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Murdaugh Murders: A Southern Scandal


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A lot of people who did not like how the HBO folks came in and handled it were willing to work with the Netflix folks.   the Murdaugh Murder Podcast or its companion piece Cup of Justice, did an episode on the the HBO doc and how bad it treated people.    Also there is a LOT of backstory.   I think the Netflix doc might get into the stealing from the clients more.   Which is the State's stated motive more the murders of Maggie and Paul.   Alec was about to have all his financial dealings exposed so he killed them to get sympathy and buy more time.   Alec is one sick MF if that is the real reason.    

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I’ve read a lot about this case…..which has so many layers, it’s more like 5-6 cases.  For background, you might check out several other shows that have featured it, I think 48 Hrs.  I’ve seen it on several threads around here, if you’re ok with spoilers. 
 

I’ll definitely be watching the upcoming docu series. How will they cover it all in just 3 episodes?  

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On 1/29/2023 at 11:32 AM, merylinkid said:

A lot of people who did not like how the HBO folks came in and handled it were willing to work with the Netflix folks.   the Murdaugh Murder Podcast or its companion piece Cup of Justice, did an episode on the the HBO doc and how bad it treated people.  

Interesting. What did HBO do that was so terrible?

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Alec's lost a lot of weight. The food must not be too good in jail. Is the current trial just for the murders of his wife & son or will it also deal with the murders of their housekeeper, as well as the murder of the "friend" of his older son?

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The housekeeper may or may not have been "murdered."   He is not charged with murdering anyone but his wife and son.   He is facing numerous financial counts for stealing from clients -- one of them the sons of the housekeeper.   But there are no other murder charges.

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  • 3 weeks later...

I created a topic for the HBO Max 3 part version of this called "The Low Country: The Murdaugh Dynasty". As I noted there, CNN will be replaying the HBO Max doc series this Sunday starting at 8pm ET

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13 hours ago, merylinkid said:

I was wrong Mandt Matney refused to be part of this doc too.  Because of how the documentary makes treated her and Sandy Smith.  Like they just existed to provide a good story.

I think this may have been what caused them to split from Fits News. I noted that Will Folks appears in this documentary. Also, that they cited Liz Farrell's reporting about Paul's favorable treatment when he was finally charged. But it also included the woman from the WSJ that Mandy Matney claims used her as a source then credited her as a "blogger" rather than an investigative journalist. So, yeah, she's not happy with these people either.

This version did include a LOT more than what was in the HBO Max series. The focus on Paul, his relationships with the other kids in the boat, his abuse of his girlfriend, and Alec and Maggie's nonchalant attitude towards his abuse of alcohol are all areas that I haven't heard a lot about before now. 

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7 minutes ago, Rlb8031 said:

I think this may have been what caused them to split from Fits News.

You may be right.   At the time Mandy said something about not liking the direction that Will was going.   I wondered if it was the same lady who bigfooted Mandy.    The WSJ lady was all "I've been covering SC for years."   Maybe, but I doubt you got far outside of Charleston.    You just parroted the line about the opiod addiction which NO ONE with a brain believes.   

I didn't like this doc.   there is SO MUCH MORE that they didn't even touch.   Too superficial.   It just didn't grab me like Mandy's podcast has from day one.   Although yes, Mandy and Liz and Eric are not the end all and be all of this story.   Definitely branch out.   But this documentary didn't add a whole helluva lot to me.

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Just finished watching this, and I personally found it informative because I really did not know much about the Murdaugh case, except that he's (Alex) been charged with murder of his wife and son. I also had known very little about the boating accident except for the news blurbs.

I liked that the series included some background and interviews with the teens who had been on the boat when it crashed. Paul's ex-girlfriend added some insight as to Murdaugh family dynamics and the relationship Paul had with the housekeeper/babysitter.

I would recommend this to anyone like me who would like a primer on the Murdaugh case, although I agree that there is likely much more information that could have been included and more to be uncovered.

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Watched this while working today. The biggest difference from the HBO documentary was the heavy focus on Mallory Beach, her relationships with her friends, the boating crash and the civil attorney’s investigation. We did get more insight into Paul but it wasn’t anything shocking just more confirmation that he was a spoiled brat who was a POS. 

A shotgun and AR-15 was used in the murders of Maggie and Paul. I know it’s being reported that evidence shows Alex was at the scene when the murders happened, but the use of two guns makes me wonder if there were two shooters. Was it him and someone else? Or two people who’ve not been identified? I’m guessing it’d most likely be the former rather than the latter if there were indeed two shooters.

I wouldn’t have been suspicious of the housekeeper falling down the stairs until Alex lied about speaking to her about the fall before she was rushed to the hospital when he wasn’t there when the incident happened. Also, him taking out a commercial insurance policy a month before the incident then swindling her family out of the insurance money made her death highly suspicious. 

I do wonder what happened to the millions of dollars he stole. He definitely didn’t spend all that money on drugs. He didn’t use it to paying bills cause apparently Maggie discovered that he wasn’t paying their bills. He didn’t use it all either to pay the guy whom he claimed to have hired to kill him. So where did the money go? Has there been an investigation to track where that money has went? Following the money will certainly provide some answers I think to many questions that have not yet been answered. 

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(edited)
3 hours ago, Enero said:

Following the money will certainly provide some answers I think to many questions that have not yet been answered. 

I sure hope that either or both NF and HBO follow up on this.  There's just something so shady about all of it - I think Alex and his lawyers have all had a hand in the client cookie jar.  I hope that the scope of the financial wrongdoing includes taking a look at all of them.  Frankly after watching both series it gave me enough insight into Alex that I'm pretty sure he either did it, or hired someone to do it. 

 

 

Edited by CherryMalotte
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Netflix CLAIMS that while making the film they uncovered MORE wrongdoing than is known.   They said they will reveal it in future episodes.   They did NOT take it to authorities.   This is one of the reasons Mandy Matney hates them.   They are teasing actual CRIMES in order to get views.   

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15 minutes ago, merylinkid said:

Netflix CLAIMS that while making the film they uncovered MORE wrongdoing than is known.   They said they will reveal it in future episodes.   They did NOT take it to authorities.

What?  I just got to the end of episode 2. That is reprehensible.  Do they say that in the doc?  I appreciate Morgan's insight into the effed up family dynamics and admire her strength for walking away completely after the crash.  Even under the circumstances, that wasn't an easy task for a teen-age girl in an abusive 4 year relationship.   The story of the car crash and her being scolded by her boyfriend's mom for calling 911, all while they run around cleaning up guns and beer cans from the crash site.  What a good young man Anthony is.  He was so candid when he spoke about his history with Paul and even now, it didn't come from a place of hate (and it would be justified if it did).  He loved his friend but knew that was over.

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1 hour ago, merylinkid said:

Netflix CLAIMS that while making the film they uncovered MORE wrongdoing than is known.   They said they will reveal it in future episodes.   They did NOT take it to authorities.   This is one of the reasons Mandy Matney hates them.   They are teasing actual CRIMES in order to get views.   

I saw an article about this from Vanity Fair (see below) and didn’t see anything in that article that said they’d not taken what they’d uncovered i.e.“previously unreported skeletons” in Alex’s closet to authorities. Perhaps this was stated in another interview the producers did about the series? They did say they did not have enough time in the allotted three episodes to explore all they’d uncovered so they are hoping for more episodes. 

https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2023/02/murdaugh-murders-netflix-interview

I will say I thought a couple of the theories presented in these three episodes didn’t make sense. If the housekeeper was murdered, I don’t think it was because she discovered Alex’s Oxy pills under a couch or because she knew too much as implied. She’d been working for that family for 20 years. She’d seen I’m sure many nefarious things and kept her mouth shut. If she was murdered it was for the insurance money. And since Alex wasn’t present when the incident happened, that would mean Maggie and/or Paul were in on the scheme.

Also, the theory around Eddie didn’t make sense. In the series they seemed to be implying Alex paid Eddie large sums of money before and after Maggie and Paul were murdered. Thus Eddie was their killer. Alex then called this guy to the remote dirt road planning to kill him for what…to tie up loose ends over the murders? But then claim Eddie tried to kill him but he managed to get the upper hand and kill Eddie first? That still wouldn’t tie up a loose end being there are financial records showing Alex paid Eddie large sums of money before and after the murders which would implicate Alex in the crime. I’m more inclined to believe the money paid to Eddie was for trafficking drugs than for the murders of Maggie and Paul. Not sure what the failed “suicide” attempt was really about but the theory present in this series didn’t make sense to me.

 

 

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Straight from the filmakers:

“There is so much more to tell in this story,” says Furst. “There are additional crimes that have occurred that we have the scoop on—corruption that goes far wider than Hampton, South Carolina. That goes to the state and to the federal level.” The filmmakers hope they’ll get enough views to warrant more episodes detailing those alleged crimes. 

“With Netflix, we get [access] to 200+ million people and 70+ different languages. We’re hoping that that creates a tidal wave to unlock the rest of the story. And we’re sitting on the rest of the story,” says Furst. 

If you tell the authorities, you lose control of when the information comes out, 2nd season greenlit or not.

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14 hours ago, Enero said:

Watched this while working today. The biggest difference from the HBO documentary was the heavy focus on Mallory Beach, her relationships with her friends, the boating crash and the civil attorney’s investigation. We did get more insight into Paul but it wasn’t anything shocking just more confirmation that he was a spoiled brat who was a POS. 

A shotgun and AR-15 was used in the murders of Maggie and Paul. I know it’s being reported that evidence shows Alex was at the scene when the murders happened, but the use of two guns makes me wonder if there were two shooters. Was it him and someone else? Or two people who’ve not been identified? I’m guessing it’d most likely be the former rather than the latter if there were indeed two shooters.

I wouldn’t have been suspicious of the housekeeper falling down the stairs until Alex lied about speaking to her about the fall before she was rushed to the hospital when he wasn’t there when the incident happened. Also, him taking out a commercial insurance policy a month before the incident then swindling her family out of the insurance money made her death highly suspicious. 

I do wonder what happened to the millions of dollars he stole. He definitely didn’t spend all that money on drugs. He didn’t use it to paying bills cause apparently Maggie discovered that he wasn’t paying their bills. He didn’t use it all either to pay the guy whom he claimed to have hired to kill him. So where did the money go? Has there been an investigation to track where that money has went? Following the money will certainly provide some answers I think to many questions that have not yet been answered. 

My understanding is that Maggie was shot in the back indicating that she was trying to get away. I'm trying to figure out even with all the hunting that went on at that property and among that family if they were so attuned to the sounds of close gunfire that whomever was the second one killed didn't suspect something was up. 

As for the millions, my guess is that a sizeable amount of it went just to their lifestyle. My understanding is that they flew private anytime they traveled, they took lavish trips (the fishing trip that they took Mallory on, the final four, etc.), Maggie spent a ton of money on clothes and cars, and they had multiple homes - none of that is cheap.  Alec had managed to keep this whole house of cards afloat for over 20 years, but at some point, there are no more rabbits in this hat. The speculation has been that the Beach's civil suit was going to create a perfect storm - Alec/Paul was certainly going to be assessed with liability and would have to come up with money that they didn't have. At the same time, Alec couldn't tell anyone he was poor with the multiple houses, the cars, and all the conspicuous consumption.

As for the "other crimes", it's clear just from the issues with Palmento State Bank and the conservatorships that there was if not outright corruption, then certainly at least incompetence or lack of oversight. The fact that conservators were not being asked by the court to document anything, that the attorneys were outright lying about the state of their cases, and no one was saying or doing anything is a problem. And then, of course, the cozy relationship between the solicitor, state legislators, the university, etc. all create grounds for looking into just what the hell is going on in SC.

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My husband and I binged this last night and were fascinated. But before, our knowledge was limited to brief snippets on national news and a brief skim of Wikipedia, so we were almost blank slates.

I did come away from it wanting to know a lot more. Feels like the surface was barely scratched on a lot of this. And I’m very curious to see where things go with the Stephen Smith investigation. We were a little confused on how they believed the Murdaughs were involved. Was there anything other than rumor? (The fact the case just disappeared was fishy in itself, of course.)

I, too, appreciated the deeper look at the kids’ relationships and family dynamics. Nearly came out of my skin that the focus of law enforcement seemed to be more about protecting Paul than about finding Mallory — or, you know, calling her parents. (Please tell me I heard that part wrong. Did they really just not call them?)

As someone who’s been in a relationship like the one described, a lot of Morgan’s story rang so very true and my heart went out to that girl. I hope she continues to find strength and peace.

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On 2/17/2023 at 12:53 PM, DanaK said:

I created a topic for the HBO Max 3 part version of this called "The Low Country: The Murdaugh Dynasty". As I noted there, CNN will be replaying the HBO Max doc series this Sunday starting at 8pm ET

Note that there was already a topic in the HBO documentary area, so now there are two.  Folks might want to reference the older one over there for more history from when it first came out.  Don't know if/when the mods might merge them.

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50 minutes ago, AgathaC said:

And I’m very curious to see where things go with the Stephen Smith investigation. We were a little confused on how they believed the Murdaughs were involved. Was there anything other than rumor?

Mostly rumors.   However, a couple of things -- John Marvin Murdaugh was seen AT THE SCENE with law enforcement after his body was found.   Also, Sandy Smith got a call from I believe John Marvin or someone on his behalf, saying that JMM would represent them in a wrongful death suit.   And this was the DAY Stephen Smith's body was found.   No one even had a cause of death by then, so how could anyone know a wrongful death suit was even possible?

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Oh that is even more complicated.    Someone showed up claiming to be an investigator working the case and asked for the laptop.   Sandy, being a trusting person who DESPERATELY wants someone to find out what happened to her son, handed it over.   It has never been seen again.

However, it turns out the investigator was a PI hired by Parker (not the Parker of PMPD) who owns the liquor store chain where Paul bought booze the night of the boat crash.   He is being sued in the boat crash case.   So WHY he needed Stephen's laptop we do not know.   But it just shows EVERYTHING is weird.

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45 minutes ago, merylinkid said:

Oh that is even more complicated.    Someone showed up claiming to be an investigator working the case and asked for the laptop.   Sandy, being a trusting person who DESPERATELY wants someone to find out what happened to her son, handed it over.   It has never been seen again.

However, it turns out the investigator was a PI hired by Parker (not the Parker of PMPD) who owns the liquor store chain where Paul bought booze the night of the boat crash.   He is being sued in the boat crash case.   So WHY he needed Stephen's laptop we do not know.   But it just shows EVERYTHING is weird.

The speculation is that Parker was looking at all of the Murdaugh related cases as a way to gain leverage and reduce his own liability. I believe he wanted to get out without having to pay anything and he was preparing to throw all of the allegations at Paul just being a bad guy out in court to see if any of it would stick. He would have used the rumors that Buster was involved with Steven and that Paul or Buster was directly involved in Steven's death to claim that Paul was mostly at fault and that he had a history of doing bad things and getting away with it. Another theory is that it was a deal between he and Alec to cover up anything that could be used by the Beach family in the trial to discredit Paul or Alec. Either way, the takeaway is that the rich guys were looking out for one another.

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I hope there are more episodes. Stephen deserves justice, and I hope the Murdaugh's aren't enabled to pin his and Gloria's death on Paul, Debbie, or even Alex if he's convicted in order to save Buster.

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This whole case is tragic but my heart goes out to Mallory's family and Anthony. It's so sad how she died and how the Murdaugh's didn't care whatsoever. It was all about protecting Paul. Who looked like a douche in every picture they showed of him. 

How did this one family have this much power and influence in this small town? yes I know, money. 

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1 hour ago, CherryMalotte said:

Wow...they found him  guilty...I've been watching the trial and honestly I am thrilled but I thought we'd end up a hung jury.

Me too.  I was convinced they got to at least one juror.

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The juror that the judge dismissed today was pro defense… she was reported to be talking about the case to two people, the judge interviewed her and the two people who reported her and she was dismissed and replaced by an alternate juror.

The funniest thing was the judge asked her if she had all her belongings and she said “No, I have a dozen eggs, my purse and a bottle of water in the jury room” the courtroom and the judge burst out in laughter and the judge instructed a bailiff to go retrieve the ladies eggs, purse and water.  😂

She left and the jurors were called in and told that she was gone and that juror 254 would be taking her place.

Over the course of the trial they lost 2 jurors to positive Covid tests, 1 juror wasn’t feeling well, went to doctor and was dismissed and the “egg lady” was the 4th juror to leave, that left them with only 1 alternate remaining so it’s a good thing it ended before they ran out of alternate jurors.

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Considering what happened during the days' long Russell LaFitte trial, the State is very lucky that the jury came back so quickly. They might have had to declare a mistrial for lack of jurors.  Which I think the Defense was counting on.

In the Lafitte Trial, as the deliberations wore on and were going late one night, one juror said they needed to take their medication at a certain time (why they did not bring it we don't know) and one juror said that another juror was refusing to deliberate and follow the instructions.    They only had 2 alternates left.   The jurors were replaced, 45 minutes later there was a verdict.

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Consecutive life sentences. The judge very clearly didn’t buy what Murdaugh was selling. At all.

His team will appeal, likely using the admission of financial crimes as a base, but regardless, he’s done.

I’m sorry there was so much tragedy. But I can’t help but feel glad that this family’s corruption and power and abuses have finally been exposed.

From what I heard, this family “ruled” by force and fear. When cracks start to appear in that sort of foundation, they don’t have much to fall back on. It’s not like there’s a lot of good will.

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There is not.  Not ONE victim impact statement on behalf of Maggie and Paul.  So sad.

They can appeal on the financial crimes but its clear the jury decided based on his lie about not being at the kennels.

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(edited)
3 hours ago, AgathaC said:

I’m sorry there was so much tragedy. But I can’t help but feel glad that this family’s corruption and power and abuses have finally been exposed.

From what I heard, this family “ruled” by force and fear. When cracks start to appear in that sort of foundation, they don’t have much to fall back on. It’s not like there’s a lot of good will.

They also ruled with their money.

My cousin likened the whole thing to a Shakespearean play..... I was also reminded of families in power throughout history like the Medicis and the Borgias. 

Edited by libgirl2
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(edited)
1 hour ago, merylinkid said:

There is not.  Not ONE victim impact statement on behalf of Maggie and Paul.  So sad.

They can appeal on the financial crimes but its clear the jury decided based on his lie about not being at the kennels.

Yeah. I was reading an article earlier today where a man who was on the jury stated that Alex lying about when the murders happened and the evidence showing he was at the kennels moments before the murders happened was what clinched it for him. 
 

As far as no one making victim impact statements about Paul and Maggie’s murders I think there are a number of reasons. From there being no one who cared enough to speak, to those who are sadden about the murders but don’t believe Alex did it, to perhaps some believing he did it but are afraid to go against him in making a statement in asking he be severely punished for what he did. Though Alex is now off to prison I don’t know how much that will diminish the Murdaugh’s power in the Low Country. Time will tell but I’m sure though many are happy to see Alex go down there’s still a lot of fear about crossing him and his family. 

Edited by Enero
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3 hours ago, merylinkid said:

Not ONE victim impact statement on behalf of Maggie and Paul. 

I just can't gather a picture of what Maggie was like.  Was she just as awful as the rest of the them?  I've read/seen a few impactful things such as she raised the boys to know they were above the law and "better" than others.  She seemed to have been actively involved in cover-ups for Paul.  She didn't seem very interested in Paul or loving towards him.  Are there any good reports about her?  How she grew up?  Her family?  Her interests, personality, etc.?  

On 2/23/2023 at 9:09 AM, Rlb8031 said:

This version did include a LOT more than what was in the HBO Max series. The focus on Paul, his relationships with the other kids in the boat, his abuse of his girlfriend, and Alec and Maggie's nonchalant attitude towards his abuse of alcohol are all areas that I haven't heard a lot about before now. 

It was gut-wrenching to hear but I thought the kids just helped to flush out the story so much more.  And despite everything that's happened, they were still able to objectively speak about Paul and share why they liked to be around him as much as why they didn't.

This is pretty pointless but I've beenstruck by how 50% of people call Alex, "Alex" and 50% pronounce his name "Alec".  Same with the last name:  "Murdaw" or "Murdoch".  Which is it???

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Now that the trial is over, I suspect we may never know what actually happened to Paul and Maggie. All the plausible theories about Alex committing the murders don't hold up once you start dissecting them. Even if it was about Maggie and Paul knowing about the financial troubles, would that actually make Alex kill them both in cold blood? What would that solve? And if it was about the civil suit from the Beach family, killing Paul wouldn't help get Alex out of that since he was the sole defendant in the case. And there's no evidence that there was a 'vigilante"(or 2) that did the murders to avenge Mallory. None of it adds up. 

I do know that the whole family is shady as hell (especially Alex), and I wouldn't trust any of them any further than I could throw them. I truly don't know if Alex pulled the triggers, but his behavior before and during the trial didn't help him at all.

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People have killed each other over parking spaces.  Men have killed their families over a LOT less than their financial difficulties being found out.   Scott Peterson killed his wife and unborn child because he didn't want to be a dad.   I am not sure why Chris Watts killed his family but he did.   WHY is it so hard to believe that Alex killed his family?

If not him, WHO?   If you pick at it, all the theories about Alex fall apart?   How about all the theories that SOMEONE ELSE did it?   He was at the scene just minutes before they died.   The ONLY time he lied about his whereabouts ALL DAMN DAY was the time of the murders.   If he didn't do it how did he know what time to lie about?   All the theories of someone else would have someone somehow getting on to this property within a very narrow time frame between when Alex was seen at the kennels and when he went to visit his mother.   During that time, this stranger managed to find two different guns, find Maggie and Paul who were NOT EVEN SUPPOSED TO BE THERE THAT NIGHT, shoot them, get the dogs in the kennel and coil up the hose, then escape without being seen.   All without causing the dogs to go nuts.   All this in 20 minutes.

Or Alex goes down to the kennels in the golf cart, shoots them, cleans up with the hose, drives the golf cart back to house, and goes to his mom's house.  

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I just finished the second episode and need a cleansing breath before I can finish the documentary.  


My theory as to why is that Alex’s life is unraveling.  He blames Paul for it.  The lawsuit regarding the boat crash is causing the discovery of his financials, and he blames Paul for the house of cards falling.  I also wonder at the rumors that Maggie hired a forensic accountant and possibly visited a divorce attorney.  That might be his motive for her, or maybe she said something after seeing Paul dead and he didn’t think she would stay silent.  My guesses so far.

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He also indicated on the stand that he was addicted to drugs and it caused him to be paranoid. So I have no issue with believing he killed his wife and son because he was going to be found out for at least the embezzlement and because he was paranoid from his drug addiction (at least according to him)

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He believed Maggie and Paul’s deaths would bring him sympathy and because everyone would be so rightly devastated for him it would stop the investigation about his stealing and embezzlement. And it absolutely worked. For a time.

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4 minutes ago, Kiki620 said:

And it absolutely worked. For a time.

All he needed was time.   Russell LaFitte (who got convicted back in November for various financial crimes) came through with an off the books loan and then Chris Wilson for reasons known only to Chris Wilson agreed to cover the rest of the missing $752,000.   The hearing regarding producing financials that was schedule for June 10, 2021 was postponed out of sympathy, then was never held after Alex was arrested and held for the roadside shooting, then the financial crimes.   

Like all con man, just give him enough time to figure out another scam to cover the first one.

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Since a few of you listen to Mandy's podcast, I started a topic on it in the podcasts:

 

this way we can talk about more than what the documentaries cover.

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