S06.E09: Execution

[paulvdb]

Quote

June faces her biggest challenge as Gilead cracks down on the rebels.

Premiere date: May 20, 2025

[kitkat343]

Elizabeth Moss directed this episode, so it is unsurprising that this episode ended on yet another infamous close up of her face while the plane dramatically explodes.  Her magical protection allowed her to wander undetected all over what should have been the most secure airspace in history.  

Aside from that, I was glad to see Commander Lawrence have a chance to say goodby to poor Angela, a child who really needs to be rescued from Naomi.  And that Serena betrayed her husband.  She really needed June's mom to explain to her that it wasn't possible for a Commander to be a good man.  

Now that we've resolved Commander Wharton's character, a new question arises: did Rose know how much danger she was putting Nick in by sending him on that plane?

Edited May 20 by kitkat343

[Anela]

Wow. I am sad that Lawrence died, but I knew as soon as they asked him to do that, that he would blow up with the plane. Nick showing up, too… as one of the “winners”.

I’m glad that Serena did the right thing. I was spoiled on the hanging, and the rest of them being rescued, but not on Lydia being there to be executed, too. 

[yesferatu]

Undercover Aunt! "I'm CIA". Should I love this? Should I be appalled? I don't even know anymore.

 

 

[crashdown]

6 minutes ago, yesferatu said:

Undercover Aunt! "I'm CIA". Should I love this? Should I be appalled? I don't even know anymore.

You should love it!

[Helena Dax]

Gilead is pretty young, like 5 or six years old, right? I think Aunts had been carefully selected from a pool of old American women linked to the new regime or tortured into compliance, meaning that I don't know where Aunt FBI Janet came from. I thought she was a regular Aunt who had become Mayday after seeing what Gilead really was.

I'm sorry Lawrence and Nick died. I think Moss's reaction to see Nick there was very well acted. She might be too fond of close-ups, but she's a great actress.

And I'm glad Aunt Lydia had her little rebellious moment. I wonder what will happen to her. 

So all the High Commanders are dead? Just the ones in Boston? How many High Commanders are? Since there is a sequel to this show, I doubt Gilead is over but the writers have been so unclear and inconsistent about Gilead that I can't imagine what the situation is now  from a political and geographical point of view.

Edited May 20 by Helena Dax

[Nozycat]

7 hours ago, kitkat343 said:

so it is unsurprising that this episode ended on yet another infamous close up of her face

The number of close ups on her face were off the chart this ep.

[Black Knight]

That was a satisfying episode. I never expected Lawrence to make it out alive - honestly I thought he would be killed off a season or two ago, but I suspect they didn't want to let go of Bradley Whitford sooner. I also leaned towards thinking that Nick would not survive.

The writers are crappy in a lot of ways, but they gave both men fitting deaths. Lawrence often had to be prodded into doing the right thing, but he still usually would even at personal risk to him. It was no surprise that he agreed to take the bomb onto the plane and that, when it came down to it, he chose to sacrifice himself in order to damage Gilead.

Nick, on the other hand, wasn't so much a good man or an evil man as he was a weak man - which in a certain way is worse than anything else. Would Nick have sacrificed himself to save June? Yeah. She was the one way in which he would be strong and put someone else ahead of his own safety. I liked that the writers didn't do fan service to the Nick/June fanbase by putting Nick in that type of situation. Instead they put him in a situation where as far as he knew, June wasn't involved, and it was strictly a matter of his own survival. Just as with the earlier conversation with Wharton, he chose his survival - and it quite literally blew up in his face. His line to Lawrence about going with the winners said it all. (If Nick had been in the same position that Lawrence was in, he would've bailed on the plot as soon as the other Commanders showed up early.)

And goodbye Wharton, a satisfying death as well. Josh Charles is very good at making you want to punch him in the face when he taps into a character's rigidity and self-righteousness. Serena chose her son over her husband, and that was satisfying too. I don't like Serena, but one line she doesn't cross is hurting children, if she can be gotten to see how something would hurt a child (yes, she tried to play backsies with Holly, but IIRC she didn't intend to actually return to Gilead with her, and while she used Hannah several times to torment June, Hannah never knew that was what was happening). Once June framed the dilemma as being about children's welfare, she had Serena.

Edited May 20 by Black Knight

[Black Knight]

By the way, how nice of Gilead to take the time to custom-build a gallows stand with exactly the right number of nooses for the rebellious handmaids, fake Aunt, and real Aunt! Wonder what would have happened if they had captured one more handmaid after it was built: "Well, it's your lucky day, you can live because all the nooses are already taken!"

[circumvent]

6 hours ago, Helena Dax said:

Gilead is pretty young, like 5 or six years old, right? I think Aunts had been carefully selected from a pool of old American women linked to the new regime or tortured into compliance, meaning that I don't know where Aunt FBI Janet came from. I thought she was a regular Aunt who had become Mayday after seeing what Gilead really was.

In the book the story is told way after the regime fell then Atwood told a weird story in The Testaments to fit the minds of the writers so anything goes, really.

6 hours ago, Helena Dax said:

She might be too fond of close-ups, but she's a great actress.

People keep saying this. I just don't see it. Regular actress, not great by any measure, imo. I watch TV shows with attention to the writing (in this case, just hate watching to see how far down they can go compared to the book). Sometimes because the theme is interesting, very rarely because of an actor. I would not anything else based on her being in a show. She was dreadful in Top of the Lake, could not finish it.

 

6 hours ago, Helena Dax said:

So all the High Commanders are dead? Just the ones in Boston? How many High Commanders are?

Rewatching the first season I was just thinking about how they made it like every single person in Gilead are either aunts, wives, commanders, Marthas, eyes or handmaids. Then they can be sent to the colonies or they are those other people that I forget how they are called. But in the first season there were men in suits in the subway, walking all over town, there were doctors. They are not commanders, they are running things but they are also brainless it seems. Nothing about why, how they keep doing what they do. 

 

[AntFTW]

7 hours ago, Helena Dax said:

Gilead is pretty young, like 5 or six years old, right?

See... I asked this same question when Naomi was talking to Serena about how they're giving the handmaids opportunities for redemption, calling them savages, and whatever else. Naomi couldn't have drank the kool-aid that much to believe these people would not remember their pre-Gilead lives, and the opportunities and freedoms they had because this was only a few years ago.

[Helena Dax]

Yeah, but Hannah is just five or six years older than she was at the beginning. And I think June was captured very early on, when Gilead wasn't still the thing it would become later; otherwise, she would have been wearing the econowives's dress, right?

I would say that by the time we met June, Gilead had been going on for a couple of years at most. Naomi simply doesn't want to see the truth. Just like Aunt Lydia, she doesn't see the Handmaids as young women who have been captured, enslaved and raped, but as sinners who have been given an opportunity to redeem themselves. 

 

[AntFTW]

8 hours ago, Helena Dax said:

And I'm glad Aunt Lydia had her little rebellious moment.

Same! I said "good shit, Lydia."

8 hours ago, Helena Dax said:

I wonder what will happen to her. 

I don't know how she leaves the fray alive, unless her plot armor is just as thick as June's. I'm sure a few people had it out for Aunt Lydia and saw that as an opportunity.

4 minutes ago, Helena Dax said:

And I think June was captured very early on, when Gilead wasn't still the thing it would become later; otherwise, she would have been wearing the econowives's dress, right?

I haven't read the books so my thoughts on the answer just comes from watching the show, but I always thought June was a handmaid solely because she had proven herself to be fertile with Hannah.

Edited May 20 by AntFTW

[crashdown]

3 minutes ago, AntFTW said:

I don't know how she leaves the fray alive, unless her plot armor is just as thick as June's. I'm sure a few people had it out for Aunt Lydia and saw that as an opportunity.

Her plot armor is that

Spoiler

she's hard wired into The Testaments.

 

[txhorns79]

2 hours ago, Black Knight said:

I don't like Serena, but one line she doesn't cross is hurting children, if she can be gotten to see how something would hurt a child (yes, she tried to play backsies with Holly, but IIRC she didn't intend to actually return to Gilead with her, and while she used Hannah several times to torment June, Hannah never knew that was what was happening).

Serena helped create a system that steals children from their parents, both via the handmaid process, as well as deciding a couple is unworthy of getting to keep their child because they have broken some Gilead rule.  She's happy to hurt kids so long as her purposes are served.  

 

11 minutes ago, Helena Dax said:

And I think June was captured very early on, when Gilead wasn't still the thing it would become later; otherwise, she would have been wearing the econowives's dress, right?

Yes, I remember they showed an episode when June and Moira escaped the Red Center, and they were entirely disoriented because all the street signs had vanished, and we saw workers chipping away at signs in the subway station.   

[Black Knight]

17 minutes ago, txhorns79 said:

Serena helped create a system that steals children from their parents, both via the handmaid process, as well as deciding a couple is unworthy of getting to keep their child because they have broken some Gilead rule.  She's happy to hurt kids so long as her purposes are served.  

I agree she has hurt children. But that's why I put in the important qualifier that I did in my original post. She didn't think she was hurting kids. If you can get her to see that she is, she won't do it. She thought those kids were going from "bad" parents to "good" parents and so would be getting their lives bettered. We've witnessed throughout the series how stunningly clueless she is - sometimes because it's convenient for her to be clueless so that she can get what she wants untroubled by doubt, but also sometimes because she really is just that clueless. Look at what she said to the mob about to tear her apart in the season premiere, or her speech to the handmaids at her wedding reception. Look at the first season episode in which she thought June was pregnant and tried to host the most awkward brunch ever in which the handmaids were supposed to sit around cheerily chatting as they would have in their old lives at some cool restaurant as some sort of reward. Her utter cluelessness about human beings is a big reason why she has gone through life largely isolated and unable to connect in a real way with people. Intellectually she's smart enough but her emotional intelligence is pretty much zero.

[watch2much]

I’m not  sorry to see Nick die. There was a line he had in an earlier episode where he was saying if it was back in the pre-Gilead days, June wouldn’t give him a second look because he would’ve been an Uber driver or something menial and out of her league. So it was no surprise that he didn’t want to give up the life he had as an elite with all the perks that came with it.  I kind of wish we got to see more bloodshed I wouldn’t have minded seeing the handmaid’s take out their commanders.

[crashdown]

1 hour ago, Black Knight said:

Her utter cluelessness about human beings is a big reason why she has gone through life largely isolated and unable to connect in a real way with people. Intellectually she's smart enough but her emotional intelligence is pretty much zero

Absolutely true. I've seen some people speculate that Serena is somewhat autistic, and I think it's an interesting way to see her. She definitely finds basic empathy almost impossible. It's why I find her stumbling attempts to become a human being so weirdly endearing, although I realize that she's far from everyone's cup of tea.

[circumvent]

13 minutes ago, crashdown said:

I've seen some people speculate that Serena is somewhat autistic, and I think it's an interesting way to see her. She definitely finds basic empathy almost impossible.

Lack of empathy is not an autistic characteristic. Lack of empathy is a sociopathic characteristic. Two different diagnosis.

[crashdown]

6 minutes ago, circumvent said:

Lack of empathy is not an autistic characteristic. Lack of empathy is a sociopathic characteristic. Two different diagnosis.

A quick AI search of the current research shows the contrary. There's a huge body of research about autism and empathy. It's evolved in nuance over the years, but it's still considered a genuine issue and research topic.

Edited May 20 by crashdown

[SharonH58]

5 hours ago, Nozycat said:

The number of close ups on her face were off the chart this ep.

I will be happy never to see her face again.

[circumvent]

41 minutes ago, crashdown said:

A quick AI search of the current research shows the contrary. There's a huge body of research about autism and empathy. It's evolved in nuance over the years, but it's still considered a genuine issue and research topic.

I live with an autistic person, most of my circle of friends and close people are autistic. I can tell you that this "research" is just as valid as the "vaccines cause autism". It is old stuff. Do not believe AI, this is ran by algorithms, not by actual human beings and human relationships.

If and when you have personal experience of sharing your day, 24 hours, for over 25 years, then you can maybe give me this argument. Meanwhile, instead of AI, search for what autistic people do and say. They are everywhere and it is not that hard to do your own investigation to form a fair opinion of how a group is or is not.

[MyArchangel]

14 hours ago, yesferatu said:

Undercover Aunt! "I'm CIA". Should I love this? Should I be appalled? I don't even know anymore.

 

 

I loved finding out that Phoebe/Ana was undercover as an aunt. I knew she had to have something to do with law enforcement prior to Gilead because of how she picked up that gun during the mob riot at the hangings and just started shooting, very accurately I might add.

[kitkat343]

4 hours ago, AntFTW said:

See... I asked this same question when Naomi was talking to Serena about how they're giving the handmaids opportunities for redemption, calling them savages, and whatever else. Naomi couldn't have drank the kool-aid that much to believe these people would not remember their pre-Gilead lives, and the opportunities and freedoms they had because this was only a few years ago.

Naomi certainly can remember her life before Gilead, but remember that she is an awful, selfish judgmental person.  Prior to Gilead, she would have been one of those awful women who went to church every week and judged everyone else.    June was a handmaid because she married a divorced man (we learned she actually cheated with Luke when he was married, but in the book women who married men who were divorced prior to their meeting were subject to becoming handmaids if they were fertile.  And the handmaid who blew up the new Rachel and Leah center was formerly a drug addicted prostitute.  Others were selected based upon being gay, which Naomi may have had less of a problem with).   She reminds me of when Rosalie Aprile was at a church diaper drive in the Sopranos and the priest noted that they had gotten mostly newborn diapers as donations, and that next year they should put a notice in the bulletin asking people to purchase larger sizes.  Rosie Aprile said "they should be grateful for whatever they get.  Nobody told them to have babies without husbands."  

[AstridM]

1 hour ago, circumvent said:

I live with an autistic person, most of my circle of friends and close people are autistic. I can tell you that this "research" is just as valid as the "vaccines cause autism". It is old stuff. Do not believe AI, this is ran by algorithms, not by actual human beings and human relationships.

If and when you have personal experience of sharing your day, 24 hours, for over 25 years, then you can maybe give me this argument. Meanwhile, instead of AI, search for what autistic people do and say. They are everywhere and it is not that hard to do your own investigation to form a fair opinion of how a group is or is not.

Yes, I don’t believe using AI is a legitimate way to do serious research. I’m appalled that so many are using it that way.

[crashdown]

Just to be clear--I'm kind of a professional researcher. I used AI to find genuine article citations, and the ones that I found were current (written in the past two years) and authoritative (peer reviewed science journals). I don't want to belabor the point, which was a minor aside for me, but it was legitimate research. AI has a lot of issues, but blanket condemnation of it as a tool for serious research doesn't make sense to me.

That said, the issue here is Serena in this particular episode. I don't think it's as important to provide her with a clinical diagnosis as it is to understand the unusual way that her mind works.

Edited May 20 by crashdown

[bettername2come]

Well, 37 dead commanders is a good start, but I was incredibly disappointed we didn't get a blood bath like we should've. Love "Look What You Made Me Do" and was all pumped for a carnage music video set to Taylor Swift, but no. Though I did appreciate "I got smarter I got harder in the nick of time" as Serena ran away. 

The "I love you"s between June, Janine and Moira were nice. I love a platonic declaration of love.

I've never liked Naomi more than when she asked "What chapter are you on?" Though her annoyance at being asked if she had paper was close. Aw, she had the tiniest smile when she nodded at Lawrence about the book. 

Nice to hear Aunt Lydia say the girls were prisoners of "wicked, godless men." I may have cheered. Can Ann Dowd have another Emmy now please? I appreciate June's speech prayer ending with "Don't let the bastards grind you down!" What were they thinking cuffing hands in front of their condemned prisoners?  Now there's the fight I was looking forward to! Though I would've preferred if they brought back the Taylor Swift song. I was expecting a Quick and the Dead style shooting of the rope. Badass Rita moment. Though I'm mildly amused she shot the guy in the head then yelled "stop!" D'arcy Carden with the baton was awesome. Of course she's CIA. 

Oh, damn, what's his name looked hot walking in in his bulletproof vest surrounded by soldiers. 

"Well, I wasn't hung, so I'm good." I forget how much I love Rita's dry humor. I liked Serena's reaction of "Praise the Lord!" to seeing June alive. And immediately getting judgmental of June. She's nothing if not consistently inconsistent.

"Have you met me? My comfort zone is miniscule." I've never related to this man more. 

I'm so glad June didn't stop Nick from getting on the plane. I really thought she was gonna do something stupid there. Ding, dong, the Nick is dead! Which old Nick? The traitor Nick! Ding, dong, the traitor Nick is dead!

[marinw]

19 hours ago, Anela said:

I’m glad that Serena did the right thing.

Serena changes sides depending on what makes her feel safe at the moment.

I'm sad about Lawrence. "My comfort Zone is minuscule." Nick not so much.

18 hours ago, yesferatu said:

Undercover Aunt! "I'm CIA". Should I love this? Should I be appalled? I don't even know anymore.

Ava is the MVP of this season.

That airport has terrible security if June can just stand there in the middle of the hanger.

16 hours ago, Helena Dax said:

And I'm glad Aunt Lydia had her little rebellious moment. I wonder what will happen to her

Spoiler

Read The Testaments. (Or wait a few years until the TV Adaption comes out.) Lydia has safely been on the "Do not kill" list since it's publication.

 

Edited May 21 by marinw

[mmecorday]

I'm not at all sad that Nick perished in the bombing. I never liked him and I hated him for squealing about the Jezebels plot, resulting in the deaths of all those women. 

I loved Bradley Whitford as Commander Lawrence. Great actor, great character. I really believed he loved little Angela. It's too bad that he and Janine couldn't have gotten together and raised her so that she'd have two parents who loved her. 

 

[shelley1234]

What I found interesting about Serena is that when she saw June in the chapel, her reaction was to smile with joy and comfort that June was alive.  Serena to me is someone so indoctrinated into a cult that she can't see her way out.  It's woven into the fiber of her being.  

I wanted Lawrence to survive, but I think it was fitting that Lawrence ended up having to die to bring down Gilead.  While he woke up and was fighting against what Gilead had become...he was a huge part of forming it.   

As for Nick...good riddance.  Never saw how June could have any conflict about who she should love and be loyal to when it came to Nick vs. Luke.  

 

[chaifan]

Oh, my.  So, so, so many things running through my head...  

First, I'm disappointed in this big wonderful plan of the rebellion that was teased the last two episodes.  The drugged cake didn't keep people asleep all that long, someone got word to command pretty quickly seeing that June & the rest of the Handmaids were captured that same night.  Where were these bombs and the military when that was going on?  I thought they were supposed to be going off during the wedding, since all the security would be there.  Were they just waiting for the handmaids to get captured so they could rescue them?  And was their plan to just place a dozen or so people with knives (???) and guns in the crowd to battle against dozens of men with automatic weapons?  I'm sorry, just none of that made sense to me.  I was expecting more.  Much, much more.

And then there's Super June, driving Lawrence around Gilead, into an airport/hangar with -0- security, even though there's an active rebellion going on and this should be the most secure place in Boston.  And then just walking out in the open to watch the plane go boom.  aaaaargh!  

But...  almost all that can be forgiven by the appearance of CIA Aunt Janet/Phoebe/Ava!  That was awesome!  I love D'arcy Carden as a bad ass fighter.  Let's scrap The Testaments and have a Truello/Ava spin off!  (They would make a hot couple.) 

I can't figure out Wharton.  Is he a total psychopath?  Or a true believer?  Was his apology to Serena sincere?  Or a ploy to get her back to his home and keep her under lock and key?  I really don't know.  I guess it doesn't matter now.

I am so glad Nick is dead.  90% of this show he's just bored me to death.  I'm sad about Lawrence, though, but I suppose it had to happen.  He'd probably rather blow up in a plane than face war crime tribunals.  Though I sort of expected him to pick a fight with Nick, punch him, just to get thrown off the plane.  That would have been funny.

OK, all the wives and children are in one spot.  I suppose that's where June is heading next, to rescue Hannah and liberate the rest of the children.

One thing I really don't understand about the story is the aspect of religion.  This was a very God-heavy episode.  As we saw last week, there were no clergy in the church to marry Wharton and Serena.  Are the Commanders also the spiritual leaders?  I don't see people like Serena going for that.  I don't understand how June (or any handmaid) is still religious, as well as Lawrence.  I always thought Lawrence wasn't religious, and just played along, but his "let's pray for June" thing with Serena seemed sincere.  Serena's "praise the lord" was sort of funny.  I wonder how Serena will feel after finding out June has killed another one of her husbands...

 

[aghst]

Looked like the plan wasn't that great.  June almost got hung but their contingency was Luke and Rita in the crowd throwing grenades at the Guardians?  

Then somehow they both get guns and they're shooing indiscriminately.  It was actually Rita who took out the crane operator to let June down from the noose.

How do they know how to fight like that and how does Rita not botch lower the crane too fast and cause June to crash into the ground?  Well at least she didn't have her neck snapped?

Fortunately they had a CIA undercover agent as one of the Aunts.  D'Arcy Carden has been in everything -- not even sure what's her signature role -- but who'd have guessed she'd be some action heroine?

Then you have this plot of the Commanders flying down to DC.  Why would they do that?  Gilead has been attacked.  They don't need to meet in person to strike back or defend the city.  They set up a command center and get rid of the American forces.

Mark says they can't shoot down the jet because of air defenses.  But they showed jets shooting rockets at Boston skyline.

They wanted to have the hangar scene, close ups for Moss and Whitford.  Maybe even Nick, because it looked for a second like he was going to turn and look at June.

Then the big scene of Moss reacting to the beautiful explosion.

But taking out two major characters, we must be close to the end.  Google shows 10 episodes in season 6.  So next week the finale?

 

[txhorns79]

9 hours ago, crashdown said:

Absolutely true. I've seen some people speculate that Serena is somewhat autistic, and I think it's an interesting way to see her. She definitely finds basic empathy almost impossible. It's why I find her stumbling attempts to become a human being so weirdly endearing, although I realize that she's far from everyone's cup of tea.

I think Serena is just a self-centered person who likes attention and power, no diagnosis necessary.  Pre-Gilead she seemed to have some kind of following in advocating to return women to what she viewed as their place in the home.  She was happy to sign on to and help plan the Gilead takeover when she imagined she would have a seat at the table.  It was only after it was made abundantly clear to her, repeatedly, that she will never have real power, that she has turned away from Gilead.  

Having said all that, I did appreciate that Serena recognized that June saved her from the mob when she did not have to do so.

 

22 minutes ago, aghst said:

Mark says they can't shoot down the jet because of air defenses.  But they showed jets shooting rockets at Boston skyline.

My guess was that after the surprise attack by the jets, it would have been too hot for them to have gone in to try and shoot down the commander-filled plane. 

[aghst]

Well maybe the element of surprise by fighter jets is gone but looks like they could have just ambushed them at that hangar.

Those commanders arrived just with their drivers, not some big contingent of  Guardians and other soldiers.

There was nobody at all in the hangar, not even those ground crew who signal to the pilots to taxi to the runway.

June just had to stay behind the car and then as the plane was taxing away from the hangar, she walked outside.

If she had an automatic rifle, she could have taken them all out by herself.

 

 

Edited May 21 by aghst

[AngelaHunter]

In a private plane hangar, June can stand around because there is not one single security guard there. After all, no one thought they were necessary with all those Commanders in one place, right after so many of them were murdered. Then she hides, not behind the car but in front of it, in clear view of anyone who might have just slightly turned his head.

June hangs by her neck for a whole minute, and not only does she not pass out in seconds from compression of her carotid artery, but she merely suffers a slightly sore throat. She really does have superpowers, or plot armour made of tungsten, maybe? I dunno, but June's plans seem to leave an awful lot of people dead, to little effect.

But here's Luke, armed with a 5" blade(?), and Rita and some others with pistols - most of whom have never fired a gun, against a group of trained, professional guards with automatic weapons. Nice that it worked so well.

I didn't really care about Nick, but I guess they had to make him so uncharacteristically slow-thinking he couldn't come up with an answer for Wharton that wouldn't have all those women murdered, so they could get rid of him this week, and no one would care.  Such a common method, used so often before on other shows. I liked something he said to June. I think it was last week: "You don't care what I do if it helps you."

And... the interminable June closeups are back. Oh, good.

Lawrence should have faked a heart attack or something once on the plane. It would have been plausible.

As for Serena, my completely unknowledgeable diagnosis is that she has a narcissistic personality disorder. She has quite a few of the characteristics. I think Wharton did have feelings for her of some sort, but we'll never know now.

 

1 hour ago, chaifan said:

And was their plan to just place a dozen or so people with knives (???) and guns in the crowd to battle against dozens of men with automatic weapons?  I'm sorry, just none of that made sense to me.  I was expecting more.  Much, much more.

I read this after posting, so sorry if it seems I was repeating what you said!

[Helena Dax]

4 hours ago, marinw said:

 

 

  Reveal spoiler

Read The Testaments. (Or wait a few years until the TV Adaption comes out.) Lydia has safely been on the "Do not kill" list since it's publication.

 

Yeah, I know, but what happens in the book can't be what happens in the show anymore, since so many things have changed by now, 

[circumvent]

AI version of empathy in autistics: AS in every AI version of anything, it is ambivalent

As for research, the only one I found that says autistics lack empathy is not only ambivalent, it was also conducted in 34 people. That's hardly a reliable source for anything.

Before the NIH was purged and research that the current government does not approve of will never happen or be published, they published this one. This in a 5 minute search.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9804307/

Sorry, this is personal to me and I think if anyone has any type of empathy, they would look for real research and, more importantly, meet the people they claim lack a very human characteristic. Some autistic people have trouble processing feelings, and can appear detached. Some have a hard time with expressive language and show empathy in a different way. If neurotypical people are not willing to accept those differences, the lack on empathy lies not on the autistic person. Why is my way of processing any better or "more right" than that of an autistic person, just because I might not understand that?

The ones who understand, and explain, are autistic people themselves, not "experts" behind badly conducted studies

If anyone wants to DM me a list of reviews contradicting me, feel free. I am pretty sure I can point out the failures on those too, just by experience doing that all these years

Edited May 21 by circumvent

[Haleth]

Wait, there is one more episode? I thought that was the end. To be continued in the Testaments. 

[BeatrixK]

 

Kinda glad Nick went boom - And C. Lawrence, sad...but he took his 'pennance' admirably (admit - I did get a little teary when he paused at the plane door - bang up acting job there, Bradley!!!  Now.....take your silver fox self into the afterlife and kick Wharton in the balls.)

I shoulda realized by the 12th extended Moss close up she directed it....srsly....grrrrlllllll.....please.  Just...please....

 

[circumvent]

Regarding the timeline of the show, discussed a little upthread: On season one, when the Mexican ambassador visits Gilead, June sent a note to Luke, who is in Canada and at that time it had been three years since they tried to escape. So, I guess it is fair to speculate that Gilead was up and running for about 4-5 years when the first season starts. 

I lost track of the timeline after that, plus I missed a season, maybe more. It bugs me how the kids age in different timelines though. If each season is about a year in the future, the supposed ages of June's kids (as in the kids who play the characters) make little sense. Maybe someone is keeping better track than I am. 

Gilead will not fall from the events in this episode. I am not sure what they are going to do with The Testaments as far as loyalty to the book but The Handmaid's Tale has nothing to do with this show anymore. Instead of delving into the conflicts, internal and societal in Gilead, they decided to do an action show, where we have no idea of how people actually feel about the whole thing. Most act as if they are easily and willfully manipulated, don't question anything. And in the sow the events are way to early in the history of the place for more people to not dissent 

[marinw]

 

13 hours ago, AngelaHunter said:

In a private plane hangar, June can stand around because there is not one single security guard there. After all, no one thought they were necessary with all those Commanders in one place, right after so many of them were murdered.

It was profoundly stupid for the remaining Commanders of Boston to get on a single plane. Does Zoom not exist in the THT Universe?

Edited May 21 by marinw

[Hanahope]

They don’t have smart phones so maybe not

[chaifan]

On 5/20/2025 at 4:00 AM, Helena Dax said:

Gilead is pretty young, like 5 or six years old, right? I think Aunts had been carefully selected from a pool of old American women linked to the new regime or tortured into compliance, meaning that I don't know where Aunt FBI Janet came from.

We've seen real life examples of undercover officers being embedded in fringe groups, before those fringe groups went mainstream.  So I'll fanwank that Phoebe/Ava was embedded in some early version of Gilead before they overtook the US gov't, and that she's been an Aunt this entire time. 

On 5/20/2025 at 1:32 AM, kitkat343 said:

Now that we've resolved Commander Wharton's character, a new question arises: did Rose know how much danger she was putting Nick in by sending him on that plane?

Are you implying that Rose knew the plane was going to be targeted by the resistance?  I can't imagine how she would know this.  Even if she were Mayday friendly (and there's no indication she is) she's been in a hospital the entire time this is all going on.

[circumvent]

1 hour ago, Hanahope said:

They don’t have smart phones so maybe not

Season one Fred is watching the news on the internet so they do have the capability.

Now, the if the writers have the capability to remember what they write from one episode to the next is anyone guess

[aghst]

They obviously wanted to stage the hangar scenes and the explosion reflected in a closeup of June's face.

That is why they had these scenes about blowing up the commanders in mid air, when they didn't need to go down to DC.

BTW, doesn't the Arcela run from Boston to NY and then down to DC?

[kassa]

28 minutes ago, aghst said:

 

BTW, doesn't the Arcela run from Boston to NY and then down to DC?

Yes, but railroad lines tend to be blown up pretty early in civil wars.  I'm not sure if the show ever delineated which states remained "free" and which were full Gilead. Large areas were uninhabitable/full of radiation. Aside from Boston and DC, I can't recall what the rest of the Eastern seaboard is supposed to constitute at this point. 

[aghst]

Yeah I agree trains are not necessarily safer, because you have hundreds of miles of railways subject to sabotage.

But hey, in the first episodes of this season, June and Serena take a train from Toronto to Alaska?  I don't even know if there's such a railroad, like would it be close to the US border and thus subject to destruction?

Why didn't they fly over there?  Because for the purpose of the plot, you wanted those women going after Serena and June pushing her off the train.

So these transportation methods are chosen depending on which ones served the plot the best.

[Anela]

I wondered how she was able to just walk around the hangar, too. It was good to see some good things happening, but it felt "off". 

 

[tennisgurl]

I wish that the plan was better thought out and that we got a real Red Wedding style bloodbath, but at least we finally got a real strike against Gilead that could lead to its downfall. Its not over yet, there are still plenty more bad guys left to keep Gilead going, but its certainly better than what we've gotten before. 

I was so not surprised to see that Elizabeth Moss directed this episode, its why we had even more dramatic close ups to her face than usual and we got lots of big June speeches. I tend to go on and off on Elizabeth's performance in this show, but I thought she was great in that last scene in the hanger, looking sad but proud when Lawrence went to sacrifice himself and shocked and heartbroken when Nick showed up. 

I knew as soon as Ava started whooping ass and grabbing a gun that she was probably with the government, of course she's CIA and an old buddy of Mark. Love her, new favorite character. 

I suspected that Lawrence would die in this episode after he had his goodbye with Angela, as soon as they gave him his mission with the exploding briefcase I knew that he would sacrifice himself. I am going to really miss him, and Bradley Whitford is such a great actor doing such a great performance, but I am glad that he went out doing the right thing and striking a blow against Gilead. He might have dragged his feel and needed nudging towards the right side, but he came through at the end and gave his life to help destroy the evil system that he helped to create. 

Nick on the other hand, ended up picking the wrong side and it got him killed. Nick truly loves June and has certainly has his moments of conscience and compassion, but he was too weak of a man to finally turn against Gilead for real, he could never really find the strength to commit to really fighting the system outside of helping people that he personally knows and cares about. 

A lot of the Gilead people actually ended up rebelling in different ways. Obviously Lawrence most of all, but also Naomi promising to read to Angela, Aunt Lydia calling the Commanders monsters at the gallows, which I did not see coming and might have cheered at, and Serena choosing her son over Gilead and her shitty husband. Serena is willingly oblivious at best and a self centered narcissist at worst, but she does at least care about her baby. 

[kitkat343]

2 hours ago, chaifan said:

 

Are you implying that Rose knew the plane was going to be targeted by the resistance?  I can't imagine how she would know this.  Even if she were Mayday friendly (and there's no indication she is) she's been in a hospital the entire time this is all going on.

Sorry - I didn't write my original post concisely.  I should have said the question should be did Rose know how much danger she was putting Nick in by telling him to leave her side and go fight instead of writing if she knew how much danger she was putting him in by sending him on the plane.  I don't believe there was any way for her to know that plane was specifically targeted. Her father was on that plane, and I am certain she would have saved him if she had known.  We haven't seen much of Rose, and she's an interesting character - she knows her husband is in love with June, but she lives in a society with very few options even for daughters of commanders.    And as a woman with a physical disability, she has even fewer options than most women in this society.  She was in the hospital possibly as a result of the Mayday attack on the cake, so she knows they are active and is sending her husband out to try to fight the rebels at a time she knows they are targeting commanders.    He's safe with her in the hospital, but she's encouraging him to leave.  That could simply be because she wants revenge on the rebels, but Nick is  a weak and thoughtless character, which led to his first wife running away and being killed.  He hasn't been very discreet about his love for June - including getting into a public fistfight with Commander Lawrence over June's safety.  That's really humiliating for his wife, so when she encourages him to do something dangerous I wonder about her motivations, but there's no indication she could possibly have had any idea how dangerous that flight would be.  But Nick wasn't initially scheduled to be on that flight, probably since the other commanders assumed he'd be with his sick pregnant wife in the hospital.  And he would have been safe there.

Edited May 21 by kitkat343