Predator and Prey: Assault, harassment, and other aggressions in the entertainment industry

[aradia22]

Quote

The suit alleges that Zeffirelli — who died in 2019 — assured both actors that there would be no nudity in the film, and that they would wear flesh-colored undergarments in the bedroom scene. But in the final days of filming, the director allegedly implored them to perform in the nude with body makeup, “or the Picture would fail.”

Hussey was 15 at the time and Whiting was 16. According to the complaint, Zeffirelli showed them where the camera would be positioned, and assured them that no nudity would be photographed or released in the film. The suit alleges that he was being dishonest and that Whiting and Hussey were in fact filmed nude without their knowledge.

“What they were told and what went on were two different things,” said Tony Marinozzi, who is a business manager for both actors. “They trusted Franco. At 16, as actors, they took his lead that he would not violate that trust they had. Franco was their friend, and frankly, at 16, what do they do? There are no options. There was no #MeToo.”

https://variety.com/2023/film/news/romeo-and-juliet-child-abuse-nude-scene-lawsuit-1235477837/

Seeing so many people on reddit talk about how the film was shown in their classes and the students were told to be "mature" about the nudity while the child actors in the movie couldn't properly consent... I hate it here. Burn everything to to the ground.

[bluegirl147]

2 hours ago, aradia22 said:

https://variety.com/2023/film/news/romeo-and-juliet-child-abuse-nude-scene-lawsuit-1235477837/

Seeing so many people on reddit talk about how the film was shown in their classes and the students were told to be "mature" about the nudity while the child actors in the movie couldn't properly consent... I hate it here. Burn everything to to the ground.

Nowadays people are arrested for having nude pics or videos of girls the age Olivia was.  Teenage girls have been arrested for showing someone a pic of themselves.  But I guess when Hollywood does it it's OK.

[Guest]

On 1/3/2023 at 5:29 PM, Terrafamilia said:

Romeo and Juliet actors sue Paramount for child abuse in 1968 film

Olivia Hussey and Leonard Whiting accuse studio of sexual exploitation in nude scene in Franco Zeffirelli adaptation

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2023/jan/03/romeo-and-juliet-actors-sue-paramount-child-abuse-zeffirelli

 

Stories like this make me so glad that intimacy coordinators now exist and are becoming more common. 

Just the other day I saw a news story  about Outlander star, Sam Heughan, saying that he felt betrayed by producers pressuring him to film unnecessary nude scenes. In later seasons he suggested that the show hire an intimacy coordinator.  

Actors, like Sean Bean, who complain about them need to shut the fuck up. 

[Mabinogia]

29 minutes ago, Dani said:

Actors, like Sean Bean, who complain about them need to shut the fuck up. 

Seriously. Sure, you don't like them, but they aren't hurting you, while not having one clearly IS harming others. 

[JustHereForFood]

Quote

The suit alleges that Zeffirelli — who died in 2019 — assured both actors that there would be no nudity in the film, and that they would wear flesh-colored undergarments in the bedroom scene. But in the final days of filming, the director allegedly implored them to perform in the nude with body makeup, “or the Picture would fail.”

That sounds like a classic move. Leave the questionable scenes as last and then pressure people with talk of how they would make the movie fail and destroy it after they already dedicated so much to it.

[Irlandesa]

4 hours ago, Dani said:

Actors, like Sean Bean, who complain about them need to shut the fuck up.

I agree.  And I found it refreshing to hear some of the Italian actors talk about how much they appreciated having an intimacy coordinator while filming The White Lotus even though it was new to them since Italian productions don't have them.

[Bastet]

Back in the original Beverly Hills, 90210 days, I watched a lot of the high school years in a love-hate way with a friend who had a hate-to-love affection for it.  When they did their weird little meta thing (in which the actors played partially-fictionalized versions of themselves reuniting to film a revival pilot of the series) a couple of years ago, that friend and I got together each week to drink our way through it.

I mention this to say Gabrielle Carteris, who was then the president of SAG-AFTRA, had her fictional/real amalgam character hold the same role within BH90210.  As such, she advocated for an intimacy coordinator for the in-series revival the ... actor-characters? "actors"? whatever we want to call the amalgam characters who shared the actors names and some of their real-life characteristics and situations and then were sometimes wildly dramatized for storyline purposes (see why we needed wine to watch?!) ... would be filming, which was great. 

But when the actor-characters went to film their 90210 characters' sex scene, the intimacy coordinator was presented as an absolute cartoon, a ridiculous impediment to artistry, thus mocking the importance of such a role, something the SAG-AFTRA president should never have been involved in even as a semi-fictionalized version of herself.  BH90210 was an absurd series, okay, but in such a fraught time, it was inappropriate to misrepresent the role intimacy coordinators play on set, period, especially with the actors' union president playing herself.  Especially when, at the time, it was the only thing many viewers had ever seen of an intimacy coordinator; it's not like it was an established, powerful position to be lampooned.

It's not enough for intimacy coordinators to exist on a handful of sets if someone asks.  They need to be required by the union.  Otherwise, those requesting them are subject to mockery at best and retaliation at worst.

Edited January 5, 2023 by Bastet

[Guest]

58 minutes ago, Bastet said:

It's not enough for intimacy coordinators to exist on a handful of sets if someone asks.  They need to be required by the union.  Otherwise, those requesting them are subject to mockery at best and retaliation at worst.

Absolutely. I feel like the tide has already begun to turn in that direction. Most of the shows known for being particularly spicy now have them. HBO deciding to hire them for all their intimate scenes was huge. The current SAG-AFTRA president, Fran Drescher, is supportive. Intimacy coordinators are now included able to join the union so they will be included in whatever deal they work out later this year.

I follow an intimacy coordinator on social media and it is fascinating to see how they work. 

[Anduin]

5 hours ago, Bastet said:

But when the actor-characters went to film their 90210 characters' sex scene, the intimacy coordinator was presented as an absolute cartoon, a ridiculous impediment to artistry, thus mocking the importance of such a role, something the SAG-AFTRA president should never have been involved in even as a semi-fictionalized version of herself.  

Part of me agrees with you. But on these type of mockumentary things, directors are often portrayed pretty badly too. Same with actors. Equal opportunity assholery.

[Spartan Girl]

I remember a bit from Olivia Hussey’s book where Zeffirelli kept calling her “Boobsamina” supposedly to put her at ease for that scene. At the time she laughed, but it still came off as gross. I wonder if she views that memory differently now. And I have the feeling that she and Whiting waited until after Zeffirelli was dead to do this because they couldn’t bring themselves to go ahead with the lawsuit when he was still alive. If so, I don’t blame them. It’s perfectly normal to have conflicting feelings about someone who gave you your big start and whom you can’t help respecting as a filmmaker even if they put you into what you now realize was an uncomfortable and inappropriate situation, regardless of the allegations against him.

That sadly wasn’t the worst of what happened to Olivia on the set. The guy playing Juliet’s father got drunk and hit on her one night after filming.

Edited January 5, 2023 by Spartan Girl

[Ms Blue Jay]

This is old news, but I feel like it's very relevant to the topic at hand.  I watched the pilot of "The Affair" and I didn't like it - no shade to people who like the show- because it employed every cliche in the book that I absolutely cannot stand.  It was no surprise to me to read these articles later:

Basically, Ruth Wilson felt very exploited on the show and had to leave it.  The showrunners seemed to have absolutely no sympathy and took no responsibility for it.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-features/ruth-wilson-left-affair-hostile-environment-nudity-issues-1263553/

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/ruth-wilson-says-she-exited-the-affair-because-she-didnt-feel-safe-4088171/

This story about one of the showrunners is particularly disgusting:

https://www.lennyletter.com/story/our-voices-are-our-superpower

He shared an extremely inappropriate photo of one of the actresses  (sources say Maura Tierney) and made some disgusting comments to Lena Dunham and somebody else at a dinner.

Edited January 6, 2023 by Ms Blue Jay

[Bastet]

10 hours ago, Anduin said:

Part of me agrees with you. But on these type of mockumentary things, directors are often portrayed pretty badly too. Same with actors. Equal opportunity assholery.

But they're not equal.  Some things you don't mock*, and it wasn't the only time in the series they went with an awful "consent is just so darn tricky these days, it was so much better back in our time" moment.

(*Like the fabulous episode of Major Crimes which mocks the hell out of celebrity life, but never once makes the celebrity assistant the butt of a joke, because she has no power.)

Edited January 5, 2023 by Bastet

[Guest]

On 1/5/2023 at 2:24 AM, Anduin said:

Part of me agrees with you. But on these type of mockumentary things, directors are often portrayed pretty badly too. Same with actors. Equal opportunity assholery.

I also wonder how much control Carteris would have had over those aspects. At the same time the show was on the air she was championing intimacy coordinators in the press and there was a lot of positive improvements at SAG-AFTRA while she was president. She and the rest of the cast were producers but that often means very little in terms of control. Garth and Spelling both got created by and story by credits so they seemed to have a bigger creative role than the rest of the cast. 🤷‍♀️

[merylinkid]

On 1/4/2023 at 4:53 PM, Mabinogia said:

Seriously. Sure, you don't like them, but they aren't hurting you, while not having one clearly IS harming others. 

If having an intimacy coordinator on set causes you problems, then the problem is NOT the intimacy coordinator.   

[BetterButter]

Chris D’Elia’s Comedy Show Quietly Canceled After New Sexual Misconduct Allegations

Quote

Hollywood Improv removed the 42-year-old’s show on Jan. 11 from its schedule without explanation, just weeks after the comedian was accused of predatory behavior

 

[Ms Blue Jay]

David Spade had this late night talk show called "Lights Out" in 2019 and 2020 where a new set of 3 other comedians would be on a roundtable with him.  At first, I enjoyed the show, but then, it was like every week at least one of them was a known predator.  It sucked all the fun out.  The show was cancelled, and David blamed it on COVID, but I wish he would be more transparent and admit that that kind of show just doesn't work anymore with the current climate.  I don't know what it is about comedy, but god, a lot of those people are disgusting.

Looking at the line up, and I see I am exaggerating, but here are some names that jump out at me:  Jeff Ross was on twice, Chris Hardwick was on FOUR SEPARATE TIMES, Chris D'Elia (ewwwwwwwwwwww), Jeff Garlin.

Anthony Anderson was also on the first season of Law and Order and is not on the second one.  All media seems to make it sound like his choice, which again annoys me.  No one is willing to publicly state that his past has anything to do with it.  He was also recently on Celebrity IOU.  Made me pretty disgusted with the Property Brothers for showcasing him.  

Edited January 6, 2023 by Ms Blue Jay

[Irlandesa]

4 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

No one is willing to publicly state that his past has anything to do with it. 

I don't think his past did have anything to do with him not coming back for a second season.  He only signed up for one season and was open about that from the beginning. 

I also doubt David's show was cancelled because of who he had on either.

[Ms Blue Jay]

I wasn't implying that.  My post was about how predators are still given platforms in current day and how so few are willing to take a stand against them.

Edited January 7, 2023 by Ms Blue Jay

[Vermicious Knid]

Ron Jeremy will be declared 'incompetent for trial', has severe dementia.

Quote

 

The Los Angeles Times, citing an email it has obtained, reported mental health experts for both prosecution and defense have found he is mentally incapacitated, with little chance of recovery.

"As a result of the agreement of the experts, the defendant will be declared incompetent to stand trial... his prognosis for improvement is not good," Los Angeles County deputy district attorney Paul Thompson wrote in the email, the paper said.

"If he does not improve, we will not be able to try him for his crimes. Because criminal proceedings are suspended as long as he is incompetent, we also cannot get a guilty plea from him or discuss other measures to get justice for the victims in this case."

 

[Anduin]

8 hours ago, Vermicious Knid said:

Ron Jeremy will be declared 'incompetent for trial', has severe dementia.

I wonder if it's real. He wouldn't be the first person to allegedly be too sick for jail. And if it is real, I hope he's kept safe and sound. Where he can't be a danger to people around him.

[merylinkid]

20 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Anthony Anderson was also on the first season of Law and Order and is not on the second one.  All media seems to make it sound like his choice, which again annoys me.  No one is willing to publicly state that his past has anything to do with it.  He was also recently on Celebrity IOU.  Made me pretty disgusted with the Property Brothers for showcasing him.  

And he is in commercials EVERYWHERE.   So even if you avoid shows he is on, he still gets shoved in your face.  

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Anduin said:

I wonder if it's real. He wouldn't be the first person to allegedly be too sick for jail. And if it is real, I hope he's kept safe and sound. Where he can't be a danger to people around him.

Experts for the prosecution and defense both concluded his dementia was too severe for him to stand trial. According to the LA Times his family suspected he had dementia before he was arrested and they had his drivers license taken away. It does seem like it is real. 

Given the severity of the charges and his diagnosis he will probably be placed in a state run hospital.

[CrazyInAlabama]

Some prisons have medical and mental care wards for petients like Ron Jeremy.    Prisoners with mobility, physical or mental issues can be housed and cared for, but are behind prison walls.   

[Guest]

39 minutes ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

Some prisons have medical and mental care wards for petients like Ron Jeremy.    Prisoners with mobility, physical or mental issues can be housed and cared for, but are behind prison walls.   

I have absolutely no doubt that he is guilty but I still wouldn’t be okay with him being sent to a prison indefinitely without a trial. 

[Zella]

27 minutes ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

Some prisons have medical and mental care wards for petients like Ron Jeremy.    Prisoners with mobility, physical or mental issues can be housed and cared for, but are behind prison walls.   

But he can't be sent to prison without a trial, and he's been declared incompetent to stand trial. I don't think the issue is accommodating his medical needs if he's found guilty. It's that they can't even go through the legal process to find him guilty in his current state, which is unlikely to improve. 

[BlueSkies]

He gave a lot of good performances over the years but my gut says he's more of a d-bag than good human

 

https://www.cnn.com/2017/12/15/entertainment/dustin-hoffman-sexual-allegations/index.html

 

 

Ditto Bobby De Niro as well.  Strikes me as well as someone on the d-baggy side in real life.  Particularly 

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/10/03/robert-de-niro-sued-for-gender-discrimination-by-former-assistant.html

 

 

I'll just leave it as guys do as I say not as I do 

[Anduin]

3 hours ago, Dani said:

Given the severity of the charges and his diagnosis he will probably be placed in a state run hospital.

Good. It isn't right for someone that badly off to be loose. Could get in worse trouble than he already is.

I do feel sorry for his victims. I imagine it's pretty hard knowing he'll escape from justice. At least this time it's not from having a lot of money and power.

[Bastet]

2 hours ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

Some prisons have medical and mental care wards for petients like Ron Jeremy.    Prisoners with mobility, physical or mental issues can be housed and cared for, but are behind prison walls.   

He's incompetent to stand trial, so he cannot be remanded to prison; those wards are for those convicted who need care (and who have very little chance of actually getting it, but that's another discussion).  When one is incapable of having a fair trial under the Sixth Amendment because they can't rationally understand the charges and participate in their defense, they cannot be tried or even enter into a plea agreement, so no conviction.  (That will change if they later become competent via treatment, but with dementia, that's not likely to happen.)

[aradia22]

Yeah, Dustin Hoffman is probably a bad person. Not sure about De Niro. I checked the article and yes, it is the same assistant he sued for using money on personal expenses and not working. I assume there's a paper trail with evidence of who is telling the truth.

Quote

That complaint accuses her of misappropriating “hundreds of thousands of dollars” for personal expenses on Canal’s American Express card, converting millions of frequent flyer miles belonging to the company for her personal use, improperly reimbursing herself for personal and luxury items, and submitting “false information in order to be paid for” for 96 days of unused vacation.

That first suit also claims Robinson, who was paid $300,000 annually by the time she quit in April 2019 after more than a decade of working for De Niro, “loafed during working hours, binge-watching astounding hours of TV shows on Netflix.”

Robinson’s own lawsuit fires back at those accusations, saying the legal action against her is made up of “concocted false allegations” that were designed to “inhibit Ms. Robinson from pursuing her claims, destroy her reputation, and obliterate her job prospects.”

 

[CrazyInAlabama]

2 hours ago, Bastet said:

He's incompetent to stand trial, so he cannot be remanded to prison; those wards are for those convicted who need care (and who have very little chance of actually getting it, but that's another discussion).  When one is incapable of having a fair trial under the Sixth Amendment because they can't rationally understand the charges and participate in their defense, they cannot be tried or even enter into a plea agreement, so no conviction.  (That will change if they later become competent via treatment, but with dementia, that's not likely to happen.)

Good point.    Since he wasn't convicted, he'll probably end up in some facility, if he can afford it.    Memory Care a month where I live is $8 to $10k a month, and this area is cheap compared to a lot of others.  I'm guessing his personal history will limit the places that would take him anyway.  

[Guest]

9 hours ago, Anduin said:

I do feel sorry for his victims. I imagine it's pretty hard knowing he'll escape from justice. At least this time it's not from having a lot of money and power.

One of them was interviewed and she was angry that prosecutors put her through the trauma of the process at all when Jeremy was showing symptoms of dementia before the arrest. 

6 hours ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

Good point.    Since he wasn't convicted, he'll probably end up in some facility, if he can afford it.    Memory Care a month where I live is $8 to $10k a month, and this area is cheap compared to a lot of others.  I'm guessing his personal history will limit the places that would take him anyway.  

Most likely he will continue to be a guest of the state so how much money he has won’t be a factor. I can’t see the judge letting him go into a private treatment facility. He’s been in a mental health facility since March. 

[janie jones]

On 1/7/2023 at 12:21 PM, BlueSkies said:

He gave a lot of good performances over the years but my gut says he's more of a d-bag than good human

I thought you were talking about Ron Jeremy at first.

[Ailianna]

On 1/7/2023 at 3:21 PM, BlueSkies said:

He gave a lot of good performances over the years but my gut says he's more of a d-bag than good human

 

https://www.cnn.com/2017/12/15/entertainment/dustin-hoffman-sexual-allegations/index.html

 

 

Ditto Bobby De Niro as well.  Strikes me as well as someone on the d-baggy side in real life.  Particularly 

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/10/03/robert-de-niro-sued-for-gender-discrimination-by-former-assistant.html

 

 

I'll just leave it as guys do as I say not as I do 

These are very old. The first one is 2017. The second is 2019.

[Notabug]

21 hours ago, Dani said:

One of them was interviewed and she was angry that prosecutors put her through the trauma of the process at all when Jeremy was showing symptoms of dementia before the arrest. 

Most likely he will continue to be a guest of the state so how much money he has won’t be a factor. I can’t see the judge letting him go into a private treatment facility. He’s been in a mental health facility since March. 

I can speak from some personal experience.  My brother is bipolar and, while manic and delusional, broke into a house-twice.  It was a home that we'd lived in when he was a kid.  He was charged with stalking (because of the repeat break-ins, he never even met the current homeowner) and possession of criminal tools (he broke a window using a pool cue).  Anyway, he was incompetent to stand trial but remained a guest of the criminal justice system in forensic mental health facilities (locked wards) for almost 7 years, which was about as much time as he'd have gotten with a conviction.  Although he was eventually competent to stand trial, it never happened. 

So, even if Mr Jeremy never stands trial, it seems like the state can insist he be placed in a locked memory care facilty.

When people are declared incompetent to stand trial, they are not released back out into society.

Edited January 9, 2023 by Notabug

[BetterButter]

Harvey Weinstein Rape Conviction Sentencing Delayed to February

Quote

Lawyers for the Hollywood producer, during a brief Los Angeles courtroom appearance, got more time to prepare a motion for a new trial.

 

[aradia22]

Quote

Paul Mescal, the star of A24’s Aftersun and Hulu’s Normal People who just landed the lead in Ridley Scott‘s Gladiator sequel, has been tapped to replace Blake Jenner in Richard Linklater‘s ambitious multi-decade feature adaptation of Stephen Sondheim‘s acclaimed musical Merrily We Roll Along, multiple sources tell Above the Line.

Ben Platt and Beanie Feldstein were cast way back in the summer of 2019 when the project first began filming. Jenner did shoot scenes for the film, though he exited the project shortly after domestic violence allegations surfaced against the actor from his ex-wife, Supergirl star Melissa Benoist.

https://abovetheline.com/2023/01/09/paul-mescal-merrily-we-roll-along-movie-richard-linklater-ben-platt-beanie-feldstein/

I still think the concept for this movie is incredibly stupid. 

[Wiendish Fitch]

51 minutes ago, aradia22 said:

https://abovetheline.com/2023/01/09/paul-mescal-merrily-we-roll-along-movie-richard-linklater-ben-platt-beanie-feldstein/

I still think the concept for this movie is incredibly stupid. 

Boyhood was decent, but I think Linklater has gone drunk with power with this gimmick. 

[janie jones]

5 hours ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

Boyhood was decent, but I think Linklater has gone drunk with power with this gimmick. 

I think he got lucky with Boyhood. No one got arrested or died or whatever. And even if they had gotten arrested or died, he could have written it into the script, which he can't do if he's adapting something.

[BetterButter]

Danny Masterson to Face Second Trial on Rape Charges

Quote

Prosecutors announced on Tuesday that they will pursue a second trial against Danny Masterson, after a jury deadlocked on three rape charges at the actor’s first trial in November.

 

[Jaded]

Genie shouldn't have had to ever defend that scene and the fact that she was 17 when it was originally filmed makes it even worse. She ended up having to though because Laura was later paired with her rapist and the duo ended up becoming a soap "supercouple".  The things she describes as having gone on behind the scenes to justify it especially a woman trying to call it "rape seduction" is maddening. 

'General Hospital' 's Genie Francis Won't 'Defend' Her Controversial Rape Scene Anymore: 'It's Been a Burden'
 

Quote

"I don't defend it anymore," Francis, 60, told reporters.

"You know, as a young kid, at 17, I was told to play rape, and I played it," she explained. "I didn't even know what it was. But, at 17, you follow the rules, and you do as you are told, and you aim to please. At 60, I don't feel the need to defend that anymore."

"I think that the story was inappropriate, I don't condone it, and it's been a burden that I've had to carry to try to justify that story, and so I'm not doing that anymore," she added. "I think, when a woman says 'No,' that she should be listened to, and if you replay that scene, you don't have Laura just saying 'No.' You have her screaming 'No.'"

 

Here's the article that these quotes mentioned later are from.
 

Quote

"Gloria Monte, the executive producer of General Hospital, essentially was told she had two weeks to save the show and ABC was going to cancel it if she couldn’t bring ratings up in that time," says De Kosnik. "In Luke and Laura, she saw potential there to maybe make things happen that shouldn’t happen, and that was electric."

"Then the question became, 'Why did Luke do that?'" she adds. "And the answer the show’s writers gave was that Luke did it for love. They became popular not despite the rape, but partly because of it."

"Gloria Monte tried to deal with it by calling it rape-seduction," Francis adds. "The term now would be date rape. The night of the rape, Luke’s last request was to dance with him, and the dance became very seductive. He took her down to the floor and that is the rape."

 

 

Edited January 12, 2023 by Jaded

[CrazyInAlabama]

On 1/10/2023 at 3:01 PM, BetterButter said:

Danny Masterson to Face Second Trial on Rape Charges

 

I don't care how many times they try him, with the influence of his religious group, and the insiders that have block prosecution for such a long time, I can't see any conviction.    They only need to get one person on the jury to deadlock it.  

Edited January 13, 2023 by CrazyInAlabama

[BetterButter]

‘Rick and Morty’ Co-Creator Justin Roiland Facing Domestic Violence Charges

Quote

Voice actor and animator was charged with two felony counts stemming from a 2020 incident involving Jane Doe victim

 

[BetterButter]

Pamela Anderson Alleges Tim Allen Flashed His Penis at Her When She Was 23

Quote

The explosive claim is one of many in her upcoming memoir, "Love, Pamela," which traces Anderson's rise from small-town girl from Vancouver Island to one of the most recognizable women in the world.

 

[Spartan Girl]

1 hour ago, BetterButter said:

Pamela Anderson Alleges Tim Allen Flashed His Penis at Her When She Was 23

 

I'm shocked.

[bluegirl147]

1 hour ago, BetterButter said:

Pamela Anderson Alleges Tim Allen Flashed His Penis at Her When She Was 23

 

He denies it but I can believe it.

[RealHousewife]

7 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

He denies it but I can believe it.

I believe Pamela too. And he thinks because he saw Pamela naked in Playboy that men can just flash her and it's okay? WTF?

[Spartan Girl]

35 minutes ago, RealHousewife said:

I believe Pamela too. And he thinks because he saw Pamela naked in Playboy that men can just flash her and it's okay? WTF?

Yeah, that’s not the same thing. I already knew he’s an asshole but JFC.

[Bastet]

35 minutes ago, RealHousewife said:

And he thinks because he saw Pamela naked in Playboy that men can just flash her and it's okay? WTF?

I said in the thread for her upcoming video memoir that it was repulsive how, after the sex tape with Tommy Lee was stolen and released, there was this widespread notion that she had no reason to be bothered by the world watching her have sex, since she'd posed for Playboy.  First, there's the huge difference in that she consented to one and not the other.  Second, there's quite a difference between a nude photograph and recorded sexual activity.  I imagine if you quizzed people who'd posed for the former if they'd be comfortable sharing the latter, most would say no, not even consensually, let alone having something meant to be private released to the public.  But she got treated like a human blow-up doll, not entitled to any feelings of violation and embarrassment (and Lee just got applauded for having a big dick).

[janie jones]

He probably thinks that if someone does something nude for work, they're okay getting nude at any time, and are okay with seeing anyone else nude. He therefore thought she'd find his "joke" funny. (And/or like what she saw.) Like, it's the same mentality that makes people think prostitutes can't get raped.

[RealHousewife]

Just now, Bastet said:

I said in the thread for her upcoming video memoir that it was repulsive how, after the sex tape with Tommy Lee was stolen and released, there was this widespread notion that she had no reason to be bothered by the world watching her have sex, since she'd posed for Playboy.  First, there's the huge difference in that she consented to one and not the other.  Second, there's quite a difference between a nude photograph and recorded sexual activity.  I imagine if you quizzed people who'd posed for the former if they'd be comfortable sharing the latter, most would say no, not even consensually, let alone having something meant to be private released to the public.  But she got treated like a human blow-up doll, not entitled to any feelings of violation and embarrassment (and Lee just got applauded for having a big dick).

Absolutely. Look, posing for Playboy isn't something I'd personally do, but a lot of women who pose see it as a modeling gig, nothing more. A sex tape with your husband is very, very different. What happened to Pamela was sick. 

Just now, janie jones said:

He probably thinks that if someone does something nude for work, they're okay getting nude at any time, and are okay with seeing anyone else nude. He therefore thought she'd find his "joke" funny. (And/or like what she saw.) Like, it's the same mentality that makes people think prostitutes can't get raped.

Yes! Holly Madison has said people think she'll always be cool with nudity because she was comfortable doing Playboy. 

I think some people can't quite grasp the differences because they're not in the industry. 

I'm sure most people here get it, but anyone who doesn't, think of it this way. Maybe you're comfortable sending a nude to your boyfriend, but you'd be humiliated if he showed anyone. Maybe you're comfortable wearing a bikini to the beach, but you don't want those pictures on social media. We all have our own comfort levels with our bodies, and all of us deserve respect.