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Pet Peeves: Aka Things That Make You Go "Gah!"


Message added by Mod-Tigerkatze,

Your Pet Peeves are your Pet Peeves and you're welcome to express them here. However, that does not mean that you can use this topic to go after your fellow posters; being annoyed by something they say or do is not a Pet Peeve.

If there's something you need clarification on, please remember: it's always best to address a fellow poster directly; don't talk about what they said, talk to them. Politely, of course! Everyone is entitled to their opinion and should be treated with respect. (If need be, check out the how to have healthy debates guidelines for more).

While we're happy to grant the leniency that was requested about allowing discussions to go beyond Pet Peeves, please keep in mind that this is still the Pet Peeves topic. Non-pet peeves discussions should be kept brief, be related to a pet peeve and if a fellow poster suggests the discussion may be taken to Chit Chat or otherwise tries to course-correct the topic, we ask that you don't dismiss them. They may have a point.

Message added by Mod-Tigerkatze,
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8 hours ago, bubbls said:

 

Yeah, it's especially difficult when I have to avoid the trash can and the vehicles. I've lost count of how many times I've almost hit their car. Idiots. 

Buy an old beater and hit 'em! Don't leave a note. (Fuck off, Santa! Sometimes, you just want to be bad.)

Edited by riley702
  • Love 3
On 11/30/2017 at 1:42 PM, backformore said:
On 11/30/2017 at 1:31 PM, peacheslatour said:

“After a time, you may find that having is not so pleasing a thing after all as wanting. It is not logical, but is often true.” -

Thank you, Spock!

Thank you, Theodore Sturgeon.  99 percent of everything may be crap, as per your famous Law, but Amok Time is purest latinum.

Quote

Who is going to spend that much money to wear a "joke" sweater to a Christmas party? 

Me...although I didn't spend too much ($24, including shipping maybe?) and it's actually something a bar decided to do on a night that my BF has a gig there so I decided I'd participate. I have never actually attended an "ugly sweater" party so I thought it would be fun (what can I say, I like a themed gathering). Plus, my sweater (actually a sweatshirt) says "Merry Krampus," hahahahhahaaaa! I have to drop some shit off at Goodwill this weekend anyway, so maybe I'll also see if I can find a secondhand one from decades past too--I pray for something that screams "Xmas in the '70s"! 

I'm sorry; don't hate me!

Quote

I haven't ironed in probably 20 years. If it needs ironing, it's too fancy for me.

I'll iron fabric that I'm using to sew something but after that--once the fabric has morphed into a real-deal dress--nope. I'll hang that bitch in the bathroom while I take a shower and hope for the best (though I have plugged in my flat iron to smooth a collar or two).

Edited by TattleTeeny
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On 11/30/2017 at 5:44 PM, emma675 said:

I'm a weirdo who finds ironing soothing, so send it my way.

I do too. But since we have started shopping at Costco the ironing board is the only flat space we have to store all the stuff.  The last thing I ironed was my son's high school graduation gown in 2004.

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My pet peeve today is shipping companies. All of them, UPS, USPS, FedEx, etc. 

I have one package with USPS that should have been delivered on Thursday and the tracking system's last update was 4 days ago when it was "in transit". Nothing since then. And yesterday UPS delivered a package to some random business instead of my home. Why do they all seem to be getting worse??

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UPS was the worst but FedEx is getting right up there. I had two packages, one on one day, the other the day after, supposedly delivered. I complained, they checked, the driver said he delivered but didn't. Two days later both packages were found on the truck and delivered. Liar hopefully was fired. For me the US Postal Service is the best. He leaves the package if possible between the storm door and the front door and knocks on the door always when delivering.

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31 minutes ago, rcc said:

UPS was the worst but FedEx is getting right up there. I had two packages, one on one day, the other the day after, supposedly delivered. I complained, they checked, the driver said he delivered but didn't. Two days later both packages were found on the truck and delivered. Liar hopefully was fired. For me the US Postal Service is the best. He leaves the package if possible between the storm door and the front door and knocks on the door always when delivering.

I'm always find other people's packages sitting on my porch. Then I have to figure out where they go.  Kind of annoying.

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1 hour ago, emma675 said:

My pet peeve today is shipping companies. All of them, UPS, USPS, FedEx, etc. 

I have one package with USPS that should have been delivered on Thursday and the tracking system's last update was 4 days ago when it was "in transit". Nothing since then. And yesterday UPS delivered a package to some random business instead of my home. Why do they all seem to be getting worse??

Temporary holiday help could be one reason. My peeve is getting huge boxes with little tiny articles in them. Yesterday some fancy organic body wash I'll be putting in my son's Xmas stocking came, in not one but two huge boxes. I mean you could have fit a fucking king sized down comforter in there. I was pissed and I will be bitching to Amazon about it.

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Not a peeve but shipping related. Today I happened to be cleaning my door when the mailman dropped off my mail. He said "you won't believe this, I have about 100 boxes in my truck and none of them are for you." I replied "that can't be true, you should check again." Then we both laughed. Amazon is a problem. 

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2 hours ago, Mindthinkr said:

My boyfriend left his phone on the front porch by accident last time he went to work in Europe. $374 later with UPS to get it over there and it still took a week. All of them have gotten slower and overwhelmed by how much we order online vs shopping in person. 

That's insane. I have shipped from TX to Hong Kong several times in the past five years using the USPS global priority flat rate boxes, and their largest flat rate box was around $60 to ship there, at least a year or so ago; it looks as if various European destinations are now around $80. A phone would fit into one of their smaller boxes, for probably around $30-40. Admittedly, it can take up to 6-10 days to arrive, but it doesn't sound as if the delivery time for UPS was much better. There's also a USPS Global Express shipping option, for 1-3 day delivery, with higher prices (~$130-$200) but still cheaper than UPS. I have priced UPS a few times for shipping various stuff, and almost always found it cheaper and more reliable to ship via USPS instead. However, I used to work for a company that did a lot of shipping and their preferred carrier was UPS, but they had a hugely discounted commercial account with them. As a private individual, I've almost never found UPS to be the best choice for either price or delivery time. I've never checked out some of the other services for international delivery, but what UPS charged you sounds like highway robbery to me. Apologies to any UPS employees here, but my impression is that UPS can be a good deal for commercial accounts who ship a lot of packages, but not so much for one-off situations.

Edited by BookWoman56
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I don't really mind stores putting out stuff for holidays months in advance because I often like to plan ahead, and some of the stuff has to be bought ahead of time, like at craft stores. I can't buy stuff to make in December and expect to get it done. Also, clearly people do buy this stuff that early, or the stores wouldn't waste floor space on it.

I do wish, however, that the store would not start taking down stuff until the holiday has actually passed. I'm still getting Christmas decorations. Don't start putting other stuff in its place yet.

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Speaking of phones, does anyone know why, in my AT&T account (which I was looking up because I am having so much trouble with storage lately!) there would be a second number? The screen looks like this:

ACCOUNT NUMBER: 1234567890

Wireless Users

  • [icon of what looks like a phone or tablet] / My Name / a number I don't know (and which isn't taking calls)
  • [icon of an iPhone, which is a bit smaller than image above it] / My Name Again: my actual cell #

[When I click on the strange number, I see this:]

  • My Name
  • Contact email Don’t have one yet
  • Contract end date Not under contract

Trying to chat through the AT&T site now; it's taking a long time. Is this normal? Help me, techies!

Edited by TattleTeeny
NEVER MIND! Solved--the mystery and the storage issue!

I just had the most frustrating online chat with Amazon. It was right up there with a cable company chat.

Amazon is doing a holiday promotion in which you complete five tasks--verbally ask the search bar to look for an item, look for an item using your phone's camera (via bar code, for example), etc. I did all the tasks and haven't gotten the $5 promo code that was to automatically be applied to my account  I have never had this issue before with Amazon. The credit was not showing up at checkout.

I started the chat function within the Amazon app and explained what the problem was. It quickly became obvious that the rep had no idea what I was even talking about, much less how to remedy it. He was telling me how to add items to my cart, and then asking me what I was ordering. At one point he said something about how certain things were only eligible for Prime members. Guy, take a half second to look at my account. I'm a Prime member.

I asked to talk to a supervisor. He understood what the problem was, but was telling me that the credit would be applied after purchase. Not so much.

I spent nearly 40 minutes on that ridiculousness and was exhausted and angry. I'm going to hope the credit shows up in my account within another couple of days. The things I'm ordering aren't urgent.

I get that the job they are doing is sheer insanity. I worked at a Sears call center in high school and it was bonkers. I can't imagine having to navigate the breadth and depth of merchandise that Amazon retails, along with the services it provides.

What I do blame the management for is not properly training the reps. It should've taken maybe two whole minutes for the rep to look at: 1) Did customer complete the promotional task? Yes. 2) Did customer receive credit in account? No. 3) Give customer promo code.

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I must have jinxed myself a page or so back. Seriously, Amazon, is this the best way leave an envelope containing two packs of bass strings*? Right on the actual ground exactly where anyone entering our building's front door would step (especially in the dark) and about six inches from the edge of stairs overlooking a bunch of bushy landscaping about eight feet below?! See that dark corner to the left...I'd never even see that envelope if it ends up down there! Good thing we have cool neighbors who grab each other's stuff and bring it in; I just hope one of them gets home before dark...and that the wind isn't as bad as it was this morning!

* Clearly they did think so, as this a photo taken by the delivery person and added to my order info to prove the package was left (which I guess could ostensibly prove nothing if (A) your front stoop is super-nondescript or (B) the package was left at the wrong apartment in a complex full of identical  ones).

imageId-acb0114b-41b0-3b92-eee7-fce8a78b35ff.jpg

Edited by TattleTeeny
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Does Service (be it FedEx, UPS, DHL, USPS) depend on the area? Because I've never had crappy service from them. I live in a high rise where you need a fob to gain access, but the delivery guys/gals are also given the fob; and so things I've ordered are left right in front of my door. Even when I lived in...garden apartments, I think they're called. Same thing. I live in the DC/MD/VA area.

The only time I ever had an issue with the USPS, was when I was actually in the post office--the first when I was renewing my passport, and before I have the much better contact lenses I have now--the person across the desk refused to read my passport ID--I could barely make them out. Now, I don't know if federal law forbid her from confirming the number--I'd already written on the form; she wouldn't confirm it. So when I called (because she was just being downright nasty) to complain, guess what? It's not against the law and she should have been able to help me; because Lord knows, when you (general you) mess up or use the wrong form, they're quick to tell you. 

The second time was when I had ordered notary supplies and according to the tracking information, it said delivered. Yet, it hadn't been delivered to the office. I played email tag/telephone tag with USPS; the local one that actually delivered; the whoever I spoke with on the phone by dialing the 800 number. And they couldn't tell me WHO the deliverer was; no way to determine that. Riiiight. And then lo and behold; two weeks later, we found the package in the general mail room. the mailman/woman didn't even come up to the FLOOR of the office to attempt delivery.

But I've never had issues with Amazon, who mostly us UPS or other carriers to deliver stuff. So it's not really AMAZON who does the delivering.                  

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Sometimes they enter the "has been delivered" info in advance, say on the night before the delivery actually goes out or earlier in the day than the delivery person usually shows up. I always wondered exactly what the point of that is. Even if it somehow saves time, isn't that canceled out by frantic people calling the CS department to report that their packages haven't arrived?

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When Amazon started selling on behalf of other retailers, things started to take a nosedive. I only order what is being sold by Amazon, not other retailers "by Amazon", and if I can get a better deal in a local store, I do so. I am a hermit with social anxiety, though, so home delivery is always going to appeal to me.

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4 minutes ago, bilgistic said:

When Amazon started selling on behalf of other retailers, things started to take a nosedive. I only order what is being sold by Amazon, not other retailers "by Amazon", and if I can get a better deal in a local store, I do so. I am a hermit with social anxiety, though, so home delivery is always going to appeal to me.

I think that you brought up a good point. I had a problem and I believe it was because a seller shipped it, not Amazon. I'm going to have to keep a closer eye on this. Thumbs up! 

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In all my life, I've had USPS lose only one package.  I've only had a few problems with other carriers, too, though (although since I've used USPS so much more frequently than the others, they do have a worse average, even though it's still a good score).  But pretty much every year, when I have a variety of carriers delivering things I've ordered online, the stuff that's coming by USPS shows up fastest.  Three cheers for government services.  So when I'm the one doing the shipping, and thus selecting a carrier, I go with the USPS.  I also agree with whomever said upthread that UPS/Fed-Ex seems like a good financial option for commercial accounts doing a lot of shipping, but not for random people shipping an individual package. 

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A few weeks back, I ordered a printer from Amazon; as a Prime customer, I was told it would arrive in two business days via USPS. It didn't arrive for over a week. I watched the tracking over the course of the week, as the printer went from Massachusetts to within 20, then 15, miles of me in Connecticut; then to Jersey City, then back to Massachusetts.... in the meantime (day four, to be exact), I went to Staples and bought almost the same printer for $50 less.  When the printer was delivered, the online information said it had been left in my mailbox.  My mailbox looks like the ones in the picture; and the printer weighs 35 pounds, and is contained in a box that's about 24 x 24 x 24.  So, my mail carrier has a sense of humor. S/he actually schlepped it up to my front door, to his/her credit.

At work, we shipped a book via USPS to someone in Florida, and now I've watched his book go up and down the East Coast three or four times (I've already sent a replacement book). Today, we were unable to complete online customs forms for our foreign orders, the only message on the USPS website being that that function was not available.  I don't like to beat up anyone in particular, but right now the USPS is not my friend. 

My UPS delivery guy honks as he pulls up, and either brings stuff to the front door or puts it out of plain sight under the front porch.  Right now, he's kicking the USPS's ass in my neighborhood.

 

Outdoor-Apartment-Mailboxes.jpg

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I ordered a dress from Etsy once and through no fault of the seller, who sent it right out from Florida via USPS, that thing went all over the place for weeks before getting to me--it actually went through the town two over from mine here in Jersey before leaving the state again! I messaged the seller just to let her know and both of us were baffled as hell.

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I posted that my complex implemented a new package delivery room, with lockers which is a fine idea in theory but the machine to open the locker is always broken. For the holidays my company gives everyone (10k plus employees) a food-based catalog to select something from. I placed my order right away to be delivered the week of Dec 1st. It didn't show up so I called and it's been delayed by UPS. They sent a replacement that I suspect will end up in a locker that I can't get access to.

The leasing office can open the lockers but they are hesitant to let you take your packages without signing for them.

So I ordered a cat tree from Chewy since they were on sale. I was able to find a $70 cat tree for $40. I ordered it, it arrived today...and I have the base and all the seats but no poles to attach it to. Called Chewy and they said I can't get a replacement because that model is all out of stock. They are refunding me but they refused to take the rest of the items back. Not sure what I'm supposed to do with or where to put these useless cat tree parts. The rep said she would call me when they get the model in stock again, but by that time they will be back to full price, which I'm not willing to pay. SMH

Edited by AgentRXS
  • Love 3

I got the girls' cat tree from--you guessed it--Amazon. It was at the end of October. It took extra time because it was delivered fully assembled (what I wanted). I have no issue putting together Ikea furniture, but I didn't want to put together a cat tree. I was afraid it would be unsteady, and everything I read online about assembling cat trees said it was endlessly frustrating--not that Ikea furniture isn't.

The tree comes up to my shoulders, so the box was huge. I also didn't want a super-heavy box of unassembled cat tree delivered to the leasing office for me to figure out how to get it back to my apartment. UPS randomly decides what they will leave at my door versus what they will leave at the leasing office.

Anyway, I'm glad they are refunding you the money. Maybe list the parts on Craigslist and someone who is a woodworker can take them off your hands, and they can make the posts for the parts and use the tree for their cat(s).

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Chewy's business model has long been not to want stuff back, but that is generally to let a customer keep something not quite right but usable and get the preferred item in addition to it (thus keeping them happy) or to encourage a customer to donate to a local shelter/rescue something that would otherwise go unused (thus keeping them happy plus leading to word of mouth about the goodwill).  Pieces of a cat tree are different, in that they're not as easy for you to turn from your trash taking up space to someone else's treasure to be utilized, but, as noted, you can probably find someone via Craigslist/Freecycle/etc. who can use the parts as components of a homemade tree.  If I was local and soon to be/thinking of making a tree, I'd definitely snatch up such an offer if the materials were of adequate quality.

  • Love 3
9 hours ago, AgentRXS said:

So I ordered a cat tree from Chewy since they were on sale. I was able to find a $70 cat tree for $40. I ordered it, it arrived today...and I have the base and all the seats but no poles to attach it to. Called Chewy and they said I can't get a replacement because that model is all out of stock. They are refunding me but they refused to take the rest of the items back. Not sure what I'm supposed to do with or where to put these useless cat tree parts. The rep said she would call me when they get the model in stock again, but by that time they will be back to full price, which I'm not willing to pay. SMH

There's always habitat for humanity for a tax deduction  [same with Goodwill (not my favorite for reasons I won't bore you with now) and Salvation Army]. Do you know a carpenter who can modify? What about attaching the components to a cheap shelving unit? Good luck. 

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10 hours ago, AgentRXS said:

The rep said she would call me when they get the model in stock again, but by that time they will be back to full price, which I'm not willing to pay. SMH

Contact the manufacturer and tell them what happened.  They might be willing to send you the missing parts.  Be sure to mention your job and that you work with local animal rescue - that would hit a soft spot for me and I would be more motivated to try and help.  Especially when their seller, Chewy, has not been helpful at all.

Since it should come with instructions and a parts list, it shouldn't be too hard to find what you need at the local hardware store.  I'd touch base with your pet resources and let them know you need a handy man to make the pieces you need.  Any place that sells lumber (like Lowes and Home Depot) should be willing to cut the pieces to size for you.  If there is an ACE Hardware, the floor staff are usually super helpful and have talked me through a number of projects.  It may end up looking like a Frankencattree, but if it works and makes your babies happy?  Who cares?

 

I broke my favorite coffee cup - it was the World's Best Boss cup just like Michael Scott's on the Office.  I had it so long that you could only see some of the remaining writing.  I'm using a back-up mug, but I suspect a new World's Best Boss one will be on my Christmas list.

Edited by DeLurker
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9 hours ago, bilgistic said:

I got the girls' cat tree from--you guessed it--Amazon. It was at the end of October. It took extra time because it was delivered fully assembled (what I wanted). I have no issue putting together Ikea furniture, but I didn't want to put together a cat tree. I was afraid it would be unsteady, and everything I read online about assembling cat trees said it was endlessly frustrating--not that Ikea furniture isn't.

The tree comes up to my shoulders, so the box was huge. I also didn't want a super-heavy box of unassembled cat tree delivered to the leasing office for me to figure out how to get it back to my apartment. UPS randomly decides what they will leave at my door versus what they will leave at the leasing office.

Anyway, I'm glad they are refunding you the money. Maybe list the parts on Craigslist and someone who is a woodworker can take them off your hands, and they can make the posts for the parts and use the tree for their cat(s).

Haha, one of my peeves is waiting around for help--even if I know that that is the best course of action. So, the weekend before my two kittens came home over 4 years ago, I set about preparing the house. Well, I wanted a new cat tree--and a big one (3-month-old boy kittens are no joke; you better have plenty of stuff for them to climb, hurl themselves at, and outright destroy!). Instead of waiting for my BF to get home, I went to PetSmart and found one reduced in price because it was the floor model, which also meant it was already assembled...and stood at 6 feet tall. I am 5'4" and somewhat scrawny.

So, I got someone to cram this monster into my car...at the time an Acura Integra. And then I drove home, and yet again, instead of waiting for my BF, I unloaded that thing from the car, rested the penultimate shelf level on my shoulder, and lopsidedly wrangled it up the 5 or 6 outside steps, and then the flight of stairs to my door. And then lugged it up the flight of steps inside my place. Yikes.

And when he got home, did he praise my freakish strength and impressive determination? NO! He scolded me for being impatient!

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Thanks for all the suggestions.. Inexplicably, the girls like the blue hooded bed that came with it (never mind that they have a brown hooded bed and beehive shaped bed that they've used once or twice then ignored).  I'll think it over and decide whether to got Home Depot and try to get the posts made or to just donate the rest of the stuff.

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On 12/1/2017 at 0:43 PM, BookWoman56 said:

If the sinus headache/pain persists, go have it checked out. I am prone to sinus infections and so often ignore them, just treating the symptoms, but a few weeks ago I ended up in the ER after having severe dizziness, etc.. I could not stand up or walk straight and thought I was having a stroke, because I had a mini-stroke about a month or so prior to this.  The hospital did a CT scan of my head, and the ER doctor came around to report that my CT scan looked better than his, except for the major sinus infection that needed antibiotics. 

Many years ago I had a headache that would just would not go away no matter how many pain killers I took. I went to the dr's and was told it was a stress headache, get rest, take a hot bath and you'll be fine. After 3 weeks I went back and said that I was pretty sure I had a sinus infection, my dr said that since I did not have green discharge that it was not. A week later I went back and demanded a CT scan, 3 hours later I had a prescription for an antibiotic and an apology. Not every patient presents with every symptom, that was a month of hell.

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That's why I haven't knit anything in seven and a half years, @DeLurker. That's when Mommy Kitty (never name a feral cat Mommy) had her kittens in our attic. We brought them down to socialize them and find homes for them, but we only found a home for one of them. That's why we have three fat and lazy cats now. (Seriously, I tried to put them on a diet, but the one that isn't fat complained so much -- generally in the middle of the night -- about not getting food. The other two were still eating a chunk of his food, too.)

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29 minutes ago, auntlada said:

That's why I haven't knit anything in seven and a half years, @DeLurker. That's when Mommy Kitty (never name a feral cat Mommy) had her kittens in our attic. We brought them down to socialize them and find homes for them, but we only found a home for one of them. That's why we have three fat and lazy cats now. (Seriously, I tried to put them on a diet, but the one that isn't fat complained so much -- generally in the middle of the night -- about not getting food. The other two were still eating a chunk of his food, too.)

Lol...that sounds like my house. The big one got fat because he pushed his sister out of her bowl after scarfing his! Good luck. I'm constantly trying to make him move more and eat less and sometimes I just don't have the energy. 

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2 hours ago, Katy M said:

my pet peeve: radio commercials that include horns blaring or car crash sounds or to a lesser extent, sirens.  Don't do that to me!!!!

In my early teens the family went on a road trip with the camper. I was playing my Moody Blues tape "In Search of the Lost Chord" which was one of the very few tapes of "long hair hippy music" my parents could tolerate.

There's one song that has a kind of squeaky repetitive sound that had my dad convinced the bearings were wearing out on the front wheel. I can't recall how many times he pulled over to check both wheels until we realized it was the instrumentation of that one particular song.

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4 hours ago, GoodieGirl said:

Many years ago I had a headache that would just would not go away no matter how many pain killers I took. I went to the dr's and was told it was a stress headache, get rest, take a hot bath and you'll be fine. After 3 weeks I went back and said that I was pretty sure I had a sinus infection, my dr said that since I did not have green discharge that it was not. A week later I went back and demanded a CT scan, 3 hours later I had a prescription for an antibiotic and an apology. Not every patient presents with every symptom, that was a month of hell.

I remember an incident like that from when I was young. It happened to my Mom.

My Mom's regular Dr. was on leave for a few weeks so she had to see another Dr. in the same office for what she suspected was a sinus infection. She had plenty in her life to know. The Dr. gives her 10 days of an antibiotic and sends her on her way. After she was done with those she still didn't feel any better so she made another appointment and saw the same guy. When she told him she still had the same symptoms and didn't feel any better he raised his voice going on about how she couldn't still have an infection and told her he was sending her for a sinus x-ray. Luckily the building for that was on the same campus which was a former private school that an insurance/healthcare group took over so different buildings were different departments.

When the Dr. got the x-ray results back it showed she still had an infection and he called her to apologize for his behavior, for not believing her and to let her know he had a different script called in to the pharmacy.

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25 minutes ago, navelgazer said:

Grammar Nazi peeve -- a national news channel crawl using "capital" when referring to Twitler's announcement about Jerusalem.  No, dummies.  It's capitol.  Capital is about money. 

How hard is that? 

Actually, capital is the city, capitol is the building.  As in "Congress meets in the Capitol, which is located in the capital, Washington, DC."

  • Love 5
Message added by Mod-Tigerkatze,

Your Pet Peeves are your Pet Peeves and you're welcome to express them here. However, that does not mean that you can use this topic to go after your fellow posters; being annoyed by something they say or do is not a Pet Peeve.

If there's something you need clarification on, please remember: it's always best to address a fellow poster directly; don't talk about what they said, talk to them. Politely, of course! Everyone is entitled to their opinion and should be treated with respect. (If need be, check out the how to have healthy debates guidelines for more).

While we're happy to grant the leniency that was requested about allowing discussions to go beyond Pet Peeves, please keep in mind that this is still the Pet Peeves topic. Non-pet peeves discussions should be kept brief, be related to a pet peeve and if a fellow poster suggests the discussion may be taken to Chit Chat or otherwise tries to course-correct the topic, we ask that you don't dismiss them. They may have a point.

Message added by Mod-Tigerkatze,

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