Figure Skating

[Domenicholas]

Sasha Trusova also had to withdraw from the NHK Trophy due to her foot injury.

[DawnDavenport]

On 11/2/2021 at 6:51 PM, Jeddah said:

I wish they’d bring back spirals for the women! So many beautiful moments came from spirals.

The only problem I have with a required spiral sequence would be everyone would be trying to do some gumby variation of a Bielmann or the god-awful "I need to take a piss on a fire hydrant" (the Y?) war crime that was prevalent in Turin. They may be hard but they sure are ugly and ungainly as hell. NO THANKS!

I would like to submit into evidence your honor:

https://www.eurosport.com/figure-skating/torino2/2006/target-topple-slutskaya_sto837547/story.shtml 

 

Edited November 8, 2021 by DawnDavenport

[Lady Whistleup]

Alexandra Trusova has withdrawn from the NHK trophy, apparently to rest her stress fracture.

[CeeBeeGee]

25 minutes ago, DawnDavenport said:

The only problem I have with a required spiral sequence would be everyone would be trying to do some gumby variation of a Bielmann or the god-awful "I need to take a piss on a fire hydrant" (the Y?) war crime that was prevalent in Turin. They may be hard but they sure are ugly and ungainly as hell. NO THANKS!

I would like to submit into evidence your honor:

https://www.eurosport.com/figure-skating/torino2/2006/target-topple-slutskaya_sto837547/story.shtml 

 

 

But that's Slutskaya. She could make even a Charlotte spiral unattractive. She was athletic but lacked grace.

[NUguy514]

I got about two-thirds of the way through the "Gold War" episode of Bad Sport before I had to turn it off because I was reminded so clearly of several things:

1. Jamie Salé has always annoyed the shit out of me.  She came across like the whiniest victim who was ever victimized before she set a blade on the ice in Salt Lake City, and seemingly nothing has changed in the ensuing nineteen years.

2. I'd have voted for Berezhnaya and Sikharulidze then, I'd still vote for them, and I still think the double gold was undeserved (even with the judging scandal).  B/S's program was much more difficult, and their presentation was stratospherically better than everything about that horrible "Love Story" program (hated it then, still hate it).  Also, and this was conveniently omitted because it wouldn't fit the storyline, Salé and Pelletier fucking fell at the end of their short program and still placed second when they should've been fourth, so Jamie, her dick agent, that self-righteous judge who talked about the non-mistakes B/S made and held S/P up as the paragon of pairs skating perfection, and (as much as I usually like her) Christine Brennan can shut their collective pie holes.

3. Nothing about the manifold judging issues in figure skating was fixed with the new scoring system; if anything, the issues are worse because the anonymity of the current system makes for an easier cover for chicanery.

Everything else about this was propaganda, which is interesting given the Cold War angle this was hitting so hard.

[CheshireCat]

3 hours ago, NUguy514 said:

2. I'd have voted for Berezhnaya and Sikharulidze then, I'd still vote for them, and I still think the double gold was undeserved (even with the judging scandal).  B/S's program was much more difficult, and their presentation was stratospherically better than everything about that horrible "Love Story" program (hated it then, still hate it).  Also, and this was conveniently omitted because it wouldn't fit the storyline, Salé and Pelletier fucking fell at the end of their short program and still placed second when they should've been fourth, so Jamie, her dick agent, that self-righteous judge who talked about the non-mistakes B/S made and held S/P up as the paragon of pairs skating perfection, and (as much as I usually like her) Christine Brennan can shut their collective pie holes.

Totally agree. What annoys me to this day is that B/S did stumble BUT they received a deduction for it in the technical score - exactly where they should have received the deduction - and it was the long program, so under that system, the presentation score had more weight in the long program and for some reason, this gets always ignored.

I still believe there was no reason for any outrage.

[healthnut]

I, too, will always prefer B/S just like I’ll always prefer Michelle over Tara and Yuna over Adelina. But that’s the subjectivity of it all. There is no denying B/S would’ve won with IJS scoring 

I have yet to watch the Bad Sport special but I did read The Second Mark this summer when the Flutzes and Watzels Podcast did their patreon series on it (highly recommend the book!). And I now have a much greater appreciation for the judging scandal and the overhaul that occurred because of it. The fix was definitely in and the double gold was really the only thing to do especially with the pressure of the American media. However, I still don’t understand why they were held up in the short program with the fall. I mean not even third?

The NHK trophy feels cursed, Hanyu, Rika, Trusova, and now Hawayek/Baker. I was half expecting Vicky & Nicky to withdraw, too, because he’s been suffering with a back injury but it appears they are going. 

[ChicksDigScars]

13 hours ago, DawnDavenport said:

The only problem I have with a required spiral sequence would be everyone would be trying to do some gumby variation of a Bielmann or the god-awful "I need to take a piss on a fire hydrant" (the Y?) war crime that was prevalent in Turin. They may be hard but they sure are ugly and ungainly as hell. NO THANKS!

I would like to submit into evidence your honor:

https://www.eurosport.com/figure-skating/torino2/2006/target-topple-slutskaya_sto837547/story.shtml 

 

Yeah. Way too little left to the imagination, there. 

Also in Turin, Elene Gedevanishvili, whose idea of racking up points was to do fifteen variations of a Bielmann in her long program. Girlfriend grabbed her skate boot so many times, I thought it was going to come off in her hand. 

 

[DawnDavenport]

4 hours ago, healthnut said:

I, too, will always prefer B/S just like I’ll always prefer Michelle over Tara and Yuna over Adelina. But that’s the subjectivity of it all. There is no denying B/S would’ve won with IJS scoring 

I have yet to watch the Bad Sport special but I did read The Second Mark this summer when the Flutzes and Watzels Podcast did their patreon series on it (highly recommend the book!). And I now have a much greater appreciation for the judging scandal and the overhaul that occurred because of it. The fix was definitely in and the double gold was really the only thing to do especially with the pressure of the American media. However, I still don’t understand why they were held up in the short program with the fall. I mean not even third?

The NHK trophy feels cursed, Hanyu, Rika, Trusova, and now Hawayek/Baker. I was half expecting Vicky & Nicky to withdraw, too, because he’s been suffering with a back injury but it appears they are going. 

Hmm. Sounds like an interesting special.

To be perfectly honest, I hated both LPs from B & S and S & P. Yes B & S's was more difficult but that god awful hacked up cut of Meditation with added cymbal crashes and harps was tasteless, as was Sikharaulizde's over emoting. Did he take an honors course from the Angelica Krylova School of Facial Expressions? I watched this with a group of friends and we all pretty much thought he was way too over the top and and laughed every time we got a close-up of his face. 

From a technical perspective, they had more than one mistake than just his double axel. They also had slight a problem with the split triple twist that should have been somewhat deducted.

As for S & P, I can't believe they used Love Story. It was way too simple for an Olympic LP and they should have stuck with Orchid (Rach. 2nd piano concerto). It had way more content and was a much more artistically pleasing program. I know they didn't skate it well at Canadian Nationals but they should have stuck with it because they skated it well in other competitions.

I do agree they should not have been 2nd after the short with the fall on their final position. I know both the US and Canadian commentators (I lived in Seattle at the time so could watch both the NBC and CBC coverage) tied themselves into knots trying to justify how the fall shouldn't have counted, but you could tell they all knew it should have.

Knowing how crooked the judging was, there was no other option but to give 2 golds under the circumstances, even if it ultimately was stupid. 

Edited November 8, 2021 by DawnDavenport

[Good Queen Jane]

17 hours ago, DawnDavenport said:

The only problem I have with a required spiral sequence would be everyone would be trying to do some gumby variation of a Bielmann or the god-awful "I need to take a piss on a fire hydrant" (the Y?) war crime that was prevalent in Turin.

We used to call that the Gynecological Exam Spiral. 

[Rootbeer]

32 minutes ago, Good Queen Jane said:

We used to call that the Gynecological Exam Spiral. 

Yep, I’ve heard it called ‘Here’s my vagina’.  A lot of skaters were doing it years ago. Not pretty.

[healthnut]

Dick Button always HATED this one. 

[DawnDavenport]

1 hour ago, healthnut said:

Dick Button always HATED this one. 

This speaks to the old adage: "Just because you can doesn't mean you should!" 

I know Slutskaya's spirals were always ugly and clunky but these were endemic to even the pretty ones like Sasha Cohen.

Bring back the spiral requirement and this is all we'll get, not the old school ones.

[Lady Whistleup]

Anyone think that this batch of Russian girls heading to the Olympics is actually the most artistic?

Kamila, Anna, Aliona -- I have quibbles with their actual programs, but I find them very artistic and lovely skaters with great skating skills.

Sasha Trusova -- not artistic but she doesn't try. Neither does Liza. Both max out what they can do without any put-on artsy fartsiness. 

[Jeddah]

1 hour ago, Lady Whistleup said:

Anyone think that this batch of Russian girls heading to the Olympics is actually the most artistic?

Kamila, Anna, Aliona -- I have quibbles with their actual programs, but I find them very artistic and lovely skaters with great skating skills.

Sasha Trusova -- not artistic but she doesn't try. Neither does Liza. Both max out what they can do without any put-on artsy fartsiness. 

I feel the same way. I hear so much complaining about the lack of artistry, and I feel like I am watching a different sport. Because I see a lot of artistry in women’s skating and even more in men’s skating right now.

[annzeepark914]

7 hours ago, Good Queen Jane said:

We used to call that the Gynecological Exam Spiral. 

It's still used, in a way, during some of the pairs lifts. It wouldn't be so awful if the ladies were wearing unitards (or whatever they call them).

[emmawoodhouse]

While we're on the topic of spirals, TSL made a video of some of the best. I haven't watched it, but I imagine the usual suspects will be included.

 

[Jeddah]

1 hour ago, emmawoodhouse said:

While we're on the topic of spirals, TSL made a video of some of the best. I haven't watched it, but I imagine the usual suspects will be included.

 

Haha! Did we give them the idea?

Okay, which one of you is Dave Lease?

[ChicksDigScars]

So, I watched the Free Dance from GP Italy last night on the Olympic Channel. Bored shitless. Too much nice, flowy, violin crap. Don't get me wrong. Beautiful skating, but I was BORRRED. Gabby and Madison's skating dresses are gorgeous. I tuned in just after Greene and Parsons took their fall, but they also have a nice, classical type piece......snooooze. Even Stepanova and Bukin, who I like, seemed to sleep their way through.

There's something missing. They're missing a spark. Watching Tessa/Scott and Meryl/Charlie, there was passion and spark. Their free dances were thrilling.  I guess I'll have to enjoy those disco original dances to be entertained. 

And unless Gabby loses her dress again, the OGM is already decided. Yes, it's gorgeous skating. But I keep wanting some Moulin Rouge or Phantom of the Opera passion. 

 

[ML89]

On 11/8/2021 at 5:11 PM, healthnut said:

Dick Button always HATED this one. 

Terry Gannon used to tee him up to comment on all these. I love spirals but wow was I sick of the eleventy billion Bielmann variations, and the fire hydrant ones.

[emma675]

On 11/8/2021 at 4:11 PM, healthnut said:

Dick Button always HATED this one. 

I have to side with Dick on this one. It was very "behold, my crotch!"-esque. 

[HartofDixie]

NHK Trophy begins tomorrow.

http://www.isuresults.com/results/season2122/gpjpn2021/

[emmawoodhouse]

7 hours ago, HartofDixie said:

NHK Trophy begins tomorrow.

http://www.isuresults.com/results/season2122/gpjpn2021/

Actually, it begins at 7:30 tonight for me. 😁

[KittenPokerCheater]

1 hour ago, emmawoodhouse said:

Actually, it begins at 7:30 tonight for me. 😁

Cool-

And since you're living in the future, can you tell us what lottery numbers are?  Asking for a friend.  :p

[annzeepark914]

I keep watching G/P & acknowledge that their skating together is sublime. *But* that FD is so boring, coupled w/ that cello piece--zzzzzzz. And so it will be interesting to see them along with the Russians and the two American top teams.

[honeywest]

Tonight’s Project Runway assignment was to design outfits for Tara and Johnny to wear while commentating the pairs in Beijing.

Kana Muramoto and Daisuke Takahashi are competing at NHK.

Edited November 12, 2021 by honeywest

[healthnut]

10 hours ago, honeywest said:

Kana Muramoto and Daisuke Takahashi are competing at NHK.

And they were fantastic! And ahead of their Japanese teammates after the rhythm dance. 

Chock/Bates we’re also really strong. They actually had first place ordinals from 4 of the 7 judges but they are second due to extremely high scores for S/K from Russia and Ukraine judges. 

[honeywest]

2 minutes ago, healthnut said:

And they were fantastic! And ahead of their Japanese teammates after the rhythm dance. 

 

Takahashi has always been one of my favorite skaters, and I was so impressed by their performance.

Not loving Chock and Bates this season—either the rhythm dance or the astronaut and the alien.

[Lady Whistleup]

P/C are beautiful dancers, but after seeing their very soft, floaty programs for seven years in a row, I'm kind of over it. 

Also, I enjoyed their rivalry with Virtue/Moir. That old iron sharpens iron phrase is true. There was excitement when the two would square off.

This time they pretty much are skating to a sure-thing OGM and it's not exciting.

[healthnut]

45 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

This time they pretty much are skating to a sure-thing OGM and it's not exciting.

It’s too bad H/D couldn’t get themselves together because they were in a position to challenge them after the last Olympics. At least, this next quad looks to be more competitive. Ice Dance has almost always been ruled by one or two teams, it’s never been competitive like the other disciplines. I really hope that this next four years, that will change. 

That being said, don’t count out S/K just yet. Still a lot of politicking left in this Olympic season. 

[emmawoodhouse]

2 hours ago, healthnut said:

It’s too bad H/D couldn’t get themselves together because they were in a position to challenge them after the last Olympics. At least, this next quad looks to be more competitive. Ice Dance has almost always been ruled by one or two teams, it’s never been competitive like the other disciplines. I really hope that this next four years, that will change. 

That being said, don’t count out S/K just yet. Still a lot of politicking left in this Olympic season. 

I thought I heard that the Olympic judging panel won't be as favorable to the Eastern Europeans as to North America and Western Europe. 

While we haven't seen S/K's FD yet, P/C have set the bar very high.

[healthnut]

47 minutes ago, emmawoodhouse said:

I thought I heard that the Olympic judging panel won't be as favorable to the Eastern Europeans as to North America and Western Europe. 

For the Olympics the Ice dance judging countries are USA, Canada, Italy, Great Britain, Spain, Poland, China, Lithuania, France, Germany, Japan, Ukraine. So, you may be correct…

[Harry24]

3 hours ago, healthnut said:

For the Olympics the Ice dance judging countries are USA, Canada, Italy, Great Britain, Spain, Poland, China, Lithuania, France, Germany, Japan, Ukraine. So, you may be correct…

What I’ve heard (and have absolutely no expertise that would allow me to assess this info), is that the ID panel for the team event is favorable to North America, but the panel for the individual ID event is more favorable to Eastern Europe.  

[honeywest]

I loved Muramoto and Takahashi’s free dance and am so glad they’re working with Zoueva.

Madison Chock is so striking, and that alien moon makeup just makes her look sick.

Edited November 13, 2021 by honeywest

[emmawoodhouse]

Evan's fall made me sick. 

S/K's FD is dull, dull, dull. Can't believe the PCS they got. 👎

[specialj67]

8 hours ago, honeywest said:

I loved Muramoto and Takahashi’s free dance and am so glad they’re working with Zoueva.

Madison Chock is so striking, and that alien moon makeup just makes her look sick.

Yes yes yes! I love the improvement in Muramoto and Takahashi’s program since last season. I hope they are selected for the Japanese Olympic team. Since Daisuke came from a singles skating discipline and has strong individual skating skills, they are one of those teams where both partners are equally grabbing my attention.  

Also agree the alien makeup on Madison isn’t doing it for me, at least in its current iteration. If she wore, like, a dark colored lipstick instead, I think it would work better? Evan’s fall at the beginning of their program was too bad, because the rest of their program was really good. I love the arm choreography in their twizzle sequence. As I suspected at the beginning of this season, the more I see this program, the more I like it.

I wish I could say the same for Fear and Gibson’s free dance this season. It just isn’t doing it for me the way their other recent free dances did.

[honeywest]

1 hour ago, specialj67 said:

 

I wish I could say the same for Fear and Gibson’s free dance this season. It just isn’t doing it for me the way their other recent free dances did.

It isn’t doing it for me either, but I do enjoy them. I don’t care much for Lajoie and Lagha. (And both teams skated to cartoon soundtracks.)

[annzeepark914]

I'm watching NBC's selections of various skaters in each discipline at the Italian comp. But somehow I missed the beginning of Tara & Weir's comments about someone's nasty critique of P/C's being able to convey certain emotions in ice dance due to one of them being gay (at least I *think* that was the topic of that particular conversation). How did this discussion begin?

[emmawoodhouse]

19 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

I'm watching NBC's selections of various skaters in each discipline at the Italian comp. But somehow I missed the beginning of Tara & Weir's comments about someone's nasty critique of P/C's being able to convey certain emotions in ice dance due to one of them being gay (at least I *think* that was the topic of that particular conversation). How did this discussion begin?

It was a Russian "journalist" who said P/C couldn't portray male/female interactions because he's gay. I saw this broadcast during the week on the Olympic Channel, and Tara/Johnny ripped this guy a new asshole. 

[annzeepark914]

40 minutes ago, emmawoodhouse said:

It was a Russian "journalist" who said P/C couldn't portray male/female interactions because he's gay. I saw this broadcast during the week on the Olympic Channel, and Tara/Johnny ripped this guy a new asshole. 

Not surprised it was a Russian. Over the years we've seen some inappropriate costumes that made fun of certain cultures.

[emmawoodhouse]

4 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

Not surprised it was a Russian. Over the years we've seen some inappropriate costumes that made fun of certain cultures.

Oh God, 2010 Ice Dance. Davis/White did the much beloved Bollywood program. The Russians were Aboriginal, IIRC, and totally disrespected the culture.

[peachmangosteen]

1 hour ago, emmawoodhouse said:

I saw this broadcast during the week on the Olympic Channel, and Tara/Johnny ripped this guy a new asshole. 

Good for them.

[Jillibean]

I love Madi and Evan. Love, love, love. But...does it sort of seem like they fall a lot? Like, more than other people? 

She needs some color or something on that dress. It's very drab even with all the sparkles. I know she takes pride in designing their costumes, but since coming to Montreal it seemed like maybe their team had more of a hand in it and her sort of odd choices from pre-Montreal seemed to be a thing of the past. And now they're back, just in time for the Olympic season. (Facepalm.)

I was slightly encouraged by how close they were to S/K in the RD. 

[specialj67]

1 hour ago, emmawoodhouse said:

Oh God, 2010 Ice Dance. Davis/White did the much beloved Bollywood program. The Russians were Aboriginal, IIRC, and totally disrespected the culture.

Domnina and Shabalin—god, that was horrific and offensive. Makes some of the more questionable hip hop rhythm dances this seasons seem merely cringe in comparison.

[Harry24]

19 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

I'm watching NBC's selections of various skaters in each discipline at the Italian comp. But somehow I missed the beginning of Tara & Weir's comments about someone's nasty critique of P/C's being able to convey certain emotions in ice dance due to one of them being gay (at least I *think* that was the topic of that particular conversation). How did this discussion begin?

It’s worse than his being a journalist.  He’s a former judge and now a coach.

[ChicksDigScars]

On 11/12/2021 at 10:28 AM, healthnut said:

And they were fantastic! And ahead of their Japanese teammates after the rhythm dance. 

Chock/Bates we’re also really strong. They actually had first place ordinals from 4 of the 7 judges but they are second due to extremely high scores for S/K from Russia and Ukraine judges. 

The usual overscoring of Vicky and Nicky notwithstanding, what is with the THONG? My request to make these dances more exciting does not mean seeing her BUTT CHEEKS for days. Yikes. 

 

 

Edited November 15, 2021 by ChicksDigScars

[peachmangosteen]

It probably just rode up like that. That sucks lol.

[annzeepark914]

1 hour ago, ChicksDigScars said:

The usual overscoring of Vicky and Nicky notwithstanding, what is with the THONG? My request to make these dances more exciting does not mean seeing her BUTT CHEEKS for days. Yikes. 

 

 

I just saw this and am astounded that the judges didn't take off points for lack of decency (or somethin').   I doubt this was a wedgie.

[KittenPokerCheater]

I love Chock/Bates, but I wish they would go back to last year's dance- Snake charmer?

[annzeepark914]

34 minutes ago, KittenPokerCheater said:

I love Chock/Bates, but I wish they would go back to last year's dance- Snake charmer?

Why do they *have* to do the unusual? Why not focus all their outstanding talent on something normal--but spectacular?  S/K have. P/C and H/D have. None of the top teams, each of whom could win the O gold medal, are wasting their time working on eerie FDs...except for Chock & Bates. Now, if C/B win the gold...I'll eat my ski hat 😋

Edited November 16, 2021 by annzeepark914