Buying books or borrowing from the library? Which do you prefer?

[Constant Viewer]

5 minutes ago, Calvada said:

I worked in my local public library when I was in school.  One job I and the other student worker had was to shelf read - go through and make sure the books were in order in each section.  People do tend to put books back in the wrong place.  That was a great way to find things to read.  And decades later, when I"m in a library, I will put books in the right spot when I find them shelved incorrectly.  

Similar story, but my mother was a librarian so I was the only kid in elementary school who was allowed to put their books back on the shelf. The others had to leave theirs on the table for the librarian to put away.

[Browncoat]

13 minutes ago, Calvada said:

I will put books in the right spot when I find them shelved incorrectly.  

I will, too.

[dubbel zout]

50 minutes ago, Calvada said:

I will put books in the right spot when I find them shelved incorrectly.  

I always do that, too. I never worked in a library, but I did set up the one in my second-grade class.

[Snow Apple]

As someone who didn't grow up with money, libraries have always been my "home away from home" since I was a child. I like the opportunity to read for free and spend my money to buy my absolute favorites. Also, library book sales for the win!

I discovered books I wouldn't have heard of if I don't spend time browsing the shelves. Book stores are great but they rarely have older stuff unless they're classics. 

Edited December 22, 2021 by Snow Apple

[andromeda331]

I worked for my middle school library. It was fun checking out books for classmates and checking them in. I loved putting them away. 

[Ohiopirate02]

16 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

I'm sure it is, but the library is a prestigious place to donate a chunk of change, so I'm sure some rich person will step up. Too many smaller library systems don't have that kind of potential (or actual) support.

Larger systems like the NYPL do have a larger endowment, but they also carry higher costs for a lot of electronic materials.  Databases and ebook platforms like Overdrive charge based upon the total population.  This is total population of all potential library users not actual library users.  They pay a considerably higher price just to have the service than the rest of us.  What costs my library servicing a population of 90,000 five thousand a year is going to cost the NYPL at least 50,000 if not more a year.  And with Overdrive that cost is just for them to host your books.  Then you have to buy titles.  Ebooks for libraries are much more expensive than what any of us pays for over on Amazon or Apple, and they come with term limits.  My system can get away with buying one or two licenses per title to fulfill demand, but then the NYPL has to buy 10 or more for each.  A fifty thousand dollar donation to a smaller library system is lifechanging, the same gift to the NYPL probably equates to one month of buying ematerials for their library.

[proserpina65]

If it's a book which I know I'm going to read over and over, I'll buy it.  Otherwise, I try to get it from a library whenever possible.

[SusieQ]

On 12/21/2021 at 8:09 PM, Calvada said:

I worked in my local public library when I was in school.  One job I and the other student worker had was to shelf read - go through and make sure the books were in order in each section.  People do tend to put books back in the wrong place.  That was a great way to find things to read.  And decades later, when I"m in a library, I will put books in the right spot when I find them shelved incorrectly.  

Ah, shelf reading! I was the unlucky one who got to "read" the 700s. Putting that section in order was a bi##h. 732.7654 comes before 732.77, etc, etc. And the spines were so narrow, making the numbers hard to read.

I always wished my section was the 800s😊😊

[Black Knight]

I really depended on my local library as a kid, so I will never say a bad word about libraries, but as soon as I started earning money I started buying books in earnest. Yes, it's expensive. Yes, it is difficult to find space for all my books (I'm nearing 3000, and no, I don't have a house). Yes, I know many of them I will not re-read, even though I do like to re-read, but life isn't that long. But I'm a book-hoarder. I can offer justifications like it helps to keep local indie bookstores (which is where I usually buy from) in business and it helps support smaller authors...but I'm a book-hoarder. I'd be this way even if I only ordered from Amazon and all I read were best-selling authors. I have books I hated, that mortally offended me, or are outdated, but I don't give away a book (at least not without buying a replacement) unless it is a duplicate.

My work study job at USC was in the mailroom, and we handled all the ILL stuff through there, so the talk of ILL brought back some memories!

[Tom Holmberg]

On 12/21/2021 at 10:15 AM, GussieK said:

True interlibrary loan is what was described above--a system where libraries can find books from any other libraries in the US and share them.  Not just the sharing among a network of local library branches that form one system.  There's a postage cost (at book rate, I guess), but it's a service that has always been available.  Probably less needed now that there's availability of electronic books. 

There might be a confusion here between "reciprocal borrowing". which is borrowing within a library's regional system, and "interlibrary loan", which might borrow from any library that owns an item regardless of location. I can see smaller libraries opting out, but at least where I live all libraries do it, and they might borrow from out-of-state if that is necessary.

[SusanM]

I love public libraries and have been a steady user all my life but I have to say since I discovered kindle my library usage has really fallen off.   Which coincided with the pandemic and first libraries being closed and then even when open with much reduced, and less convenient for me, hours.  Not sure honestly if my library use will ever go back to pre-pandemic days - my kindle is my new bestest friend :).

[sugarbaker design]

On 12/24/2021 at 2:22 PM, SusannahM said:

Not sure honestly if my library use will ever go back to pre-pandemic days

My library re-opened and everything is virtually the same except for two things;

• mandatory masks
• no more reading at tables, it's come in, browse books, check out books, then go.

[Tom Holmberg]

On 12/27/2021 at 8:31 AM, sugarbaker design said:

My library re-opened and everything is virtually the same except for two things;

• mandatory masks
• no more reading at tables, it's come in, browse books, check out books, then go.

We have mandatory masks, but we've even reopened the meeting rooms and discussion rooms (though who knows what will happen with omicron). Covid is still keeping the numbers of visitors down, but I have to wonder if we'll ever get back to pre-Covid normal.

Though they just closed the library's cafe.

Edited December 29, 2021 by Tom Holmberg
Update

[OtterMommy]

Our library is pretty much back to normal.  I think the only thing not back are the private study rooms.  

The Friends of the Library did have their book sale over the last 2 months, which was different.  It was in a small room and they would only let a limited number of people in at time for no more than 20 minutes, but it still worked.

[blackwing]

On 12/19/2021 at 10:07 AM, JustHereForFood said:

Also, my OCD/germaphobia/whatever it is is getting stronger and I don't want to touch books that other people already read anymore. Especially after I heard someone say that they read books when on the toilet. What kind of psycho does that?! It made me paranoid about library books, I tell you.

I am a library user... I can afford to buy books but it seems like such a waste to buy a book, read it once, and put it on the shelf, never to be looked at again.  When I was younger and lived in the city and worked long hours, I never used the public library because 1) no time to go and 2) didn't want to deal with trying to find parking.  But ever since I moved to the burbs, I've always used the library.  And now with Covid it's even easier... do a search online for the book you want, they pull it for you and put it on the hold shelf in the lobby.  You pop in, get the books, do self-checkout, and can leave quickly.

That said, the comment above about germaphobia resonates strongly with me as well.  I do think it's kind of gross to get a library book, be reading, and then find a piece of someone's hair in between the pages.  Or food crumbs, like cookies or cake.  Or worst, that frightening tiny brown piece of smudge that's stuck to the page.  Is it chocolate?  Is it dried snot?  So gross!

I do make a habit out of taking a lysol wipe and wiping the covers, spine, edges and endpages.  Makes me feel slightly better, but short of wiping down every single page, it doesn't do anything about the random hair/cookies/snot that are possibly lurking within the pages.

Ugh.  And yes, I automatically assume that all library books are read on the toilet.  I guess I'm hopeful that any germs would have died in between the time they were on the toilet and when I checked it out.  

I've always enjoyed reading actual books and have always been anti-Kindle, but typing out these paragraphs is making me wonder if I should reconsider my stance.  E-books would clearly be 1000% more sanitary.

[JustHereForFood]

7 minutes ago, blackwing said:

I am a library user... I can afford to buy books but it seems like such a waste to buy a book, read it once, and put it on the shelf, never to be looked at again. 

The good thing about having limited time to read is that I carefully choose which books I'll read and only pick those that I would still want to have at home, either to reread parts of it, or just because I like them so much. Most of the time, I pick right.

10 minutes ago, blackwing said:

I've always enjoyed reading actual books and have always been anti-Kindle, but typing out these paragraphs is making me wonder if I should reconsider my stance.  E-books would clearly be 1000% more sanitary.

Same. Plus, it would save the paper and damage to environment done by shipping. But after spending 8 hours a day on the computer for work and then a lot of free time on the internet, I try to eliminate at least this additional looking into an electronic device.

[Snow Apple]

My library quarantined returned books for at least 10 days when they opened up again, but they stopped doing it. I don't borrow books with stains (yuck).

(GROSS ALERT. You've been warned.) At least 10 years ago, I remember flipping through a newish book and there were big chunks of snot smeared on a few of the pages. Green and everything! I washed my hands multiple times. Now I make it a habit to flip though every book I'm interested in.

I discovered e-library books and adore the service. They don't have every new book so I still have to borrow physical copies, but I have discovered books I never heard of.

[RealHousewife]

1 hour ago, JustHereForFood said:

The good thing about having limited time to read is that I carefully choose which books I'll read and only pick those that I would still want to have at home, either to reread parts of it, or just because I like them so much. Most of the time, I pick right.

Same. Plus, it would save the paper and damage to environment done by shipping. But after spending 8 hours a day on the computer for work and then a lot of free time on the internet, I try to eliminate at least this additional looking into an electronic device.

I wasn't as selective about what I read when I was younger, but that's me now too. I look for books that I am pretty confident I'll love and would want to revisit at some point. If someone is an avid reader (like a new book a week), I'd totally get only checking books out. I still like the idea of checking out random books or books I know I will only read once, like a celeb memoir or something. I used to just buy all of those. I agree that it is kind of wasteful even if you have money to throw around. 

Yes! I work on a computer. I shop online. I'm on here. I get on YouTube. My eyes need a break at a certain point. 

[babyhouseman]

I'm cheap so I usually get books from the library. I also get library ebooks. I buy books that aren't at the library which is rare. I did go on a shopping spree with Xmas gift cards for books. I use two libraries, the one in my small town and the branch of a bigger library. 

[Vanderboom]

I'm lucky enough to live in a place that has access to two libraries with extensive e-book catalogs, which saves me time and money. While I miss being able to sit and browse in a physical library, the pandemic has changed that feeling forever. I access my books on a standard tablet, but do you guys know if or how Overdrive or Libby work with e-ink devices? @JustHereForFood has a good point about computer screens and eye strain.

Edited December 30, 2021 by Vanderboom

[Ohiopirate02]

2 hours ago, Vanderboom said:

I'm lucky enough to live in a place that has access to two libraries with extensive e-book catalogs, which saves me time and money. While I miss being able to sit and browse in a physical library, the pandemic has changed that feeling forever. I access my books on a standard tablet, but do you guys know if or how Overdrive or Libby work with e-ink devices? @JustHereForFood has a good point about computer screens and eye strain.

I don't know what device you are using, but here's the link from Overdrive on how to access titles--

https://help.overdrive.com/en-us/categories/getting-started.htm

[DearEvette]

If you have multiple library cards and like to use Overdrive a lot  for ebook and audiobook borrowing, I have found a browser plugin very helpful.

It called Library Extension and you set it up so it searches the overdrive digital catalog to any and all libraries you use, also if your library uses Hoopla you can set it up for that as well.

The way it works is, if you are browsing a book site -- Goodreads, Amazon, Barns & Noble (there are others that are listed on their FAQ page) it'll bring up a little window within the site that lets you know if you specific book you are looking at is available at your library. 

Since I have three library systems it is a nice time shortcut and it brings up all the systems to let me know which, if any, of my libraries has the book, if it is an e-book or audiobook, if it is currently available or if it is out and what is the hold/wait time sitch.

It has been pretty cool so far.  Here is a screenshot of what it looks like on Goodreads:

 

[EtheltoTillie]

NYPL has a great new feature for reserved e-books.  If you make it to the top of the list and you don't have time to read it then, you can postpone and you're still at the top of the list the next time the book is returned. 

[Ohiopirate02]

6 minutes ago, GussieK said:

NYPL has a great new feature for reserved e-books.  If you make it to the top of the list and you don't have time to read it then, you can postpone and you're still at the top of the list the next time the book is returned. 

Overdrive has this feature.  I love it because my ebook holds always come in at the worst possible time. 

[EtheltoTillie]

1 minute ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

Overdrive has this feature.  I love it because my ebook holds always come in at the worst possible time. 

NYPL has three windows into its Kindle-available books:  Overdrive, Libby and NYPL's own web site.  If you reserve a book on any of the three it all goes to the same place.  I prefer using the Kindle app on the iPad over the Cloud Library platform.  I just prefer the way the "print" looks.  But some books are available only on Cloud Library. 

[isalicat]

I just received an email from my county library system about their new hours for every branch starting tomorrow, and my local branch hours are now reduced down to Tuesday-Wednesday-Thursday from 11 AM to 5 PM (closed from 1-2 PM for lunch). Clearly this branch is going to be catering to retirees and kids pretty much exclusively 😿

[andromeda331]

1 hour ago, isalicat said:

I just received an email from my county library system about their new hours for every branch starting tomorrow, and my local branch hours are now reduced down to Tuesday-Wednesday-Thursday from 11 AM to 5 PM (closed from 1-2 PM for lunch). Clearly this branch is going to be catering to retirees and kids pretty much exclusively 😿

Oh, that stinks.

[Darian]

On 12/29/2021 at 1:48 PM, blackwing said:

. I can afford to buy books but it seems like such a waste to buy a book, read it once, and put it on the shelf, never to be looked at again. 

I am definitely not encouraging you to buy more books or otherwise questioning or judging your choice. But for anyone who finds themselves with books on the shelf they'll never touch again, there are a lot of places that would love them as donations. My closest library has a dedicated book store attached to it, but many have shelves or carts or periodic sales, and mostly sell donated books. Libraries in lower-income areas especially can use them. I live near Boston and there's a bookstore there that exists to empower and help adults and children who were/are in the foster care system, who also run it and staff it. They sell new and used books, vinyl, and a few other things, but rely most on book donations. I'm hoping to enter hospice soon and I've got boxes of books and the other things they accept basically taking up all the space in my sparely furnished spare bedroom. They even make porch picks, which we might do since it would be a lot of trips for my husband. Wherever people live, if they need to do book purges, there are a wealth of places that want and need book donations.     

[Snow Apple]

When I moved a few years ago, I donated a ton of books to the library. Most of them were from book sales brought at the exact same library I donated back to! 20 years worth. 

I regret letting go of some of them but we only had a few weeks to pack up and my mind was in a stupor. Makes me sad just writing this out. But I love library book sales and hope others found some treasures like I did.

[Anela]

I love the library, and have multiple massive bills in the past, to prove it. It would have been cheaper for me to buy the books.

I haven't used the library since early 2020, unless it's borrowing online. I have been in bookstores again, though, but am backing off until things calm down again. The library had several outbreaks, and closures. 

I have mainly bought books secondhand, to finish off trilogies that I had one book from (like Inkheart, or Alice Hoffman's "Practical Magic" series). I'm trying to decide what to keep, and what to give away. The Alice Hoffman books were brand new. I don't own the rest of the Hunger Games books, so I might donate the one book I bought last year, or give it away in a free library. 

[Browncoat]

I broke down and bought books last week when giant bookstore chain had all their hardcover books at 50% off.  Only one, Scientist, by Richard Rhodes, about E. O. Wilson, was an impulse purchase.  I was on the waitlist for two others at the library  (The Boys by Ron & Clint Howard, and Sistersong, by Lucy Holland).

[Anela]

On 12/18/2021 at 5:35 PM, Irlandesa said:

Library.  I'm a procrastinator.  If I don't have a deadline to read a book, the odds greatly decrease that I'll actually read the book.  I've probably only read 10% of the books I own. 

That doesn't mean I finish everything I borrow from the library either but at least I know if I haven't gotten into it by the time I have to return it, I probably won't get into it enough to finish.  Or I'll know if I want to get it back.

The deadline actually makes it worse for me. That's why I had huge bills. 

This morning, I picked up a non-fiction book that I bought eleven years ago. Just because it was fitting for something I'm dealing with right now. 

[Bookish Jen]

For the longest time, I was a avid visitor of my local library. I could spend hours just looking for books to read. However, with the pandemic that has put on the back burner. Plus, as book reviewer, I have so many authors reaching out to me to read and review their books, I will be busy reading and reviewing them for all of 2022.

[OtterMommy]

On 1/1/2022 at 3:06 PM, Anela said:

The deadline actually makes it worse for me. That's why I had huge bills. 

 

Our library has joined the wave of getting rid of overdue fees, which is nice (although I'm more than happy to pay the fee and support the library).  They've also started auto-renewing books which is VERY nice!

[EtheltoTillie]

On 1/1/2022 at 6:06 PM, Anela said:

The deadline actually makes it worse for me. That's why I had huge bills. 

 

Me too!  Now NYPL just joined a national trend and ended fines!!!!  This is the greatest thing ever!!!  I think libraries nationwide have realized that fines don't pay and discourage people from using the library. 

2 minutes ago, OtterMommy said:

Our library has joined the wave of getting rid of overdue fees, which is nice (although I'm more than happy to pay the fee and support the library).  They've also started auto-renewing books which is VERY nice!

Just cross posted same thing!!

Edited January 3, 2022 by GussieK

[dubbel zout]

5 minutes ago, GussieK said:

fines don't pay and discourage people from using the library

Fines also often disproportionately affect the population that can least afford them and need the library the most. Getting rid of fines is long overdue. (Heh.)

[Tom Holmberg]

4 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

Fines also often disproportionately affect the population that can least afford them and need the library the most. Getting rid of fines is long overdue. (Heh.)

Our library got rid of fines, but the only people who were fined were people who had books other patrons were on hold for or people who had a book out for more that 15 weeks.  Now, no matter how many people are waiting for a books, people can keep them for six or eight weeks overdue with no consequences, which is nice if I have the book and not so nice if I'm waiting for the book.

Fines weren't to make money, they were to encourage people to return checkout items. 

 

Edited January 3, 2022 by Tom Holmberg

[dubbel zout]

10 minutes ago, Tom Holmberg said:

Fines weren't to make money, they were to encourage people to return checkout items. 

I wonder how effective fines were for that.

[Tom Holmberg]

1 minute ago, dubbel zout said:

I wonder how effective fines were for that.

You have a group of book hoarders who will have 50-75 or more books out at a time, with a quarter or more of them overdue,, who nothing will make them act in a responsible manner.  But most people were sensitive to overdues, and actually tried to return books on or before there due dates.  I'm not sure why we assume that "the population that can least afford fines" were somehow unable to return books (or renew their books-we automatically renewed books if they weren't on reserve for someone else) on time.

[Browncoat]

My library still has fines, but they also have limits to how many books one can have checked out at a time.  So you have to return books to get new books.

[Anela]

8 hours ago, Tom Holmberg said:

You have a group of book hoarders who will have 50-75 or more books out at a time, with a quarter or more of them overdue,, who nothing will make them act in a responsible manner.  But most people were sensitive to overdues, and actually tried to return books on or before there due dates.  I'm not sure why we assume that "the population that can least afford fines" were somehow unable to return books (or renew their books-we automatically renewed books if they weren't on reserve for someone else) on time.

How is it possible to have that many books out at one time?? I've never had that many out.

One time in 2014, one large fee was because one of my pets spilled my tea over a pile of books. There was no way we could return them, so we bought them. 

9 hours ago, Tom Holmberg said:

Our library got rid of fines, but the only people who were fined were people who had books other patrons were on hold for or people who had a book out for more that 15 weeks.  Now, no matter how many people are waiting for a books, people can keep them for six or eight weeks overdue with no consequences, which is nice if I have the book and not so nice if I'm waiting for the book.

Fines weren't to make money, they were to encourage people to return checkout items. 

 

This happened to me when my mother was in the hospital, and when I was really sick. Also, when a few books were lost. I didn't realize they were still in the house. I can't drive, so I'm dependent on someone else getting me there, and would usually leave books on a table, for my dad to take back. It was easier when I could walk to one, in another town. 

There have been times when I held onto a book, determined to finish it. I did with a few of them. Others (like an Erin Morgenstern book, early 2020), I gave up and returned. I ordered in on the online library, to finish it. For at least two months, fees were sidelined, because of the pandemic. I couldn't concentrate, I was too depressed. 

Edited January 4, 2022 by Anela

[Rushmoras]

Since I carefully consider, which books would appeal to me, I always buy them. In fact, the last time I borrowed a book from the library was while I was still in school (for literature classes). Of course, I'm disregarding university subjects, but that's a different matter. And in all my life maybe there was only a handful of books, which I regretted buying.

Edited January 4, 2022 by Rushmoras

[Tom Holmberg]

8 hours ago, Anela said:

How is it possible to have that many books out at one time?? I've never had that many out.

I think its a hoarding syndrome.  You can't really read that many all at once. The problem is often they'll have 75 new books out for a month or more, keeping others from seeing them. And since books only stay "new" for a limited time, and this is their best chance of circulating, they are hurting the circulation of these items.

A lot of libraries will deliver and pick up books for people who are homebound or have other issues.  People might want to look into that if they have similar issues.

 

Edited January 4, 2022 by Tom Holmberg

[Tom Holmberg]

13 hours ago, Browncoat said:

My library still has fines, but they also have limits to how many books one can have checked out at a time.  So you have to return books to get new books.

I can see eliminating fines for kids books, because kids often are dependent on others to get to the library (though a link with the local schools for library book returns would be useful). But encouraging the prompt return of books helps everyone.

[SusanM]

18 hours ago, Tom Holmberg said:

Fines weren't to make money, they were to encourage people to return checkout items. 

This is true but speaking as a former Chief Librarian we do factor in fines when drawing up our yearly budget.  It may not be a huge amount (depending on the library) but I admit when I first read about libraries foregoing fines I thought "whoa there goes that 2k I used to count on!"

[Ohiopirate02]

1 hour ago, SusannahM said:

This is true but speaking as a former Chief Librarian we do factor in fines when drawing up our yearly budget.  It may not be a huge amount (depending on the library) but I admit when I first read about libraries foregoing fines I thought "whoa there goes that 2k I used to count on!"

Yeah, some library systems are so poorly funded that they rely upon fines and fees as income.  If they go fine free, then they will have to cut something.  It could mean shorter operating hours, fewer new books or cutting programs.  My library system is trying to go fine free.  The pandemic really helped speed this along since we waived fines last year for 4 months.  Some of the management team has also been waiving a lot of fines in order to further decrease the revenue coming in from fines and giving the higher ups a fair amount of time to rework the budgets and ask for more money from our various local governments.  My system has an interesting situation where we receive money from multiple local government entities 3 different cities plus the county.  I say interesting because we are in the South and local southern politics can be fun at times.  

[JustHereForFood]

18 hours ago, Browncoat said:

My library still has fines, but they also have limits to how many books one can have checked out at a time.  So you have to return books to get new books.

My library also has a limit of maximum 5 books you can have at a time. I thought it was standard practice.

[blackwing]

22 hours ago, Tom Holmberg said:

Our library got rid of fines, but the only people who were fined were people who had books other patrons were on hold for or people who had a book out for more that 15 weeks.  Now, no matter how many people are waiting for a books, people can keep them for six or eight weeks overdue with no consequences, which is nice if I have the book and not so nice if I'm waiting for the book.

Fines weren't to make money, they were to encourage people to return checkout items. 

 

My library has also eliminated fines.  I had initially thought that would lead to more people hoarding books and keeping them out overdue with no consequence.  But apparently they have since instituted a policy that if a book is overdue by two weeks, then your card will be put on hold and you won't be able to check out any more books until you return the overdue one.  That's a good policy.

 

30 minutes ago, JustHereForFood said:

My library also has a limit of maximum 5 books you can have at a time. I thought it was standard practice.

Five books?!?!?  I'd definitely be writing a letter to the library board about that.  Five books is pretty much nothing.  Especially children's picture books.  I remember checking out 25 books every time I went with the kids.  

 

[Tom Holmberg]

15 minutes ago, blackwing said:

 

Five books?!?!?  I'd definitely be writing a letter to the library board about that.  Five books is pretty much nothing.  Especially children's picture books.  I remember checking out 25 books every time I went with the kids.  

 

I agree five books is too small, esp. for kids books.  Our limit is 100 books, but even that isn't really enforced.

Edited January 4, 2022 by Tom Holmberg

[dubbel zout]

13 minutes ago, blackwing said:

But apparently they have since instituted a policy that if a book is overdue by two weeks, then your card will be put on hold and you won't be able to check out any more books until you return the overdue one.  That's a good policy.

I completely agree. And ifthe person can still use the library services—internet, copy machines, etc.—just not check out books, it's not totally punitive.