S03.E03: Barbary Coast

[gonzosgirrl]

Airdate: June 3, 2022

[AnimeMania]

Tonight at 9/8C on Vought Plus, it’s the season finale of #AmericanHero! Three contestants remain, but only TWO will join #TheSeven! Will Starlight choose her old flame Supersonic? Or will someone else be moving into the Seven Tower? Tune in tonight for the SHOCKING final episode, brought to you by Lean Lady Frozen Dinners by Vought: Where slim tastes super!

[DeeDee79]

Yay, Soldier Boy! Love to see the 1st shot of Jensen outside of the photos from the 1st two eps and I also didn't expect to see that Stan Edgar was in the mix when Payback was in action. The actor is pretty good, he has Giancarlo's speech pattern down pat. I'm not surprised how Homelander is screwing with Starlight, Deep and A-Train right now but I actually felt sorry for Deep during the dinner scene. His wife is pretty fucked up to have enjoyed what Homelander did to him. And holy hell what an ending!!

Edited June 3, 2022 by DeeDee79

[mac123x]

The actors they got for young Grace and Stan were pretty good imitators.

[Bergamot]

10 hours ago, DeeDee79 said:

I'm not surprised how Homelander is screwing with Starlight, Deep and A-Train right now but I actually felt sorry for Deep during the dinner scene.

I was like, omg, is he really going to eat Timothy?! NOOO!! Timothy is his friend! He has kids! He is praying and begging for his life!

That was horrible. 🤢 Of all the over-the-top things we saw in these first 3 episodes, for some reason that was the one time I had to look away from the screen. I couldn't watch!

I don't know how sorry I felt for the Deep though. It was his choice. Deep seems almost likable sometimes, and he is always getting pushed around, but when you come right down to it, he was willing to swallow his friend alive for the opportunity to be in The Seven. That's who he is.

[gonzosgirrl]

3 minutes ago, Bergamot said:

That was horrible. 🤢 Of all the over-the-top things we saw in these first 3 episodes, for some reason that was the one time I had to look away from the screen. I couldn't watch!

Me too. That octopus had soulful eyes for a tiny little guy. RIP Patrick. I get why Homelander is an egomaniac and needs love/adoration like air, but I really don't get why he has to be a sadistic prick along the way.

I don't see a spoilers and spec thread - maybe someone can come up with a good thread title and make one? Meantime:

Spoiler

I had a thought about Supersonic - I wonder if he is going to end up being a double-agent. Homelander seemed oddly accepting of him. I got a skeevy feeling from him when he told Starlight he was only accepting the position to have her back.

[Bergamot]

3 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

  Reveal spoiler

Spoiler

I was wondering about him too! I wasn't sure if he was sincere when he said he would not bail on her, or if he just really wanted to be part of The Seven. I didn't think about him possibly being a double agent, although after seeing what people will do for power on this show, I wouldn't be surprised!  Anyway, if Supersonic really does mean it, and intends to be there for her and to watch her back, he is pretty much doomed already, because there is no way Homelander will allow that.

[Bergamot]

15 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

That octopus had soulful eyes for a tiny little guy.

Octopuses are actually very intelligent!

https://www.nhm.ac.uk/discover/octopuses-keep-surprising-us-here-are-eight-examples-how.html

[Bergamot]

I have a couple questions about this episode.

Why is Butcher so cruel to Ryan when he leaves him?  Is he so angry, and so bitter and defeated at the accusation that he has turned out to be just like his father, that he decides he might as well go all the way and become the person he hates?

Or maybe he just wants to keep Ryan at a distance, either because he thinks it is safer for him, or because he knows that Ryan can sense his temporary super powers. But in either of those cases, he did not need to say what he said, he could have chosen a kinder way to separate himself from the child. From the look on his face when he says it, I don’t think he actually holds Ryan responsible for Becca’s death, but I don’t know why he said that to him. There was no need, and the damage he has done may not be repairable.

My other question is from the flashback story with Soldier Boy that Grace tells them. At one point, before the shooting starts, she hears Edgar say to Black Noir, “Will the others go along?” And Black Noir answers, “Everyone but Gunpowder”. What is this about?

I assumed that if there was some kind of conspiracy regarding Soldier Boy’s disappearance that it was orchestrated by the CIA, that is if he really wasn’t killed by the Russians. But now it looks as if Vought was behind it, and that the other members of Payback were in on it. Maybe that’s why they took out so many of Grace’s men, rather than because they were uncontrolled/untrained and/or incompetent. I thought that the hysterical declaration from the Countess, announcing  that Soldier Boy has been killed as she points dramatically to the helicopter, sounded kind of fishy, like she was acting from a script.
 

[gonzosgirrl]

34 minutes ago, Bergamot said:

Why is Butcher so cruel to Ryan when he leaves him?  Is he so angry, and so bitter and defeated at the accusation that he has turned out to be just like his father, that he decides he might as well go all the way and become the person he hates?

I think he thought he was being cruel to be kind, distancing himself from the kid, but moreso distancing the kid from him. I'm sure he knows the odds are pretty high that he'll die in the attempt to take out Homelander and it'll hurt less if the kid hates him. And he also knows he puts him in danger every time he visits, with the possibility that Homelander will discover the safe house. This way the kid won't miss him. That was a pretty scorched-earth way to do it though. Ouch.

[MAK]

1 hour ago, Bergamot said:

I assumed that if there was some kind of conspiracy regarding Soldier Boy’s disappearance that it was orchestrated by the CIA, that is if he really wasn’t killed by the Russians

I think Vought was getting tired of Soldier Boy's behavior, and refusal to (at least pretend) to evolve with the times. Stan probably had Homelander in the wings, with plans to have better control over Vought's "product."

Apparently there really wasn't anything to kill him, so they decided to put him on ice? Also, hedging their bets, if Homelander didn't work out?

[gonzosgirrl]

I'm curious to learn more about MM's hatred of Soldier Boy. Obviously it involves his father/family, but how? It seems Soldier Boy is to MM as Homelander is to Butcher, his 'white whale' so to speak.

[tessathereaper]

37 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

I'm curious to learn more about MM's hatred of Soldier Boy. Obviously it involves his father/family, but how? It seems Soldier Boy is to MM as Homelander is to Butcher, his 'white whale' so to speak.

Spoiler

In one of the newspapers on his wall, someone posted a blow up of it, you can read a partial story about how 3 members of the Milk family were killed in a Soldier Boy incident.  The official story was apparently that he was attempting to stop some bad guys and a car tried to ram him and it veered/he deflected it and it ran into the Milk's house where it killed three adult members of his family(they had ages two were in their 30's one in their 50's so I assume a grandparent and either his mother(I can't remember if his mother was around when he was growing up) and/or aunt/uncles.  Maybe in reality it was something like A-Train?  He was drunk/high and HE drove the car into the house? Maybe it was more like the Stormfront incident we saw in Season 2 and they just completely fabricated a story? That's what I'm assuming will be the case.  Or maybe it really was just an accident, even assholes aren't necessarily at fault for everything.

[PurpleTentacle]

I really don't like the "I have to be mean to you for your own safety"- trope. The boy is old enough, just explain it to him.

The flashbacks are certainly interesting. I had hoped they'd make soldier boy gay, if only to abate some of the backlash Ackles got after the Supernatural fiasco, of which the writers deserved all but the actors really didn't (I think there was also something taken a bit out of context he said at a con). But maybe he still is and just waaaay overcompensating with his corny one-liners.

comic "spoilers":

Spoiler

In the comics he does have sex with Homelander, but there his character is very different.

spoilers from the season-trailer:

Spoiler

I'm surprised they didn't find soldier boy alive yet. I would have thought by the end of episode three that would have happened at the latest. Somebody decided to spoil quite a bit of the season with that trailer.

Edited June 3, 2022 by PurpleTentacle

[DeeDee79]

3 hours ago, gonzosgirrl said:

I'm curious to learn more about MM's hatred of Soldier Boy. Obviously it involves his father/family, but how?

In season 2 he said that his father killed himself trying to get justice because of a Supe so I'm assuming Soldier Boy may have killed his mother, siblings or both. I'm guessing that they were either Supe collateral damage or it was done with intentional cruelty like we saw from Liberty.

[Affogato]

4 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

I really don't like the "I have to be mean to you for your own safety"- trope. The boy is old enough, just explain it to him.

comic "spoilers":

  Reveal spoiler

In the comics he does have sex with Homelander, but there his character is very different.

spoilers from the season-trailer:

  Reveal spoiler

I'm surprised they didn't find soldier boy alive yet. I would have thought by the end of episode three that would have happened at the latest. Somebody decided to spoil quite a bit of the season with that trailer.

It wasn't just being mean to him for his own safety. Butcher IS his father's son and Ryan becomes, in this case, collateral damage in his argument with Mallory. Butcher has a lot of good qualities, but he is carrying a lot of trauma, as is Ryan, Grace, Hughie, the whole lot of them.

[AntFTW]

10 hours ago, Bergamot said:

I was like, omg, is he really going to eat Timothy?! NOOO!! Timothy is his friend! He has kids! He is praying and begging for his life!

After watching, I kinda felt the title of the episode should have been "Eat Fucking Timothy" 🤣

[Affogato]

If we have two supes that don't age I wonder if this Black Noir is the same as the Payback Black Noir. Vought/Homelander/the Seven are so outrageously racist (and misogynistic) that it would be interesting to see him get payback, They are showing an increasing number of Supes who are POC and a plot could be forming.

God, Timothy. The Deep is just the worst. I suppose he was listening to the oysters scream, too.

[Glade]

When Black Noir was talking about going maskless, my immediate thought was that the reason Black Noir in the present is speechless and always masked is because he's actually Soldeir Boy in disguise, that he must have killed him and stolen his suit for some reason...but I guess not.

The endless toxic masculinity on this show is a real turn off.

[PurpleTentacle]

7 hours ago, Affogato said:

It wasn't just being mean to him for his own safety. Butcher IS his father's son and Ryan becomes, in this case, collateral damage in his argument with Mallory. Butcher has a lot of good qualities, but he is carrying a lot of trauma, as is Ryan, Grace, Hughie, the whole lot of them.

I disagree and so did Hughie, which is what he tried to say before Butcher vomited in his face. But I guess you can interpret it a different way.

6 hours ago, Affogato said:

If we have two supes that don't age I wonder if this Black Noir is the same as the Payback Black Noir.

He is. His nut-allergy was mentioned and we saw how he got those massive scars on his face. But that doesn't necessarily mean that he doesn't age. He was pretty young when that whole thing went down. He could absolutely be just an older guy under that mask.

6 minutes ago, Glade said:

When Black Noir was talking about going maskless, my immediate thought was that the reason Black Noir in the present is speechless and always masked is because he's actually Soldeir Boy in disguise, that he must have killed him and stolen his suit for some reason...but I guess not.

For that to work he would have to put on a fake scar and wear black makeup under that mask all the time. We saw half of his face last season when Maeve pulled up his mask and shoved an almond joy down his mouth.

[Affogato]

2 hours ago, Glade said:

When Black Noir was talking about going maskless, my immediate thought was that the reason Black Noir in the present is speechless and always masked is because he's actually Soldeir Boy in disguise, that he must have killed him and stolen his suit for some reason...but I guess not.

The endless toxic masculinity on this show is a real turn off.

I think it is the point of the show. It is good that it is a turn off. 

Edited June 4, 2022 by Affogato

[Affogato]

12 hours ago, Affogato said:

God, Timothy. The Deep is just the worst. I suppose he was listening to the oysters scream, too.

I feel bad about this post. If I leave it at that, anyway. There is more that needs to be said.

Look, Butcher and Homelander are both pretty abusive guys. We learn about their backgrounds, which are different. Butcher maybe tries to walk away from Ryan before he becomes what he hates about Homelander. Homelander hasn't had enough in his life to be able to even venture to empathise with someone, Butcher had some advantages.

Now Chase is an abused person. We can assume he was heavily bullied because, freak. Homelander uses and abuses him, His church and his wife and his friends use and abuse him. It doesn't make him a nice person at all, but he doesn't have a lot of power in this situation. It can be way to easy to feel sympathetic when someone abuses someone who does horrible things themselves, or when someone abuses someone and, as in this case, they cave to the more powerful person, but it is still abuse and it is important to look at the power dynamic.

Chase and Timothy are both victims, here.

[Affogato]

7 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

I disagree and so did Hughie, which is what he tried to say before Butcher vomited in his face. But I guess you can interpret it a different way.

It isn’t a light switch. You aren’t a hero or a villain.  Butcher struggles with it. Realistically many people would never think (under similar circumstances) ti say that to Ryan. Honestly Hughie may as Butcher’s mentee be more able to appreciate the love aspects of Butcher’s tough live approach, particularly since Hughie has a loving father. We haven’t seen how But her would do as a father long term, though..

i think I’ve been assuming they were pulling something different with Noir and it has blinded me to some things. 

Edited June 4, 2022 by Affogato

[AntFTW]

On 6/3/2022 at 10:22 AM, Bergamot said:

I don't know how sorry I felt for the Deep though. It was his choice. Deep seems almost likable sometimes, and he is always getting pushed around, but when you come right down to it, he was willing to swallow his friend alive for the opportunity to be in The Seven. That's who he is.

I wouldn't say it was his choice. I thought it was about more than being in The Seven. Sure, that's part of it but Homelander is intimidating, threatening, and unstable. It's hard for him to resist when he legitimately fears Homelander.

Edited June 6, 2022 by AntFTW

[Ohiopirate02]

On 6/2/2022 at 11:55 PM, DeeDee79 said:

Yay, Soldier Boy! Love to see the 1st shot of Jensen outside of the photos from the 1st two eps and I also didn't expect to see that Stan Edgar was in the mix when Payback was in action. The actor is pretty good, he has Giancarlo's speech pattern down pat. I'm not surprised how Homelander is screwing with Starlight, Deep and A-Train right now but I actually felt sorry for Deep during the dinner scene. His wife is pretty fucked up to have enjoyed what Homelander did to him. And holy hell what an ending!!

Deep's wife had it out for Timothy after her husband forgot about her while still thrusting inside her.  I can't say I blame her.  Timothy was watching her having sex without her consent while talking dirty to her husband.  He's not some poor innocent octopus.  

[mac123x]

On 6/3/2022 at 11:21 AM, Bergamot said:

My other question is from the flashback story with Soldier Boy that Grace tells them. At one point, before the shooting starts, she hears Edgar say to Black Noir, “Will the others go along?” And Black Noir answers, “Everyone but Gunpowder”. What is this about?

I assumed that if there was some kind of conspiracy regarding Soldier Boy’s disappearance that it was orchestrated by the CIA, that is if he really wasn’t killed by the Russians. But now it looks as if Vought was behind it, and that the other members of Payback were in on it. Maybe that’s why they took out so many of Grace’s men, rather than because they were uncontrolled/untrained and/or incompetent. I thought that the hysterical declaration from the Countess, announcing  that Soldier Boy has been killed as she points dramatically to the helicopter, sounded kind of fishy, like she was acting from a script.

I hadn't thought of that but it definitely fits the evidence so far.  Present!Day Gunpowder didn't know anything useful, and Scarlet Witch, err, Crimson Countess did NOT want to talk.  I wonder if the TNT Twins and Mindstorm are still alive; maybe one of them will spill.

[WritinMan]

8 hours ago, Affogato said:

I think it is the point of the show. It is good that it is a turn off. 

Yeah...that's kind of the point. Although, I'd hesitate to refer to it as toxic "masculinity" as so many characters overall--male and female--are horrible people.

Edited June 4, 2022 by WritinMan

[Chicago Redshirt]

1 hour ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

Deep's wife had it out for Timothy after her husband forgot about her while still thrusting inside her.  I can't say I blame her.  Timothy was watching her having sex without her consent while talking dirty to her husband.  He's not some poor innocent octopus.  

I wonder if Ms. Deep sold Timothy out to Homelander. She had to have, for Homelander to have picked him out of all the sealife in the aquarium. And also, it seems like swallowing a whole live octopus would be tough to do in one swallow without chewing....unless you have a Deep throat.

I'll be here all week!

[Ohiopirate02]

49 minutes ago, WritinMan said:

Yeah...that's kind of the point. Although, I'd hesitate to refer to it as toxic "masculinity" as so many characters overall--male and female--are horrible people.

I see the show skewering American corporate culture specifically the media/Hollywood in between the creative gore scenes and plot.  Someone in the writers' room is having fun writing these scripts.  Take Ashley's summation of the one female contestant "she's body-positive without being too body-positive" i.e. a woman who is not a size zero but who's still "fuckable."  I personally did a double take later in the episode when I actually saw the actress who's maybe a size 4 on the wrong day of the month.  

[Bergamot]

2 hours ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

Deep's wife had it out for Timothy after her husband forgot about her while still thrusting inside her.  I can't say I blame her.  Timothy was watching her having sex without her consent while talking dirty to her husband.  He's not some poor innocent octopus.  

The Boys Cast Says RIP to Timothy the Octopus

Chace says that Timothy was a "good listener" and was "gone too soon". He also says though that Timothy "didn't taste very good", which, I don't know, is kind of insulting! 😏

[Ottis]

6 hours ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

I see the show skewering American corporate culture specifically the media/Hollywood in between the creative gore scenes and plot.

I think it is less corporate culture than politics and Hollywood. In this ep it became very clear who Homelander represents. And the whole superhero thing is like satire within satire of the current Marvel/DC universes. And the obsession with ratings and popularity is a Hollywood/pop culture thing. The show has been pretty light on actually making money, aside from the serum.

[CletusMusashi]

As far as I'm concerned, fuck The Deep.. I mean, he's not a monster on the level of Homelander, but no matter how sympathetically he is written or acted, at the end of the day he is all about himself. Every sea creature "friend" we've seen him with with dies horribly, and he shrugs it off and goes right back to using somebody else. Timothy was literally only living in that aquarium because The Deep took him out of the ocean and brought him there? And what sort of non-living-marine-life-octopus-food was Deep going to feed him anyway? Crabmeat-flavored Fancy feast? And, in addition to the narcissism, he's a fool. I mean, I can understand being trapped in a contract with The Seven and living every day of your life in terror of what Homelander might do to you next if he becomes increasingly annoyed. But Deep was out. And he was doing perfectly well financially. His book sales were high enough for him to be doing TV interviews. I pay my bills perfectly well without working for The Seven. Maybe he himself could try working a real job. But no. The entire time he was out, all he fucking wanted was to go back the The Seven. Okay, well, you're back now. Spoiler Alert: Homelander did not magically turn into a nice guy while you were gone.

Edited June 11, 2022 by CletusMusashi

[CletusMusashi]

On a non-Deep note, I love that their flashbacks to the 80s and 90s actually feel right. There are so many little Easter eggs of not only historial accuracy but also of plausible simulation woven into them... I love it. Most movies' and/or shows' flashbacks just re-create the Hollywood version of an era, so the 80s is all studded leather and Mohawks and luftballoons. Nope. I was there. Big dorky mustaches and jokes about how hot Loni Anderson was were far more representative of the era. I mean, shit. You think people today repeat the same memes over and over? Imagine a world before we even had a dailly fix of new material from the internet! All we had was newspapers! (Calvin and Hobbs was good though. So was The Far Side.)

[Myrelle]

So very happy for the return of The Boys to my screen.

Love this show so much and that they've added my all-time favorite actor ever to the cast this season is like a dream come true for this tv fan.

Still soaking it all in, tbh.

Loving the set-up they've given us for Soldier Boy.

All the hints in the first two and then the flashback to his disappearance in this one have me counting the days, hours, and minutes until the next episode.

It seems like they're going to interweave him into a number of the other characters' storylines and I'm so here for that as the overall acting on this show is what predominantly drew me into it from the get-go.

Well, that and Kripke's writing and showrunning with the satire only being half of it. 

So yes, a big welcome back Show.

I'm more than ready for more of The Boys. Bring it! 👏💞

[PurpleTentacle]

On 6/4/2022 at 4:31 PM, Affogato said:

It isn’t a light switch. You aren’t a hero or a villain.  Butcher struggles with it. Realistically many people would never think (under similar circumstances) ti say that to Ryan. Honestly Hughie may as Butcher’s mentee be more able to appreciate the love aspects of Butcher’s tough live approach, particularly since Hughie has a loving father. We haven’t seen how But her would do as a father long term, though..

Butcher is certainly no hero. Doesn't change the fact that this was a "I have to be mean to you, for your own safety".

On 6/4/2022 at 9:47 AM, PurpleTentacle said:

He is. His nut-allergy was mentioned and we saw how he got those massive scars on his face. But that doesn't necessarily mean that he doesn't age. He was pretty young when that whole thing went down. He could absolutely be just an older guy under that mask.

On 6/4/2022 at 5:54 PM, AntFTW said:

I wouldn't say it was his choice. I thought it was about more than being in The Seven. Sure, that's part of it but Homelander is intimidating, threatening, and unstable. It's hard for him to resist when he legitimately fears Homelander.

I think you quoted the wrong person there.

[Bergamot]

56 minutes ago, WatcherUatl10 said:

I am assuming the writers are aware of this:

"Timothy" by The Buoys

Ha! I remember that song!  Even though, strangely enough, it was a hit, radio stations were banning it, so the record company executives tried unsuccessfully to claim that Timothy was not a third miner, but was actually the miners' mule! Which actually sounds like something Vought would try.

[Bergamot]

18 hours ago, CletusMusashi said:

I mean, I can understand being trapped in a contract with The Seven and living every day of your life in terror of what Homelander might do to you next if he becomes increasingly annoyed. But Deep was out. And he was doing perfectly well financially. His book sales were high enough for him to be doing TV interviews. I pay my bills perfectly well without working for The Seven. Maybe he himself could try working a real job. But no. The entire time he was out, all he fucking wanted was to go back the The Seven.

That reminds me of the scene where Homelander comes close to reducing the Deep to a bloody smear on the floor merely because Deep got a better time slot for his television interview than Homelander did. The Deep is reduced to cringing and fearfully stammering that it was a stupid, ridiculous mistake, because he is a complete nobody compared to Homelander and should never go before him. Then afterwards, he tells his wife with a hopeful, pleased smile that he thinks his encounter with Homelander went pretty well!

A-Train is the same way. Both of them will do literally anything, sacrifice anything, including the last molecule of their self-respect and even their loved ones, in order to be back in The Seven.  Personally I don't get it, but I think it is one aspect of the show that is actually true to life. It is scary, but there are people who are so addicted to that kind of fame and power that they really would do anything for it.

[AntFTW]

5 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

Butcher is certainly no hero. Doesn't change the fact that this was a "I have to be mean to you, for your own safety".

I think you quoted the wrong person there.

I did LOL

It was in response to @Bergamot. I don't know how I missed that.

On 6/3/2022 at 10:22 AM, Bergamot said:

I don't know how sorry I felt for the Deep though. It was his choice. Deep seems almost likable sometimes, and he is always getting pushed around, but when you come right down to it, he was willing to swallow his friend alive for the opportunity to be in The Seven. That's who he is.

On 6/4/2022 at 11:54 AM, AntFTW said:

I wouldn't say it was his choice. I thought it was about more than being in The Seven. Sure, that's part of it but Homelander is intimidating, threatening, and unstable. It's hard for him to resist when he legitimately fears Homelander.

[Broderbits]

On 6/3/2022 at 1:57 PM, MAK said:

I think Vought was getting tired of Soldier Boy's behavior, and refusal to (at least pretend) to evolve with the times. Stan probably had Homelander in the wings, with plans to have better control over Vought's "product."

And this,to me,is Vought Enterprises' fatal flaw: they created Supes and released them with no solid plan to control and/or destroy them. It must have been obvious fairly early on that most Supes weren't going to listen to handlers, but Vought just wanted those government contracts. Hell, John Hammond had a better plan for dealing with the dinosaurs he brought back and look what a shit-show that turned into. At least he put a little thought into it; Vought just concentrated on product and how much money it could get for that product. Let someone else worry about cleaning up the mess.

[DeeDee79]

On 6/3/2022 at 1:57 PM, MAK said:

I think Vought was getting tired of Soldier Boy's behavior, and refusal to (at least pretend) to evolve with the times. Stan probably had Homelander in the wings, with plans to have better control over Vought's "product."

Apparently there really wasn't anything to kill him, so they decided to put him on ice? Also, hedging their bets, if Homelander didn't work out?

This is a great theory. With that in mind I wonder if Stan Edgar will see Soldier Boy as his way to bring Homelander back in line since he's now out of his control. 

Spoiler

Since The Boys are obviously going to come across a still alive Soldier Boy this season (I think in episode 4) while looking for the weapon that they thought had killed him Butcher could possibly be the one to give Stan this information.

[BabySpinach]

A couple thoughts about Soldier Boy...

His retort to Mallory's blunt rejection is petulant and schoolyard-level at best, which suggests a vast well of insecurity underneath. The guy's been on top of the world for four ageless decades, has no reason to think his position will ever change, yet he's still so easily rattled by basic hostility. This already points to a more complex and vulnerable character than the old-timey chauvinistic caricature he could have easily been.

He also seems to be the only member of Payback to demonstrate any amount of skill and competence (other than Noir, maybe?). As soon as the camp's attacked, he snaps straight into business mode; while Swatto's getting blown up and the twins are cowering and Gunpowder's wildly shooting at anything that moves, he's taking out the actual enemy quickly and efficiently. And it's an interesting moment when Mallory covers for him and he quickly turns in acknowledgement/thanks, their previous confrontation forgotten.

Soldier Boy being one of the few legitimately skilled and competent supes, despite his obvious personality defects, serves as a nice contrast to Homelander's easy-peasy laser eyes while also establishing the former as a serious presence, even when his actual screentime so far is limited. I guess I'm just glad they didn't make him a completely pathetic loser in all aspects; what a waste of Jensen Ackles that would be!

Edited June 6, 2022 by BabySpinach

[MAK]

47 minutes ago, BabySpinach said:

His retort to Mallory's blunt rejection is petulant and schoolyard-level at best, which suggests a vast well of insecurity underneath.

Like you said, he's been on top for 40+ years. He has not grown and evolved, physically nor emotionally. He seems to still behave like he lives in the 50s. Women in the workplace, sure, but at levels much below men. It's the 80s now. He's probably been getting a lot of pushback from women. Especially women who are his "colleagues." And there are now, in the 80s, many more women who would consider themselves on equal, if not higher, footing with him, regardless of his Supe status.

Grace is CIA. She knows what she is doing. She's not a young starlet or a hero-worshipping naive pretty young thing. She is looking through his bravado and flirting and finding zero substance. He is a 60+ year old told that his accomplishments mean nothing in the grand scheme, and his physical prowess, beauty, and quasi-youth don't have the value he thinks.

He's probably been harboring resentment and anger towards capable intelligent women for some years by now.

[iMonrey]

Who was the woman that Frenchie was helping, and who was the woman who kidnapped him? Have we seen these characters before?

Weren't all four of Stormfront's limbs burned off last season? This season she still had the one arm. Did it regenerate or am I misremembering?

[AnimeMania]

I wonder if Butcher already has the perfect weapon to defeat Homelander.  Homelander has been lasering Stormfront's tits and it only gave her pleasure, Ryan lasered Stormfront's tits clean off. I am not sure if Homelander was holding back or not.

[dabbrusc]

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

Who was the woman that Frenchie was helping, and who was the woman who kidnapped him? Have we seen these characters before?

Cherie from S1. Frenchie's ex-girlfriend that likes to blow things up.

[Ohiopirate02]

28 minutes ago, AnimeMania said:

I wonder if Butcher already has the perfect weapon to defeat Homelander.  Homelander has been lasering Stormfront's tits and it only gave her pleasure, Ryan lasered Stormfront's tits clean off. I am not sure if Homelander was holding back or not.

This show is dark, but not that dark.  

[Myrelle]

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Who was the woman that Frenchie was helping, and who was the woman who kidnapped him? Have we seen these characters before

The woman who kidnapped him is Little Nina, a new character and a ruthless Russian drug runner who they both worked for at one time, apparently, and who they were both clearly very afraid of; and especially of the repercussions and punishments that she might visit upon anyone who she perceived as stealing from her(Cherie told Frenchie that someone else stole Little Nina's heroin from her).

Edited June 6, 2022 by Myrelle

[marketdoctor]

Quote

On a non-Deep note, I love that their flashbacks to the 80s and 90s actually feel right.

That's one of the things that makes this show better.  Someone is trying hard with the continuity, and the details, and it's working.  Even details like Homelander's "you're my one birthday save", and then, a few minutes later "I wasn't asking." This shows the depth of how screwed up he is.

Also, it was one of the smartest gunfights I've seen:  "I can't hit him directly, so I'll angle a shot..." and "I can't hit him directly, so I'll set off car alarms."  Then, the way it changed after Butcher powered up, and the side effects after, all felt real.  (Gross, but real.)

[Colorado David]

What a weird dynamic to have to contend with, to be in Homelander's shoes - he can pretty much do anything he wants, until Butcher finds whatever weapon.

I would not have eaten Timothy, I'd have walked out. Carrying Timothy to safety, to put it in Homelander's smug ass face. It's like eating a pet.

Edited June 7, 2022 by Colorado David
removing potentially offensive verbiage

[Bruinsfan]

On 6/3/2022 at 3:22 PM, PurpleTentacle said:

I had hoped they'd make soldier boy gay, if only to abate some of the backlash Ackles got after the Supernatural fiasco, of which the writers deserved all but the actors really didn't (I think there was also something taken a bit out of context he said at a con).

Eh, I've heard enough direct quotes from Ackles about that issue and in response to fans' other LGBTQ-related questions over the years to be more than fine with him getting his share of the backlash. He can go eat his feelings about it at Zaxby's with his anti-gay bigot friends from Duck Dynasty.

On 6/3/2022 at 7:43 PM, Affogato said:

If we have two supes that don't age I wonder if this Black Noir is the same as the Payback Black Noir.

As PurpleTentacle said, it was pretty clear that Black Noir is the same person. Also Crimson Countess is played by Laurie Holden in scenes set more than three decades apart, so she ages extremely slowly if at all as well. I assume the supes with functional immortality have regenerative abilities rather than merely being bulletproof, which means Kimiko is likely one of their number as well.