Small Talk: We'll Be Right Back

[Prevailing Wind]

8 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

I can't stand Dick Cavett.  One particular interview completely turned me off.  I was looking for it, but can't seem to find any reference to it.  I think it was an interview with Dana Delany.

I saw Letterman interview her. Trust me, it's her, not the interviewer.

[Annber03]

Haha, you're welcome @Browncoat! Those mistakes get to me, too :p. 

[susannah]

1 hour ago, Browncoat said:

Thank you for saying "couldn't care less" instead of the incorrect-but-more-common "could care less."  Also for "unfazed" instead of "unphased".

I never understood why people say "I could care less," which makes NO sense, and you think people would get that!

[Gramto6]

I've been worried about the kittens & mama living under my front deck in this heat so I started tossing quarts of water out on the deck several times a day. After each time, they popped up and ate and drank and then went back under the deck. They are in the shade under there and the water probably made it cooler there. I can't wait for this heat wave to pass!

[Annber03]

11 minutes ago, Gramto6 said:

I've been worried about the kittens & mama living under my front deck in this heat so I started tossing quarts of water out on the deck several times a day. After each time, they popped up and ate and drank and then went back under the deck. They are in the shade under there and the water probably made it cooler there. I can't wait for this heat wave to pass!

Aw, poor babies :(. Glad they've got you looking out for them and tending to them-hope they'll get through this heat wave okay!

[theatremouse]

1 hour ago, susannah said:

I never understood why people say "I could care less," which makes NO sense, and you think people would get that!

My understanding is both expressions exist, and mean slightly different things. I couldn't care less is exactly what it sounds like: you do not care at all. Impossible to care less.

I could care less means you care a smidge, not much, but it is possible to care less than currently. The implication here being depending on what's said next, that could move the needle in either direction, but it's not looking good.

[Leeds]

 

1 hour ago, Gramto6 said:

I've been worried about the kittens & mama living under my front deck in this heat so I started tossing quarts of water out on the deck several times a day. After each time, they popped up and ate and drank and then went back under the deck. They are in the shade under there and the water probably made it cooler there. I can't wait for this heat wave to pass!

At this point in our current heat ridiculousness, I wish someone would throw me quarts of water, especially if they were frozen and ready to nestle against pressure points.

40 minutes ago, theatremouse said:

My understanding is both expressions exist, and mean slightly different things. I couldn't care less is exactly what it sounds like: you do not care at all. Impossible to care less.

I could care less means you care a smidge, not much, but it is possible to care less than currently. The implication here being depending on what's said next, that could move the needle in either direction, but it's not looking good.

I'm old and curmudgeonly and so even though I know both can be correct, "could care less" still pisses me off.  (Especially in this heat.)

[Leeds]

5 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

Do you have fans? I found some relief yesterday by having a bowl of ice water next to me and dropping a washcloth in it and the plastering it on the back of my neck or over my thighs and sitting in front of a fan. Also put your feet in a basin of of ice water and sit in front of a fan. Also misters, which I alternated in the fridge.

Wish I could put my mister in the fridge.  Maybe then he'd stop complaining about the heat.

[Yeah No]

2 hours ago, theatremouse said:

My understanding is both expressions exist, and mean slightly different things. I couldn't care less is exactly what it sounds like: you do not care at all. Impossible to care less.

I could care less means you care a smidge, not much, but it is possible to care less than currently. The implication here being depending on what's said next, that could move the needle in either direction, but it's not looking good.

I always interpreted "I could care less" when obviously used when "couldn't" would be more appropriate as sarcasm but I suppose I was giving it too much credit, LOL.

I admit I also have pet peeves about "unphased" instead of "unfazed" and the use of "jive" when it should be "jibe".  Both have become so prevalent in "the common parlance" that I've actually seen online dictionaries that will accept both forms.

Also annoying for me is when someone says they're "chomping at the bit".  The expression is actually "champing at the bit", but online dictionaries will now say both are OK to use.

[Yeah No]

My mind is boggled hearing about 115 degree heat, and I'm no stranger to heat waves in the Northeast.  We are having one right now.  I think it got close to 100 today.  I know that sounds much easier than 115, but the heat here in the East is somehow more horrible than in the West.  I'm thinking it's the humidity.  I've been out West during heatwaves and they were much more tolerable than here in the Northeast.  It was so bad today my husband and I took a drive down to the shore for seafood.  I wish I could have sat there all day with the cooler air and breeze from the water.  It's always cooler at the shore.  I hear it's supposed to cool down after tomorrow.  Thank goodness! 

Every year the heat is harder for me to take.  I honestly don't know what I'd do without air conditioning.  Last year I suffered through 2 heatwaves only weeks apart without air conditioning.  One because the power was knocked out all over the state for a few days due to high winds from thunderstorms and the other when our old central AC unit bit the dust.  It was so bad my husband and I checked into a local hotel for two nights.  BTW when our power was out we were able to rescue most of our cold food because a friend of ours with a whole house generator was away at the time and offered to let us use their fridge.  We were housesitting for them so we had the keys to their house.  But it was quite an ordeal to unload an entire fridge and schlep it all the way to their house in the 100+ degree heat.  I ended up tripping and bruising a rib in the process.  Ugh.  Last year was horrific for me in many ways and this heatwave is giving me PTSD just thinking about it......

[susannah]

2 hours ago, Leeds said:

Wish I could put my mister in the fridge.  Maybe then he'd stop complaining about the heat.

Take out a couple of racks and give it a go!

[susannah]

3 hours ago, Leeds said:

 

At this point in our current heat ridiculousness, I wish someone would throw me quarts of water, especially if they were frozen and ready to nestle against pressure points.

I'm old and curmudgeonly and so even though I know both can be correct, "could care less" still pisses me off.  (Especially in this heat.)

Amen to all! I could be wrong, yet cranky, but I don't think "could care less" is correct, especially as it is used meaning the opposite. I would go for quarts of cold water thrown me, but I think quarts of ice would be a little painful! Everything pisses me off in this heat. Someone could show up having cured cancer and achieved world peace and I'd be like, "who cares! Get away from me!"

[susannah]

2 hours ago, Yeah No said:

Also annoying for me is when someone says they're "chomping at the bit".  The expression is actually "champing at the bit", but online dictionaries will now say both are OK to use

I have never even heard of the word "champing." It has nothing to do with "champion?"  "Chomping" makes more sense since you do it with your teeth, where the bit is. Let the animal abuse roll on!

[Browncoat]

6 hours ago, theatremouse said:

My understanding is both expressions exist, and mean slightly different things. I couldn't care less is exactly what it sounds like: you do not care at all. Impossible to care less.

I could care less means you care a smidge, not much, but it is possible to care less than currently. The implication here being depending on what's said next, that could move the needle in either direction, but it's not looking good.

The problem is that people use “could care less” when they mean “couldn’t care less”, and give me a confused look when I ask them why they care at all.  But they said they could care less!  That means they must care at least a little!

[smittykins]

19 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

Our sixth grade homeroom teacher used to play Wipe Out by The Surfaris every day at the start of the lunch period.

When I was in fourth grade, our principal would sometimes play current popular songs during lunch and we’d have a discussion.  One of them was Harry Chapin’s “Cat’s In The Cradle.”  He asked if anyone knew what the song was about, and one of my classmates mentioned that “The dad doesn’t have time for his son while he’s growing up, so the son can’t make time for him as an adult.”

[peacheslatour]

2 hours ago, smittykins said:

When I was in fourth grade, our principal would sometimes play current popular songs during lunch and we’d have a discussion.  One of them was Harry Chapin’s “Cat’s In The Cradle.”  He asked if anyone knew what the song was about, and one of my classmates mentioned that “The dad doesn’t have time for his son while he’s growing up, so the son can’t make time for him as an adult.”

Very astute.

[Bruinsfan]

12 hours ago, Leeds said:

Wish I could put my mister in the fridge.  Maybe then he'd stop complaining about the heat.

You could, but you'd be trading one problem for another.

 

[Katy M]

14 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

Like father like son.  Too bad the son didn't learn from the mistakes that his father had made.

Maybe he did.  Maybe he's spending all that time he can't find for his father with his son.

[friendperidot]

  

1 hour ago, peacheslatour said:

3 hours ago, smittykins said:

When I was in fourth grade, our principal would sometimes play current popular songs during lunch and we’d have a discussion.  One of them was Harry Chapin’s “Cat’s In The Cradle.”  He asked if anyone knew what the song was about, and one of my classmates mentioned that “The dad doesn’t have time for his son while he’s growing up, so the son can’t make time for him as an adult.”

Very astute.

exactly what I said aloud to myself when I read that. Btw, one of the best concerts in my life was Harry Chapin. He really put on a lovely show, even in a very large outdoor theater in Columbia MD, it was in the mid 70s, several years before he was tragically killed. 

Edited June 30, 2021 by friendperidot
got rid of an extra quote box

[peacheslatour]

1 hour ago, friendperidot said:

  

exactly what I said aloud to myself when I read that. Btw, one of the best concerts in my life was Harry Chapin. He really put on a lovely show, even in a very large outdoor theater in Columbia MD, it was in the mid 70s, several years before he was tragically killed. 

He was a lovely man.

[peacheslatour]

6 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

I don't think being vindictive is any kind of message to send to a child, or anyone else for that matter.  That son is going to know that there is a problem between his dad and his grandfather, and he is going to have questions.

The world would be much better off if people were more forgiving, instead of holding grudges.  There needs to be a path for redemption, for forgiveness.  People make mistakes, people screw up.  People learn from their mistakes and mature in the process.  I have never met a person who hasn't made a mistake.

Yes but there are only so many hours in a day. I don't think it was a matter of vindictiveness. As the song explains, and this was true especially before these "enlightened" times, men supporting families had to prioritize their time. My dad was out of town on business three days out of five. It didn't mean he didn't love me and my mom but that's just the way it was.

[Prevailing Wind]

12 hours ago, susannah said:

Take out a couple of racks and give it a go!

But where would she put all those plastic packages of food from Hungry Root?

[Bastet]

The song isn't about vindictive behavior, but learned behavior.  The entire oh, wow point of the song is the twist on the kid repeatedly saying "I'm gonna be just like you, Dad" and the father's horrified realization at the end of what "He'd grown up just like me, my boy was just like me" wound up meaning.

[peacheslatour]

58 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

Is the father horrified, or is the father proud of his son?  Here is the lyrics for those who may not know the lyrics.

It may be both.  He says to his dad, "You see my jobs a hassle and the kids got the flu".  He is giving reasons, or excuses for not seeing his dad.  One being his son has the flu.  Yeah, he is talking to his dad on the phone, so they do have at least that going for them.

Yeah, I don't see any anger there. Just sadness that life is short and we don't always have time, sometimes to do all the things we want to do. That was a recurring theme with Jim Croce as well.

Edited June 30, 2021 by peacheslatour

[Prevailing Wind]

Quote

  6 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

They say if you give someone a puppy or a kitten, you're handing them heartbreak. I know this but I still will have pets. I want to give them all the love I can in their short lives.

I'd read that adopting a pet is one of the most courageous things a person can do - knowing they'll likely die before you and leaving you vulnerable to incredible heartache.  But the pain is well worth the joy they bring.

 

[Bastet]

1 hour ago, Prevailing Wind said:

I'd read that adopting a pet is one of the most courageous things a person can do - knowing they'll likely die before you and leaving you vulnerable to incredible heartache.  But the pain is well worth the joy they bring.

Exactly.  Animal lifespan is the bane of having pets, so that speaks to how rewarding it is -- we sign up to get our hearts broken over and over again (the 20th loss is every bit as hard as the first) because the unconditional love they give us, the joys of sharing a life with them, and the comfort that comes from knowing we provided a great home to a dependent creature makes that pain worth enduring for all we get in exchange. 

Edited July 1, 2021 by Bastet

[friendperidot]

2 hours ago, Prevailing Wind said:

I'd read that adopting a pet is one of the most courageous things a person can do - knowing they'll likely die before you and leaving you vulnerable to incredible heartache.  But the pain is well worth the joy they bring.

Right now, I'm facing the opposite dilemma, I'm trying to make arrangements for my dogs to be taken care of because they will most likely outlive me. That's the part that worries me most. Nobody is going to love them and take care of them like I do.

[susannah]

10 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

It may be both.  He says to his dad, "You see my jobs a hassle and the kids got the flu".  He is giving reasons, or excuses for not seeing his dad.  One being his son has the flu.

I assumed that line meant that since his kids were sick, no mention that it was one son, that he was there for them, helping to care for them. Maybe he was was just using them as an excuse. The line "I'm gonna be like you" is worrying, since it implies that he is learning that a father is never there for his child, but hopefully, he felt differently.  I didn't like the premise that the father was all about spending time with his son as soon as it was convenient for HIM. He might have had a job to do and bills to pay but he should have also spent time with his child.

[susannah]

On 6/29/2021 at 10:42 PM, Yeah No said:

It was so bad my husband and I checked into a local hotel for two nights. 

I was considering that but it was too close to the weekend of hell and there were no vacancies.

[susannah]

10 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

I have never met a person who hasn't made a mistake.

Except for Christine McVie. She was born Perfect! 😃

[Prevailing Wind]

8 hours ago, Bastet said:

Exactly.  Animal lifespan is the bane of having pets, so that speaks to how rewarding it is -- we sign up to get our hearts broken over and over again (the 20th loss is every bit as hard as the first) because the unconditional love they give us, the joys of sharing a life with them, and the comfort that comes from knowing we provided a great home to a dependent creature makes that pain worth enduring for all we get in exchange. 

Right now, Bosco is holding down my left wrist, so I have to type one-handed, He loves me.

[peacheslatour]

3 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

A lot of "drama" in that band (Fleetwood Mac).

You misspelled "cocaine".

Edited July 1, 2021 by peacheslatour

[janie jones]

Isn't there a Gorge Carlin line about how getting a pet is getting a small tragedy?

[susannah]

6 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

A lot of "drama" in that band (Fleetwood Mac).

Alot of everything in that band, cocaine, sleeping around, God knows what else! I bet it was not easy for Christine having Perfect as a last name, I bet she got teased alot by rotten kids.

6 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

I am more of a Mac and Tosh fan myself, but I will say this Chip And Dale ornament is really cute.🐿️

Before my local Hallmark Store closed several years ago, they used to have donuts and punch like drinks on Keepsake Ornament Day.   Customers would walk around with store provided wicker baskets and buy lots of ornaments.  Especially series ornaments. 

Now I have to travel bit in order to get to a Hallmark Store.  This year, July 10th is the day when most of the ornaments will be available.

I used to collect Precious Moments figurines.

[Moose135]

On 6/30/2021 at 1:58 PM, friendperidot said:

Btw, one of the best concerts in my life was Harry Chapin. He really put on a lovely show, even in a very large outdoor theater in Columbia MD, it was in the mid 70s, several years before he was tragically killed. 

In 1975ish, he did a concert at my high school on Long Island - it was a week day, after classes ended, raising donations for a world hunger foundation he started. I really liked his music, and enjoyed the show. He was involved with many causes, and did a lot of philanthropic work on Long Island. I've driven past that section of highway where he had his fatal accident a million times over the years. I wish I had more opportunities to see him perform.

[GHScorpiosRule]

Well hell’s bells.

I love the song Cat’s in the Cradle” and have never thought there was anything ominous/paybackish/or that the son, now grown, was lying to his dad.

When I got older, I just thought Dad realized what being a workaholic had reaped.

But that’s just me.

[susannah]

I don't think the son was lying to  his dad. He just was telling him in no mean way, what was what, that he had no time for him. The dad also realized that that is what his lack of parenting had reaped.

[smittykins]

20 hours ago, janie jones said:

Isn't there a Gorge Carlin line about how getting a pet is getting a small tragedy?

(Obligatory NSFW warning because, you know, Carlin.)

Edited July 2, 2021 by smittykins

[GHScorpiosRule]

14 minutes ago, susannah said:

I don't think the son was lying to  his dad. He just was telling him in no mean way, what was what, that he had no time for him. The dad also realized that that is what his lack of parenting had reaped.

And listening to the lyrics again (yes I just watched his live performance and it still gives me goosebumps), son grew up happy and wanted to be like Dad. And the son just didn’t have time just then.

What I’ve always wondered was, where was Mom?😅

I just love the song.

[smittykins]

Also, when I attended a church that performed baby dedications instead of baptism(which was reserved for people old enough to request it), the pastor recited the lyrics as part of the ceremony one time.

[Prevailing Wind]

6 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

IFC is having a comedy movie 4th of July weekend starting today.

People have started to light off fireworks already and it isn't even the 4th.  I am not a happy camper.

I was invited to my brother's for the Fourth. Their HOA collects $ from the residents to buy a pro fireworks display - this year, they collected $10k, so I'm assuming it will be spectacular. 

EXCEPT - some fool shot off some fireworks last night & scared the crap out of the cats. I couldn't get either of them off my lap. I can NOT go away and leave them alone during fireworks displays.  Maybe it was a Canadian, celebrating Canada Day, but it frightened my cats and I'm angry about it.

[Bruinsfan]

Thankfully mine are former alley cats used to car backfires, action movie explosions, and the occasional spray of bullets. As long as no one makes a firework that sounds like a person walking their dog in the stairwell, they'll be fine.

[friendperidot]

7 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

What I’ve always wondered was, where was Mom?

I don't remember if he explained it in the live concert I saw him in, but I have evenings of watching Harry Chapin videos on YouTube and in one of them, he talks about his wife inspired him to write the song. I think the lyrics are about the dad/son bond or lack of it and many men of past generations were like that. My dad loved us, but he had to work hard to support us and that was how a man showed love for his family with his generation. He had jobs over the years that required him being gone overnight one or two nights a week, but he came home to us always. I know he loved us, I have pictures to prove it. I miss him and it's been 21 years.

[smittykins]

IIRC, the song was inspired by a poem Harry’s wife wrote.

From Wikipedia:

Quote

The song's lyrics began as a poem written by Harry's wife, Sandra "Sandy" Gaston; the poem itself was inspired by the awkward relationship between her first husband, James Cashmore, and his father, John, a politician who served as Brooklyn borough president. She was also inspired by a country music song she had heard on the radio. Chapin also said the song was about his own relationship with his son, Josh, admitting, "Frankly, this song scares me to death."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cat's_in_the_Cradle

Edited July 3, 2021 by smittykins
Add link

[susannah]

On 7/2/2021 at 3:13 PM, friendperidot said:

I think the lyrics are about the dad/son bond or lack of it and many men of past generations were like that.

I agree. Back in the day, a father showed his love for his children by supporting them financially, keeping them fed, clothed and housed. They were not expected to be hands on with the children, weren't in labor/delivery rooms, didn't change diapers or do all the other childcare. Obviously this would not be true of all fathers but it was the societal expectation. It had to be confusing for men when pretty suddenly, they not only still were the breadwinners alot of the time, but also expected to have real relationships with their kids and be there for them.

Talking about Harry Chapin's song, I remember seeing an interview with Anne Murray, on Youtube, and her daughter Dawn, who suffered from anorexia as a teen. Anne felt major guilt for having left her, on tours and things, and she thought that was to blame for her daughter's illness. She spoke of how torn she was, but she had to do her job.

[peacheslatour]

Quote

I agree. Back in the day, a father showed his love for his children by supporting them financially, keeping them fed, clothed and housed. They were not expected to be hands on with the children, weren't in labor/delivery rooms, didn't change diapers or do all the other childcare. Obviously this would not be true of all fathers but it was the societal expectation. It had to be confusing for men when pretty suddenly, they not only still were the breadwinners alot of the time, but also expected to have real relationships with their kids and be there for them.

And by the same token, imagine how confusing it was for a generation of women who had expected to be home makers to suddenly be thrust into a world where  families could live on one paycheck any more and they realized they had better learn to make a living.

Edited July 4, 2021 by peacheslatour

[Yeah No]

I saw Harry Chapin in concert on Long Island in the '70s myself.  I was always happy that I at least got to see him in person once before he died.

I always took "Cats in the Cradle" to mean that the apple sometimes unfortunately doesn't fall far from the tree, and that the son learned those behaviors from his Dad.  It wasn't just that men weren't "hands on" parents and it was expected that they work long hours, it was often a choice men made because they saw their world as the board room, not the kitchen.  All of that was the woman's realm, not the man's in their eyes. 

A good male friend of mine has an interesting relationship with that song.  Growing up his father was an executive with a big company.  He was a workaholic and rarely home (like a lot of male executives to this day).  He grew up wishing his father spent more time with him and the family, and it had an unfortunate affect on their relationship until the day his father died.  There was always a bit of tension there.  His father could have made the time for his family; he was on that kind of level that he could have carved out the time if he wanted to.  When I was an EA in the corporate world I worked for executives that made a point to be there for their kids when it counted even if it meant curtailing their work hours at times and passing up opportunities for advancement.

Anyway, my friend became a lawyer and found himself slipping into the same kind of workaholism as his father.  His kids also missed him and wished he was home more.  After a heart attack at the age of 42, his priorities changed completely and he gave up career opportunities and ambitions in order to spend more time with his kids.  He was determined not to be "just like Dad" and realized he was forgetting the lesson of "Cats in the Cradle", which being around my age he also listened to as a teenager.  We all have choices, and this song actually made a difference in my friend's life.  Thanks to Harry Chapin, may he rest in peace!

Edited July 4, 2021 by Yeah No

[peacheslatour]

Quote

I saw Harry Chapin in concert on Long Island in the '70s myself.  I was always happy that I at least got to see him in person once before he died.

The song that really broke my heart was Taxi. I could have been his passenger and he could have been one of my exes. It's sad how lonely they both were.

[Bastet]

My dad, who was the sole "breadwinner" for the family, went through a period where he worked long hours six days a week due to a big project/looming deadline.  At one point in there, he was home on a Saturday, and I remarked, "I keep thinking it's Sunday, because you're here."  I didn't mean anything beyond that simple statement, but I later overheard him sharing it with my mom, feeling guilty about his recent prolonged absence.

Once, after he'd retired, we were sitting around a campfire after my mom had gone into the motorhome for the night, and he expressed concern that he'd missed too much of my life because of work - my mom spent so much more time with me.  I assured him that was not the case.  In my whole life, there were only two times he had to miss something I really wanted him there for (my tenth birthday, and a HS volleyball game against our rival school).  Because those were anomalies and I knew at the time he was as disappointed as I was, they made me sad, but didn't cause me to be upset with him, just that circumstances caused the issue.  (His boss gave me a present for that birthday, a book, in which he wrote a nice little note apologizing for having to take my dad out of town on my birthday.)

No, he wasn't there for every game the way my mom was, but I didn't need either of them there for every game; being there for all but one of the big ones was plenty.  He came to all my school plays, spelling bees, etc.  He knew my friends.  He went to Meet the Teacher nights.  He played with me, helped me with homework.  All the stuff my mom did; he didn't do as much of it as she did, but he certainly didn't treat raising me like her job with which he sometimes graciously helped.

The three of us had dinner together almost every night, and went out to dinner every Friday night.  He took three weeks off every summer for us to go on vacation.  We took the motorhome out for the weekend once a month.  It was plenty!  He spent more time with his family than a lot of men of his generation did, but he wasn't looking at it in comparison to other fathers, but to my other parent.  Well, of course she spent more time with me, since she didn't have an outside job!  I never felt like she was a better parent/he was less of one because of that; if I made a list of the 50 best and worst things about each of them as parents, working/being home wouldn't appear on either one's pro or con list. 

Circumstances limit our choices, but we still have them.  The attitude about it all and how the time is spent mean a lot more to a kid than the amount of time.  "You were never around because you chose not to be" is a completely different experience than "I know we both wish you could have been around more" and thus yields a completely different dynamic between parent and adult child.

[peacheslatour]

5 minutes ago, susannah said:

I agree. I also think it is so weird that they for one keep saying "tell your doctor to give you  med X," like the dr wouldn't know to prescribe it already if you need it, and the second, "tell your doctor if you have had or have ...a leg amputated, a heart transplant, rickets, beri beri, malaria and every other disease known to man.." but, wouldn't your doctor already know your medical history?

Yes. It's beyond stupid.