S19.E07: Week 5: The Switch-Up

[Packerbrewerbadger]

Producers, next week can we please have a pro opening number with couples doing the Viennese Waltz or a Paso or Fox Trot, you know, a couple dance, just anything but the same o same o we keep getting week after week!!! Mix it up!!!

[OakGoblinFly]

I thought Julianne was fairly hypocritical calling out Janel's raunchiness since Julianne herself danced pretty naked a couple of weeks ago. I do agree with her, but still.

 

 

Julianne didn't call out Janel on being raunch/sexy she called her out on not dancing burlesque - which she didn't.

 Why did PETA put all those lifts in when he had so much trouble with them?

 

 

I know - Jonathan was doing well -actual dance steps - until the lifts started and then he completely lost it.  I wish Jonathan was paired with someone other than Allison .... I'm beginning to think that it was a mistake to have her on this show.  Her Bollywood routine with Antonio was really, really bad - didn't seem very Bollywood to me.

 

And what was with the crappy camera work?  I didn't want to see Allison that dance (really I want less focus on the pros) I wanted to see Antonio - instead I got close-ups of Allison's face. 

[OakGoblinFly]

Does burlesque actually have rules by which it can be judged?  Particularly within the constraints of primetime network television?

 

 

I think there are certain aspects that make a burlesque dance burlesque - think Pussy Cat Dolls or Dita Von Teese; heck think of Natalie Wood in Gypsy or even the movie with Cher and Christina Aguilera.  Yes, the dances are very sexy (no more than the Latin dances) but there is a certain amount of humor/tongue in cheek about them that was missing from Janel's routine. 

Edited October 14, 2014 by OakGoblinFly

[spanana]

I don't think it really matters what Julianne and Carrie Anne have danced in the past and if they have ever really done real burlesque before.  They also haven't done real flamenco before, but were still asked to judge a flamenco routine.  Considering Janel still got 8's and a 9, I'm not even sure what there is really to complain about.  Straight 8's would have been more than fair for that dance.   As most of the celebs got harsh comments, Janel got off super easy.  I think their only point, albeit perhaps expressed badly, is that they questioned whether the routine was burlesque or not.  It's not like they called her out and then gave her 6's.  She got one point less than Alfonso.

[OakGoblinFly]

I agree with everyone else who said it was the wrong week for the judges to break out the reality paddles.  That should have happened next week.  I thought the switch was supposed to be more about having fun and learning from someone else.  Julianne should be ashamed of herself, and Jessie J should just stick to singing.  It's no fun when a guest judge is not a fan of the show.

 

 

It should have happened in week two (I'm all for letting the cebs have an easy first week) or week three at the very latest ..... week five is way to late to hit the special snowflakes with the reality stick. 

[Donny Ketchum]

I generally find Jonathan adorkable, but how could he not know how off he was tonight? I agree with the comment that it was uncomfortable to watch.

I'm a bit shocked by the sentiments that Jonathan's being screwed by Allison and has thus gotten his low scores because of her.  I think getting a low score with Peta, as well, just shows to me that he's really not very good.  I imagine he's out in the next few weeks.

[OakGoblinFly]

Carrie Ann Inaba danced topless in Madonna's GIRLIE show, it was raunchy and pretty ugly with her bald head, so I just don't get the Burlesque has to be funny/cheeky comments, Inaba's Burlesque was just WTF.  

 

The fun comes from how you feel when you watch the dance, and there were moments on Janel's dance that you just had to have a sly giggle at Artem and her. This girl is incredibly beautiful, and curvy, the way Burlesque dancers are supposed to look, not like Asian boys, Carrie Ann. I thought this one was great for Janel and we all enjoyed it at our house.  I loved Artem's nod to both Bob Fosse and Baz Lurhman, except Bob and Baz would have been raunchier.Oh well it is PG 13  

 

 

By definition, burlesque IS intended to be humorous.  

 

noun

1. an artistic composition, especially literary or dramatic, that, for the sake of laughter, vulgarizes lofty material or treats ordinary material with mock dignity.

2. any ludicrous parody or grotesque caricature.

3. Also, burlesk. a humorous and provocative stage show featuring slapstick humor, comic skits, bawdy songs, striptease acts, and a scantily clad female chorus.

adjective

4. involving ludicrous or mocking treatment of a solemn subject.

5. of, pertaining to, or like stage-show burlesque.

 

That being said, I agree with Carrie Ann and Julianne in saying what Janel did wasn't burlesque - blame Artem for that mess.  Janel can only dance what she's given.

 

Yes, Lea did miss a step at the very beginning of her routine - however, she quickly got back on the correct beat and performed the heck out of that routine.  It was fun, happy, bouncy, and a lot of fun to watch.

 

I enjoyed Alfonso's routine - it would have been perfect if he kept his shoulders down.

 

Despite being a lankly teen who is nothing but limps, I was impressed with Sadie's dance - the choreography was complex, quick, and she kept up nicely.

 

It was nice to see Bethany let her guard down a little (I like the little show she has with Sadie - so nice to see teenagers act like teenagers) - I think has Bethany becomes more acclimated to the process we'll see more and more of her guard come down.

Edited October 14, 2014 by OakGoblinFly

[Donny Ketchum]

I would be okay if any of the bottom 4 (Michael, Tommy, Jonathan, Antonio) left.

These four are very clearly inferior to the top five.  But I unfortunately think that Michael's fanbase (he has the Nascar voting bloc plus Bill's voting bloc from two seasons ago) will carry him past at least one of the top five (Alfonso, Sadie, Lea, Bethany, and Janel).  Which sucks, because he's so terrible.  Like I said, Jonathan's probably gone next week.  If not he, then Antonio or Tommy.

Edited October 14, 2014 by Donny Ketchum

[sidwich]

 

Why did PETA put all those lifts in when he had so much trouble with them?

 

Well, one thing is that with swing, for better or worse, people expect them.

 

I THINK the more practical answer is that "Rock this Town" is BLISTERINGLY fast, especially for an inexperienced dancer.  Doing the charleston steps that fast is VERY tiring, and Jonathan was already starting to fatigue halfway through the routine.  (Seriously, try doing charleston steps for 90 seconds and see how fast you get tired...)

 

I think Peta put in the aerials to give him a break actually.  With a lot of aerials, it's actually much more on the woman to get the move done.  The guy CAN plant and brute force it (not ideal, but this is DWTS, so a lot of circumstances are not ideal). 

 

I actually thought Jonathan and Peta got the most difficult assignment out of the bunch.  You can't really half-ass the Jitterbug.  There actually ARE steps to it that people expect to see (unlike Burlesque).  There is a very real partnering component that you can't hand wave.  (It's not a dance that you can mostly do as side by side, like the Bollywood or Charleston).  The music they were given was blisteringly fast.  

 

All in all, I thought they did "not bad."  Better than the judges critiques, certainly.

[spidermiss2426]

Just popping in to say something.  I don't watch this show anymore, but I used to.  However, I am a burlesque performer-- that wasn't burlesque at all.  It wasn't classic burlesque nor was it neo burlesque.  Real burlesque would not be on this show.

[crowceilidh]

 

 

As far as guest judges go, Jessie was the worst.  She kept saying she’d never seen any of them dance, so why bother to go on the show if you don’t even watch it occasionally?  She knew nothing about dance, nothing about the dancers.  Absolutely useless.

I think she hadn't even made rehearsals or meetings with the producers.  That's why her first score was not consistent with everyone else.  Then they brought her up to speed in the commercial break and all of the rest of her scores were in line.  I think it's outrageous that she hadn't watched any of the show prior to this experience (and offensive to the entertainers and the audience).  I think guest judges are, in general, freaking annoying, but she went exponential on that.  By the end of the show, I would have been happy to kick her (hard).

[smiley13]

I didn't know who that Jessie woman was before the show and now that I have seen her, that's fine with me.  I don't feel that she brought anything of any value to the judges table at all.

 

The best dances of the night were Sadie and Alfonso for me.  Hopefully either Tommy or Jonathan will go next Monday.  Other than Alfonso, none of the men are very good IMO.

[Zuleikha]

By definition, burlesque IS intended to be humorous.

 

That's a really old school definition of burlesque that hasn't defined burlesque in decades. If you YouTube classic-era burlesque numbers as well as contemporary burlesque numbers, what you'll find is that the only unifying factor is striptease (you'll also see a wide range of body types because burlesque has always had a degree of body diversity). Some dancers are very funny; some dancers are very technical; some are disturbing and gory; some are over-the-top raunchy; and some are a mix. Everyone takes off some amount of clothing. :) 

 

I would have loved there to be more of a wink and a smile in Artem/Janel's number, but that would have been up to Artem to choreograph for her. IMHO, it was very obvious that Artem was going with the burlesque jazz interpretation of the assignment, and Carrie Ann and Julianne should have just judged the dance on that basis. There was enough to criticize about Janel's technical execution without complaining about something she didn't have control over and neither she nor Artem probably even knew was expected. They didn't say a word about Alfonso/Cheryl dancing more of a paso than a flamenco, so the judges were also inconsistent about caring about authenticity. 

 

Rewatching Alfonso/Cheryl, I did see some posture issues. He had his head too far forward and his arms not back enough in the up position (what Bruno actually said about the lift and separating... go Bruno getting something right!) I still think it was a 9 by the DwtS standard, though. Cheryl's floreos really were bad. They were as bad as Kellie Pickler's! I have to believe she's capable of better, so I wonder who they had guiding them in the flamenco.

[Andiethewestie]

By definition, burlesque IS intended to be humorous.  

 

noun

1. an artistic composition, especially literary or dramatic, that, for the sake of laughter, vulgarizes lofty material or treats ordinary material with mock dignity.

2. any ludicrous parody or grotesque caricature.

3. Also, burlesk. a humorous and provocative stage show featuring slapstick humor, comic skits, bawdy songs, striptease acts, and a scantily clad female chorus.

adjective

4. involving ludicrous or mocking treatment of a solemn subject.

5. of, pertaining to, or like stage-show burlesque.

 

That being said, I agree with Carrie Ann and Julianne in saying what Janel did wasn't burlesque - blame Artem for that mess.  Janel can only dance what she's given.

 

Yes, Lea did miss a step at the very beginning of her routine - however, she quickly got back on the correct beat and performed the heck out of that routine.  It was fun, happy, bouncy, and a lot of fun to watch.

 

I enjoyed Alfonso's routine - it would have been perfect if he kept his shoulders down.

 

Despite being a lankly teen who is nothing but limps, I was impressed with Sadie's dance - the choreography was complex, quick, and she kept up nicely.

 

It was nice to see Bethany let her guard down a little (I like the little show she has with Sadie - so nice to see teenagers act like teenagers) - I think has Bethany becomes more acclimated to the process we'll see more and more of her guard come down.

The only thing that was a MESS in a big way was that off time gangly ungainly Charleston.  As far as CarrieAnn Inaba's mess, that was  Burlesque, believe it or not, it was intended to be tongue in cheek, it was called GIRLIE SHOW after all, and it ended up being horrible.  OTOH I would never blame Artem for a nice little nod to Fosse and Lurhman. 

[luvthepros]

 

......Can we just give Alfonso the trophy and skip the rest?  Seriously.  The fact that he's being given the same score as people that are doing far less just bothers me.  

The judges have always scored on a curve. I guess that is how they try to even the playing field. There is no doubt, Alfonso is the best dancer there is this season.

[iMonrey]

 

The few things that interested me last night were:  how much better and seemingly happy both Bethany and Sadie are when dancing with Mark B rather than Derek.

 

I kind of thought Julianne actually threw Derek under the bus a little bit, even if she didn't mean to, when she pointed out to Bethany that Derek and Mark have very different teaching styles. She said Mark prefers individual, side-by-side moves whereas Derek likes more moves in hold. Well, that's pretty much admitting what a lot of people have accused Derek of in the past: steering his partners around the dance floor to mask their flaws. Consider the fact that last season, Mark was paired with Amy during the switch week, and instead of holding onto her the whole routine the way Derek had been doing, he actually let her dance on her own next to him and do the steps without much support from him. Derek never seemed to trust her - or himself - enough to do that with her. 

 

I think Mark has taken a lot of heat for doing goofy routines with goofy costumes and drawing too much attention to himself, but I also think he does a better job teaching partners with real potential to dance, whereas Derek goes the safe route and does everything he can think of to hide any potential mistakes his partner might make.

[sinkwriter]

 

I think she hadn't even made rehearsals or meetings with the producers.  That's why her first score was not consistent with everyone else.  Then they brought her up to speed in the commercial break and all of the rest of her scores were in line.

 

Was her first score the 6 for Antonio? It was harsh, but I thought she was grading fairly based on what she saw, that Antonio wasn't doing much and with the exception of him hanging from the ceiling at the end the fancy parts of the performance were clearly all his partner Allison. I don't know why she (or any guest judge) should have to be "in line" with the other judges' scores if she doesn't think that's what the pair should get. If she's forced to be an automaton, what's the point of having a guest judge at all?

 

For example, I liked that Kevin Hart gave Betsey a high score because he thought she did an impressive job. He wasn't there as an expert, he's there to judge based on what he sees. Same with Jessie. She thought Antonio didn't do much, she gave him a 6.

 

I may not always agree with the guest judges, but I don't think they should have to score exactly like the regular judges if they don't share the opinion. Sometimes the regular judges don't agree with one another either, and their scores can veer wildly from 7 to 9 and get the crowd booing. 

[truthaboutluv]

Consider the fact that last season, Mark was paired with Amy during the switch week, and instead of holding onto her the whole routine the way Derek had been doing, he actually let her dance on her own next to him and do the steps without much support from him.

 

 

YMMV but I always thought Mark's work with Amy during the switch up was a bit exaggerated. It was a nice dance, sure, but I watched the dance and Amy never let go of Mark. She may not have been holding on tightly to him but she always had a hand on his shoulder or they were in hold in some way so he didn't exactly let her go off freely which was understandable for her circumstances. And I thought her mambo with Derek when they repeated the Switch Up dance had far more challenging content for her. 

 

As far as CarrieAnn Inaba's mess, that was  Burlesque, believe it or not, it was intended to be tongue in cheek, it was called GIRLIE SHOW after all, and it ended up being horrible.

 

 

What does Madonna's very, very successful tour have to do with this, simply because Carrie Ann deigned to have a not so positive opinion on Janel's dance? She gave an opinion on a performance as the judges do. Yet it almost seems like the comments against her are almost personal. At the end of the day it's all opinion - no more and no less. Some think Janel's dance was oh so amazing and hot and others well didn't. 

Edited October 15, 2014 by truthaboutluv

[crowceilidh]

 

I don't know why she (or any guest judge) should have to be "in line" with the other judges' scores if she doesn't think that's what the pair should get. If she's forced to be an automaton, what's the point of having a guest judge at all?

 

Ex-fucking-xactly.  So she had one score (her first one) out of line with the other judges (and, I thought, out of line with her own comments) and then she was completely in line for the rest of the show.  Like every other guest judge.  Kevin Hart stepped out of line on his thirds score, I believe, but was in line the rest of the show (maybe the rule is that they're allowed to step out of line once just so they don't look like puppets?).  

 

My point is NOT that they should be in line with the other judges, but that they ARE in line with the other judges, because that's what tptb want.

[Abra]

I feel so bad for Jonathan - not just because of his story, losing both of his parents within the past year, but because it feels like the entire show is out to screw him over. He's so sweet and so enthusiatic and just wants to do well and enjoy dancing. Okay, so he can't do well dancing-wise with Allison, but he's enjoying himself. He did much better dancing-wise with Peta (her near-death experiences notwithstanding), but he gets completely raked over the coals. And yet he still has good humor about it and is completely respectful to and about the judges. He never stood a chance, really.

 

Okay, so Antonio does absolutely nothing for me. I would be find with him going before Michael, Tommy, and Jonathan.

 

Speaking of Tommy and the slowest mambo ever, I am developing something of a girl crush on Emma. Her body in that costume with those belly rolls? Damn son.

 

Every dance of Sadie's looks like a cheerleader doing whatever the assigned dance is. Her personality while dancing is great, but she doesn't have a lot of nuance.

 

I actually loved almost everything about Lea's dance except for her choreography. Normally I love Val's choreo, but I feel like it was uninspired (for Lea's portion) and she was capable of a lot more. Hm.

 

The problem I have with Janel (aside from the bullshit showmance/jealousy stuff) is that she still seems like a girl to me. She's mid-twenties or something, right? But she doesn't have the emotional maturity to round out the performance portion of the dances as they should be done.

 

Jessie J by far is the worst guest judge this show has ever had. Sweet Lord. I did love her Strictly Come Dancing '6' paddle for Antonio, though. She had no idea what was going on :)

 

And finally we get to see some energy from Bethany, god. I felt like she was going through the motions in all her previous dances, so good for her.

[MortysCleaningLady]

That was terrible, aside from Alfonso. 

 

Antonio was spectacularly bad -- Allison didn't do anything to showcase his skills (if he has any) and focused on Bollywooding her socks off because she apparently loves to Bollywood.  (I know its not a verb - my apologies.)  Most of the lifts were a mess: Johnathan looked like he was about to drop Peta at least twice. Artem had his hands in areas I really didn't want to see. 

As for the ladies: Sadie and Bethanny were not that memorable and they were the best of the bunch.  Lea was frantic.

 

Seriously, Alfonso was completely underscored and many others gifted.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I'm really hoping they will stop with these stupid stunt dances. I don't want to see Hip-Hop, Broadway, Bollywood or whatever else they can come up with. The judges don't know how to judge it and the pros don't know how to properly choreograph and so we end up with a mess. Please go back to ballroom.

I haven't watched the last few seasons so this season I was like WTF is this switch business? Everyone got ridiculous dance styles that are usually not done on the show, so I thought this was more of a "everyone gets a pass" week until I saw that the judges were still giving out scores. It is ridiculous for them to assign styles like Bollywood and flamenco and score the celebs. Then again, I'm still annoyed that they now have hip hop and contemporary as official styles during the regular part of the season.

 

Bollywood requires sharp movements and precision and Antonio was nowhere near that. I don't blame him though because it is such a specific style and it is not something that a non-dancer is going to pick up in a week. He learned the choreography but he just didn't have the style down. He looked like he was having fun, but it's time for him to go soon.

 

Jonathan's dance this week made me wish that Allison had challenged him more in earlier weeks because he is capable of learning more difficult choreography than she has given him in the past. True, this week's performance was flaily and frantic, but I think that is partly due to all the lifts which require a lot of trust and timing. He was doing so well at the very beginning so I had high hopes that he was finally going to wow the judges but they are too far gone in their hate for him at this point (and to be fair, it was 90 seconds of craziness). If they are going to keep giving him 6s then Michael should have been getting 3s the first few weeks.

 

I didn't have an issue with Janel's burlesque but I live in San Francisco so I have seen a wide range of burlesque. Some is raunchy, some is boring, some is classy, etc. It depends on the act itself. Not all burlesque is cheeky either. Some of it is straight sex on a platter. It isn't like tap or pointe where if you put on the shoes, it automatically qualifies. Burlesque is not just one thing. While I understand what Julianne was saying, I didn't agree with her. I understand that kind of criticism more when the dances are ballroom because there are specific steps, patterns, and requirements but for most of the dances tonight, that wasn't really fair. I mean, have you seen the range of things that passes for hip hop? Because Bethany's was barely hip hop and the little hip hop that she did was like suburban dance recital hip hop, yet the judges were complimenting her swag. I always feel bad for the celebs when the judges criticize a routine for not being [dance style] enough because the celebs are not the ones who are choreographing this routines. They are just doing what they are told by their pro.

[truthaboutluv]

I haven't watched the last few seasons so this season I was like WTF is this switch business? Everyone got ridiculous dance styles that are usually not done on the show, so I thought this was more of a "everyone gets a pass" week until I saw that the judges were still giving out scores. It is ridiculous for them to assign styles like Bollywood and flamenco and score the celebs. Then again, I'm still annoyed that they now have hip hop and contemporary as official styles during the regular part of the season.

 

 

Hip Hop is not an official dance style on the show. It's only contemporary and jazz that has been added to the more traditional ballroom dances. Also, when they did the Switch Up last season, which was the first time they did it, they didn't pull this ridiculous random styles gimmick and it worked very well in my opinion. Most of the couples did the usual dance styles - like Val and Meryl's AT, Candace and Tony's Quickstep, Witney did a Cha Cha I think with Drew, Cheryl did a Tango with James, etc. I don't know why this season they decided to go with that ridiculous gimmick that was used back in the All-Stars season with all those random styles. Especially since as noted, last season's Switch Up worked very well with the regular dance styles assigned.

Edited October 15, 2014 by truthaboutluv

[KLovestoShop]

I've been to a few flamenco shows in Spain, and those artists, yes they are artists, take years to learn the intricacies of that dance. I was impressed with Alphonso's dance especially knowing that he only had a week to learn it. If you watched his hand movements near the beginning, even those were quite good. Many men can't do the hand and finger movements for the flamenco.

I laughed at the comment about Sadie's dances looking like a high school cheerleader. So true.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I was surprised that the judges gave Sadie comments about her dance looking clean. Between the bent knees and the gangly arms, she looked awkward and I didn't think she had clean lines at all. She reminded me of a kid at a dance recital with too much energy that she doesn't know how to control so she ends up flailing her limbs everywhere.

[COESpiral]

I think Sadie has a lot of potential as a dancer.  Every now and then during a dance she'll do something that makes me think she could do well at this if she had the right teachers and the drive to pursue it.  I know seventeen is extremely late to begin dancing, but she's got a natural talent that could be developed.  However, I know that there probably aren't a lot of top level dance instructors where she lives, nor do I think her family would go along with the idea. 

 

At this point, I'm only paying attention to Alfonso, Lea, Sadie, Bethany, and Janel.  I'm not impressed by, nor do I remember anyone else by the end of the show.  Well...maybe Tommy, but that's damning with faint praise.

[KR Vermont]

I thought it was originally mentioned that Len would be gone for two weeks...?

High hopes for a great Val and Lea performance were dashed, sigh. Must've been distracted by all the walkers and fakey gray hair. The Kiss was barely noticeable, more like a peck.

Bethany seemed to exude personality in her routine with Mark.

The played-up jealousies of some were a bit much.

Wasn't impressed with Jessie J expressing (more than once) her unfamiliarity with the dancers/their performances prior to this...as if she was invited to guest judge at the last minute, since she was going to be there anyway to sing a few songs.

[KLovestoShop]

There's so much going on with the UK's Strictly Come Dancing, that Len can't get away. That show, like the US version, is having problems attracting celebrities, so much so that they're using the mothers of celebrities. And if you think that the US version gets raunchy, you should see the UK version. Wow, really bad on some nights. Their costumes absolutely nothing to the imagination, using tiny bits a fabric to cover the bits.

[luvthepros]

Cheryl did what I feared from her rehearsal photos and choreographed more of a paso, less of a flamenco. Derek/Kellie remains the most recognizable flamenco. Cheryl's floreos also seemed really bad to me (although I've only watched once and mostly looked at Alfonso, so I may re-evaluate on a rewatch). I did like her music, and she had choreographed nice partner spins. The part at the end also had more recognizable flamenco steps in it it. She did give Alfonso the escobilla solo that I wanted, but it was at the wrong place (should have been the end... according to everything I was taught, it's just not right to open up a flamenco with an escobilla section). It was also a lot more basic than I would have liked. From what I caught on viewing 1, it was just fast heel taps over and over with no other part of the foot used... that's a classroom drill more than it's an actual step sequence (literally). I thought Alfonso did a nice job with what he was given and given the practical limitations. His attitude was nice; I missed whatever posture problems he apparently had; he seemed very clean and intentional in his movements (which was one of my problems as a student! I couldn't always keep up with the class choreography and would get sloppy). Definitely not a 10 dance to me, but I would have given him 9s on the typical DwtS scale.

Thank you for your review....so informative and given with knowledge. I, who knows nothing about Flamenco, thought it had many Paso elements in it. Is Paso derived from Flamenco or is Flamenco derived from Paso? I have a feeling Flamenco came first.

[Lisa4106]

I thought it was originally mentioned that Len would be gone for two weeks...?

They sure made it sound that way on the show, but I believe on GMA before the season started, they said 4-5 weeks. Apparently Lacey on the live feed this week said Len would be back before the season is over, so I don't expect him back anytime soon. We know we have Pit Bull next week and I bet we have at least one more week after that of a guest judge.

I still wonder how much of this is Len's idea because he's sick of the travel and how much of it is the show encouraging him to lessen his role on the show so they can bring in demo friendly guest judges and emphasize something other than ballroom to make the show appeal to a younger demo. (Which isn't working at all.)

[ari333]

Maybe I don't pay enough attention, but I saw something I hadn't seen before. I think it was about 1/3 of the way into the show, give or take; and I don't recall what couple had just danced. Anyway, the camera panned to the judges table and they seemed to be conferring with each other before the scoring. Tom even had to wait on them to finish. Is that the norm? I thought every judge chose his/her own paddle number. If they're telling guest judges how to vote, what's the point? Or maybe I just answered my own question.

 

Were the old people costumes and walkers a take on some play? I want to be old someday. But wow, people dancing dressed as folks with mobility problems.... ok I didn't really like it. Do they do dances about people pretending to be blind or deaf too or people in wheelchairs?  There just so many other things to dance about, but maybe I didn't get the context.   I'll see myself out.

[ari333]

If Jessie J couldn't be bothered to watch a show on which she was invited to judge, then she should have kept that little nugget to herself. And if she can't tell who is the pro dancer and who is the "celeb," well then - shocker.  "I don't know you from Adam's housecat, nor have I ever seen this show, and frankly I'm not really sure how I got here, but...I put myself in your shoes when you dance." Ok I'm paraphrasing [/snerk]

[Kendra143]

Sometimes i feel like I must be watching an entirely different show.  I don't see desparation on Janel's face or her performance.  I see determination to learn something new and perform it well.  I DO see desparation on Lea's face especially at the end of the routine and she is facing the judges - furrowed brow, tears in the eyes, shaky smile -"please please like me."  It started when she said she always wanted to be a dancer but couldn't/didn't for whatever reason.  Sadie has a ton of enthusiasm and is a natural performer but she doesn't have any finesse in those long legs and arms; she flings them about willy nilly.  I think Allison is trying too hard to please everyone and her partner is just not a very good dancer.  If he were, surely his new partner would have brought that out.  I really don't see Allison as self promoting unlike Golden Boy Derek who shows off more than Mark does these days.  I find Alfonso entertaining but the rest all just blurr.  I did like Tommy's response to air head Julianne's comment that he looked tired.  Could she be any more insulting and stupid sounding??  I didn't think I had this many opinions but anyway, here's hoping next week brings something new and fun to watch.

[Serendi]

Anna Trebunskaya, on Afterbuzz TV, said she thought the number with the walkers is based on The Producers (the musical); Kristyn Burtt agreed with her. Don't know anything about that part, but both my parents are on walkers, which they have quite a time getting past each other (they DO take up space) and I've had a knee replacement and will someday have the other replaced, so I've been there. I thought the walker number was terrific! I think it's the image of *playing* on the things. Jenna thought it was the most fun dance she's ever done on the show. 

 

I *do* like the advice not to try this at home...

[spanana]

Sometimes i feel like I must be watching an entirely different show.  I don't see desparation on Janel's face or her performance.  I see determination to learn something new and perform it well.  I DO see desparation on Lea's face especially at the end of the routine and she is facing the judges - furrowed brow, tears in the eyes, shaky smile -"please please like me."  It started when she said she always wanted to be a dancer but couldn't/didn't for whatever reason. 

I don't see desparation on Janel's face and I do think she is mostly a determined young woman just trying to do well.  The desperation for me sometimes comes across in her personal interactions, at least on the show.  In interview segments or with the judges or with the other pros/celebs or even with Val, it just feels like she's almost always on.  I've said from day one that I think it's the theatre kid in her that she just really soaks up attention and always feels like she needs to be playing a character.  So we are going into Week 6 and I feel like I know nothing about her whatsoever because I don't really feel like she's ever just being real. 

 

My other beef is I just don't think she's improved much since the first week and I think it's partly that she hasn't been pushed to improve certain things.  Her legs are still awful.  I think she's had it fairly easy so far, so I'm very much interested to see what she can do with a samba this week as it's a difficult dance and one where she can't be dragged from place to place by Val.  I think it's harder to hide in a samba.

 

Lea on the other hand I do think has a bit of the "like me, like me" thing going on.   Jenna was the guest on Afterbuzz and she said that Lea was really stressed out this past week.  It was partly the switch up in general, but it sounded like she was stressed because Janel/Artem had this big sexy dance and she was dancing a broadway about old people and kind of maybe felt there was no way they were going to be able to outdo Janel/Artem.  It sounded like the pros had to give Lea a lot of encouragement about how great she looked and how she was going to kill it and etc.  Kristyn then jumped in talking abot how she had interviewed Lea several weeks ago and Lea was really worried about having to go up against the younger female stars and their voting blocks and how could she compete with them.  So I do think it's a bit of a thing with Lea.

 

For me personally, I think where I'm stuck this season is that even the "good" dancers just aren't that good.  Outside of maybe Alfonso.  A lot of these people that we are holding up as the better dancers are only better because they don't have any major competition.  So I watch people like Lea and Janel and Bethany and Sadie and I'm never fully lost in their performances because I can always see obvious mistakes.  Alfonso is the only one that has managed to transport me a time or two with his jazz and jive.

Edited October 15, 2014 by spanana

[fishcakes]

The scoring was strange and all over the place but they're still underscoring Jonathan and overscoring Sadie, so I guess all's well in the DWTS universe. Jonathan's not great, but compared to his other dances, this one was at least as good and given how ambitious it was, I think it merited 7s. And while Michael continues to be terrible, he seems less terrible than he used to be. His timing is improving, which is really one of the hardest things to improve on since it's essentially an either-you-have-it-or-you-don't proposition, but he is better than he was and I would have given him at least a 6 for that dance. I think his fan base is going to keep him in the competition until close to the end anyway, so I don't see the point of giving him humiliating scores. That said, he is a pretty big weirdo. I don't find him as creepy as most do -- he seems more socially awkward than creepy to me -- but WTF with that first meeting with Witney? She told him they had disco and he says, "oh I'm really flexible!" and immediately drops to the floor and tries to put his leg behind his head. Witney's face was polite but basically said, "HOW IS THIS RELEVANT, SIR?"

 

I love Bollywood dancing, but Allison and Antonio were not good at all. It was mostly her dancing toward and staring hard into the camera with Antonio hidden behind her. She reminds me of a girl I grew up with named Laura who every year in the school talent show would do a Tahitian dance. Some years, she'd get a friend to do it with her and at some point, the dance would kick into high gear and the friend wouldn't be able to keep up and would end up standing there looking sheepish. Whenever it happened you could see Laura's face light up a little, like, "hah! crushed another one!" I don't think Allison is actively trying to hurt her partners, but she's definitely not putting them first.

 

I don't ask for much from this show, but I would appreciate it if they'd stop showing their trash reality princesses demonstrating their down home values by firing a gun.

Edited October 15, 2014 by fishcakes

[ari333]

Tom had some clever one liners that escape me at the moment, but he is always a highlight of the show for me even if the individual eppy is a  bit of a stinker.

 

Not sure how I feel about the switch-a-roo thing as a whole, but the feigned jealousy was a bit much for me. Blarg. My lawn. :)

 

I just didn't like the walker bit. It's not cute or fun to me. People in walkers wish they weren't dependent on them to walk (I'm supposing.) I get it that grey hair and sweaters are cute because folks with any color hair and any wardrobe can be active with no mobility issues. That's all. I didn't like it and even if it's based on a play, I guess I wouldn't like the play either, in that case. So there's that. As mentioned, "dancing" in wheelchairs routine, for example, (even if based on a play) wouldn't be cute to me either.

But I do understand the mileage.

Edited October 15, 2014 by ari333

[sinkwriter]

 

Were the old people costumes and walkers a take on some play? I want to be old someday. But wow, people dancing dressed as folks with mobility problems.... ok I didn't really like it. Do they do dances about people pretending to be blind or deaf too or people in wheelchairs?  There just so many other things to dance about, but maybe I didn't get the context.   I'll see myself out.

 

I thought Val said it was supposed to be tongue-in-cheek, that the "old people" were former pro dancers all living in a home for retired dancers, and Lea comes along and sparks them back to life. Hence Val the "old guy" dancing more vibrantly, but occasionally getting an pain in the back (which was part of his dance moves during the routine).

 

It's also a play on a scene from The Producers in which Nathan Lane's character has to seduce a bunch of rich old ladies in order to fund his upcoming Broadway show. It's called "Along Came Bialy." I couldn't find a clip from the film version so that link is from the soundtrack via Youtube. At a certain point during the song you can hear the walkers being used rhythmically as part of the dance routine, like tap-dancing. There's a terrific Behind the Scenes of the musical that used to be aired on PBS or something, which showed Matthew Broderick and Nathan Lane and the rest of the cast recording their songs from the Broadway musical - it was so fun to watch them sing in the recording studio and joke around between takes. 

Edited October 15, 2014 by sinkwriter

[sunnyheart]

That said, he is a pretty big weirdo. I don't find him as creepy as most do -- he seems more socially awkward than creepy to me -- but WTF with that first meeting with Witney? She told him they had disco and he says, "oh I'm really flexible!" and immediately drops to the floor and tries to put his leg behind his head. Witney's face was polite but basically said, "HOW IS THIS RELEVANT, SIR?"

 

I love Bollywood dancing, but Allison and Antonio were not good at all. It was mostly her dancing toward and staring hard into the camera with Antonio hidden behind her. She reminds me of a girl I grew up with named Laura who every year in the school talent show would do a Tahitian dance. Some years, she'd get a friend to do it with her and at some point, the dance would kick into high gear and the friend wouldn't be able to keep up and would end up standing there looking sheepish. Whenever it happened you could see Laura's face light up a little, like, "hah! crushed another one!" I don't think Allison is actively trying to hurt her partners, but she's definitely not putting them first.

 

fishcakes, I don't post much here anymore but I just have to tell you how much I enjoy your posts. Your story about Laura crushing the high school competition is brilliant.  I definitely see the parallel between her and Allison. I agree that Allison is not trying to diminish her partners, but she just can't help herself - when that camera is on, everybody better LOOK OUT cause it's ALLISON TIME!!

 

What I want to know is when Len is going to call her on it because he rode Lacey's ass ragged when she first started - constantly saying how she wasn't the star, Lance Bass was the star.  When the hell is someone going to say that to Allison?

[kayma]

Lea on the other hand I do think has a bit of the "like me, like me" thing going on.   Jenna was the guest on Afterbuzz and she said that Lea was really stressed out this past week.  It was partly the switch up in general, but it sounded like she was stressed because Janel/Artem had this big sexy dance and she was dancing a broadway about old people and kind of maybe felt there was no way they were going to be able to outdo Janel/Artem.  It sounded like the pros had to give Lea a lot of encouragement about how great she looked and how she was going to kill it and etc.

I liked the concept of Lea's dance a lot better than Janel's, mostly because the burlesque thing would be so hard to do well. If Lea had just had fun with it and owned the dance, I think it would have been more of a showstopper. If she is worried about competing with someone, it should be Alfonso and he hasn't done a sexy dance at all.

[Woodrose]

This is not really on-topic, but is anyone else not able to navigate through the pages on this thread? It gives me an error message and I have to go to the main board to get to the next page. It's happened on this board for me many times, but never anywhere else.

 

I've had difficulties in the DWTS episode threads, I think it is a result of the name of the thread changing.  I have lost a post because I typed it up, hit 'reply,' then the board tells me I've tried to access a thread that does not exist -- because the name of the thread changed while I was typing.  I definitely vote for naming the thread once and leaving it alone.

 

My favorite dance of the night, by far, was Lea and Val.  I thought the old folks home for retired ballroom dancers was fun and hilarious.  Campy, over-the-top Val is my favorite version of Val; he got into it 100%.  He was really funny going down the stairs while pretending to have a back problem.  Kudos to Val and Lea and the troupe -- if this was on Broadway, I'd buy a ticket.

 

I agree with others who would have preferred to see regular ballroom dances from the switch-up pairs.  Bollywood was a ridiculous choice for both Antonio and Allison, and it wasn't an enjoyable train wreck to watch.  Same for burlesque.  

Edited October 15, 2014 by Woodrose

[Dancingjaneway]

I wouldn't be surprised if because of her previous experience with dance that Lea is trying so hard to please everyone. I cannot imagine having someone like Barishnakoff tell me that I wasn't right for dancing when it was all that I wanted to do. I think she wants to be perfect because people know her background and expect her to be perfect or really, really good. Also I think it's just human nature to want to be liked and have people vote for you. She knows she needs good scores to help her along because she doesn't have the fanbase to help her along.  Allison I don't think will last long enough to learn how to be a good partner/teacher. I also don't forsee her being asked back which isn't a loss.

[fishcakes]

What I want to know is when Len is going to call her on it because he rode Lacey's ass ragged when she first started - constantly saying how she wasn't the star, Lance Bass was the star.  When the hell is someone going to say that to Allison?

 

I wonder if some of that is going on behind the scenes and they either haven't said anything to Allison yet or they have and she can't or won't stop. Mark clearly thought he was the star from day one, and no one ever called him out except for Julianne when she was a guest judge a couple of seasons ago. Peta and Sharna in their first couple of seasons were also about themselves, though none of these three to the extent that Allison is. It seems like they've all toned it way down now, so I'm thinking maybe the producers figured that one attention hog among the pros was okay, but if they were all going to be that way, they'd have to tamp down on it. Regardless, I like all of them better now, and though I can't see ever being a Mark or Peta fan, they're at least tolerable, even though Mark's ridiculous little hip hop outfit the other night did make me want to punch him in the face.

[sinkwriter]

 

I wonder if some of that is going on behind the scenes and they either haven't said anything to Allison yet or they have and she can't or won't stop.

 

Maybe they're waiting for Len to come back into town and school her.

[luvthepros]

.....Were the old people costumes and walkers a take on some play?........

Yes, seems Val lifted the idea from Mel Brooks' Broadway play, "The Producers" which was choreographed by Susan Stroman. I saw the musical on Broadway and LOVED it, especially the number with the elderly ladies dancing with their walkers. That scene was also in the movie of the musical play. You had to be there!!!

[ari333]

Yes, seems Val lifted the idea from Mel Brooks' Broadway play, "The Producers" which was choreographed by Susan Stroman. I saw the musical on Broadway and LOVED it, especially the number with the elderly ladies dancing with their walkers. That scene was also in the movie of the musical play. You had to be there!!!

 

 

Ok Thanks. I guess I'll just leave it at ...I didn't like the old people walker dance. I'll shutty now.

 

I didn't like the so-called Charleston either, so let me check my lawn.

 

The hip hop (to me) seemed like a cha cha with some hippy hoppy-ish moves. So there's that.

[Princt1]

I don't ask for much from this show, but I would appreciate it if they'd stop showing their trash reality princesses demonstrating their down home values by firing a gun.

 

            AMEN!

 

Edited October 15, 2014 by campbellcat

[crowceilidh]

I thought Bethany was conspicuously happier as a dancer when partnered with Mark. I thought they were a great looking couple.

 

I think Sadie's knees are just bowed, they look double jointed on the inside.  They looked like they were going to break outward while she was dancing, so I couldn't tear my eyes away to evaluate the ostensibly gangly arms.

 

Interesting that Cheryl made a comment about Drew and Witney.  Wish I could remember what she said...  anyone?

[Dancingjaneway]

So it looks like the switch week paired with shit dances will probably pop up again next season because the ratings actually went up this week. It's interesting to see how Derek teaches his celebrities. According to Mark and Sadie he pretty much just comes up with things on the spot or will have the dance set and then come in the next day and throw something new in. I can't imagine learning in that fashion that would scare me to death. I also don't think that's a great way to teach a beginner because they don't know the basics and it's hard to have to keep teaching a new section of a dance AND fix their posture and other technical issues. I get the idea of thinking on your toes(ie the instant dance which Mark pointed out) but I think this is why he has to do so much with props or covering up of his partners. I also think it's the reason why Bethany isn't comfortable like she was with Mark. 

[RedheadZombie]

Interesting that Cheryl made a comment about Drew and Witney.  Wish I could remember what she said...  anyone?

 

 

Cheryl's talking head - "Last season we did the switchup - Witney got my partner, Drew Carey.  Got his highest score.  A little bit nervous that he won't come back to me, and now the tables have turned, and I have Alphonso.  And I really hope that people see a different side of him that they haven't seen yet".