General True Crime Shows

[hoosiermom]

I never watch anything without an ending (person found,killer caught) and now I may regret that with this development.

[auntjess]

39 minutes ago, riley702 said:

Wow! I am astonished - I thought there was no way he could be alive and not still be committing crimes!

This is what I'm most curious about.  There are a lot of old crimes solved with DNA, but have any known serial killers been known to alive, but retired?

[Mannahatta]

16 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Recall how on that last 3 segment special, they said that when he was almost caught, he would disappear....even with police all around!  I guess so.  I wonder if he had a uniform in his bag or just pulled out his badge to fade into the background.  There were many theories that he was into real estate. I wonder if that is true. I had leaned towards him being a utility person, since he seemed to know so many details about the personal lives of people in the homes.  I thought he was listening in on their phone calls.  Can't wait to find out many details.  Now THIS will make for a great new SPECIAL.  

He was only a police officer from 1973 to 1976 so your utility worker theory may prove to be true.

As happy as I am that this monster has been caught - and his arrest is a great tribute to all the people who never gave up - I'm so angry at the idea that he had been married, had children, owned a home, presumably had once worked- in other words - he was just going about his life all these years. But I guess it's better late than never.

[galleta]

45 minutes ago, riley702 said:

Wow! I am astonished - I thought there was no way he could be alive and not still be committing crimes!

I haven't been paying that a much attention to the recent shows because I thought there was no way he was going to be caught after all this time. I was SHOCKED at the headlines. I feel that McNamara helped from above. 

I saw a interview with a neighbor who said that DeAngelo raised his 3 daughters by himself. That chilled me to the bone to think what they probably went through. 

[SunnyBeBe]

Yeah, I hate to make such a big deal about this monster, because he is a piece of garbage, but, it's just so interesting from an investigative viewpoint to see how all the pieces fit together.  I hope he's not getting a big head over this.  He was pretty proud and cocky with his victims.  I want him to get nothing positive from this process.  A full confession would be awesome, but, he won't likely do that.  

[Lovecat]

15 hours ago, Mannahatta said:

I haven't read Michelle McNamara's book. Did she give clues about a specific suspect?

I haven't read it either, but this NYT article says, "At a news conference held by law enforcement agencies to announce the arrest, an official said that the book “kept interest and tips coming in” and kept the case in the public eye, but noted that information from the book hadn’t led directly to Mr. DeAngelo’s arrest."

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/25/books/michelle-mcnamara-patton-oswalt.html

I have to note as well that I appreciate how the NYT titled the article "Michelle McNamara Died Pursuing the Golden State Killer. Her Husband, Patton Oswalt, Has Questions for Him."  Too often she is primarily identified as "Patton Oswald's wife" and secondly with her own name and profession.

[funky-rat]

2 hours ago, Lovecat said:

I have to note as well that I appreciate how the NYT titled the article "Michelle McNamara Died Pursuing the Golden State Killer. Her Husband, Patton Oswalt, Has Questions for Him."  Too often she is primarily identified as "Patton Oswald's wife" and secondly with her own name and profession.

Because they think it will generate more interest that way (by naming Patton first).  I have this argument with friends I know who work in the news field.  I get so sick of "This mom was murdered!!".  I don't give a flip if she was a mom or not.  All humans have value.  Irritates the tar out of me.

[Razzberry]

18 hours ago, Mannahatta said:

I haven't read Michelle McNamara's book. Did she give clues about a specific suspect?

No.  I was disappointed in how little information was actually in the book, though what was there was very well written, it seemed more about her than the GSK.  Hunting a Psychopath by Detective Richard Shelby was more complete. 

I'm so glad that this SOB lived to face the consequences.  That's him with the mustache.

Edited April 26, 2018 by Razzberry

[SunnyBeBe]

From what I've heard it was the major Task Force that was created 2 years ago that got it going. 

[Brattinella]

O/T (but it is true crime) Bill Cosby found Guilty!

[SunnyBeBe]

1 hour ago, Brattinella said:

O/T (but it is true crime) Bill Cosby found Guilty!

This is turning out to be a great week for justice. Can't wait to see what comes down tomorrow. 

[auntjess]

They used an ancestry/DNA search.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2018/04/26/authorities-begin-racking-up-cases-against-golden-state-killer-suspect-ex-cop-turned-mechanic/?utm_term=.4e88ba69cd79

[tobeannounced]

This is so interesting because I had wondered before if they could get a familial match through Ancestry or one of those type services. It's been said they've been very resistant to cooperating with police, which is understandable. Could have a chilling effect on people submitting their DNA. But now I'm thinking, what's stopping police from just submitting a suspect's DNA sample as if it were an individual customer? Can't wait to hear more details!

Edited April 27, 2018 by tobeannounced

[auntjess]

ID has something tonight, 4/27, a People mag. thing on identifying the killer.
The story said it wasn't Ancestry.com or 23andme.com, unless they didn't know.
I'd wondered on this an other cases, about those DNA tests where they can usually get the physical description.
 

[bubbls]

On 4/25/2018 at 5:47 PM, Mannahatta said:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5656217/Suspected-Golden-State-Killer-responsible-12-homicides-50-rapes-ARRESTED.html

Apparently he wasn't exactly flying under the radar as at least some of the neighbors were creeped out by his ticking time bomb demeanor. It really makes one wonder what he's been up to all these years and how the people closest to him never suspected him. Apparently he had been married and divorced, and has 3 adult daughters. I wonder if he had given any of them any of the so-called trophies he had stolen - some valuable, some just odd. Not just jewelry but items like a full set of dishes.

I haven't read Michelle McNamara's book. Did she give clues about a specific suspect?

No, but I thought it was a very good book. She was a good writer in my opinion, and I’d have read other books if she’d lived to write them. If you want a fact-filled chronological account read Kat Winters’ book; Casefiles of the East Area Rapist/Golden State Killer. It’s kind of an emotionally difficult read because he was so very prolific. It was oppressive reading rape after rape after rape after rape, page after page, victim after victim, and I had to skip around to other sections for relief. But it’s chock full of details and facts presented in order. 

I haven’t read the other books yet, but Michelle’s and Kat’s books compliment each other very well. You’ll get an emotional tour and a factual tour. 

It’s been days. I’m still pumped!!!

[Josette]

1 hour ago, auntjess said:

ID has something tonight, 4/27, a People mag. thing on identifying the killer.
The story said it wasn't Ancestry.com or 23andme.com, unless they didn't know.
I'd wondered on this an other cases, about those DNA tests where they can usually get the physical description.

 I think it's a repeat of a previous episode on the GSK, but maybe with some updated material.  I know they're touting it as new.

The website used for the DNA search was GEDmatch.com, a free site. 

 

Here's an interview with Paul Holes discussing how he did the search.

Edited April 27, 2018 by Josette
added a link

[auntjess]

I think the ID show may be updated.
https://www.investigationdiscovery.com/tv-shows/people-magazine-investigates/

From ID's Facebook page, "

Investigation Discovery

 

Law Enforcement have finally located and apprehended the suspected serial murderer who's held the nation in a grip of paralyzing fear since the 1970s.

Join us tonight at 10/9c.

Edited April 27, 2018 by auntjess

[walnutqueen]

We probably won't be getting much new information so soon after the arrest, but I'll still be watching, because it is just so damned satisfying to finally have a viable suspect.  There are SO many people whose lives have been impacted by these crimes; to know that they might finally get a small measure of satisfaction, or even a sense of peace knowing they no longer need to fear THIS particular monster, is a very good thing.  I will be watching, with a semblance of pleasure, instead of the usual frustration.

Just watched Marcia Clark Investigates the Rebecca Zahau "suicide".  I am ever so glad she outlined all the evidence that convinced the jury in the civil trial to award the Zahau family damages, and that the San Diego police are finally being shamed into "looking in to the case" again.

[atlantaloves]

IN RE: THE REBECCA ZAHAU SUICIDE.....THAT WAS A GREAT SHOW. Oh man Marcia Clark IS ON TOP OF IT.....that gal was murdered....I love that the pathologist who looked at the evidence again said what I have been saying forever, no woman would ever kill herself and be naked when she did it. Period. It just doesn't happen, EVER, or those rope knots either. What was wrong with those stupid police people, oh yeah, the killer WAS RICH. They just wanted it to go away. Suicide my tits, good for her family. Thank you Marcia! 

[walnutqueen]

53 minutes ago, Midnight Sun said:

Joseph James DeAngelo, suspected Golden State Killer, arrived in court today sitting in a wheelchair. Trying to garner sympathy, asshole? He should be confined to a chair, one that emits electric currents.

Hee!!!  You know I could imagine much more torturous wheelchairs than ones that just administer a zappo, eh?!  ;-)

[SunnyBeBe]

On 4/27/2018 at 8:16 AM, tobeannounced said:

This is so interesting because I had wondered before if they could get a familial match through Ancestry or one of those type services. It's been said they've been very resistant to cooperating with police, which is understandable. Could have a chilling effect on people submitting their DNA. But now I'm thinking, what's stopping police from just submitting a suspect's DNA sample as if it were an individual customer? Can't wait to hear more details!

Maybe, law enforcement could work with scientists to do this, but, with Ancestry, they send you a small container that you have to deposit your own saliva, actually a fair amount. Then you mail it back. I'm not sure how they could send the suspects's back in that fashion, since, it's in a different form, but, maybe, they figured out a way. 

[Mannahatta]

14 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Maybe, law enforcement could work with scientists to do this, but, with Ancestry, they send you a small container that you have to deposit your own saliva, actually a fair amount. Then you mail it back. I'm not sure how they could send the suspects's back in that fashion, since, it's in a different form, but, maybe, they figured out a way. 

I was confused by the initial reporting until I read this article: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/27/us/golden-state-killer-case-joseph-deangelo.html?action=click&contentCollection=Health&module=RelatedCoverage&region=Marginalia&pgtype=article    

Apparently, the site that the detectives used is called GEDmatch. People don't send them an actual DNA sample. Instead they upload their genetic profile to the website. (But, of course, this profile has to be obtained by first sending their actual DNA sample for testing to other sites such as ancestry.com, etc.) GEDmatch, which is free and oddly enough operates out of a private house, just provides people with an additional means to put out their DNA info into cyberspace with the goal of finding relatives - close or distant. (Be careful what you wish for!) So the detectives made up a name, submitted the DNA test results (obtained from a well-preserved sample from a 1980 murder), and found someone who shared enough of the GSK's DNA profile to be considered a relative. What followed was good old-fashioned, time-consuming, labor-intensive detective work. Pretty amazing. Now if they could just find the Zodiac killer....

Edited April 29, 2018 by Mannahatta

[Brattinella]

3 hours ago, Mannahatta said:

So the detectives made up a name, submitted the DNA test results (obtained from a well-preserved sample from a 1980 murder), and found someone who shared enough of the GSK's DNA profile to be considered a relative. What followed was good old-fashioned, time-consuming, labor-intensive detective work. Pretty amazing. Now if they could just find the Zodiac killer....

That really doesn't sound like a legitimate way to make their case.  With a good attorney, that might get tossed and they are screwed.

[kathyk24]

Did anyone see the Oxygen special on the Turpin family? I thought it was excellent. They interviewed members of Louise's family and it was heartbreaking how close the kids came to being rescued. When the family lived in Texas one of the girls escaped and a lady found her and brought her home. If they had notified the authorities things would have been so different.

[tobeannounced]

9 hours ago, Brattinella said:

That really doesn't sound like a legitimate way to make their case.  With a good attorney, that might get tossed and they are screwed.

From what I understand, it just helped them narrow their search, and the legally-collected discarded DNA from the suspect confirmed it 100 percent.

[auntjess]

Can't find the quote now, but one of the many articles on the DNA said something to the effect of "how would you feel if your DNA submission, led to one of your relatives being convicted of serious crime?"
I would be absolutely OK with that.  They aren't doing DNA checks for shoplifting, or even car theft, but for serious crimes.

[bubbls]

10 hours ago, auntjess said:

Can't find the quote now, but one of the many articles on the DNA said something to the effect of "how would you feel if your DNA submission, led to one of your relatives being convicted of serious crime?"
I would be absolutely OK with that.  They aren't doing DNA checks for shoplifting, or even car theft, but for serious crimes.

Exactly! Yeesh! If people have concerns about going to prison here’s a thought.....don’t commit crimes! I know, I know, it’s a crazy idea. I like to think outside the box. I’m a genius. I can’t help it. 

[SunnyBeBe]

On 4/27/2018 at 5:47 PM, atlantaloves said:

IN RE: THE REBECCA ZAHAU SUICIDE.....THAT WAS A GREAT SHOW. Oh man Marcia Clark IS ON TOP OF IT.....that gal was murdered....I love that the pathologist who looked at the evidence again said what I have been saying forever, no woman would ever kill herself and be naked when she did it. Period. It just doesn't happen, EVER, or those rope knots either. What was wrong with those stupid police people, oh yeah, the killer WAS RICH. They just wanted it to go away. Suicide my tits, good for her family. Thank you Marcia! 

So true.  But, what is equally infuriating about this case is that law enforcement seemed to side with the murderer.  WHY did law enforcement cover this crime up and refuse to admit it was a murder.  I would have to explore collusion on their part.  But, WHY? The civil trial found the homeowner's brother liable for the murder.  So, I'm just trying to figure out why he was protected by police. 

[walnutqueen]

5 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

So true.  But, what is equally infuriating about this case is that law enforcement seemed to side with the murderer.  WHY did law enforcement cover this crime up and refuse to admit it was a murder.  I would have to explore collusion on their part.  But, WHY? The civil trial found the homeowner's brother liable for the murder.  So, I'm just trying to figure out why he was protected by police. 

Rich & famous family?   check

Historic and famous mansion?  check

San Diego Police Department?  check

I could go on ...

[auntjess]

More on the Golden State killer's DNA search.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/public-safety/to-find-alleged-golden-state-killer-investigators-first-found-his-great-great-great-grandparents/2018/04/30/3c865fe7-dfcc-4a0e-b6b2-0bec548d501f_story.html?utm_term=.56683d5098e2

[SunnyBeBe]

Last weekend there was a show about the work Michelle McNamara did for her book and how she wrote a letter in it to the killer taunting him of when the police finally figure it out and come after him. She says to him,  You will be in your house, the police approach up the walk to GET YOU! You are now old and weak and can't flee anymore.  Oh, I can't recall the exact words, but, IT ACTUALLY HAPPENED THAT WAY!  I am getting that book. 

Edited May 2, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[KellsBells]

I read two interesting articles this morning about the GSK DNA search. This one talks about how investigators initially targeted an Oregon man: https://www.cnbc.com/2018/04/28/the-associated-press-apnewsbreak-serial-killer-search-led-to-wrong-man-in-2017.html

This one fleshes out that misidentified man's daughter's role in helping the investigation: https://apnews.com/0b5432fb50624e199a1514c9ad36a4d9

[KellsBells]

Interesting coincidence: This morning I watched Saturday's 48 Hours about the guy who (accidentally?) shot his wife from the back seat. I'd never heard of the story, so it held my interest. Then, I turned on my TV at lunch today and the same story that I'd just seen this morning was on. There were additional details, like that he was allegedly having an affair or getting massages or something, but I thought it was kind of weird to get the same story twice. Also, Chris Hansen is looking a bit chubby. 

[SunnyBeBe]

Yeah, I saw that one about the man who claims he accidentally shot his wife in the car....so bizarre.  I can't recall if he claimed to be drinking or not.  Even drunk, that would be hard to swallow. It just goes to show how a spouse will kill you in a heartbeat.  Twenty-some years of marriage means nothing when it comes to the cash.  lol  

Edited May 2, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[KellsBells]

1 hour ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Yeah, I saw that one about the man who claims he accidentally shot his wife in the car....so bizarre.  I can't recall if he claimed to be drinking or not.  Even drunk, that would be hard to swallow. It just goes to show how a spouse will kill you in a heartbeat.  Twenty-some years of marriage means nothing when it comes to the cash.  lol  

I've been married more than 35 years and if my hubby shot me he'd be up a creek -- he doesn't know any of our passwords. 

[SunnyBeBe]

On 4/29/2018 at 1:14 AM, kathyk24 said:

Did anyone see the Oxygen special on the Turpin family? I thought it was excellent. They interviewed members of Louise's family and it was heartbreaking how close the kids came to being rescued. When the family lived in Texas one of the girls escaped and a lady found her and brought her home. If they had notified the authorities things would have been so different.

I missed it, but, would like to see it.  Did they say why people didn't report them?  Did they report and nothing was done?  So frustrating.  I've actually reported something not right 3 times with children, CPS investigated and removed the children each time, so, I was right and the agency did their job. I wouldn't hesitate. I'm not sure why people are so skittish about it. It's a child welfare that's at stake. To me, that's everyone's business. 

[auntjess]

I skipped the Turpin show.  I couldn't take 2 hours on child abuse.
Did anyone catch an old show called Over My Dead Body?  It seems to be about people who fought back, and survived.  I recorded one, about an old lady and her dog, who took on a burglar.
It was THE worst put-together show, as if they pulled people in off the street, and had them read the lines.
Can't think of how it ever got on the air.
It made Nightmare Next Door look like an Emmy-worthy production.

[kathyk24]

1 hour ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I missed it, but, would like to see it.  Did they say why people didn't report them?  Did they report and nothing was done?  So frustrating.  I've actually reported something not right 3 times with children, CPS investigated and removed the children each time, so, I was right and the agency did their job. I wouldn't hesitate. I'm not sure why people are so skittish about it. It's a child welfare that's at stake. To me, that's everyone's business. 

The special will repeat tomorrow night at 8:00 est. I think the family withdrew from the public whenever someone noticed anything strange. I also think that's the reason they moved so they wouldn't be caught. 

[seasons]

20/20 tonight on GSK.

[auntjess]

Skakel conviction overturned again.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2018/05/04/kennedy-cousin-michael-skakels-murder-conviction-overturned-again/?utm_term=.1c0aaa99989e

[Brattinella]

1 hour ago, auntjess said:

Skakel conviction overturned again.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2018/05/04/kennedy-cousin-michael-skakels-murder-conviction-overturned-again/?utm_term=.1c0aaa99989e

Again? Jeez!

[hoosiermom]

The last Breaking Homicide? Meh. Marcia Clark did it way better. These guys are just rediculous imho.

[SunnyBeBe]

I actually like Breaking Homicide, on ID Discovery.  I watched all episodes and think they did a pretty good job.  I found the one last night the most intriguing.  I don't necessarily agree with them on it, but, it did provide me with many new questions, that I wonder why have not been addressed.  The information they provided last night, actually caused me to turn my opinion towards the opposite direction for both deaths!!!!!! I know...that's odd.  

http://people.com/crime/rebecca-zahau-boyfriend-brother-found-liable-death/

(wealthy business man's girlfriend found in shocking condition ruled as suicide days after his son plunges to his death in their mansion)

I have read a fair amount about the cases and I used to believe firmly that the young boy did die accidentally, and that the girlfriend, who was caring for the boy was murdered.  NOW, I'm not so sure.  I'm now leaning towards the boy being murdered and her committing suicide or being murdered too!  I know it's crazy. 

My primary question was NOT even addressed and that is the chandelier that was hanging in the foyer that was allegedly hit by the child and broken.  I fail to see how a small person falling over the railing would go to the center of the room and hit the chandelier that is hanging from the ceiling.  I just don't get it. Maybe, if the person took a running leap and jumped towards the chandelier as they fell, but, that's not what they contend. 

  Their demonstration sucked. I will say that.  AND, why no account of what Rebecca told them about how it happened?  Why not? Did she not see it? That would be helpful to know. I believe that either she was responsible for the boy's injuries OR someone else did it, because she was not looking after him.  So, she couldn't really say how it happened. But, I do not believe the accident story. I agree with his mother.  She knows, it was not an accident. 

I used to firmly believe that Rebecca was murdered, by someone who wanted to punish her for the boy's death.  NOW, I'm not so sure.  I wonder if she was targeted to be be murdered before the boy was.  I don't believe she wrote the note, but, who would have?  Who else believed that she saved the boy?  I don't think that anyone in the boy's family thought that she saved the boy.  I could be wrong, but, they likely only had immense turmoil, but, certainly not think of it as her saving the boy.  That sounds like something someone on her side would say. 

Quote

The message, painted in black on the white door, was written on two lines. The first line: "she saved him;" the second: "can you save her"

 

http://fox5sandiego.com/2018/03/05/handwriting-expert-takes-the-stand-in-zahau-wrongful-death-case/

The fingerprint stuff was tricky though. I'm not sure how to explain that.

My other big question is how long did those co-workers/friends they interviewed know her? Years, months, etc?  Sometimes, you don't always know a person. There is so much more to investigate on these two cases.  I'm not so sure the jury got it right though.........so, I may have to eat my words. 

[Ananayel]

My question wasn't about the chandelier. It was how on earth she could tie her own hands behind her back. Or even, in front. It would seem like there would be no way to actually get it tight working in the front, much less in the back.

[Sile]

On 5/2/2018 at 7:20 AM, SunnyBeBe said:

Last weekend there was a show about the work Michelle McNamara did for her book and how she wrote a letter in it to the killer taunting him of when the police finally figure it out and come after him. She says to him,  You will be in your house, the police approach up the walk to GET YOU! You are now old and weak and can't flee anymore.  Oh, I can't recall the exact words, but, IT ACTUALLY HAPPENED THAT WAY!  I am getting that book. 

I'm about halfway through the book and I'm really enjoying (if that's the right word) reading it.  I like her writing style a lot.  You can really tell the difference in flow between what she wrote and the chapters that were pieced together from her notes.  It's also disappointing that there isn't much on the Smith (Ventura) murders because it took her literally years to get copies of the case file.  She finally got a couple dozen boxes a month or so before her death, but didn't have time to do anything with them.

I had the ebook on hold at the library for a couple months and was #4 on the list with 5 copies available.  They must have some system where more copies are purchased according to holds, because right after the arrest the holds per copy jumped to over 100 each.  Then all of a sudden it was available to me and I saw that the amount of copies had quadrupled (still double digits per copy).  I was trying to read it quickly so I could return it as fast as possible and get it back into circulation, but I find myself going over paragraphs more than once and kind of savoring her words.  Really tragic, she was a talented writer.

[SunnyBeBe]

11 hours ago, Ananayel said:

My question wasn't about the chandelier. It was how on earth she could tie her own hands behind her back. Or even, in front. It would seem like there would be no way to actually get it tight working in the front, much less in the back.

Breaking Homicide did a demonstration of how you can actually tie your feet, then hands in the front with that rope, then switch your hands behind you, and tighten the ropes.  I have also seen that demonstrated on tv before, for this case.  So, it is possible.  But, to me, a person who is not familiar with camping, or ropes of some kind would not be able to do that, or even have the idea of doing that.  AND, the rope came in one long piece. It had to be cut in parts to allow some for binding the feet, some for binding the hands, and the other for hanging.  Very planned.  So, if she is devastated over the boy's injury and she thinks of this rope that just happens to be stored somewhere in the house? No way.  Plus, no proof she went out and purchased the rope.  To me, that was planned. A hanging in the closet would make more sense.  So, where did the rope come from? Was it in the house for some reason? If not, who brought it in?  

As the experienced forensic pathologist, who has done over 40,000 autopsies said, he's never seen a woman commit suicide completely naked that way. (Baring herself outside.)  I assume people do it in the privacy of their home or bedroom, but, not hanging outside.)

They explained that binding her hands and feet served the purpose of preventing herself from trying to save herself when she plunged off the balcony.  So, that she wouldn't be able to grab at the railing or put her feet on the ledge.  So, it prevented her from saving herself when she realized she was dying.  That's a lot of forethought.  I mean....I just have trouble buying that she planned it that much after such a horrific injury of the child.  Binding her for the hanging seemed more like a killer might do. 

Also, they didn't mention the knot in the rope on her neck.  How was that done? 

Edited May 8, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[Ananayel]

Thanks - I must have missed that demonstration. This is on late, so a) my attention span goes to crap by that point in the evening and b) I am usually flapping about trying to get things ready for the next morning. Once I'd missed that, it just seemed like this huge elephant in the room that everyone was studiously ignoring.

So, without being a contortionist able to flip her arms backward over her head, she'd have had to sit on the floor, put her tied hands between her legs (feet bound) and scooch her body forward until her arms were behind her? I just don't see it. If she was that devastated that she felt she had to go this route, why not pills with a real note? 

And how would one get paint out of a tube without any prints at all on the tube, only the cap? To me, that says that her prints (including the cap) were all over it, someone else opened it carefully, and then wiped off all prints from the tube.

Overall, I'm enjoying the show, even though I couldn't stand Derrick on Big Brother.

[SunnyBeBe]

Good points about the paint tube and prints. 

I thought that they missed a lot on this Mansion Mystery episode, but, there was a lot to cover.  

Another point you make is the note. I agree.  If this was suicide, why attempt to disguise the writing?  Why not just write it in your own handwriting?  And why so high up? Did she stand on her tip toes to write it?  Just so many bizarre things that make no sense.  But, still....I now am more convinced the child's death was not accidental, regardless of her death.

[walnutqueen]

On 05/07/2018 at 1:00 PM, hoosiermom said:

The last Breaking Homicide? Meh. Marcia Clark did it way better. These guys are just rediculous imho.

Those two chucklefucks haven't "broken" a case yet.  They are useless twits who just go over the same ground as other investigators already have, and then pontificate and postulate their ridiculous "theories".

[hoosiermom]

53 minutes ago, walnutqueen said:

Those two chucklefucks haven't "broken" a case yet.  They are useless twits who just go over the same ground as other investigators already have, and then pontificate and postulate their ridiculous "theories".

Thank you Walnutqueen! You said it way better than I did and spelled ridiculous correctly too. (I didn’t. Lol) Chucklefucks indeed! I won’t be watching them again.