S03.E09 : This is Your Only First Concert

[Rootbeer]

8 hours ago, Jeanne222 said:

The Plath family seemed to be just cruising along until Olivia entered the picture. 

They may have different beliefs than we do but their family and their business. 

How do we know that?  They weren't on TV before Olivia entered the picture.  We saw from the start that all of the older kids, except maybe the one who never appears on the show, had significant issues with their mother's controlling ways. That wasn't Olivia's doing; that was already there.  When adult kids are afraid to tell their mother how they really feel about things she does because they know she will explode, that is not due to the recent addition of a wife.  Those kids were raised by Kim and she is the one who did that to them.

[Madding crowd]

16 minutes ago, Loves2Dance said:

I have been in Olivia’s shoes before. Just knowing someone is there, and worse yet, see them would put me into a full blown panic attack. No amount of logic or trying to put someone else first, is going to overcome that level of anxiety. 

I have also been in Olivia’s shoes . For 26 years until she just died , I had the mother in law from hell. Not religious but horrible. Just a couple of her highlights: -had a secret 20 year relationship with my husband’s ex in the hopes they could reunite 

-called me and my family trash because my sister threw me a baby shower 

-when I was promoted to VP at my company told everyone I was a clerk who married my husband for his money even though I made much more than him

Plenty of times I had to hold my tongue and see her but I did it because there were family occasions that were important to my husband. Believe me I understand.

 

[JayDub1987]

1 minute ago, Madding crowd said:

I have also been in Olivia’s shoes . For 26 years until she just died , I had the mother in law from hell. Not religious but horrible. Just a couple of her highlights: -had a secret 20 year relationship with my husband’s ex in the hopes they could reunite 

-called me and my family trash because my sister threw me a baby shower 

-when I was promoted to VP at my company told everyone I was a clerk who married my husband for his money even though I made much more than him

Plenty of times I had to hold my tongue and see her but I did it because there were family occasions that were important to my husband. Believe me I understand.

 

I'm sorry that you had to endure that, especially for that long. It's sad to say, but in some cases, there can be no peace until someone dies. 

[Jeanne222]

Olivia needs to get her own life in order. I have never seen her parents or any family members on the show. 
I did read that Olivia convinced her parents to leave their church and her sister no longer speaks to her.   

I never see Olivia out with an old or new friend.

Kim and Barry have a right to raise their family as they see fit.   They have mended bridges with Moriah and Micah and have a loving relationship with their married daughter.

The fly in the ointment is always Olivia.  What has she done to improve the Plaths?  Nothing but bring strife to everybody she touches. 

Most kids when they leave the family nest don’t say ‘gosh that was a wonderful experience’!  No they say thank goodness I’m free!  So there’s that! 

I think it speaks well for the Plath family that four young adult children are out on their own making good lives…well save for Ethan who’s stuck with Olivia and that bad choice!

[Loves2Dance]

20 minutes ago, Jeanne222 said:

Olivia needs to get her own life in order. I have never seen her parents or any family members on the show. 
I did read that Olivia convinced her parents to leave their church and her sister no longer speaks to her.   

I never see Olivia out with an old or new friend.

Kim and Barry have a right to raise their family as they see fit.   They have mended bridges with Moriah and Micah and have a loving relationship with their married daughter.

The fly in the ointment is always Olivia.  What has she done to improve the Plaths?  Nothing but bring strife to everybody she touches. 

Most kids when they leave the family nest don’t say ‘gosh that was a wonderful experience’!  No they say thank goodness I’m free!  So there’s that! 

I think it speaks well for the Plath family that four young adult children are out on their own making good lives…well save for Ethan who’s stuck with Olivia and that bad choice!

Olivia has friends but that isn’t the focus of the show. This is very edited and not a total capture of her life. 

[JayDub1987]

26 minutes ago, Jeanne222 said:

Olivia needs to get her own life in order. I have never seen her parents or any family members on the show. 
I did read that Olivia convinced her parents to leave their church and her sister no longer speaks to her.   

I never see Olivia out with an old or new friend.

Kim and Barry have a right to raise their family as they see fit.   They have mended bridges with Moriah and Micah and have a loving relationship with their married daughter.

The fly in the ointment is always Olivia.  What has she done to improve the Plaths?  Nothing but bring strife to everybody she touches. 

Most kids when they leave the family nest don’t say ‘gosh that was a wonderful experience’!  No they say thank goodness I’m free!  So there’s that! 

I think it speaks well for the Plath family that four young adult children are out on their own making good lives…well save for Ethan who’s stuck with Olivia and that bad choice!

She discussed the toxicity of her father in the most recent episode. She also said that she was raised in a very similar situation as Ethan, which would explain the friend "issue" that you've created. She may not want to associate with people who she knew in her youth. As far as new friends, she just went on a trip with Moriah and the girl who Micah is/isn't dating (can never remember that girl's name). Also, just because you don't see her surrounded by friends on a 42 minute TV show doesn't mean she doesn't have any. That's quite a stretch, even for the staunchest Kim defender.

Kim and Barry can raise their kids anyway they want, and people can point out the blatant glaring hypocrisy that they exhibit and the fact that the children have pointed to their lack of education as a hindrance in their lives. Also, according to this article (https://www.the-sun.com/entertainment/3504683/why-is-hosanna-not-on-welcome-to-plathville/), I'm not sure where you get this "loving relationship" with Hosanna. A direct quote from Moriah:

"“Sometimes we keep in touch to some extent, but it’s also, like, she’s across the country and, you know, it would just be a hassle and she doesn’t want to be on the show.”

Georgia to Ohio isn't "across the country." Also, it should be fun to see how "great" their relationship with Micah and Moriah is after Kim's most recent self-absorbed stunt. Micah calling out Kim's "bullshit" and her blatant refusal to adhere to something Moriah asked her to do certainly doesn't bode well for this mended bridge.

Finally, how is Ethan "stuck" with Olivia? Divorce is pretty simple, especially if there are no children involved. 

Edited October 14, 2021 by JayDub1987

[scorp01]

I know this was probably discussed in the past, but the way the Plath kids refer to their parents and siblings is off-putting.

I usually talk about my sisters as 'my sister' or use their given name.  I can't remember a time where I referred to them as 'sibling'.  Ethan, Micah, Moriah and Lydia all do this.  And Lydia and Moriah kept saying 'my parents' to each other (I'm paraphrasing but it was something like, "I don't know how to say this to my parents").  Wouldn't most people say 'mom and dad' or just 'our parents' rather than 'my parents' especially in conversations with their own brothers or sisters?  It's just odd to me.

[JayDub1987]

13 minutes ago, scorp01 said:

I know this was probably discussed in the past, but the way the Plath kids refer to their parents and siblings is off-putting.

I usually talk about my sisters as 'my sister' or use their given name.  I can't remember a time where I referred to them as 'sibling'.  Ethan, Micah, Moriah and Lydia all do this.  And Lydia and Moriah kept saying 'my parents' to each other (I'm paraphrasing but it was something like, "I don't know how to say this to my parents").  Wouldn't most people say 'mom and dad' or just 'our parents' rather than 'my parents' especially in conversations with their own brothers or sisters?  It's just odd to me.

I'm sure it's some kind of requirement for the Cult of Plath.

Lydia has her head so far up her own mother's ass, I'm surprised she doesn't refer to as "The Holy Mother" or something along those lines. I guess we should be happy with the phrase "my mother."

[Rootbeer]

1 hour ago, Jeanne222 said:

Olivia needs to get her own life in order. I have never seen her parents or any family members on the show. 
I did read that Olivia convinced her parents to leave their church and her sister no longer speaks to her.   

I presume we never see any of Olivia's family members because 1.  they don't live in Georgia and 2. it is not their show.  More interesting to me is that the eldest Plath daughter, Hosanna, has only appeared on the show in the background at Ethan's wedding.  I know she lives in Ohio, but we've seen the Duggars and other reality TV families include visits or other interaction with immediate family who don't live nearby.  Heck, we had Jill Duggar Dillard's adventures in El Salvador on that show.  Hosanna is married and has a baby and also a musical career; surely there is something of interest that the show could use.  She is still a conservative Christian, so it cannot be that.  If the show is going to drag random out of town relatives onto our screens to explain themselves, I'd like to hear what Hosanna thinks first.  According to interviews, she only sees them a couple times a year.  Wonder why?  Ohio and Georgia are not that far apart and she and her husband perform all over the Bible belt, well within driving distance for the Plaths.  Surely if Kim is so eager to be front and center when Moriah performs, she is equally excited to see Hosanna and her husband in concert, too.

As it is, the show is about Kim and Barry and their kids who live nearby or in their home.  I don't see any reason why we need a deeper exploration of Olivia's family at this point.  She has certainly made it clear that she has issues with the way she was raised and they are many of the same issues she has with Barry and Kim.  That's enough for me.

Edited October 14, 2021 by Rootbeer

[Jeanne222]

Thank you for a most interesting discussion. We each have different opinions on the Plath family.   It reminded me of this parable.

‘A group of blind men heard that a strange animal, called an elephant, had been brought to the town, but none of them were aware of its shape and form. Out of curiosity, they said: "We must inspect and know it by touch, of which we are capable". So, they sought it out, and when they found it they groped about it. The first person, whose hand landed on the trunk, said, "This being is like a thick snake". For another one whose hand reached its ear, it seemed like a kind of fan. As for another person, whose hand was upon its leg, said, the elephant is a pillar like a tree-trunk. The blind man who placed his hand upon its side said the elephant, "is a wall". Another who felt its tail, described it as a rope. The last felt its tusk, stating the elephant is that which is hard, smooth and like a spear.

The blind men and the elephant 
(wall relief in Northeast Thailand)

In some versions, the blind men then discover their disagreements, suspect the others to be not telling the truth and come to blows. The stories also differ primarily in how the elephant's body parts are described, how violent the conflict becomes and how (or if) the conflict among the men and their perspectives is resolved. In some versions, they stop talking, start listening and collaborate to "see" the full elephant. In another, a sighted man enters the parable and describes the entire elephant from various perspectives, the blind men then learn that they were all partially correct and partially wrong. While one's subjective experience is true, it may not be the totality of truth.[4][7]

The parable has been used to illustrate a range of truths and fallacies; broadly, the parable implies that one's subjective experience can be true, but that such experience is inherently limited by its failure to account for other truths or a totality of truth. At various times the parable has provided insight into the relativism, opaqueness or inexpressible nature of truth, the behavior of experts in fields of contradicting theories, the need for deeper understanding, and respect for different perspectives on the same object of observation’

[Harmony Joy]

Okay, I usually do not like to chime in, but am I the only one that found Ethan’s behavior a bit disturbing roaming through the parking lot looking for his parents (turned out to be Kim and the girls)? So sorry, but he has overstepped his boundaries and is completely out of place to confront them for wanting to see Mariah’s concert.  Ethan, Olivia, Micah, etc. were worried about upsetting Mariah, but she never would have known that Kim and the girls were there had it not been for Ethan telling her just before her FIRST concert (unnecessary drama).  Regardless, season 3 has been very stressful and my heart truly goes out to this family – I’d much rather them reconcile rather than keep up this non-sense (mostly because of Olivia who doesn’t even talk to her own family). Sorry, Olivia is a strange one and a very intense person.  I sure hate that Ethan has to sell his lovely first home because Olivia can’t breathe the same air as his parents (such non-sense). The Plath's are a beautiful family that have problems, but they are not irreconcilable. I have to agree with Kim, I am tired of this, this has got to stop.

[readheaded]

2 hours ago, Loves2Dance said:

I think you’re projecting a lot. Olivia is a 21/22 year old child who grew up in a sheltered environment and is trying to create a more normal life for herself and her husband. When someone sets boundaries, that isn’t manipulation. Olivia’s mental health means more than Kim’s inflated ego. 

Agreed. If Olivia was truly trying to "tear apart the family," she'd try to isolate Ethan from his entire family. She's fine with the people who don't tell her she's the devil incarnate and don't try to manipulate her. Kim and Barry are such hypocrites because they suddenly accept Micha and Moriah, along with semi-nude modeling and a barely-there wardrobe (neither of which I have an issue with), but Olivia was somehow a tyrant because Ethan drank a Coke and some wine? Something doesn't add up about that. 

2 hours ago, JayDub1987 said:

She discussed the toxicity of her father in the most recent episode. She also said that she was raised in a very similar situation as Ethan, which would explain the friend "issue" that you've created. She may not want to associate with people who she knew in her youth. As far as new friends, she just went on a trip with Moriah and the girl who Micah is/isn't dating (can never remember that girl's name). Also, just because you don't see her surrounded by friends on a 42 minute TV show doesn't mean she doesn't have any. That's quite a stretch, even for the staunchest Kim defender.

Kim and Barry can raise their kids anyway they want, and people can point out the blatant glaring hypocrisy that they exhibit and the fact that the children have pointed to their lack of education as a hindrance in their lives. Also, according to this article (https://www.the-sun.com/entertainment/3504683/why-is-hosanna-not-on-welcome-to-plathville/), I'm not sure where you get this "loving relationship" with Hosanna. A direct quote from Moriah:

"“Sometimes we keep in touch to some extent, but it’s also, like, she’s across the country and, you know, it would just be a hassle and she doesn’t want to be on the show.”

Georgia to Ohio isn't "across the country." Also, it should be fun to see how "great" their relationship with Micah and Moriah is after Kim's most recent self-absorbed stunt. Micah calling out Kim's "bullshit" and her blatant refusal to adhere to something Moriah asked her to do certainly doesn't bode well for this mended bridge.

Finally, how is Ethan "stuck" with Olivia? Divorce is pretty simple, especially if there are no children involved. 

I saw a repeat yesterday (season 1, episode 2) where Olivia tells a little about how her family evolved to be less controlling and that she now has a great relationship with them.

[RedDelicious]

I wonder how people would feel about the Plaths if they were not physically attractive people (Barry notwithstanding). They are a beautiful family with a very, very dark and abusive dynamic.

I think Ethan was visibly so angry and extremely frustrated because he and Olivia are trying to work out their issues and here comes Kim f*cking everything up yet again. He was protecting Olivia because he loves her. Yes I felt getting the hotel was slightly manipulative, but so was the producer edit of that scene and what woman doesn't feel very attracted to their mate when they have defended them? I mean really. That's biology at work and they are still husband and wife. That might have actually been a step in the right direction for their relationship.

But beyond all of that, this was not a concert. It was a gig at an outdoor restaurant. If Moriah was headlining a ticketed event at a proper concert venue, then I might have argued that Kim & Co. should be able to attend. But it wasn't. Kim blew the whole entire thing completely out of proportion for her benefit, as narcissists always do. And Lydia was just sitting there smirking like the queen of Kim's minions. Gross. 

I felt really bad for Moriah and Olivia because they looked very anxious and upset on-stage. Kim's stunt ruined it. I thought it was better that Ethan and Micah told them what was going on because you KNOW Kim would not have stayed in the car if the boys had not finally located her. She would have had the gall to get out of the car and sit at a table, just waiting to be recognized, because again, nobody tells Kim Plath what to do. She's sick.

[Twopper]

11 hours ago, Jeanne222 said:

The Plath family seemed to be just cruising along until Olivia entered the picture. 

I am not sure they were cruising.  I think once Kim ran over her toddler, the family started to go off the rails.  Ethan was the oldest boy, and I suspect a lot of responsibility landed on his shoulders as Barry would have been absent because he was away all day at his job in Tallahassee and Kim was physically present but absent emotionally as she was despondent.  I can imagine the home schooling for those older kids went by the wayside at least in part due to Kim's emotional state.  Not to mention, family members---especially Ethan-- were probably afraid to say anything that would upset her.   Barry had a great opportunity in this episode to dissuade her from going to Tallahassee, but he backed off, although he himself did not go.

 

19 hours ago, gingerella said:

Yeah, I have no idea why Moriah even told her psycho parents about this gig. They wouldn't have known had she not told them. Here's an idea, DON'T drive to their house and DON'T tell them you're having a gig. Invite them when it's okay to invite them. Period, end of story.

I think because Kim would have been very angry with Moriah when she found out about the gig.  It seems like Kim has enough friends/spies that she learns through the grapevine about what the adult children are doing.   I am guessing Moriah wanted/needed Olivia to play keyboard because she felt more comfortable with her than she would with another person.  I see having Olivia and Micah involved in her gig as being a security blanket for a first public outing.  I suspect Moriah was angry at her mother for not respecting her wishes, but I am not sure she will be able to tell her mother  how she really feels.  If she is angry at Kim, Kim will just use that as an excuse to be a victim again, and it will be all about Kim and how it makes her feel.

[Loves2Dance]

Isaac wanting to be there to make sure nothing happened and Micah saying "This is what my mom has always done" was the highlights for me because it's not just Ethan and Olivia. These children have been abused because their mother is a narcissist and no narcissist will raise children unscathed. 

[charmed1]

12 minutes ago, RedDelicious said:

I wonder how people would feel about the Plaths if they were not physically attractive people (Barry notwithstanding).

LMAO! Mean! But I laughed, so I guess I’ll end up on Lydia’s prayer wall too. A few of those Plathlets look exactly like Barry though, and Micah, although he happened to hit the genetic jackpot, looks exactly like Kim. Truth be told, they all sort of creeped me out and it was their creep factor that drew me in initially. 

[Shelbie]

I feel like people are watching two different Olivias. 
I see a very young woman who grew up in a repressive family and community trying to control her own life. I find her thoughtful and articulate about boundaries and marriage and she sees Kim and Barry as they really are and is unwilling to allow them to warp her perceptions. Moriah and Ethan seem to love her and enjoy being around her.
Others seem to see her as Alexis Carrington from Dynasty. An evil controlling woman laughing in delight in thwarting Kim. 

[RedDelicious]

2 hours ago, charmed1 said:

LMAO! Mean! But I laughed, so I guess I’ll end up on Lydia’s prayer wall too. A few of those Plathlets look exactly like Barry though, and Micah, although he happened to hit the genetic jackpot, looks exactly like Kim. Truth be told, they all sort of creeped me out and it was their creep factor that drew me in initially. 

I know, burn. But seriously though, if Barry had a great personality it would make him infinitely more attractive as a person. Kim is overweight and a trash human, but she does have a pretty face and thick hair. Her personality, behavior and double standards ruin it completely.

[JayDub1987]

5 hours ago, Harmony Joy said:

Okay, I usually do not like to chime in, but am I the only one that found Ethan’s behavior a bit disturbing roaming through the parking lot looking for his parents (turned out to be Kim and the girls)? So sorry, but he has overstepped his boundaries and is completely out of place to confront them for wanting to see Mariah’s concert.  Ethan, Olivia, Micah, etc. were worried about upsetting Mariah, but she never would have known that Kim and the girls were there had it not been for Ethan telling her just before her FIRST concert (unnecessary drama).  Regardless, season 3 has been very stressful and my heart truly goes out to this family – I’d much rather them reconcile rather than keep up this non-sense (mostly because of Olivia who doesn’t even talk to her own family). Sorry, Olivia is a strange one and a very intense person.  I sure hate that Ethan has to sell his lovely first home because Olivia can’t breathe the same air as his parents (such non-sense). The Plath's are a beautiful family that have problems, but they are not irreconcilable. I have to agree with Kim, I am tired of this, this has got to stop.

Micah was in on the search until he had to take the stage, and also referred to Kim's behavior as "bullshit." Ultimately, Moriah told Kim that she couldn't come to the concert. Kim, being the all-knowing, all-seeing, sugar-hating, control-freak Nazi that she is decided that what Moriah said didn't matter because she was going to do what she wanted.

In order for there to be reconciliation, both parties need to admit wrongdoing. Kim doesn't believe she's ever been wrong. 

[Not Buyin It]

23 hours ago, Ms.Lulu said:

My two cents:

If someone told me that I was filled with evil spirits I would never associate with them again. I would leave a party, a store, a commitment if they attempted to insert themselves in my life.  I would not cause a scene and I would not acknowledge them.

If someone told me that my husband was filled with evil spirits I would never associate with them again.  I would have even stronger feelings than if they said I was filled with evil spirits.  

I don't blame Olivia for setting boundaries.  At the beginning of the band conversation she was upfront," I'll be in the band if Kim isn't at the show.  And I have no problem if you tell me that you want them there.  I am happy to step aside.  Your choice."   Moriah chose Olivia rather than Kim.

Regarding Ethan protecting Olivia, I have no problem with that.  I think the original accusation made it crystal clear to Ethan that his mother was a master manipulator who wants to stay at the center of her children's lives.  Kim wants to come before her kid's partners in terms of priority.  I don't believe it should work that way.  We all get to be the stars in our own life stories.  Our parents are just supporting roles.

So Ethan's anger is just as much for himself as it is protecting Olivia.

On a separate note, Lydia is a Kim minion (Kiminion?), and a weird one at that.  She has moved away from the long skirts and scenes in the prayer closet to more form fitting clothes and a good bit of make up. I hope she marries early and leaves the show.  I wish her health and happiness away from TV.

Yes! Yes to all of this!

[toomuchtv]

I forget, were we ever given a reason that Kim and Barry moved from the farm to a house closer to Ethan/Olivia and Micah/moriah? How far away was the farm (vs the house they’re in now)? I know Olivia wants to live in a bigger city, but I wonder if that contributed to wanting to move. She’s trying to build boundaries for her mental health and they just keep pushing at them as much as they can

[SongbirdHollow]

14 hours ago, Not Buyin It said:

Yes! Yes to all of this!

I would go all Elaine Benes and make finger horns and yell “I’m the devil! THE DEVILLLLLL!” 😈

[Xena]

3 hours ago, SongbirdHollow said:

I would go all Elaine Benes and make finger horns and yell “I’m the devil! THE DEVILLLLLL!” 😈

Bonus points if you are wearing a leather 8-Ball jacket while doing this!  

I do wish Olivia would lean into it like this.  Whenever she knows Kim may be somewhere she isn't wanted,  carry around a book titled 'Spells and other Witchcraft'.  Wear a pentagram necklace.  Make weird finger guestures and mumble incoherantly in Kim's direction.

Edited October 15, 2021 by Xena

[JayDub1987]

29 minutes ago, Xena said:

Bonus points if you are wearing a leather 8-Ball jacket while doing this!  

I do wish Olivia would lean into it like this.  Whenever she knows Kim may be somewhere she isn't wanted,  carry around a book titled 'Spells and other Witchcraft'.  Wear a pentagram necklace.  Make weird finger guestures and mumble incoherantly in Kim's direction.

I'd kick it up a notch. Maybe have an Alka Selzer in her pocket with a bottle of water in hand. She could pop it in and start foaming at the mouth if the opportunity presented itself. Really drive that whole "evil spirit" thing home. 

The audacity of Nazi Kim saying anyone has an evil spirit when she's actually the most evil, vile "human" on this show is laughable.

[emmawoodhouse]

Finally was able to watch the episode. Damn, Kim is absolutely vile. Everything has to revolve around her or she isn't happy. Her behavior leading up to the concert was just awful. Can't wait for the confrontation next week when Ethan eventually finds her in the parking lot.

[Guest]

My two takeaways and a thought...for what they are worth:

1) Moriah should never been put in the middle....

2) Barry was correct about not going...

If I were Moriah...I would have canceled the concert...

[jacksgirl]

This family puts the fun in dysfunctional for sure.  One thing to always remember is Kim and Barry are adults. Yes, Olivia has made mistakes, but she and Ethan are kids, and were what 19, 20 when they met and dated. And yes, I'm sure the TLC producers are scripting a good portion of this, but there are raw emotions that ring true at times like Ethan's rage/sadness and Max and Micah's bromance/crush.

Edited October 16, 2021 by jacksgirl

[readheaded]

3 hours ago, artisto said:

My two takeaways and a thought...for what they are worth:

1) Moriah should never been put in the middle....

2) Barry was correct about not going...

If I were Moriah...I would have canceled the concert...

Moriah wasn’t put in the middle, she knowingly made choices that resulted in the situation. 

[JayDub1987]

38 minutes ago, readheaded said:

Moriah wasn’t put in the middle, she knowingly made choices that resulted in the situation. 

This. Olivia told Moriah on more than one occasion that she would opt out of playing so Kim could come. Moriah refused that offer and told Kim not to attend. That's not "being put in the middle." That's taking a look at your options and choosing one. 

[RedDelicious]

21 hours ago, JayDub1987 said:

I'd kick it up a notch. Maybe have an Alka Selzer in her pocket with a bottle of water in hand. She could pop it in and start foaming at the mouth if the opportunity presented itself. Really drive that whole "evil spirit" thing home. 

The audacity of Nazi Kim saying anyone has an evil spirit when she's actually the most evil, vile "human" on this show is laughable.

I want to throw some water on Kim just to see what happens.

[gingerella]

2 hours ago, JayDub1987 said:

This. Olivia told Moriah on more than one occasion that she would opt out of playing so Kim could come. Moriah refused that offer and told Kim not to attend. That's not "being put in the middle." That's taking a look at your options and choosing one. 

It was also on Moriah to tell or not tell her parents, knowing what a psycho her mother is. That was a stupid decision. Kim took her shopping to hold something over her, and that something was 'what if I sneak in the back and nobody sees me *tee hee*?' I think the producers forced Moriah to tell her parents to be honest.

And while I love that it looks like Ethan is going to try to force Kim & Co to get out of that car and leave the venue, I hate that they make him look crazy for trying to find them and deal with the problem. It's gross how these damaged kids are being used by the producers. I wish the older kids would quit or just demand a show without their parents and younger subs since the younger kids, even the older boy, don't bring anything to the show. The older kids need the TLV .o ey to help set them up in new lives, I get that. I just wish they'd refuse to shoot anything that involves the rest of the family. Id.rather watch the 3 of them navigate the real world and know that Kim isn't getting a fucking penny from it!

Edited October 16, 2021 by gingerella

[luvmylabs]

On 10/14/2021 at 10:36 AM, Shelbie said:

I feel like people are watching two different Olivias. 
I see a very young woman who grew up in a repressive family and community trying to control her own life. I find her thoughtful and articulate about boundaries and marriage and she sees Kim and Barry as they really are and is unwilling to allow them to warp her perceptions. Moriah and Ethan seem to love her and enjoy being around her.
Others seem to see her as Alexis Carrington from Dynasty. An evil controlling woman laughing in delight in thwarting Kim. 

Olivia won't compromise.  It's her way or the highway.  I feel she shouldn't have put Mariah in that position...your parents come and I don't play...or at least I'll make everyone aware of how miserable I am.  Kim should not have come, or if she did she should not have brought the family. And Ethan stalking around the parking lot was plain creepy, although it won him points with Olivia.  Does Ethan ever smile anymore?  It's one thing for Ethan and Olivia to want to have nothing to do with his parents...no problem there, although I think they are extreme.  But to drag other family members along in their little drama is unfair, especially when they know Mariah is beginning to make peace with her mother.  Just my opinion.

[Jeanne222]

And the ‘let’s get a room’. After the way he treated his mother. Wow!

Kim is his mother. He can choose to stay away from her but he should be respectful. 

He  isn’t and I blame Olivia!

[Rootbeer]

3 hours ago, luvmylabs said:

Olivia won't compromise.  It's her way or the highway.  I feel she shouldn't have put Mariah in that position...your parents come and I don't play...or at least I'll make everyone aware of how miserable I am.  Kim should not have come, or if she did she should not have brought the family. And Ethan stalking around the parking lot was plain creepy, although it won him points with Olivia.  Does Ethan ever smile anymore?  It's one thing for Ethan and Olivia to want to have nothing to do with his parents...no problem there, although I think they are extreme.  But to drag other family members along in their little drama is unfair, especially when they know Mariah is beginning to make peace with her mother.  Just my opinion.

Moriah asked Olivia to join the group, not vice versa.  She said the knew from the start that Olivia wouldn't want Barry or Kim to see them perform.  Then, Olivia repeatedly offered to not perform and Moriah made it clear she wanted her there.  Meanwhile, Moriah very specifically told her mother not to come.  When asked, she admitted she wanted 'family' there but never requested Kim's presence.  She did tell her mother she wanted Lydia there and the other kids could come and her Kim said that wouldn't happen because it was not fair to KIM.  Also, if Moriah was so interested in having her mother watch her perform, why did she tell Kim not to tell her if she came?  Presuming Moriah would find Kim's presence supportive and loving, why wouldn't she want to know her mother was there?  To me, it seemed like Moriah made it clear she didn't want her parents to come and Kim ignored that in favor of making a scene and pretending she is the victim in all of this mess.

Ethan and Micah running around the parking lot looking for Kim was much less creepy than their own mother hiding in someone else's car and dragging her young kids along with her all the while knowing she wasn't wanted.

Moriah has been trying to get along with her mother; after this betrayal, that could certainly change.

7 minutes ago, Jeanne222 said:

And the ‘let’s get a room’. After the way he treated his mother. Wow!

Kim is his mother. He can choose to stay away from her but he should be respectful. 

He  isn’t and I blame Olivia!

What about the way his mother treated him and his wife?  And his sister?  He stood up to Kim which hasn't happened nearly enough in that family and is a big part of the reason those kids are so very messed up.

[jacksgirl]

Kim, you are Moriah's mom. She said not to come to the concert. As a parent, you, at times HAVE to put the needs of your children before your needs. Would I be disappointed AF missing something like this? Hell yes. But I'd respect my child's wishes because I love them. 

The only way to ever get any relationship back with Ethan and Olivia is to first respect their boundaries. 

[Back Atcha]

4 hours ago, jacksgirl said:

As a parent, you, at times HAVE to put the needs of your children before your needs.

KIM cannot understand any such comment.  

• If she can't read between the lines when her husband is trying to tell us something, WHY would she read anything we write.
• She has BIG mental problems.
• And...it seems a little late for any eye surgery to help Mercy.  Her eye problem should have been diagnosed/treated YEARS ago.

[Back Atcha]

On 10/14/2021 at 6:59 AM, Jeanne222 said:

I have never seen her parents or any family members on the show. 

Contracts for these reality TV shows are REAL contracts.  Olivia, Ethan, and Olivia's parents probably had the option to appear.  I'd bet KIM has the last word on everyone's contract.  Even Production is a-skeer'd of her.

On 10/14/2021 at 6:59 AM, Jeanne222 said:

I never see Olivia out with an old or new friend.

Contracts ain't easy.  Friends have to be vetted (including COVIDing) and they have to sign.

On 10/14/2021 at 7:59 AM, scorp01 said:

but the way the Plath kids refer to their parents and siblings is off-putting.

Seems  efficient to me.   Why not say SIBLINGS instead of BROTHERS AND SISTERS ... every time?

[jacksgirl]

13 hours ago, Jeanne222 said:

And the ‘let’s get a room’. After the way he treated his mother. Wow!

Kim is his mother. He can choose to stay away from her but he should be respectful. 

He  isn’t and I blame Olivia!

 Ethan and Olivia are married. I think Olivia felt supported and protected by Ethan after he dealt with Kim's shenanigans.  The fact that they both wanted intimacy afterwards is a good sign that maybe they can save their relationship.  Olivia does not use her feminine wiles on Ethan, it was a mutual choice. 

[JayDub1987]

15 hours ago, Jeanne222 said:

And the ‘let’s get a room’. After the way he treated his mother. Wow!

Kim is his mother. He can choose to stay away from her but he should be respectful. 

He  isn’t and I blame Olivia!

Respect is earned, not given, especially with adult children. Kim can demand that the younger children respect her, but that doesn't fly with adults. For instance, my wife's biological mother is a waste of oxygen, total piece of shit. My wife doesn't respect her and makes sure that she knows that. Kim is his mother, but he's an adult. "I'm your mom, so respect me" doesn't work with grown ups. That's why there's a good chance that every one of these kids are going to grow up to hate her, and I hope we get to see it happen. 

[Jeanne222]

I'm really sorry more adults find it so hard to at least respect their parents.  Kim has raised nine children to the best of her ability.  She suffered a terrific loss of one of them at her hand.  I feel so sad for her.

I think many here are coming off their own bad relationships with parents and I'm so very sorry that happened to you.

Everybody deserves a happy, supportive family because life's tough.

Kim makes mistakes but I feel confident she loves her kids.

Please don't beat up the few of us here that see things differently.  It is a discussion board and some of us with successful relationships see things from a different angle.  Peace!

[JocelynCavanaugh]

7 hours ago, Back Atcha said:

• And...it seems a little late for any eye surgery to help Mercy.  Her eye problem should have been diagnosed/treated YEARS ago.

Mercy’s problem was “diagnosed” as soon as it occurred, when her eye was injured by a pice of plastic that flew off of something in the yard. She’s spent weeks in the hospital having multiple surgeries and the family has helped to work with her on rehabilitation exercises. Kim detailed it at length on their family blog. If she’s lying to make herself look good, it’s an elaborate and extremely detailed lie carried out over more than a year. 

[Back Atcha]

20 minutes ago, JocelynCavanaugh said:

Kim detailed it at length on their family blog

I didn't realize there was a "family blog."   Am I in the minority on this forum?

[JayDub1987]

1 hour ago, Jeanne222 said:

I'm really sorry more adults find it so hard to at least respect their parents.  Kim has raised nine children to the best of her ability.  She suffered a terrific loss of one of them at her hand.  I feel so sad for her.

I think many here are coming off their own bad relationships with parents and I'm so very sorry that happened to you.

Everybody deserves a happy, supportive family because life's tough.

Kim makes mistakes but I feel confident she loves her kids.

Please don't beat up the few of us here that see things differently.  It is a discussion board and some of us with successful relationships see things from a different angle.  Peace!

It is a discussion board. Disagreeing with your posts supporting Kim is no more a case of "beating you up" than you disagreeing with others. I personally have a wonderful relationship with my parents, even though they are far more conservative than I am (which is saying a lot, as I'm a very conservative person). Kim isn't conservative. She is an insufferable, manipulative person who thinks she should be able to control her adult children. Going to an event that your adult child told you not to come to isn't "caring." It's wrong.

30 minutes ago, Back Atcha said:

I didn't realize there was a "family blog."   Am I in the minority on this forum?

I also had no idea. Part of me would like to read it, but I also don't want to reward the Super Bitch with more traffic on a platform that she uses to increase her own self-worth.

[ethalfrida]

1 hour ago, Jeanne222 said:

 

I think many here are coming off their own bad relationships with parents and I'm so very sorry that happened to you.

I think many here are coming off reasonable and normal relationships with their parents. And are quite capable of identifying toxic home environments.

[JayDub1987]

18 minutes ago, ethalfrida said:

I think many here are coming off reasonable and normal relationships with their parents. And are quite capable of identifying toxic home environments.

Exactly. I've discussed (maybe in this episode discussion) that my parents are very anti-alcohol. With that in mind, I don't drink around them. However, they know that I do have an occasional drink or two, and don't try to shame me for it. Those are adult boundaries.

[Back Atcha]

39 minutes ago, JayDub1987 said:

1 hour ago, Jeanne222 said:

I'm really sorry more adults find it so hard to at least respect their parents.  Kim has raised nine children to the best of her ability.  She suffered a terrific loss of one of them at her hand.  I feel so sad for her.

I think many here are coming off their own bad relationships with parents and I'm so very sorry that happened to you.

Everybody deserves a happy, supportive family because life's tough.

Kim makes mistakes but I feel confident she loves her kids.

Please don't beat up the few of us here that see things differently.  It is a discussion board and some of us with successful relationships see things from a different angle.  Peace!

Expand  

It is a discussion board. Disagreeing with your posts supporting Kim is no more a case of "beating you up" than you disagreeing with others. I personally have a wonderful relationship with my parents, even though they are far more conservative than I am (which is saying a lot, as I'm a very conservative person). Kim isn't conservative. She is an insufferable, manipulative person who thinks she should be able to control her adult children. Going to an event that your adult child told you not to come to isn't "caring." It's wrong.

JayDub1987 ...  EXACTLY!   Kim has some mental health issues, so "to the best of her ability," should be stopped by reasonable people.  This is obviously not the producers at TLC.   I do feel sad for Kim, but SADDER for anyone under her dangerous control.   She obviously has serious guilt over her antics as a teen and young woman (what was so horrible?)...and will make DAMNED sure her children (especially her girls) don't follow her path.    

We ALL know of parents who don't deserve respect...instead deserve punishment--perhaps prison time--at least re-education.  Just because someone gives birth, doesn't mean she is doing things "to the best of her ability."  Kim's children are all well-behaved; the scars will turn up soon enough.  Lack of education is showing up every day.

 

39 minutes ago, JayDub1987 said:

1 hour ago, Back Atcha said:

I didn't realize there was a "family blog."   Am I in the minority on this forum?

I also had no idea. Part of me would like to read it, but I also don't want to reward the Super Bitch with more traffic on a platform that she uses to increase her own self-worth.

JayDub1987 ... I'll follow YOU anywhere!!!

[JayDub1987]

7 minutes ago, Back Atcha said:

JayDub1987 ...  EXACTLY!   Kim has some mental health issues, so "to the best of her ability," should be stopped by reasonable people.  This is obviously not the producers at TLC.   I do feel sad for Kim, but SADDER for anyone under her dangerous control.   She obviously has serious guilt over her antics as a teen and young woman (what was so horrible?)...and will make DAMNED sure her children (especially her girls) don't follow her path.    

We ALL know of parents who don't deserve respect...instead deserve punishment--perhaps prison time--at least re-education.  Just because someone gives birth, doesn't mean she is doing things "to the best of her ability."  Kim's children are all well-behaved; the scars will turn up soon enough.  Lack of education is showing up every day.

 

JayDub1987 ... I'll follow YOU anywhere!!!

I appreciate that! If my viewership had anything to do with ratings, I don't even think I would watch this show because I'm sure Kim believes that people are supporting and endorsing her. She's a horrible human who (under the guise of "raising her children") is doing nothing but damaging them. Hell, cult leaders all throughout history claimed that they were doing what was best for "their people" when they were actually manipulating them and ultimately destroying their lives. Kim is a nasty, despicable person who I hope visits these forums just so she can know that there are people other than Olivia who see her for what she is.

[jacksgirl]

1 hour ago, Back Atcha said:

JayDub1987 ...  EXACTLY!   Kim has some mental health issues, so "to the best of her ability,"  

 

(Sorry. I chopped off the rest of the quote. Am babysitting my 6 month old granddaughter as I have a great relationship with my son and d-i-l 😀).

 

If I had accidentally killed my toddler (or any child), I would have serious mental health issues. I also would seek therapy and lean into help and support. I don't walk in Kim's shoes, but she seems totally un-self aware as to her contributions to her crumbling family dynamics.

[MarCap]

13 hours ago, Jeanne222 said:

I'm really sorry more adults find it so hard to at least respect their parents.  Kim has raised nine children to the best of her ability.  She suffered a terrific loss of one of them at her hand.  I feel so sad for her.

I think many here are coming off their own bad relationships with parents and I'm so very sorry that happened to you.

Everybody deserves a happy, supportive family because life's tough.

Kim makes mistakes but I feel confident she loves her kids.

Please don't beat up the few of us here that see things differently.  It is a discussion board and some of us with successful relationships see things from a different angle.  Peace!

Respect is earned.....Period It goes both ways. I feel sad for Kim as well, as there could be nothing more horrific than to be the accidental cause of your own child's death.  That being said, it gives her NO excuse to be the controlling, vile, sneaky, manipulative & toxic mom that she is.  She needs help. If she loves her kids, she will seek it, before they all end contact with her, one by one 

[gingerella]

12 hours ago, MarCap said:

She needs help. If she loves her kids, she will seek it, before they all end contact with her, one by one 

You honestly think she will ever seek help? She's a narcissist, so the problem lies with others, never herself. If each kid moves away from her, she will simply blame the evils of society for turning her kids on her. 

Edited October 19, 2021 by gingerella