S01.E05: On A Very Special Episode...

[Perfect Xero]

Yeah, I thought that most of the episode was Family Ties inspired, they definitely wore a lot of plaids and button up shirts on that show.

11 hours ago, Snapdragon said:

Okay, so I know there's no way this is going to happen since they're only doing happy family sitcoms, but can we all agree that a Married With Children episode would be glorious?  

Personally I'm hoping for The Simpsons, which really is the biggest cultural touchstone family sitcom of the 90s, and a show where Bart and Lisa have remained the same ages for 30 years would fit in with Wanda not wanting her kids to grow up fast.

[MagnusHex]

lol Finally caught up to episode 5, and my god, so many questions!

First off, so glad we finally addressed the post-snap situation and how people dealt with it in episode 4. That was long overdue.

Second, this version of Pietro's probably not Wanda's actual brother, much as I wanted him to be. I just have a feeling that getting Evan Peters to suddenly play Quicksilver again (even if Disney got back the rights) just wouldn't really work smoothly narratively, and the audience would probably be too confused, so I'm not sure if Feige would go through with it.

That being said, god, I want Evan to do it! This was just how I imagined it, the X-Men universe being brought into the MCU through some reality-bending multiverse situation. I've been dreaming in my head how it would go down back then, long before Fox got bought out, and Wanda's House of M reality-bending powers finally being brought to the forefront couldn't be more perfect for this.

Jesus, she's certainly powered up more than I expected. I knew that she would be powerful if they really brought Wanda's reality powers into the MCU, but I had my doubts how powerful Feige was willing to make her. Certainly didn't disappoint me.

But now that Wanda is implied to be able to raise the dead even, we're playing with a totally different ballgame now. It's a sign that the MCU is going to be filled with people who could literally change reality or even destroy entire galaxies, not just one or two Thanos (which would be closer to the power levels of the superheroes in the comics). Dr. Strange is even going to travel across the multiverse now, so Wanda raising the dead is no more stranger than that.

Speaking of strange, that word keeps popping up in this show, as if the Sorcerer Supreme's gonna be related to Wanda's actions somehow. If she's interfering with the dead, could Dr. Strange be involved as well, since he's kinda in charge of the supernatural realm of the MCU? That is of course, assuming that Vision has a soul for Strange to be bothered with to begin with, but I doubt he does, being a sentient machine. Then again, I'm not entirely caught up with how souls work in the Marvel universe.

But man, did I mention how powerful Wanda is? I wouldn't be surprised at all if she's able to literally grab Pietro from the Fox Universe and bring him to the MCU. Her powers seem to be growing at an exponential level with every episode. Soon, multiverse-interference might be a piece of cake for her too. But that's wishful thinking on my part. I really want that X-Men crossover soon. lol

Oh, this is such a great series. Every episode brings new surprises that satiates the Marvel comics geek inside me. What could they possibly come up with next to top this?

[Peace 47]

I know most people already suspect that someone is manipulating Wanda and that this situation is not “all Wanda” as Monica exclaimed last episode.  I think one additional piece of evidence for that (and apologies if this has been mentioned, as I’ve read this thread here and there over 4 days) could be that Wanda explained to her kids in this episode that she couldn’t bring Sparky back from the dead.

Whatever is going on Vision being alive (and perhaps Pietro), I don’t think Wanda initiated that because she still seems to think “dead is dead”.  I mean, she knows on some level that Vision is dead because of how she saw him in the 1970s, but I just think it’s important that she drew the line at the dog, even though Agnes (as well as the kids) seemed to be trying to push Wanda into it.

[ddiced35]

On 2/6/2021 at 3:52 PM, Dani said:

On 2/6/2021 at 3:40 PM, lovett1979 said:

But the fact the audio description said in that scene "Wanda stares at the version of Pietro from the X-Men films" so I think that's a little more definitive.

I don’t consider that to be confirmation. It could just be the easiest way of explaining what was happening for people with vision issues. 

But if it was just to explain for people with vision issues, wouldn't they say "Wanda stares at the actor who played the version of Pietro from the X-men films"? Think about it--if it really has nothing to do with the X-universe, they're really messing with the vision impaired by describing him like this if it really means nothing.

[Morrigan2575]

On 2/10/2021 at 4:59 AM, Perfect Xero said:

Yeah, I thought that most of the episode was Family Ties inspired, they definitely wore a lot of plaids and button up shirts on that show.

And suspenders. I Googled Family Ties when the discussion of clothing and 80s/90s came up. So many images of plaid, suspenders, high waisted pants/shorts. 

[Wolfprincess]

Hi, I am new to forums so please forgive any mistakes on my part.  I read through the whole discussion of episode 5 and learned some interesting new ideas.  However, not much was said about Vision's body being at SWORD or the implications of it.

I will admit that I completely overlooked this myself when the video was revealed.  I was too annoyed at how Hayward was characterising Wanda's past and her actions, and cheering on Agent Woo for his lack of bias.  I also really dislike the Sokovia Accords in general.

Thinking more clearly now, I have some questions.  If the video is correct, it did look like Vision was in a lab, probably being examined at the very least.  Was he in pieces?  If he was then why isn't anyone saying anything?  Surely it would raise eyebrows at least.  Unless his will said that that was okay, which seems doubtful.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

 

 

 

[Kromm]

1 hour ago, Wolfprincess said:

However, not much was said about Vision's body being at SWORD or the implications of it.

It's been mentioned, both here and I believe in the Speculation Topic. A number of people have specifically drilled down on the fact that Vision was in pieces. I myself spoke at one point that it allows an alternate theory that Wanda was simply taking his remains because SWORD was dissecting/weaponizing him and Hayward's version was just spin. 

[Wolfprincess]

Thanks for the reply, I did see a few mentions.  I guess that I am confused as to why the characters on the show aren't reacting so much.  They said that Wanda was violating his living will, but what about them?

[kay1864]

A. Sorry if this has been asked (7 pages... yay?) but what does Vision mean when he says I’m ignoring statistics entirely?

 B. And am I the only one that interpreted Peter‘s shrug (in response to Wanda’s “Pietro?”) as “Ah, close enough”

C. (I assume it’s been mentioned already that Pietro should at least know who  ‘popsicle’ Vision is, since they fought Ultron in the same structure)

 D. And finally, do I have this timeline right?

5 years ago: the Snap

3 weeks ago: the Blip, and Wanda came back (and then Endgame)

11 days or so ago:  Wanda attended Tony Stark’s funeral 

9 days ago: Wanda retrieved Vision‘s body from Sword, where it had been for five years  (and Vision’s memory started)

Edited February 12, 2021 by kay1864

[kay1864]

 2nd Finally (like second breakfast), so Vision has only nine days of memory, but he has a ‘core memory’ of being with Wanda?

[Perfect Xero]

20 minutes ago, kay1864 said:

 And am I the only one that interpreted Peter‘s shrug (in response to Wanda’s “Pietro?”) as “Ah, close enough”

(I assume it’s been mentioned already that Pietro should at least know who  popsicle Vision is, since they fought Ultron in the same structure)

Pietro the person who died would know. Peter from the X-Men movies wouldn't. Pietro the sitcom character being played by Evan Peters is going to know whatever is relevant to the plot of the sitcom.

I think it's a good point about Pietro though, Wanda seems to be soft blocking out his death in this episode, she refers to him as being "far away" rather than "gone" when the kids ask about her brother. So in that sense it explains why Pietro doesn't know Vision even though they met in real life.

[kay1864]

3 hours ago, Wolfprincess said:

They said that Wanda was violating his living will, but what about them?

 I think that was just Hayward justifying the ‘mission’ to Rambeau, by making Wanda more of a threat. He himself is not concerned about the ethics of Sword. 

[Silver Raven]

Somebody on Reddit dug up that Norm, played by Asif Ali, was on an episode of Agents of SHIELD.  Cue the speculation that they're the same character, even though they have different names.

 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, kay1864 said:

 

A. Sorry if this has been asked (7 pages... yay?) but what does Vision mean when he says I’m ignoring statistics entirely?

 

He was saying that by wanting to believe Wanda that she didn’t know what was happening he was ignoring all logical evidence and probability. 

 

2 hours ago, kay1864 said:

D. And finally, do I have this timeline right?

5 years ago: the Snap

3 weeks ago: the Blip, and Wanda came back (and then Endgame)

11 days or so ago:  Wanda attended Tony Stark’s funeral 

9 days ago: Wanda retrieved Vision‘s body from Sword, where it had been for five years  (and Vision’s memory started)

Mostly, but we don’t know exactly when Tony’s funeral was or where Vision’s body was in the 5 years. Vision said he didn’t remember anything before Westview do his memory could be shorter than that. We don’t know exactly when the sitcom world started. 

On 2/10/2021 at 12:22 PM, ddiced35 said:

But if it was just to explain for people with vision issues, wouldn't they say "Wanda stares at the actor who played the version of Pietro from the X-men films"? Think about it--if it really has nothing to do with the X-universe, they're really messing with the vision impaired by describing him like this if it really means nothing.

There’s really no time for a longer explanation. The audio description is done so that it doesn’t interfere with the dialog or sound effects. They only had 1 or 2 seconds to fit the description in. As it is the end of the description is nearly lost in the applause. 

[arc]

6 hours ago, kay1864 said:

but what does Vision mean when he says I’m ignoring statistics entirely?

What Dani said. But the weird phrasing of it reminded me that in the comics, Wanda's powers are framed as reality manipulation, specifically by altering probabilities. If you're a Hitchhiker's Guide fan, she's basically got the powers of an (Infinite) Improbability Drive.

[QuantumMechanic]

On 2/7/2021 at 6:46 PM, Cobalt Stargazer said:

As hot to trot as Director Jackhole is to paint her as some lunatic who wants to kill everyone, he'd have mentioned casualties, and he didn't. That's key too, his insistence that she must be neutralized, whether he tells anyone what he's about to do or not.

True.  Wanda is merely a lunatic who is mentally torturing thousands of people.  No reason to insist on neutralizing that or anything.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

6 minutes ago, QuantumMechanic said:

True.  Wanda is merely a lunatic who is mentally torturing thousands of people.  No reason to insist on neutralizing that or anything.

I love the smell of sarcasm in the morning.

Meanwhile Director Jackhole is so worried about innocent people that he brings an entire squadron to the barrier after trying to blow Wanda up. If he was really on the up and up, he'd have at least told Monica what he was doing, since she was the one piloting the drone into Westview remotely. "You're holding thousands hostage, Wanda. So I'm going to do an end run around the person who's looking to me to handle this with a modicum of sense, then take a whole bunch of armed soldiers who can easily be mind-controlled to try and talk reason." Double brilliant.

[Daisy]

Hee. 
SWORD and SHIELD.

(It also took me like two episodes before it clicked in). 
I have to say i wasn't sure i wasn't going to watch this - but my friend was like - watch it and so i caught up on almost all the episodes. This is extremely well done.. Seeing XMen Quicksilver made me go "Ooooh" so I wonder if that's 1/2 tie in 1/2 easter egg.  A lot of questions and more pop up when they get answered. 

[bethy]

On 2/11/2021 at 7:07 PM, Wolfprincess said:

Thanks for the reply, I did see a few mentions.  I guess that I am confused as to why the characters on the show aren't reacting so much.  They said that Wanda was violating his living will, but what about them?

I've had the same question in terms of the lack of reaction by Monica, Darcy, and Woo. I'm not sure there's an answer.

[arc]

from twitter:

Quote

The second half of the Lagos kitchen paper advert in episode five, with the German lager being spilled and 'husbands can use it too' VO is about Vision in Germany, with what happened to Rhodey. Red liquid for Wanda, gold for Vision.

 

[Bruinsfan]

On 2/6/2021 at 1:46 PM, Kel Varnsen said:

The thing I wonder is if it is someone else who set it up, what are they getting out of this whole thing.

The twins is the most obvious possibility, but distracting Wanda with her fantasy-come-to-life and neutralizing her as a threat is another. With Thor and Captain Marvel off-planet and Dr. Strange not widely known to the public, Wanda may very well be the most powerful superhero on earth as far as some nefarious person/being knows.

[teenj12]

So, like, Wanda's clearly mentally unstable (and furthermore, her mental health is a pretty big aspect of her character in the comics), and perhaps S.W.O.R.D isn't as clued in on that, but I mean this to say that instead of nearly nuking her or bombarding her with guns upon her exist from the bubble, there should've been some kind of mental health services on the ground to talk Wanda off her edge.

 

[Chicago Redshirt]

On 2/11/2021 at 9:53 PM, kay1864 said:

C. (I assume it’s been mentioned already that Pietro should at least know who  ‘popsicle’ Vision is, since they fought Ultron in the same structure)

 D. And finally, do I have this timeline right?

5 years ago: the Snap

3 weeks ago: the Blip, and Wanda came back (and then Endgame)

11 days or so ago:  Wanda attended Tony Stark’s funeral 

9 days ago: Wanda retrieved Vision‘s body from Sword, where it had been for five years  (and Vision’s memory started)

Even assuming WV Pietro is some sort of reincarnation of MCU Pietro, it could be that Wanda (or someone else) is playing games with his memory or that the process used to bring him back played games with his memory or that he is playing a role.

We don't know when Tony's funeral was. It could have literally have been the same day as the Blip for all we know (though doubtful), or it could be that Wanda stole back Vision's body before the funeral (although that too seems doubtful).

We don't know how long SWORD had Vision's body. It could have been that they've held it since he died. It could be that they literally just got it in time for Wanda to steal it nine days ago.

On 2/11/2021 at 10:33 PM, kay1864 said:

 2nd Finally (like second breakfast), so Vision has only nine days of memory, but he has a ‘core memory’ of being with Wanda?

Vision has said that he doesn't remember anything prior to Westview. So at least based on what he has said, he does not have any memory of being at SWORD and his memories start with whatever has ben planted in his mind for sitcom purposes: that he and Wanda love each other and have been together for an unspecified period of time, that he works for Computing Solutions and the like.

As we saw in episode 1, Vision did not seem to be able to remember their anniversary, how they met, how they came to town, where they are from, etc. 

Since the sitcoms started, it is possible that Vision has gotten the equivalent of decades worth of memories stored in his brain. I guess it depends on how much he retains after going through the various episodes/decades/etc. 

[arc]

One thing that jumped out at me, but I forgot to mention it till now, was that there was very noticeable halation in the image in the inner show. (Halation is the red halo effect on film caused by bright edges hitting the red layer of the film. See this article for more.) This effect was probably added in post because (I assume) the entire show was shot on digital cameras.

It's doubly interesting to me that they did this for this episode because the earlier eras of sitcoms really were shot on film while the era of this episode was the era of shooting on video, where halation didn't occur. (OK, except for the travel episodes like when the Family Ties show went to Europe.) But the third episode, set in the 1970s, didn't have nearly as noticeable halation, if any.

[TigerLily20]

On 2/5/2021 at 2:02 PM, swanpride said:

There wasn't much Full House there, was there? Mostly just the picnic in the opening and I guess quicksilver acted a little bit like uncle Jesse.

I am just now getting around to watching this but I have to say, I think the most full house thing was how much Elizabeth looked like her sisters with the hair (that crimpy/high ponytail).  I didn't even realize she was related to the Olsen twins until I started reading here (I have seen the movies but she just didn't look like them to me, and I never paid attention to the names).  But in this episode she really looked like them with that 80's/early 90's hair.