S01.E08: Conflict & Resolution

[crazychicken]

I am hoping Doug & Cortney met at the filming of the decisions and run off together, they seem the only two in this experiment that are ready for a relationship. Jason seems so sad and has so much on his plate he needs somebody to look after him but is not willing to open up and allow it. Monet & Vaughn are so set in their ways, are both keeping track of their partners faults and seem unwilling to compromise. Jamie is such a mess she needs to sort herself out before even contamplating a relationship and needs to step away from reality tv forever.

I am beginning to wonder if Monet & Vaughn were just a big joke played by the experts to see if they told people that they were a good match that they would change themselves to make it work.

[ExMathMajor]

The only person who didn't completely piss me off this episode was Cortney. Vaughn's mom comes a distant second.

 

Jason: I'm starting to sound like a broken record but I'll say it one more time and then I'm done: He had NO BUSINESS going on this show with the way his life is right now. Not only that, I don't understand why the producers even picked him. Surely he wasn't the only cute young Brooklyn (?) firefighter/wrestler type auditioning? I'm not even going to get into his not opening up; there's no point.

 

Monet: At this point I'm just mad she's still making an effort. If I had any kind of sympathy for Vaughn I would have had a problem with her "compliment" to him being "You have a lot of potential." I would have considered it condescending...if there weren't at least a little truth to it...

 

Vaughan: I can't believe I didn't pick up on this sooner: If you are a man who's grown up in a time and a culture that says that men like you are rare gems and that women will fight to get you, of COURSE you're going to think you don't have to compromise...because you DON'T. There will ALWAYS be women needy enough and desperate enough to put you on a pedestal and give you every single thing you want without you having to put in more than minimum effort. I completely agree with those who said that he checked out very early on; I also agree that he'll probably never be satisfied, which means he probably won't get married (again) until his 40s at the very least, if ever.

 

Jamie: I agree with everyone who said she was just looking for an excuse. I really wish I could feel sorry for her but...honestly...she's another one who should have never gone on this show. It's getting to the point where it's difficult for me to watch her or to hear her talk. I just want her off my screen.

 

Doug: Goddammit, Doug. I don't blame you for needing a cigarette but lying about it, and lying in that way...that was a punk-ass move. And then to promise something that the vast majority of human beings can't promise...another punk move. Your living with your parents I can completely understand because shit, this has been a rough few years economically speaking plus you're living in one of the money-suck capitals of the world. That isn't what's making me question your maturity level. You acted like a punk this episode. You may think it's out of love, but it smells like desperation. Not cool at ALL.

 

Dr. Cilona: How much are you getting paid to sit there and offer crap advice? Oh wait...I have to go to that OTHER board to get an answer? Yeah, no.

[PityFree]

I do not think Monet is fat, but I do think Vaughn was turned off by the amount of cellulite she had. I think he wants a pear with no cellulite.

[aradia22]

There's something a little bit off about Jamie's accent. I wouldn't have guessed NY. I would have guessed Canada.

 

No one on the show is particularly articulate which makes them seem a little more insincere to me.

 

Vaughn picking Monet up from the... clinic(?) made me think of something. I wonder if any of them have changed their spouses to their "call in case of emergency" person. 

 

Why don't they have footage of this cigarette debacle? I think Jamie overreacted (she had a right to be upset but she was definitely putting the reality TV spin on it) but it would have been interesting to see Doug's actual reaction to being confronted. I've never bought Doug's good guy act. I don't think he's necessarily a horrible person but I think he's playing nice for the cameras. Also, I'm really not sympathetic to the "blue balls" or "tease" argument. 

 

I'm no "expert," but I'm pretty sure these "experts" are terrible.

ITA. I have yet to see the spiritual adviser contribute anything.

 

Doug has been in long-term relationships before, right? I wish one of those women would pop up to tell us about Real Doug.

Yes! That would be brilliant.

 

Also, this makes Jamie the second wife to question her spouse's manhood and to say he's not ready to be a husband. Is this something their being fed or is this how they genuinely fight? I know they're married but they're fighting dirty for only a few weeks.

[Armchair Critic]

When Monet had to leave when Vaughn's mother was there, did I hear him say Monet had 2 brunches to go to?  I do think Vaughn is high maintenance, but if Monet wants her life to be like an episode of Sex And The City, why did she marry him?

 

As for Jamie, I would love to be a fly on the wall to see what her coworkers say about her being on these reality shows. I wonder if she has thrown herself at any of the doctors?

Edited August 28, 2014 by Armchair Critic

[Soobs]

His desire to please Jamie is sad and scary and unrealistic to me. He's gotta get out of this mess. After this series, he won't have any trouble dating and getting serious with a better match.

I hope that she breaks up with him for his own good. I don't see him pulling the plug. It's sad that Doug doesn't seem to think he deserves the same adoration he doles out to Jamie. It's like it doesn't occur to him that he should get that back. He was so guilty about smoking, it made me think he probably smoked a gutter butt.

 

Vaughn and Monet continue to confuse me but I'm still leaning towards disliking Vaughn. When they were talking to the therapist and he was ticking off how many times she had done things for him, she should have walked out.

 

Next week looks bad for Courtney. Seems like wrestler dude is done with her.

Edited August 28, 2014 by Soobs

[StayingAfterSunday]

Actually I don't think he is "unpleasable" at all. I know men like Vaughn... they expect to be "the head" and like to be adulated and catered to. Vaughn has consistently indicated exactly what he wants in a spouse. The advice his mom gave Monet spoke wonders IMO... that is exactly what Vaughn wants... a women who makes him feel like a king.  He wants what his parents had and Monet is not one for the subservient role. I am not going to demonize him because this works for some couples but both people have to be on the same page. 

 

I believe Vaughn has been upfront and honest about what he was looking for in a mate.  I do not believe the same is true of Monet.  Monet knows how to charm,  and she knows the right things to say when it benefits her.  But she is spoiled and selfish and, for all the talk of being "independent," she is stuck in a middle-school/high school girl's mindset.  I would not be surprised if she changed her name to Monet because some chick at school whom she admired had that name.  I also  think Monet is more hell bent on Vaughn making her happy, a misguided, juvenile goal if ever there was one.    I am sorry if this comes off as judgmental, but that's how I see her.  She absolutely infuriates me!  I think Monet would have made quite a good actress - literally; unfortunately, she obviously does not want  to pretend that Vaughn is "all that" (as Vaughn's mother had advised her to do, in so many words).

 

Vaughn is not being unreasonable in the least in expecting a lousy compliment from Monet once in a while.  Personally, I never have been able to understand why some people have such a difficult time eeking out a compliment for someone else.  It's a pet peeve that I have never been able to grasp let alone accept about others. 

I remember something I read long ago that went something like this:  "If a person is stingy with his compliments expect him to be stingy with everything else as well --  his money, his time, his love.  (This is true of Monet, I'm afraid.) 

Edited August 28, 2014 by StayingAfterSunday

[ethalfrida]

I never got the impression that Vaughn was asking to be coddled. What I am picking up on is he wants her to share affection equally. He cooked for her so he wants her to cook for him. Whatever he wants she could at least quiet down and listen. And one thing my mom told me as a young woman... when you are married, your girlfriends come after all other things. She told me it didn't mean women should isolate themselves because that is not healthy. It meant that you do not schedule activities with your friends as if you were a single woman. So I understood exactly how he felt about her brunches and girls night at her place. But maybe someone else saw this... when they were at brunch the girlfriends did not look happy or festive. Vaughn, however, put on a great face and seemed to be acting quite nicely. And there were even shots of him with his arm around Monique or around her chair. Well he had it around something but I saw it.

 

So... Monique, cute as a button and very warm, does not have the proper filters in place; when Vaughn's mother told her what he had said, she told him. He wasn't pleased. There are some things for knowing and some things for saying. She shouldn't have told him because it was obvious he felt a little betrayed.

 

But I am still not convinced that all the arguments amongst all the couples are real. They are just so petty.

[aradia22]

So I understood exactly how he felt about her brunches and girls night at her place. But maybe someone else saw this... when they were at brunch the girlfriends did not look happy or festive. Vaughn, however, put on a great face and seemed to be acting quite nicely.

I think this might be part of the problem for Monet. If I'm upset, I act upset. I might not always be pugnacious or sullen but you can definitely tell what I'm feeling. And if I'm not expressing about how upset I am, it's because I'm just being polite until I have the opportunity to cut and run because I've already checked out. Vaughn seems to jump between being affectionate/physically intimate and fighting with her and confronting her in a really blunt way that outside of this reality show would be incredibly rude.

[Sunnyside]

IMO, Vaughn checked out after the honeymoon night.  Monet is treating him like he's breaking his promises to her, but they just met -- there was no promise other than I agree to this experiment for 5 weeks and then we'll see.

 

Jason and Cortney seem to have sincere intentions, they just need to give it time to trust and stay open and honest and back their words up with action.

 

Doug and Jamie seem to be faking.  Jamie's just going through the motions until its all over and Doug is trying to sell himself to her and the audience--after all, he's a salesman, right?  I just think he really deserves someone who will appreciate and love him for him, he's just gotta remember to be himself. period.

[sleekandchic]

When Monet had to leave when Vaughn's mother was there, did I hear him say Monet had 2 brunches to go to? I do think Vaughn is high maintenance, but if Monet wants her life to be like an episode of Sex And The City, why did she marry him?

I'm probably remembering incorrectly, but I thought there was some narration ( maybe by Monet?) that Vaughn had requested alone time with his mother and that's why Monet made other plans? I'm not sure though.

I know Vaughn' s mother has been well-received, but I don't care for her. I mean she seems lovely and articulate, but telling your faux daughter-in-law that she should play pretend and go along to get along is dopey and insulting advice, in my opinion. I think Mama Vaughn is a more genteel, stealth version of Marie Barone. IOW, a PITA. I also think Mama Vaughn contributed to the special-snowflake mindset that Vaughn possesses.

I definitely respect and can agree in theory with the viewpoint that Monet has her issues and has contributed to the failure of her marriage. But I feel sorry for her because I think she was totally blindsided and truly confused by Vaughns behaviors toward her.

On their wedding day, both M and V were happy and excited. V reacted well when he first laid eyes on M, and M was the anti-Jamie. Monet was delighted with Vaughn.

The wedding day, the reception, the photo session and the getting to know you stuff were all happy, optimistic experiences. Then the audience was told the couple consummated the marriage on the first night, so obviously there was heat and attraction between the two. They were were off to a promising start.

The first day or days of the honeymoon also seemed happy. But then as they took a stroll Vaughn started to complain. He told Monet she wasn't attentive enough or demonstrative enough. He outright REFUSED to hold her hand as they strolled. His criticism and standoffishness seemed to come out of nowhere, and it happened so early in the process. I think Monet was hurt and confused, and, in some ways, never bounced back.

In my opinion, Vaughn is unreachable because he really doesn't care for Monet and he checked out very early in the game. Nothing she can do or say will change his mind. That's why, I believe, he latched on to complimenting himself this episode about his being civil. I thought he was trying to say, Hey cooperate with me! I'm giving you a gift! Let's just be civil til this BS is over with.

I can understand why Monet is acting skittish and impatient, even angry. She THOUGHT the marriage might still have a chance, but his "civil" comment brought home to her that he's only biding his time. -- and probably has been doing that since the honeymoon.

So while I do agree that Monet has said a couple of hurtful, insulting things to Vaughn, I believe she's thrown up her defense mechanisms cause she realizes the guy never even TRIED to respect the spirit of the experiment.

P.S. I noticed Vaughn patted himself on the back a couple of times (once or twice in the therapy sessions) for picking up Monet at her surgeon's office. But did you catch his snide remark as the receptionist led him back to Monets recovery room? The woman commented, I think she's back here, and V replied well if you hear someone talking and talking, that's her. (Paraphrasing) He can't help himself.

Edited August 28, 2014 by sleekandchic

[62GREAT]

I think if Jason's going to dump Cortney he'll do in private first. I will feel bad for her because she thinks he loves her, like she loves him already.

I think this crap with Jamie might have waken Doug up to the fact that he'll be basically licking Jamie's every drop of poop if SHE decides to stay with him. He's already said that he knows she would never pick him in the real world. I think like many others she's been faking all along.

Could they just STOP showing Monet & Vaugh they just get mor painful to watch each episode

[ketose]

I can easily believe there was no video of the cigarette fight. This show is still pretty low budget, so they only have a camera crew at the staged events and some camcorders to fill in the other stuff. I wouldn't be surprised if Doug and Jamie rehashed the fight for the cameras the next day when someone was available to film it.

[seauxheaux]

Jamie's reactiong to the cig thing was just too much. Yes he lied and that was stupid (hello? that awful smoke smell) but come on. Like she was waiting for him to fuck up so she could say hypothetically this is a big problem because it all starts out small and then it blows up, well Doug you failed like everyone else, I'm out. Doug could have easily told the truth. It was a dumb mistake but trying to please Jamie is quite a task and he's trying to be too perfect.

I still don't like Jamie but it's sad that she has resorted to this for affection. She probably is playing a part but it's people like her that are really attracted to cameras and tv for a reason. Girl needs some therapy.

 

Welp Vaughn I can't help ya out much this week lol but I think his mother said it all when she told Monet you don't have to mean it, just do it, or something like that. Also yall do know that big thighs and big ass tend to go hand in hand right? Monet has a pear shape and while she isn't as thin is jamie or Courtney, she is a little overweight but not that much. If Vaughn wants someone like his mother and seeing his mother's size, I really don't think that would be the worst for him, I think it was something else in the honeymoon that got him down because to me he seemed enthused about the project at first. He's saying stuff to the experts to act like he cares but everyone can tell he really doesn't. Well except Monet. Monet is still trying and I don't know why.

 

Jason needs to open up some. Courtney said right when she said I'm not going to force you to open up, but if you can't open up any then just call it a day. Gone and take care of your mother.

[trimthatfat]

I'm probably remembering incorrectly, but I thought there was some narration ( maybe by Monet?) that Vaughn had requested alone time with his mother and that's why Monet made other plans? I'm not sure though.

I know Vaughn' s mother has been well-received, but I don't care for her. I mean she seems lovely and articulate, but telling your faux daughter-in-law that she should play pretend and go along to get along is dopey and insulting advice, in my opinion. I think Mama Vaughn is a more genteel, stealth version of Marie Barone. IOW, a PITA. I also think Mama Vaughn contributed to the special-snowflake mindset that Vaughn possesses.

I definitely respect and can agree in theory with the viewpoint that Monet has her issues and has contributed to the failure of her marriage. But I feel sorry for her because I think she was totally blindsided and truly confused by Vaughns behaviors toward her.

 

Great post! ITA with what you've said, and I wanted to touch on Vaughn's mother. I, too, thought her comment that Monet should pretend to be happy about catering to Vaughn was very questionable. I get having to do things that you don't want to do in a relationship but you do it because it makes your spouse happy, but that should not an everyday thing. Monet doesn't want to feel like she has to cook for Vaughn - that's a lot of pressure.  I mean, let's be real, Vaughn wouldn't do something for Monet to make her happy even though he didn't feel like it, i.e. refusing to hold her hand and initially scoffing at the idea of brunch.

 

Vaughn never truly tried to give this experience a chance and I have a feeling he just signed up without any real intention of remaining with the wife after all was said and done. I imagine if they show was about a couple trying to work through a year and not a month, he would have never agreed to it. He probably figured a month was doable, esp. if he got a decent appearance fee.

[JustPeachy]

I just heard Jamie is going to be on next season's Survivor.

 

Okay, just kidding! Although I wouldn't be surprised. She is definitely a reality*whore! Poor girl...she needs more attention then people can seem to provide her. I'm dreaming here, but I wish that the last episode would show Doug deciding not to stay married to her because he realized that nothing he could ever do would be good enough for her in her eyes. I'd love to see him turn her down because she thinks she's too good for him. That would be a great ending!

 

Someone had posted that Doug would be able to pick and choose from real woman after the show is over. I agree. He's a nice, athletic, tall, funny, caring guy! You can do much better I assure you!

 

BTW...for any of you who don't know this, Jamie has her own web page. jamieotis.com "Host, Model, TV Personality, RN" She's definitely in it for the fame.

 

Personally, I think Cortney could do a whole heck of a lot better!

 

Vaughn and Monet...geez...what can I say! The "experts" must have lost interest by the time they came to matching those two up. Not remotely compatible, I waver weekly on who I like least. This week...Both!

[62GREAT]

I am so wondering why the "experts" let Jamie be part of this.  It doesn't take even one college degree, let alone 4 PHD's, to know that Jamie was only doing this for the TV time, especially since the producers called her.  Do you think they warned Doug ahead of time? It would be cruel if they didn't at some point let him know that she might not be for real.

[red12]

I honestly think the main reasons Vaughan and Monet were put together was that the "experts" had a very small pool of candidates (I heard 50 somewhere) and an even smaller number those candidates were black. If I had to guess, i would go with 5 at most. So, they are victims of a phenomenon that every type of minority has experienced where friends try to hook you up with the only other black, Latino, Asian, gay person they know and are confounded by how it is that you have nothing in common since you are both members of whatever group.

[ridethemaverick]

I wouldn't be a bit surprised if both Vaughn and Monet indicated that they preferred to be matched with other black people. I'm sure that question was asked in some way in the paperwork everyone filled out. Unfortunately, they happen to not be right for each other.

[Armchair Critic]

Jamie reminds me of ''Nurse Betty" (Renee Zellweger in the movie) where she lives her life like she is in a soap opera.

[62GREAT]

Tell me what you think of this scenario :

At the beginning of each show they show they couples being asked their decision. Monet & Vaughn are apart and look done with each other. Jamie & Doug don't. Look happy and she wipes a tear. Cortney and Vaugh are holding each other as they always do, but a one point she has a slight smile.

This has always made me think that C & J stay married. But now that we've experienced the edits making us think things are going a certain way, perhaps J & C are the couple that don't stay married. I don't think J is the type from what has been shown that would dump C on camera unless he had already told her privately. But I could see him making that decision out of fear of being hurt and also his upcoming Fire Academy commitment. Now if it was me I would be holding on to someone who I've given all to and then been dumped, regardless of the reason.

Even though there's been a lot of social media strongly suggesting J & D have stayed together, I still don't think J has ever had serious intentions of stay with D and will be done once she thinks she won't get as much backlash.

Oh the errors I have!!! Sorry. Of course I meant Cortney & Jason and that I would not be hugged up with the person who dumped me.

[62GREAT]

Oh the errors I have!!! Sorry. Of course I meant Cortney & Jason and that I would not be hugged up with the person who dumped me.

[Bandolero]

You know I have been thinking about this and decided to post. It seems almost a consensus that Jamie should be oh so grateful to Doug for his patience and tolerance cause you know she may not find someone else to do the same for her and I don't think that is right. There is nothing wrong with Jamie wanting someone who is good-looking, successful/established, mature and independent. Lots of women want and have gotten that... it should be no different for her. Yes she has issues that she should be working on and addressing through therapy, etc. but that does not mean that she should settle for less that she truly desires. Just because a guy "appears" to be nice, patient and understanding doesn't mean she is obligated to be with him. I fault Jamie for the way she "treated" Doug based solely on his looks but not because she wasn't attracted/didn't want to be with him (that is her prerogative IMO). 

 

It seems to me that men are never expected to settle in the way that women are.

[crazychicken]

On re-watching the episodes something that Dr Pepper said when Jamie was going back to the trailer park struck me, she said "Jamie doesn't realise how deep her trust issues are"  So while I still think that Jamie needs therapy I am giving serious side eye to the experts that cast her knowing that she had such deep emotional issues. It has always bothered me that they cast people with trust issues knowing that they will take time to open up in an experiment that only last 5 weeks. I sort of gave them a pass thinking maybe they didn't  realise the extent of them until she was already married but going back to re-watch it bother me even more than on first watch. Some of Jamie's statements send up huge red flags so why did they ignore them.

 

 

You know I have been thinking about this and decided to post. It seems almost a consensus that Jamie should be oh so grateful to Doug for his patience and tolerance cause you know she may not find someone else to do the same for her and I don't think that is right. There is nothing wrong with Jamie wanting someone who is good-looking, successful/established, mature and independent. Lots of women want and have gotten that... it should be no different for her.

 

You are right she shouldn't have to settle or be grateful just to be treated well it is not fair on either Jamie or Doug. I think she is really conflicted in a few episodes she has made statements like 'he is all that I asked for/wanted I really want to fall in love with him'. I really hope that if they do not remain together that she at least learns that she deserves to be treated well and will have a better idea of what makes a good relationship.

[ethalfrida]

Okay, for just a moment I am redirecting my thinking a bit. It seems to me that none of these stories are real. None! But the fact that Monet was adamant about Vaughn having lunch with her and the girls just didn't sit right. Then it occurred to me that she may have promised to get her girlfriends on camera and that was a way to do it. All along she's tried to get them involved.

I can't for sure say that no one would involve their friends in their honeymoon but it sure doesn't seem likely. 

So, to me, this has just been another made for tv reality show that got us all involved and emotional, thinking we were actually watching real life. At least for a while. LOL, congrats to the posters who called it earlier!

[Nilo]

I think maybe the producers didn't want to cast three all-white couples. When they found Monet and Vaughn - both of whom having lost their fathers young - they might have felt there was enough to work with there. Didn't Monet say, at one point, that she wanted a more traditional marriage? I had thought she did, but it would have been in the first episode and that was quite a while ago for me. But I did remember having some red flags when she then told Dr. Pepper that she didn't cook - because that's not exactly traditional.

While Vaughn drives me crazy - and I could certainly never be in a relationship with him - there really was no false advertising there. He told all 4 doctors/therapists/and atheist ministers (wth?) exactly what it was he wanted. He hasn't deviated from that at all.

[leisawoo]

Maybe Doug lied so cuz he knew Jamie would blow up like that and dump him? He's got to be exhausted from jumping through all the hoops.

[queenanne]

Didn't Monet say, at one point, that she wanted a more traditional marriage? I had thought she did, but it would have been in the first episode and that was quite a while ago for me. But I did remember having some red flags when she then told Dr. Pepper that she didn't cook - because that's not exactly traditional.

 

 

I agree, it’s not like I equate cooking with some kind of 1:1 duty or exchange but I LOL’ed back when Vaughn said he wanted to pay all the bills, and Monet said she wouldn’t mind.  Because I realized, I’m all for a traditional marriage in theory, but I wouldn’t even let a spouse volunteer to be sole breadwinner, if I wasn’t cooking some meals or doing much that contributed to “homemaking”.  He wants to pay everything, just so that he can say he pays?  I should accept this, because I breathe, and am awesome enough to let myself exist in this man’s orbit and he should be grateful?  It didn’t make me think that Monet had spent a lot of time in her mind thinking on what a “traditional marriage” would consist of, because it definitely means some type of equality where husband gives/provides something, and wife gives/provides something else relatively equal to what hubby is providing, even if it means each chore isn't split 50/50.

[Nilo]

Right?  Most "traditional" men who volunteer to be the breadwinner seem to look at it as a trade-off ala "I'll take care of bringing home the money, but then I want the home (and any children we might have) to be taken care of."  This seems to be especially true when talking about military families - simply because the military spouse has to be able to think that homes are being managed while the active duty military member is deployed (and I feel I can say this as a former military wife!).  Cooking definitely falls into the category of "home" work.  

 

The one disconnect with Vaughn might be where he says he wants someone "happy," but doesn't seem to want someone "bubbly."  This might be an issue with vocabulary.  He definitely seems to prefer a quiet and peaceful home.  When Monet is "loud" or her dog is "yappy," that really seems to bug him.  This confuses Monet because, when she's in a good mood (i.e. "happy"), she babbles.  And the babbling drives him nuts.  Then he lashes out, which makes her unhappy and sullen.  Then he says he wishes she were happier.  I think the issue there is that Monet is social, and Vaughn really isn't.  A "good" day off for him is one spent inside, reading - maybe being physically together, but not necessarily needing to talk too much.  He needs peace and quiet to decompress.  And for Monet, a "good" day off is one spent talking and laughing - quite often with her good friends and definitely together.  

 

As someone whose idea of heaven is to curl up on the couch reading (and who hates being interrupted just when I get to the good part), I can kind of relate to Vaughn here - although I hate to say it.  Plus the thought of deliberately standing on-line for brunch?  No, thank you.  I can totally see where he's coming from when he encourages her to go out and go have brunch with her friends but please, for the love of heaven, don't make me go, please let me read in peace!

Edited August 30, 2014 by Nilo

[Ohwell]

It seems almost a consensus that Jamie should be oh so grateful to Doug for his patience and tolerance cause you know she may not find someone else to do the same for her and I don't think that is right. There is nothing wrong with Jamie wanting someone who is good-looking, successful/established, mature and independent.

Honestly, I don't get that sentiment from the posters here.  It's not that Jamie shouldn't be with who she wants to be with and who she's attracted to.  I think the main issue with Jamie has been how she's acted around Doug, how she's treated him, independent of whether she wanted to be married to him.  Her whole narrative has been "This is an ugly dog I've got here, but hey, he's nice, and I've gotten used to him.  Maybe we can hang together for five weeks after all.  Oops!  He lied!  How dare he do that to me!"  Her behavior onscreen has been odious, and it has nothing to do with whether or not she wants to stay married to him; it has to do with being nice and decent to someone who treats you the same way.

 

Vaughn started off saying he wanted to pay the bills, but then agreed on a 50/50 split.  

Edited August 30, 2014 by Ohwell

[queenanne]

Admittedly, for all we know Monet could be in control of takeout every night, but I live in NYC and that ish is expensive.  $12-15 is an averagely healthy workplace lunch, $22-25 is a singleton's dinner.  I'm also speaking as a person who hates to cook for myself, not the cooking itself but the prep and maneuvering around my tiny apartment kitchen with little prep space; but I do it because the alternative is shelling out all that money, and it would make a difference for me if I was cooking for a friend or mate. 

 

I think the problem with Vaughn is probably "internal language", as others have suggested.  He didn't answer the experts' questions 100% honestly, possibly because he doesn't know himself that well.  I do think he is making a mountain out of a molehill in respect of brunch, but give him his due, he was very charming and made an effort when he did brunch.  I think the "silence all day long" on Sundays a bit absurd although I am also an introvert, but learning that, said to me that Vaughn is indeed VERY introverted if he's worse than me, heh.  I'm not ambitious on Sunday but I do allow talking, and I think I'd be more ambitious with a mate. 

 

Monet blew up too fiercely over the "civil" comment as well, IMO it didn't warrant her reaction.  I don't think she would have liked it that much better if he had upped it to "accommodating" or something a bit warmer, because in Monet's eyes she's either (a) bending over backwards to please; or (b), her "husband" shouldn't be invoking "civil" because he's "her husband".  She somehow twinned that with "he's treating me like an unaccommodating stranger" but they ARE, in fact, strangers.  To me "civil" is "veering away from blowing up", but maybe to someone as volatile as Monet it's an insult, and she needs to have the high-emotional reaction to feel like she's actually invoked a reaction or made a difference.  In which case she herself would have a hard time making do with someone as cool and detached as Vaughn. 

 

It's not that Jamie shouldn't be with who she wants to be with and who she's attracted to.  I think the main issue with Jamie has been how she's acted around Doug, how she's treated him, independent of whether she wanted to be married to him.  Her whole narrative has been "This is an ugly dog I've got here, but hey, he's nice, and I've gotten used to him.

 

Agreed that's not the issue for me; I absolutely do believe a woman has a right to hold out and not "settle" in terms of physical pulchritude - as long as she can actually "pull" that man.  Jamie's romantic history shows that she can get the interest of a more classically handsome man.  She just can't keep or parlay that into an LTR.  Which either proves the conventional wisdom that "overwhelmingly a very good-looking man is likely to be a jackass", or "Jamie looks good enough to snag their interest, but her personality, "quirks", whatever, means she can't hold said interest."  Thus, I think she absolutely should be willing to trade in looks for personality, and someone else has made the decision, to the point where she has already gotten to know a man "less handsome than" what she would normally opt for.  It would be different, maybe, if she were still looking at still photos and had no idea of the personality behind the photo.  We have gotten to know Doug a little as a person, and some of us are attached to him as a person, hoping Jamie feels the same way because that would just be sensible of her.

Edited August 30, 2014 by queenanne

[Puffaroo]

Geez, Jamie! Okay. Doug smoked. He lied. He swore on his Mom. All bad. But he did NOT abuse you. And he did NOT kill anyone. Sure, a bit of annoyance -- even anger -- is possibly called for. And have a nice discussion. But chill out, honey! Yeah, I do think she was looking for an excuse -- ANY excuse. And Doug handed it to her on a silver platter. Bad move, Doug.

 

Holy guacamole -- I'm not a violent person, but I just want to smack some sense into Jamie.  Only thing is, it wouldn't help. 

 

Fortunately, all this drama clarified something for me:  she's acting.  She's a big ole fame-whoring phoney.  Didn't someone post here pretty early on that she'd been on The Bachelor and also Bachelor Pad?  She's hamming it up, whining about how horrible her past is (honey, whose ISN'T?), looking for an excuse to get out of the marriage, so she can... wait for it... be on THE BACHELORETTE!  Or has she already done that, too?

Edited August 30, 2014 by Puffaroo

[absolutelyido]

You know I have been thinking about this and decided to post. It seems almost a consensus that Jamie should be oh so grateful to Doug for his patience and tolerance cause you know she may not find someone else to do the same for her and I don't think that is right. There is nothing wrong with Jamie wanting someone who is good-looking, successful/established, mature and independent. Lots of women want and have gotten that... it should be no different for her. Yes she has issues that she should be working on and addressing through therapy, etc. but that does not mean that she should settle for less that she truly desires. Just because a guy "appears" to be nice, patient and understanding doesn't mean she is obligated to be with him. I fault Jamie for the way she "treated" Doug based solely on his looks but not because she wasn't attracted/didn't want to be with him (that is her prerogative IMO).

 

It seems to me that men are never expected to settle in the way that women are.

 

Based upon what she said she wanted, I don't think that Jamie would be just settling for Doug if they stay together. On her cast bio, she said she was looking for someone "loyal, trustworthy, passionate and successful, who loves her and her siblings, and wants to conquer the world as partners". I went back and watched, and in her initial interview with Dr. Logan she said, "it really comes down to personality for me, a guy who's like super, super genuine and caring, and like fun and outgoing and kind of goofy". I think Doug matches up pretty nicely with those criteria.

 

No, Doug hasn't seemed all that successful in his career, and if it turns out he can't hold a job for very long I think that would likely be the end of them. Hopefully that is not the case. But, I don't think Jamie was necessarily looking for some wealthy guy with a high-powered, prestigious career. I think that even shows when she says that Doug's family is exactly what she asked for. The Hehner's seem like a very nice, fun, stable family, but they're not the Rockefellers or anything. They're solidly middle class. If Doug can maintain a career that will keep them on stable ground financially, I think that is all she needs.

 

Plus, I think they both are in the mindset of having sideline careers. Based on their social media presence, I think they are both enjoying the attention this show has brought them, and would love it if it could lead to more. If it does, and they can make a little money together from it, I could see that as fitting Jamie's desire to conquer the world as partners. 

 

As for Doug not being good looking enough, and her not being attracted to him, I think she has truly had a turn-around on that. I hate to say it because I adore Doug now, but I can kind of see why she was turned off initially. Honestly, I don't think he looked his best at the wedding. I think his nerves made him pale and sweaty (he seems to be a nervous sweater), and those stupid white shoes didn't help! Given her pretty intense initial negative reaction, I think it's actually amazing that she changed her opinion of him so quickly. To me the look in her eyes after their first kiss showed that she was really into him already by that point. On a shallow note, I think the fact that she discovered he has a smoking hot body didn't hurt.

 

I am so interested in the finale when they get to reveal their feelings. For the purposes of suspense, I think the show is very cagey about how they present things to keep people in suspense about whether the couples stay together. Obviously, Doug's not going anywhere, so I think they edit Jamie in a way that makes you wonder if she will want to stay married to him. (Same with Jason, because it's so obvious Cortney is all in.) Based on the preview they keep showing where Jamie is wiping a tear, but has a smile on her face, I actually do think she will say she that she is very grateful and feels very lucky to have been matched with Doug.

[Puffaroo]

Gonna take a stab and say Vaughn's primary love language is acts of service. He wants Monet to show him an act of service (cook him dinner), so he performs an act of service for her (picks her up from the doctor).

 

Don't look now, Vaughn, but THAT'S WHAT SPOUSES DO!!!  How the hell else is she supposed to get home?  What emotionally dead person would even consider this some special act?

[Ohwell]

Yeah, Vaughn lost me with that one, too.  Did he really think it was such a big deal that he picked her up from the doctor's office? 

[MsPH]

Agreed that's not the issue for me; I absolutely do believe a woman has a right to hold out and not "settle" in terms of physical pulchritude - as long as she can actually "pull" that man.  Jamie's romantic history shows that she can get the interest of a more classically handsome man.  She just can't keep or parlay that into an LTR.  Which either proves the conventional wisdom that "overwhelmingly a very good-looking man is likely to be a jackass", or "Jamie looks good enough to snag their interest, but her personality, "quirks", whatever, means she can't hold said interest."  Thus, I think she absolutely should be willing to trade in looks for personality, and someone else has made the decision, to the point where she has already gotten to know a man "less handsome than" what she would normally opt for.  It would be different, maybe, if she were still looking at still photos and had no idea of the personality behind the photo.  We have gotten to know Doug a little as a person, and some of us are attached to him as a person, hoping Jamie feels the same way because that would just be sensible of her.

 

Well put! Though for me the biggest issue isn't even his looks, because I think Jamie is attracted to him now. She's said so several times and they're always kissing. Just because they haven't gone all the way yet, doesn't mean she's not attracted to him. I don't even find anything wrong with his looks. He may not be a model, but his body is way above average and he's got a lovely smile and eyes. And if I were to judge the couples' chemistry based on kisses, Jamie and Doug would win hands down.

 

I think the biggest (and only) issue is Doug's lack of career. I totally get that Jamie is scared of him not having a stable income, since she wants kids soon, but I just hope she can give him a chance to prove himself. He only recently started at his current job, so there's no way of knowing where it'll lead. Of course she would feel safer, if he had a well-paying stable profession, but if I were her I wouldn't give up on someone so right in other ways because of it, not after 5 weeks anyway. Having someone whose personality compliments yours and who is there for you 100% is the most important thing in a relationship and it's not that easy to find. If I thought staying married to Doug would be settling, I wouldn't want her to do it either, but I see it as readjusting one's priorities for a happier outcome.

[ketose]

Assuming the people on the show are not professional actors or sociopaths, I think they are real. They are not normal, however, because most people would not get married to a stranger on a lark (or to get TV exposure). There have been a number of studies and experiments that show men and women with shared experiences, (like being on a TV show) are more likely to find each other attractive. The romantic stories are supposedly of people who see each other across a crowded room. The reality is that couples get together often because they went to the same college or high school or worked in the same building.

 

Still, I don't see any of these couples being afraid of hitting the divorce button when it gets annoying.

[aradia22]

 

Well put! Though for me the biggest issue isn't even his looks, because I think Jamie is attracted to him now. She's said so several times and they're always kissing.

I still find Jamie and Doug really fake. So from my perspective, she's lying about being attracted to him now and the kisses are just a pretense of affection. 

[62GREAT]

I'm not sure how to read twitter but there's a conversation on Cortney's talking about moving out of NYC due to problems and lease being up. Can someone tell me if that is coming from her.

[ketose]

She's saying it on her twitter. Even if you aren't on twitter, you can read her timeline of tweets.

 

https://twitter.com/KortKneee_Rae

[MsPH]

She didn't say she's moving out of NYC, just that she's moving because her lease is up. So probably to another apartment nearby. I think she just meant that it's a NYC problem that apartments in are in big demand/expensive. 

[62GREAT]

MsPH

Thank you for clarifying

[Double-S Mom]

My first previouslytv post -- woo hoo 

 

On to the topic at hand;  what I dont understand is why Jason going to the Fire Academy is so earth shattering.  Didn't Cortney say at the very beginning that her father and brother are firefighters?  If so then this should not be a deal-breaker for their relationship.

[62GREAT]

I know I might not have this right, but also on Cortney's twitter it implies the ending is bittersweet.

I have a bad feeling they don't stay together. I was looking forward to a love story.

[Adeejay]

The fact that Jason hasn't introduced Cortney to his mom or even mentioned her name, clearly indicates that he isn't in this for the long haul.

Jamie was just looking for any excuse as to why she couldn't be with Doug and not look like a total bitch. Sooner or later she was bound to find something.

I agree with the poster who said that Vaughn checked out after seeing Monet in her "birthday suit". He seems to be just biding his time.

[StayingAfterSunday]

Jamie reminds me of ''Nurse Betty" (Renee Zellweger in the movie) where she lives her life like she is in a soap opera.

 

 

 Yes, and I was thinking Cortney actually resembles a  younger Renee Zellweger. 

 

Okay, for just a moment I am redirecting my thinking a bit. It seems to me that none of these stories are real. None! But the fact that Monet was adamant about Vaughn having lunch with her and the girls just didn't sit right. Then it occurred to me that she may have promised to get her girlfriends on camera and that was a way to do it. All along she's tried to get them involved.

 

Wow.  I never considered that!  But it is certainly a plausible theory. 

 

Yeah, Vaughn lost me with that one, too.  Did he really think it was such a big deal that he picked her up from the doctor's office? 

I know...but it seems men often instinctively go into "action" or "fix-it"  mode when dealing with others, including  their wives. They define the quality of their contribution within the marriage by what they DO.

 

 

The fact that Jason hasn't introduced Cortney to his mom or even mentioned her name, clearly indicates that he isn't in this for the long haul.

 

 

I was wondering if maybe Jason's mother is the one opposed to meeting Cortney.  When Jason alluded to having a "hard" childhood or something of that nature, I wonder what he meant beyond the obvious: That his father was out of the picture by the time Jason was three yrs. old, and that Jason's mother raised him by herself without any extended family around to help.  

 

His mother, despite her failing health, might be possessive of him and may even feel jealous that she is no longer the number one woman in Jason's life. 

 

With respect to Jason's withholding the name of his mother I wonder if this decision was a cautionary one based on a need to protect the mother's privacy, particulary in light of her compromised health.  I suspect Cortney has known Jason's mother's name, etc. for a while now, but that Jason shared those details with Cortney privately, away from the cameras.

Edited September 1, 2014 by StayingAfterSunday

[absolutelyido]

With respect to Jason's withholding the name of his mother I wonder if this decision was a cautionary one based on a need to protect the mother's privacy, particulary in light of her compromised health.  I suspect Cortney has known Jason's mother's name, etc. for a while now, but that Jason shared those details with Cortney privately, away from the cameras.

 

Cortney said she "realized" she didn't know Jason's Mom's name. I don't think Jason was necessarily withholding his Mom's name, just that whenever they talked about her they just naturally referred to her as his Mom, until at some point Cortney realized that she didn't know her name.

 

It's really been the same for Doug's Mom. For all the times J & D have talked about his Mom, they've never referred to her by her first name. I assume Jamie knows it, but I've never heard either of them use it.

[Hypatia70]

I'm a newbie here, so please be patient. This is my first post. My comment is about Monet having had a girl's night when Vaughn  was coming home after having been away for work.  You folks seem to have overlooked an important part.  Vaughn could have come home the night before, however he chose to stay in New Jersey instead of coming home to his wife!  How would that make you feel if you were Monet?  He certainly was not excited to get home to his bride, so feeling put off, she went ahead and scheduled her girls night when he finally did decide to come home the next night.   I don't blame her. He had his chance, and he kind of insulted her by not coming home when he could have, thus putting her off for the next day.  There's some underhanded stuff going on already.  He started this one, and she responded accordingly, yet he makes it look like it's all her doing.  He instigated it from the start.  They don't stand a chance.  This relationship will only get worse over time.  

 

I think Jamie would be more attracted to Doug if he'd just get to a dermatologist and get those ugly bumps removed from his face!  I know it sounds and is shallow, but when you're talking physical attraction, looks go a long way when you're starting out.  Jamie has the most to gain by accepting and growing to love Doug.  He comes with the family she wants, and he puts up with her drama.  She has to decide if she wants the reality show limelight or actually a nice dependable guy with whom to settle down.  I think Doug would rise to the occasion if and when any serious life tragedy or challenge faced them, and that says a lot.  She could do much worse, and already has. She should be counting her blessings to have this opportunity.  Doug has some growing up to do, but I think his heart is in the right place. I think they stand a chance.

 

Poor Courtney!  Why on earth did Jason get on this show knowing he was soon to be completely unavailable for months on end with his job?  That's just downright irresponsible and not fair to the woman.  Courtney is a catch. He seems too dumb and immature to appreciate what he's got. He's going to blow it.  I actually believe she would stick with him throughout his training and such, looking at the long term, but I'm not so sure he's worth it. If he won't introduce her to his Mom, well, it can't go any further.  Shame on him for wasting her time and stealing her heart. He doesn't deserve her.  He didn't take all this seriously from the start. IMHO

[Higgins]

I'm a newbie here, so please be patient. This is my first post. My comment is about Monet having had a girl's night when Vaughn  was coming home after having been away for work.  You folks seem to have overlooked an important part.  Vaughn could have come home the night before, however he chose to stay in New Jersey instead of coming home to his wife!  How would that make you feel if you were Monet?  He certainly was not excited to get home to his bride, so feeling put off, she went ahead and scheduled her girls night when he finally did decide to come home the next night.   I don't blame her. He had his chance, and he kind of insulted her by not coming home when he could have, thus putting her off for the next day.  There's some underhanded stuff going on already.  He started this one, and she responded accordingly, yet he makes it look like it's all her doing.  He instigated it from the start.  They don't stand a chance.  This relationship will only get worse over time.  

 

I think Jamie would be more attracted to Doug if he'd just get to a dermatologist and get those ugly bumps removed from his face!  I know it sounds and is shallow, but when you're talking physical attraction, looks go a long way when you're starting out.  Jamie has the most to gain by accepting and growing to love Doug.  He comes with the family she wants, and he puts up with her drama.  She has to decide if she wants the reality show limelight or actually a nice dependable guy with whom to settle down.  I think Doug would rise to the occasion if and when any serious life tragedy or challenge faced them, and that says a lot.  She could do much worse, and already has. She should be counting her blessings to have this opportunity.  Doug has some growing up to do, but I think his heart is in the right place. I think they stand a chance.

 

Poor Courtney!  Why on earth did Jason get on this show knowing he was soon to be completely unavailable for months on end with his job?  That's just downright irresponsible and not fair to the woman.  Courtney is a catch. He seems too dumb and immature to appreciate what he's got. He's going to blow it.  I actually believe she would stick with him throughout his training and such, looking at the long term, but I'm not so sure he's worth it. If he won't introduce her to his Mom, well, it can't go any further.  Shame on him for wasting her time and stealing her heart. He doesn't deserve her.  He didn't take all this seriously from the start. IMHO

He ought to shave his head. I don't think it is his moles. I think it is his weak chin and too flat nose. He would be much more attractive with a more masculine bridge and jaw even with the moles.

[bluemoon]

Doug is mama's boy with his mama still very in control of his happiness! If I were Jamie, after the dinner at her and Doug's apartment with his parents, and after having conversations with his mom, I would run!.

Vaughn has to marry a submissive girl, not and independent person like Monet.

I like Courtney and feel sad for her. Like many other people, I don't know why he wanted to do this show.