S05.E10: Mother's Mercy

[Andromeda]

Well I feel like I just got it in the gut, Knights Watch style. As Jon's blood is soaking the snow all I could think of is "Poor Ghost." 

 

I don't understand why they wouldn't show Stannis' death when I got to see a dude's eyes stabbed out and a woman's naked body for like ten minutes. Shame! And the Battle Of Winterfell was like fast forwarded.

 

Mel's fire really...backfired.

 

What is the pink letter?

 

That bugged me too! 

 

The pink letter... I had to Google it last week, and I read all the books! I had forgotten it completely. All this time, I was left thinking the Night's Watch turned on John almost entirely because of the Wildings situation. I still think that's true, and the letter in the book was more the final nail in the coffin. So to speak.

 

http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Bastard_Letter

 

On Stannis' death, I think the writers/editors were just being creative -- they had Stannis slated to die by Brienne's sword, and Ramsey cleaning up Stannis' men in the scene that followed, so they did some creative hijinks editing. But Stannis is dead.

[GreyBunny]

Welp, so that happened.

 

Jon is dead and Mel, who conveniently arrived earlier that day, will probably resurrect him.  She might be useful for something after all.

 

I bet Sansa and Theon will cross paths with Davos and he'll go after Rickon.

 

At least Sam, Gilly, Tyrion, and Varys got something that resembled a happy season ending.  I missed Varys too.

 

Alliser Thorne I was hoping for a redemption arc.  Nope.  Ollie can be a snack for Ghost at any time. 

 

Frankengregor Mountainstein looked ridiculous.  They should have CGI'd out the face so the helm appeared dark and hollow inside.

Edited June 15, 2015 by GreyBunny

[Pete Martell]

I still wonder why Tyrion is capable of leading Meereen. I guess there's no one else...and we need more thrilling scenes of Tyrion getting drunk and groping naked women.

[MrWhyt]

I still wonder why Tyrion is capable of leading Meereen.1

He ran King's Landing and was Hand to the king. He's more qualified than Daario, Jorah, Missandei or Grey Worm combined.

[Umbelina]

Overall, I have been disappointed with this season. We spent a stupid amount of time on Arya and her plot has gone virtually nowhere. Most of the rest of the characters are now either dead or in purgatory like Arya's two brothers who have been completely MIA all season. Just disappointed that I have to wait another year to continue plots that didn't go anywhere this season. Like Sansa, other than getting raped by Ramsey her plot went nowhere.

 

I just had to bring this post over from the unsullied thread because it really made me laugh!  I'm not laughing at the poster.  I'm laughing thinking about them actually reading these books in real time.

 

Have to wait another year!

Slow moving plots that go nowhere!

Characters that just disappear for a whole episode or two!

 

It just made me giggle, thinking of the last two books, or hell, most of the books.  They have no idea how absolutely compressed all of this is, and what they could have suffered through.  "Where do whores go?"  or endless river trips, or (on and on and on and on.)  Imagine if they'd read THOSE!

 

Hee!

[Miles]

Overall I liked it.

I especially liked that Brienne got to fullfill at least one of her duties. Don't like as much that she didn't at least have Pod keep watch for the candle.

 

Hmmm.... Up until now I've been okay with the deviation from the book, but now... I just don't know.

What deviation? They got it a lot more back on track than they were before this episode.

I guess Stanis dying hasn't happened yet in the books, but I think we can assume it will. Other than that only thing that's new is that Varys is in a different place than he is in the books

Straight from the books:

- Jon got stabbed

- Millesandre is back in place to probably smootch Jon back to life

- Theon did the same for Sansa he did for Jane Pool in the books

- Aria is blind

- Dany met a new dothraki army in the dothraki sea

- Cersei did her walk of shame

- Sam is on his way to oldtown

- The mountain is an undead kings guard

- Wasn't Myrcella almost-dead in the books?

 

And Thorne as the first stab? I don't buy it. They only had it be him because he's recognizable.

I don't even really buy that he was in on it at all. Since Jon got voted lord commander they've shown Thorne to have a grudging respect for Jon.

I also have a little bit of a hard time believing the stabbing in general, after some of these people have seen Hardhome with their own eyes and know what the real threat is. If Ollie had done it on his own, I could have bought it easily, but this seems very far fetched.

 

And last words, "Olly", instead of "Ghost"? Ick.

For that matter, where the hell is ghost? Why wouldn't he save Jon? That wasn't established at all on the show.

 

According to an interview with Entertainment Weekly, Kit Harrington said he isn't coming back. So unless he and the writers are duping us....

(bolding by me)

Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding.

Also do you have a link? I'd lie to read the exact wording. Usually they weasel their way around this stuff.

 

A ring. I don't know the significance.

I think it was her wedding ring. So she can play the card "I was married to Drogo and I never married again, bring me to that weird city where all the Dothraki widows live." or something like that.

 

Who will (refuse to type her name) burn to bring back Jon? Maybe herself!

Resurrections don't require burnings, at least not at the same time. I suspect all the burnings the red priests do around the world get put in a bank and can be used for resurrections. Ofcourse Jon has kings blood, so he'll need someone with kings blood to resurrect him, which is where Shireen comes in. In the books Mel will burn Shireen on the spot, but on the show it will be enough that she's in the bank.

 

If the Night's Watch stabs their commander, and a red witch revives him and he leaves, does he get hunted down for desertion? Or are they all like "See you Snow, don't forget the direwolf? Oh and here's a fleet of ships, a bunch of Wilding, and Wun Wun."

The first two sentences from the night watch's vow: "Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death."

Jon's watch ended with his death. He is a free man afterwards. It's the loophole that will get him on the iron throne, eventually.

Edited June 15, 2015 by Miles

[Skeeter22]

He ran King's Landing and was Hand to the king. He's more qualified than Daario, Jorah, Missandei or Grey Worm combined.

Tyrion knows nothing about Meereen. He can't speak the language and he doesn't know the politics or culture. He sold himself to Dany as someone who was an expert on politics in Westeros. She needed him because she couldn't possibly navigate the politics of an unfamiliar place. How the hell can he turn around and rule Meereen when he's been there for maybe two weeks?

[Umbelina]

Tyrion is smart as hell though, and a fast learner who knows how to listen, and he's also loyal to Dany.  He was the best choice.  I am happy to see Varys, Jorah, and Tyrion teaming up.

 

I was watching the extra features from the last movie from the Twilight series last night  <shuddup>.  Anyway, by the last movie they really got the wolves right, and they even managed an extremely believable CGI cougar.  Wolves were their main focus though, and they improved on the each movie, so by the end, they were pros.  They also spent quite a bit of time with real wolves to get behavior right.  I keep wondering why GoT's simply didn't hire those guys?  I mean, the hell?  They have so much experience doing the giant wolf thing already, and they looked great!  Looks, emotion, behavior, all of it was working great by the end.  http://www.decodedscience.com/breaking-dawn-part-2-how-did-they-do-the-special-effects-corrected/20457

 

Too much money on the dragon budget, horses, and war scenes?  Meanwhile, most of the sullied and unsullied really do miss getting the occasional inclusion of those Direwolves.  I do.

Edited June 15, 2015 by Umbelina

[MrWhyt]

Tyrion knows nothing about Meereen. He can't speak the language and he doesn't know the politics or culture.

that's what Missandei is for. He's an administrator, Daario, Grey Worm and Jorah aren't. They have skills he doesn't, he has ones they don't. No one is saying everything is going to be instantly fixed just that he's the best one to attempt the fixing.

Edited June 15, 2015 by MrWhyt

[polyhymnia]

I thought he was outstanding tonight.  That look of recognition when Brienne called him out on murdering Renly was phenomenal.  The realization that he killed not only his only child but his own brother for nothing, all revealed in a single look.

When he saw all of the horses coming from Winterfell, he had another great look.  His unspoken delivery was fantastic.  I said to my husband (an Unsullied viewer that has not hated the plot twists this season) "Oh.  So Stannis Baratheon is Richard the Third after all."

[WearyTraveler]

Tyrion knows nothing about Meereen. He can't speak the language and he doesn't know the politics or culture. He sold himself to Dany as someone who was an expert on politics in Westeros. She needed him because she couldn't possibly navigate the politics of an unfamiliar place. How the hell can he turn around and rule Meereen when he's been there for maybe two weeks?

 

Because he has Varys who comes from Essos and presumably knows a lot about the continent and Mereen?

___________________________________________

 

This was in the unsullied thread:

 

 

LOL!

Edited June 15, 2015 by WearyTraveler

[MadMouse]

What deviation? They got it a lot more back on track than they were before this episode.

I guess Stanis dying hasn't happened yet in the books, but I think we can assume it will. Other than that only thing that's new is that Varys is in a different place than he is in the books

Straight from the books:

- Jon got stabbed

- Millesandre is back in place to probably smootch Jon back to life

- Theon did the same for Sansa he did for Jane Pool in the books

- Aria is blind

- Dany met a new dothraki army in the dothraki sea

- Cersei did her walk of shame

- Sam is on his way to oldtown

- The mountain is an undead kings guard

- Wasn't Myrcella almost-dead in the books?

 

To be fair how the characters got those points is completely different and I would argue that's just as important if not more. But some of them aren't in the same place Myrcella lost an ear, Sam is hanging with Sarella the superior Sand Snake, Jaime and Brienne are about to reunite, etc. 

 

 

[DigitalCount]

The worst part of Shireen’s death is probably that none of this was even about her. Her death was meaningless to the narrative.

 

Stannis didn’t die because of her. Stannis died because of Brienne’s love for Renly. Stannis didn’t lose the battle because of her death.

 

Melisandre was unfazed by the whole thing. No real doubt or fear over her plans and visions failing her. She just left and moved on.

 

Selyse was always a minor character, left in the “mother’s love” trope once and for all so that they could have an excuse to get rid of her.

 

The one character who got to have a genuine reaction or whose story might be affected by Shireen’s death is Davos...the only character in that group D&D ever really gave a damn about anyway.

 

It’s pretty sad to think that D&D were so desperate for shock value they had to burn a little girl alive, and then didn’t even bother to write one hint of aftermath. I’m not sure if anything could better epitomize their failings as showrunners.

Um...Shireen's death cut Stannis' force in half. I feel that I can state with certainty that Stannis lost the battle because of her death. And if you call Melisandre unfazed...she's been riding the Stannis train for her entire storyline, and then she willingly abandoned him in the face of one failure after another. Furthermore, Brienne was only in a position to kill him because of the weakening of his army that, again, happened as a direct result of his burning of his daughter. So basically, of the characters you mentioned in your post, every single one of them was affected by Shireen's death and had aftermath shown.

 

I mean, this is like last week when people said Stannis' men were so blase about Shireen's burning when the show actually took the time to pan over the faces of guys looking super uncomfortable. I've been enjoying the show, and it's kind of depressing to get here and read people slagging on it, especially when those things being said aren't even accurate.

Edited June 15, 2015 by DigitalCount

[dr pepper]

Poor Cersei. Even Pycelle was too sorry for you to give your body an appraisal. But now you're down to just 2 allies, a mad scientist and a golem.

 

No, not poor Cersei. This is way less than what you have done to others, even if the show left out the death by torture part.

 

Stannis knows justice when he sees it. Finally.

 

Mel arrives at Castle Black just in time for what everyone but me suspects. If it had happened that way in the book, i would've had the same speculation. Instead i thought that Jon would do what the wildling mindrider did and merge with his wolf.

 

Arya discovers that she's been catfished by a personality franchise.

 

Dammit, Marcella "Tasted the dornishman's wife" is just a song! Never taste a dorne, you don't know what's been smeared on them.

 

Horse barbarians of the plains are a renewable resource; use them up, then get some more.

 

The Small Council of Mereene presents an all new gladiatorial extraviganza, featuring all the surviving insurgents!

 

The Winter King would like everyone to knw that his army is back in shamble mode. So by all means waste as much time as you like, there's no hurry to make plans for the defence of the continent.

 

I nominate Sam for Boy Most Likely to Light a Black Candle.

 

Wait, what was that shadow visible for an instant at the end of the episode? It's the back cover of Book 5! To the keyboard, GRRM, you've got 8 months!

[GreyBunny]

Because he has Varys who comes from Essos and presumably knows a lot about the continent and Mereen?

___________________________________________

 

This was in the unsullied thread:

 

 

LOL!

 

Nice!  They forgot Ellaria.  That poisonous c-bag should be right smack in the middle of that meme.

[Brn2bwild]

Do none of the other characters on this show remember that Dany has two other dragons living in darkness??  That was one thing I really looked forward to this episode: the freeing of Dany's other dragons.

 

Also, maybe I'm looking for too much, but did anyone think that Jon's eyes glowed, or at least brightened, during a segment of his final scene?

Edited June 15, 2015 by Brn2bwild

[dr pepper]

Too many loose threads. The only thing that is certain is that Cersei needs a bath.

 

I said i wasn't sorry for Cersei. But it must have been traumatic for Lena. I hope they were able to shoot it in one take and get her into a bath followed by a long nap in a quiet place.

[GreyBunny]

A body double was used for some of it.  That said, I hope she got a warm bath and the drink of her choice.

[placate]

Man, there is some stuff I just don't get.  I don't know if it was put there for fanservice or including stuff from TwoW but here I go:

 

-Arya stole a death from the multiple faced god?  WTF?  He is a god of death.  She originally stole 3 deaths from him by SPARING 3 lives.  He wasn't even picky, just 3 names would appease him.  Now she's killing people for the god of death and he feels cheated because she isn't nobody yet?

-Why the hell did that one Sandsnake show Bronn the poison that killed Myrcella?  This is so stupid.  Oh ya, the mom has the antidote but this stupid chick explained to me how the poison worked last episode.

-Bad pussy.  Who let this line get included in the script? 

-Trytane death march, he really did love her, she told Jamie that he didn't mind him being her father but poor Tommen is still locked in his room.

-How are we going to get Davos looking for Rickon now?

-Is this freaking book going to published anytime soon?!!!

 

Oh ya, I think Kit Harrington is full of shit.  Too much R+L=J foreshadowing and getting actors to lie to the press is too easy.  Case in point, if you've watched Grimm then you know that Juliette's character is either D-E-D or dead depending on what the actress and show runners said.  Lying to the press is so cool right now.

Edited June 15, 2015 by placate

[GreyBunny]

Looks like Mel borrowed Littlfinger's teleporter and a teleported horse since the sellswords ran off with all of the horses.

[Miles]

Tyrion knows nothing about Meereen. He can't speak the language and he doesn't know the politics or culture. He sold himself to Dany as someone who was an expert on politics in Westeros. She needed him because she couldn't possibly navigate the politics of an unfamiliar place. How the hell can he turn around and rule Meereen when he's been there for maybe two weeks?

He just demonstrated that his valyrian is actually pretty good. The languages of the free cities are actually really closely related to valyrian in the books and I'm not sure, but I think they are just flat out valyrian on the show.

To be fair how the characters got those points is completely different and I would argue that's just as important if not more.But some of them aren't in the same place Myrcella lost an ear, Sam is hanging with Sarella the superior Sand Snake, Jaime and Brienne are about to reunite, etc.

I don't think it's that important how they got there, when we are taling changes this episode and that we were.

That's also why I wasn't talking about Brienne or Sansa, because that was changed looong ago.

Sam is at the same place he was in the books, on his way to oldtown. He just isn't as far along as most other characters. But neither is Aria and their storylines are the most likely to cross.

-Arya stole a death from the multiple faced god? WTF? He is a god of death. She originally stole 3 deaths from him by SPARING 3 lives. He wasn't even picky, just 3 names would appease him. Now she's killing people for the god of death and he feels cheated because she isn't nobody yet?

Well, they might just be fucking with her and this is somehow part of her training. At least that's what I hope...

[Pete Martell]

Um...Shireen's death cut Stannis' force in half. I feel that I can state with certainty that Stannis lost the battle because of her death. And if you call Melisandre unfazed...she's been riding the Stannis train for her entire storyline, and then she willingly abandoned him in the face of one failure after another. Furthermore, Brienne was only in a position to kill him because of the weakening of his army that, again, happened as a direct result of his burning of his daughter. So basically, of the characters you mentioned in your post, every single one of them was affected by Shireen's death and had aftermath shown.

 

Ramsay Stu and his 20 magical men halved Stannis' forces. They were already weakened and disoriented before Shireen was sacrificed. This led to her death, then the loss of the battle, and Stannis being killed by Brienne. Brienne making it all about Renly just undercut Shireen's death even more for me, especially since I kept remembering the books, where he said terrible things about Shireen, yet on here is dredged back up after years dead mostly just so we can, I guess, be reminded of Brienne's honor in lieu of her actually having a purpose on the show. 

 

I've felt like Melisandre has played the angles more than she's ridden the Stannis train. It didn't work out, so she left. Slightly shaken up, but pretty much the same as usual.

 

A young girl was burned alive and I mostly remember a few rushed, lackluster scenes (with Selyse having such a cheap death that I nearly flipped off the screen). I guess I can say it was better aftermath than Oberyn's death, which amounted to his daughter getting her breasts out and talking about her lady garden, but I think a show that had an idea of death beyond shock value would have taken more care and respect in how to handle this type of material.

Edited June 15, 2015 by Pete Martell

[scrb]

On the behind the Episode thing, they said Ollies stab was the most significant one. So it sounds like Jon was killed for bringing the wildlings in.

But did Jon share with the rest of the Night Watch what happened in Hardhome and how dire their situation was? You would think that would have preoccupied them more than any thought of mutiny.

For that matter, were any of the ones who stabbed him among those who voted him as commander? They're going to make him leader (and wasn't it a one sided vote?) and the first decision he makes that they don't like, they're going to kill him?

No fear of retribution?

[Andromeda]

that's what Missandei is for. He's an administrator, Daario, Grey Worm and Jorah aren't. They have skills he doesn't, he has ones they don't. No one is saying everything is going to instantly fixed just that he's the best one to attempt the fixing.

It really was totally logical. Tyrion going off to find Dany would have been a waste of his talents. The city needs an administrator, and Tyrion is even better than Dany (probably by a lot!) for that role. Now that Varys is back in town, they'll figure everything out and have it running smoothly by the time Dany comes back or is found. Grey Worm will manage the Army, Missandei will be the interpreter (her job when Dany first hired her) and royal communicator. It's a good arrangement.

 

I just rewatched, and Brienne definitely killed Stannis. There was no pulling back on that sword swing -- she was past the point of pulling it.

[AGuyToo]

A lot of things about this episode irritated/annoyed/angered me, but one small thing stood out:

 

Brienne had one job. She had ONE JOB!!! She was supposed to wait for the candle in the Broken Tower. But D&D set it up so that she broke her vigil mere seconds before the candle appeared.

 

What the hell? As a storytelling device, that is so cheap and stupid. As soon as I saw Brienne glance at the tower, I knew that moments after she turned away the candle would appear. I knew that because I've watched lots of bad TV.

 

Presumably D&D have watched lots of TV too (both good and bad) and I'm astounded they went for that device.

 

 

[WearyTraveler]

I just rewatched, and Brienne definitely killed Stannis. There was no pulling back on that sword swing -- she was past the point of pulling it.

 

Playing Devil's advocate, she could just land the blow on the tree he was leaning on, right above his head.

[Pete Martell]

On the behind the Episode thing, they said Ollies stab was the most significant one. So it sounds like Jon was killed for bringing the wildlings in.

But did Jon share with the rest of the Night Watch what happened in Hardhome and how dire their situation was? You would think that would have preoccupied them more than any thought of mutiny.

For that matter, were any of the ones who stabbed him among those who voted him as commander? They're going to make him leader (and wasn't it a one sided vote?) and the first decision he makes that they don't like, they're going to kill him?

No fear of retribution?

 

The NW is almost always written like a Saved by the Bell scene where Slater is tempted to shove Zack into a locker. Interchangeable pettiness and squabbling with no interest in the outside world. That's one of the reasons last week's scenes rankled me. It showed me just how unseriously I should take the threat beyond the Wall - it's meaningless compared to more cafeteria squabbles.

 

I also wonder if the NW is going to end up being slaughtered, aside from Sam and maybe Edd, and they're writing it this way so that we won't care.

[dr pepper]

 

What did Dany drop on the ground as she was being surrounded by the riders?

 

 

A ring. I don't know the significance.

 

Obviously she dropped it just in case her boyfriend and ex-non-boyfriend come this way, they'll know she was here. You know, in case they miss the nest of chared bones and horse tracks.

[Pete Martell]

I know that Brienne was only gone briefly and waited a long time, so I'm not going to criticize her, but it bothered me somewhat that after all the talk of honor and duty to Catelyn and Catelyn's wishes, they pointedly had Brienne prioritize Renly and his memory when it came down to it. It just felt like another reminder of where a female character's mind is going to go when the chips are down.

[WearyTraveler]

I know that Brienne was only gone briefly and waited a long time, so I'm not going to criticize her, but it bothered me somewhat that after all the talk of honor and duty to Catelyn and Catelyn's wishes, they pointedly had Brienne prioritize Renly and his memory when it came down to it. It just felt like another reminder of where a female character's mind is going to go when the chips are down.

 

Or, you know, as they say in logistics management, FIFO (First In, First Out).  She swore a vow to Renly first, and Sansa didn't signal her for days and days on end.  

 

I suspect she's caught in Westerosi crazy morals that Jaime outlined so well at the pools: vows upon vows, which ones do you keep? how do you prioritize?

Edited June 15, 2015 by WearyTraveler

[dr pepper]

So what was the point of Dorne this season again? Anyone? And what the hell was that line from Tyene.

 

 

"You want a good girl. But you need a bad [short word for female anatomy]!"

I knew Myrcella was a goner after that tender scene with Jaime.

 

I called it at the kiss on the dock, but then when nothing happened for a while, i thought, oh, false alarm. Alas, i forgot the legendary skill of dronish pharmacologists, and their precise control of reaction times.

[Pete Martell]

Or, you know, as they say in logistics management, FIFO (First In, First Out).  She swore a vow to Renly first, and Sansa didn't signal her for days and days on end.  

 

I suspect she's caught in Westerosi crazy morals that Jaime outlined so well at the pools: vows upon vows, which ones do you keep? how do you prioritize?

 

I don't know how she would prioritize, but it felt like the show didn't even really try to make a dilemma. Sansa didn't signal, Sansa had told her to stay away...while Renly was this saintly figure who had been kind to her and helped protect her from ridicule. It felt like more of female characters being put into limited narratives.

[InsertWordHere]

I just had a horrible thought. Littlefinger is supposedly riding North with a rested army and the Iron Throne's backing to take Winterfell, and there's no Stannis army to stop him. I mean, if he kills the Boltons, good for him, but I'd rather he keeps his paws off Winterfell and I hope Sansa and Theon are far away by then.

[dr pepper]

And why didn't the show Stannis' death blow? He better be dead - I don't want anymore of his plot.

 

 

In a more standard drama, they'd revisit that scene later and show that at the last moment, a flay happy Bolton trooper showed up to interfere with that cozy conversation, so Brienne kills him instead. Then she decides that Stannis has shown proper contrition, so she charges him, under the customs of chivalry, to forswear his claim to the throne. He does, and becomes her follower. And with his commander's talent, he manages to do what she couldn't train Pod to be a decent fighter. Then the three of them become masked avengers, cleaning up the riverlands of wandering soldiers turned bandits, and ending each episode with some good natured humor and a big slice of hot pie.

 

But this is not a more standard drama.

Edited June 15, 2015 by dr pepper

[MadMouse]

 

In a more standard drama, they'd revisit that scene later and show that at the last moment, a flay happy Bolton trooper showed up to interfere with that cozy conversation, so Brienne kills him instead. Then she decides that Stannis has shown proper condition, so she charges him, under the customs of chivalry, to forswear his claim to the throne. He does, and becomes her follower. And with his commander's talent, he manages to do what she couldn't train Pod to be a decent fighter. Then the three of them become masked avengers, cleaning up the riverlands of wandering soldiers turned bandits, and ending each episode with some good natured humor and a big slice of hot pie.

 

But this is not a more standard drama.

 

Brienne takes over the role LSH in a role reversal scene from the books. Stannis wants to the join the NW, Pod finds Sansa and Theon. They make their way to the Wall while being hunted by Ramsay. At molestown (boob quota) they run into Tormund who's angry because of the death of Jon. Sansa kissed by fire reveals herself as his sister and rallys the Wildings to her side. Stannis leads them against the NW and kills the newly elected LC Thorne. Sansa, Davos and Brienne go off to find Rickon or Bran. Stannis and Theon take the black. The WW attacks, Mel realizes Jon is the true savior and kills Stannis for his Kings Blood. She resurrects Jon with ritual sex (boob quota again).

[Oscirus]

Seriously, I want to hear from all the people who were stepping up and saying that storyline was good for Sansa's character.

She freed herself from her confinement, waited as long as possible to get rescued using the agreed upon plan and then faced down her attacker who had a weapon pointed at her thereby causing Theon to snap out of his Reek funk. What more do you want from her? I guess she could've taught herself how to fight while in confinement then laid down a can of whoop ass on the Bolton camp and took it over. But that wouldn't have been realistic.

 

I still wonder why Tyrion is capable of leading Meereen. I guess there's no one else...and we need more thrilling scenes of Tyrion getting drunk and groping naked women.

Who else in that group was more qualified then Tyrion to lead Mereen in Dany's absence? I also don't think he's been whoremongering since season one.

 

Jon has a wolf named ghost and that interview only said he was gone for next season.

The White Walkers just picked up a whole lotta wights. I doubt Stannis's army was burned.

Arya wasn't punished for stealing from the death god. She was punished for using her skills to settle old vendettas. She's supposed to be nobody, not Arya Stark.

[ElizaD]

Sam and Gilly are the only happy people in Westeros.

 

Headey was great. That was probably the best plot of a bad episode. The mob was horrifying yet completely believable.

 

The last Tyrell appearances were in 3x08, 4x06 and 5x07. Season 2, when they appeared in 2x10, was the only time they didn't fade from view.

 

Dany drops her ring, because that will be a better clue than the charred bones. I expect we'll see someone pick it up next season.

 

Oh wow, Sansa is Jeyne Poole, except she opened a door! What a way to treat a POV character. Two of them, actually. When it was clear from interviews that Sansa would be raped, I thought it was messy to have her become a prop in Theon's plot, but in the end things turned out to be even worse. The show cut everything that made the plot good, sidelined Theon, made Sansa slightly more important than Theon but a complete idiot, and turned Ramsay into a superhuman, infallible prodigy who never fails: he's Joffrey with worse acting and without the constraints and vulnerabilities that made Joffrey fun to watch. Unlike Ramsay, Joffrey wasn't going to win all the bloody time and there was actual tension and wit in his scenes. Ramsay just commits one horrible act after another: he's a super commander who defeats Stannis, a shirtless badass who sends Yara running, and a wonderful lover who makes Myranda so jealous she wants to kill his rape victim for having caught his eye.

 

"You want a good girl. But you need a bad [short word for female anatomy]!"

 

The porn parody can quote actual show dialogue now.

 

Ellaria must be suicidal. That's a Dornish ship, right? Why wouldn't they turn back after Myrcella's death instead of taking Trystane to KL where he's likely to be killed? And Jaime, damn. Two children poisoned right in front of him. He and Brienne have been turned into incompetent bodyguards. Brienne fails Renly and abandons Sansa to pursue revenge; Jaime fails Joffrey and Myrcella.

[dr pepper]

Dorne - really? The best thing about this will be watching Cersei go nuts next season. Tristane better hide.

 

 

I think the way the story has been going, Jaime would go into a blind rage, smash Tris's head in with his golden hand, and throw him overboard.

[Happy Harpy]

It's weird, Qyburn seems to truly care and be loyal to Cersei as a person and not only as the Queen or as his guinea pigs purveyor...and I just realized that one of the grand two heartwarming moments of the episode (and the only one not ending with a teenager pissing blood) was Qyburn being gentle and supportive with Cersei after her walk. Oy.

[Dewey Decimate]

I've been enjoying the show, and it's kind of depressing to get here and read people slagging on it, especially when those things being said aren't even accurate.

I get bummed too - clearly I'm too attached, to feel sad when the show and/or books get so criticized! I've been loving the show (mostly), and loving the books (mostly). But a difference of opinion is what makes the world go 'round. Warning, though: I also loved Lost, through and through. (Except for Nikki and Paolo. That travesty will never be forgiven.) So maybe I'm just a contrarian.

 

I'm hoping a Missandei-Grey Worm-Tyrion polyamorous/sexual surrogate relationship is in the works. She'll get balls, intelligence, compassion, and bravery, all in just two guys!

 

Yay for Hot-hraki return. Just the back shot of some tan warrior with a long braid sets my heart a-flutter. RIP, sex-on-a-stallion Khal Drogo. And I was vastly relieved to realize (at least I think) that Drogon was just resting up after a charred snack. Licking his wounds was FUCKING ADORABLE.

 

I think when Ellaria tossed aside the poison-wipe hankie it was supposed to go into the sea. I was reminded of Job Bluth trying to toss an envelope into the ocean and couldn't help cracking up. (I'm grateful for any laughs I can get from this show.)

 

LH had a body double for the walk scene? Seriously, no sarcasm, I had no idea. I thought it looked great* (despite the excessive and redundant nudity) and actually thought she did an excellent job of conveying humility and embarrassment with a smidge of queenly pride with her face and body. Guess only the former was attributable to her!

*But then I also thought the Hardhome wight battle looked fucking fantastic. As a babe weaned on classic Ray Harryhausen, I thought the combo of CGI, make-up, actors, and puppets were fantastic. And Jason battling the skeletons still creeps me out. Guess I'm an old fogey!

 

Loved Qyburn swooping in to chivalrously cover Cersei. And Pycelle's petty little "serves ya right!" eye twitch. Even enjoyed FrankenGregor as the newest Kingsguard. Pretty sad times when I'm almost rooting for a - literally - horrific monster to take some revenge.

 

Biggest loser from this season: religion. Burning of a little girl for a god. "Confess/shame" puppet bitch. Persecution based on sexual preference. The "good" people of KL hurling vile invectives and offal at a (supposed) penitent. Religious strong arms beating said "good" people in their faces with blackjacks. Many-faced god punishing a young lady who (imo) serves justice to a deserving recipient. Unless Bran pulls out some holy Treebeard goodness next season, I will be further driven to atheism.

[dr pepper]

 If they stuck to what was on the page they would have needed another 15 - 20 episodes

 

And i would be cool with that.

[WearyTraveler]

IWarning, though: I also loved Lost, through and through. (Except for Nikki and Paolo. That travesty will never be forgiven.) So maybe I'm just a contrarian.

 

 You're not alone! Namaste!

 

And i would be cool with that.

 

HBO wouldn't, though.  Money is not an infinite resource.

[ulkis]

The Sansa door thing is reminding me of Leonardo Da Vinci's quote from Ever After:

"You're a genius!"

"Yes - I'll go down in history, as the man who opened a door!"

I don't whether lying to the press is an in thing right now but I don't think they should be obliged to reveal their plots either anyway. I thought they didn't give them good enough reason to kill Jon though. It reminded me of the end of the movie Half-Blood Prince where Snape says he's the prince but it lost any impact because they didn't go into any detail about it. This episode wasn't quite as bad but it would have been way better to have had Jon say he was leaving for Winterfell.

[Haleth]

Oh, come on.  There is no way Jon is done, no matter what D&D or Kit say.  The writers created a convoluted way to get Mel back to Castle Black just in time.  Both book and show made it clear that a resurrection is possible if done right (Dondarion).  LSH was left out to make Jon's revival more dramatic.  There are far too many loose threads regarding parentage, prophesies, and a needed hero that point to Jon.  Killing him is how he gets out of his NW vows so he can pursue his own agenda.  I won't believe he's gone until we see his burned body.  (I doubt he'll warg in the show, D&D have apparently decided only Bran can warg.)

 

For that matter I bet Stannis is still around too.  Brienne didn't kill him after all.  Would they cheat Dillane out of a juicy death scene?

 

Lena was fabulous during the walk, whether it was her body or not.  Her rising panic was palpable.  I loved Sansa's confrontation with Miranda.  How great will be the party of Sansa, Brienne, Pod, Theon, (and Stannis?) next season?  Dany and Drogon were great.  She met up with the Dothraki pretty quickly.  With a gazillion horses running around how likely is it that her ring will be squashed into the earth?  Naww, Jorah and Daario will find it.  I was surprised D&D started the Blind Beth storyline for Arya.

 

The only part I absolutely hated was Dorne.  The show went to a lot of trouble to get well known actors and an unprecedented setting.  So the whole point was to get Myrcella dead?  What a waste of time. 

Edited June 15, 2015 by Haleth

[Advance35]

I am filth.  Apparently.

I wouldn't have been sad if they flayed her.  Cersei is horrible, and BFD, she was embarrassed for a couple of minutes.

 

May I join you?   I bet Ned, Robb, Catelyn all would have preferred that to the ending they met.   And you can't blame the people of Kings Landing, look at how Cersei has treated them throughout the run of the show.   She's happily had them starved and brutalized.   She didn't rain in her maniac of a son, I bet the Mother's of those bastards that were slaughtered would have taken that walk over what happened to their lives because of Joffrey and Cersei.    Karma is Karma.   You sometimes get away with horrible things only to have something unrelatedly horrible happen to you.

 

And yeah, Sansa opened a door with a corkscrew -who says it's the first time she tried to use it to open her door? She had it for weeks, probably (still the vague timeline). That's great, and I'm not ironic. Again, she doesn't have the resources of a Brienne, an Arya, and Olenna...and it doesn't matter to me. It doesn't matter what she did, what matters is that she did it. Sansa in KL would never have dared...actually, she never did. But here she was alone, with no one to rely on, in the most horrible situation she ever was and she took a chance, she was instrumental in her own escape if it succeeds so yes, as far as I'm concerned, it's empowerment. She's just a very young woman, who was blessed/cursed with extraordinary beauty, but is ordinary about everything else and only recently learned to use her brain. But now she's doing her best and for me, it's more than enough.

I'm afraid that people expecting a "legendary" Sansa might be as disappointed as those who waited for "legendary" Stannis (or as those of us, maybe, who expect Jon to survive? You never know). Personally, I like very much the Sansa I get this season, because she faces her destiny or her doom by herself.

 

ICAM.  I thought she was awesome.   Some people do go fetal when faced with overwelming adversity.  Sansa is/was nothing but a pampered, sheltered, cossetted, debutante raised to smile and be pretty.   Her Father and Mother taught her all the coping mechanism's and life lessons one would expect bestowed on a fabrege egg.   Yet she doesn't go completely fetal.  She's going to continue to do whatever she can think of to survive.   Things are never in her favor but she never gives up.   She's inwardly a very strong individual lMO.

 

She freed herself from her confinement, waited as long as possible to get rescued using the agreed upon plan and then faced down her attacker who had a weapon pointed at her thereby causing Theon to snap out of his Reek funk. What more do you want from her? I guess she could've taught herself how to fight while in confinement then laid down a can of whoop ass on the Bolton camp and took it over. But that wouldn't have been realistic.

 

Don't  you know?  She should be cooking up machiavelli plans that would make Varys and LF bow their heads and say "My Queen."    She get's crap for being passive, I call it careful.   Ned took actions, So did Robb, Catelyn, Joffrey, Tywin, Lyssa, John Arryn, Jon Snow, Stannis, I'd say she's doing better than any of the mentioned IMO.   The Best Revenge can be to outlive everyone IMO.

Edited June 15, 2015 by Advance35

[ACW]

Kit Harrington is John Snow. He knows nothing.

[benteen]

I think D&D are very good at adapting books, but I think a lot of critics have overpraised them vs GRRM. Once GRRM started losing the story, I knew that sooner or later D&D would too. While I liked some changes, like Arya forming a familial bond with Hot Pie and Gendry, and Gendry being less of a jerk, there is a lot of shit where they dropped the ball.

I miss Bran and the Reed kids. I found Meera completely charming.

 

Agreed about overpraising GRRM.  It's his 15 years of underwhelming writing and writers block that has led to this current predicament.

[proserpina65]

Okay, well, that happened.

 

What was the point of the Dorne clusterfuck?  Honestly, they took the best storyline from Feast (Jaime's) and did THAT with it?  Why?  Really, I want to know, 'cause damned if I can figure it out from what I watched this season.  Although I will give them credit for doing the walk of shame really well.  I still felt no sympathy for Cersei (like I've said before, bitch is reaping what she sowed) but Lena Headey did sell the hell out of that scene.  I really got the sense that Cersei had no idea until then how much the people of Kings Landing hated her.

 

I've had my issues with D&D's deviations from the books over the first 4 seasons, but I've tried to keep an open mind about them.  But this season was just . . . well, 'lame' is the word that springs to mind.  There was one truly magnificent stand-out episode (Hardhome), one very good, if terribly disturbing, one (The Dance of Dragons), and a few good scenes here and there (particularly that journey through old Valyria).  Other than that, this season has been a mess, and not a good hot one either.  Usually after the season finale, I feel bereft, like "how am I going to wait until next spring for more?!?!?" but after last night, I was mostly just angry at how badly the producers and writers screwed up season 5.  I'm not sure I'm even going to bother with next season.

[proserpina65]

Oh, and the Lipstick of Doom?  I knew what would happen the minute Ellaria kissed Myrcella goodbye, because I, too, have seen the Our Mrs. Reynolds episode of Firefly.  Weaksauce, really weak - although it may be GRRM's fault, not the producers'; when the next book comes out sometime in 2025, we might find out.

[Sarah D. Bunting]

How do you end a season of Game Of Thrones? By killing off many, many characters! There's also a dragon; Monty Ashley has more! http://previously.tv/game-of-thrones/season-ending-massacre/