Pet Peeves: Aka Things That Make You Go "Gah!"

[PRgal]

Re vegetarian/vegan:  I'm pescatarian before dinner with some days going (lacto-ovo) vegetarian.  My parents don't think I'm getting "enough protein" and don't understand that lentils, chickpeas and other legumes are sufficient enough.  They always tell me that Chinese cuisine often uses meat for flavouring and isn't the main part of the dish (e.g. stirfries), but they don't understand that that's not the reason why I limit my meat intake.  They're still very critical of what I feed my son.  My mom used her Mom Look when she asked me whether there was "anything else" with the tomato and cheese quesadilla I gave my son the other day.  He had broccoli as a side.  He had a huge breakfast and had a decent-sized (healthy) snack at preschool in the morning.  She also gets mad at some of my dinners....I served low-carb/high protein flatbread mushroom pizza last night, along with a side salad.  She was like "is that enough?"  Mom comes to our place every day to babysit while I prep (the convenience of having them in the same building...I'm pretty thankful for their help.  And no, changing the locks won't work because she'll just knock/ring the doorbell nonstop).   

[ECM1231]

29 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

Right? I understand not wanting meat in the house but they could have premade deli sandwiches, veggie pizza and take dad out for dinner. On the flip side, I think it's a hell of a lot to expect home cooked dinners every night when these young people probably have full time jobs, kids and a thousand other demands on their time.

Huh? You're reading an awful lot into what I wrote. Never did I say I expected home cooked dinners every night. Nor any night, for that matter. What I said was that when we visit they expect us to fend for ourselves. They don't have any foods we would normally eat and as I said my husband doesn't want to eat fast food for lunch; he's strictly a deli meat sandwich person for lunch and  a meat and potatoes guy for dinner. We can't eat out with them b/c the establishments they frequent would not appeal to my husband.. Even Sunday dinner when we have our pasta, there have to be meatballs, too.   Even when we attempted to make dinner for ourselves, our son was very specific as to what frying pan to use.  I will buy oat milk, special yogurts, beans, plant based frozen 'meats' for them to eat but they can't even bother to stock their fridge when we come with lactose-free milk for dad, some eggs, butter, etc. On the flip side, they DON"T come with their own food items when they visit. They rely on Uber Eats. Personally, imo it's fine every once in a while, but it gets to be very costly. My son is the only one bringing in any income. But hey, it's their life, not mine. FWIW my DIL became a SAHM right after her 3-month maternity leave ended in Texas. Her employer wasn't allowing employees to continue working from home and they weren't putting any kind of COVID safety measures in place, and she didn't feel comfortable returning to the work force when they had an infant at home.  When they moved to NY last year my son got a new job which allows him to work from home and his wife is not employed.  They have one child who is now a year old. I, too, was a SAHM after the birth of my first child, and I was able to take care of said child AND have a hot-cooked meal on the table for my husband each night. At least after the first month or so. She had a C-section and I did for both of my kids, so that's no excuse imo. Just different lifestyles. He's got to live with her.

If it sounds like I'm a cranky MIL, I am. We never got to meet before the wedding. They met in 2019 and she moved in a few months later. March 2020 Covid hit. I saw my son in Oct 2019 when he returned home for his friend's wedding, but she wasn't with him. I didn't see him again for over a  year and a half, when he returned in May 2021 for 4 days. He was a married man of 2 months by then. His wedding in March 2021 was in a remote part of Texas and only a dozen people attended. We were not able to go. By that point his wife was 6 months pregnant. We only met her in June of 2021 when the baby was a month old. When they surprised us last August to say that they were selling his Austin home and returning East, they asked to stay with us while they house-searched. We opened our home to them and their dog and cat for almost 2 months. I'm sure my DIL felt awkward, as did we. I don't interfere but I don't really understand her nor my son, either, to be frank. They are very free-spirit types, don't believe in much planning, and don't believe in schedules. It's been difficult keeping my mouth shut, but I do. 

I just feel that as the parents, we shouldn't be an afterthought. They come here and accept our hospitality, but offer none in return. From what I have been told by my son's mother-in-law, and by my son himself, his wife is an excellent cook. Well, that remains to be seen b/c she's never once offered to cook for us. 

Again, I don't expect her to cook for us at all, although maybe once would be nice, but to maybe have some things like suggested above, that we could eat. 

The biggest blessing in all of this, though is my grandson. I became a first-time grandma at 64 and my husband was 69. I never thought it would happen. At least not with this son. He was 35 when he married and had his son. So, I'm trying my best. It's hard. People are all so different. I had a wonderful relationship of almost 40 years with my own mother-in-law, who passed last year at age 90 of COVID. It meant so much to me especially since I lost my own mother at age 30 and she missed meeting 2 of her 4 grandchildren. My MIL was like a second mother to me. I know I'm not going to have that sort of relationship with my DIL but I'd hoped it would be at least better than it is. She seems to like us. Our political ideologies mesh. Not so with my husband, who is the polar opposite politically. 

Anyway, I've probably shared too much. They just left this afternoon after being here since Saturday night. End of May they were here for a week with their dog, cat, baby. I even hosted my DIL's mom from Texas, who was here for 5 days as she didn't want to miss her grandson's first birthday either. She, at least, had the good sense to take my husband and me out to dinner the last night of her stay to thank us for our hospitality, and sent a lovely thank you card afterward. The party set us back a good chunk. I was happy to do it, but I guess I'm feeling a bit unappreciated. 

1 hour ago, TattleTeeny said:

But I do have to add that there doesn't have to be "nothing for the meat eaters." All the meat eaters I know don't eat only meat, same as I don't eat only grain and beans (which leads to another peeve: "but what do you eat?!").

But, but, but.... I guess what you are saying is that we meat eaters should just shut up and be content with salad, veggies, grains, and maybe pasta? Why can't we have our MEAT and eat it, too?  I'm a little easier than my husband in that regard. He will never, ever go to a vegetarian or vegan place for a meal. He wants his steak! 

So, when we are invited to a function where the hosts are vegan/vegetarian they shouldn't have a meat option for us?  Doesn't seem fair to me. 

[Mondrianyone]

1 hour ago, ECM1231 said:

Anyway, when my son still lived in Texas my husband went to visit him for 10 days as my son was having car trouble and my husband is an auto mechanic.

I would send your son a bill for ten days' worth of professional auto mechanic services with a note saying, "We would've waived the charges for a few pounds of meat. And P.S., Dad poured a couple quarts of soy milk down your gas tank before he left."

Seriously, he couldn't feed his father in exchange for all this time, travel, and free labor? I'm a little shocked.

[Bastet]

Friends of a friend are vegan, and hosted a lot of parties pre-pandemic, so I've been to their house many times.  They never only served vegan food, or even only served vegetarian food, unless everyone coming ate that way.  When they had omnivores among the guests, they provided a wider selection of food (just like when I'm hosting and one or more guests is vegetarian, I take care to include more vegetarian dishes on the menu than I would in a typical meal; I would never want a guest to just have the salad and a side dish or two.  Although, like I said, for one-on-ones with my vegetarian friend, I find it easier to just order in than cooking for both of us).

[TattleTeeny]

Yes, that is clearly what I said (in my previous post where I was on your side).

To be honest, it kind of sounds like your husband's diet is just as strict as your son's (and it also sounds, to me anyway, like this is all about more than food). 

Edited June 8, 2022 by TattleTeeny

[Angeltoes]

2 hours ago, ECM1231 said:

Maybe this isn't the forum for this post and it should go in the Family thread

There's a Family thread?

[ECM1231]

3 minutes ago, TattleTeeny said:

Yes, that is clearly what I said (in my previous post where I was on your side). To be honest, it kind of sounds like your husband's diet is just as strict as your son's. 

Fair point. I suppose you are correct. I'm a little easier in that I can make a mean potato and egg frittata and be happy. Or meatless chili. Or a broccoli and cheese quiche. I'm fine with meatless options but vegan is so hard b/c I do love my dairy. I even had to stop preparing my son's favorite penne a la vodka b/c of the cream and butter. I suppose I could search out a vegan way of doing it, but honestly I am exhausted and it's not even appreciated, so nah.

I realize that this goes far beyond vegan/vegetarian and there seems to be a sense of entitlement here with the younger generation. I've talked to others in my age group, both friends and relatives, and they are experiencing similar issues. 

I raised my sons to do the right thing, express gratitude, write thank you notes, etc. Never come to a host's house without bringing something (I'm not including parents for this), but they don't find any of this necessary. It's disheartening and makes me sad. 

And if you haven't gathered, I'm an Italian mama. I show my love for others by cooking and baking for them. I'll never stop doing it as long as I am able, even if I feel unappreciated. 

I've probably bored you all to tears. Thanks for indulging me.

[RealHousewife]

If I had an Italian mama, I’d probably have to rethink my whole vegan lifestyle . . .

[TattleTeeny]

Well, either way, I still think you have already been super-accommodating and it stinks that it wasn’t reciprocated. You have definitely done better than my mom, who — oh my goodness — still calls to ask, “do you eat chicken?” (and then asks why, what’s wrong with chicken? I just say fine, whatever, and bring something). It sounds a bit like, along with playing host, you’re also stuck playing “food mediator” and who wants that? If the Italian Mama personality allows, tell them all to fend for themselves, that you’re on vacation, haha!

ETA: I miss penne a la vodka. I’m sure that there are excellent vegan facsimiles, but they’re not likely store-bought/bottled and I’m definitely not the person who should try to perfect it from scratch!

Edited June 8, 2022 by TattleTeeny

[Blergh]

Forgive me if others have mentioned it but here's a new pet peeve of mine: mechanics that won't take cars to be towed on their properties that are unsafe to drive!

Long-short is that several weeks ago, my car suddenly became undrivable and I've been trying to get different mechanics in my city to, at the very least, allow me to have it towed to their garage for them to eventually look at it to see if it can be fixed for a somewhat reasonable amount of money.

However, I've gotten mostly recorded messages or answering services and the few times I've gotten through to a human receptionist, they tell me that they're too busy to have it brought in 'for a few days/to the end of the week' and to call back . .but when I do they postpone the window AGAIN and refuse to let me just have the car towed there until they are able to look at it.

And, I've had to give my employer  notice about possibly being late EACH morning to see if I can get the car towed,etc. 

Meanwhile my car is sitting in the carport and I don't dare to even attempt to restart it for fear that it may overheat and smoke (again). .and I don't want to chance my car catching on fire with me in possibly burning down the carport and . ..maybe my home!

Thankfully, my 90-something mother volunteered to let me drive her car (that she hadn't driven in over a year)  to work (and I went through the hoops to transfer the permit to her car so I could keep parking in my garage without getting ticketed/towed. ..or fired).  But I'd like to see if I COULD get my own car checked out if not fixed!

WHY?!!

ARRRGGHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[SusanM]

17 hours ago, ECM1231 said:

On the flip side, they DON"T come with their own food items when they visit. They rely on Uber Eats. Personally, imo it's fine every once in a while, but it gets to be very costly.

This jumped out at me and I have to ask  the board - is this a generational thing?  I had a young fellow working for me for awhile (just before Covid) who was always moaning about his student loans and bills mounting up and yet every single lunch time, as in 5 days a week, he ordered in a meal delivered from local restaurants.  I get that it's his money to spend as he pleases but I was still a little surprised.  Am I showing my age when I think "what's wrong with bringing a sandwich and an apple from home? do you really need a frappacinno from Starbucks when you can't pay your bills?"

[TattleTeeny]

When I lived by myself, I found that there was barely a difference moneywise between (a) buying a lot of groceries or (b) buying less at a time at the food store and just ordering lunch and/or dinner (maybe in part because latter option would sometimes stretch into 2 meals? Only sometimes though; I have always been a generally hungry person!). As for the Starbuck's thing, back when I was paying off an exhorbitant (and predatory) student loan, cutting out life's "little extras" would hardly have made a tiny dent in that mess (art school, man. Ugh). 

Edited June 9, 2022 by TattleTeeny

[SusanM]

24 minutes ago, TattleTeeny said:

When I lived by myself, I found that there was barely a difference moneywise between (a) buying a lot of groceries or (b) buying less at a time at the food store and just ordering lunch and/or dinner (maybe in part because latter option would sometimes stretch into 2 meals?

This is a really good point.  I guess I come at expenses like groceries and buying restaurant meals from the POV of buying for a family as opposed to a single person.  My mother (influenced I am sure from growing up during the Depression and WWII) always insisted on having a pantry and freezer full of food.  Made her feel secure I guess.  But the flipside to that was the waste!  I can't count how many times, when she still lived in her own home, that I would go through the pantry and fridge and freezer and have to throw out expired food!  It's not a saving if you never eat all that food you stockpile!

Edited June 9, 2022 by SusanM

[TattleTeeny]

Quote

But the flipside to that was the waste!  I can't count how many times, when she still lived in her own home, that I would go through the pantry and fridge and freezer and have to throw out expired food!  It's not a saving if you never eat all that food you stockpile!

Yup, that too! Before I started working from home full time, I found it a better option to spend a bunch of money daily at the really good salad bar at my office's nice cafeteria as opposed to the whole "buy, wash, chop, clean up, bring to work...if I don't forget to" routine. And even after all that, I'd still never be able to finish all of the fresh vegetables before some went bad. 

I miss that salad bar. It had normal salad stuff, plus roasted vegetables, tofu, various fruits, etc. It was awesome. I wonder if it's even still there in post-COVID life? I probably wouldn't use it anymore if I still worked there.

Edited June 9, 2022 by TattleTeeny

[TattleTeeny]

I just got a work message asking, "Do you have time to do This Thing?" While it's a bit annoying to get that message at 4:30 pm, I'm obviously going to say yes because I'm still on the clock. However, the reply after my "yes" is a REAL PEEVE: "OK, I'll send it to you as soon as I am done." THAT is not what I said yes to; my answer was based on the present ("DO you have time..." as opposed to "will you have time [after your full day of working already]...?")!

Edited June 9, 2022 by TattleTeeny

[Bastet]

23 hours ago, Angeltoes said:

There's a Family thread?

Yes

[SoMuchTV]

Arrgh! TV commentators: Stop talking about things that happened “half a century ago” that are still fresh in my memory!

[annzeepark914]

28 minutes ago, SoMuchTV said:

Arrgh! TV commentators: Stop talking about things that happened “half a century ago” that are still fresh in my memory!

The other day I was watching a panel of talking heads & one of the young squirts said, "As we read in our history books..." (he was referring to events that happened during 1972-74 🤬). Now I feel ancient.

Edited June 10, 2022 by annzeepark914

[GaT]

5 hours ago, SoMuchTV said:

Arrgh! TV commentators: Stop talking about things that happened “half a century ago” that are still fresh in my memory!

4 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

The other day I was watching a panel of talking heads & one of the young squirts said, "As we read in our history books..." (he was referring to events that happened during 1972-74 🤬). Now I feel ancient.

You should check out the TIL sub on Reddit. Every now & then you get a thread that says something like "TIL there used to be something called a payphone", "TIL that they used to repeat television shows during the summer", "TIL Paul McCartney was in a band called The Beatles". Sometimes it just makes you want to crawl under a rock.

[ABay]

For those like me who have no idea what TIL means, it stands for Today I Learned. And my peeve of the day is having to click on a link to get a definition instead of seeing the answer in the 2 line description of the site in Google.

[Rose Quartz]

On 6/9/2022 at 10:15 AM, SusanM said:

This jumped out at me and I have to ask  the board - is this a generational thing?  I had a young fellow working for me for awhile (just before Covid) who was always moaning about his student loans and bills mounting up and yet every single lunch time, as in 5 days a week, he ordered in a meal delivered from local restaurants.  I get that it's his money to spend as he pleases but I was still a little surprised.  Am I showing my age when I think "what's wrong with bringing a sandwich and an apple from home? do you really need a frappacinno from Starbucks when you can't pay your bills?"

Maybe it is generational, because I'm with you.  When I worked in an office I'd typically bring my lunch four days a week and then go out with friends on the fifth day.  Making my own meals was so much cheaper than constantly eating out that even if I occasionally had to toss some food I still came out ahead.  That savings might be a drop in the bucket compared to major expenses, but those drops add up and helped me pay off my mortgage early.

[Adiba]

On 6/9/2022 at 10:20 AM, TattleTeeny said:

When I lived by myself, I found that there was barely a difference moneywise between (a) buying a lot of groceries or (b) buying less at a time at the food store and just ordering lunch and/or dinner (maybe in part because latter option would sometimes stretch into 2 meals? Only sometimes though; I have always been a generally hungry person!). As for the Starbuck's thing, back when I was paying off an exhorbitant (and predatory) student loan, cutting out life's "little extras" would hardly have made a tiny dent in that mess (art school, man. Ugh). 

The thing is, even though cutting out extras may not pay off a student loan quicker (or any other big bill), those extras do add up yearly. It’s an individual choice I guess which extras really matter to you as far as enjoyment of life. 

My pet peeve when it comes to buying groceries is when the discount only applies if one buys 2 or more of an item. If it’s perishable, I might wind up throwing it out anyway. Also, prepackaged spinach and vegetable that are not the size that I want, too much or too little— and the store does not a loose option to bag yourself.

[partofme]

On 6/9/2022 at 10:15 AM, SusanM said:

is this a generational thing?  I had a young fellow working for me for awhile (just before Covid) who was always moaning about his student loans and bills mounting up and yet every single lunch time, as in 5 days a week, he ordered in a meal delivered from local restaurants.  I get that it's his money to spend as he pleases but I was still a little surprised.  Am I showing my age when I think "what's wrong with bringing a sandwich and an apple from home? do you really need a frappacinno from Starbucks when you can't pay your bills?"

I have massive student loans that I've been paying off since the late 90's.  I don't drink Starbucks and am a very picky eater, but when I used to go into the office pre-Covid found there was nothing I could bring from home that would be cheaper or more enjoyable  than buying a slice of pizza for lunch.  I don't spend money frivolously, but if there's something I really want I'm not going to deprive myself because of loans that I've been paying off for over twenty years and probably will be for the rest of my life, barring some miracle.  Actually the biggest problem for me, more than my loans even, is rent, I live in an expensive city(nyc) and don't have the option to move elsewhere, I grew up around here.

Edited June 10, 2022 by partofme

[Rose Quartz]

29 minutes ago, Adiba said:

The thing is, even though cutting out extras may not pay off a student loan quicker (or any other big bill), those extras do add up yearly. It’s an individual choice I guess which extras really matter to you as far as enjoyment of life. 

My pet peeve when it comes to buying groceries is when the discount only applies if one buys 2 or more of an item. If it’s perishable, I might wind up throwing it out anyway. Also, prepackaged spinach and vegetable that are not the size that I want, too much or too little— and the store does not a loose option to bag yourself.

It's definitely a balancing act between not depriving yourself while still keeping the big picture in mind.  I probably focused a little too much on the big picture but I wanted to get the mortgage paid off as quickly as possible so it would be one less thing for me to worry about.

I hear you with the BOGO sales!  I use a couple of rebate apps and they often have BOGO deals but unless it's something that's shelf stable for an extended period I usually can't take advantage of them.  Now that it's summer they have a lot of deals on frozen treats and it just kills me that I can't use them - no room for multiple packages in the freezer.  So maybe that's my pet peeve - I wish stores would do more 50% off sales instead of BOGOs.

[SoMuchTV]

The grocery store I mostly shop at has BOGO sales, but they also offer the half-off price if you only get one.  Sometimes that's in the fine print on the sale signs, but I bet they still manage to encourage a lot of people to buy two.

My peeve is the pharmacy I use - they have a lot of buy-one-get-one-half-off items.  But I'm not going to use up two bottles of Ibuprofen or whatever before they expire, so I end up paying full price.

[SusanM]

48 minutes ago, Adiba said:

My pet peeve when it comes to buying groceries is when the discount only applies if one buys 2 or more of an item.

This is my peeve today.  Well that but signage about that that is very unclear.  The item I wanted to buy had a sign below it that read "Buy two and get one free".  To me this meant if I buy two then one of those two is free.  Not so fast.  According to the cashier it means buy two and get a third one for free.   Which does make sense but honestly my interpretation made sense to me too and especially as we're talking about a perishable item  not many people would typically buy three at a time in the first place.  

[rcc]

What happened to buy one, get one free. That was a real sale. Of course these days we can't have that.

[SusanM]

15 minutes ago, rcc said:

What happened to buy one, get one free. That was a real sale. Of course these days we can't have that.

Another peeve of mine is that along with not seeing too many sales like that anymore instead (at least at our local grocery) they have signs like "3 for 7.98" or similar amounts.  All this does for me is make me think "huh?" Not that I might be getting a deal or that at that price it's worth stocking up.  I'm convinced the store does this just to confuse the consumer.  Which it does with me but it also makes me not buy that particular product at all, which I am guessing isn't what they want.

[PRgal]

Speaking of "old,"  someone on a Facebook group recently posted a meme that said something along the lines of if one is over 40, she's no longer a HOT GIRL, but a GOLDEN GIRL.  It's meant to be funny, but NOOOOOOO.  I don't think 40+ has been "old" since before SATC.  I'm probably a couple of years older than Samantha Jones was in the first season of SATC.  Maybe this should be more humour than a peeve, though.

[theredhead77]

On 6/9/2022 at 10:15 AM, SusanM said:

This jumped out at me and I have to ask  the board - is this a generational thing?  I had a young fellow working for me for awhile (just before Covid) who was always moaning about his student loans and bills mounting up and yet every single lunch time, as in 5 days a week, he ordered in a meal delivered from local restaurants.  I get that it's his money to spend as he pleases but I was still a little surprised.  Am I showing my age when I think "what's wrong with bringing a sandwich and an apple from home? do you really need a frappacinno from Starbucks when you can't pay your bills?"

On 6/9/2022 at 10:20 AM, TattleTeeny said:

When I lived by myself, I found that there was barely a difference moneywise between (a) buying a lot of groceries or (b) buying less at a time at the food store and just ordering lunch and/or dinner (maybe in part because latter option would sometimes stretch into 2 meals? Only sometimes though; I have always been a generally hungry person!). As for the Starbuck's thing, back when I was paying off an exhorbitant (and predatory) student loan, cutting out life's "little extras" would hardly have made a tiny dent in that mess (art school, man. Ugh). 

^^^

This all circles back to "if they would stop eating avocado toast (or paying for Netflix) they would have money for a house". Not eating avocado toast is not going to result in enough money for a down payment. 

It is generational. When you're drowning in student loan debt, with a balance going up instead of down no matter how much you pay, and your rent for a tiny apartment you share with 3 other people is over half of what you bring home, sacrificing Starbucks, or lunch out (which could also be the only meal of the day), isn't going to create a stream of income.

 

[RealHousewife]

44 minutes ago, PRgal said:

Speaking of "old,"  someone on a Facebook group recently posted a meme that said something along the lines of if one is over 40, she's no longer a HOT GIRL, but a GOLDEN GIRL.  It's meant to be funny, but NOOOOOOO.  I don't think 40+ has been "old" since before SATC.  I'm probably a couple of years older than Samantha Jones was in the first season of SATC.  Maybe this should be more humour than a peeve, though.

How are you a golden girl at 40+ when you're still young enough to easily be a GG daughter?

I might be sensitive about age because I spent many years of my life feeling old, even as a child and barely an adult. I grew up constantly reminded I was the older sister, the oldest among my parents' friends kids, too old to begin gymnastics, etc. If a boy around their age thought I was attractive, one of the other girls would say "she's too old for you!" If younger friends wanted to do stuff and parents were uneasy I'd hear "she'll be with us and is like 35 now" when I was about 15 years away from that. It got, well, OLD.  

Even though I am much older now, I refuse to spend what is more than likely decades and decades left of my life feeling old. I'll admit some age jokes can be funny and won't pretend I haven't made them myself (normally when poked by someone who has it coming), but in general I don't like age shaming/teasing. 

Edited June 10, 2022 by RealHousewife

[SusanM]

1 hour ago, theredhead77 said:

It is generational. When you're drowning in student loan debt, with a balance going up instead of down no matter how much you pay, and your rent for a tiny apartment you share with 3 other people is over half of what you bring home, sacrificing Starbucks, or lunch out (which could also be the only meal of the day), isn't going to create a stream of income.

I have friends who get really annoyed when someone accuses the boomers of ruining things for the younger generation and acting like our generation had it all and none of us struggled.  Of course that's demonstrably false, but, and it's a big but - most boomers didn't have to take on enormous debt loads just to get a degree that didn't get them a decent job and even with a decent job didn't earn them enough to live on their own.  I'm glad this thread reminded me of that.

[Rose Quartz]

1 hour ago, theredhead77 said:

^^^

This all circles back to "if they would stop eating avocado toast (or paying for Netflix) they would have money for a house". Not eating avocado toast is not going to result in enough money for a down payment. 

It is generational. When you're drowning in student loan debt, with a balance going up instead of down no matter how much you pay, and your rent for a tiny apartment you share with 3 other people is over half of what you bring home, sacrificing Starbucks, or lunch out (which could also be the only meal of the day), isn't going to create a stream of income.

 

Nobody is saying that cutting out a few extras will somehow create a new revenue stream, and certainly not that someone should be starving themselves to pay off their bills, but it's incorrect to say that these things don't add up over time.  Take @SusanM's coworker for example.  Even the smallest frappaccino is over $5 so if he cut out his daily Starbucks he could save $25/week or $1200/year which should certainly be enough to make a few payments towards those bills that were causing him so much stress.  And that doesn't even touch his daily restaurant meals - it's all about striking a reasonable balance.

Personally, I always thought the avocado toast argument was stupid, but on the other hand if you're feeling pinched financially and still going out and spending $10 for that at a restaurant every day instead of buying a $5 bag of avocados and a $4 loaf of bread and making your own breakfast for a week, then yeah, I'm gonna  judge.  If that makes me an old fart so be it.

[ginger90]

Back in the day an aunt of mine worked at Woolworths. They would sell items for .25 each. If they weren’t moving, they would go on sale at 4/$1. “Sale” doesn’t always mean  bargain.

[peacheslatour]

1 minute ago, ginger90 said:

Back in the day an aunt of mine worked at Woolworths. They would sell items for .25 each. If they weren’t moving, they would go on sale at 4/$1. “Sale” doesn’t always mean  bargain.

I have a friend whose parents own an antique shop. If something doesn't sell and sits there long enough they raise the price.

[SusanM]

21 minutes ago, Rose Quartz said:

Personally, I always thought the avocado toast argument was stupid, but on the other hand if you're feeling pinched financially and still going out and spending $10 for that at a restaurant every day instead of buying a $5 bag of avocados and a $4 loaf of bread and making your own breakfast for a week, then yeah, I'm gonna  judge.  If that makes me an old fart so be it.

Yep.  I totally get the argument that a few dollars a day spent on a treat is a drop in the bucket if you are dealing with a huge debt load but on the other hand spending 20-30 dollars every single day (and that's just what I was personally aware of) isn't really a small treat,  That's adding up to anywhere from 400 to 500 a month.

[TattleTeeny]

6 hours ago, theredhead77 said:

^^^

This all circles back to "if they would stop eating avocado toast (or paying for Netflix) they would have money for a house". Not eating avocado toast is not going to result in enough money for a down payment. 

It is generational. When you're drowning in student loan debt, with a balance going up instead of down no matter how much you pay, and your rent for a tiny apartment you share with 3 other people is over half of what you bring home, sacrificing Starbucks, or lunch out (which could also be the only meal of the day), isn't going to create a stream of income.

 

There’s something unsettling (and maybe even a bit cruel) in the idea that someone with any kind of debt to be paid should not have any non-necessities until that debt is gone. (ETA: Not saying anyone here is doing that; was directed more toward whomever began that whole “avocado toast” nonsense).

Also, $5 gets you only 4 avocados where I am. 

Edited June 11, 2022 by TattleTeeny

[Adiba]

4 hours ago, theredhead77 said:

^^^

This all circles back to "if they would stop eating avocado toast (or paying for Netflix) they would have money for a house". Not eating avocado toast is not going to result in enough money for a down payment. 

It is generational. When you're drowning in student loan debt, with a balance going up instead of down no matter how much you pay, and your rent for a tiny apartment you share with 3 other people is over half of what you bring home, sacrificing Starbucks, or lunch out (which could also be the only meal of the day), isn't going to create a stream of income.

 

How one chooses to spend their money is, of course, their own business. 

I will agree that there are more things deemed necessary today than when my husband and I started out. We both did have student loans (both undergrad and grad school) to pay, though. We did not have new cars (I drove a hand-me-down beater station wagon gifted by my mil for the first year of my marriage), no cell phones, internet, etc.

So yes, the cost of living was less— but probably every generation preceding the next one can say that.

[theredhead77]

1 hour ago, TattleTeeny said:

There’s something unsettling (and maybe even a bit cruel) in the idea that someone with any kind of debt to be paid should not have any non-necessities until that debt is gone. (ETA: Not saying anyone here is doing that; was directed more toward whomever began that whole “avocado toast” nonsense).

It's an extension of the empathy free "I had a loan from the bank of mom and dad or inheritance, or was able to live rent free, college paid for 'worked hard' to get where I am, why should I help you" mentality. Which is one of my biggest peeves.

1 hour ago, TattleTeeny said:

Also, $5 gets you only avocados where I am. 

I started buying quite a bit of my produce at Target. Avocados are still 99c each (up from the mismarked 75c each).

[TattleTeeny]

I think we have a lot of the same peeves.

Also, my comment should have said “4 avocados” — I really thought I typed that 4! 

Edited June 11, 2022 by TattleTeeny

[SusanM]

20 minutes ago, Adiba said:

So yes, the cost of living was less— but probably every generation preceding the next one can say that.

Funny you post this now, I just had a conversation with my Dad on this subject.  He feels bad for "the kids" today because of the economy the way it is, which is sweet if him, but I pointed out that no generation has really had it all that easy - least of all his own (he's 87). 

Anyway I think the biggest peeve I have right now in regard to the economy is that for cripes sake it's been one damn thing after another now for a couple of years and c'mon universe - can we please catch a break?

[Bastet]

2 hours ago, TattleTeeny said:

There’s something unsettling (and maybe even a bit cruel) in the idea that someone with any kind of debt to be paid should not have any non-necessities until that debt is gone.

It's the same attitude that leads to shaming at the grocery store if someone paying via EBT card (which, thankfully, is far more discreet than when there were actual food stamps) dares purchase something someone in line behind them deems to be frivolous.

I've always lived below my means in order to amass savings for emergencies, luxuries, and the ability to leave a job without having another one lined up if needed.  I like a financial cushion, and I don't like debt.  I opened an IRA as soon as I was eligible, and put the max into my 401K at my entry level salary, because of how both things would benefit me in the long run.  Blah, blah, blah -- the fact I never had any student loan debt is what made all the difference in the world in the first place; that gave me a lot more freedom of choice, and acting like my financial security is all a result of my fiscal responsibility would be ludicrous.

And even if I hadn't always been able to pay my credit card bill in full each month, I'd have still bought booze, gone to the movies, ordered in, and had nights out.  Not excessively, so I agree a scenario like @SusanM describes, where someone with significant debt is spending $20-30 every single day to have food delivered, is unwise, and it would be hard not to roll my eyes at someone regularly living like that also keeping up a constant stream of complaining about their financial situation.  But I wouldn't feel I wasn't "allowed" to sometimes spend $30 on lunch just because I could have made one instead for $5.

[theredhead77]

2 hours ago, TattleTeeny said:

I think we have a lot of the same peeves.

Also, my comment should have said “4 avocados” — I really thought I typed that 4! 

I was thinking I know bread got expensive but if you can only buy avocados and no toast thats sad.

I'm totally making avocado toast for breakfast.

Edited June 11, 2022 by theredhead77

[bilgistic]

People who have never been poor have no idea how excruciatingly hard it is to be poor.

[SusanM]

11 hours ago, Bastet said:

the fact I never had any student loan debt is what made all the difference in the world in the first place; that gave me a lot more freedom of choice, and acting like my financial security is all a result of my fiscal responsibility would be ludicrous.

Same.  My husband and I were lucky enough to be living in Quebec when we reached university age and the tuitions there were significantly lower than pretty much anywhere else.  We also  both were able to live at home, in comfortable middle class homes at that, which meant when we graduated we had no student debt. 

But we both know people in the exact same circumstance  who, to use that famous quote act like "he was born on third base and thought he hit a triple".  If you are fortunate enough to get a decent head start into grownup land at least have the grace to acknowledge that instead of assuming this is true for everyone and it's only their own bad choices that make a difference!

Edited June 11, 2022 by SusanM

[Boston]

I have bought alot of products i.e. Swiffer etc. to wash my kitchen floor (I have been doing it by hand with ammonia and water).  My floor is really big. I am getting older and really don't want to be on my hands and knees.  Anyone have suggestions?  It is a tile floor and it is WHITE.. ugh.  it has many squares in it.  Thanks.

[ginger90]

5 minutes ago, Boston said:

I have bought alot of products i.e. Swiffer etc. to wash my kitchen floor (I have been doing it by hand with ammonia and water).  My floor is really big. I am getting older and really don't want to be on my hands and knees.  Anyone have suggestions?  It is a tile floor and it is WHITE.. ugh.  it has many squares in it.  Thanks.

Depending on what type of tile, a steam mop is great.

[PRgal]

5 hours ago, bilgistic said:

People who have never been poor have no idea how excruciatingly hard it is to be poor.

My parents covered my education (everything - including books and living expenses) and I'm grateful for that.  However, sometimes, people like me don't want to admit that, because we're fearful of being criticized.  They never wanted me to work while I was at school - I was meant to concentrate in my studies.  Work was for the summer or co-op opportunities and money made was meant to be invested/put away for what's now termed "adulting."  I'm now okay with admitting that, but this wasn't the case when I was younger.  
 

[SoMuchTV]

29 minutes ago, Boston said:

I have bought alot of products i.e. Swiffer etc. to wash my kitchen floor (I have been doing it by hand with ammonia and water).  My floor is really big. I am getting older and really don't want to be on my hands and knees.  Anyone have suggestions?  It is a tile floor and it is WHITE.. ugh.  it has many squares in it.  Thanks.

I have something like this (look for "ocedar spray mop" if the link doesn't work).  The pad is washable and the solution tank is refillable (unlike Swiffer).  I still have to drag out the "real" mop every once in a while but this takes care of most of the cleanup.

https://www.amazon.com/Cedar-ProMist-Microfiber-Spray-Refills/dp/B07FMPT1LG/ref=sr_1_5?crid=3BFSI11185GUC&keywords=ocedar+spray+mop&qid=1654975456&sprefix=ocedar+spray+mop%2Caps%2C89&sr=8-5

[emma675]

28 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

Depending on what type of tile, a steam mop is great.

This is what I was going to recommend, too. And if you have pets, it's safer than Swiffer wet products.