S03.E05: You Were the One That Changed

[Ms.Lulu]

Max and Lydia go on a mission. Tension between Ethan and Kim threatens a plan for him and his brothers to hang out. Moriah faces a tough choice for her band. Ethan and Olivia reach a critical point in their relationship as the idea of a move looms.

Original Air Date: 9/14/2021

Edited September 15, 2021 by Ms.Lulu

[Cancun]

You know Kim wanted to follow Max and Lydia (undetected) to see where they went…

And I agree with the poster last week who said Kim appears to have gained a tremendous amount of weight. I struggle with this, too, but when I am not eating healthy it’s usually because things aren’t right in my world. Pretty sure Kim is the same.

Those scenes of Ethan running back and forth on the golf course were a nice comic relief to the sad stuff Ethan is dealing with.

Edited September 15, 2021 by Cancun

[seasons]

Isn't Tallahassee pretty close to Cairo? Couldn't they find a compromise?

Ugh. Sometimes this is what happens nowadays especially when people marry so very young. 

[SunnyBeBe]

I posted on last week’s thread before this one opened that it seems Ethan is a senior man approaching retirement and his wife a young person going off into the world.  Is the angst really about moving?  I don’t think so.  I didn’t watch when they were happy together.  Were they?

[Jeanne222]

This one was confusing!  Ethan is a small town guy married to a big city girl.  Didn't they discuss this back when they were in lust?  He doesn't seem to want to try anything new and she won't stay!

I didn't like Ethan last evening when I watched this show.  He appeared stubborn and looked unwilling to compromise.  

Kim is a PIA but many overcome their mothers faults because they are family.

Ethan saying he won't pull up to the door to pick up his brother and borrowed golf clubs...childish and foolish.

Olivia saying she doesn't want Kim and husband..family at Mariah 's gig...really.  How sad to put Mariah in that situation.  With her voice and presentation she's going to need support.

Looks like her boyfriend lashes out about her skimpy clothes next week.  Now he'll see how Kim and Barry felt with the wild child dressing.

13 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I posted on last week’s thread before this one opened that it seems Ethan is a senior man approaching retirement and his wife a young person going off into the world.  Is the angst really about moving?  I don’t think so.  I didn’t watch when they were happy together.  Were they?

They were in lust!  Olivia was teaching Ethan many things like a Dr Dooliddle!   He was her grasshopper!

She mixed and stirred until Ethan parted from his parents and then the trouble between them started.

[SunnyBeBe]

I read here that Ethan was against therapy….that’s too bad.  Last night he said that he wanted to tell his mother how her behavior made him feel….and she would then feel bad about it and apologize.  So, he has no idea what his mother is (narcissist) nor that she will never be the person he wants her to be.  His expectations are not realistic.  I believe one reason he doesn’t want to move is that he’s hanging on to getting that apology.  Once he leaves, that opportunity fades, in his mind.  He’s living in a fantasy believing that is feasible.  A therapist might be able to help him realize realty and help provide hm tools for coping with things he can’t control.  It seems he has some control issues too.  

[Chicken Fingers]

I feel sad for Olivia and Ethan. It's so very common and normal to have your first serious relationship at their age, and then grow and change and move on from each other. Having been locked into marriage at 20 just makes it more difficult, because they also have to deal with the sense of failure to live up to a set of vows they were really unprepared to take.

I think maybe Ethan has good instincts, as young and sheltered as he is. He seems to recognize the type of lifestyle and setting that makes him happy. There's nothing wrong with wanting a quiet, small-town life, just as there's nothing wrong with Olivia wanting to travel, experiment, and live in the "big city." And as childish as it may appear, Ethan also seems to recognize that he has to go overboard to avoid his parents for now, until he's stronger and has worked through some issues, and until (if it ever happens) they accept his boundaries and stop pushing. Any of us who've dealt with narcissist parents know that the minute you give a little, they're all over you again. 

Kim is doing that with Moriah in this episode, with her "oh hey let's hang out and be girlfriends" act. Moriah thinks she's now immune to her mother's toxic behaviors and that maybe her mother has learned/changed, but we know how that goes. 

I don't remember seeing Barry at all in the two most recent episodes. I'm still curious as to what's behind that smirk.

 

 

[bichonblitz]

Ethan and Olivia will not make it. He is depressed and miserable and she is already packing regardless of what he has to say about it. I have no doubt that when they divorce they will both find partners that are more compatible. 

Ethan wants to live in the country setting, have space to work on his cars and his yard. He doesn't like crowds. Nothing wrong with that. 

Olivia has goals, she wants more excitement which a bigger city can give her. Nothing wrong with that. 

What is wrong is that this wasn't discussed before they got married. Their young horniness and lust got in the way. IMO this is why you should have some sexual experience before getting married. Sex clouds everything. LOL

[Jeanne222]

I can see Olivia and Ethan splitting up.  They are worlds apart and both seem so unhappy.  Sometimes divorce happens for the best.

I wonder if Olivia can support herself with her photo business?  That's a consideration.  I also wonder if they do split will Ethan try and keep the house that seems to have everything he wants and needs right now.

I can see Ethan marrying a small town girl that gets along with everybody and having Sunday dinners with his family but leaving each other alone during the week.  Won't make much of a tv show but they might be happy.

[applewood]

A part of me thinks that Ethan and Olivia should just split up. They got married too young. They seem to want different things in life. Ethan will never be happy in an apartment in Tallahassee. I'm not pro-divorce but they don't have children and it would be easy to split up now.

Also, why are the parents so against Lydia communicating with this boy? Is it just that they felt she was becoming too obsessive and she really didn't know him?

[Jeanne222]

Just now, applewood said:

A part of me thinks that Ethan and Olivia should just split up. They got married too young. They seem to want different things in life. Ethan will never be happy in an apartment in Tallahassee. I'm not pro-divorce but they don't have children and it would be easy to split up now.

Also, why are the parents so against Lydia communicating with this boy? Is it just that they felt she was becoming too obsessive and she really didn't know him?

I think that's it.  Being so obsessive.  Wasn't she texting him 100 times a day? 

Maybe because he lives so far away.  Lydia is Kim's sweetheart and I'm sure she doesn't want to lose her.  I think her oldest daughter lives far away.

If Kim is all everyone seems to be saying about her it could be control.  Who knows?

[Ziggy]

28 minutes ago, Jeanne222 said:

I think that's it.  Being so obsessive.  Wasn't she texting him 100 times a day? 

Kim said there was one day where she texted him 100 times, but isn't that a conversation?  Realistically, a conversation back and forth can include that much.  My husband and I started out long distance, and I'm sure if everything we said to each other on the phone had to be texted, it would take around 100 texts on some days.

[Twopper]

2 hours ago, Chicken Fingers said:

I don't remember seeing Barry at all in the two most recent episodes. I'm still curious as to what's behind that smirk.

I think he is uncomfortable being filmed plus he has very thin lips.  I doubt he would be on tv if it were not for Kim.

 

6 minutes ago, applewood said:

A part of me thinks that Ethan and Olivia should just split up. They got married too young. They seem to want different things in life. Ethan will never be happy in an apartment in Tallahassee. I'm not pro-divorce but they don't have children and it would be easy to split up now.

Last season Olivia seemed perfectly happy looking at a house in nearby Thomasville.  Ethan, of course, hated its location as it was in a neighborhood with houses close together.  Now she wants to move to Tallahassee.  Depending on the time of year that she is looking for apartments, I wish her good luck.  This is a town that, despite being the state capital, is an overgrown cow town with a huge university of 30,000 plus students.   As it is they are only about 45 minutes away.  I am not even sure they would be talking about moving if Kim hadn't moved  into their neighborhood.  I guess the move from the farm was because the only farm hand left was Isaac.

I am fairly familiar with the area;  I have relatives in Tallahassee and my DIL's sister recently moved to Thomasville.  They could easily find a house on the northern outskirts of Tallahassee with a little land.  Ethan could commute to his job and Olivia could do whatev she wants in town.

They could really use a good marriage counselor.

14 hours ago, Cancun said:

You know Kim wanted to follow Max and Lydia (undetected) to see where they went…

I would guess she has one of those trackers on Lydia's phone.  and on Isaac's as well, if he has one.

14 hours ago, Cancun said:

Those scenes of Ethan running back and forth on the golf course were a nice comic relief to the sad stuff Ethan is dealing with.

absolutely hilarious.

20 minutes ago, Jeanne222 said:

I think that's it.  Being so obsessive.  Wasn't she texting him 100 times a day? 

yes, if she initiated all those texts.  It really depends for me on the length of the texts.   I get tons of texts from one person who thinks every sentence or sentence fragment should be a text message.

5 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I posted on last week’s thread before this one opened that it seems Ethan is a senior man

I am convinced he was the man of the family in many ways despite the physical presence of the dad especially in the aftermath of Kim running over the child.  I think Kim moving close enough to spy on him has really shaken him up.

 

[Ziggy]

3 hours ago, Chicken Fingers said:

And as childish as it may appear, Ethan also seems to recognize that he has to go overboard to avoid his parents for now, until he's stronger and has worked through some issues, and until (if it ever happens) they accept his boundaries and stop pushing. Any of us who've dealt with narcissist parents know that the minute you give a little, they're all over you again.

I'm really glad you said that.  Even though I usually think Ethan is making really good choices with regard to his parents, last night I was on team, "Really, Ethan, you're not going to hang out with your brother if it means knocking on the door to pick him up?"  But what you said really makes sense, and there are just no easy choices for him right now.

[WahooLAH99]

33 minutes ago, Jeanne222 said:

I think that's it.  Being so obsessive.  Wasn't she texting him 100 times a day? 

Maybe because he lives so far away.  Lydia is Kim's sweetheart and I'm sure she doesn't want to lose her.  I think her oldest daughter lives far away.

If Kim is all everyone seems to be saying about her it could be control.  Who knows?

Maybe if Kim would mind her own GD business Lydia would get to know this mystery boy. And let’s face it this b.s about not being able to know someone over the phone is ridiculous. Because you know it is not like she would be able to go visit this guy! The texting and calls is all she has. So let her talk to him. Maybe she will realize they are not compatible and drop it. Hello! Maybe if Ethan and Olivia had been allowed to talk more than an hour every 3 months they would have realized they would never work out!  Or maybe Kim just wants Lydia to get married at First site to someone, because clearly getting to know someone before hand is a completely ridiculous concept! I hate Kim!

[bichonblitz]

1 hour ago, Ziggy said:

"Really, Ethan, you're not going to hang out with your brother if it means knocking on the door to pick him up?"

I don't know why that would even be a problem. Micah was in the car with him. Ethan could have parked at the bottom of the driveway and Micah could have gone to the door. I like Ethan a lot but that was silly. 

Does Olivia have a relationship with her own family since she got married? I'm just curious. 

[Shelbie]

Lydia is 17. The surest way to make her believe she has met soulmate is to forbid communication. Instead Kim has decides that once again she knows best and leans into controlling her child. 
Let them text. Let them discover how they feel about a million different subjects. Let them see if they share a sense of humour. 
The relationship could mature into a deep friendship or marriage or could peter out once they realize they don’t see eye to eye on important stuff. 
 

Kim just wants total control regardless of the effect on her children.

Edited September 15, 2021 by Shelbie

[Jeanne222]

I didn’t think about the Texts as conversations. 

That makes more sense to the amount of texting. 

I do agree. They could learn a lot about each other if given the chance. 

Actually they should be FaceTiming. That is more close up and personal and we know they have laptops and phones. 

[JocelynCavanaugh]

It was a huge mistake for Ethan and Olivia to ever marry. They’re not compatible at all. They were young and wanted out of their strict family homes. This was one of the few ways they could do that without going nuclear, plus the bonuses of “guilt-free” sex and being smug about how mature they are because they’re married (more of an Olivia vibe). But it turns out that the vast majority of people are indeed subject to the factors that make marrying young a bad idea, and they’re no exception. 

I could see Ethan as a doting stepdad and second husband of a widow, maybe one whose first husband was heroically killed in the line of duty, or saving a drowning child at Pensacola. Ethan, emerging from a year or two of darkness and car tinkering post-divorce, is ready to throw himself into commitment to a small-town lady with a built-in family they can add to. They’ll host Backyard Bible Clubs for Second Baptist Church. He may run into Olivia sometimes when she’s home for a visit, and they’ll be cordial, but not especially nostalgic.

Olivia will be having too much fun to marry again. She might buy a live-work loft in Atlanta or Charlotte, fill it with candles and dramatic furniture, then live in Phuket or Goa for a year. Eventually, she’ll end up in the Bay Area; maybe she’ll have a long-term non-marriage like Kurt and Goldie. No kids, maybe some exotic pets. Always creative, a little tiresome, but generally harmless.

Meanwhile, Max is shopping for a “pinkie promise ring” for Moriah, because they’re special, and commitment at 19 will definitely work for them. Totally different from Ethan and Olivia, who are a traditional, reserved guy and a free-spirited young woman eager to live her best sexy life. Toooootally diff. No worries here.

Then the real Max comes out in the previews where he wants to know if her confidence depends on showing her ass… which… is not a bad question. But it’s not a question Moriah is prepared to answer. She’s made it as far as “I’m young and free and I can wear whatever I want,” but not quite to “maybe sometimes I could show off my personality instead.” I’m afraid even after she outgrows this phase, she may never ditch the garish lip shades. Moriah: if they make Nerds candy in that color, it’s not a face color for you.

I actually like all of the Plath kids, as much as I’ve seen of them. They’re all coping with growing up in isolation, with arbitrary rules, competition for resources (including parental affection), and a HUGE, horrible tragedy (which they do acknowledge, just super awkwardly). Yet they each seem like decent and interesting people with surprisingly well-developed senses of self. It’s possible most of them will turn out okay; they just have a long road of delayed adolescence to travel first. 

[camom]

Why weren't the boys wearing seat belts when driving to the golf course?  That was so distracting to me.

I wish Ethan and Olivia would go to marriage counseling.  Even if they split up, at least they'll know they tried.  it seems Ethan is the one who won't do it.

 

[Madding crowd]

I hope Ethan and Olivia can find a way to stay together. I don’t see Ethan as an old man; I see him as someone who was raised working on machinery and outside stuff and it’s his way of decompressing. It’s not that much different than a guy spending hours fishing or playing video games. He also works repairing copy machines and working on cars.

If Olivia leaves she might find her wedding photography business might not be so popular without the TV show. I also don’t think she is as worldly as she thinks and doubt if she would fit in with world travelers or super sophisticated people. My guess is she would end up in a city but married to another guy who isn’t much different than Ethan. As far as someone saying Ethan needs to be married to an older widow , why ? I know a lot of people who are young and enjoy living in rural areas and I don’t see any reason he couldn’t have his own kids.

[JocelynCavanaugh]

5 minutes ago, Madding crowd said:

As far as someone saying Ethan needs to be married to an older widow , why ? I know a lot of people who are young and enjoy living in rural areas and I don’t see any reason he couldn’t have his own kids.

I’m not sure if you’re referring to my comment, but I didn’t say “old,” and I said a family they could “add to” — meaning more kids with Ethan’s DNA, since some people care about that so much. By inference, the widow couldn’t be that “old.” I know the car working stuff keeps coming up, but I didn’t make a judgment about it. It’s just a hobby. 

Fascinating what we read into other people’s words sometimes. 

[Madding crowd]

I didn’t mean anything negative, I think a woman who already has children would likely be older than 22 and most people who lose their spouse are a bit older in general.

[TwirlyGirly]

6 hours ago, Twopper said:

I think he is uncomfortable being filmed plus he has very thin lips.

When people end a sentence with LOL, you know they probably did not actually Laugh Out Loud when writing it.

However, when I read the above, I can assure you I did LOL! 

Partially because of the absurdity of Barry refusing to be filmed because it makes him uncomfortable and because he has thin lips, but mostly because we're talking about Barry so "I'm uncomfortable being filmed plus I have very thin lips" is precisely the kind of nonsensical excuse I would not be at all surprised to hear coming out of his thin-lipped mouth.

Thank you. I needed that. 😂

Edited September 16, 2021 by TwirlyGirly
Forgot a word.

[Ms.Lulu]

I thought this was another uncomfortable episode.

Ethan and Olivia don't touch each other or even get close to each other.  It is good they are talking.  I predict they will not break up this season.  I think one will compromise.

Lydia might be the most social awkward in the group.  she seems so uncomfortable in her skin.

Kim was definitely laying the groundwork to manipulate Moriah.  She will continue to push on the show for an invite, even though she knows the keyboardist is Olivia.

Micah, he seems to be living his best life.  He might be a slob.  He might not be educated.  But he has great instincts on being a good person.

9 hours ago, Ms.Lulu said:

 

 

Edited September 16, 2021 by Ms.Lulu

[JocelynCavanaugh]

6 hours ago, Madding crowd said:

I didn’t mean anything negative, I think a woman who already has children would likely be older than 22 and most people who lose their spouse are a bit older in general.

You’re welcome to @ or quote me directly.

It’s just a hypothetical I made up. I did not set parameters on age. The whole imaginary scenario was a tragic, unnatural death, wherein age would not be a factor and the dissolution of the marriage wouldn’t carry a stigma in their culture. (This is loosely based on people I know, so it does happen, and nobody was old; one just got glioblastoma. Between a honeymoon baby, a surprisingly fast adoption, and a baby conceived during the adoption process, they racked up three kids in under three years of marriage. Just in time for the brain tumor.) I don’t actually have the power to consign Ethan to any fate whatsoever, much less the most horrible of all: a woman over 22.

My whole point was I think Ethan would be happier with someone whose values and goals are similar to his. Because he will have lost a few “prime” (not my opinion) years to his first marriage, which is declining rather slowly but surely, divorce, and some time to collect himself, he might appreciate starting out with some pre-baked kids before mixing up a few of his own. If the imaginary widow I made up also married at 19, this still puts us well shy of 30.

Also, based on my own experience of growing up evangelical, I think he might find comfort and propriety in marrying someone who had also been married before. I didn’t mention it before because I didn’t want to conjure the tired “what evangelicals believe” conversation.

[Guest]

23 hours ago, seasons said:

Isn't Tallahassee pretty close to Cairo?

[SunnyBeBe]

It doesn’t really matter if they move to a city or not….what’s the saying?  No matter where you go, there you are.  The couple seems to be struggling with basic interpersonal conflict.

Edited September 16, 2021 by SunnyBeBe

[Jeanne222]

5 hours ago, artisto said:

Lots of areas they could live in where he’d have land and easy commute for her 

They are struggling with much more than location. 

Olivia will soon get a taste of how Ethan treats his mother!  Unbending, uncooperative, stubborn  

Back atcha!

Edited September 16, 2021 by Jeanne222

[Twopper]

39 minutes ago, Jeanne222 said:

Lots of areas they could live in where he’d have land and easy commute for her 

They are struggling with much more than location. 

yes, Olivia seems to be searching for a geographical cure to what ails her and what she thinks ails her marriage.  Last season she seemed content to move to Thomasville.  Thomasville, Tallahassee, and Cairo make a triangle, and from Tallahassee to either it is about 45 minutes. Tallahassee is pretty much state government employees and FSU students and employees.  I am not sure she would really be that much happier there except it makes her farther away from Ma Plath.   This seems to be stirring the pot as there are plenty of semi-rural places that are close to Tallahassee.  She could drive into town every day with ease and they could go into the city on Fri and Sat nights for whatev.

[lightninggirl]

As petulant as Ethan seems when reacting to his parents/mother at present, I appreciate his stubbornness and sticking to his guns. He was manipulated and pushed around for years by them, and him pushing back is exactly what they deserve. I like that his first instinct of Kim pushing back was to literally turn the car around, even though Kim was reasonable in asking that the car comes closer to the house when she/the family is loaning out the clubs. It was telling when she thought Ethan was there, craning her neck and peering out the window to catch a glimpse of him.

Kim seemed cool, laid-back, and not judgey when she visited Moriah - I raised my eyebrows in shock when she joked about Moriah being pregnant and then laughed. However, we all know what a garbage person Kim is and she was simply collecting fuel and fodder to use against Moriah, Max, and Micah at a later date.

I can relate to Ethan's moving situation where my husband wanted to move to another city across the state, and I put my foot down (there were SO many reasons for us not to move, such as having to pull a kid out of school, leave my trusted babysitter of my infant, me knowing no one in the new place, breaking our lease, packing/unpacking with an infant while he worked 50-60 hours/week, me having to quit my job and leave all of my friends, being farther away from my family, among others). Four months later my husband was just horrible to live with and he went to work every day hating his life. I relented and the move happened, and we're still together over 20 years later and still in that same city. That being said, I do feel that Olivia's compromise is perfectly acceptable. I lived in the area, and my roommate was from Bainbridge and her family was from Cairo. I nannied for a family for years that lived between Tallahassee and Thomasville, and I'm familiar with the towns and spaces between them. Baby steps would be moving to Thomasville, but Tallahassee is more Olivia's speed and would be a great place for her to grow. I have many friends who lived on the outskirts of Tallahassee with large properties, and Ethan would do well somewhere like Midway to the west of town. However, Olivia keeps saying "apartment" but I think that moving into a home on some decent property with enough space to Ethan to putter on his cars is optimal.

Edited September 16, 2021 by lightninggirl

[Back Atcha]

35 minutes ago, lightninggirl said:

However, Olivia keeps saying "apartment" but I think that moving into a home on some decent property with enough space to Ethan to putter on his cars is optimal.

EXACTLY!  If Olivia's heart's desire is an apartment, maybe there's a storage center or something similar where people are allowed to have a workshop or mechanic station.

4 hours ago, Jeanne222 said:

Olivia will soon get a taste of how Ethan treats his mother!  Unbending, uncooperative, stubborn  

I think Ethan will be fine with give-and-take.  His mother was an unyielding tyrant.  Olivia approaches things from an almost therapist point of view.

[Jeanne222]

I don’t think Ethan will ever move to an apartment so they should take that one off the table if they expect to make a move!

[SunnyBeBe]

Since college, I’ve always said that everyone should have to live in a dorm for at least one year of their life.  It taught me so much!  But, Ethan and his siblings have endured so much, I think they have suffered enough. 

[SunnyBeBe]

I’m not sure which episode it was in, but what beverages were they drinking in the scene where Ethan is sitting at a table talking to his parents in a very serious tone? They show the flashbacks a lot, but just for a moment.  It appears to be beer……? 

[emmawoodhouse]

I remember Ethan drinking beer in front of his parents, but it obviously wouldn't have been at the Plath homestead. I,m pretty sure they were at a restaurant. I don't recall him drinking during a serious conversation with Kim/Barry.

[charmed1]

On 9/15/2021 at 4:41 PM, bichonblitz said:

I don't know why that would even be a problem. Micah was in the car with him. Ethan could have parked at the bottom of the driveway and Micah could have gone to the door. I like Ethan a lot but that was silly. 

Does Olivia have a relationship with her own family since she got married? I'm just curious. 

I thought it was silly too. Isaac is what, 13 or 14 years old and he’s a string bean. So not only does he have to carry the golf clubs all the way to the end of the driveway, he’s also literally and figuratively put in the middle of the feud between his parents and brother. You could see how excited and desperate he was to hang out with his brothers, he would’ve done whatever it took to go. I’m glad Micah was able to come up with a compromise or I’m sure Isaac would’ve been crestfallen.

I’m not sure if Ethan is so much against big city living as he is being away from his siblings. Micah and Moriah seem to have a small friend group, but Ethan has no one other than them, Olivia and an elderly man that he calls his best friend. He really would benefit from seeking therapy.

Edited September 20, 2021 by charmed1

[peacockblue]

On 9/15/2021 at 8:22 AM, Chicken Fingers said:

I don't remember seeing Barry at all in the two most recent episodes. I'm still curious as to what's behind that smirk.

Quite frankly...I would not be surprised if he is on the high functioning part of the Spectrum

[the-grey-lady]

Catching up on this episode...did Ethan really marry Olivia and expect she would never change at all?

[Mothra]

This show leaves me feeling like I've just been to a funeral.  It's not fun to watch.

[JayDub1987]

On 9/23/2021 at 2:26 PM, the-grey-lady said:

Catching up on this episode...did Ethan really marry Olivia and expect she would never change at all?

I believe he did, and when you're raised in an uber-conservative, religious household, that's not that surprising. My parents were/are very adherent to their Christian beliefs. While not to the level that Kim and Barry are (not anywhere close, really), they raised me very similarly to how they were brought up. Lived in a small town (that I still live in and love). My wife was raised by her grandparents, and again, very conservative, Christian home. 

My parents don't approve of the fact that I have a drink every now and then. As a form of respect, I don't drink around them, but they know that I have no issues with it. My wife's grandfather thinks it's absolutely crazy that my wife wears blue jeans to church. 

Sorry for the long post, but it's easy for me to believe that Ethan assumed he would marry a small-town girl and they would have their own version of a small-town life. I'm not saying that Olivia is wrong for wanting more. I'm not even saying that Ethan is wrong for wanting life to stay the same. I do believe that a divorce would be better for both parties, especially at such a young age.

[Taylor1703]

100% Olivia is in the wrong. She is petty and controlling. She manipulates all situations,  from her and Ethan to her and moriah with the band. She wants to be picked over everything. Ethan gives up his family, suppose to move, suppose to be ok with always changing more and more but what has she changed for ethan?? They are not going to make it and he would have given up everything, she is forcing him to lose himself. She shouldn't have married a man she wanted to change everything about. I feel sorry for ethan!

[Back Atcha]

On 9/16/2021 at 2:01 PM, Back Atcha said:

On 9/16/2021 at 9:15 AM, Jeanne222 said:

Olivia will soon get a taste of how Ethan treats his mother!  Unbending, uncooperative, stubborn  

I think Ethan will be fine with give-and-take.  His mother was an unyielding tyrant.  Olivia approaches things from an almost therapist point of view.

Hmmm...my comment in 2021 is OFF ... WAY OFF!  I suppose Ethan IS "fine," but Olivia will be fading from any family pictures and TV shows.

On 10/4/2021 at 2:40 PM, Taylor1703 said:

100% Olivia is in the wrong. She is petty and controlling. She manipulates all situations,  from her and Ethan to her and moriah with the band. She wants to be picked over everything. Ethan gives up his family, suppose to move, suppose to be ok with always changing more and more but what has she changed for ethan?? They are not going to make it and he would have given up everything, she is forcing him to lose himself. She shouldn't have married a man she wanted to change everything about. I feel sorry for ethan!

Can one truly believe that she "married a man she wanted to change everything about"?  She was just as young and inexperienced as he.  She evolved over the years as most young people do; he did not.  Each wants the other to be something they (perhaps) cannot be.  I feel sorry for both of them, but Olivia can move on and be the happier and more complete human.  Ethan will be happiest working on cars and mechanical things and not thinking or feeling anything.

[Jeanne222]

23 minutes ago, Back Atcha said:

Hmmm...my comment in 2021 is OFF ... WAY OFF!  I suppose Ethan IS "fine," but Olivia will be fading from any family pictures and TV shows.

Can one truly believe that she "married a man she wanted to change everything about"?  She was just as young and inexperienced as he.  She evolved over the years as most young people do; he did not.  Each wants the other to be something they (perhaps) cannot be.  I feel sorry for both of them, but Olivia can move on and be the happier and more complete human.  Ethan will be happiest working on cars and mechanical things and not thinking or feeling anything.

Aaa back when I watched but one episode and ‘felt bad’ for the parents!

What a mess it all was. 

I think Ethan and Olivia were more in lust rather than in love. Sounds like they hardly knew one another. 

Kim is finding such joy telling her children ‘I’m dating”!  Who cares. Go away.  

Moriah is just sad.  I ask myself is she a wanna be porn star or a misunderstood child?

This family would make a great case study for someone doing research on difunctional families!

[Back Atcha]

1 hour ago, Jeanne222 said:

Kim is finding such joy telling her children ‘I’m dating”!  Who cares. Go away.  

I agree!  And when will she EVER come clean and say, "Ken was in my plan (plot) long before I ever moved out of our home" ??  Since she's no longer a Plath per se, maybe she should not appear on a show called "Plathville."  Hope Ken likes to be controlled; that's all she's about.