years now. If she's lost both that and the flip, Liza, Maiia, Aliona or even Daria could potentially sneak in there for that third spot. 

[Lady Whistleup]

I think the team will be Kamila/Sasha Trusova/Liza. Two jumping powerhouses, one jumping veteran. But this is Russian skating where things often change by the hour. So who knows.

[Harry24]

5 hours ago, emmawoodhouse said:

Well, even if he makes the GPF, he has several weeks to address his "issues." If he doesn't make the final, he doesn't have a competition until Nats in January. Hopefully, he'll look more comfortable by then; the Olympics are something like 4 weeks after Nats.

Nathan said in the post-comp presser that he’s been having an issue with his hip.  

[emmawoodhouse]

15 minutes ago, Harry24 said:

Nathan said in the post-comp presser that he’s been having an issue with his hip.  

Oh no! Having not hit up the figure skating message boards today, I hadn't heard that. 😕

[Lady Whistleup]

Wasn't he dealing with a hip issue in Pyeonchang as well?

[annzeepark914]

1 hour ago, Harry24 said:

Nathan said in the post-comp presser that he’s been having an issue with his hip.  

Uh-oh. That sure doesn't sound good. I remember hearing that after the 1998 O's, Tara could barely walk up stairs (& didn't see she have surgery?) 

[legaleagle53]

12 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

Uh-oh. That sure doesn't sound good. I remember hearing that after the 1998 O's, Tara could barely walk up stairs (& didn't see she have surgery?) 

Yep. That's why she retired from skating at such a young age.

[Jeddah]

I think he’s always had hip problems. He injured his hip during the exhibition at his first senior Nationals. It was hard to watch. He could barely skate off the ice. I hope he’s okay. At least he’s got some time before he has to compete again.

[healthnut]

20 hours ago, emmawoodhouse said:

We haven't seen her on the Grand Prix yet, but I imagine that Shcerbakova can't be left off Russia's Olympic team unless she regressed like Alena. I can't see them leaving Trusova home. Poor Liza. 

Right now it’s Vaileva, Trusova, and Liza. Scherbakova has some ground to make up and losing to Maia earlier in the season didn’t help. It’s crazy to think either the world champion or runner up won’t be at the Olympics but unless someone is injured in February (I realize Sasha is injured now), that’s exactly what is going to happen. 

[ChicksDigScars]

I haven't watched the Ice Dance yet, but it seems that Green/Parsons have overtaken Carreira/Ponomarenko in the U.S. pecking order? G/P finished 4th and C/P were eighth? Is it the coaching change for C/P? They were #4 in U.S. ice dance before switching to Moir (not counting the year they had to WTD due to a COVID exposure before Nats). Disappointed for C/P.

[Lady Whistleup]

25 minutes ago, ChicksDigScars said:

I haven't watched the Ice Dance yet, but it seems that Green/Parsons have overtaken Carreira/Ponomarenko in the U.S. pecking order? G/P finished 4th and C/P were eighth? Is it the coaching change for C/P? They were #4 in U.S. ice dance before switching to Moir (not counting the year they had to WTD due to a COVID exposure before Nats). Disappointed for C/P.

C/P are just not developing the way they need to in order to stay afloat.